Every week you step in the role of my Mentor/Teacher and give me more information then I can take in on one view. As a beginner over the last year I have truly come along way because of your clear information. You are much appreciated.
My mill is a DoAll 200V variable speed with a 9 x 49 inch table. I'm the original owner having purchased in new in the mid-eighties. At the time, it was a better machine than the Textron Bridgeports and it's served me well over the years. Glad you are enjoying the videos. Tom
Thank you very much for this demonstration. I was so stupid to indicate the cutter at each side instead of rotating the workpiece in the vice. What I like most about your videos is that you show how to make something good AND fast. It is always very frustrating when I spend all night in the shop and get only 10% of the work that I wanted to do actually done.
Lol, hence the "Common sense machining" tag on my website. It's the little tricks that I've learned from spending a lifetime in machining that I'm trying to share with others. Glad you liked the demo and thanks for watching. Tom
I'd like to see a video of you using the corner rounding end mill in the lathe as you hinted at in this video. Thanks for your videos. Very informative.
Tom, Thank you so much for taking your time to make, edit & post these videos. They are so helpful to those of us who have the equipment & need help with the techniques. Thanks Again & Best Regards, Jon
Thanks Scott. There isn't much to using one on the lathe, but I guess I could throw together a short video on it. Basically you just use one flute of the cutter as a form tool and pick up the corner of the part just like on the mill. The difference is the part is rotating and the cutter is stationary. I'll see what I have going tonight and maybe I can squeeze one in. Tom
Hi mister, first of all i want to say that i'm not from a country that speak english so i want to apologize for my bad english skills. I'm a college student i'm doing a project in manufacturing technology class. And your video has help me a lots in my project. Thanks for helping me. At the end of the course, i have to submit my essay about this mill to my teacher. And i wonder if you can help me about the specifications of the mill and the machine, the requirement of the material surface,... that you using in this clip. I'm very admire your work. I look forward to hearing from you.
Sorry it took so long to answer your question but I have been on vacation and didn't have access to UA-cam comments. Hopefully you got what you needed through Facebook. Tom
I notice a lot of your videos are with the spindle extended to the work. Is this for demonstration purposes, or simply because your spindle is thicker than my thigh? I've thought its best to bring the knee up to the spindle. You have done amazing work with these videos. You are a tremendous resource to those of us starting out! I can't thank you enough!
+Damien Gregory I only retract the quill when I need the extra rigidity for heavy cuts. It's a more efficient use of time than cranking the knee up and down unnecessarily. Of course you may not have that luxury on a lighter mill. Tom
Thanks Dave. Deciding to extend or retract the quill when milling is actually more of a common sense thing. Yes there are times when the quill should be retracted for a cut, such as when taking heavy cuts on steel. But it also saves a lot of time to leave the quill extended when taking light cuts, rather tha crank the knee up or down. In short, never say never when referring to a machining practice.
I've been a Machinist/model-maker for 40 years and it amaises me how many people side mill with the quill extended. You should never side mill with the quill extended. the more it is extended the less support it has which results in pre mature ware and chatter on your part. That is the way I was taught in my voc. school and it makes perfect sense to me.
That makes sense if you are taking a heavy cut David, but on a light application like this it makes little difference. I'd rather spend the time cutting metal than cranking the knee up and down. You'll notice that I was taking a full depth cut with no chatter at all. If the part had been steel, I probably would have been cranking. Tom
Why would you need to crank the knee (or the quill) up and down for this? Keep the same adjustment without moving anything, except the cutting movement of course.Very nice video. :-)RegardsR.
Nice demonstration on a quick way to mill a nice round corner. I enjoy watching your videos. For me personaly I have an other way to use a corner rounding end mill. If you have a quality tool you can zero Z-axis with the bottom of the tool on the top surface of your product (with the quill it's very fast). Then you lower your tool (or raise the table) the same amount as the radius of the corner rounding. For the side first I zero the fixed jaw, which usually is zero for me or I know the coordinates of the edges already. The distance you need to move the mill away from the product = outer radius of the mill - radius of the corner rounding. Ofcourse as you point out you move the Z just a little less and the side a little more. I hope I make sense (no English speaker), it's just another approach to the same goal.
tjeerd russch Thanks. I'm not sure where you are from, but corner rounding cutters around here aren't made that way. There is a significant flat area outside of and tangent to the radius in each direction, so setting up as you describe would not produce a full radius. By doing as I show in the video, there is no doubt as to when the cutter is tangent to the faces of the part, regardless of the make or quality of the cutter. Thank for watching. Tom
Tom I like this Correct me if I’m wrong but these cutters could save a lot of time. Avoiding setting up a rotary table with a 4 jaw chuck etc trying to round corners on a rectangular stock. I’m sure you could use the lathe but I think we can all agree on dialing in a 4 jaw chuck is a pain.
It's worth pointing out that, since the part has a square cross section from the POV of the camera, you didn't need to "touch and back off" on subsequent passes. Oh, and nice Hardinge lathe in the background.
Not sure I understand your point. I only touched and backed off on the first pass. Yes, the Hardinge is my pride and joy. I purchased it new in the mid 80's and it has served me well over the years. Thanks for watching, Tom
Hi Tom! Pretty impressive. I can see where tjeerd is going. Where we come from, there is at least three different( which I know of) types of corner rounders in use; reached, flared and standard, non flared. The most common one is non-flared one. You read( or better yet measure) the OD of the cutter double check the radii with radii gauge and measure the inner diameter of the cutter. Inner diameter and two radii should add to outside diameter of the cutter. If you have the digital readout on your mill the rest is quite simple. Obviously, where you came from, the reached model is the one mostly used. That would explain your technique. I like to use flared ones the most - if I can get them for a decent price - those have small angle (about 5°) ground in at the both ends of the radius - you never get the line on the parts using those...OSG, KEO and, I think, Latrobe use to make those. Now, I believe, there is only Harvey and they are insanely expensive... Thank you for your videos - the are excellent!
This is a really fantastic video that demonstrates the core essentials of using Corner Rounders! Would you mind if we referenced it on our new website?
Thanks and I wouldn't mind at all. The more viewers you send my way, the better. You may want to mention my website as well, tomstechniques.com. Thanks Tom
I have visited your site. And it just gave me an idea to suggest to both of you. If you manufacture this tolls and if Tom presents tutorial on using, if you give Tom some tools for his milling machine hen could use it as example and make some good propaganda since most of his viewers are from this area.. Just a suggestion. I hope I am not been silly. But give Tom a whole set of this tools so he can show us his viwers.
Hi Tom. Do you deliberately make your pass on the trailing edge? Normally I would feed the other way on the leading edge of the cutter for a cleaner cut.
Swansong18 If you mean do I intentionally climb mill, the answer is yes. Climb milling produces a much better finish than conventional milling. You do need to be careful when climb milling on light machinery because the cutter may grab. There it would be better to conventional mill to remove stock and climb mill for a good finish. Tom
Good info, but swapping work in the vise with the machine running is one of those things that's only OK until it's not. You appear to still have all 10 digits, so you're lucky.
Not lucky, experienced. When you work with machinery on a daily basis, for as long as I have (45 years), you develop a sense of what you can get away with without getting hurt. One of the most difficult things about making these videos is filtering that sort of thing out so novices don't get the wrong idea of what is safe and what is not. Thanks for pointing that potentially dangerous practice. It certainly is not acceptable practice for a novice machinist. Tom
Once again, thanks Tom! I keep leaving an edge on the top face when trying to use the corner rounding endmill. Does the radius have to be the entire endmill radius? Only reason I ask is because on some applications I'd like to have a small radius rather than a chamfer.
Hi Tom.....It is really a good tips and demonstration. It is really an artistic job to work on the milling machine. However i am a beginner, though i have some idea. But i have not worked on milling machine. I just want to learn to operate. Is there any baby milling machine available for beginners? And if so,what will be approximate cost? Please let me know.
Sorry David, but none of my cutters are like that. Most are around .05" greater than the radius and vary from cutter to cutter depending on size. I suppose it's possible that some are made that way, but I have never come across any. Tom
The same as with any end mill; 4 x cutting speed (surface feet per minute) / diameter. You can't really go too fast on aluminum and other non-ferrous metals. The limiting factor on aluminum is when it starts sticking to the cutter.
The axis of the corner rounding end mill has to be parallel to the side, or perpendicular to the top of the part. The only way to make them work off angle would be to tilt the head of the mill. It's normally a better option to orient the part to the end mill rather than the other way around.
Glen, It depends on the size of the radius. On my mill, a large one like a 3/4" would require a couple of cuts, but a 1/8" or 1/4" would only take one. Of course that is on my mill, a lighter mill would require more cuts. You have to know the capability of your machine to decide. Tom
Thanks Tom, I have a similar sized machine. Jut acquired a set of corner rounding mills a while back and only used them once so far. Will use your advice next time around.
Anyone ever tell you your voice on this video sounds like Norm McDonald? Nice technique. I have a different process for setting them up, but more complicated.
Sadley, I have not found any files that cut as well as the old U.S. made Nicholson's. Grob used to make good ones, but even those are now made in India. I have read that dull files can be resharpened a couple of times by etching them in a 10% solution of sulfuric acid, but I haven't tried it. Maybe those old Nicholson's have some life left in them?
Not sure what you have, but a lot of the Chinese knock off vises have this problem. Kurt AngleLock vises have a wedge feature that pulls the movable jaw down when tightened. If yours doesn't have this feature, all you can do is attempt to reduce the vertical play in the movable jaw, so it doesn't lift so much when tightened.
Im from hong kong, actually I have a friend who manufacture and supplies CNC machine tools around europe and US and I was thinking that if you are interested in his business that would be great.
You led me to believe that you were looking for a supplier. Now I find out that you are just promoting a friends business? That is not what UA-cam is for.
That depends on the size of the radius and the rigidity of your mill. I can do one pass with mine up to 1/4"R on steel, but larger radii require several. The rpm of any cutter depends on the diameter of the cutter, not the radius. Measure the OD and use 4XCS/DIA to calculate the rpm. There is a chart on my website that lists the cutting speeds for various metals. Tom
416 is one of the free machining stainless steels. It has the same cutting speed as mild steel with a machinability rating of 85%. Treat it the same as mild steel and you should be fine. Just be sure to use cutting oil on the radius cutter because of the added friction.
HI Mr Tom i saw ur video...how to calculate RPM with the formula..4*speed/Diameter i want to cut a design in the ms iron sheet with 8mm cutter how till wecalculate
+subash sharma Just convert the diameter of the cutter to inches and use the formula. Mild steel has a cutting speed of 100 surface feet per minute. Tom
according to your formula...4*speed / diameter. if we convert 8 mm into inches , we get 0.341. Now 4*100= 400 400/0.3149=1270.2 that means Rpm should be 1270 only. My tool get weared on this RPM. Sir, Please guide me .
Ah yes, I've heard of some shops using brushes instead of air to reduce air use thus reduce cost not for that though. The more you know! I'm the lead machinist where I work, we use air but I'm also a clean freak when it comes to everything setup related as well as part change overs.
BSevenShido BSevenShido aIf you do not have an answer yet it appears to be an older Bridgeport. The Bridgeport is a very common manual light duty mill. Some of the old versions have a 1 HP step pulley drive and the later models have a 2 hp variable speed drive. Just research Bridgeport milling machines. His mill might be about 30 to 40 years old.
crosstimbers2 Actually it's a DoAll 200V knee mill. It is almost identical as a Bridgeport, but when I purchased it in the mid 80's, it was of better quality than the Bridgeports that Textron was building. It has a variable speed head and a 9"x49" table. Tom
I rarely conventional mill. It's hard on the cutters and leaves a poor finish. It just requires an understanding of the forces climb milling puts on the machine, so compensation can be made by controlling the depth of cut, size of cutter or dragging a table lock. It's probably not a good idea to be taking a heavy climb cut with a large end mill on a light bench mill, but most knee mills are plenty rigid enough to handle it. You just have to know what your machine is capable of. Tom
Thank you. At least now I know what the message was. Now if I just knew what information he wanted. :) Sometimes face to face is the only way to communicate effectively. Tom
this was an interesting vid for me. the thing i'd really like to know is: how the hell did the internet know I had problems with this tool last night? really... this was offered up, not searched for. bizarre.
It's all relative Nick. I prefer to leave the quill extended for better access, and in the case of shooting a video, better visibility. If a job requires more rigidity, then it will be retracted as necessary. Not sure what you mean by "Safety first!" This actually a good idea for a video. To demonstrate when it is necessary to retract the quill, and when it just doesn't matter. Tom
I actually do all the time. Heavy cuts when end milling (up to half the diameter of the end mill) are actually less apt to grab than the light cuts in this video. You just need to know the capability of your machine. Thanks for watching. Tom
The corner rounding end mill will indeed work on stainless, cast iron, and mild steel if the proper cutting speeds are followed and coolant is applied. You are correct, they will not work on hardened steel.
Really great video!!! Love the hardinge HLVH in the background!!!!! Ran those lathes for over 50+ years. Ran all of hardinges equipment, hlvh, dv59’s chuckers, milling machines, and last lathe I obtained was hlvh-e/m. I think they make absolutely the best equipment in America!!!!!! Never had a machine down in all those years!!!! Cutting threads on the hlvh really spoils you for cutting threads on any other engine lathe.
I'm glad you subscribed as well. I could never get used to the minus Y thing, so I always picked up the front left corner of the part for CNC. Like anything else, just use what works for you. Tom
Tom, You know I have followed you from the first video, And for a while I have been thinking of asking you to make a segment of movie on the correct use of "T" slot cutters and cutting. I have done quite a few jobs recently, and kind of fumbled my way through. So I believe being shown the correct way will not only aid me and others in the long run, But also dispel any bad habits I and others had taught ourselves... Thanks in advance Tom. Regards Matt
Thanks for the tips on using these. A point about the filing near the end - instead of rocking the file forward (away from you) over the sharp edge, start on the back side and rock the file back towards you. It feels weird at the start but only a tiny bit of practice to get the feel of it and you will find it’s far easier to make a very nice filed radius. Cheers, al
Hi Tom, Thanks for all the great tips. I've learned alot from you. I'm surprized that you lay your tools and parts right on the ways of your mill. My shop teacher would have killed us for that. He showed us how to make plywood covers for our ways. Is that a good idea or wasted time? Thanks, Kevin.
Do you mean the table Kevin? I've seen tool organizers used before that fit into the T-slots and they are probably a good idea in theory, but I've always thought that they would get in the way and be more trouble than they are worth. Nothing wrong with trying it out though, maybe you would like them. Thanks for watching. Tom
I do have a DRO, but it doesn't help in this case. Once the two faces of the part are picked up with it against the solid jaw of the vise and the dials or stops set to zero, backlash doesn't come into play. In the video, I raise the tool with the quill to get it clear of the part and then return it against the quill stop. If your mill doesn't have a quill, you can leave Y locked and remove the part to return the cutter, or back off the Y or Z axis and then return it to zero with your dials. Tom
Once I get my life back in order with this retirement thing, I'll crank out some more videos. Right now I'm whittling away at a huge honey do list. :) Tom
Almost every milling video I've seen there is aluminum being used which as we all know is easy to work with. When you work with steel to me it is a different story requiring lighter/multiple cuts to achieve a nice finish. I'd like to see the instructor passing on knowledge on working with steel. NOT aluminum. Thanks for the video.
If you had to watch me machine this part in steel, you would quickly get bored and lose interest. We use aluminum because it speeds up the video and keeps it interesting. The principles are the same, regardless of what you are machining.
I like the idea of having my stop located on the vise itself, keeps the table clear and stays with the vise if you have to move it for whatever reason.
Hi Tom, does the standard CSx4/D formula apply for corner rounding end mills? I'll be using a 1/4" and 1/8" on an aluminum project very soon. Let me know, thanks.
Every week you step in the role of my Mentor/Teacher and give me more information then I can take in on one view. As a beginner over the last year I have truly come along way because of your clear information. You are much appreciated.
Thank you very much. It's good to hear that the videos are appreciated.
Tom
My mill is a DoAll 200V variable speed with a 9 x 49 inch table. I'm the original owner having purchased in new in the mid-eighties. At the time, it was a better machine than the Textron Bridgeports and it's served me well over the years.
Glad you are enjoying the videos.
Tom
Thank you very much for this demonstration. I was so stupid to indicate the cutter at each side instead of rotating the workpiece in the vice. What I like most about your videos is that you show how to make something good AND fast. It is always very frustrating when I spend all night in the shop and get only 10% of the work that I wanted to do actually done.
Lol, hence the "Common sense machining" tag on my website.
It's the little tricks that I've learned from spending a lifetime in machining that I'm trying to share with others. Glad you liked the demo and thanks for watching.
Tom
I'd like to see a video of you using the corner rounding end mill in the lathe as you hinted at in this video. Thanks for your videos. Very informative.
Tom,
Thank you so much for taking your time to make, edit & post these videos. They are so helpful to those of us who have the equipment & need help with the techniques.
Thanks Again & Best Regards,
Jon
My pleasure Jon.
Some good pointers in this vid, its always a pleasure to watch an experienced craftsman at work! Thanx for sharing Tom.
I'm about to do this at school in an hour, this video really helped. Thanks
Thanks Scott.
There isn't much to using one on the lathe, but I guess I could throw together a short video on it. Basically you just use one flute of the cutter as a form tool and pick up the corner of the part just like on the mill. The difference is the part is rotating and the cutter is stationary. I'll see what I have going tonight and maybe I can squeeze one in.
Tom
Thanks Tom your video's are great I have one of these bits and had no idea how to use it until now. I'm not a machines I'm a hobbyist. Keep it up
This is aluminum. It's done exactly the same with steel, just slower and with coolant.
Tom
Toms Techniques and
Thanks - I thought climb milling was the best but couldn't remember. Also good tips about setting zero on top and side.
I really miss your videos. Basic shop skills are always in demand.
I hear you John. Once I get used to this retirement thing, I'm pretty sure there will be plenty of time for more videos, not to mention a new website.
Great to hear. I retired last year too!
Hi mister, first of all i want to say that i'm not from a country that speak english so i want to apologize for my bad english skills.
I'm a college student i'm doing a project in manufacturing technology class. And your video has help me a lots in my project. Thanks for helping me. At the end of the course, i have to submit my essay about this mill to my teacher. And i wonder if you can help me about the specifications of the mill and the machine, the requirement of the material surface,... that you using in this clip.
I'm very admire your work.
I look forward to hearing from you.
Sorry it took so long to answer your question but I have been on vacation and didn't have access to UA-cam comments. Hopefully you got what you needed through Facebook.
Tom
I notice a lot of your videos are with the spindle extended to the work. Is this for demonstration purposes, or simply because your spindle is thicker than my thigh? I've thought its best to bring the knee up to the spindle.
You have done amazing work with these videos. You are a tremendous resource to those of us starting out! I can't thank you enough!
+Damien Gregory
I only retract the quill when I need the extra rigidity for heavy cuts. It's a more efficient use of time than cranking the knee up and down unnecessarily. Of course you may not have that luxury on a lighter mill.
Tom
I did Damien Gregory
Thank you you sir! Your video was very well done and easily understood.
That was very useful. Never thought about setting up on the stationary jaw great tip.
Thanks for this info - it seems to be a US thing, but I would have been shot for using the quill for putting a cut on when I was an apprentice
Thanks Dave. Deciding to extend or retract the quill when milling is actually more of a common sense thing. Yes there are times when the quill should be retracted for a cut, such as when taking heavy cuts on steel. But it also saves a lot of time to leave the quill extended when taking light cuts, rather tha crank the knee up or down. In short, never say never when referring to a machining practice.
This video solved my problem. Thanks.
They are a handy tool to have in your bag of shop tricks.
I've been a Machinist/model-maker for 40 years and it amaises me how many people side mill with the quill extended. You should never side mill with the quill extended. the more it is extended the less support it has which results in pre mature ware and chatter on your part. That is the way I was taught in my voc. school and it makes perfect sense to me.
That makes sense if you are taking a heavy cut David, but on a light application like this it makes little difference. I'd rather spend the time cutting metal than cranking the knee up and down. You'll notice that I was taking a full depth cut with no chatter at all. If the part had been steel, I probably would have been cranking.
Tom
Why would you need to crank the knee (or the quill) up and down for this? Keep the same adjustment without moving anything, except the cutting movement of course.Very nice video. :-)RegardsR.
Great video Tom. Thank you for the content!
Nice demonstration on a quick way to mill a nice round corner. I enjoy watching your videos. For me personaly I have an other way to use a corner rounding end mill. If you have a quality tool you can zero Z-axis with the bottom of the tool on the top surface of your product (with the quill it's very fast). Then you lower your tool (or raise the table) the same amount as the radius of the corner rounding. For the side first I zero the fixed jaw, which usually is zero for me or I know the coordinates of the edges already. The distance you need to move the mill away from the product = outer radius of the mill - radius of the corner rounding. Ofcourse as you point out you move the Z just a little less and the side a little more. I hope I make sense (no English speaker), it's just another approach to the same goal.
tjeerd russch
Thanks.
I'm not sure where you are from, but corner rounding cutters around here aren't made that way. There is a significant flat area outside of and tangent to the radius in each direction, so setting up as you describe would not produce a full radius. By doing as I show in the video, there is no doubt as to when the cutter is tangent to the faces of the part, regardless of the make or quality of the cutter.
Thank for watching.
Tom
Tom I like this
Correct me if I’m wrong but these cutters could save a lot of time. Avoiding setting up a rotary table with a 4 jaw chuck etc trying to round corners on a rectangular stock. I’m sure you could use the lathe but I think we can all agree on dialing in a 4 jaw chuck is a pain.
They are definitely time savers and do things you can't necessarily do on a rotary table, like mill a radius on a long corner.
@@TomsTechniques love it thank you
Thank yiu for all your videaos and nice tips, good job!!!
The only problem with a vise mounted stop is the limited reach. I use both types.
Thanks Tom, Another great video and usefull tips !
Very satisfying to watch
Thanks for taking the time to watch it.
It's worth pointing out that, since the part has a square cross section from the POV of the camera, you didn't need to "touch and back off" on subsequent passes.
Oh, and nice Hardinge lathe in the background.
Not sure I understand your point. I only touched and backed off on the first pass.
Yes, the Hardinge is my pride and joy. I purchased it new in the mid 80's and it has served me well over the years.
Thanks for watching,
Tom
What is my part has beveled corners and the part is only 1.5mm thick?
Hi Tom!
Pretty impressive.
I can see where tjeerd is going. Where we come from, there is at least three different( which I know of) types of corner rounders in use; reached, flared and standard, non flared. The most common one is non-flared one. You read( or better yet measure) the OD of the cutter double check the radii with radii gauge and measure the inner diameter of the cutter. Inner diameter and two radii should add to outside diameter of the cutter. If you have the digital readout on your mill the rest is quite simple. Obviously, where you came from, the reached model is the one mostly used. That would explain your technique. I like to use flared ones the most - if I can get them for a decent price - those have small angle (about 5°) ground in at the both ends of the radius - you never get the line on the parts using those...OSG, KEO and, I think, Latrobe use to make those. Now, I believe, there is only Harvey and they are insanely expensive...
Thank you for your videos - the are excellent!
This is a really fantastic video that demonstrates the core essentials of using Corner Rounders! Would you mind if we referenced it on our new website?
Thanks and I wouldn't mind at all. The more viewers you send my way, the better. You may want to mention my website as well, tomstechniques.com.
Thanks
Tom
Excellent! We've added it to our website! Thanks much. Really great presentation! www.destinytool.com/corner-rounders.html
I have visited your site. And it just gave me an idea to suggest to both of you. If you manufacture this tolls and if Tom presents tutorial on using, if you give Tom some tools for his milling machine hen could use it as example and make some good propaganda since most of his viewers are from this area.. Just a suggestion. I hope I am not been silly. But give Tom a whole set of this tools so he can show us his viwers.
Hi Tom. Do you deliberately make your pass on the trailing edge? Normally I would feed the other way on the leading edge of the cutter for a cleaner cut.
Swansong18
If you mean do I intentionally climb mill, the answer is yes. Climb milling produces a much better finish than conventional milling. You do need to be careful when climb milling on light machinery because the cutter may grab. There it would be better to conventional mill to remove stock and climb mill for a good finish.
Tom
Good info, but swapping work in the vise with the machine running is one of those things that's only OK until it's not. You appear to still have all 10 digits, so you're lucky.
Not lucky, experienced. When you work with machinery on a daily basis, for as long as I have (45 years), you develop a sense of what you can get away with without getting hurt. One of the most difficult things about making these videos is filtering that sort of thing out so novices don't get the wrong idea of what is safe and what is not. Thanks for pointing that potentially dangerous practice. It certainly is not acceptable practice for a novice machinist.
Tom
Once again, thanks Tom! I keep leaving an edge on the top face when trying to use the corner rounding endmill. Does the radius have to be the entire endmill radius? Only reason I ask is because on some applications I'd like to have a small radius rather than a chamfer.
Watch the video again, around 2:40.
Tom
Hi Tom.....It is really a good tips and demonstration. It is really an artistic job to work on the milling machine. However i am a beginner, though i have some idea. But i have not worked on milling machine. I just want to learn to operate. Is there any baby milling machine available for beginners? And if so,what will be approximate cost? Please let me know.
Grizzly offers quite a few bench top mills starting around $1000. Just stay away from the round column types because they lack rigidity.
Tom
Thanks for the vid, learned something.
Great video, very helpful
Thanks!
Those cutters are ground so you can touch off the bottom and get exactly what you want. I think its .005 or .010 then the radius starts
Sorry David, but none of my cutters are like that. Most are around .05" greater than the radius and vary from cutter to cutter depending on size. I suppose it's possible that some are made that way, but I have never come across any.
Tom
How do you Calculate the Speed and Feed for a Corner Rounding End Mill? That lookk fast even with Aluminum
The same as with any end mill; 4 x cutting speed (surface feet per minute) / diameter. You can't really go too fast on aluminum and other non-ferrous metals. The limiting factor on aluminum is when it starts sticking to the cutter.
@@TomsTechniques Thank you. I love your videos.
awesome video!
Would it be possible to pick this part up again at a 45° angle and then round thr edges over properly?
The axis of the corner rounding end mill has to be parallel to the side, or perpendicular to the top of the part. The only way to make them work off angle would be to tilt the head of the mill. It's normally a better option to orient the part to the end mill rather than the other way around.
I think that I can use this same set up when rounding over with my woos router table!
Excellent videos!
Thanks!
What material were you cutting? It is all fun and games till you break out the tool steel ;-)
Tom,
Do you use the same technique for mild steel? ie... climb mill with a one shot full depth pass? Obviously slower speeds for steel.
Glen,
It depends on the size of the radius. On my mill, a large one like a 3/4" would require a couple of cuts, but a 1/8" or 1/4" would only take one. Of course that is on my mill, a lighter mill would require more cuts. You have to know the capability of your machine to decide.
Tom
Thanks Tom, I have a similar sized machine.
Jut acquired a set of corner rounding mills a while back and only used them once so far. Will use your advice next time around.
Anyone ever tell you your voice on this video sounds like Norm McDonald?
Nice technique. I have a different process for setting them up, but more complicated.
what brand of files do you recommend? i know Nicholson is made in brazil now
Sadley, I have not found any files that cut as well as the old U.S. made Nicholson's. Grob used to make good ones, but even those are now made in India. I have read that dull files can be resharpened a couple of times by etching them in a 10% solution of sulfuric acid, but I haven't tried it. Maybe those old Nicholson's have some life left in them?
@@TomsTechniques thanks- maybe we should copy some old Nicholson's?
My vice lifts on the clamping end (not the fixed end) and I don't know how to correct for this.
Not sure what you have, but a lot of the Chinese knock off vises have this problem. Kurt AngleLock vises have a wedge feature that pulls the movable jaw down when tightened. If yours doesn't have this feature, all you can do is attempt to reduce the vertical play in the movable jaw, so it doesn't lift so much when tightened.
Dear Mr Toms, I found your video very useful for the cornering, would you mind if I copy the video and show them to my students?
Be my guest. The more people who learn from my videos, the better.
Tom
ok Thank you very much.
By the way do you know any machine tools suppliers?
What are you looking for and where are you from?
Im from hong kong, actually I have a friend who manufacture and supplies CNC machine tools around europe and US and I was thinking that if you are interested in his business that would be great.
You led me to believe that you were looking for a supplier. Now I find out that you are just promoting a friends business? That is not what UA-cam is for.
Thanks Matthew.
Can you do 1 pass for mild steel or would you recommend a few passes. What RPM for a 1/4" radius tool in mild steel?
That depends on the size of the radius and the rigidity of your mill. I can do one pass with mine up to 1/4"R on steel, but larger radii require several.
The rpm of any cutter depends on the diameter of the cutter, not the radius. Measure the OD and use 4XCS/DIA to calculate the rpm. There is a chart on my website that lists the cutting speeds for various metals.
Tom
How bout 416 stainless? Any help appreciated
416 is one of the free machining stainless steels. It has the same cutting speed as mild steel with a machinability rating of 85%. Treat it the same as mild steel and you should be fine. Just be sure to use cutting oil on the radius cutter because of the added friction.
good video, thanks Tom...
Thanks Paul.
How do i know what size end mill to use for my project?
Bigger is generally better for a cut. Limiting factors would be any corner radii on the part, pocket dimensions, or slot widths.
A torque wrench should be used so the solid jaw push back after clamping will be uniform.
Hmmm, I haven't heard that one before. Exactly how much torque should be applied?
Thanks Guys.
Tom very cool thank you
Thanks Tom!
HI Mr Tom
i saw ur video...how to calculate RPM with the formula..4*speed/Diameter
i want to cut a design in the ms iron sheet with 8mm cutter how till wecalculate
+subash sharma
Just convert the diameter of the cutter to inches and use the formula. Mild steel has a cutting speed of 100 surface feet per minute.
Tom
according to your formula...4*speed / diameter.
if we convert 8 mm into inches , we get 0.341.
Now
4*100= 400
400/0.3149=1270.2
that means Rpm should be 1270 only.
My tool get weared on this RPM.
Sir, Please guide me .
sir..please reply me
+subash sharma
1270 rpm is correct for mild steel.
will it work for vmc
Not good practice to let the parallels fall on dirty/chip laden vice flats then continue. Should have air blasted between each changeover. :)
Normally I use a brush because air tends to blow dirt where it doesn't belong.
Ah yes, I've heard of some shops using brushes instead of air to reduce air use thus reduce cost not for that though. The more you know! I'm the lead machinist where I work, we use air but I'm also a clean freak when it comes to everything setup related as well as part change overs.
Toms Techniques Can you give me the specifications of the machine that you are using in this video clip for me? I reaaly need it.
BSevenShido BSevenShido aIf you do not have an answer yet it appears to be an older Bridgeport. The Bridgeport is a very common manual light duty mill. Some of the old versions have a 1 HP step pulley drive and the later models have a 2 hp variable speed drive. Just research Bridgeport milling machines. His mill might be about 30 to 40 years old.
crosstimbers2
Actually it's a DoAll 200V knee mill. It is almost identical as a Bridgeport, but when I purchased it in the mid 80's, it was of better quality than the Bridgeports that Textron was building. It has a variable speed head and a 9"x49" table.
Tom
Nice
Noisey bearing in your quill
No. It was a worn out bronze bushing in the variable speed pulley. I made a new one and it's as good as new.
Is it me or you're climb milling on a manual mill?
I rarely conventional mill. It's hard on the cutters and leaves a poor finish. It just requires an understanding of the forces climb milling puts on the machine, so compensation can be made by controlling the depth of cut, size of cutter or dragging a table lock. It's probably not a good idea to be taking a heavy climb cut with a large end mill on a light bench mill, but most knee mills are plenty rigid enough to handle it. You just have to know what your machine is capable of.
Tom
I need this machine
can you sell how much it
How much you got?
50,000
Ill corner round aluminum with my teeth for 50 G's
You can get cheaper one made in germany. But okay.
Same principle, different speeds.
Now let's make some dice!
Never get the same finish on different metals
Not sure what that means.
Top
4 futes? Are you sure?
Let's see, 1, 2, 3, 4
Yup. Four flutes. Still had one extra finger left, but didn't need it. :)
Nice video.
Thanks
hola!necesitoinformacions osbre las caracterizticas deun fresa cnc enmill bull
end mill flat y end mill slutt
I got the hello part, but neither I or Google can translate the rest.
Thanks for watching.
Tom
Toms Techniques
I believe that, that's Portuguese not Spanish
Along with a few grammatical and/or spelling errors as well I suspect. Google Translate didn't know what to do with it.
Thanks
Thank you. At least now I know what the message was. Now if I just knew what information he wanted. :) Sometimes face to face is the only way to communicate effectively.
Tom
this was an interesting vid for me. the thing i'd really like to know is: how the hell did the internet know I had problems with this tool last night? really... this was offered up, not searched for. bizarre.
Google knows everything about you. :(
Shouldn't mill with the quill down like that, even on small applications the added stress reduces life span of tool. Safety first!
It's all relative Nick. I prefer to leave the quill extended for better access, and in the case of shooting a video, better visibility. If a job requires more rigidity, then it will be retracted as necessary. Not sure what you mean by "Safety first!"
This actually a good idea for a video. To demonstrate when it is necessary to retract the quill, and when it just doesn't matter.
Tom
crikey, climb milling on a turret mill, bet you don't do heavy cuts like that! :-) good video Tom.
I actually do all the time. Heavy cuts when end milling (up to half the diameter of the end mill) are actually less apt to grab than the light cuts in this video. You just need to know the capability of your machine.
Thanks for watching.
Tom
Toms Techniques not in my tired old BP! :-)
You forgot to zoom in again
See you later
I made it by myself. I used woodprix woodworking plans for that.
Not use stainless steel ,cast iron ,mild steel, toughen steel
The corner rounding end mill will indeed work on stainless, cast iron, and mild steel if the proper cutting speeds are followed and coolant is applied. You are correct, they will not work on hardened steel.
Hi Tom . Will a dove tail cutter work the same way on steel ? thanx for the cool videos
This guy sounds like norm McDonald.
I was going to say the same thing.
Really great video!!! Love the hardinge HLVH in the background!!!!! Ran those lathes for over 50+ years. Ran all of hardinges equipment, hlvh, dv59’s chuckers, milling machines, and last lathe I obtained was hlvh-e/m. I think they make absolutely the best equipment in America!!!!!!
Never had a machine down in all those years!!!! Cutting threads on the hlvh really spoils you for cutting threads on any other engine lathe.
Thanks. The Hardinge is definitely bullet proof. I've only had one issue since purchasing mine in the 80's and it was just an electrical relay.
Tom
I'm glad you subscribed as well.
I could never get used to the minus Y thing, so I always picked up the front left corner of the part for CNC. Like anything else, just use what works for you.
Tom
Man I just have to say there is really no point of trying to seat it if you have your parrallels set like that.
I think you missed the fact that they were shifted in to clear the radii on the part, also that they were both tight after hammering the part down.
Tom,
You know I have followed you from the first video, And for a while I have been thinking of asking you to make a segment of movie on the correct use of "T" slot cutters and cutting. I have done quite a few jobs recently, and kind of fumbled my way through. So I believe being shown the correct way will not only aid me and others in the long run, But also dispel any bad habits I and others had taught ourselves...
Thanks in advance Tom. Regards Matt
Thanks for the tips on using these. A point about the filing near the end - instead of rocking the file forward (away from you) over the sharp edge, start on the back side and rock the file back towards you. It feels weird at the start but only a tiny bit of practice to get the feel of it and you will find it’s far easier to make a very nice filed radius. Cheers, al
Hi Tom,
Thanks for all the great tips. I've learned alot from you. I'm surprized that you lay your tools and parts right on the ways of your mill. My shop teacher would have killed us for that. He showed us how to make plywood covers for our ways. Is that a good idea or wasted time? Thanks, Kevin.
Do you mean the table Kevin? I've seen tool organizers used before that fit into the T-slots and they are probably a good idea in theory, but I've always thought that they would get in the way and be more trouble than they are worth. Nothing wrong with trying it out though, maybe you would like them.
Thanks for watching.
Tom
I do have a DRO, but it doesn't help in this case. Once the two faces of the part are picked up with it against the solid jaw of the vise and the dials or stops set to zero, backlash doesn't come into play. In the video, I raise the tool with the quill to get it clear of the part and then return it against the quill stop. If your mill doesn't have a quill, you can leave Y locked and remove the part to return the cutter, or back off the Y or Z axis and then return it to zero with your dials.
Tom
Third year Apprentice Millwright comin here 10 years after your post!!
Much appreciated but I’d love to know the RPM you ran at
@@---co9cs I'm still here, ten years after. I generally run corner rounding end mills half the rpm of an end mill of the same size.
Guys in my shop don't wanna teach me fuck it I'll do it myself
I sure miss your videos Tom! Good stuff worth watching a few times for sure!
Once I get my life back in order with this retirement thing, I'll crank out some more videos. Right now I'm whittling away at a huge honey do list. :)
Tom
Almost every milling video I've seen there is aluminum being used which as we all know is easy to work with. When you work with steel to me it is a different story requiring lighter/multiple cuts to achieve a nice finish. I'd like to see the instructor passing on knowledge on working with steel. NOT aluminum. Thanks for the video.
If you had to watch me machine this part in steel, you would quickly get bored and lose interest. We use aluminum because it speeds up the video and keeps it interesting. The principles are the same, regardless of what you are machining.
Thanks!
Thank you Tom!!! Another good video!!! Do you have DRO's on your mill? If not, how do you deal with back lash and getting back to zero?
Yesterday I used 0.063 corner round to make a radius on a Handel I'm making, yes if you go to deep you'll have a burr.
I like the idea of having my stop located on the vise itself, keeps the table clear and stays with the vise if you have to move it for whatever reason.
I'm taking a machine tool class at my local college. I love it!! Why didn't I do this kind of thing before?
Thanks, wasn’t sure how to do this. Will use carbide wood router bits on Delrin black parts🤗🤗
Hi Tom, does the standard CSx4/D formula apply for corner rounding end mills?
I'll be using a 1/4" and 1/8" on an aluminum project very soon.
Let me know, thanks.
It sure does. Use the outer diameter of the cutter to calculate the proper rpm.
Tom
Could you use a carbide router bit to radius aluminum. The shaft could be too weak.
You can buy router bits with 1/2" shanks, but the price would be comparable to a HSS corner rounding end mill.
Thank you Nice