Just want to say as per shop manual the turbo, manifold, and cat will come off all in one piece witch will avoid taking the studs out and creating more room to take the pan off aswell.
Safe to say you're likely OKAY as long as you're not constantly driving aggressively/track driving, if so you should look into getting this fixed; If not you may be able to put this off, hoping for recall on issue. To potentially expedite this process, it may help for all VB owners (Or enthusiast that want to help out) to file a safety problem through nhtsa (Google if you're unfamiliar). Mass complaints around this issue will force Subaru to place a recall (If not it's at least worth a try).
I don't think they will make an recall，even the bottom of the pick up is blocked，it is still fine for 99.9 of people's daily use，that pick up not only suck oil from bottom but also from side，the problem happened most on track，but you will never know those blow motor is because the RTV or the oil pan since all FA motor does not have any buffle like EJ does
You guys are fine. Imagine if you will, drinking a fountain drink soda and the straw get clogged by a piece of ice at the opposite end so you are u able to receive any soda. Take that same straw, but it now has 4 additional holes for soda to enter through. A piece of ice getting stuck at the end, preventing you from drinking soda is not going to happen. Same principle with the oil pickup box that has four additional sides with holes to allow oil to flow through. Don't believe, ask real race shops like CounterSpace Garage if this is an issue. They'll tell you it's not. The real issue is running these cars on track without an oil cooler or money shifting. Once oil Temps hit 260+, oil pressures drops to below 50 and your internals aren't being properly lubricated since the oil is thinning out from the heat, resulting in pressure drop.
You can probably check this with those small inspection cameras rather than pulling the pan which would not void your warranty. Seen people do that on an 86 through the oil drain.
Nylon razor blades work well to remove the RTV, especially scraping with the corner of the blade. Yeah, Subaru's in general has issues with the RTV just because it uses it to seal the engine just all over the place AND the way it applies the RTV towards the inner side of the mating surface. Globs of RTV collect on the falloff/groove. And when the chunks fall off, they go to the pickup..... Great video.
I think the big question is, will Subaru ever own up to the problem when it becomes fully documentable? Or do they settle a class action lawsuit as that might be the cheaper route? Kind of a terrifying situation when you consider the macro economics of the situation...
Subaru has 5 year/60k engine warranty right? As much as I'm concerned about this, I think best course of action is do nothing about it for now. Best case scenario they'll issue a recall/TSB, or they'll improve in future model years and I'd pay the depreciation and trade-in for a newer year. If it breaks during warranty then it'll be covered under warranty. The worst part about this plan is I can't go full out on modding... sucks to be in this position.
You really take an amazing time capturing these ultra high quality shots to walk us through every step. Awesome job! This has certainly made the job go from intimidating and challenging to downright scary and impossible for a noob DIYer
It’s illegal for a manufacture to void your warranty because you or someone else performed maintenance on your car. It’s perfectly ok to go to a different mechanic to have the rtv redone. It can’t legally void your warranty
I was going to buy a 2024 GR86, but scared away due to this RTV issue. I don't plan on tracking it, but it is a car I would of used as a daily and hope to keep it for a decade. With the RTV issue I worry about the reliability and longevity especially with how subaru is getting a bad rap with class action law suites against them for electronics and other things. I did today ask the sales manager the local "stealership" who has 2 GR86's coming in (so basically need to put a deposit down to lock them in) if the RTV issue was fixed on the 2024 models. His response was "we have not heard anything from Toyota regarding this issue for 2023 or 2024. Unless its big enough where Toyota will have a recall, I am not really sure what this issue is and how many cars are impacted." The GR86 checks all the boxes for me, but I can't move forward taking my hard earned cash and putting it into this since I feel Subaru has been making engines for a long time and this sounds like a simple fix to me - and the fact they are keeping everyone in the dark tells me they are not doing anything to fix the problem. The cars are 34k msrp where I live, vs 29k msrp. Just way to much to buy for something that may turn into a headache down the road. Really appreciate posting this video and educating folks on this. WRX and GR86 are great cars, but when I think of Subaru I don't think "reliability". I owned a 1998 Subara Imprezza 2.5RS. I bought it new and 4k miles after ownership, the engine had to be rebuilt due to some defect. At 26k miles, the drive-shaft fell off when driving down the highway. I avoided Subaru's ever since that expierence but will willing to give them a 2nd chance with the GR86, but the red flags still in 2024 are there that Subuaru does sloppy work, just so happy I found this out now rather then 4k miles down the road.
While you had the oil pan off, you should have welded a second screw-in bung where the oil-pick up tube is. Ansix Auto has a kit which does this, but it's super $$$ (!). If you have an access hole directly under the pick-up, you can reach up there with a pick or suction tube and get the RTV out. This epic effort for a few bits of RTV is ridiculous; Subaru needs a good punching for this. Also, going through all of this, just to put RTV back on. Man, that's confidence! Why can't there be a normal gasket??
Getting a second drain plug in for the pick up is GENIUS that way every oil change you could easily stick a scope in to check and honestly I think the mating surface is just too small for a solid gasket to work.
I was going to buy a GR86 but the RTV issues and Toyota/Subaru's abysmal lack of response to such a critical issue is appalling and has completely turned me off wanting to buy the car. Its a shame because the car is otherwise great. Just shows a complete lack of attention/care by Subaru and Toyota on such an important issue.
Glad I didnt pull $$$$$ out of the bank for the new 2023 WRX or GR86/BRZ. It was still early to own from the production year. A lot more problems we will see from a real world usage of the new engine platform. Let just hope Subaru make the fix on these.
I don’t understand why we can’t just use a damn regular seal instead if the damn liquid sealant that in the 20 years I have never seen work 100% and they almost always leak. And what’s up with the shitty studs and bolts?
@@BoostedFB6 Subaru ECUs do not have oil pressure parameter values for an AP to monitor. Subaru only use dummy lights and when that goes off, you're too late. All turbo Subarus need an oil pressure gauge imo.
@@rallysportdirect maybe I’ll try that out if I pick up one of these cars, debating letting my Tundra go now that I got a Suburban to haul the kids around.
Great stuff. My base 22 wrx is only used as a daily driver, no tuning or modding for more power. Do u think i will ne OK to leave as is concerning rtv issue ?? Thanks again for the video.
It would be restrictive and redundant. Oil filter should take care of any particulate. If the factory messes up the rtv that is a different problem but a screen wouldn't help it.
doing your own check/repair will not void your warranty, dealers must prove that any work/mod damaged the vehicle, if a dealer gives you a hard time, call the corporate
Well I used my buddies judgment on that and I can confidently say he’s an amazing mechanic, but for some reassurance the bead we put on was about the size of what I had scraped just off of the inside lip of the pan so probably about 1/3-1/4 of what Subaru squirted on there.
@@ryanpolk8754 I tried to do that last month when I changed the oil on my '22. I couldn't see anything in there with it but maybe I just have a crappy cheap borescope- IDK. Would be cool if Subaru figured out a way to snake something up the drain hole that could see any pieces in the pick up and suck them out or something.
Possibility? Yes, we won't really know though. i'd say the best way to get an idea is to look at the timing covers up front above the turbo, if you see a bunch of RTV sticking out then it's definitely not fixed.
I've got a wrx this just sad to see, we pay our hard earned money and a car that is still not complete as it should be is just pathetic. They could've pushed it back to a 2023-24.
Pretty much all Subaru's will have this problem. If you ever disassemble the engine, take a close look at how much and where the RTV is applied. It's inevitable that chunks of RTV in the inner falloff/grove next to the mating surface will fall off over time. If Subaru can figure out how to consistently apply RTV, their quality would improve dramatically.
What can I say to the dealership to get them to check this for me while its under warranty? "The oil pressure feels weird...please do 4 days of work now?"
Warranty… They can claim it voids the warranty, it can not. That policy is not enforceable and is against the law. They have to prove that any work you do to your car was the direct cause of a failure. Now, they may try to pull some BS, and you may have to threaten them with a lawyer… If you had to take them to court, they are not likely going to push it, the cost of legal fees is more than a new engine or part. This only applies to the US based customers, I don’t know about other countries.
Tbh I would use for this oil pan some red gasket maker( it’s like a jelly and when it compresses create a solid gasket but when it goes to the oil it’s dissolve in the oil
If you're keeping it stock then I'd recommend paying the "stealership" some cash to check it for you. That way you get to keep your warranty and have some peace of mind. Only problem: someone in a 22 WRX group said their dealer quoted them 540$ to do it which is absurd.
@@sebastien4565 I tried this just a couple minutes ago and it doesn't work. The oil pickup sits too low in the pan and at an angle from the drain plug point to where it's likely impossible to get the camera up the tube. Sadly the only way to make sure of the problem is to drop the pan...
WHAT IN THE ACTUAL F^@K…. I’m JUST now finding out about this an I literally bought my 2023 last week…. Not only that, I actually see the RTV literally staring at the engine from the outside…. WOWWWWW
Also, a lot of the guys at the front desk of the service area make money off commission, so when it's a warranty job, they don't make anything. Also, SOA often under pays for the job. I remember reading from a tech on reddit they only pay like 20 hours for an engine swap, and the tech was saying even the best mechanic being careful can't do it in under 27 hours. So he see's guys rush, and often those cars come right back in. That or you don't get paid the difference as a tech.
I talked on the phone with the guy in charge the warranty program with SOA, and he admitted they can deny touching your car at all for any modification, including window tints, which is the run around they gave me to refuse to look at a low speed stutter issue. I had an extended warranty, so when they did that, I went and canceled my warranty and got most of my money back. I also told the sales guys that I'll never buy another Subaru from you because you won't honor my warranty, they were shocked and denied that what I was told was what they said. I've never owned anything but a subaru, and I was debating trading in for new wrx, but after my experience with my current subaru, I'm done. Not every car brand plays these games.
Highly likely. Just not an enthusiast car, owners are likely unaware and therefore there isn't much public knowledge. This isn't really an issue for a normal travelling, commuter car. A lot more threatening to an aggressively driven, likely track used car such as the WRX, GR86 or BRZ.
Okay, should I buy the extended mileage warranty and run it till it blows or just hope a class action law suit happens and they fucking fix it for free? I have about 5k on mine, the car is fun, but I'm not rich, so I don't want to tune something and have to spend 15k for a new motor to have them put another busted piece of shit in it.
I’d say talk to your dealer and see if they’d drop the pan, I’ve heard of dealers saying that if they find RTV they won’t charge. But I’ve also heard of dealers quoting 1300$ for the job so really depends on yours. If they do want to take an arm and a leg then steer clear of mods that may void your warranty.
daaam and i was in the fence to order a new 23 WRX as a daily driver smh imma just keep my cheap 2000 car for now lol my summer car is a 19 5.0 mustang
Even may of 2022 could have this issue, since just NOW it's becoming a bigger topic for the VB WRX... They will need/want a lot of complaints before they make a fix. Fixes cost money. Subaru, just like every corporation, want to save money and take their time to see if they can get away with it.
The thing about the warranty is such horse shit! They give you a bloody free track day when you buy the car ffs! Lol I'm shopping right now between a WRX, GTI, and possibly an Elantra N. One of the things I'm asking for if I go with the WRX is for them to drop the oil pan and prove the RTV is good. Also, dropping an oil pan should not void warranty unless you fuck it up. I still have to research if it's even a problem on the 23 model. You would think at this point they would have retrained their employees on how to apply RTV properly. An engine replacement is not a warranty repair any manufacturer wants to do. The goal these days is to make the wearable parts more expensive and wear faster, while making anything covered by warranty more reliable. Obviously, some manufacturers do this better than others. Toyota gas proven that this formula works. The Germans went a little heavy on the expensive suspension and brake parts. One reason labor is so expensive on vehicles is that manufacturers give unrealistic time frames on repairs, resulting in shops losing money on warranty repairs. I saw a job that paid 5 hours under warranty, take 2 days because the exhaust system had to be removed, and the transmission dropped.
Just like with my F80 m3 don't be like the cheap asses that don't get there crankhub fixed. Just get it fixed. But it's a Suburu. Should've known better
Why did you make your life so hard for yourself ? the turbo comes out with the manifold. just removed the oil feed banjo at the top, pcv hose and coolant hose, removed the charge pipe clip and connectors. removed the turbo manifold assembly together. you dont need to remove everything separate. I do these almost everyday.
Great video. Very detailed and informative. Massive PITA to do this job and 99%+ of us won't or can't DIY. SOA is going to fight to the death to avoid having to pay dealers to do this job as a recall. What a mess. I'm new to WRXs - so is this why Subaru didn't put an oil psi gauge on this car like most other sports/muscle cars?
It’s not the reason, Subaru to my knowledge has never had an oil pressure gauge in a WRX but I believe it does have a pressure sensor which means you could monitor it with a COBB AP
@@rallysportdirect I was being somewhat sarcastic- I do think it's very odd that these cars don't have a common oil psi gauge like virtually every other performance car and would be very helpful as far as the customer being able to monitor this RTV sealant problem.
95% of "oil gauges" you see in cars and trucks aren’t. You will notice the needle doesn’t track oil pressure directly, only indirectly move to low medium or high indicated positions. There are too many dumb dumbs who would freak out seeing the realtime oil pressure fluctuating.
@@m0r0gu3 my daily driver - a '15 Challenger R/T- has real-time oil psi (as well as other vitals) that's easily scrolled to from the steering wheel by the speedometer. I have no reason to think it's not accurate. This is not a very expensive car. In fact it cost a bit less than my '22 WRX. Why couldn't SOA incorporate something like that into this car? I'd gladly trade the Starlink, the birthday notifications and the "check back seat" warning for this vastly more important feature. Oil Temp is nice but oil psi is just as important if not more IMO.
@@jedwin4816 The rest of Chrysler/jeep/ram just have the fake gauge, if there’s one in the cluster. The last real oil pressure guage I saw was around 2000 on an early wj, and it was subsequently decontented. Sadly, my 2004 wj has a dummy guage. You get your oil pressure info thanks to Daimler.
ua-cam.com/video/4Jk5WTWoqt4/v-deo.html (watch this video) I have a 23 brz and they have data proven oil pressure issues on high g right hand turns. The rtv maybe a culprit but not the whole issue. Since this engine is shared in the wrx to some extent (compression with turbo difference) I felt like sharing info here. If you drop your pan or change your oil to a different weight or add a oil baffle etc. then that may compromise your warranty if your engine grenades. Subaru will never do a recall for this because there is only a extreme minority of engine failures to pay out of pocket vs 1000's of labor charges to drop an oil pan to clean rtv predicated on no real data as the main culprit and the oil tube screen box is setup to still function properly even with substantial rtv in the tube.
Oh trust me I was on that video like syrup on pancakes 😅 from what I understand the FA24DIT in the wrx has a different oiling system which isn’t subject to the same thing as the brz motor (supposedly) the RTV and oil drop in corners do indeed seem to be different issues. What was interesting in that video was the brz which had its pickup cleaned out seemed to have better oil pressure across the board that the other ones, could be just a coincidence would require further testing to be sure.
@@rallysportdirect I would be curious to see the wrx do the same test/course. If wrx doesnt have any oiling issues I may just trade in brz. I dont track it but I dont want to keep it and it grenade after the warranty is over.
Not much better. Issues Just shift from one place on the engine to another and 10 year intervals to correct the flaws. Trying to sell my ej257 and done with them
![Lp. Сердце Вселенной #60 РОЖДЕНИЕ ЛОЛОЛОШКИ [Финал] • Майнкрафт](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/YoR0pAV9FVQ/mqdefault.jpg)
Just want to say as per shop manual the turbo, manifold, and cat will come off all in one piece witch will avoid taking the studs out and creating more room to take the pan off aswell.
I figured thanks for confirming!
Safe to say you're likely OKAY as long as you're not constantly driving aggressively/track driving, if so you should look into getting this fixed; If not you may be able to put this off, hoping for recall on issue. To potentially expedite this process, it may help for all VB owners (Or enthusiast that want to help out) to file a safety problem through nhtsa (Google if you're unfamiliar). Mass complaints around this issue will force Subaru to place a recall (If not it's at least worth a try).
Thanks family
You’re on the dot
I am puzzled as to why this is not a recall item.
As much as I want to do this myself, I’ll wait until Subaru makes it a recall/TSB
Time will tell, they might not. It might not be an issue for 99% of people. We will see.
I'm thinking the same... but This video made me nervous.
I don't think they will make an recall，even the bottom of the pick up is blocked，it is still fine for 99.9 of people's daily use，that pick up not only suck oil from bottom but also from side，the problem happened most on track，but you will never know those blow motor is because the RTV or the oil pan since all FA motor does not have any buffle like EJ does
I think the TSB is already out on this motor since the outback shares this motor if I’m not mistaken
You guys are fine. Imagine if you will, drinking a fountain drink soda and the straw get clogged by a piece of ice at the opposite end so you are u able to receive any soda. Take that same straw, but it now has 4 additional holes for soda to enter through. A piece of ice getting stuck at the end, preventing you from drinking soda is not going to happen. Same principle with the oil pickup box that has four additional sides with holes to allow oil to flow through. Don't believe, ask real race shops like CounterSpace Garage if this is an issue. They'll tell you it's not. The real issue is running these cars on track without an oil cooler or money shifting. Once oil Temps hit 260+, oil pressures drops to below 50 and your internals aren't being properly lubricated since the oil is thinning out from the heat, resulting in pressure drop.
What is the build date on your VB?
was this production issue addressed for the 2023 model
You can probably check this with those small inspection cameras rather than pulling the pan which would not void your warranty. Seen people do that on an 86 through the oil drain.
That is a great solution. I should see if there's a video of this. Thx.
Thinking about buying a WRX, found you researching the car and I ended up watching this whole video. Great editing and well put together video, bravo!
Did you pull the trigger?
nope
@@OGYELLOW
Nylon razor blades work well to remove the RTV, especially scraping with the corner of the blade. Yeah, Subaru's in general has issues with the RTV just because it uses it to seal the engine just all over the place AND the way it applies the RTV towards the inner side of the mating surface. Globs of RTV collect on the falloff/groove. And when the chunks fall off, they go to the pickup..... Great video.
Any clue as to when they readjusted their robots to fix the excess RTV issue? As to after what build date? Thanks!
I think the big question is, will Subaru ever own up to the problem when it becomes fully documentable? Or do they settle a class action lawsuit as that might be the cheaper route? Kind of a terrifying situation when you consider the macro economics of the situation...
Subaru has 5 year/60k engine warranty right? As much as I'm concerned about this, I think best course of action is do nothing about it for now. Best case scenario they'll issue a recall/TSB, or they'll improve in future model years and I'd pay the depreciation and trade-in for a newer year. If it breaks during warranty then it'll be covered under warranty. The worst part about this plan is I can't go full out on modding... sucks to be in this position.
Well even all of that aside, it is a new platform so in general it wouldn't be a good idea to go full out on modding
You really take an amazing time capturing these ultra high quality shots to walk us through every step. Awesome job! This has certainly made the job go from intimidating and challenging to downright scary and impossible for a noob DIYer
Probably a dumb question.
Why Subaru don't use a regular gasket on the oil pan instead of RTV?
To save money
It’s illegal for a manufacture to void your warranty because you or someone else performed maintenance on your car.
It’s perfectly ok to go to a different mechanic to have the rtv redone. It can’t legally void your warranty
look for silicone disolver in the tile section at your local hd or slows
Sorry not familiar with engine coding but could this issue also be present with the Outback’s?
I was going to buy a 2024 GR86, but scared away due to this RTV issue. I don't plan on tracking it, but it is a car I would of used as a daily and hope to keep it for a decade. With the RTV issue I worry about the reliability and longevity especially with how subaru is getting a bad rap with class action law suites against them for electronics and other things. I did today ask the sales manager the local "stealership" who has 2 GR86's coming in (so basically need to put a deposit down to lock them in) if the RTV issue was fixed on the 2024 models. His response was "we have not heard anything from Toyota regarding this issue for 2023 or 2024. Unless its big enough where Toyota will have a recall, I am not really sure what this issue is and how many cars are impacted." The GR86 checks all the boxes for me, but I can't move forward taking my hard earned cash and putting it into this since I feel Subaru has been making engines for a long time and this sounds like a simple fix to me - and the fact they are keeping everyone in the dark tells me they are not doing anything to fix the problem. The cars are 34k msrp where I live, vs 29k msrp. Just way to much to buy for something that may turn into a headache down the road. Really appreciate posting this video and educating folks on this. WRX and GR86 are great cars, but when I think of Subaru I don't think "reliability". I owned a 1998 Subara Imprezza 2.5RS. I bought it new and 4k miles after ownership, the engine had to be rebuilt due to some defect. At 26k miles, the drive-shaft fell off when driving down the highway. I avoided Subaru's ever since that expierence but will willing to give them a 2nd chance with the GR86, but the red flags still in 2024 are there that Subuaru does sloppy work, just so happy I found this out now rather then 4k miles down the road.
Thanks for doing this. Every video helps with the inevitable class action suit that will be coming if Subaru doesn’t handle this correctly.
It all comes off in one piece. As a dealer tech I've had to drop it all for pan reseals a few times
Yeah I learned it the hard way… At least when we do a j-pipe I won’t have to deal with those studs ever again.
Hello what’s is the flexible extension you use called ? Where is it available?
🤷♂️ Is there any way to blow air or pour oil from top of the engine to make that rtv come out the mesh and drop into the pan ?
While you had the oil pan off, you should have welded a second screw-in bung where the oil-pick up tube is. Ansix Auto has a kit which does this, but it's super $$$ (!). If you have an access hole directly under the pick-up, you can reach up there with a pick or suction tube and get the RTV out. This epic effort for a few bits of RTV is ridiculous; Subaru needs a good punching for this. Also, going through all of this, just to put RTV back on. Man, that's confidence! Why can't there be a normal gasket??
Getting a second drain plug in for the pick up is GENIUS that way every oil change you could easily stick a scope in to check and honestly I think the mating surface is just too small for a solid gasket to work.
Make the bung huge and do it with the pan still on the car to avoid all this disassemblely
I was thinking. Make the dealer pull the pan and inspect. But if there is no gasket, and have to use more silicon. Likely just going to mess it up.
is this a problem in the 23's as well?
Does this give a smell in the cab of the car during heavy load?
I was going to buy a GR86 but the RTV issues and Toyota/Subaru's abysmal lack of response to such a critical issue is appalling and has completely turned me off wanting to buy the car. Its a shame because the car is otherwise great. Just shows a complete lack of attention/care by Subaru and Toyota on such an important issue.
Glad I didnt pull $$$$$ out of the bank for the new 2023 WRX or GR86/BRZ. It was still early to own from the production year. A lot more problems we will see from a real world usage of the new engine platform. Let just hope Subaru make the fix on these.
I don’t understand why we can’t just use a damn regular seal instead if the damn liquid sealant that in the 20 years I have never seen work 100% and they almost always leak. And what’s up with the shitty studs and bolts?
Either Subaru steps up and fixes the issue or there’s going to be a lemon lawsuit for sure.
Time for all us VB owners to get oil pressure gauges
Believe accessport reads oil pressure but that also can be denied for warranty repairs 😂
@@BoostedFB6 Subaru ECUs do not have oil pressure parameter values for an AP to monitor. Subaru only use dummy lights and when that goes off, you're too late. All turbo Subarus need an oil pressure gauge imo.
@absolutely failz fuel pressure is monitored, water is not.
@@KennyJ540that is just some backwards shit. Performance vehicle with no OP guage. 😑
So happy I've ditched Subaru. This is the last wrx and good ridden.
Does this apply to the new 2023 VBs? I would hope they have been aware of the issue and fixed it by this gen.
Unfortunately don’t have an answer for you :(
Has anyone hooked up an oil pressure gauge to the car ? I got a level sensor light the other day with 2k miles on the car.
Dang RSD is doing some intense how-to's now! Videos are looking good.
Mine blew up and Subaru is trying not to cover my bumper-bumper on the new engine
Is there any way to use an inspection scope to get in the drain hole and up into the pickup tube to check vs removing the oil pan?
Bottom of the Pickup is really close to the oil pan I’d say it’s possible but it won’t be easy
@@rallysportdirect maybe I’ll try that out if I pick up one of these cars, debating letting my Tundra go now that I got a Suburban to haul the kids around.
Great stuff. My base 22 wrx is only used as a daily driver, no tuning or modding for more power. Do u think i will ne OK to leave as is concerning rtv issue ??
Thanks again for the video.
Yeah man if you’re keeping it stock and your engine goes they’ll warranty it!
why dont they have a screen on the outside of the pick up tube as well..
It would be restrictive and redundant. Oil filter should take care of any particulate. If the factory messes up the rtv that is a different problem but a screen wouldn't help it.
Holy crap that’s a lot of work for a video!! Thanks super detailed and informative! 🤓👏🏽
Your welcome :)
doing your own check/repair will not void your warranty, dealers must prove that any work/mod damaged the vehicle, if a dealer gives you a hard time, call the corporate
When are they addressing the problem?
It’s been awhile so probably never or atleast not until they start popping motors left and right, which they might or might not kind off a dice roll
How do you know your RTV bead isn’t excessive?
Well I used my buddies judgment on that and I can confidently say he’s an amazing mechanic, but for some reassurance the bead we put on was about the size of what I had scraped just off of the inside lip of the pan so probably about 1/3-1/4 of what Subaru squirted on there.
Why not get a lit borescope and have a looksee up through the drain plug...? @rallysport
@@ryanpolk8754 seems to be a easier way to check
@@ryanpolk8754 I tried to do that last month when I changed the oil on my '22. I couldn't see anything in there with it but maybe I just have a crappy cheap borescope- IDK. Would be cool if Subaru figured out a way to snake something up the drain hole that could see any pieces in the pick up and suck them out or something.
Did they make any changes to this process in the 23 model year?
No one really knows
No they did not. In true subaru tradition, 2023 wrx will be the exact same as 2022 but with a bit of a price hike.
So I'm getting a new 2023 WRX at the end of May. Is there a chance this issues fixed from factory by this point??
Possibility? Yes, we won't really know though. i'd say the best way to get an idea is to look at the timing covers up front above the turbo, if you see a bunch of RTV sticking out then it's definitely not fixed.
Will there be a recall about this issue?
No one really knows, they're yet to directly acknowledge this issue.
I've got a wrx this just sad to see, we pay our hard earned money and a car that is still not complete as it should be is just pathetic. They could've pushed it back to a 2023-24.
Pretty much all Subaru's will have this problem. If you ever disassemble the engine, take a close look at how much and where the RTV is applied. It's inevitable that chunks of RTV in the inner falloff/grove next to the mating surface will fall off over time. If Subaru can figure out how to consistently apply RTV, their quality would improve dramatically.
do you need to prime the oil before you start it every time?
Nope but since all the oil had leaked out of our turbo sump it’s not a bad idea
@@rallysportdirect ok so like the moment i pick er up just prime it each time or down the road a bit?
Has any problems came up from a 2018 Forester FA20 XT, with same issue.
The FA20 did not have this issue
What can I say to the dealership to get them to check this for me while its under warranty? "The oil pressure feels weird...please do 4 days of work now?"
Like I said if you drop turbo and headers in one it won’t be a 4 day job, I’m guessing that hoe they do it at the dealership.
Warranty… They can claim it voids the warranty, it can not. That policy is not enforceable and is against the law. They have to prove that any work you do to your car was the direct cause of a failure.
Now, they may try to pull some BS, and you may have to threaten them with a lawyer… If you had to take them to court, they are not likely going to push it, the cost of legal fees is more than a new engine or part.
This only applies to the US based customers, I don’t know about other countries.
Is there no way other than removing the oil pan to diagnose this? No symptoms or tests because GOD I don't want to do that...
love the no jack sign on the turbo
I guess it’s because on the previous gen owners were jacking up their whole cars by the turbo sump lol
Tbh I would use for this oil pan some red gasket maker( it’s like a jelly and when it compresses create a solid gasket but when it goes to the oil it’s dissolve in the oil
I'd be very disappointed if my new VB is suffering from this, I love Subaru but this is something that can lead to major issues if not dealt with soon
If you're keeping it stock then I'd recommend paying the "stealership" some cash to check it for you. That way you get to keep your warranty and have some peace of mind. Only problem: someone in a 22 WRX group said their dealer quoted them 540$ to do it which is absurd.
@@rallysportdirect Why go to a dealership to check this? A 50$ borescope from Amazon, pass through the oil drain oil and you're set.
@@sebastien4565 I tried this just a couple minutes ago and it doesn't work. The oil pickup sits too low in the pan and at an angle from the drain plug point to where it's likely impossible to get the camera up the tube. Sadly the only way to make sure of the problem is to drop the pan...
@@aceofshapes5394 That's too bad :(
Was this fixed with the 2023 or is it still a issue?
Unfortunately I have no clue :(
WHAT IN THE ACTUAL F^@K…. I’m JUST now finding out about this an I literally bought my 2023 last week…. Not only that, I actually see the RTV literally staring at the engine from the outside…. WOWWWWW
Is this rtv issue not a recall or covered under warranty?
Will this process void the warranty if I ask a licensed mechanic to open it and have a look for me?
It’s a dice roll depending on if your Subaru tech notices and decides to bring it up the the service rep or not.
I'll never understand why a dealership would deny warranty work that is guaranteed payment from a billion dollar company.
I'm guessing it's either not guaranteed, or the profit margin is too thin?
@@orochicc002 I think maybe they can't mark up the parts and hourly rate like they do for you and me?
Yeah they’d rather fill a tech’s schedule with profitable work.
Also, a lot of the guys at the front desk of the service area make money off commission, so when it's a warranty job, they don't make anything. Also, SOA often under pays for the job. I remember reading from a tech on reddit they only pay like 20 hours for an engine swap, and the tech was saying even the best mechanic being careful can't do it in under 27 hours. So he see's guys rush, and often those cars come right back in. That or you don't get paid the difference as a tech.
I talked on the phone with the guy in charge the warranty program with SOA, and he admitted they can deny touching your car at all for any modification, including window tints, which is the run around they gave me to refuse to look at a low speed stutter issue. I had an extended warranty, so when they did that, I went and canceled my warranty and got most of my money back. I also told the sales guys that I'll never buy another Subaru from you because you won't honor my warranty, they were shocked and denied that what I was told was what they said. I've never owned anything but a subaru, and I was debating trading in for new wrx, but after my experience with my current subaru, I'm done. Not every car brand plays these games.
Assuming the ascent’s have this issue too?
Highly likely. Just not an enthusiast car, owners are likely unaware and therefore there isn't much public knowledge. This isn't really an issue for a normal travelling, commuter car. A lot more threatening to an aggressively driven, likely track used car such as the WRX, GR86 or BRZ.
@@KingNoahJM yeah agree. I have a 23 ascent and a 22 Wrx. I don’t track the Wrx just a fun daily.
Okay, should I buy the extended mileage warranty and run it till it blows or just hope a class action law suit happens and they fucking fix it for free? I have about 5k on mine, the car is fun, but I'm not rich, so I don't want to tune something and have to spend 15k for a new motor to have them put another busted piece of shit in it.
I’d say talk to your dealer and see if they’d drop the pan, I’ve heard of dealers saying that if they find RTV they won’t charge. But I’ve also heard of dealers quoting 1300$ for the job so really depends on yours. If they do want to take an arm and a leg then steer clear of mods that may void your warranty.
New generation oil starvation like EJ cracked oil pick up.
daaam and i was in the fence to order a new 23 WRX as a daily driver smh imma just keep my cheap 2000 car for now lol my summer car is a 19 5.0 mustang
I honestly don't understand why they would denied warranty even if its modded. Techs still get payed for doing warranty work so doesn't make sense.
You cannot pay me to own a Subaru, each time I mildly get interested in them Subaru reminds me of how much of a terrible automobile they are…
Can you give the date of manufacture?perhaps it was an issue only on some of the earliest runs? Mine is May of ‘22
Even may of 2022 could have this issue, since just NOW it's becoming a bigger topic for the VB WRX... They will need/want a lot of complaints before they make a fix. Fixes cost money. Subaru, just like every corporation, want to save money and take their time to see if they can get away with it.
Great informative video Ernie! Thanks again!
Always ;)
Dont let this video discourage you in buying a VB subaru..
Was never my intended goal, they’re great cars!
It's what makes Subaru a Subaru..
...Add this to the list of things I oh so love about my WRX. Any major catastrophic failures that have been caused by this on record?
I’ve seen one person claim this killed their engine at 8k miles besides that haven’t heard anything
Appreciate all your wisdom Ernie! ✌
The thing about the warranty is such horse shit! They give you a bloody free track day when you buy the car ffs! Lol I'm shopping right now between a WRX, GTI, and possibly an Elantra N. One of the things I'm asking for if I go with the WRX is for them to drop the oil pan and prove the RTV is good. Also, dropping an oil pan should not void warranty unless you fuck it up. I still have to research if it's even a problem on the 23 model. You would think at this point they would have retrained their employees on how to apply RTV properly. An engine replacement is not a warranty repair any manufacturer wants to do. The goal these days is to make the wearable parts more expensive and wear faster, while making anything covered by warranty more reliable. Obviously, some manufacturers do this better than others. Toyota gas proven that this formula works. The Germans went a little heavy on the expensive suspension and brake parts. One reason labor is so expensive on vehicles is that manufacturers give unrealistic time frames on repairs, resulting in shops losing money on warranty repairs. I saw a job that paid 5 hours under warranty, take 2 days because the exhaust system had to be removed, and the transmission dropped.
26:09 For a brand new car, that passenger side front tire has some major wear on the inside! How can the camber be that bad already?!
We were testing a prototype set of coil overs and didn’t get our alignment adjusted for some miles
Before watching video:
Yep. Gonna go buy me a new Subaru WRX 😁...
After watching video:
~~ Long sigh ~~
Nope. Probably not.😐
New WRX are kind cool until this RTV issue came up for the FA motors… smh
Good work
good thing I've got a 100k warranty
Just like with my F80 m3 don't be like the cheap asses that don't get there crankhub fixed. Just get it fixed. But it's a Suburu. Should've known better
If a brand new car is snapping bolts like that I’m totally screwed on my 2018 STI😵💫
They still got this problem? I had this issue on my 16 wrx smh subaru needs to get their shit together or else they will become like Mitsubishi
Sti dead, this is the last wrx, It's more of an appliance nowadays than ever.
Sad to see this
Good thing my name legal name isnt attached to any of my social media 😂
MR2 sweatshirt!
Thanks for showing me something I could do but would never have the balls to do… or patience
Oh boy if only you knew how badly i was scared to work on cars by myself before working here ;)
You should sell a stud kit for the oil pan. They do that a lot for other brands because putting an oil pan on with bolts vs studs is a PITA.
Why did you make your life so hard for yourself ? the turbo comes out with the manifold. just removed the oil feed banjo at the top, pcv hose and coolant hose, removed the charge pipe clip and connectors. removed the turbo manifold assembly together. you dont need to remove everything separate. I do these almost everyday.
surrounding blind holes in silicone for a reseal is a dead giveaway that the mech is noob.
I dont like Subaru anymore
Great video. Very detailed and informative. Massive PITA to do this job and 99%+ of us won't or can't DIY. SOA is going to fight to the death to avoid having to pay dealers to do this job as a recall. What a mess.
I'm new to WRXs - so is this why Subaru didn't put an oil psi gauge on this car like most other sports/muscle cars?
It’s not the reason, Subaru to my knowledge has never had an oil pressure gauge in a WRX but I believe it does have a pressure sensor which means you could monitor it with a COBB AP
@@rallysportdirect I was being somewhat sarcastic- I do think it's very odd that these cars don't have a common oil psi gauge like virtually every other performance car and would be very helpful as far as the customer being able to monitor this RTV sealant problem.
95% of "oil gauges" you see in cars and trucks aren’t. You will notice the needle doesn’t track oil pressure directly, only indirectly move to low medium or high indicated positions. There are too many dumb dumbs who would freak out seeing the realtime oil pressure fluctuating.
@@m0r0gu3 my daily driver - a '15 Challenger R/T- has real-time oil psi (as well as other vitals) that's easily scrolled to from the steering wheel by the speedometer. I have no reason to think it's not accurate. This is not a very expensive car. In fact it cost a bit less than my '22 WRX. Why couldn't SOA incorporate something like that into this car? I'd gladly trade the Starlink, the birthday notifications and the "check back seat" warning for this vastly more important feature. Oil Temp is nice but oil psi is just as important if not more IMO.
@@jedwin4816 The rest of Chrysler/jeep/ram just have the fake gauge, if there’s one in the cluster. The last real oil pressure guage I saw was around 2000 on an early wj, and it was subsequently decontented. Sadly, my 2004 wj has a dummy guage. You get your oil pressure info thanks to Daimler.
Lmfao. The ghost in the shop. "Am I a joke to you". Well guess ill wait for the recall or until my engine goes kaboom and let warranty do its thing.
if im not mistaken, i remember a lot of new VB owners talking mad trash about VA's being inferior in the fb groups lolol
It's what makes subaru a subaru lol. Buy it new only to have to rebuild it.
Wrx issues. You don't say.
damn it maybe i should have kept my 70k mile warranty. oh well.. I sell it at 29999 miles ;)
ua-cam.com/video/4Jk5WTWoqt4/v-deo.html (watch this video) I have a 23 brz and they have data proven oil pressure issues on high g right hand turns. The rtv maybe a culprit but not the whole issue. Since this engine is shared in the wrx to some extent (compression with turbo difference) I felt like sharing info here.
If you drop your pan or change your oil to a different weight or add a oil baffle etc. then that may compromise your warranty if your engine grenades. Subaru will never do a recall for this because there is only a extreme minority of engine failures to pay out of pocket vs 1000's of labor charges to drop an oil pan to clean rtv predicated on no real data as the main culprit and the oil tube screen box is setup to still function properly even with substantial rtv in the tube.
Oh trust me I was on that video like syrup on pancakes 😅 from what I understand the FA24DIT in the wrx has a different oiling system which isn’t subject to the same thing as the brz motor (supposedly) the RTV and oil drop in corners do indeed seem to be different issues. What was interesting in that video was the brz which had its pickup cleaned out seemed to have better oil pressure across the board that the other ones, could be just a coincidence would require further testing to be sure.
@@rallysportdirect I would be curious to see the wrx do the same test/course. If wrx doesnt have any oiling issues I may just trade in brz. I dont track it but I dont want to keep it and it grenade after the warranty is over.
why not 3D print a gasket instead of putting that crap back?
Cost likely
Bang on mine all day long. Something happens, warranty baby
Warranty only covers defcts/normal wear and tear. They won't cover you abusing the car..
Praise the EJ 😂
Not much better. Issues Just shift from one place on the engine to another and 10 year intervals to correct the flaws. Trying to sell my ej257 and done with them
Anyone else more surprised he had a penny than the RTV? 😅
not a big deal
Cool so don’t buy a wrx, got it