Does Music Have a Speed Limit? And Why?
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- Опубліковано 2 тра 2024
- Video essay on why the Mahavishnu Orchestra slaps
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And why is the Mahavishnu Orchestra's live version of Vital Transformation so damn fast? A journey into embodied musical cognition.
0:00 - Intro
2:17 Part 1 - Brain and Body
13:14 Part 2 - Vital Transformation
23:33 Part 3 - The Aesthetics of Fast Things
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Peace,
Adam
Yo thanks for putting my Guitar Hero clip in the intro, I'm sorry to break this theory but I actually run sped up songs on real guitar now too 😭 it seriously means a lot to be featured by someone I've watched for so many years, you're a legend
Are you familiar with Danny Johnson? “Guitar Hero phenom”? I played in a band with him, and he’s a good friend of mine…..super cool cat….
@@nomandad2000yeah he’s my guy! We’ve known each other a long time, one of my absolute favourite dudes in the community
@@GHAddict112 he’s even better in person. The most wholesome guy you’ll ever meet. And badass at real guitar too! Glad to hear ! I’m sure he admires you a lot as well!
I played GuitarHeroPhenom online on GH3 when I stayed home from school one day in 2010, I was so star struck.
@@MochaBlendedFun he’s super humble! In fact, him and his brother own an air conditioning company. They came and fixed my AC a few weeks back! I love ole Danny!
I am eternally grateful to Adam for succinctly defining what walking is for me 😃 oh, and all the interesting musical and biological stuff too I guess
To be fair it was not a very good definition of walking, it includes hanging by your arms waving your feet around in the air, which is clearly not walking
I was gonna ask you what "succinctly" means but then I remembered I can just Google it. I then realised that I don't have to write this comment. But here we are
7:22 Correction, Usain Bolt's world record is 9.58 seconds from 2009. Massive difference in the athletics world.
How do you feel about Adam’s videos being so chock-full of ideas ?
@@squidward5110😊 24:15 24:44
The fast tempo aesthetic existed even before this era in jazz. I used to play with Toshiko Akiyoshi, who was actually around during the bebop era, and she told me that in that style, there's a tempo where everyone just plays as fast as they can play. The drums and the bass don't really lock in, but the result is a unique kind of energy that you can't get any other way.
It's too bad that in jazz education, we focus so much on the harmonic content of bebop, as if that's the main lesson to be learned from it, when there's so much more visceral rhythmic interplay that made that music what it is.
I think a great exemple of when going fast is serving a purpose is punk. Punk to me is just raw emotion. You play punk to express your chaotic hate and frustration, so going fast becomes a tool to make the music feel more chaotic and also disorganised as the band dosent really hold it together. Somehow that "i don't care if it's good this is how i feel!" just sounds so great to me.
Good, insightful description of the punk genre. Seems fitting. And also in the other direction provides a good definition for the mindset of people referred to as punks, regardless of chosen appearance. That could be perceived as a derogatory term, but a punk wouldn't give a shit about that. 😁
On one hand yes, on the other punk doesn't really seem to mesh well with the approach of perfecting your musical craft to the level that allows to break the speed limit.
When I heard the segment of the original live version of Vital Transformation, it sounded like the punk version of the original to me. I don't know if it comes from a place of frustration, but it definitely captures a more chaotic feel.
Wow. I had a back injury post-car accident. I used to write, dj and enjoy music around 128 bpm. The injury has lowered my walking and movement speed, and I've been drifting towards lower tempo music since. I would feel physical pain trying to write music at 128, but 96 provides enough recovery time to not feel pain with every beat.
Thanks, Adam! This was super interesting - and I'm only 9:43 in!
Glad you're still jamming after all you've been through!
Experiment: Show the remnants of the accident trauma a smiling middle finger by composing some music even slower than your new comfort level.
@@Dowlphin Brilliant, mate! I'm dropping down to 60 BPM in protest against my pain.
@@pthelo Right on, dude! Feel the paaaaaaaaaiiiiiiiiinnnnnn, maaaaaaan. 😄
My favourite speeding up happened to the song Hocus Pocus from the Dutch prog rock band Focus. On the album it was about 6m30 long. When they appeared on a TV show, their slot was only 4m30 long, so the show producer suggested maybe cutting out part of the song. To that they said, "what if we just play it faster", and so they did.
Also, I hear Vital Transformation with two beats per bar, I'm pretty sure as like 4+5 eighth notes.
Ah yes, the Cocaine Edit
I love that performance. The guitarist is absolutely shredding lol. The flute part feels so frantic
I was waiting for Adam to mention that performance. In a sense, I feel like it has a bit more mundane of an answer to the "how do your values reflect in how you play" question he was digging into - their values were to not compromise on the music, to not cut out part of the song in order to fit it into the time they had for performance. And so they didn't, regardless of the physical struggle (and probably substances) that it took to pull it off.
It was such an obvious link to what he was talking about that I was actually astounded Adam didn't at least namecheck this - when I saw the video title I even assumed this was what it was going to be about.
"Playing fast is for the artist " was always my feeling. If you can comfortably improvise with another being at a pace that's challenging for all parties, its almost like flying.
Yeah, it's like playing a game and challenging yourself
True, but, to me, music is for the audience. When I hear something that is so fast that I cannot appreciate its melodic value, well, something is lost.
@@AlDunbarat the same time, some things that dont sound melodic at all slow, sound amazing sped up very fast. I think John McLaughlin is a great example of that. He uses so much chromatic stuff that would sound so weird slow but at his speed it flows.
@@AlDunbarmusic isn't for the audience. It's for the listener. The first listener is always the creator.
@@taylordcraig Cool, so play your speedruns at home and leave the venues for the artists who actually care about the audience.
That 16/18 interpretation of Vital Transformation immediately felt so much more natural to me. 💜
idk, i think its really really good but i think the original album version is a masterpiece. I think i prefer the raw, rock tone especially on the guitar.
@@jamosbigjaw1791 I think they just meant hearing it in that time signature rather than sungazer's recording
@@stephenahernah I see I see.
18/16.
The bottom number has to be 2^n
@@Lord_Skeptic yeah? or maybe you're just not good enough to hear eighteenth notes
I think mathcore music has a lot of moments that try to force you into these sections you can’t physically feel. It’s like trapping your body in a dance you can’t do, and it’s awesome
GRIND
i would love to see an adam neely mathcore video
I kept thinking about Ben Koller and Converge while watching the video - he and the rest of the band are constantly playing on the edge of what most people can physically comprehend and I think it makes their sound what it is
same with war metal solos
My favorite music is often stuff with a funkey beat that dances right on the line of a tempo you can just barely keep up and just the right sprinkle of breaking rhythmic expectations. It's like salt, put a dash in my veggies and they from bland to yum but .....there's a point where more salt makes things worse.
Just like I sometimes want "regular" food and sometimes I want the salty potato chip experience; I like differing amounts of "rhythmic spice" I don't ever remember wanting to drink a bottle of soy sauce or eat a salt block.
There is a reason mathcore and experimental Jazz aren't getting played on top 40 pop stations, or featured on blockbuster soundtracks. When you loose the ability to "feel" the music there's really something lost that we usually appreciate music for.
When a sound has a jarring section you can't interpret with your "body" it's special but you're never engaged in the music like that to begin with there's not the same impact.
As someone who regularly listen to audiobooks at 200% speed I find it fascinating how quickly one can get used to higher tempos, and how going back can feel so sluggish.
yeah it's like listening to 1.25x on youtube and just forget about it until something actually sounds weird.
Playing a recording faster is just going to warp the sound, it's not the same as actually playing something faster
This is so true. Normal speed really sounds like it's slooooooweeeed doooowwwn. 😂😂😂
yeah, I have the same thing as someone who watches UA-cam videos at 2x speed
and then my mom comes in and is like "why are those people talking so quickly?"
and i'm like "they're not mom. they sound normal to me....oh wait"
...I may have watched this (along with most things on youtube) at 2x speed
So no one's gonna talk about how this guy literally just Rickrolled us?
I scrolled way too long to find this comment!
For reference: 4:05
ua-cam.com/video/erBecZH7b0Y/v-deo.html
@@walterd.warren6627 same
Scrolled the comments to see if anyone else noticed lmao
This makes so much sense as an old punk rocker, the "D-beat" is one of the most simplistic intuitive rock beats but when the tempo is turned up the beat stops sounding like that same beat. It sort of sounds like random banging but everything is hitting together so you know there's structure. There's a Mars Volta drum chops video where someone is showing some of their fast beats starting real slow and progressively speeding up. They start off sounding simple then they hit a tipping point and the beat is transformed into something completely new by the blistering speed.
17:18 amazing how Adam illustrates different ways to interpret 9/8, for me it is like a miracle, converting the same phrase to something completely different every time
What helps me hear it best is the eighth note in the middle of the bar: one and two and dot three and four and. I don't think Adam covered that possi initially at 15:20 on, maybe it's different when you're trying to play the notes.
Nothing miraculous, it's all just math and accents.
9/8? No, everything is 4/4 if you try hard enough
oh, get a room already..
a room for one
@@RyanWaldroop To me, everything is 4/4 if I don't try at all. I only have a hammer so everything looks like a nail.
I remember when my friend showed me Vital Transformation. It was ADHD heaven. A perfect cacophony of complex noise. Absolutely made my day
You should try breakcore, speedcore or extratone, depending on how wild you're feeling
People with adhd would just get overwhelmed by the density of sound and tune it out. You have to have a high level of focus to keep up with music like that.
@@zerologic7912 i totally might. i think the thing about VT was the acoustic side of things. i had never heard anything so powerfully energetic with acoustic instruments before it. John McLaughlin became one of my favourite guitarists not long after hearing what he was capable of on the track
@@st_orlie a good musical hyperfocus like i have definitely helps LOL
Just the one day though, long live adhd
This is interesting to me. I always wondered why I couldn’t really communicate to my friends why I’m skilled at rhythm games. “How do you not fall of tempo? How can you read all of that?”
“I… good question. I don’t know? I just kinda feel it?”
I don’t look at the judgement zone when I hit a note in a rhythm game I just sense when to hit the note from the song. This video explores this in a very neat way. Didn’t realize how much my body literally vibing with the music helps me.
Adam, you’re the best. You are providing people with university-level music education blended with humor, brilliant tangents, and your inimitable style all at once. There are few programs of any kind at this level and yours is so enjoyable to watch. Bravo, 10/10 every time.
We already basically covered the perceived minimum speed limit; “how slow can music be”. It kinda makes intuitive sense that there would be an opposite upper limit.
my guess before watching the video was 20 Hz, because that's where traditionally the range of audible sound starts. you won't hear the single notes, you'll hear a low buzzing sound.
and it's actually crazy to think about that 20Hz/50ms is the drumming world record.
but after watching the video, it makes sense that music stops making sense earlier, at lower speeds.
There's an organ performance in a church in Halberstadt that started in 2001 and set to end in the 2600s. There's a list of note changes on Wikipedia with the dates when the changes will happen.
As a guitar fan, I find that good shredding can do two things. It can blend into a single sound, almost like the sound of heavy rain - Natural but enveloping. Or it can feel like anxiety, like 100s of plates falling from a shelf. One feels super natural but not human, whilst the other is human but unnatural. I either don't care about them individually, content to listen to the overarching feel, or I need to scramble and try to grab them, always missing some because it is an almost impossible task.
The worst music is fast the best is slow
@@user-du1yk7uk9v how so? What a strange way to split up music?
@@toblexson5020 Gilmour = wonderful intense playing Malmsteen = boring garbage
@@toblexson5020
just some boomer opinion
Speed is an ingredient that certainly fulfills some impressionisms. Overdone, it's a racetrack instead of a story. When indulged occasionally, it's a dazzling sonic firework spectacle.
Guitar is far from alone in pursuing this ingredient.
I became a musician because of the Mahavishnu Orchestra. So glad you appreciate them! I went to three MO concerts. The first was great; the second was unreal - they had really hit their stride. At the third concert,though, I remember thinking they had degenerated into a “I can play faster than you” contest instead of conveying a musical message. It was also too loud, even for a teenager as I was at the time.
I'm a huge John McLaughlin fan but I do think he occasionally played the guitar too fast just to show off, rather than to make great music which hes a master at. I do think he got much better at not getting carried away as he got older. When he joined the Friday night at San Francisco band he managed to balance the slow melodies with the fast flourishes incredibly well. But i still think the first two Mahavisnu albums are some of the best things I've ever heard and it will probably remain that way.
@@jamosbigjaw1791 If you listen to “Birds of Fire” carefully, you’ll hear amazingly little fast guitar. I don’t know why JM gets such a bad rep for playing too fast. Listen to Bird, Trane, Dizzy & Joe Pass. Thry all played like lightning, I would argue, much more than McLaughlin.
I’ve got that mahavishnu record. Omg I love that. Thanks pop for leaving me that. Awesome record.
Inner Mounting Flame is one hell of a Fusion essential. Your pop had amazing taste.
Anecdote : Taking a beer with my cousin an uncle, I accidentally put the vinyl of Mahavishnu orchestra _The Inner Mounting Flame_ on 45 rpm instead of 33. As we were deeply involved in our conversation, no one notice! A whole side of the album at the speed of that live concert. It sounded great honestly!
You and your cousin and uncle sound cool af
What a great way to have a beer!
My favorite example of this concept is on the song Bubblehouse by Medeski, Martin & Wood. The main riff feels similar from bar to bar but when you skip a few seconds, the feel completely changes
Love a bit of MMW!
Bubblehouse is what I kept thinking about as well!
Nothing like a hot mmw show. Usually requires two sets.
Definitely one of your best video essays in a while. Great job!
Seeing y’all live this year was seriously epic. My vestibular system was appropriately exercised.
I applaud the sneaky Rick Roll at 4:06. You won this time, Adam.
I'd love to see a video going deep into Yo Yo Ma's Bach cello suites over his lifetime. It's super fascinating to see them change over time.
That would be an amazing video but idk if its something Adam would make
I love the rep for Mahavishnu Orchestra. I want everyone to hear their wonderful music
Just wanted to say thank you for everything you are doing! You inspired a passion in music theory for me, and now I am a music theory major at college planning to go on to be a music professor. All thanks to you
I'm so glad you're highlighting this album, it's one of my desert island pics for sure. A friend of mine showed it to me when I had come over tripping on some bad acid. He handed me a djembe, put the record on, turned off the light and left me alone to enjoy to majesty of the Mahavishnu. Utterly life-changing....
That is such a hippie picture lmao. Love it!
I gain a lot of joy from "messy" musicianship, where things are not perfectly clean or smooth and you can hear the raw effort. It's why Brian Chippendale of Lightning Bolt is one of my favorite drummers - dude sounds absolutely unhinged and iconoclastic in comparison to your Danny Careys or Bill Brufords. When you go so fast that you lose minute precision, the music can't help but imbue you with its energy. If you can't find the "walk" of the groove, it's because you're already flying.
it's why I love the song Maggot Brain. It's so...Cathartic, raw and just pure, unfiltered emotion in music form. It sounds like crying your heart out, but as one long guitar solo focused, beautiful and tragical track. Fantastic song!
YESSS LIGHTNING BOLT
Great video. I am always excited to here anyone doing deep dives into the rhythmic aspects of Mahavishnu music.
Excellent as always. Good to have you back.
Band: *makes a recording*
Band: *plays it way faster live*
Adam: "Anyways, here's a 34 minute video essay" 🤣
Welcome back, hope your tour was amazing. This was utterly fascinating, as always. Reminds me of how you said "music is not a sport" in the Whiplash review.
Absolute class as usual. You have this way of elucidating the relevance of music, the reason we're all here putting hours into listening to, studying, practicing, writing, improvising and discussing music, and for me it's just the most inspiring thing. Thank you for so much!
The editing in this video is amazing. Thanks a lot for this work.
Gotta love the depth you go into stuff
Thank you Adam for talking about the Mahavishnu Orchestra. Their second album, "Birds of Fire", has really opened my eyes - and my ears - when I was a teenager. It still is my favorite jazz rock album.
Loved the video, and was especially delighted to hear you reference Tosin Abasi and Javier Reyes in this discussion. I discovered their music during the pandemic and love how they’ve changed their style over the years. Thanks for the interesting and entertaining video
The funniest thing ever is, I played this unintentionaly in 4x speed and immediately started laughing. 😂😂
This was so awesome! I love that I always learn something that makes me excited to be alive when I watch your videos. Your dry humor always makes me smile. Most of my musical experience is from singing and dancing video game tracks when nobody's watching, but I love music and I love your videos!
Maaaan, I was just listening to that live version of Vital Transformation the other day and thinking how utterly insane it was, so this video is very timely for me haha.
Was also a cool surprise to see you guys play it at the Glasgow show! Great show all round.
How fast can a person play a video game?
(In terms of raw input speed, and still have it ‘feel good’, as opposed to the more general concept of speedrunning)
How does controlling a little digital puppet’s movement relate to the ways we move our bodies?
Idk but you’d make a good video about it I’m sure. Love your stuff man, have a good one
@@callumwoulahan7681 To be honest, with video games, at least ones that aren't rhythm games, I don't think there is a hard limit. I think it's just the limits of the player until it becomes physically uncomfortable. I know that Smash Bros Melee only gets more satisfying the faster you play.
I’ve always had a hard time keeping track of the downbeat in music even though I’m good at most of music. Then he said the part of your brain that’s involved in balance is what processes it and that just made my jaw drop. I have horrible balance and that just feels so weird that those are connected
incredible video man, thankyou for this
I was skeptical of the title, but this is probably my favorite video I’ve ever seen of yours. Bravo, sir! Speedrun encore 🙌
Thank you for this Adam. Long live the Mahavishnu Orchestra
Incredible video. That short bit at the end of an old John Mclaughlin talking about liberation gave me actual goosebumps.
U know where it is from?
Great video! One of your best and that's saying a lot. I loved the things I learned in this and the through line of the mahavishnu song from studying it musically to transcending with it was really awesomely put together. Gonna revisit those two Maha records again
I'm pleasantly surpised at how much love jazz fusion is getting currently, lots of great young players. Thanks for the quality content!
Inner Mounting Flame was a revelation for me. I stumbled upon it just because I was checking famous guitarists, but this turned out to be something else. I had never sat an listened to an instrumental album over and over before.
I am happy to finally learn what walking is. Thank you, Adam!
Good to see ya, Adam. Thanks Bra.
Finally somebody with great talent put my favorite band (Mahavishnu) in a educational video.
I love Mahavishnu Orchestra, and it's really awesome that this video was anchored to their music.
Just use the Mustaine rule: Faster = Better
Possible the most eloquent and appropriate segue I've ever seen between the subject matter of the video and the promotion of the sponsor.
Also, a great video. As a guitarist and bass player I appreciate the attention played to the virtue (or not) of mere speed.
This is one of my favorite videos of yours.
Always cool to encounter Mahavishnu Orchestra in the wild. So underrated
Dang, hearing about how rhythm is felt with our motor system and meter is felt with our vestibular system is absolutely wild. It means we have evolved to appreciate movement by co-opting other systems in out bodies. Music is awesome
such a fascinating and thought provoking video!! excellent as always Adam
Amazing as always.
Fabulous video! The section on Yo Yo Ma and the ways in which the same person might approach one piece of music differently over time (and how these approaches exhibit the artist's worldview in that moment) reminded me of another great example from the same sphere: Glenn Gould and his two official recordings of Bach's Goldberg Variations. One might say that the first recording (1955) is (to borrow Nietzsche's dichotomy) *Dionysian*: it's earthy, visceral, subjective, quirky -- and certainly faster in relation to the late (1981) *Apollonian* recording, which is very steady in tactus, slower overall, and generally marked by an intellectual, considered approach. Funny fact: while people have argued for ages over which is better (and hey, why need to choose?), I've been most drawn to the live recordings (1959 from Salzburg, and another one whose year eludes me), as these seem the least "labored" to me, and closest to what Renaissance Italian's called "sprezzatura" -- or what we might call "nonchalance": making something difficult look easy!
The thing about what musicians value when they play specific things reminded me of the variation that happens over the execution of Vivaldi Four Seasons that is made from different orchestras. It's fun to realize the minor differences over those executions
Been watching your vids for many years and I gotta say this is one of your best
You’ve made some great videos but this one is one of the absolute best. Wow, I’ve been a musician for most of my life and this is one of the most interesting lectures I’ve ever heard.
Love the MO shoutout- the inner mounting flame is my favourite album :)
Hey Adam, thank you for putting so much work and passion in your videos. It really shows. This video made me think about Hella. I am a massive fan of their first album "Hold Your Horse Is". As @ufoufo2788 put it so well (with your inspiration) in the comments: " I think mathcore music has a lot of moments that try to force you into these sections you can’t physically feel. It’s like trapping your body in a dance you can’t do, and it’s awesome". Hella gave me this feeling, bodily and mentally. They take me places I rarely go. I would be thrilled to hear you talk about them, and math rock / core in general.
Absolutely phenomenal video - huge respect for the way you explain this so well and ALSO put it into practice with sungazer. You're inspiring so many people to respect microrhythm
Thanks Adam, great stuff as always!
Adam is the messiah!! I, once, could not walk... and now I can; thanks to Adam!! Jokes aside, before starting to watch Adam's videos many years ago, I just to just hear music... now I listen.
I love Mahavishnu Orchestra
They were so incredibly tight as a band
Love everything about this video … the musical observation, thought, analysis, humor, editing, shape of the script … kind of like tactus, rhythm, micro-rhythm, phrasing, form. Oh, and I watched to the last second but you never shaved! 😲
After 15 years of playing music this is the first time I’ve seen subdivisions referred to as “patterns of shorts and longs.” I wish I would’ve realized this years ago 🙃🙃🙃
very interesting video. one thing that I felt was left out is discussing the context in which the fast performance happens. in the mahavishnu live album for exemple there are other tracks much lower paced which contributes to the overall experience through contrast. you can play a really fast tune in order to "break the spell" of a slow track you played previously or to enhance the slow rythm of the next track or next session in the same track. also in a live performance everything is turned up to higher levels in comparison with studio performances. it is very common to people play faster live without noticing and also to listeners enjoy a really fast song, and even dance to it, without realising exactly how fast it is.
also i think that if we take an average souding music and simply accelerate it to absurd speeds it will obviously sound strange but i think fast paced music is a thing on it self. if the song is composed from scratch to be a 300bpm song, for example, it will take other creative paths than just writing a melody and playing it fast. there is certainly some tipes of rythm that can vibrate nicely with our body in that range, the polyrithm of audible frequencies being maybe the extreme example of that, meaning that a note is nothing more than a really fast rythm and a nice sounding chord a relation between two rythms (polyrithm), which you already covered in a very nice video of yours
Part 3 probably could have been it's own video. As a viewer I wonder how much Adam cut out. One really important point that I would add is that the interpretation of speed is cultural and context dependent. So in metal or hardcore punk, fast is seen as aggressive. Meanwhile, in Bop or bluegrass, music can be exceptionally fast without ever having the connotation of being aggressive; the music is fast because that's the tradition. I think this is to say that speed can have many interpretations that might not even be related to how fast the music actually is.
Definitely. I think the question of whether you want to lose yourself or keep yourself grounded to yourself is really interesting deserving of its own video. Or maybe he already made that video idk
It's not aggressive..IT'S BORING ! The worst music is fast the best is slow
@@user-du1yk7uk9vthen you’re listening to the wrong bands 🤷🏻♂️
@@user-du1yk7uk9vfound the Doom Metal fan
@@gabriel77196 Good Music fan from Satie to Vangelis
Thank you for more intervals.
Punter, "I'm going to see Stargazer tonight."
Adam Neely, "You are going to take part in my musical experiment tonight."
What a fascinating video; especially the bit about body-augmentation potentially changing musical understanding.
Wow...this guy is beyond words...such dexterity with his bass, piano...such musical knowledge...and now neuroscience in a nutshell. What wonderful and clear explanation about the neurological foundationss of MUSIC. A real masterclass!!!
My choir conductor let me teach the group Kaval Sviri today, a Bulgarian folk song that I first heard on your channel a few years ago.
It took them some time to get used to the aksak in the verse/chorus, but just like you mentioned in the video, at some point it clicked for most of them and suddenly learning the tune came much easier and quicker.
It was very cool to see that.
Also, I stumbled across Some Skunk Funk a decade ago, and I heard the fast live versions first.
I was very excited by it, I loved the tune. But then I listened to the original recording, and from that perspective it suddenly sounded glacial. It's like what the hell happened
On a more earthly level, as a the CHR83 pointed out recebtlly, when your ears are accustomed to the faster, energetic live hit Version of Cheap Trick's I want you to want me, the studio version is a yawnfest
Nice work Adam, thank you!
I'm an english/british folk musician primarily and I was so confused when trying to feel the pulse underneath Vital Transformation's riff, because I saw 9/8 and immediately made all of the obvious assumptions. When I just let myself feel the rhythm the music is trying to tell me, it was more like 3/4 + 3/8, or a hemiola followed by three quick pulses. When you slowed it down for the 18/16 analysis I agreed, but there was no way I could notice that at tempo as a listerner.
In a marching band, feeling the pulse was almost more important than watching the drum major. I wasn't marching, instead I was in the front ensemble. The sound delay from the back of the field was tiny, but still noticeable, so instead of following what the marchers were watching, we needed to feel the groove of the snare drum. When the music is supposed to be fast, we halve the tempo and the duration of the notes, so the pulse is felt on what would have been a half note instead of every quarter note. It makes marching actually possible sometimes. The craziest experience I had was the time signature changing 11 times in 20 measures, from 3/4 to 5/4 to 4/4 to 7/4 and back, not with any repetitions of pattern. If I've learned anything from coordinating with 100+ high schoolers it's that staying together is relative, and the beat goes wherever it wants. Sometimes 9/8 is felt as two sets of 7 16ths and then one set of 4 16ths, sometimes 4/4 is two groups of 6 8ths and one group of 4.
4:35 i couldn't walk properly before i watched this video, props to you Adam 🙏
I hope he will make a video on The Ministry of Silly Walks and the odd rhythms used in their walks one day.
The idea of motion information in music is amazing, loved the video.
Man, Adam's such a good essayist. Good fun this
my immediate thought is that theres two limits towards the speed of music, Practical and theorethical. practically the human body can only move so fast and for soo long and whilst you can train your body to go to extreme speeds there has to be a limit to where you simply cant go any faster. and theoretically. if we take a 8th note ostinato at 180bpm. you can write the same ostinato as 16th notes at 90bpm. but the slower the tempo the faster the note you have to write it as and at some point it will just become impracticle to write it
This video seems to be part of an explanation for why I absolutely love bands like Hüsker Dü, Saccharine Trust, King Crimson, Volcano Suns, Meat Puppets, some of Yes, Mahavishnu (just started not long ago), Neu, ELP, My Bloody Valentine, Dinosaur Jr, Bauhaus, Big Black, Black Flag, Bad Brains and especially Charles Mingus!!!!! The thing I adore about these is that they all share the common idea of somewhat speed in atleast one instrument or either frequent changement of tempo. I guess I translate this to apparently being very hyper or remaining hyper in creeping adulthood 😦. This also must explain why I can’t tolerate so much of the music my friends show me or stoner metal stuff, it’s just too slow!!! It’s not that I don’t understand the greatness in slower tempos and styles that incorporate them but rather that my body (specifically feet) is just too bouncy or active all the time and I just don’t have the ability to « chillllll » and music is supposed to be the most beautifully visceral experience that I can live on the daily, not a way for me to relax and sit down. I understand the appeal of relaxing music as one’s leisure activity but to me my down time is sleep!! Calm music will make me want to sleep or I don’t know lie down and not do much. Faster (though I prefer the term visceral to describe it) music just goes well with being in a GREAT mood and wanting to either read, or be on the bus, or run somewhere, or bike, or play instruments, or write down things and especially for studying. I find that the music of bands like Neu trigger the exact areas of the brain needed to understand and then note down onto paper what you are feeling in a very mentally naked fashion. It’s very much stream of consciousness music where I have much awareness as to where an album like The Black Saint and The Sinner Lady by Mingus or Earthbound by KC serve the purpose of evoking the most emotional feelings without any literary or verbally explanatory needed or even attainable. It sends you into the questioning that you must be irrational to be feeling so strongly but the assurance in your feelings is so powerful that it makes you realize nothing else could make you reach that point of rationality (at least in a controlled manner or healthy manner). It is like your amygdala is highly active but remove the flight or fight sense and you are just sitting in a pool of emotional palpitations. The beauty of this can also be felt in albums like New Day Rising by Hüsker Dü as they mix such emotion with velocity but equal it out by having the music be perhaps less complex so that it is a more visceral experience and feeling and can maybe allow or accept more freeing movement or dance, and its in those moments where you should be dizzy from such physical rambunctiousness but you realize that your Cerebellum has never before been at such ease. With all that said, it does not mean that I cannot enjoy songs that are not « heavy » or « fast » and are slow as I do. I just need them to be uncomfortably emotion ridden in their sound, queue: Oh Me on Meat Puppets’s Ii, Myself when I am real by Mingus, Faitbful by Ornette Coleman, and I’ve grown accustomed to her face by Wes Montgomery!! Needless to say, music is amazing. This is why it’s so amazing. Psychology and music go so well hand in hand and only make so much sense together and i don’t say that out of opinion but as a fortunate learner when watching Adam’s videos, as what he explains is frequently quantitative!! Thanks Adam, amazing video like usual. Sad that I missed you playing at the Jazz Fest but oh well, hopefully i can see BASS another time 😎
Loved the edit about the "walking" definition.
In truth, the whole video was very interesting. The areas of the brain that process phrase, pulse, etc. and what else those areas process was quite revealing.
Another great one, Adam. Love your videos on the philosophy of music.
Hell, I'd like to see a speedrun version of one of the first established pieces of the explosive musical genre of Balinese gong kebyar, a Indonesian gamelan genre born in early 20-century Bali, Indonesia that is characterized by its interlocking parts that are often played at breakneck speeds. This workhorse is "Kebyar Legong", a dance piece that takes about 30 minutes to perform in its entirety, even by the most skilled Balinese ensembles. Thus, the piece not only tests how quickly and precisely your ensemble can play, but also how long can your musicians endure playing those fast sections (which are interspersed by relatively slower sections).
Adam's videos are honestly perfect to sit back, relax and grab some snacks
That's just an overlearned motor procedure
WHY ARE YOU EVERYWHERE
Dude, your lighting is exquisite.
Adam, great video - and a study of mine over the past 2+ years..... so much here to this conversation. I also like that you've used speed as the gateway leading down many paths of philosophy and value systems. It's a key aspect I don't believe anyone teaches or is really learning other than through specific research you did for this vid or side conversations and "aha moments". There's always something, especially at the level of musicianship you are talking about that goes beyond "playing fast". Absolutely loved how you went about it. Scholar at the core!!! Awesome. Thank you!
It's nowhere near as complex but I love seeing how crowds move to Silhouette by Thrice. It switches back and forth between 4/4 and 7/4. It's a slow, head-bangy sort of a song, which encourages you to nod on the 1 & 3 accents initially. But when the signature changes, if you don't keep up then you end up nodding on the un-accented 2 & 4 beats which feels really wrong. Luckily, the snare drum shows you the way. There's an extra snare accent on each bar, which if you move to it, sort of "resets" you back to the correct beat every time. Once you find it and move to it, it feels fantastic.
My favorite sped-up song is King Gizzard's The Evil River, from their 2022 live performance at Red Rocks. It's a normal version of The River for the first five or so minutes, but for the following section the song is sped up so much it's hard to keep up in your head. The whole feel of the song changes from 5/8 to 5/16. And then they keep it going at that insane pace for like eight minutes.
Wah wah wah wah wah
6:09 is exactly how my old guitar teacher has been describing music for close to 20 years, which is exactly how I've been conceiving of it since he told me.
Thanks for an interesting and well produced video.
12:30 This reminds me of how the swing in a jazz ride cymbal pattern gets less obvious as the tempo increases.
I’ve always loved the Mahavishnu Orchestra and Larry Coryell’s 11th House, and studied for a few years with Larry, before his passing in 2017. Ever since developing heart arrhythmias in 2020, I’ve avoided those fabulous complex rhythms, because it feels so much like the skipping of my ventricles that led to a near death experience in 2021. The music feels… dangerous to me now!
Great video Adam....long, complete, full of insights....a true gem! Thank you!!
excellent as always ... this opened a door