+Date Masamune It would end with Sera under a table drunk trying to ignore the elves. Zevran trying to hit on her while Fenris and Solas are probably gonna come to blows with Merill trying to calm them down.
+Lelouchxzero1 Fenris really doesn't care about elves at all, so Solas would have no reason to hit him and vice versa. As a matter of fact I think they could discuss so much with each other, since Fenris is a wise man, just not very patient when it comes to stupid questions and Solas gets along with anyone who isn't preaching qun.
Zervan: Give me a bottle of your best! Fenris: I hate that bottle of their best... Sera: Give me a bottle of something that gets me piss drunk! Fenris: I hate that bottle too... Merill: ill just take water... Solas: Water... it reminds me of something i once saw in the Fade
Fenris and Merrill both have closed minds about the things they feel are important. Merrill's life is dedicated to elven history and tradition; to her, magic is a part of who she is - even if demons come with it. Fenris has been tortured beyond belief, and he is constantly trying to liberate himself, to feel like he's more than what he was made to believe for years and years. To him, magic stands for exploitation of power over the innocent. So, could we stop arguing over who is more misled? They are both very powerful people, fighting with their own insecurities. The only thing they agree on is that "Breaking the things you love most isn't only restricted to mages." They're fighting against parts of themselves that they see reflected in others.
***** Because the Keeper dying was a direct result of Merrill not listening when she was told not to mess with blood magic or demons. I love Merrill and I understand the mirror was important to her and why she felt the need to restore it but her actions are the cause of her own misery. She didn't ask the keeper to step in, Merrill was quite willing to face the consequences which is why she brought Hawke along in case she did get possessed. She didn't expect the keeper to intervene and Fenris may be very cruel here but the keeper is dead as a result of her actions, and if you fight the Dalish that's her entire clan gone because of her insistence on fixing the mirror. Her keeper died for something Merrill did and yet she didn't have to face the consequences.That's why he said it because she made that choice and the consequences are on her and she has to live with it, as much as the Keepers own actions are her doing. And Merrill needs to hear that cruel or not it is the truth, Coddling Merrill and excusing her of blame is not doing her any good. I actually like both characters and I hate how Merrill manages to be supportive of the other characters in game when some of them (Anders and Fenris in particular treat her so badly, it really does make me angry when they do that)
Merrill wouldn't have been putting herself or any members of the clan in danger at all if she had left the mirror alone. Marethari was trying to protect her, you say she was selfish because she put Merrill before the Clan. But Merrill was of her clan, she was Marethari's first until the disagreement over the mirror. Why wouldn't she still love Merrill as one of her own. In her eyes Merrill was following a path that would only lead to ruin through possession by a demon or death. So she opted to save her even though it meant sacrificing her own life because Merrill was still one of her children, even when she was walking a separate and entirely dangerous path. If you chose to do something dangerous and potentially lethal and actively told people about it,and your parent or guardian stepped in to protect you but doing so cost them their life. Would you declare yourself blameless. Yes they ultimately made the choice to step in and save you, but you putting yourself in that situation makes you just as responsible as they are. Marethari knew the risks of getting involved to save Merrill and yes you can say she was selfish or whatever for focusing on Merrill instead of the entire Clan. But to be fair the rest of the Clan hadn't consorted with a demon while trying to fix an artifact that killed two other members of that clan against the advice of everyone despite knowing the dangers. If the rest of the clan were doing that yet she still focused on Merrills actions then yes she would be unreasonably focusing on Merrill. But Merrill was taking a huge risk and she wasn't going to sit around and watch her potentially destroy herself. Maybe she had no idea Hawke would intervene, especially if Marethari had already taken the demon into her body before she met Hawk for the first time. Perhaps she thought Merrill would engage the demon alone and thought it was the only way to save her. Or perhaps she did know Merrill would bring Hawke along to put her down if she got possessed but she didn't want Merrill to die from such recklessness. Or for any of your party to go through that regardless. Also I see no evidence in game stating that the demon wasn't already a Pride demon before possessing Marthari. Sure maybe it is based upon Marethari's pride but Merrill also thought she was right and refused to listen to anybody else. Therefore perhaps the pride demon was actually a manifestation of Merrill's pride. Or perhaps it was a pride demon inside that place the whole time.
To be entirely unpopular, I enjoyed both of these characters, but Merrill is very naïve and sweet, but she is way too naïve about the risks of using blood magic and summoning demons. She believes she runs no risk with what she's doing and Fenris is a perpetual pessimist who has seen powerful mages at their worst. Harsh lessons are being passed between them, but as I always played a mage in my DA stories, I support Fenris here because all mages are being punished for the actions of a few. As innocent as her intentions are, her lack of knowledge about what she's truly up against finally ends up destroying the people she loves.
Honestly Merrill is too good of a character, she sympathizes and still willing to help Anders and Fenris regardless. More sad fact, if you look at the cut content / you had a dalish warden in origins, it reveals that part of the reason she wants to restore the mirror was to help get her friends back, basically closure which I feel that's the main reason behind her drive, not for history, but for her Tamlen and Mahariel.
@@callmek186 Get Tamlen and Mahariel back? Tamlen died of the darkspawn taint, Mahariel was forced to become a grey warden as a result of the mirror. For Tamlen's case, Merrill isn't aware of Tamlen's fate, maybe she believes the mirror took Tamlen. But it's obvious that there's not much Merrill can do to bring Mahariel back unless if she somehow finds a cure for the taint through the mirror. But the mirror only proved that it's only tainted.
Merrill is naïve in thinking that her blood magic could ever lead to something good, and Fenris is right to criticise her for it, but that comment about how his only regret over the Keeper's death is that she died for Merrill was unnecessarily cruel, especially after Merrill told him that the Keeper was like a mother to her.
Most of the interactions at least on his part are needlessly cruel. He mocks all Dalish elves simply because Merrill is a ditzy twist. She's skipping around landmines and mistaking them for daisies. except it's blood magic and demons not flowers
I saw another comment that Merrill's blood magic was fine. She wasn't contacting any demons, she was contacting a spirit of wisdom which is a good spirit. According to Justice in Awakening though, spirits can be corrupted by their own will, and according to Solas, interaction with corrupt will turns fine spirits into demons. So it's possible that Merrill was actually right about the eluvian, the spirit, etc, and that Marethari was actually the one that corrupted the spirit and risked Merrill's life. One thing I noticed about spirits and demons is that demons tend to tempt or command people, but spirits only answer questions. Maybe I need to replay DA2 to recall if Merrill's spirit ever asked her to do anything, but Justice in Awakening was already a huge flag that he was a demon of Vengeance than a spirit of Justice because he'd already been telling a non-compliant Anders to free the mages. Anders only wanted to escape at that point. Which makes me feeling extremely betrayed because I used to romance Anders a lot and try to dictate Merrill for not being careful. Things could have been the other way around knowing Anders was a legitimate abomination all along...
@@kalen2465 Not necessarily. Merrill is quite aware that everything in the Fade, including spirits and demons is quite dangerous. She just thinks she has mostly under control, which, admittedly, she does. She could've fixed the mirror without intervention, she'd have just turned into an abomination, but I think by that point she was more than past caring.
While Fenris and Anders are not entirely wrong and I can understand where they are coming from, I still wish they would ease off a little when speaking to Merrill. There is being right, and then there is being an utter jerk about it. Jeez, sometimes I just want to lock my companions in a room, except for Varric, we'd play Wicked Grace, while the rest sort out their differences and hopefully don't kill each other. I could take away their weapons and cast paralyze on all of them, maybe that will keep them from spilling blood. I love them all though, they are like family. Well, Sebastian can go get eaten by a dragon, but everyone else is cool.
10 years. The game timeline spanned 10 years. I blame the lack of time, for most of the companion party banters. After 10 years fighting side by side, hanging out with the same person and overall just being around each other, most of them should have been able to get past their differences and get along. Fenris becomes friends with Varric and Aveline rather quickly, and he does have a sense of humor, not to mention he is one of the few companions who doesn't mind sarcastic Hawke. Romancing him as a mage would have more effect on his view of magic and mages. Letting Hawke butt in the banters, would have changed things up too, I like that they allowed the Inquistitor to speak sometimes during banters, and even have companions talk to him/her. Within 10 years, Anders and Fenris should have found common ground, and if Hawke had been able to interject their banters with Merrill, they should have eased off and apologized to her. They don't have to stop warning her about blood magic and demons but could have realized they need to be nicer about it. So much more could have and should have been done. If they just had the time they need, I feel like things would have been a lot different. Fenris is a conflicted character, but he is way less selfish than Anders and not nearly as nasty to the other companions. You'd have to romance him through the friendship path as a mage to really see the softer sides of him. Despite the lack of writing, these companions are not black and white and you really got to listen to the tones of the voice actors. DA voice actors are amazing. I think I'm a Cole when it comes to fictional characters. I'm not sure if that made any sense, it's late where I am.
Everything you just said, supports the fact that the writing was bad. All the companions have done shit, Merrill to, she is not all innocent. That being said, they all have done some good too, depending on the way the game is played. Fenris and Varric are friends, but then again, Varric is friends with everyone. I've never had a problem getting Fenris' friendship maxed out even though I support mages and even when I'm romancing someone else on a different playthrough. Unlike Anders with the temps, Fenris sides with Hawke to help the mages at the end of the game. Yeah, Anders heals people for free during the game. He knows how to do that. Fenris was a slave his entire life, and in case you forgot, he was sexually abused. He does plenty post game, however, killing the slavers that came down to pray on the Kirkwall refugees is a good thing. Merrill helps refugees post game but does little in-game. Aveline is guard captain in and out of game, and will stop Sebastian from storming Kirkwall. Most of the companions do more for others post game. Isabella and Sebastain are the only one that don't.
Fenris was tortured by Blood magic, he knows about demons, and Anders knows plenty too, first-hand even. Stop defending Merrill like she's all innocent, none of the characters are innocent. She does not know what she is doing, and if Solas was in 2, he would have lectured her too. Oh yeah, Fenris approves, will he didn't in mine because I did not choose that route so it didn't happen. Fenris actually gets better than Anders by act 3, hell there's a conversation between him and Anders, where Fenris is being civil. *Again. Fenris. Sides. With. The. Mages.* He changes the most depending on how you play the game. Let's mess with the mirror that took away two of my clan, great idea! My Mahariel would have lectured her as well. Yeah, Merrill's cute, but gods damn she is naive as hell! Let's not forget her taking the demon's offer in the Fade and turning on you.
Fenris and Merrill are both flawed. Fenris is violent and stubborn with anger, yet Merrill does not like to listen to constructive criticism. Merrill is clueless at some times, which can be cute at times but sometimes leads to danger. Fenris is tainted by trauma, Merrill is tainted by jealously (like how she's upset when Maratheri will help Fenriyel) She uses blood magic and messes with demons, which lets face it is not a great idea. They're both stubborn. Yes, Merrill is more open in many ways than Fenris, but you NEED to remember that Fenris's first memory is torture at the hands of a mage. There was no therapists or psychologists for PTSD, BPD, etc whatever results of trauma back then. Fenris sees mages as a danger, even if he does not think those mages are bad people. They're both flawed. They're both beautiful. They both have their flaws and weaknesses, but also their strengths and they make both Hawke and the viewers happy. Neither of them are bad. Neither of them are evil. Neither are perfect. That's what I love so much about Dragon Age, that each character is beautifully flawed.
Merrill is smarter than you think, the whole mess with the clan, happened because Marethari decided to "save her" but if she didn't, Merrill would have died and she accepted the risks and the consequences because she was that desperate: The Eluvian took her friends(Tamlen and Mahariel) away from her, and she didn't get any closure, she felt like she didn't enough to save them and was trying to...ALONE(aside from Hawke's help) exactly because she understood the risks. And then things happened, and both Fenris, Anders and Aveline(i think) decided to stick a finger in her still fresh "mental wound" by accusing her, blaming her and belittling her.
I see a lot of Solas in Merrill in retrospect. They both see that repairing the past comes with a heavy cost, but one they cannot afford not to pay. They can't live with themselves just accepting what's lost is forever lost.
some people think that Merrill is naive and innocent, but imo i think that merrill is just misunderstood. because she was born a dalish, the Common Language is her second language, so she misunderstands idioms and sayings people say. i feel like Fen is just being a serious dick to her, cause he refuses to see her point of view.
@@SeventhheavenDK Not nearly as much imo. She, at least, understands that what she's doing isn't so black and white, but necessary. I'd do the same thing as her. Though I'm a history teacher. So I'm biased. ESPECIALLY if there's hardly any history left of your people. It's super important.
I think now is a good time to bring up a piece of wisdom from Star Wars: Many of the truths we cling to are very dependent on our point of view. There are about six-seven regular party members in Dragon Age II, each with a distinct view of the world, and even though those viewpoints may be in conflict with one another and the player might not necessarily agree with them, that does not make them wrong. In this case, Merrill may not be behaving responsibly by turning to blood magic, but she did it to further a noble cause: reclaiming her people's culture. Likewise, Fenris may be overly harsh, but he's reacting this way due to trauma that caused him to severely distrust anything pertaining to magic. It's not a simple matter of right and wrong here, it's a case of clashing viewpoints.
God I love Fenris so much, but his hate of Merrill is heartbreaking 🤧 she's so nice to him and he's so vitriolic. It's one thing when he hates on Anders because Anders hates him back. Fenris kicks Merrill when she's down and she's always kind to him anyway 😭 it killlllllls me
Anders doesnt "hate" him, he hates his believes. When they dont talk about mages, similarities resurface so much that its just holy sheeet. Especially when they talked about suicide.
@@SeventhheavenDK ill rephrase, if fenris tomorrow will stop harping on him specifically and advocating so strongly for the circles comparing free mages with magistets, he wouldnt hate him. So its not about fenris specifically but what he believes and represents
After Trespasser it only makes Merrill’s journey that much more tragic because you know she’s fighting to reclaim something that isn’t worth the sacrifices she’s making
Dragon age fans: “I hate viv cause she’s a mean B !!” Also them: fenris and morrigan saying and being the absolute worst people imaginable is such a mood and so funny 😂
Yeah of course cause she knows "her place" and so mellow you would try hard to make someone hate her. Because she has no believes or personality, especially compared to the rest of the party. What even defines her? Nothing.
But your face might crack when you smile, so be careful. Holy goodness, I love Merrill. And I love Fenris at the same time. Their banter is some of the most interesting. It's possible to like both, you know.
oh come on Carter was so realistic, mostley when I choose whatever he wants so I can make him happy and he just goes "Fuck you Ima hate you anyways cause you don't suck"
Spenser Steinhorst Varrick is my favorite just because he isn't so piss full of himself Fenris is 2nd just because he reminds me of how I used to be But Carver goes way to the bottom just above anders, out of dragon age 2 of course because in all honesty dragon age 2 didn't feel like a sequel to me just more of a side story that build alot of context on magic
Fearfulcrawdog I can agree with you on feeling like it's a side story. I like Carver because he's a realistic younger brother. I'm a younger brother, and I was just like him growing up. Yeah, he's a jerk in the beginning, but not if you actively work to make him your friend in Act 1. Plus, if you make him a Warden, he makes a U turn. In Legacy as a Warden, he even admits he was an ass, and he's tried to change. What I don't understand is why people call Fenris a whiny emo when he shares the game with Anders, a good character that got ruined...
Ugh, again with all this Fenris hate. I like Merrill, but I'm not letting her cute and innocent demeanor cloud my better judgement. As is Fenris. He wouldn't have snapped at her unless he had a good reason to, which is her being a naiive blood mage who was foolish enough to never think about the consequences (you won't see him being hostile towards Bethany during their banter just because she was a mage; you will see him gaining respect towards a mage Hawke as the game proceeds). Fenris had good reasoning and arguments when it came to his conflict with Merrill, moreover, he ended up being right all along. In fact, you're just being too judgemental towards him because you refuse to see her faults and hate him for delivering the ruthless truth. But when he told he was sorry about the keeper I believe that he was sincere, then Merrill just had to snarl back at him when he finally tried to be friendly, which destroyed the sence of comradery in him and made him snap back. Yes, his speeches were always harsh, but since he was the person who was willing to talk some sense into her, I'd let him continue on with it for as long as he likes. Because someone had to stop coddling her and show her that she ripped what she sow. You cultivate you hate towards him by dwelling on this conflict and won't even let him show you his developement. Listen to his other party banters and you'll see that he is not an asshole you came to believe he is. He is a nice guy who can ponder on serious matters, crack a few jokes and deliver some sarcastic comments. I absolutely love seeing him coming out of his shell during his conversations with Hawke and warming up considerably towards other companions, becoming good friends with Aveline, Isabela, Sebastian and Varric. JUST GIVE HIM A CHANCE, DANG IT!!!
Nastenya Who are the people who hate Fenris? Aww but he's SO CUTE AND WISE! Wah detailed analysis thumbs up! I don't really hate Merrill either, but they're foils to one another. All of us even between elves have differences and prejudices so this is quite realistic.
Are you serious? Yes, I agree that he should knock some sense into her, but he takes it to far. For example he insulted her when she lost a dear friend.
@thomas brady . Well, the game hasn't shown one single example of Blood Magic not being evil yet, none of the three games. Or at least, the coincidence of every people shown in the game that uses blood magic always fall into making stupid things, and Merril is not the exception.
3:25 I didn’t think of it before, but that was concern, for Merrill, wasn’t it? I forget sometimes that it’s not mages personally that Fenris hates, it’s the endless loop of tragic ends they seem intent on persisting in (even in inquisition, they were on the brink of going to Tevinter to become magisters. All it took was the opportunity, opportunity that came when Alexius reversed time to make it there.) He (Fenris) is just fine with a MageHawke, especially one who controls their powers well and doesn’t make deals with demons. It’s the paths that Anders and Merrill insist on taking that sets them on a bitter note for him. And he wasn’t wrong for it, for all the tragedy that begot.
Although Merrill's path (if nobody bothered her) would destroy herself alone: Marethari got in the way because she loved Merrill as a daughter but her love was obsessive and suffocating, when you consider that her only friends in the clan were Tamlen and Mahariel(and it was Mahariel who started that friendship while Tamlen was apparently a bit skeptical about it). IF the Keeper didn't get in the way, Merrill would have been possessed, and killed on the spot by Hawke and the rest of the team(which is why Merrill brought them along, just in case) and nobody else would have been harmed, the keeper would still be alive. Anders' path is wider, he was pacifically trying to spread awareness about the mages-plight, while Justice was slowly being corrupted and distorted into Vengeance. Anders is a good guy who used the wrong methods and became a hypocrite without even noticing how he was changing.
@geistsoulsAnders was not in his right mind, and deliberately instigated a slaughter of a Circle to prove a point and get other circles rebel. There’s a good reason even Anders fully recognizes he went to far, and that he’s become too much of a monster with Justice.
You can't really blame Fenris for that viewpoint considering he knows literally nothing else. He's only ever seen mages who are cruel or, like Merrill, good intentions leads them down a potentially destructive path. I agree that the mages shouldn't have to be locked up in the Gallows, but to turn Fenris over to the mages who enslaved him makes you just as hypocritical as he is. Basic freedom shouldn't be conditional; you can't support the mages autonomy while letting someone else be a slave.
Yes she is. Many things besides "kind" - patronizing, condescending, pitying. Pity in particular is the worst. I know many people probably dont quite understand but pity (not sympathy) humiliates you. You always should be careful about trying to give someone sympathy in a situation like abuse, especially of that level. Note that he doesnt react the same way about Hawkes or even Sebastians sympathy
1:09 I don't why but I find it ironic that the valesine on fenris is somewhat an irony or ironic since in the ancient elven empire to have a valesine it means you're a slave
while all this is going on Hawk is sick and tired of it, i can imagine him just turning around and go at them like " Oh, for fucks sake! if you two don't shut up and stop bickering I will glue your hands together and keep it that way until i say otherwise!" XD
I am not saying it´s right, but it´s natural "human" reaction. Sometimes it´s just too hard not to ressemblance. If you see me bully someone else it will remind you person who bullied you. When Fenris see mages (blood mages in particular) it will remind him everything he came throught, and her effort to "connect" with him is making it even worse, it is like pouring salt into yet open wound.
I think the weirdest thing about this is, after watching the Merrill/Anders banter, Fenris is much less of a prick to Merrill than Anders is. That's troubling to me...
@@thenablade858 yeah but Anders is mostly a hypocrite, while Fenris bitches...just for the hell of it(i'm not defending either of them, they both suck but in different ways)
It doesn't give Fenris the license to be a total asshole. Anders hates the Templars with a passion, but he realize that not all Templars are bad. If I become an asshole to Thrask, by blackmailing him using his abomination daughter I receive a negative reaction from him. I also remember killing his former master to be than back stabbed at the end of ACT 3 when he decided to fight me instead of helping me to fight for the mages.
Jesus I know that comment is old but seeing someone give Anders credit is honestly incredible, when even his own writers hate him. Brings a tear to my eyes. I hate that people forget everything he did during da2 and only remember what he did in the end after 9 years. But still, taumatized people will be assholes. Considering that all he does is talk instead of say trying to kill mages left and right and in fact can get better off in the end of da2, its not as bad imo. But I'd like an option to shake him up a bit and tell him to shut up when it gets too much, sadly da2 doesnt have it.
Also kind, innocent, and clearly being used by him as a scapegoat for the injustices done to him by someone else. It would be like me blaming you for bullying me at school, you didn't but some other guy did, and you're a guy so, by Fenris logic, it's your fault.
There are so many times in the game I want to just punch Fenris. A few times where he is alright, but mostly I want to just hit him for being so cruel to Merril- Anders too, when Justice goes all "All blood-mages are evil!" mode.
He's got a point about Merrill on the Keeper dying. You have used magic could have destroyed you but killed your own keeper after warning after warning.
Yeah, never understood why people like Fenris so much. He is an idiot who can't see past his own feet, yet feels like he can criticize anyone else. Man suffered, sure, but he's also caused tons of suffering to others. Yet apparently, he acts like only he suffered. He insults Merrill and tries to bash her into the ground, but how is he any better? Anders put it best in their conversation, when Fenris acknowledge that he didn't need demons in his head to perpetrate mass murders and mass horrors. Also, extremely prideful, but acts like only his words and views is right. He's a pompous fool through and through.
the banter triggered while I was still on sundermount XD i was like Daaaamn Fenris her clan just died like 20 seconds ago and then i clicked him by accident when i was trying to hit him with my sword and he says "I am yours." and all was forgiven
And what are Tevinter mages? Blood mages. What is Merril? A Blood mage. Dalish don't become blood mages, hence her own clans distain for her. Also I wasn't really trying to make an excuse, just pointing out a fact. I ran out of room or I would have put in more about Anders's apparent dislike for her choices.
Lmao the cruelest things he says to Merril here are at the end of the game. There is no reason to say the things he does after Merril said the keeper was like her mother. The point was cruelty. He is just a cruel, miserable person through and through.
A mod made him a little bigger, replaced that emo hair of his and his armor to a more fitting one and bang: I could like the character. And the original voice fit his new looks perfectly.
Been looking all over for party banter between Fenris and Merrill where they both were involved with Hawke at one point. Am I to assume there is none? If so am highly disappointed cause I was expecting some jealous convos, like Fenris has with Anders once Hawke ends up with him after Fenris leaves
That is true, and I wouldn't let him sweet talk me out of anything. I love to rival him to much. But I understand his past and hatred of mages and don't get mad or surprised when he is mean to them. I mean would you get mad at a holocaust survivor for being mean to a german? Also he wasn't trying to be mean to Merril at first, He was trying to offer some of his condolences, and she snapped at him. It's her ignorant nature that seems to bother him the most. Anders is mean to her at times. :D
maybe i spoke too harshly, but if you forgive his mistreatment of others it gives him the wrong idea that he can just sweet talk his way out of anything with you, you need to be firm and assert yourself with him otherwise him and his issues will walk all over you and is that the kind of relationship you really want to have?
already making apologies for him? ive seen many relationships take a bad turn when one of the partners started doing that... but as to your holocaust survivor german example. it doesnt really hold up. its like a holocaust survivor being made at someone who looks german, or once visted germany. he is mad at a specific mage, or if you wish to generalize, the mages of Tevinter(spelling?) neither of which is a naive dalish from an entirely different continent.
Well there is one option that shuts him up for good. You can give him to danarius..,.but merrill begs you not to so I can't bring myself to do it in anything but my super evil playthrough. I did quite enjoy my 1st playthrough were I wasn't at sufficient friendship with him and he turned on me at the end game. Most satisfying explosive strike ever.
What's with the personal attack on my taste in men D: I was agreeing with your hatred of him being mean to her, by saying that I tried to hit him with my sword, and was caught of guard by the "I am yours." And who else was I supposed to romance in the game? Anders? He is just so lame now that he has justice in him. Isabela? Nope. And personally I don't even like Merril.
The only reason I can justify his behavior to Merril is because she is trying to rebuild the thing that killed Tamlin, otherwise, as much I adore him, Fenris is definitely being a dick
So... when caan we get the DLC to throw Fenris out the Dragon-Age version of the Airlock?Because I really want to space him... or drown him in blood... or stab him... Still, that last remark Merril had, 'Your face might crack'? That was just a bicth-slap to the moody bugger :D
Hmm. possible, I AM a dark lord of the Sith. But I'm more the emperor then Darth Maul. Less showing off and more subtle manipulations. Its like a game of chess, only the pieces bleed and scream.
He is a piece of shit. I can't stand him to be honest with you. Hes all about himself. He doesn't care that the innocent mages are being abused in the circle for as long as their kept in the chantry prison. He thinks all mages are just like his master. Thank goodness you have the option to turn him over to his master.
fenris point about merril she too naive not powerfull eugh control blood magic she will fall pray demon 1 point or other ting is blood magic not cerefull not powerfull eugh will consume u will leave u demon meal then it better kill mage then treqeul thet just ew
also now that I think about it, your logic doesn't stand. He doesn't hate merril because she is a dalish, he hates her because she was a mage. By your logic you're implying that he hates his old master because he is human, which is not the case. He hates the fact that he is a blood mage. He hates the fact that merril is a blood mage. Her race or where she comes from has nothing to do with his hatred.
He does look down on BOTH the dalish and city elves tho, I think that was in his short story. Dalish because they dance in the mud in the woods nad city elves because they're basically outcasts but still live in cities with humans. There's literally NO winning with him - I mean what the f*ck is wrong with the way dalish live? Its awesome. Its so natural and they're free from everything. He hates everyone. He says the smug gives them away, but he's just as bad.
![Dragon Age 2: Party Banter: Fenris & Sebastian [complete]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/CscNHx5q-Lc/mqdefault.jpg)
![Dragon Age 2: Party Banter: Fenris & Sebastian [complete]](/img/tr.png)
![Dragon Age 2: Party Banter: Isabela & Varric [complete]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/GAeICsZQqDc/mqdefault.jpg)
So, Zevran, Fenris, Merill, Solas and Sera walk into a bar...
+Date Masamune I don't even WANT to imagine the collateral damage.
+Date Masamune It would end with Sera under a table drunk trying to ignore the elves. Zevran trying to hit on her while Fenris and Solas are probably gonna come to blows with Merill trying to calm them down.
+Lelouchxzero1 Fenris really doesn't care about elves at all, so Solas would have no reason to hit him and vice versa. As a matter of fact I think they could discuss so much with each other, since Fenris is a wise man, just not very patient when it comes to stupid questions and Solas gets along with anyone who isn't preaching qun.
R StandsforRated oh its not because of the elves that Fenris would fight him but because solas probably won't shut u[ about mages and elves.
Zervan: Give me a bottle of your best!
Fenris: I hate that bottle of their best...
Sera: Give me a bottle of something that gets me piss drunk!
Fenris: I hate that bottle too...
Merill: ill just take water...
Solas: Water... it reminds me of something i once saw in the Fade
"Even you can be happy once in a while it won't kill you. But your face might crack if you smile so be careful." Gets me every time.
Evie W you could say it "cracked" you up XD
There is a sarcastic bitch hiding behind that puppy face.
+Luiz Antonio I love it
Good for you. :D
Luiz Antonio thank... you?
I actually wanted to slap Fenris at that "I'm only sorry she died for you."
What a horrible thing to say.
That the reason I always kill him, his hate for merrill will not be tolerated in my party
Fenris and Merrill both have closed minds about the things they feel are important. Merrill's life is dedicated to elven history and tradition; to her, magic is a part of who she is - even if demons come with it. Fenris has been tortured beyond belief, and he is constantly trying to liberate himself, to feel like he's more than what he was made to believe for years and years. To him, magic stands for exploitation of power over the innocent. So, could we stop arguing over who is more misled? They are both very powerful people, fighting with their own insecurities. The only thing they agree on is that "Breaking the things you love most isn't only restricted to mages." They're fighting against parts of themselves that they see reflected in others.
***** Because the Keeper dying was a direct result of Merrill not listening when she was told not to mess with blood magic or demons. I love Merrill and I understand the mirror was important to her and why she felt the need to restore it but her actions are the cause of her own misery. She didn't ask the keeper to step in, Merrill was quite willing to face the consequences which is why she brought Hawke along in case she did get possessed.
She didn't expect the keeper to intervene and Fenris may be very cruel here but the keeper is dead as a result of her actions, and if you fight the Dalish that's her entire clan gone because of her insistence on fixing the mirror. Her keeper died for something Merrill did and yet she didn't have to face the consequences.That's why he said it because she made that choice and the consequences are on her and she has to live with it, as much as the Keepers own actions are her doing. And Merrill needs to hear that cruel or not it is the truth, Coddling Merrill and excusing her of blame is not doing her any good.
I actually like both characters and I hate how Merrill manages to be supportive of the other characters in game when some of them (Anders and Fenris in particular treat her so badly, it really does make me angry when they do that)
Merrill wouldn't have been putting herself or any members of the clan in danger at all if she had left the mirror alone. Marethari was trying to protect her, you say she was selfish because she put Merrill before the Clan. But Merrill was of her clan, she was Marethari's first until the disagreement over the mirror. Why wouldn't she still love Merrill as one of her own. In her eyes Merrill was following a path that would only lead to ruin through possession by a demon or death. So she opted to save her even though it meant sacrificing her own life because Merrill was still one of her children, even when she was walking a separate and entirely dangerous path. If you chose to do something dangerous and potentially lethal and actively told people about it,and your parent or guardian stepped in to protect you but doing so cost them their life. Would you declare yourself blameless. Yes they ultimately made the choice to step in and save you, but you putting yourself in that situation makes you just as responsible as they are.
Marethari knew the risks of getting involved to save Merrill and yes you can say she was selfish or whatever for focusing on Merrill instead of the entire Clan. But to be fair the rest of the Clan hadn't consorted with a demon while trying to fix an artifact that killed two other members of that clan against the advice of everyone despite knowing the dangers. If the rest of the clan were doing that yet she still focused on Merrills actions then yes she would be unreasonably focusing on Merrill. But Merrill was taking a huge risk and she wasn't going to sit around and watch her potentially destroy herself. Maybe she had no idea Hawke would intervene, especially if Marethari had already taken the demon into her body before she met Hawk for the first time. Perhaps she thought Merrill would engage the demon alone and thought it was the only way to save her. Or perhaps she did know Merrill would bring Hawke along to put her down if she got possessed but she didn't want Merrill to die from such recklessness. Or for any of your party to go through that regardless.
Also I see no evidence in game stating that the demon wasn't already a Pride demon before possessing Marthari. Sure maybe it is based upon Marethari's pride but Merrill also thought she was right and refused to listen to anybody else. Therefore perhaps the pride demon was actually a manifestation of Merrill's pride. Or perhaps it was a pride demon inside that place the whole time.
Neeta Song yea agreed. The keeper was good and even fen respected that. He's prejudiced but ustand his position
***** er how did she fail? No matter our views its gd that ppp here like them. Hehe
i see ok
Damn... the party banter between these two is brutal
To be entirely unpopular, I enjoyed both of these characters, but Merrill is very naïve and sweet, but she is way too naïve about the risks of using blood magic and summoning demons. She believes she runs no risk with what she's doing and Fenris is a perpetual pessimist who has seen powerful mages at their worst. Harsh lessons are being passed between them, but as I always played a mage in my DA stories, I support Fenris here because all mages are being punished for the actions of a few. As innocent as her intentions are, her lack of knowledge about what she's truly up against finally ends up destroying the people she loves.
MiyuEmi Agree 1000000%
MiyuEmi Merril isn't pure like a child.
Her use of sarcasm shows that. It has less to do with naivete and more with... just not caring.
MissMurder1243 HE is brutal
Fenris has a giant hate boner doesn't her!
"I'm only sorry she died for you," is seriously the worst thing any character says to any other character during the banter in this game.
Annnnd that's why Fenris can FUCK OFF. Seriously, he has no excuse.
She was lucky Anders wasn't also present. They both join forces for a moment to deliver a brutal verbal beatdown on her lol.
Honestly Merrill is too good of a character, she sympathizes and still willing to help Anders and Fenris regardless. More sad fact, if you look at the cut content / you had a dalish warden in origins, it reveals that part of the reason she wants to restore the mirror was to help get her friends back, basically closure which I feel that's the main reason behind her drive, not for history, but for her Tamlen and Mahariel.
@@callmek186 Get Tamlen and Mahariel back? Tamlen died of the darkspawn taint, Mahariel was forced to become a grey warden as a result of the mirror. For Tamlen's case, Merrill isn't aware of Tamlen's fate, maybe she believes the mirror took Tamlen. But it's obvious that there's not much Merrill can do to bring Mahariel back unless if she somehow finds a cure for the taint through the mirror. But the mirror only proved that it's only tainted.
I feel at the point Isabella probably should have slapped Fenris or Ander for saying that shit.
You never say that to anybody
I love how self-aware the developers were on Fenris's edgelord mentality
Hell, Varric practically outright calls him an "edgelord" at one point (or "angsty" or something), and Fenris is basically like, "Yeah that's fair."
@@GoddoDoggo “angsty Tevinter elf”
Merrill is naïve in thinking that her blood magic could ever lead to something good, and Fenris is right to criticise her for it, but that comment about how his only regret over the Keeper's death is that she died for Merrill was unnecessarily cruel, especially after Merrill told him that the Keeper was like a mother to her.
Most of the interactions at least on his part are needlessly cruel. He mocks all Dalish elves simply because Merrill is a ditzy twist. She's skipping around landmines and mistaking them for daisies. except it's blood magic and demons not flowers
Fenris is unnecessarily cruel. Period. He’s not a good or kind person.
I saw another comment that Merrill's blood magic was fine. She wasn't contacting any demons, she was contacting a spirit of wisdom which is a good spirit. According to Justice in Awakening though, spirits can be corrupted by their own will, and according to Solas, interaction with corrupt will turns fine spirits into demons. So it's possible that Merrill was actually right about the eluvian, the spirit, etc, and that Marethari was actually the one that corrupted the spirit and risked Merrill's life.
One thing I noticed about spirits and demons is that demons tend to tempt or command people, but spirits only answer questions. Maybe I need to replay DA2 to recall if Merrill's spirit ever asked her to do anything, but Justice in Awakening was already a huge flag that he was a demon of Vengeance than a spirit of Justice because he'd already been telling a non-compliant Anders to free the mages. Anders only wanted to escape at that point. Which makes me feeling extremely betrayed because I used to romance Anders a lot and try to dictate Merrill for not being careful. Things could have been the other way around knowing Anders was a legitimate abomination all along...
@@kalen2465 Not necessarily. Merrill is quite aware that everything in the Fade, including spirits and demons is quite dangerous. She just thinks she has mostly under control, which, admittedly, she does. She could've fixed the mirror without intervention, she'd have just turned into an abomination, but I think by that point she was more than past caring.
Fenris, honey, I love you but if you say one more mean thing to Merrill I will pinch your ear.
While Fenris and Anders are not entirely wrong and I can understand where they are coming from, I still wish they would ease off a little when speaking to Merrill. There is being right, and then there is being an utter jerk about it. Jeez, sometimes I just want to lock my companions in a room, except for Varric, we'd play Wicked Grace, while the rest sort out their differences and hopefully don't kill each other. I could take away their weapons and cast paralyze on all of them, maybe that will keep them from spilling blood. I love them all though, they are like family. Well, Sebastian can go get eaten by a dragon, but everyone else is cool.
10 years. The game timeline spanned 10 years. I blame the lack of time, for most of the companion party banters. After 10 years fighting side by side, hanging out with the same person and overall just being around each other, most of them should have been able to get past their differences and get along. Fenris becomes friends with Varric and Aveline rather quickly, and he does have a sense of humor, not to mention he is one of the few companions who doesn't mind sarcastic Hawke. Romancing him as a mage would have more effect on his view of magic and mages. Letting Hawke butt in the banters, would have changed things up too, I like that they allowed the Inquistitor to speak sometimes during banters, and even have companions talk to him/her. Within 10 years, Anders and Fenris should have found common ground, and if Hawke had been able to interject their banters with Merrill, they should have eased off and apologized to her. They don't have to stop warning her about blood magic and demons but could have realized they need to be nicer about it. So much more could have and should have been done. If they just had the time they need, I feel like things would have been a lot different. Fenris is a conflicted character, but he is way less selfish than Anders and not nearly as nasty to the other companions. You'd have to romance him through the friendship path as a mage to really see the softer sides of him. Despite the lack of writing, these companions are not black and white and you really got to listen to the tones of the voice actors. DA voice actors are amazing. I think I'm a Cole when it comes to fictional characters.
I'm not sure if that made any sense, it's late where I am.
Everything you just said, supports the fact that the writing was bad.
All the companions have done shit, Merrill to, she is not all innocent. That being said, they all have done some good too, depending on the way the game is played.
Fenris and Varric are friends, but then again, Varric is friends with everyone.
I've never had a problem getting Fenris' friendship maxed out even though I support mages and even when I'm romancing someone else on a different playthrough. Unlike Anders with the temps, Fenris sides with Hawke to help the mages at the end of the game.
Yeah, Anders heals people for free during the game. He knows how to do that. Fenris was a slave his entire life, and in case you forgot, he was sexually abused. He does plenty post game, however, killing the slavers that came down to pray on the Kirkwall refugees is a good thing. Merrill helps refugees post game but does little in-game. Aveline is guard captain in and out of game, and will stop Sebastian from storming Kirkwall. Most of the companions do more for others post game. Isabella and Sebastain are the only one that don't.
I do like Merrill, but she is unreasonable. Everyone warns her about demons and blood magic, but does she ever listen?
Fenris was tortured by Blood magic, he knows about demons, and Anders knows plenty too, first-hand even. Stop defending Merrill like she's all innocent, none of the characters are innocent. She does not know what she is doing, and if Solas was in 2, he would have lectured her too. Oh yeah, Fenris approves, will he didn't in mine because I did not choose that route so it didn't happen. Fenris actually gets better than Anders by act 3, hell there's a conversation between him and Anders, where Fenris is being civil. *Again. Fenris. Sides. With. The. Mages.* He changes the most depending on how you play the game. Let's mess with the mirror that took away two of my clan, great idea! My Mahariel would have lectured her as well. Yeah, Merrill's cute, but gods damn she is naive as hell! Let's not forget her taking the demon's offer in the Fade and turning on you.
I love Fenris but he's such an edgelord
lol right
Which is why it's so worth it to get him flustered and to laugh 💕
"Avert your eyes, witch" probably wasn't meant to be funny but it really is
Fenris is a Final Fantasy character who wound up stumbling upon a portal and fell into Thedas
Considering how XI and XIV have Elves, I could definitely see that.
Fenris and Merrill are both flawed. Fenris is violent and stubborn with anger, yet Merrill does not like to listen to constructive criticism. Merrill is clueless at some times, which can be cute at times but sometimes leads to danger.
Fenris is tainted by trauma, Merrill is tainted by jealously (like how she's upset when Maratheri will help Fenriyel)
She uses blood magic and messes with demons, which lets face it is not a great idea.
They're both stubborn. Yes, Merrill is more open in many ways than Fenris, but you NEED to remember that Fenris's first memory is torture at the hands of a mage. There was no therapists or psychologists for PTSD, BPD, etc whatever results of trauma back then. Fenris sees mages as a danger, even if he does not think those mages are bad people.
They're both flawed. They're both beautiful. They both have their flaws and weaknesses, but also their strengths and they make both Hawke and the viewers happy. Neither of them are bad. Neither of them are evil. Neither are perfect. That's what I love so much about Dragon Age, that each character is beautifully flawed.
Merrill is smarter than you think, the whole mess with the clan, happened because Marethari decided to "save her" but if she didn't, Merrill would have died and she accepted the risks and the consequences because she was that desperate: The Eluvian took her friends(Tamlen and Mahariel) away from her, and she didn't get any closure, she felt like she didn't enough to save them and was trying to...ALONE(aside from Hawke's help) exactly because she understood the risks.
And then things happened, and both Fenris, Anders and Aveline(i think) decided to stick a finger in her still fresh "mental wound" by accusing her, blaming her and belittling her.
@@derokdeathaxe6984 Yup, I agree. I made this comment two years ago and agree with some of what I said but not everything.
I see a lot of Solas in Merrill in retrospect. They both see that repairing the past comes with a heavy cost, but one they cannot afford not to pay. They can't live with themselves just accepting what's lost is forever lost.
"They've heard...They just don't care..."
lmao!
some people think that Merrill is naive and innocent, but imo i think that merrill is just misunderstood.
because she was born a dalish, the Common Language is her second language, so she misunderstands idioms and sayings people say.
i feel like Fen is just being a serious dick to her, cause he refuses to see her point of view.
Yes.
Lol, I am pretty sure the language barrier here doesn't exist.
And Merril is pretty narrow minded herself to opposite opinions.
@@SeventhheavenDK Not nearly as much imo. She, at least, understands that what she's doing isn't so black and white, but necessary. I'd do the same thing as her. Though I'm a history teacher. So I'm biased. ESPECIALLY if there's hardly any history left of your people. It's super important.
I think now is a good time to bring up a piece of wisdom from Star Wars: Many of the truths we cling to are very dependent on our point of view. There are about six-seven regular party members in Dragon Age II, each with a distinct view of the world, and even though those viewpoints may be in conflict with one another and the player might not necessarily agree with them, that does not make them wrong. In this case, Merrill may not be behaving responsibly by turning to blood magic, but she did it to further a noble cause: reclaiming her people's culture. Likewise, Fenris may be overly harsh, but he's reacting this way due to trauma that caused him to severely distrust anything pertaining to magic. It's not a simple matter of right and wrong here, it's a case of clashing viewpoints.
I think more people need to remember that these days.
@@georgemeyers7172 ua-cam.com/video/pSOBeD1GC_Y/v-deo.html u.u
Some things are up to point if view, but some things are objectivelly true or false... A view twisted by trauma doesn't change that.
God I love Fenris so much, but his hate of Merrill is heartbreaking 🤧 she's so nice to him and he's so vitriolic. It's one thing when he hates on Anders because Anders hates him back. Fenris kicks Merrill when she's down and she's always kind to him anyway 😭 it killlllllls me
Anders doesnt "hate" him, he hates his believes. When they dont talk about mages, similarities resurface so much that its just holy sheeet. Especially when they talked about suicide.
@@vermilion6966 . Yet he celebrates the deed if Hawke turns Fenris over to Danarius, to me that is an example of hating him.
Because Merril represents what he hates in many ways, and too make it words she proved him right.
@@SeventhheavenDK ill rephrase, if fenris tomorrow will stop harping on him specifically and advocating so strongly for the circles comparing free mages with magistets, he wouldnt hate him. So its not about fenris specifically but what he believes and represents
@@vermilion6966 Beliefs are part of who someone is, dunno why you're pretending Anders doesn't hate Fenris.
After Trespasser it only makes Merrill’s journey that much more tragic because you know she’s fighting to reclaim something that isn’t worth the sacrifices she’s making
Yeah all elven history is a lie
Why? Access to Crossroads through mobile portals is quite worth it.
Dragon age fans: “I hate viv cause she’s a mean B !!”
Also them: fenris and morrigan saying and being the absolute worst people imaginable is such a mood and so funny 😂
"But your face might crack if you smile, so be careful" OWNED
I would like to see Fenris do a weather forecast. He'd probably say something negative about that, too. xD
One of the best Party Banters ever!!! 2:32 probably one of my favourites. I love these two so much ha ha
he's nice to Bethany too you know. Its all about respect with him :]
Probably because Bethany is the only one who is actually nice to him who.
Yeah of course cause she knows "her place" and so mellow you would try hard to make someone hate her. Because she has no believes or personality, especially compared to the rest of the party. What even defines her? Nothing.
Because Bethany earns respect as a person and as mage, Merril is idiotic.
But your face might crack when you smile, so be careful.
Holy goodness, I love Merrill. And I love Fenris at the same time. Their banter is some of the most interesting. It's possible to like both, you know.
3:02
Merrill: Do you like anything?
Fenris: I like quiet:
(Hawke gives him the ''Really and nothing else" look)
Fenris:.........and Hawke
why so much hate on fenris hes probably the most real character in dragon age 2 besides varric
oh come on Carter was so realistic, mostley when I choose whatever he wants so I can make him happy and he just goes "Fuck you Ima hate you anyways cause you don't suck"
***** I usually make him a templer just because I don't like having two mages in the party at any one time
Fenris is my second favorite character in the entire series. Carver' my favorite and Varric's my third.
Spenser Steinhorst Varrick is my favorite just because he isn't so piss full of himself Fenris is 2nd just because he reminds me of how I used to be But Carver goes way to the bottom just above anders, out of dragon age 2 of course because in all honesty dragon age 2 didn't feel like a sequel to me just more of a side story that build alot of context on magic
Fearfulcrawdog I can agree with you on feeling like it's a side story. I like Carver because he's a realistic younger brother. I'm a younger brother, and I was just like him growing up. Yeah, he's a jerk in the beginning, but not if you actively work to make him your friend in Act 1. Plus, if you make him a Warden, he makes a U turn. In Legacy as a Warden, he even admits he was an ass, and he's tried to change.
What I don't understand is why people call Fenris a whiny emo when he shares the game with Anders, a good character that got ruined...
Ugh, again with all this Fenris hate.
I like Merrill, but I'm not letting her cute and innocent demeanor cloud my better judgement. As is Fenris. He wouldn't have snapped at her unless he had a good reason to, which is her being a naiive blood mage who was foolish enough to never think about the consequences (you won't see him being hostile towards Bethany during their banter just because she was a mage; you will see him gaining respect towards a mage Hawke as the game proceeds). Fenris had good reasoning and arguments when it came to his conflict with Merrill, moreover, he ended up being right all along. In fact, you're just being too judgemental towards him because you refuse to see her faults and hate him for delivering the ruthless truth. But when he told he was sorry about the keeper I believe that he was sincere, then Merrill just had to snarl back at him when he finally tried to be friendly, which destroyed the sence of comradery in him and made him snap back. Yes, his speeches were always harsh, but since he was the person who was willing to talk some sense into her, I'd let him continue on with it for as long as he likes. Because someone had to stop coddling her and show her that she ripped what she sow.
You cultivate you hate towards him by dwelling on this conflict and won't even let him show you his developement. Listen to his other party banters and you'll see that he is not an asshole you came to believe he is. He is a nice guy who can ponder on serious matters, crack a few jokes and deliver some sarcastic comments. I absolutely love seeing him coming out of his shell during his conversations with Hawke and warming up considerably towards other companions, becoming good friends with Aveline, Isabela, Sebastian and Varric.
JUST GIVE HIM A CHANCE, DANG IT!!!
Nastenya Who are the people who hate Fenris? Aww but he's SO CUTE AND WISE!
Wah detailed analysis thumbs up! I don't really hate Merrill either, but they're foils to one another. All of us even between elves have differences and prejudices so this is quite realistic.
Are you serious? Yes, I agree that he should knock some sense into her, but he takes it to far. For example he insulted her when she lost a dear friend.
@thomas brady . Well, the game hasn't shown one single example of Blood Magic not being evil yet, none of the three games. Or at least, the coincidence of every people shown in the game that uses blood magic always fall into making stupid things, and Merril is not the exception.
3:25 I didn’t think of it before, but that was concern, for Merrill, wasn’t it?
I forget sometimes that it’s not mages personally that Fenris hates, it’s the endless loop of tragic ends they seem intent on persisting in (even in inquisition, they were on the brink of going to Tevinter to become magisters. All it took was the opportunity, opportunity that came when Alexius reversed time to make it there.)
He (Fenris) is just fine with a MageHawke, especially one who controls their powers well and doesn’t make deals with demons. It’s the paths that Anders and Merrill insist on taking that sets them on a bitter note for him. And he wasn’t wrong for it, for all the tragedy that begot.
Although Merrill's path (if nobody bothered her) would destroy herself alone: Marethari got in the way because she loved Merrill as a daughter but her love was obsessive and suffocating, when you consider that her only friends in the clan were Tamlen and Mahariel(and it was Mahariel who started that friendship while Tamlen was apparently a bit skeptical about it). IF the Keeper didn't get in the way, Merrill would have been possessed, and killed on the spot by Hawke and the rest of the team(which is why Merrill brought them along, just in case) and nobody else would have been harmed, the keeper would still be alive.
Anders' path is wider, he was pacifically trying to spread awareness about the mages-plight, while Justice was slowly being corrupted and distorted into Vengeance. Anders is a good guy who used the wrong methods and became a hypocrite without even noticing how he was changing.
@geistsoulsAnders was not in his right mind, and deliberately instigated a slaughter of a Circle to prove a point and get other circles rebel. There’s a good reason even Anders fully recognizes he went to far, and that he’s become too much of a monster with Justice.
You can't really blame Fenris for that viewpoint considering he knows literally nothing else. He's only ever seen mages who are cruel or, like Merrill, good intentions leads them down a potentially destructive path. I agree that the mages shouldn't have to be locked up in the Gallows, but to turn Fenris over to the mages who enslaved him makes you just as hypocritical as he is. Basic freedom shouldn't be conditional; you can't support the mages autonomy while letting someone else be a slave.
Seriously. She's never anything but kind to him (even giggling extatically when he and hawke are involved) but he treats her like garbage.
Yes she is. Many things besides "kind" - patronizing, condescending, pitying. Pity in particular is the worst. I know many people probably dont quite understand but pity (not sympathy) humiliates you. You always should be careful about trying to give someone sympathy in a situation like abuse, especially of that level. Note that he doesnt react the same way about Hawkes or even Sebastians sympathy
@@vermilion6966Yeah, 'cause Sebastian isn't a mage he hates on principal, and Hawke is the main character.
1:09 I don't why but I find it ironic that the valesine on fenris is somewhat an irony or ironic since in the ancient elven empire to have a valesine it means you're a slave
Any mark on ones body is a sign of belonging to something so no wonder here.
Elf players arguing about the best backstory in Dragon Age Origins
while all this is going on Hawk is sick and tired of it, i can imagine him just turning around and go at them like
" Oh, for fucks sake! if you two don't shut up and stop bickering I will glue your hands together and keep it that way until i say otherwise!" XD
I am not saying it´s right, but it´s natural "human" reaction. Sometimes it´s just too hard not to ressemblance. If you see me bully someone else it will remind you person who bullied you. When Fenris see mages (blood mages in particular) it will remind him everything he came throught, and her effort to "connect" with him is making it even worse, it is like pouring salt into yet open wound.
I romanced her, rivaled him, and yet the "Renegade" button to punch his face in never showed up. I was deeply saddened.
fenris doesn't deserve the name,, he's an angsty teenager.
I think the weirdest thing about this is, after watching the Merrill/Anders banter, Fenris is much less of a prick to Merrill than Anders is. That's troubling to me...
He really is not.
Especially talking about her dead keeper, he is way worse of a d*ck.
Anders at least thinks he’s helping her. Fenris kind of just bitches constantly.
@@thenablade858 yeah but Anders is mostly a hypocrite, while Fenris bitches...just for the hell of it(i'm not defending either of them, they both suck but in different ways)
It doesn't give Fenris the license to be a total asshole. Anders hates the Templars with a passion, but he realize that not all Templars are bad. If I become an asshole to Thrask, by blackmailing him using his abomination daughter I receive a negative reaction from him. I also remember killing his former master to be than back stabbed at the end of ACT 3 when he decided to fight me instead of helping me to fight for the mages.
Jesus I know that comment is old but seeing someone give Anders credit is honestly incredible, when even his own writers hate him. Brings a tear to my eyes. I hate that people forget everything he did during da2 and only remember what he did in the end after 9 years.
But still, taumatized people will be assholes. Considering that all he does is talk instead of say trying to kill mages left and right and in fact can get better off in the end of da2, its not as bad imo. But I'd like an option to shake him up a bit and tell him to shut up when it gets too much, sadly da2 doesnt have it.
Also kind, innocent, and clearly being used by him as a scapegoat for the injustices done to him by someone else. It would be like me blaming you for bullying me at school, you didn't but some other guy did, and you're a guy so, by Fenris logic, it's your fault.
Seeing Solas' Romance then hearing Merrill comment that Fenris has rhe vallaslin....
There are so many times in the game I want to just punch Fenris. A few times where he is alright, but mostly I want to just hit him for being so cruel to Merril- Anders too, when Justice goes all "All blood-mages are evil!" mode.
Lol I thought he was very sexy.
She needed to hear every bit of it.
Being cute doesn't put you above accountability.
Luiz Antonio he takes it too far. He is downright sadistic.
I hate him with a passion, i'm glad i had to kill him in the end game.
See, even the Wardens agree that Fenris needs to choke on a Qunari sword
I hated Fenris so damn much. His whining and hatred for Merrill.
fenris is such a mood
He's got a point about Merrill on the Keeper dying. You have used magic could have destroyed you but killed your own keeper after warning after warning.
Yeah, never understood why people like Fenris so much. He is an idiot who can't see past his own feet, yet feels like he can criticize anyone else. Man suffered, sure, but he's also caused tons of suffering to others. Yet apparently, he acts like only he suffered. He insults Merrill and tries to bash her into the ground, but how is he any better? Anders put it best in their conversation, when Fenris acknowledge that he didn't need demons in his head to perpetrate mass murders and mass horrors. Also, extremely prideful, but acts like only his words and views is right.
He's a pompous fool through and through.
the banter triggered while I was still on sundermount XD
i was like Daaaamn Fenris her clan just died like 20 seconds ago
and then i clicked him by accident when i was trying to hit him with my sword
and he says "I am yours."
and all was forgiven
And what are Tevinter mages? Blood mages.
What is Merril? A Blood mage. Dalish don't become blood mages, hence her own clans distain for her.
Also I wasn't really trying to make an excuse, just pointing out a fact. I ran out of room or I would have put in more about Anders's apparent dislike for her choices.
@lastofthemogicans No, I don’t use mods.
I didn't really like Fenris but 2:22 and 6:07 made me like him, I love it when him and Anders put her down for using blood magic.
it's Marethari's staff, you get it after Merrill's final companion quest
UGH, fucking hated that whiny emo-I usually end up killing him after siding with the mages :P
"I like quiet" Fenris...you sound like Branch (from Trolls) XD
2:31 Hahahahaha! Nice one, Varric. xD
Fenris probably has the most character development in any game I’ve ever seen
#stopfenrishate
sadly most of that development happens in comics XD
Lmao the cruelest things he says to Merril here are at the end of the game. There is no reason to say the things he does after Merril said the keeper was like her mother. The point was cruelty. He is just a cruel, miserable person through and through.
How is it that merrill can make the word blood seem adorable?
I just want to gut fenris for treating merrill like that
BOO HOO FENRIS.
A mod made him a little bigger, replaced that emo hair of his and his armor to a more fitting one and bang: I could like the character. And the original voice fit his new looks perfectly.
Bindair Dundat what mod?
Big Bad Fenris.
Been looking all over for party banter between Fenris and Merrill where they both were involved with Hawke at one point. Am I to assume there is none? If so am highly disappointed cause I was expecting some jealous convos, like Fenris has with Anders once Hawke ends up with him after Fenris leaves
That is true, and I wouldn't let him sweet talk me out of anything. I love to rival him to much.
But I understand his past and hatred of mages and don't get mad or surprised when he is mean to them. I mean would you get mad at a holocaust survivor for being mean to a german?
Also he wasn't trying to be mean to Merril at first, He was trying to offer some of his condolences, and she snapped at him. It's her ignorant nature that seems to bother him the most. Anders is mean to her at times.
:D
it's the staff you get from the keepers body (or one of the bound staffs)
Hm, I have the off feeling that these two will hook up in the future.
maybe i spoke too harshly, but if you forgive his mistreatment of others it gives him the wrong idea that he can just sweet talk his way out of anything with you, you need to be firm and assert yourself with him otherwise him and his issues will walk all over you and is that the kind of relationship you really want to have?
the thing that bothers me so much is, that Fenris is... nice to even mage Hawke, but hates all other mages
Well gotta suck up to the pc am i right?
But yeah, hate it personally.
avert your eyes, witch!
lol oh fenris ;)
That last one. Aaawwwww!
already making apologies for him? ive seen many relationships take a bad turn when one of the partners started doing that... but as to your holocaust survivor german example. it doesnt really hold up. its like a holocaust survivor being made at someone who looks german, or once visted germany. he is mad at a specific mage, or if you wish to generalize, the mages of Tevinter(spelling?) neither of which is a naive dalish from an entirely different continent.
Well there is one option that shuts him up for good. You can give him to danarius..,.but merrill begs you not to so I can't bring myself to do it in anything but my super evil playthrough.
I did quite enjoy my 1st playthrough were I wasn't at sufficient friendship with him and he turned on me at the end game. Most satisfying explosive strike ever.
I don't care what anyone says, she a blood Mage and her being "innocent" doesn't make up for that. That magic is evil
*Solas greaty dissaproves*
he is pretty cool guy, even though he has a final fantasy look.
Because I'm not Gordon Freeman.
Merrill is such a troll
thats it! im getting my shovel!
What's with the personal attack on my taste in men D:
I was agreeing with your hatred of him being mean to her, by saying that I tried to hit him with my sword, and was caught of guard by the "I am yours."
And who else was I supposed to romance in the game? Anders? He is just so lame now that he has justice in him. Isabela? Nope. And personally I don't even like Merril.
the force
The only reason I can justify his behavior to Merril is because she is trying to rebuild the thing that killed Tamlin, otherwise, as much I adore him, Fenris is definitely being a dick
Banter Banter
So... when caan we get the DLC to throw Fenris out the Dragon-Age version of the Airlock?Because I really want to space him... or drown him in blood... or stab him...
Still, that last remark Merril had, 'Your face might crack'? That was just a bicth-slap to the moody bugger :D
I agree with fenris the dalish need to let go of the past and mages I care for them but I frickin hate them as well
God i wish wynne could school him
Because I'm not Thor.
y a shovel y not a crowbar
ok then how bout a hamer
well if i may say, you have abysmal taste in men.
Fenris is so unnecessarily mean to Merrill :/
This is why I ship Fenrill. Draaamaaaaaaa!!
So many fangrils defending Fenris just because he's handsome.... Pathetic.
Federico Machado he is not even handsome.
So many sexists thinking fangirls defend Fenris just because he's handsome... Pathetic. (I don't care that this comment is a year old)
Federico Machado I don't understand why people find him handsome
Jessica sexy as fuck ❤
M ew
Doesn't Fenris treat everyone like garbage?
Well he was treated like garbage all his known life to him is that so surprising?
@@vermilion6966By the end of the game he was with the crew for 6 years, he should have learned some basic decency.
Hmm. possible, I AM a dark lord of the Sith. But I'm more the emperor then Darth Maul. Less showing off and more subtle manipulations. Its like a game of chess, only the pieces bleed and scream.
He is a piece of shit. I can't stand him to be honest with you. Hes all about himself. He doesn't care that the innocent mages are being abused in the circle for as long as their kept in the chantry prison. He thinks all mages are just like his master. Thank goodness you have the option to turn him over to his master.
For all his hate of Slavery, he is perfectly fine with imprisonment and forceful lobotomy...
Reckless, naive yet powerful blood mage? I am just suprised he restricted himself to verbal assaults only
He is so agressive with her! He is a coward I really hate him.
fenris point about merril she too naive not powerfull eugh control blood magic she will fall pray demon 1 point or other ting is blood magic not cerefull not powerfull eugh will consume u will leave u demon meal then it better kill mage then treqeul thet just ew
also now that I think about it, your logic doesn't stand. He doesn't hate merril because she is a dalish, he hates her because she was a mage. By your logic you're implying that he hates his old master because he is human, which is not the case. He hates the fact that he is a blood mage. He hates the fact that merril is a blood mage. Her race or where she comes from has nothing to do with his hatred.
He does look down on BOTH the dalish and city elves tho, I think that was in his short story. Dalish because they dance in the mud in the woods nad city elves because they're basically outcasts but still live in cities with humans. There's literally NO winning with him - I mean what the f*ck is wrong with the way dalish live? Its awesome. Its so natural and they're free from everything. He hates everyone.
He says the smug gives them away, but he's just as bad.