Kiesel Guitars - Scott Carstairs - Fallujah - "Lacuna" Playthrough

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  • Опубліковано 25 вер 2024
  • Scott Carstairs plays through Fallujah's song "Lacuna" on a K Series K7C Guitar.
    For more information on the K7, call our custom shop experts at (858) GUITARS
    or click below:
    www.kieselguita...
    Be sure to follow Kiesel Guitars for guitar and bass build pictures, news, and updates from the custom shop:
    / kieselguitars
    / officialjeffkiesel
    / kieselguitars
    / jeffkiesel
    Follow Scott Carstairs:
    / fallujahofficial
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    / fallujahsf
    / scott_carstairs

КОМЕНТАРІ • 205

  • @johnbotelho3453
    @johnbotelho3453 6 років тому +73

    the way how he utilizes the tremolo is amazing. Very delicate and tasteful

  • @dsaillant811
    @dsaillant811 7 років тому +171

    Man, this guy is tight. Such a long hitting distance with the tapping, I'm impressed he can do that without missing.

    • @virnalinebrida-sunga7748
      @virnalinebrida-sunga7748 6 років тому +27

      Dan Saillant I'm impressed he can do it cleanly

    • @johnredcorn1131
      @johnredcorn1131 6 років тому +23

      Virnali Nebrida-Sunga yes!!! you gotta mute the strings just right and tap hard as shit . he makes it looks easy. I'm sure he's spent countless hours on just doing that alone

    • @KyleMcMullan_Musician
      @KyleMcMullan_Musician 5 років тому +36

      I'm pretty sure he's not actually tapping in the normal way.
      It looks like tapped harmonics to me, which requires you to really bounce your fingers off the string so you don't deaden the note, which would explain the long wind-up. It also doesn't have to be quite as accurate, although his look very accurate anyway.

    • @Exgrmbl
      @Exgrmbl 3 роки тому +2

      @@KyleMcMullan_Musician
      that's correct. Tapped harmonics also don't need to be as precise as actual tapping since you never push the string down.

    • @KyleMcMullan_Musician
      @KyleMcMullan_Musician 3 роки тому +1

      @@Exgrmbl Yeah, that is what I said. Except you do mean "accurate" not "precise".

  • @jonhowell5014
    @jonhowell5014 2 роки тому +3

    To comment on just one aspect of his playing: Many of his rapid taps are *harmonic taps*, perfectly executed. Difficulty level = 11/10 (playing for 40+ years, can confirm). Yet he's relaxed and grooving.
    WTAF.

  • @joshuasalgado4694
    @joshuasalgado4694 7 років тому +31

    Glad there's a play through for this song, this is probably the best on the album.

    • @retrorewind6042
      @retrorewind6042 3 роки тому +4

      Along with abandon of course. The whole album is incredible imo

  • @redduskironsky1058
    @redduskironsky1058 4 роки тому +14

    MY FAVORITE SONG OFF THE ALBUM!!!!! Seriously why are people only reacting to songs that have music videos of lyric videos? The best songs are always the ones without videos. This song and Sapphire from The Flesh Prevails are the best songs they ever produced imo.

    • @sephiroth10191
      @sephiroth10191 Рік тому +3

      The night reveals & prodigal son are their best songs 😉

    • @tricksonafixed
      @tricksonafixed Рік тому +1

      @@sephiroth10191 The Night Reveals and The Prodigal Son both have such unique vibes and I'd agree are some of Fallujah's best work. Levitation and Become One are also some of my favorite by them. Honestly, I am just vibing to all of them going into 2023 lol

  • @LunA-Emi
    @LunA-Emi 7 років тому +168

    Wow, most of the bands that I like, such as Fallujah, The Zenith Passage, Archspire, Obscura, Rivers of Nihil, and so on, are now Kiesel players. Nice

    • @duckjones3192
      @duckjones3192 6 років тому +13

      LunaXEmi have you ever played a Kiesel? These guitars are so well made, they're almost perfect. Their tone and structure are incredible!

    • @WalrusDoom
      @WalrusDoom 6 років тому +13

      LunaXEmi yup it all began when everyone started having sex with each other, a truly beautiful thing

    • @Zyborggian
      @Zyborggian 6 років тому +5

      @@WalrusDoom OH YEAH MR KRABS AAAAAAAA

    • @WalrusDoom
      @WalrusDoom 6 років тому

      Zyborggian butts

    • @erfansamadi4921
      @erfansamadi4921 3 роки тому +1

      @Reactor Anomaly I love artisan era , lots of cool artists and cool playthroughs

  • @marcsee4072
    @marcsee4072 7 років тому +29

    Tone made of tears... so much love for music in each and every bend. Fallujah is next level

  • @akaperry5626
    @akaperry5626 7 років тому +56

    I want a fucking solo album from this guy

    • @robsolis68
      @robsolis68 7 років тому +3

      aKa Perry real talk!

    • @neilpatrickhairless
      @neilpatrickhairless 2 роки тому +2

      A supergroup album with Tati Shmayluk on vocals, Carstairs on guitar, Aria Novi on bass and Abe Cunningham on drums. It would be like Pantera on alien roids

  • @AshtonFitness
    @AshtonFitness 6 років тому +37

    This was pretty badass! Giving it a second listen now. Really glad to hear some modern metal that isn't just 0-0-0-0-1-0! This is some creative stuff right here!

  • @BrandonParkerMusic
    @BrandonParkerMusic 7 років тому +120

    Dude Scott is on a whole different level. I love watching him play.

    • @chickenslips
      @chickenslips 6 років тому +14

      Seriously a massively underrated guitarist. He's so damn good.

    • @evilthecat13
      @evilthecat13 6 років тому

      He's talented, but his writing isn't catchy or fun to listen to; just high-pitched squeaks and scales that don't sound great. Plus his ears are crazy ugly.

    • @fountane
      @fountane 6 років тому

      Opinions n stuff.

    • @tricksonafixed
      @tricksonafixed 6 років тому +15

      Creep Are you kidding? I wonder what your songs sound like... oh wait

    • @chickenslips
      @chickenslips 6 років тому +2

      I initially felt the same about Fallujah. They just sounded like mindless noise, but they are in fact very catchy and great to listen to.

  • @rideu2b
    @rideu2b 7 років тому +18

    I recently (a few months ago) discovered Fallujah, and they very quickly became one of my favorite bands.

  • @MarioSpeedWagon
    @MarioSpeedWagon 4 роки тому +8

    Holy hell I miss old fallujah. Bring that singer back!

    • @jimmyrustles5357
      @jimmyrustles5357 4 роки тому

      He's in Muldrotha now check them out! Also the old guitarist Rob is in there too

  • @var_guitar
    @var_guitar 4 роки тому +9

    I watch this a couple times a week. It's just incredible.

    • @DennisFeinsteinCEO
      @DennisFeinsteinCEO Місяць тому

      I've been a regular here since it dropped 7 years ago. Scott is fantastic 🤌

  • @Klasharx3x
    @Klasharx3x 6 років тому +16

    Most unique and beautiful solos i've heard in a single song damnn

  • @FLOURISHFAMILYENT
    @FLOURISHFAMILYENT 6 років тому +9

    Took these guys parting after a show in mcallen a long ass time ago 😂😂.. really some of the coolest dudes out there and musical guinuse

  • @spectranwolfinfusion
    @spectranwolfinfusion 6 років тому +9

    That tapping is so effortless!

  • @coltontoth2382
    @coltontoth2382 5 років тому +3

    This is one of the most epic songs to end an album with that I ever heard, and will always be one of my favorite songs.

  • @LOLOLOL1ish
    @LOLOLOL1ish 7 років тому +13

    I'm in love with that guitar omfg! And Scott's playing is unlike any other! Beautiful combination

  • @RockHeiland
    @RockHeiland 7 років тому +210

    Lacuna Matata

    • @franciscopineda7760
      @franciscopineda7760 7 років тому

      Rock Heiland zjajajajaajaja yeah dude

    • @yogaaris9288
      @yogaaris9288 6 років тому +6

      lacuna coil

    • @jbasti227
      @jbasti227 5 років тому +2

      What a wonderful playing

    • @ForestGoddard
      @ForestGoddard 5 років тому

      I'm glad I'm not the only person who thought of this

    • @2goXD
      @2goXD 4 роки тому +2

      i'm 2 years late but still, this comment made my day :D

  • @ammazingbllack207
    @ammazingbllack207 6 років тому +19

    He makes the guitar sound like a violin ! damn

  • @Necrocous
    @Necrocous 7 років тому +11

    Great playthrough. Fallujah is a fantastic band.

  • @wattlingzeus
    @wattlingzeus 7 років тому +5

    Favorite song on the album

  • @DomSchu
    @DomSchu 7 років тому +83

    I can shred some Lamb of God but this shit is downright incredible. Always good to have something to strive for.

    • @tylerholdsworth1519
      @tylerholdsworth1519 7 років тому +18

      Yeah LOG guitar parts are a walk in the field compared to Fallujah guitar parts.

    • @MattLarscheid
      @MattLarscheid 6 років тому +46

      NOW YOU'VE GOT SOMETHING TO STRIVE FOR!!! ....I couldn't resist.

    • @gavinjuge6621
      @gavinjuge6621 6 років тому

      haha nice

    • @magisterialanubis06
      @magisterialanubis06 3 роки тому +3

      LoG still have the best riffs

    • @jazzymichael
      @jazzymichael Рік тому

      "shred some Lamb of God" ha! Can you also lift 5lb dumbbells?

  • @kchennessey8781
    @kchennessey8781 4 роки тому +3

    The whole Dreamless album kicks ass. If you don't own it, stop watching this video and go get it!

  • @skylardewitt6271
    @skylardewitt6271 5 років тому +2

    That tremolo bar part is so smooth its almost look like a slow motion ❤️

  • @emmancipateph2793
    @emmancipateph2793 4 роки тому +2

    The tapping is so powerful! 💥🤘🏼

  • @janssenchang4777
    @janssenchang4777 5 років тому +1

    the control on this man and the absolute tightness of it all wow

  • @propagrandma
    @propagrandma 7 років тому +4

    Favorite song on the album!

  • @Funnyyelowdog
    @Funnyyelowdog 6 років тому +9

    That guitar is so beautiful, I'm not good enough at guitar to justify buying a kiesel but maybe one day

    • @FloridaGoth
      @FloridaGoth 3 роки тому +1

      Lol im right there man, 3k+$? Fuuuuck

  • @The_Crooked_Path
    @The_Crooked_Path 6 років тому +7

    Is that regular tapping in the intro or tapped harmonics? He’s using a lot of movement so it suggests harmonics

  • @bocahkostindonesia
    @bocahkostindonesia 7 років тому +9

    wow your technique is really amazing, fallujah is my fav prog metal band, very technique, good sound, nice song, perfect !!!!

    • @jaredbrooks7219
      @jaredbrooks7219 7 років тому +1

      ilham muhamad Its not really progressive its more atmospheric death metal

  • @LtxVirgo
    @LtxVirgo 7 років тому +4

    My favorite song from the album! thanks for the wonderful video.

  • @nos4me
    @nos4me 6 років тому +20

    whoever writes these guitar parts is nuts, the post rock elements are sick

    • @Martell276
      @Martell276 5 років тому +5

      Scott writes all of the guitar parts to all of their music - with the exception of only a couple of solos that Brian wrote.

    • @ScottCarstairs
      @ScottCarstairs 4 роки тому

      @@Martell276 !

    • @Martell276
      @Martell276 4 роки тому

      @@ScottCarstairs 🤙🏻

  • @ThePortal101
    @ThePortal101 6 років тому +16

    I'd like to see a tour with Fallujah and The Faceless

  • @jordanliubenov
    @jordanliubenov 7 років тому +7

    yesss i watched the stream when this was filmed :^) amaziiiiing

  • @StromboliKicks
    @StromboliKicks 7 років тому +5

    So fucking awesome. Hope to see you live one day.

  • @CesarRuiz-zp9fx
    @CesarRuiz-zp9fx 4 роки тому +1

    That is some goddamned legendary playing fluidity and skill mate. I must admit.

  • @edyblues9952
    @edyblues9952 7 років тому +5

    wow...wow...wow...amazing...nice....

  • @DashHoundRacing
    @DashHoundRacing 7 років тому +3

    Love the finish on the body

  • @davemoreno8897
    @davemoreno8897 2 роки тому

    Awesome guitar player!, I met Scott finishing Falluja's show in February 2020 at Guadalajara in Mexico :,) and then 2 days later I saw him again in Mexico City, it was an awesome show

  • @eurologic
    @eurologic 7 років тому +5

    Pretty amazing

  • @foofy14
    @foofy14 6 років тому +5

    That TONE

  • @montyhockey99
    @montyhockey99 7 років тому +6

    Well, new favorite song

  • @mjrocks6310
    @mjrocks6310 6 років тому +4

    wow! hands down!

  • @paulsdino
    @paulsdino 7 років тому +2

    Beautiful Guitar . I'd love to see this exact model but with the set neck construction that the contour and Litchford model have .

  • @thebloodychord
    @thebloodychord 7 років тому +4

    I love fallujah

  • @joshpetit44
    @joshpetit44 6 років тому +4

    Is he tapping or hitting the harmonics? Looks so weird but sounds so good.

    • @JM-ll6hd
      @JM-ll6hd 6 років тому

      Josh Petit looks to be hitting the natural harmonics.

  • @AndrewLein
    @AndrewLein 7 років тому +6

    amazing

  • @SEAWRECKS83
    @SEAWRECKS83 6 років тому +5

    Mastery

  • @isafleader
    @isafleader 3 роки тому +1

    Went to learn this song and realized those were tap harmonics, I still don’t have any idea how he got them so fast and precise.

  • @AleArzMusic
    @AleArzMusic 5 років тому +1

    Any hint about what gear was used to get that perfect chuggy metal tone?

  • @TheFatBeaRr
    @TheFatBeaRr Рік тому

    OMG the tapping ❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤

  • @sudharsanpaskaran
    @sudharsanpaskaran 6 років тому +3

    NICE!

  • @Jonny_2099
    @Jonny_2099 6 років тому +1

    Check out the guest solo he does on the new Ontogeny record

  • @centaur70
    @centaur70 4 роки тому +1

    That riff there at 3:43 is sick.

  • @dackjaniels4205
    @dackjaniels4205 3 роки тому

    This song gives me reason to live!!! 😤😤😤

  • @xenomorph2056
    @xenomorph2056 6 років тому +1

    I FUCKING love this song

  • @svarogsmolenski3663
    @svarogsmolenski3663 4 роки тому +1

    impressive

  • @PatrickSomoulay
    @PatrickSomoulay 7 років тому +8

    hell yeah

  • @ToTheSummitkicksass
    @ToTheSummitkicksass 6 років тому +10

    If there were any band's guitarist i wish i could steal it's fallujah xD

  • @KALLISSTO
    @KALLISSTO 7 років тому +12

    top song off Dreamless top 3 of Fallujah along with The Dead Sea and Sapphire.

    • @KALLISSTO
      @KALLISSTO 7 років тому +2

      dead sea for the emotion, lacuna for the riffs, sapphire for the song writiing/structure

    • @airwann
      @airwann 7 років тому +3

      ablougabla chemical cave has a sick riff. I personally prefer it over sapphire. The dead sea is great, don't misunderstand me, but venom upon the blade is one damn masterpiece of a song.
      Also the high vocals in the void alone are top notch.
      I don't disagree with your list, but it isn't mine, personally. But it's great to have different opinions !

    • @KALLISSTO
      @KALLISSTO 7 років тому

      Lol bro I can't believe I forgot about Venom. I often talk about the outro being the most intense/beautiful in modern metal. The only thing for me I think is that it doesn't get interesting until its second half IMO

    • @LtxVirgo
      @LtxVirgo 6 років тому +1

      Sapphire's the best damn thing invented by mankind. This one is definitely the best off of Dreamless, though.

    • @fredriksvard2603
      @fredriksvard2603 6 років тому

      Scar queen?

  • @superbotte1706
    @superbotte1706 4 роки тому +1

    Can i play this song if i dont have a floyd rose?

  • @JackCarlino
    @JackCarlino 6 років тому +2

    This song reminds me of the movie "Arrival"

  • @paulsdino
    @paulsdino 7 років тому +1

    Fine looking instrument

  • @RKDriver
    @RKDriver 7 років тому +1

    What was he singing in the 2nd verse? I couldn't quite make it out.

    • @redhat7730
      @redhat7730 7 років тому +2

      Finally I've found my faith
      Belief in the cause of your warm embrace
      Now I have all that I want
      But I can't help that I'm
      Wishing I could change today
      And all that I had hoped to gain
      I'll meet you where land goes to end
      I hope to find you there
      Knowing I can't change today
      You know that I was desperate
      I'll meet you where land goes to end
      Will you remember me?
      Give me back my thoughts
      Can I keep just this one?
      Dig in your hands, I know what's done is done
      What feels like lapse in time
      Was when you were mine
      Our souls collide in
      The lessons and the strife
      We move like ghosts
      Fade into my arms
      I watched this tragic love of mine
      Dissolve and divide
      Before my desperate eyes, running out of time
      What feels like lapse in time
      Was when you were mine
      Our souls collide in
      The lessons and the strife
      I had found my queen
      But she's forgotten me

  • @eurologic
    @eurologic 2 роки тому

    The anthem to this world dying out, knowing that no other species or being in the universe will ever know we were here.

  • @soulsreunion9723
    @soulsreunion9723 2 роки тому

    How can get that guitar build. The virtual build page does not allow to achieve this guitar l think

    • @spoonerluv
      @spoonerluv 2 роки тому

      It's a K-Series which means you'll need to call in.

  • @YutsiAion
    @YutsiAion 7 років тому +22

    Damn!!

    • @kindachubby
      @kindachubby 6 років тому

      Yutsi Aion my thoughts exactly

  • @skycaptain141
    @skycaptain141 7 років тому +3

    I love that shape so much but the premium for the shape alone compared to the d700 is so much.

    • @hbkhhhhbbbbkkkk
      @hbkhhhhbbbbkkkk 7 років тому

      skycaptain141 fuck you bro

    • @skycaptain141
      @skycaptain141 7 років тому +1

      LOL wtf. Oh shit im laughing so hard.

    • @hbkhhhhbbbbkkkk
      @hbkhhhhbbbbkkkk 7 років тому

      skycaptain141 that's the spirit.

    • @skycaptain141
      @skycaptain141 7 років тому

      you are really random bro.

    • @martyrofgrenth2136
      @martyrofgrenth2136 7 років тому

      This is because this model is a 70th anniversary special.
      It just has some special features in it.
      You can order any other model that you liked and customize it to what you want and it will still be a wonderful instrument.
      I made a 6 string fretless Aries bass and it didn't turn out too expensive (around 1800-1900 USD) and it is phenomenal, any increase in the price would be for cosmetic features.

  • @manashbarman8585
    @manashbarman8585 6 років тому +1

    Is that a flamed spalted maple top?

  • @JohnMnDza
    @JohnMnDza 6 років тому +1

    Amazing guitar !! How much does this model cost ?

    • @KieselGuitarsTV
      @KieselGuitarsTV  6 років тому +2

      7 string K Series guitars with Floyd Rose trems start at $2999. Email sales@kieselguitars.com or call (858)GUITARS to get exact pricing for the specs on this guitar.

  • @linoalcaraz5407
    @linoalcaraz5407 7 років тому +3

    Fucking amazing

  • @Burtyburtburt8
    @Burtyburtburt8 6 років тому +1

    That is a killer axe

  • @IAMBRIANJOHANSON
    @IAMBRIANJOHANSON 5 років тому

    How the fuck have I not watched this 👀. Talented

  • @mattcarey9398
    @mattcarey9398 4 роки тому +6

    This dude followed me on instagram. I followed him back and messaged him about how dope this song was and we had a little chat. And then he unfollowed me lol

    • @austinmorris4471
      @austinmorris4471 4 роки тому +6

      That’s kinda uncool.

    • @mattcarey9398
      @mattcarey9398 4 роки тому

      @@austinmorris4471 It's whatever haha. Probably just trying to gain more followers with that technique. I do a similar thing but I don't unfollow anyone who follow me

    • @ScottCarstairs
      @ScottCarstairs 4 роки тому +2

      @@mattcarey9398 haha it happens.

  • @Demonstealer
    @Demonstealer 6 років тому

    Just fucking unreal man!! What a guitar player!!

  • @ricardorodriguez8978
    @ricardorodriguez8978 3 роки тому

    The best guitar player easily

  • @MrWhitemare
    @MrWhitemare 6 років тому +3

    So sick

  • @tonyflorez703
    @tonyflorez703 Рік тому

    Sick🤘

  • @MckinleyDjents
    @MckinleyDjents 2 роки тому

    GLEAM!

  • @paulsdino
    @paulsdino 7 років тому

    Gorgeous guitar . I'm pretty inteerested in a set neck guitar and would love if this model was available with set-through neck as well . Neck thru is fine but tonally , it doesn't work as well for me as set or bolt . Set neck being the construction I like the most .

    • @KieselGuitarsTV
      @KieselGuitarsTV  7 років тому

      If you're into the looks of the K series but prefer a set through neck, you should definitely check out our Crescent model!

  • @Rose.Of.Hizaki
    @Rose.Of.Hizaki 6 років тому +7

    It seems like all the cool kids are playing Kiesel these days.

  • @mitchu9677
    @mitchu9677 6 років тому +1

    1:43

  • @logos_motorider6274
    @logos_motorider6274 5 років тому

    I see more than 5 fingers in hes left hand 😱😱😱🤘

  • @LegendMathai
    @LegendMathai 6 років тому +1

    👽

  • @nameless989
    @nameless989 7 років тому +7

    metal david gilmour

    • @sephiroth10191
      @sephiroth10191 4 роки тому

      After hearing levitation I thought the same thing lol. Pink floyd is my favorite band and fallujah is just behind them.

  • @matthewramroop
    @matthewramroop 7 років тому +1

    He's tapping with his right hand I reckon?

    • @Raittarian
      @Raittarian 7 років тому +4

      Matthew Ramroop he's doing tapped harmonics

    • @ScottCarstairs
      @ScottCarstairs 4 роки тому

      tap harmonics

  • @ELotion
    @ELotion 7 років тому +5

    ripppppin iiiiit

  • @criticalmass04
    @criticalmass04 4 роки тому +1

    oszszszsz kurwa to tak można grać ? :) szacun

  • @IROCK80551
    @IROCK80551 5 років тому

    Dude, what happened? This compared to your new playthrough. Deep down, you have to know.

  • @wakjob961
    @wakjob961 4 роки тому

    Damn it...from the thumbnail it looked like the dude from Shokran...
    oh well.

  • @guitarserenadior9399
    @guitarserenadior9399 6 років тому +1

    fucking . respec.

  • @loganross6436
    @loganross6436 2 роки тому +1

    Im sure Im not the only one who noticed this but uhh 4:20 😂

  • @joerivas9219
    @joerivas9219 3 роки тому

    Bro, why that ad? Lmfao 🤦🏻‍♂️🌎

  • @Weird_1
    @Weird_1 5 років тому

    Awesome song. But...
    Does he really have gum in his mouth. Chews soooo slow

  • @fender68able
    @fender68able 7 років тому +2

    They need tom jones to do the vocals. LOL

  • @jaysonoverocker4866
    @jaysonoverocker4866 6 років тому +3

    Ridiculous

  • @theviolator1074
    @theviolator1074 6 років тому +15

    People that complain about growls... Smh stick to your slipknot and A7X if you want to hear your mainstream clean vocal BS

    • @kutsumiru
      @kutsumiru 6 років тому +4

      Both Slipknot and A7X have full albums of screamed vocals tho lmao

    • @kutsumiru
      @kutsumiru 6 років тому +5

      I have heard far worse vocals than that of the ones on Iowa and Waking the Fallen
      I'm not saying you have to like those albums, but you can't deny their existence either.
      I was under the impression that the tech death community was pretty open to musical diversity though. How else do you think it as a genre keeps seeing such evolution and creativity? You have to be open to new things and to explore to craft such intricate and unique music.
      I thought that the people who listened to metal just for the sake of "it's heavy" were the kind that stuck with deathcore. People like that never struck me as the type to like saxophones and flutes making their way onto The Faceless albums, or sung female vocals on Fallujah albums.
      Honestly if you guys are complaining about clean vocals, what are you guys doing listening to Fallujah? There's not only clean vocals, but _girly_ unheavy ones!

  • @bluesleonard
    @bluesleonard 7 років тому +35

    Shoulda kept it instrumental.

    • @chickenslips
      @chickenslips 6 років тому +6

      I used to hate this band for the vocals, but now I love em.

    • @Zyborggian
      @Zyborggian 6 років тому

      I could quote a very fitting 3 word Dr Evil phrase here

  • @EvanFifesMusic
    @EvanFifesMusic 7 років тому +1

    Great playing but the guitar tone is alil *loose* IMO.