I want to take the time to address the same comment I get almost daily on my channel in regards to testing 9mm+P VS .45 ACP VS .40 S&W. People will ask why the 9mm and .45 ACP are +P but the .40 S&W is not. It's pretty simple, the 9mm and the .45 ACP are both over 100 years old and their original design was for guns that could not handle more pressure. Now fast forward over 100 years and modern guns can easily handle more pressure, so under SAAMI specification the .45 ACP maximum pressure of 21,000 PSI was bumped up to 23,000 PSI with +P. The 9mm under SAAMI specification max pressure of 35,000 PSI was bumped up to 38,500 PSI with +P. The .40 S&W was created around 30 years ago well into modern metallurgy times, so it's creation simply started out at what is essentially +P pressure of 35,000 PSI, but not labeled as +P as there's no need to label it as such. There IS NO .40 S&W+P under SAAMI spec, so I do not use what does not exist.
You could have used 40 caliber “Buffalo Bore” or “Underwood” ammo which would have simulated +P or +P+ and then it would have actually been a fare comparison/test against the +P+ 9 millimeter and +P 45 caliber rounds.
@@jamesw713 James, no one is arguing that the 10mm is stronger than the 40 cal everyone knows that, but that’s not applicable to this particular test video because he’s comparing the 9mm 40 cal and 45 cal but his conclusions aren’t accurate because he uses “Plus P” or “Plus P Plus” ammo for the 9 & 45 but strategically chose to only use standard ammo for the 40 cal when enhanced ammo is readily available for the 40 caliber. I like all three calibers he compared and I have handguns in all three calibers but my point is, if your going to do a comparison video, than do it equally so that your end results are accurate for the viewers.
PWC FOR ALL MEASURED IN VOLUME: 9mm - 4.75 cubic inches. 40 S&W - 8.64 cubic inches. 45 ACP - 6.53 cubic inches. It seems in this test, 40 S&W was far and away the best. Typically we see largest expansion with 45, so this particular 40 S&W load is very good.
A great test! Thank you. I have been a big advocate of 185 grain jhp in the 45 for a long time. Hollow point bullets need velocity to expand and that often means heavier isn't better.
Thats the logik normaly but it is has more to do with bullet design and how hard the alloying is. Sometimes lighter bullets with high velocity dont expand well but slower heavier bullets do.
@@Gieszkanne Indeed sir. Bullet material and construction means a lot more than most people consider. Maybe because it is just not part of the equations on the box, nor is the info readily available.
It's all about bullet design. Some bullets do well at higher velocities, others start to experience all types of failures, like over expansion, no expansion (might clog hard not allowing the expansion), jacket separation, accuracy issues, and under penetration. So it all depends on the bullet. Higher velocity is not always better. It seems counter intuitive, but it is what it is.
@BigBear-- More accurate to say that the vast majority do better at higher velocities. The 45 acp is a very low velocity cartridge and over driving it is near impossible. On the other hand, inadequate velocity to expand happens for many many 45 acp rounds.
Best test I've found. You used the same Ammo brand, all JHP ammo, and a clear comparison of each caliber. Thank you for taking the time to put this up!
I’ve owned and loved 45… I switched to 40 because of higher capacity and similar ballistics… I was forced to switch to 9mm because of injuries…. 9mm is the easiest thing to use that still works ok 👍
i love .40 s&w, it is my favorite and ideal cartridge caliber, but 180gr was always too heavy for the .40 s&w, great for the 10mm auto, between 135gr minimum and 165gr maximum parameters is best, with 180gr bullet weight being ideal
.40 s&w is the ideal cartridge caliber, but 180gr was always too heavy for the .40 s&w, great for the 10mm auto though, between 135gr minimum and 165gr maximum parameters is best, with 155gr/150gr being the ideal bullet weight for the .40 s&w!
I own a Glock 17, 22, and 27 -- the recoil is a little less with the 9mm. But I would rather carry the .40 S&W. The .40 is a good mix of power and capacity.
the lowish recoil, capacity and good ballistic performance makes the 9mm a winner. I wouldn`t be surprised if the 40 and 45 needs to be made heavier as well due to pressure
@@hotdog9262 bro, google 9mm pressures, alright, good job, now, google .40 s&w pressures. PS, get ready to feel dumb and edit your comment, I am a reloader for both .40 and 9. I already know the answer even without google...you're puking up a boomer myth, stop it(btw +p and +p+ 9mm are even freakin higher than what google told you by like 10-20,000 LOL). I shoot IPSC matches and watched TONS more "9mm major" guns explode and mutilate fingers and hands than I EVER did the .40's, even when loaded "hot". We gotta stop this .40 is "high pressure" thing just because it's more recoil than we can handle. Just say ".40 is too much for me and 9mm is not". .40 uses quicker powders which giev it that snap, not cause it's "high pressure". Straight up boomer lies.
@@losi8ightyew how you load your personal ammo is not interesting for people buying theirs at a store. max pressure for 9mm listed is 34k psi and 40cal 35k, but typically according to info online 9mm is loaded to 27-28k psi
@@hotdog9262 all I needed to hear right there. Most factory non +p and +p+ is right about 32k. +p and +p+ 9mm can be well over that. Listed chamber pressures on both for standard loadings are 35k in my load book. Don't make a difference as my point in teaching was gotten across, they are both the same standard store bought loadings EXCEPT +p and +p+ 9mm are higher than .40. Myth, busted.
P.S. I hope a couple of your future tests w ammo I am sending will prove that Old School tech bullets still can work great for civilians not as worried about barrier penetration like LE has to as long as it is pushed to a fast enough velocity. Real World results tended to say those worked really well (and better than the same bullets at standard velocity). Old Tech, from longer barrels, at plus p or hot velocity. It's the modern Micro/Subs/Snubs that may need higher newer tech bullets...And in Ammogaddon that might mean the expensive stuff for the short barrels and old school/cheaper for the longer barreled pistols IMO. Thanks again!
@@timrobinson6573 ask Sam...all depends on barrel length. 115 prob ok from 4" or longer 147 who knows...but that's just a guess would need to do your own research. Neither would be carry choice just shtf maybe. 124Plus p one of the top 6 in my 5+1 best ammo choices vid
@@totalnewb123 That & the huge blast is why I sold all my 357s . If you shot it in doors with no ear pro it would be ugly . I went to 44 , 45 & 9mm back in the day .
Good demonstration. All calibers hit the gel blocks violently. I have all calibers from .45 down to .22, revolvers and semi's. I carry .40 almost exclusively same as I did during my 25yrs as LEO. I will carry a J-frame on special occasions though. Keep up the good work.
I love all of your videos, I like how fair and thorough they are as well as how many different things you test, from large bear defense guns to lighter recoil calibers for self defense. I think this really goes to show that with all handgun rounds there is no guaranteed fight stopper, all of these will do the job if placed correctly and none of them are a magic bullet that sends the bad guy flying like in the movies.
My G23 shooting 180gr HSTs has better pen(13"-14"), better wound cavity, and better expansion(.68-.73) that the (150-200fps)faster heavier 10mm 200 gr HST from my G20(11-12".... .59-65). To much speed causes rapid expansion that slows the round faster and then peels the petals back further to quickly, so you lose pen and expansion.
Those were all quite good by modern defensive standards. I’d carry any of them. 45 years ago, the options were pretty much ball, or a 200 cast SWC in .45, and ball or JHP that didn’t work in 9mm. Back then, I chose the .45 and I’d carry a 200 gr.H&G cast SWC now, if it was all I could get. Some of today’s bullets are really good. I still have Federal 9BPLE in my Beretta 92, but science keeps advancing.👍 Thanks.
P.S. been said Seal Team 6 had 185 plus p jhp in their Mark24 HK45c as I discussed in my 2 hk45c vids...guessing Golden Saber but who knows. Would love to see what a 185 plus p hst would look like.
Thank you sir. I just bought some underwood 40sw 150g nosler to load in one of my carry pistols(4” barrel). I feel very confident now it packs a punch.
I’m considering a handgun of home defense and EDC. This video clearly shows the .40 and .45 rounds really tearing up the gel, but it seems that the 9mm holds it own. Your ability to stay on target with the 9mm gives me confidence that the 9mm has plenty of lethality to stop an intruder or attacker. Thanks again.
I used to think the 9mm was great, but real world information really shows it differently. I have seen a lot of evidence in videos of 9mm not working at all and .40 working very well. I haven't seen any .45 videos where I can confirm a .45 was used.
@@GunSam Thanks for your insight. I’m still open to the .40 S&W, Does the issue w/ 9mm failing have to do with quality or just the fact that most have “luger” action?
@@lewistwist 185 +p about as close as you get to +p+ unless going to 45 super,would require same installing stronger recoil spring and beefing up his mag spring. Most manufacturers won't push 45acp to its potential because of all the unsupported chambers,mainly in 1911s. I could give Sam some super recipes that destroy 10mm though 🤣
@@ratagris21 Same with perception of recoil. People will put their .45 in a heavy 1911 and feel a lighter "push" recoil, then shoot .40 out of a compact polymer Glock and feel a "snappier" recoil and claim that .40 must magically be a worse recoiling round. The reality is that if you read any reloading manual with recipes, you'll see substantial crossover between 9mm, .40, and .45 in terms of bullet weight and powder charge. The rounds are more similar than they are different.
Here’s more empirical data that folks may have retired their .40s way too soon. Such a superb street proven round. I choose my Glock .40 over my Glock .45 for HD. Thanks for the great video.
(I paused during the chrono session to write this so no idea yet how they perform) -- That 9mm loading was giving you, from a pistol, very, very close to what I clocked Federal 9BPLE (115gr +P+) from a 10.5" SMG barrel (Colt 635). That was back probably just over 20 years ago (geez, I'm getting old) so this speaks wonders on what companies have managed to do with powder chemistry.
Amazing video! Those Noslers dump a whole bunch of energy really fast with all that push behind them. Good shooting there Tex. But par for the course with you, sir. I think the biggest issue as far as choosing 9 vs 40 vs 45 is you can factor out capacity in California. Which sucks.
I appreciate that you don't edit out the malfunctions. Shows us that we should shoot plenty of defense rounds through our carry pistols before counting on them. In light of this, I will be taking a few boxes of GD and HST with me to shoot next time I go camping.
Great format for a good video testing light bullets in each caliber, comparing apples to apples instead of apples to oranges. I'm looking forward to the heavier bullet test, and I think I'll subscribe now. 😎
. My point is mostly @ the 40 cal , @3:57 & again later it jammed . When you shoot ammo that is too hot for the DESIGN , bad things can happen . Slide speed is up , I don't recall the track record of THAT 40 . I think all this ammo would work at less Vel , I would feel better about it if it was used in a strong revolver OR rifle . +P can be hard on some guns , I would want to use ammo that's in the middle of the specs for any gun . Cold weather is a time when it's possible more power is OK .
Interesting vid. Thank you. And thank you for mentioning sectional density. Practically nobody these days talks about it. I think most have no idea what it is. Me being an old time deer hunter, i always think in terms of S.D. Hence my reason for choosing heavier for caliber bullet weights. Not the top weights, since I want some velocity also. But in the middle. 124 for 9mm, 180 for 40sw, etc.
I will stick with my .40 Speer Lawman, 165 grain, JHP. It is easier to control and penetrates better/deeper. If it doesn't expand as much it still puts a pretty good sized hole, about .50 plus every time. The .40 you tested expanded to .977 or about that, but penetration in bare gel was kinda weak. IMHO. Love you videos, but not so much these three boutique ammos. Thanks for the great review and info!
@@rob.3575 Yeah, you're right. The Lawman are the practice rounds and the Gold Dot are the duty rounds, I misspoke. I have both in the safe and I must be getting old/senile. LOL!
Traditionally , the Lawman sub branding simply meant " normal first quality " brass cased . Before Gold Dots , their conventional bulleted LE ammo was marked as Lawman .
The penetration was exactly as designed/ intended . It's a Feature , not a Fault . Massive expansion with 12-14 in penetration vs moderate expansion with deep penetration is an eternal debate of Tastes Great vs Less Filling porportions , with near religious conviction on both sides . If you prefer the later , the 165 Gold Dot doesn't suck .
@@filianablanxart8305 My stash isn't that old. I retired in 2014. When I retired I bought Glock 22 and a Glock 27 because that is what I carried and I feel well armed with when the need arises. My daily carry though is my 640-1 that was my original backup gun loaded with the old Federal 147 grain, jacketed hydrashock, .38 special +p+. Its not as loud as the .357 loads and easier for follow up shots.
We have all 3 calibers in our home but the 40 sets on my bedside table. Any of these will work fine for self defense but after witnessing first had the damage the 40 does hitting targets, trees, the ground or whatever I feel the 40 has a lot more destructive effect. So it’s my go to piece.
These light for caliber performed well, but I really excited to see how the heavier bullets perform. Thanks for addressing the real world vs. "spray and pray." This thinking that you are unarmed unless you have 15 plus 1 in your gun needs to be debunked.
@@GunSam I HATE when that happens lol. My husband carries a 442 smith 1 7/8 barrel and standard pressure 158gr semi wadcutters. He says he can hit with it just fine.
Impressive ammunition to say the least and highly consistent. Underwood makes really good stuff. I always see Scott from Kentucky Ballistics using it, or Federal
Thanks for sharing the link to this video. I just acquired an FN FNP-40 and am looking forward to handloading bullets in the 150-165 range. Several candidates with the 150 Asp near the top of the list
I have many pistols in all three of these calibers but I still prefer my Springfield XDs in .45 acp. I use 6+1 185gr Golden Saber rounds which produce 1013fps/422fpe consistently. They have excellent expansion & penetration. My 2nd favorite is my Glock 29 in 10mm, but it gets to heavy and bulky after several hours of carrying.
What if you were in a gun fight and other guy shoots at you a couple times and misses An you get your gun out and off safe the shooter is running away You follow him home know where he lives Next day you go to his place follow him down side walk get your gun off safe Can you shoot him cause he fired at you first with a deadly weapon ?
Loved the test!👍👍 Not a fan of the Glock, (and a 1911A1 is THE .45ACP weapon), but all the same, the 45 hit like a sledgehammer!🔨🔨 Reckon thats why one of my favorite sayings is "There's not an issue that I can't resolve with good left hook, or a slug from a 45."
Kudos for matching sectional densities between the 9, 40, & 45 to .130. I think when you match sectional density you get a more fair comparison between dissimilar bullet diameters/calibers vs the common tendency to match bullet weights. Although I'm puzzled why you are measuring to the backside of the bullet on a couple of the shots versus to the leading edge? That aside was a good video, I enjoyed it. Much appreciated. BTW I doubt limp wristing was an issue with the 40. I've never noticed a 40 to be affected by that with the higher slide thrust they generate.
Hi Sam, ballistics aside, you put a .45 slug in the guy's face, it doesn't get any worse for him :D A suggestion: could you shoot loads at different heights (load A, height X) in the gel? MDF first on the left, without on the right? We would be able to see the cavities better, this way.
And yet, any pistol is a compromise when it comes to stopping a threat. A simple blast from a common 150gr .30-30 yields 1,903 ft-lb. A rifle isn't always convenient, but boy, do they easily get the job done and reach out to touch something.
@@exothermal.sprocket Boy howdy. I agree 100%. Unfortunately the weapon most people have handy is a pistol. You know the old saying, you use your pistol to fight your way to a long gun.
Rifles are vastly superior, but they also penetrate way to much. Shooting through walls is a real issue, handguns or shotguns with buckshot help limit that
@@sleeper.simulant7327 Very much a generalization. I know rifle rounds doing 4000+ FPS that disintegrate on impact, on a critter that's no more than 2" thick. I also know rifle rounds that will go through an elk end-to-end.
I read your comment about the use of the +P, +P+, but I'd venture to say most people are only using some brand of defensive hollow point in their 9mm/.40/.45 pistols, not hot loads. Also, many pistols manufacturers do not recommend the +P/+ unless the firearm is rated for it.
Nice! I appreciate the test and video. LFC tests are always interesting to me. Those head shots were fun. Good commentary on less than ideal, real world rapid fire (but it happens).
Great job using the same sectional density. I always wonder why most ballistic tests ignore this and try to match the weight of bullets when they are different caliber bullets. Keeping the same SD keeps it fair.
Overall not a bad review. I believe with bullet expansion, fpe and penetration I would choose the .40 cal. . Although I normally choose my EDC by season. I have a few in each cal. 9mm, .40 cal. , 45 ACP and 10 mm. 10mm normally when I go hunting as a backup to my rifle or shotgun.
I was prepared to debate your video title, but I instead agree it was a very nicely done comparison outside of lab conditions. I switched to carrying 10mm and 45ACP after the Live Goat tests that the FBI did way back when I was in the academy but I am starting to concede that modern 9mm is not the crap show that it once was.
You should have more subs!! I’ll definitely point all the .40 haters to this video lmao 🤣 !! Great shooting. Your nickname should be the human bench-rest 😅!
What i inferred was to use the lightest recoil and controllable round which was the 9mm . It performed about the same on the gelatin as the .45 and . 40. Perhaps the .40 is a good all purpose round when all things are considered. Perhaps the best data would be from hospital emergency rooms and surgeries documenting actual human wounds vs caliber?
Thanks for testing these, Sam. They appear to be powerful and effective in all three calibers. I have it on good authority that even in a shorter barrel the 9mm will expand and penetrate about the same as from the longer barrel. Nosler makes good bullets, and IMHO, Underwood loads some excellent ammo.
.40sw the best semi auto handgun caliber, cheap, easy to reload, good capacity, can get to magnum/sig level with Light weight bullets(135 to 155 grain)....
What they made a 45 ACP? I (still) be rocking the 45 Colt! The “Taylor Knock Out Index”: Velocity (in fps) x Weight (in grains) x Diameter (in inches) = _ divided by 7,000 [to convert into foot pounds of energy]. 9mm: [1901 AD] (Original) Standard P - 1180 x 115 x .355 = 48,173.5 divided by 7,000 = 6.88 ft pd Underwood Ammo 9mm: Standard P - 1300 x 115 x .355 = 53,072.5 divided by 7000 = 7.58 ft pd +P - 1100 x 147 x .355 = 57,403.5 divided by 7000 = 8.2 ft pd +P+ - 1550 x 90 x .355 = 49,522.5 divided by 7000 = 7.07 ft pd - (?) Notice how big and slow is better than little and faster every time? Well now, it ain’t just what she said anymore! And on that note - 45 ACP: [1904 AD] Standard P - 835 x 230 x .451 = 86,614.55 divided by 7,000 = 12.37 ft pd Underwood Ammo 45 ACP: +P - 925 x 255 x .452 = 106,615.5 divided by 7000 = 15.23 ft pd Fools Figure, but Figures don't Fool! Which now leads us to the Facts - 45 Colt: [1872 AD] (Original) Standard P - 1000 x 235 x .456 = 107,160 divided by 7,000 = 15.3 ft pd Original Underwood Ammo 45 Colt: Standard P - 1000 x 250 x .452 = 113,000 divided by 7,000 = 16.14 ft pd - Xtreme Penetrator +P - 1400 x 250 x .452 = 158,200 divided by 7,000 = 22.6ft pd - Xtreme Penetrator +P This is the results of big getting faster. So, "faster can be goods so long as size is not compromised!" And I quoted her on that. [Liberty Ammunition 45 Colt: Standard P - 1800 x 78 x .452 = 63,460.8 divided by 7,000 = 9.0658 ft pd - Civil Defense Showing little going fast is just that, and nothing more!] +P - 1325 x 325 x .452 = 194,642.5 divided by 7,000 = 27.8 ft pd - Long Flat Nose Gas Check Hi-Tek Coated Hard Cast +P This is the results of big getting bigger! As so did her eyes!
40 was developed as a penetrator after the infamous Miami shootout. It usually does well in punching through a windshield or the like. Maybe the +p+ rounds in other calibers could keep up now.
This was the best comparison I've seen in a while. 500-600 ft lbs is the sweet spot IMO. The 45 seems to be the most devastating at that mark. I'm building a 45 super/460 rowland 1911 and have learned much about comps and ports. When I'm done, this gun will fire 44 mag power with minimal recoil. Imagine a tack hammer delivering Dirty Harry style justice....mmmm mmmm good! (Of course the gun weighs 3 lbs but that's what holsters are for).
Thanks, You tested that underwood 45 ACP +P 185 grain before and it performed slightly better than rated velocity of 1200 fps and this batch is quite a bit lower so that's kind of puzzling - I think you were using the same pistol...even so it's still a good round!
I've been looking at the Underwood 9mm 147 +P Nosler sporting hollow points but I don't know anything about Nosler projectiles so I haven't bought the ammo.
You get your money's worth for Nosler Rounds. GB Goods uses the Noslers for accuracy comparison when available because of the consistency in the Quality of the rounds.
Excellent video! Very well presented. Also, you are one helluva good shot! I was impressed with the force of the .45 ace rounds. Fine penetration with perfect expansion. All the rounds did well, but I would say the .45 would have the best stopping power. Love your videos.
Back before Underwood got really big I contacted Kevin Underwood several times. Real nice guy BTW. I doubt you can call him on the phone these days. At that time Kevin used actual firearms while developing all his loads. I was told he used the most common firearm commonly used for the caliber under development unless he was developing a load for a specific platform. I can't say he still does the same these days but my guess is he does. So if you keep in mind what the most common firearms for each given caliber is you should have a good idea of barrel length used to get the FPS stated on the box. Most ammo manufactures use test barrels and you cant extrapolate anything from their rated FPS on the box. In my limited testing Underwood ammo has always hit or exceeded the rated FPS stated on the box when using a standard sized firearm for the caliber. AKA Glock 19 (4 inch barrel) for 9mm and a full sized 1911 (5 inch barrel) for 45 ACP. No .40 here. It's strange the 45 ACP you tested did not make close to its rated FPS in your 5.3 in Glock 41. My Underwood ammo is from back in the day and either uses Speer Gold Dots or Hornady XTP's BTW. Maybe they had to back the 45 ACP down and did not change the rated FPS? Oh well I cant wait to see the testing with standard for caliber bullet weights.
Nice point shot on tbe .45 for a lighter gun. It’s a reason I prefer a steel gun, controls recoil better. I’m better with my Para-Colt Combat commander or even with the original frame than I am with a Glock. The Old school P series Sigs I’m better with over a Glock as well.
I agree with the idea of quality shots over quantity of shots. Fewer deeper shots > more scattershots. However, to achieve that deeper penetration, I would skew toward heavier loads.
I like the comparison you did. So much similarity between the 3 calibers. Great expansion on all three in full sized guns. Do they work the same in a micro sized gun or is the velocity loss too great to over come like some revolver ammo. IMO it is shot placement that is the key item as long as there is a decent amount of penetration. No handgun is a really good terminal tool for people compared to a rifle and shotgun. But even with those you have to get a GOOD hit. Yeah a wound in the extremity "can" be fatal ( ie femoral artery) but a center punch or cranial hit with at least 8" penetration will do damage to critical organs.
There's no question that a properly-loaded .40 S&W is the most effective of the 3 calibers tested here. Even a typical self-defense/law-enforcement round like the 165 grain Gold Dot packs almost 500 lb/ft of energy and expands extremely well. The real hot rod .40 loadings like the Underwood & Buffalo Bore 155 grain hollow points deliver close to 600 lb/ft. That's magnum-class performance. This is not to say that 9mm and .45 aren't good calibers, although I question the relevance of .45 in the modern world. IMO .40 S&W made it obsolete due to having equal or better ballistics with higher capacity. I was considering buying a double-stack 10mm pistol until I looked at the performance of the really hot .40 loads. If a .40 won't take care of it, you probably need a .44 magnum or a rifle.
Energy isn't really the end all be all, momentum is just as important to consider. What's most important is how reliably does your bullet expand, how big does it expand and does it go deep enough. The .40 has offerings that fall into an impressive Goldilocks zone, I'd say a hot 180gr Gold Dot really does almost make the .45acp seem irrelevant but a 230gr +P HST or Golden Saber is still going to destroy more tissue at the end of the day.
Look at the recoil management. From the side view. .45ACP swings up to double angle compared to 9mm. 0.40 almost the same as .45ACP, but visible small difference exists. Huge difference in sending the next shot.
It's only a split second more for a heavier recoiling round to come back down on target. It's debatable if maybe 4 shots of 9mm VS 3 shots of .40 S&W or .45 ACP in the same time frame would have one being better than the other. Many people think the first shot or second is what saves your life, assuming that shot or two will stop the attack. But what if it does not? To me having the first impact being more powerful gives you better odds.
@@GunSam I only notice the difference is huge, and the real effect should be measured with a timer. Few typical scenarios defined and then tested. Double or even triple taps for sure. Penetration then needs to be compared with scenarios too. E.g. perp in car, perp with bulletproof vest, enemy with plate carrier. And then from each caliber the best performer (logistics and price taken into account) would be used. Well, military has to select one single cartrigde as pistol/pcc are only secondary weapons or for police. Thus hard to replace 9x19 anyways. I'd hope NATO would increment the pressures of 9x19 a bit. But it performs okay already. We would need to hear from Ukrainian trenches how it has performed against the Russian invaders/occupiers. In the rare cases they had to resort to pistol.
The expansion with the 150gr .40 was amazing! All of the safety related failures to fire in minute 13 demonstrate perfectly why a defensive firearm should not have a manual safety.
I want to take the time to address the same comment I get almost daily on my channel in regards to testing 9mm+P VS .45 ACP VS .40 S&W. People will ask why the 9mm and .45 ACP are +P but the .40 S&W is not. It's pretty simple, the 9mm and the .45 ACP are both over 100 years old and their original design was for guns that could not handle more pressure. Now fast forward over 100 years and modern guns can easily handle more pressure, so under SAAMI specification the .45 ACP maximum pressure of 21,000 PSI was bumped up to 23,000 PSI with +P. The 9mm under SAAMI specification max pressure of 35,000 PSI was bumped up to 38,500 PSI with +P. The .40 S&W was created around 30 years ago well into modern metallurgy times, so it's creation simply started out at what is essentially +P pressure of 35,000 PSI, but not labeled as +P as there's no need to label it as such. There IS NO .40 S&W+P under SAAMI spec, so I do not use what does not exist.
that's a good bit of info, I was wondering that myself.
Ok so why didn’t you use 40+p😂….
You could have used 40 caliber “Buffalo Bore” or “Underwood” ammo which would have simulated +P or +P+ and then it would have actually been a fare comparison/test against the +P+
9 millimeter and +P 45 caliber rounds.
40+P does exist, it is called 10mm and has a SAAMI of 37,500 psi. The 40 S&W is the weakened child of the real caliber.
@@jamesw713 James, no one is arguing that the 10mm is stronger than the 40 cal everyone knows that, but that’s not applicable to this particular test video because he’s comparing the 9mm 40 cal and 45 cal but his conclusions aren’t accurate because he uses “Plus P” or “Plus P Plus” ammo for the 9 & 45 but strategically chose to only use standard ammo for the 40 cal when enhanced ammo is readily available for the 40 caliber. I like all three calibers he compared and I have handguns in all three calibers but my point is, if your going to do a comparison video, than do it equally so that your end results are accurate for the viewers.
Sir, you are much more experienced than I, yet you demonstrated why I do NOT have safeties on my carry weapons.
PWC FOR ALL MEASURED IN VOLUME:
9mm - 4.75 cubic inches.
40 S&W - 8.64 cubic inches.
45 ACP - 6.53 cubic inches.
It seems in this test, 40 S&W was far and away the best. Typically we see largest expansion with 45, so this particular 40 S&W load is very good.
A great test! Thank you. I have been a big advocate of 185 grain jhp in the 45 for a long time. Hollow point bullets need velocity to expand and that often means heavier isn't better.
Thanks. I have often wondered if it's velocity, or energy per weight. It's a small bullet lengthwise and a lot of energy on it.
Thats the logik normaly but it is has more to do with bullet design and how hard the alloying is. Sometimes lighter bullets with high velocity dont expand well but slower heavier bullets do.
@@Gieszkanne Indeed sir. Bullet material and construction means a lot more than most people consider. Maybe because it is just not part of the equations on the box, nor is the info readily available.
It's all about bullet design. Some bullets do well at higher velocities, others start to experience all types of failures, like over expansion, no expansion (might clog hard not allowing the expansion), jacket separation, accuracy issues, and under penetration. So it all depends on the bullet. Higher velocity is not always better. It seems counter intuitive, but it is what it is.
@BigBear-- More accurate to say that the vast majority do better at higher velocities. The 45 acp is a very low velocity cartridge and over driving it is near impossible. On the other hand, inadequate velocity to expand happens for many many 45 acp rounds.
Best test I've found. You used the same Ammo brand, all JHP ammo, and a clear comparison of each caliber. Thank you for taking the time to put this up!
I’ve owned and loved 45… I switched to 40 because of higher capacity and similar ballistics… I was forced to switch to 9mm because of injuries…. 9mm is the easiest thing to use that still works ok 👍
I agree, absolutely!
i love .40 s&w, it is my favorite and ideal cartridge caliber, but 180gr was always too heavy for the .40 s&w, great for the 10mm auto, between 135gr minimum and 165gr maximum parameters is best, with 180gr bullet weight being ideal
.40 s&w is the ideal cartridge caliber, but 180gr was always too heavy for the .40 s&w, great for the 10mm auto though, between 135gr minimum and 165gr maximum parameters is best, with 155gr/150gr being the ideal bullet weight for the .40 s&w!
Still the best choice in my opinion too.
45 the best
@@504Trey agree to disagree
@@504Trey Try shooting auto glass from varying distances, 45 just does not cut it like other calibers. Its great for soft targets though.
@@rtaggs8178
Why would I be shooting through auto glass?? 🤔💀
Finally, someone addresses sectional density in one of these ballistics gel tests.
"Velocity and expansion are variables! Mass and cross section are constants!" The late Colonel Jeff Cooper
I own a Glock 17, 22, and 27 -- the recoil is a little less with the 9mm. But I would rather carry the .40 S&W. The .40 is a good mix of power and capacity.
the lowish recoil, capacity and good ballistic performance makes the 9mm a winner. I wouldn`t be surprised if the 40 and 45 needs to be made heavier as well due to pressure
Yup
@@hotdog9262 bro, google 9mm pressures, alright, good job, now, google .40 s&w pressures. PS, get ready to feel dumb and edit your comment, I am a reloader for both .40 and 9. I already know the answer even without google...you're puking up a boomer myth, stop it(btw +p and +p+ 9mm are even freakin higher than what google told you by like 10-20,000 LOL). I shoot IPSC matches and watched TONS more "9mm major" guns explode and mutilate fingers and hands than I EVER did the .40's, even when loaded "hot". We gotta stop this .40 is "high pressure" thing just because it's more recoil than we can handle. Just say ".40 is too much for me and 9mm is not". .40 uses quicker powders which giev it that snap, not cause it's "high pressure". Straight up boomer lies.
@@losi8ightyew how you load your personal ammo is not interesting for people buying theirs at a store. max pressure for 9mm listed is 34k psi and 40cal 35k, but typically according to info online 9mm is loaded to 27-28k psi
@@hotdog9262 all I needed to hear right there. Most factory non +p and +p+ is right about 32k. +p and +p+ 9mm can be well over that. Listed chamber pressures on both for standard loadings are 35k in my load book. Don't make a difference as my point in teaching was gotten across, they are both the same standard store bought loadings EXCEPT +p and +p+ 9mm are higher than .40. Myth, busted.
Your videos helped me choose my carry ammunition for my HK45. Thanks for the detailed ammunition reviews.
P.S. I hope a couple of your future tests w ammo I am sending will prove that Old School tech bullets still can work great for civilians not as worried about barrier penetration like LE has to as long as it is pushed to a fast enough velocity. Real World results tended to say those worked really well (and better than the same bullets at standard velocity). Old Tech, from longer barrels, at plus p or hot velocity. It's the modern Micro/Subs/Snubs that may need higher newer tech bullets...And in Ammogaddon that might mean the expensive stuff for the short barrels and old school/cheaper for the longer barreled pistols IMO. Thanks again!
What do you think of Federal Hi-Shok? I can always find Hi-Shok 9mm in 115 and 147 grain but have heard that the it doesn't expand reliably.
I agree some old rounds are as good & cost less
@@timrobinson6573 ask Sam...all depends on barrel length. 115 prob ok from 4" or longer 147 who knows...but that's just a guess would need to do your own research. Neither would be carry choice just shtf maybe. 124Plus p one of the top 6 in my 5+1 best ammo choices vid
@@nicholasroberts9618 that stuff is fierce coming out of a snub nose revolver. My hand was numb for three days. I liked it though.
@@totalnewb123 That & the huge blast is why I sold all my 357s . If you shot it in doors with no ear pro it would be ugly . I went to 44 , 45 & 9mm back in the day .
Good demonstration. All calibers hit the gel blocks violently. I have all calibers from .45 down to .22, revolvers and semi's. I carry .40 almost exclusively same as I did during my 25yrs as LEO. I will carry a J-frame on special occasions though. Keep up the good work.
I had the same problem with the safety on my M&P 2.0. It ended up breaking so I removed it and put in the frame plugs. It works much better now.
I love all of your videos, I like how fair and thorough they are as well as how many different things you test, from large bear defense guns to lighter recoil calibers for self defense. I think this really goes to show that with all handgun rounds there is no guaranteed fight stopper, all of these will do the job if placed correctly and none of them are a magic bullet that sends the bad guy flying like in the movies.
That 9mm was hot! Looks like it kicked just as the .40 . But the 40 was the clear winner in the gel!
My G23 shooting 180gr HSTs has better pen(13"-14"), better wound cavity, and better expansion(.68-.73) that the (150-200fps)faster heavier 10mm 200 gr HST from my G20(11-12".... .59-65).
To much speed causes rapid expansion that slows the round faster and then peels the petals back further to quickly, so you lose pen and expansion.
Those were all quite good by modern defensive standards. I’d carry any of them. 45 years ago, the options were pretty much ball, or a 200 cast SWC in .45, and ball or JHP that didn’t work in 9mm. Back then, I chose the .45 and I’d carry a 200 gr.H&G cast SWC now, if it was all I could get. Some of today’s bullets are really good. I still have Federal 9BPLE in my Beretta 92, but science keeps advancing.👍 Thanks.
I tested the 9BPLE a few days ago. Video is still unreleased.
@@GunSam I look forward to it.👍
even when you handicapped the .40 s&w as much as you did, either on purpose or clumsily, it still performed the best.... by a mile
How was it handicapped?
And how was it handicapped? He used a 562 fpe bullet.
P.S. been said Seal Team 6 had 185 plus p jhp in their Mark24 HK45c as I discussed in my 2 hk45c vids...guessing Golden Saber but who knows. Would love to see what a 185 plus p hst would look like.
Just to simplify it all for everyone here. .40 is the best for everyone, and 10mm is better if you can handle it. Thanks for watching.
The .40 cal.is more expansion than 45 acp and 9mm so the .40 cal.is the best
Man those M&P pistols are making my jealous. I got the compact 2.0 but those 5 inch models gotta be great shooters.
Thank you sir. I just bought some underwood 40sw 150g nosler to load in one of my carry pistols(4” barrel). I feel very confident now it packs a punch.
I’m considering a handgun of home defense and EDC. This video clearly shows the .40 and .45 rounds really tearing up the gel, but it seems that the 9mm holds it own. Your ability to stay on target with the 9mm gives me confidence that the 9mm has plenty of lethality to stop an intruder or attacker. Thanks again.
I used to think the 9mm was great, but real world information really shows it differently. I have seen a lot of evidence in videos of 9mm not working at all and .40 working very well. I haven't seen any .45 videos where I can confirm a .45 was used.
@@GunSam Thanks for your insight. I’m still open to the .40 S&W, Does the issue w/ 9mm failing have to do with quality or just the fact that most have “luger” action?
@@GunSam where can I look for the real world data
Bullet placement is what counts.IMHO
@@Grunt49 , Great in theory but in real world high stress situations accurate placement is a lot harder.
Love how everything is on the same playing field in this test
Sam is very considerate unlike other channels which compare "same, " yet the rounds are different in bullet type, grain, and use a suppressor.
+p+ on the 9m ???
@@lewistwist 185 +p about as close as you get to +p+ unless going to 45 super,would require same installing stronger recoil spring and beefing up his mag spring. Most manufacturers won't push 45acp to its potential because of all the unsupported chambers,mainly in 1911s. I could give Sam some super recipes that destroy 10mm though 🤣
@@ratagris21 Same with perception of recoil. People will put their .45 in a heavy 1911 and feel a lighter "push" recoil, then shoot .40 out of a compact polymer Glock and feel a "snappier" recoil and claim that .40 must magically be a worse recoiling round. The reality is that if you read any reloading manual with recipes, you'll see substantial crossover between 9mm, .40, and .45 in terms of bullet weight and powder charge. The rounds are more similar than they are different.
@@Jason608 true, but some people just hype up stuff for an ego trip.
Here’s more empirical data that folks may have retired their .40s way too soon. Such a superb street proven round. I choose my Glock .40 over my Glock .45 for HD. Thanks for the great video.
That was entertaining. That’s for the efforts.
Thanks for watching!
(I paused during the chrono session to write this so no idea yet how they perform) -- That 9mm loading was giving you, from a pistol, very, very close to what I clocked Federal 9BPLE (115gr +P+) from a 10.5" SMG barrel (Colt 635). That was back probably just over 20 years ago (geez, I'm getting old) so this speaks wonders on what companies have managed to do with powder chemistry.
When you read off the bullet weights I thought "Holy crap this actually is going to be fair".
Amazing video! Those Noslers dump a whole bunch of energy really fast with all that push behind them. Good shooting there Tex. But par for the course with you, sir.
I think the biggest issue as far as choosing 9 vs 40 vs 45 is you can factor out capacity in California. Which sucks.
I appreciate that you don't edit out the malfunctions. Shows us that we should shoot plenty of defense rounds through our carry pistols before counting on them. In light of this, I will be taking a few boxes of GD and HST with me to shoot next time I go camping.
Great format for a good video testing light bullets in each caliber, comparing apples to apples instead of apples to oranges. I'm looking forward to the heavier bullet test, and I think I'll subscribe now. 😎
. My point is mostly @ the 40 cal , @3:57 & again later it jammed . When you shoot ammo that is too hot for the DESIGN , bad things can happen . Slide speed is up , I don't recall the track record of THAT 40 . I think all this ammo would work at less Vel , I would feel better about it if it was used in a strong revolver OR rifle . +P can be hard on some guns , I would want to use ammo that's in the middle of the specs for any gun . Cold weather is a time when it's possible more power is OK .
For an auto , I want it to cycle every time , better a FMJ that works , than the best Wiz Bang round that jams your auto .
I carry a Glock 32c in 357Sig, but been thinking of changing it to a 40 caliber. I love the 357Sig though!
Interesting vid. Thank you. And thank you for mentioning sectional density. Practically nobody these days talks about it. I think most have no idea what it is. Me being an old time deer hunter, i always think in terms of S.D. Hence my reason for choosing heavier for caliber bullet weights. Not the top weights, since I want some velocity also. But in the middle. 124 for 9mm, 180 for 40sw, etc.
I will stick with my .40 Speer Lawman, 165 grain, JHP. It is easier to control and penetrates better/deeper. If it doesn't expand as much it still puts a pretty good sized hole, about .50 plus every time. The .40 you tested expanded to .977 or about that, but penetration in bare gel was kinda weak. IMHO. Love you videos, but not so much these three boutique ammos. Thanks for the great review and info!
Isn't Speer Lawman FMJ??
@@rob.3575 Yeah, you're right. The Lawman are the practice rounds and the Gold Dot are the duty rounds, I misspoke. I have both in the safe and I must be getting old/senile. LOL!
Traditionally , the Lawman sub branding simply meant " normal first quality " brass cased . Before Gold Dots , their conventional bulleted LE ammo was marked as Lawman .
The penetration was exactly as designed/ intended . It's a Feature , not a Fault .
Massive expansion with 12-14 in penetration vs moderate expansion with deep penetration is an eternal debate of Tastes Great vs Less Filling porportions , with near religious conviction on both sides .
If you prefer the later , the 165 Gold Dot doesn't suck .
@@filianablanxart8305 My stash isn't that old. I retired in 2014. When I retired I bought Glock 22 and a Glock 27 because that is what I carried and I feel well armed with when the need arises. My daily carry though is my 640-1 that was my original backup gun loaded with the old Federal 147 grain, jacketed hydrashock, .38 special +p+. Its not as loud as the .357 loads and easier for follow up shots.
We have all 3 calibers in our home but the 40 sets on my bedside table. Any of these will work fine for self defense but after witnessing first had the damage the 40 does hitting targets, trees, the ground or whatever I feel the 40 has a lot more destructive effect. So it’s my go to piece.
Very great Idea ! Thanks for this vidéo. I would like to see non-expensive comparison with g9 n co. And .380.
These light for caliber performed well, but I really excited to see how the heavier bullets perform. Thanks for addressing the real world vs. "spray and pray." This thinking that you are unarmed unless you have 15 plus 1 in your gun needs to be debunked.
Mix that with the fact that some people even use .38 Special revolvers which bounces off winter clothing or baby skin. They are truly unarmed.
@@GunSam LOL!
@@GunSam I HATE when that happens lol. My husband carries a 442 smith 1 7/8 barrel and standard pressure 158gr semi wadcutters. He says he can hit with it just fine.
@@nicholasroberts9618 wow! I think I’ll stick with my 230 grain Golden Saber.
@@nicholasroberts9618 Don't try that at home !!!!!
12:20 that's a beautiful shot. most people would have lied and said yep right where I wanted it to go. lol. props
Impressive ammunition to say the least and highly consistent. Underwood makes really good stuff. I always see Scott from Kentucky Ballistics using it, or Federal
Perfect performance all across the board. Take your pick in caliber because they all work great.
A 🔨 of a test Sam!! Lol awesome demonstration and test 👍🏻👍🏻
Thanks.
Great job! Very thorough, educational, and fun.
Thanks for sharing the link to this video. I just acquired an FN FNP-40 and am looking forward to handloading bullets in the 150-165 range. Several candidates with the 150 Asp near the top of the list
I have many pistols in all three of these calibers but I still prefer my Springfield XDs in .45 acp. I use 6+1 185gr Golden Saber rounds which produce 1013fps/422fpe consistently. They have excellent expansion & penetration. My 2nd favorite is my Glock 29 in 10mm, but it gets to heavy and bulky after several hours of carrying.
i do as well. i have the m&p shield pc and its a tack driver for a 3.3 inch barrel.
Great comparison and excellent reason I don't own any defensive handguns with manual safeties. We all just watched you come in second in a gun fight.
What if you were in a gun fight and other guy shoots at you a couple times and misses An you get your gun out and off safe the shooter is running away You follow him home know where he lives Next day you go to his place follow him down side walk get your gun off safe Can you shoot him cause he fired at you first with a deadly weapon ?
Next Sam! The fairest test between .45acp+, .88 magnum +P+, and a 40W laser plasma. Great videos and testing. Well done Sir!🎩☯️♠️
A really nice presentation. I was impressed with you did the comparison camera screen shots.
All three calibers are good. Pick the one you are most accurate with and easiest to control.
Loved the test!👍👍
Not a fan of the Glock, (and a 1911A1 is THE .45ACP weapon), but all the same, the 45 hit like a sledgehammer!🔨🔨
Reckon thats why one of my favorite sayings is "There's not an issue that I can't resolve with good left hook, or a slug from a 45."
Kudos for matching sectional densities between the 9, 40, & 45 to .130. I think when you match sectional density you get a more fair comparison between dissimilar bullet diameters/calibers vs the common tendency to match bullet weights. Although I'm puzzled why you are measuring to the backside of the bullet on a couple of the shots versus to the leading edge? That aside was a good video, I enjoyed it. Much appreciated.
BTW I doubt limp wristing was an issue with the 40. I've never noticed a 40 to be affected by that with the higher slide thrust they generate.
Excellent video. Can't wait for the video your going to put out next.
So… shoot what you shoot well, because they aren’t too far apart performance-wise. Just be first to make hits.
Hi Sam, ballistics aside, you put a .45 slug in the guy's face, it doesn't get any worse for him :D A suggestion: could you shoot loads at different heights (load A, height X) in the gel? MDF first on the left, without on the right? We would be able to see the cavities better, this way.
You put any of these in someone’s face the effect would be equal across the board…
I’d be happy with any of them. They all produce over 500 foot pounds of energy.
And yet, any pistol is a compromise when it comes to stopping a threat. A simple blast from a common 150gr .30-30 yields 1,903 ft-lb. A rifle isn't always convenient, but boy, do they easily get the job done and reach out to touch something.
@@exothermal.sprocket Boy howdy. I agree 100%. Unfortunately the weapon most people have handy is a pistol. You know the old saying, you use your pistol to fight your way to a long gun.
@@maxmccain8950 Fo sho.
Rifles are vastly superior, but they also penetrate way to much. Shooting through walls is a real issue, handguns or shotguns with buckshot help limit that
@@sleeper.simulant7327 Very much a generalization. I know rifle rounds doing 4000+ FPS that disintegrate on impact, on a critter that's no more than 2" thick. I also know rifle rounds that will go through an elk end-to-end.
I read your comment about the use of the +P, +P+, but I'd venture to say most people are only using some brand of defensive hollow point in their 9mm/.40/.45 pistols, not hot loads. Also, many pistols manufacturers do not recommend the +P/+ unless the firearm is rated for it.
Yeah I’ve never seen a +p 40 cal.. makes sense GunSam!!!
Nice! I appreciate the test and video. LFC tests are always interesting to me. Those head shots were fun. Good commentary on less than ideal, real world rapid fire (but it happens).
Great job using the same sectional density. I always wonder why most ballistic tests ignore this and try to match the weight of bullets when they are different caliber bullets. Keeping the same SD keeps it fair.
Overall not a bad review. I believe with bullet expansion, fpe and penetration I would choose the .40 cal. . Although I normally choose my EDC by season. I have a few in each cal. 9mm, .40 cal. , 45 ACP and 10 mm. 10mm normally when I go hunting as a backup to my rifle or shotgun.
I was prepared to debate your video title, but I instead agree it was a very nicely done comparison outside of lab conditions. I switched to carrying 10mm and 45ACP after the Live Goat tests that the FBI did way back when I was in the academy but I am starting to concede that modern 9mm is not the crap show that it once was.
Good results. Great comparison test. Thank you.
You should have more subs!! I’ll definitely point all the .40 haters to this video lmao 🤣 !! Great shooting. Your nickname should be the human bench-rest 😅!
What i inferred was to use the lightest recoil and controllable round which was the 9mm . It performed about the same on the gelatin as the .45 and . 40. Perhaps the .40 is a good all purpose round when all things are considered. Perhaps the best data would be from hospital emergency rooms and surgeries documenting actual human wounds vs caliber?
PS. I carry .380, 9mm, and .40
Thanks for testing these, Sam. They appear to be powerful and effective in all three calibers. I have it on good authority that even in a shorter barrel the 9mm will expand and penetrate about the same as from the longer barrel. Nosler makes good bullets, and IMHO, Underwood loads some excellent ammo.
Based on this presentation, I'd have to agree - very impressive!
When seconds count between life and death. Thanks for sharing why it's best to stay away from anything with a safety.
Heck yeah, this is gonna be a good one!
Really liked this comparison. Great video. Great shooting too.
excellent presentation sir! One of your best I think!
Thank you.
.40sw the best semi auto handgun caliber, cheap, easy to reload, good capacity, can get to magnum/sig level with Light weight bullets(135 to 155 grain)....
*45
@@504Trey9mm*
@@504Trey **.40 s&w
@@a2gseduccion431 9mm paraplegic? 🤣🤣🤣
i think you meant .40 s&w 😉
@@504Trey .45 aarp?? 🤣🤣🤣
i think you meant .40 s&w😉
Thanks for comparing pistols ofnsimiliar size and caliber density. Good job and data points
What they made a 45 ACP?
I (still) be rocking the 45 Colt!
The “Taylor Knock Out Index”: Velocity (in fps) x Weight (in grains) x Diameter (in inches) = _ divided by 7,000 [to convert into foot pounds of energy].
9mm: [1901 AD] (Original)
Standard P - 1180 x 115 x .355 = 48,173.5 divided by 7,000 = 6.88 ft pd
Underwood Ammo 9mm:
Standard P - 1300 x 115 x .355 = 53,072.5 divided by 7000 = 7.58 ft pd
+P - 1100 x 147 x .355 = 57,403.5 divided by 7000 = 8.2 ft pd
+P+ - 1550 x 90 x .355 = 49,522.5 divided by 7000 = 7.07 ft pd - (?)
Notice how big and slow is better than little and faster every time? Well now, it ain’t just what she said anymore!
And on that note -
45 ACP: [1904 AD]
Standard P - 835 x 230 x .451 = 86,614.55 divided by 7,000 = 12.37 ft pd
Underwood Ammo 45 ACP:
+P - 925 x 255 x .452 = 106,615.5 divided by 7000 = 15.23 ft pd
Fools Figure, but Figures don't Fool! Which now leads us to the Facts -
45 Colt: [1872 AD] (Original)
Standard P - 1000 x 235 x .456 = 107,160 divided by 7,000 = 15.3 ft pd Original
Underwood Ammo 45 Colt:
Standard P - 1000 x 250 x .452 = 113,000 divided by 7,000 = 16.14 ft pd - Xtreme Penetrator
+P - 1400 x 250 x .452 = 158,200 divided by 7,000 = 22.6ft pd - Xtreme Penetrator +P
This is the results of big getting faster. So, "faster can be goods so long as size is not compromised!" And I quoted her on that.
[Liberty Ammunition 45 Colt:
Standard P - 1800 x 78 x .452 = 63,460.8 divided by 7,000 = 9.0658 ft pd - Civil Defense
Showing little going fast is just that, and nothing more!]
+P - 1325 x 325 x .452 = 194,642.5 divided by 7,000 = 27.8 ft pd - Long Flat Nose Gas Check Hi-Tek Coated Hard Cast +P
This is the results of big getting bigger! As so did her eyes!
Good video. I agree with Cliff. Take care.
Thank you
You did a fantastic job with your test! My S&W .40 doesn’t have an external Safety.
Wish I could get some of this ammo for my 40 MP and my SR1911.
Those are definitely the hottest 9mm loads I've ever seen
Someone needs to do these tests with objects passed through first. Car doors, dry wall and various home and windshield glass.
40 was developed as a penetrator after the infamous Miami shootout. It usually does well in punching through a windshield or the like. Maybe the +p+ rounds in other calibers could keep up now.
This was the best comparison I've seen in a while. 500-600 ft lbs is the sweet spot IMO. The 45 seems to be the most devastating at that mark.
I'm building a 45 super/460 rowland 1911 and have learned much about comps and ports. When I'm done, this gun will fire 44 mag power with minimal recoil. Imagine a tack hammer delivering Dirty Harry style justice....mmmm mmmm good!
(Of course the gun weighs 3 lbs but that's what holsters are for).
Thanks, You tested that underwood 45 ACP +P 185 grain before and it performed slightly better than rated velocity of 1200 fps and this batch is quite a bit lower so that's kind of puzzling - I think you were using the same pistol...even so it's still a good round!
I've been looking at the Underwood 9mm 147 +P Nosler sporting hollow points but I don't know anything about Nosler projectiles so I haven't bought the ammo.
You get your money's worth for Nosler Rounds. GB Goods uses the Noslers for accuracy comparison when available because of the consistency in the Quality of the rounds.
The most fare would be comparing the top performing or top rated round of each caliber against each other.
Excellent video! Very well presented. Also, you are one helluva good shot! I was impressed with the force of the .45 ace rounds. Fine penetration with perfect expansion. All the rounds did well, but I would say the .45 would have the best stopping power. Love your videos.
Back before Underwood got really big I contacted Kevin Underwood several times. Real nice guy BTW. I doubt you can call him on the phone these days. At that time Kevin used actual firearms while developing all his loads. I was told he used the most common firearm commonly used for the caliber under development unless he was developing a load for a specific platform. I can't say he still does the same these days but my guess is he does. So if you keep in mind what the most common firearms for each given caliber is you should have a good idea of barrel length used to get the FPS stated on the box. Most ammo manufactures use test barrels and you cant extrapolate anything from their rated FPS on the box. In my limited testing Underwood ammo has always hit or exceeded the rated FPS stated on the box when using a standard sized firearm for the caliber. AKA Glock 19 (4 inch barrel) for 9mm and a full sized 1911 (5 inch barrel) for 45 ACP. No .40 here. It's strange the 45 ACP you tested did not make close to its rated FPS in your 5.3 in Glock 41. My Underwood ammo is from back in the day and either uses Speer Gold Dots or Hornady XTP's BTW. Maybe they had to back the 45 ACP down and did not change the rated FPS? Oh well I cant wait to see the testing with standard for caliber bullet weights.
I have the 115 gr +p at 1300 fps. That’s a hot little pill.
It’s hot but if I want spicy I’ll switch to .357 sig. 1300+ fps from a 3” barrel 😵💫! Lmao
Nice point shot on tbe .45 for a lighter gun. It’s a reason I prefer a steel gun, controls recoil better. I’m better with my Para-Colt Combat commander or even with the original frame than I am with a Glock. The Old school P series Sigs I’m better with over a Glock as well.
I agree with the idea of quality shots over quantity of shots. Fewer deeper shots > more scattershots.
However, to achieve that deeper penetration, I would skew toward heavier loads.
People hate on.40 yet it won in my opinion
I like the comparison you did. So much similarity between the 3 calibers. Great expansion on all three in full sized guns. Do they work the same in a micro sized gun or is the velocity loss too great to over come like some revolver ammo. IMO it is shot placement that is the key item as long as there is a decent amount of penetration. No handgun is a really good terminal tool for people compared to a rifle and shotgun. But even with those you have to get a GOOD hit. Yeah a wound in the extremity "can" be fatal ( ie femoral artery) but a center punch or cranial hit with at least 8" penetration will do damage to critical organs.
The classic rule of thumb is that +P from a shorty semiauto will be ( at least) equivalent to std vel of same bullet weight from a full size pistol .
Cool video thanks.
Very impressive ammo... that 9mm is the same velocity as the .38 Super JHP I use...
There's no question that a properly-loaded .40 S&W is the most effective of the 3 calibers tested here. Even a typical self-defense/law-enforcement round like the 165 grain Gold Dot packs almost 500 lb/ft of energy and expands extremely well. The real hot rod .40 loadings like the Underwood & Buffalo Bore 155 grain hollow points deliver close to 600 lb/ft. That's magnum-class performance. This is not to say that 9mm and .45 aren't good calibers, although I question the relevance of .45 in the modern world. IMO .40 S&W made it obsolete due to having equal or better ballistics with higher capacity. I was considering buying a double-stack 10mm pistol until I looked at the performance of the really hot .40 loads. If a .40 won't take care of it, you probably need a .44 magnum or a rifle.
Energy isn't really the end all be all, momentum is just as important to consider.
What's most important is how reliably does your bullet expand, how big does it expand and does it go deep enough.
The .40 has offerings that fall into an impressive Goldilocks zone, I'd say a hot 180gr Gold Dot really does almost make the .45acp seem irrelevant but a 230gr +P HST or Golden Saber is still going to destroy more tissue at the end of the day.
Safety on, dead, malfunction, dead, safety went on, dead. All I heard was Glock Glock Glock perfection.
Look at the recoil management. From the side view. .45ACP swings up to double angle compared to 9mm. 0.40 almost the same as .45ACP, but visible small difference exists. Huge difference in sending the next shot.
It's only a split second more for a heavier recoiling round to come back down on target. It's debatable if maybe 4 shots of 9mm VS 3 shots of .40 S&W or .45 ACP in the same time frame would have one being better than the other. Many people think the first shot or second is what saves your life, assuming that shot or two will stop the attack. But what if it does not? To me having the first impact being more powerful gives you better odds.
@@GunSam I only notice the difference is huge, and the real effect should be measured with a timer. Few typical scenarios defined and then tested. Double or even triple taps for sure.
Penetration then needs to be compared with scenarios too. E.g. perp in car, perp with bulletproof vest, enemy with plate carrier. And then from each caliber the best performer (logistics and price taken into account) would be used.
Well, military has to select one single cartrigde as pistol/pcc are only secondary weapons or for police. Thus hard to replace 9x19 anyways. I'd hope NATO would increment the pressures of 9x19 a bit. But it performs okay already. We would need to hear from Ukrainian trenches how it has performed against the Russian invaders/occupiers. In the rare cases they had to resort to pistol.
The expansion with the 150gr .40 was amazing!
All of the safety related failures to fire in minute 13 demonstrate perfectly why a defensive firearm should not have a manual safety.
Sam...you ought to through the 10mm into the mix as it's popularity is growing.
He already did.
BEAUTIFUL hat brother Sam
Very interesting test. That was the first negative I have seen with your 9 mm M&P 2.0.
Underwood is good ammo. But it shoots low. Stick with my 155 gr gold dot in 40