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Ashton, your videos are among the best researched, best written, and among the best produced and present I've seen anywhere on UA-cam, and I've seen a lot of videos by a lot of people. You're in a class of your own. Bravo for consistently producing such amazing and thought-provoking content!
""being able to accrue up to 5 days off after a year", damn that sound straight out of the advertising from Cyberpunk 2077, only missing the 20 year loyalty pledge (aka no working for anyone else) and an 80 hours work week
i works at mcdonalds for years and 2020 new hiries would get 12 € + tax free night sunday and special day which would be 25 % 50 % and 100 % if you works nornal every shift you would get 15-18 € and this is at every mcdonalds in germany !! i was a shift leader and would get only 14 € fix not at hourly rates. as a normaly mcjob you can make enough money to live a good live in germany becaus every year you get an raise of est. 0,50 €
I have been working since approx. 15 years on and off in various projects in the US and the condition people are working there are often unthinkable in Germany. I have seen people coming to work with food poisoning, chills/fever, broken right wrist, so the colleague had to operate keyboard with his left hand. And these were not low income jobs but well paid IT jobs. When I had my first project in the US in around 2010 I cancelled my 'dream' of working in the US permanently. Most Germans complain about things but don't really appreciate what they have cause they don't really know what's going on outside their own country.
I still remember watching a TV show from USA, Tough jobs or dirty jobs. First episode I watched the presenter was making roof shingles at a timbre mill. Cutting thin planks to size standing in front of a massive 6ft diameter saw blade, no blade guards, no safety cage, no laser stop sensor, no pressure safety sensors, no supervision, no off switch, no PPE, no blade clutch. Just blew my mind, what do the employers think will happen if he, slips, falls, faints, collapses, the blade explodes, packing strap goes into the blade or it jams on debris?
@@glanciaeltro1271 "what do the employers think will happen if he, slips, falls, faints, collapses, the blade explodes, packing strap goes into the blade or it jams on debris?" Nothing. Most are not even employed so their employer - another independent company - would have the liability. If something like this happens the lawyers glee and get much money in the ensuing process. Sometimes the worker wins and gets a million US$. The lawyer gets 5 million when he wins. And 4 million when he looses...
@@glanciaeltro1271 My family works in insurance. I was told of this guy who lost 3 digits on his hand. He was told by his employer and his worker's comp that they would not cover all 3 fingers. He had to choose which ones went in the trash and which he would keep. The guy was 19 and had a mental breakdown. The company told him he will keep his index, middle and part of his ring finger went into the trash. This is America. You don't even get to keep your body parts in the event of a sawblade incident. It would be socialism if you said otherwise. Even worse if you mentioned unions and God forbid safety regulations. You sound like a Marxist.
The mentioning of „6 weeks of paid sick leave“ in Germany was a bit incomplete: it‘s six weeks per illness. So if you are really unlucky and break a leg in January and then break your other leg in June, this would be two different illnesses and the counter starts anew for the second leg. If you need more than 6 weeks to recover, you will also still receiver money: 60% (?) of your normal income is paid by your health insurance.
It's 70% of the regular gross income (but no taxes deducted), and maximum 90% of the net income. With children, the numbers are a bit higher. That's for the 72 weeks after the initial 6 weeks at full pay, so, for a total of 18 months.
@@Thiesi yes exactly. You could break your leg just a couple of centimeters further up or down a week after the other break healed and it technically would be a new injury.
I noticed one big difference that was not mentioned when you loose your job. As I understood you will loose your healthplan the moment you loose your job in the US. This is not the case when you loose your job in Germany, the unemployment pay covers your health-insurrence. And this goes also for your pension. That is also covered by the unemployment pay.
That isn't really correct because it depends on the state. Most states in the US expanded Medicaid under the Affordable Care Act, so if you live in one of those states you can get Medicaid and not pay anything for your health insurance. If you live in a state that didn't expand Medicaid, then you probably won't qualify. However, if you replace that job with a low-earning job, you can get a government-subsidized health plan and if your earnings are low enough, you either don't pay anything or else you pay a fraction of the cost.
Another thing that is missing is the Hartz IV (now Bürgergeld) which covers all that plus rent even after you have been unemployed for over a year. Here in Germany, if you are homeless, it usually is by choice or not willing to accept the offers you get.
Yes, because the only other option in the US is to foot the whole bill in the marketplace. Effectively, every employee is a contractor in the US, but we don't actually get to sign contracts with an employer ensuring basic rights and severance unless you're a top level executive.
You can also continue to pay for the employer-sponsored insurance yourself under a plan called COBRA. We did this when my husband lost his job. It was cheaper to put the family on COBRA than to add them to my firm’s insurance, which isn’t subsidized. All of these are substantial considerations with any job change.
As a German with quite a few of international friends I had discussions about this topic again and again. Bring socialised here and security inclined, I mostly preferred our system over one were you are more 'free' were to put your income. I did not become rich but also not destitutely poor and feel better knowing that health insurance is covered if I lose my job as well as for all the others around me. The system is far from perfect and needs reforms, but still....
Ganz richtig, es ist noch weit weg von prefekt, aber das zeigt dann auch auf welch hohem niveau wir dann von Verbesserungen reden. Während in den USA muss das erst mal überhaupt eingeführt werden. Deswegen ist trotz aller Mängel immer noch ein Leben in Deutschland bevorzugenswert. Aber klar ist auch, es muss immer noch massiv verbessert werden, und nur weil es wo anders schlechter geht, heißt es nicht, dass man mit den Brotkrumen sich dankbar abfinden muss!
One needs to remember a lot of government in the US functions at the state and local level. You’ll see huge variations in social benefits, minimum pay rates, taxes, and living costs between states. If one were to compare a state like Massachusetts to Germany as well as Mississippi vs Germany, the results would be startling different with one state being much closer to the overall benefits seen in Germany.
@@KRYMauL Just eductate yourself and don't waste money on financial advisors. It's not that complicated. Go by the rule 'nobody between me and my money'.
Those numbers are still very big! I live in Missouri and my husband worked a management position in a small restaurant for 3 years and never made over 11k a year.. But that wasn't corporate so he left for a corporate job with less pay for benefits and full hours. I started my own business and only made about 20k in profit my first two years but it's improving every month. Wild to see these numbers. Your last video opened my eyes to how deep in poverty we've been living so I decided I want to try to go to school in my 30s. Wish me luck!
I like Ashton's academic approach to economic and social matters so much! We need more statements supported by empirical data and less abstract stuff like "nothing is better than free market" blah-blah.
The free market / capitalism is a very very powerful tool to improve economy and thus living standards. HOWEVER you always have to remember that improving the live of the people is the reason, so if you are in a situation where capitalism isn't working (anything with infrastructure), do not force it. A free market is only free if someone can enter the market and with reasonable investment start competing against existing companies. Meaning you must be able to get a return on your investment after at most 20 years for low risk or much earlier when high risk. So if you have a market that naturally trends towards a monopoly or a localized-monopoly/oligopoly then no one can enter the market and there is no real competition and thus it is not a free market. Capitalism doesn't work here.
@@_aullik So you mean healthcare, the Pension System and fulfilling basic needs like providing Housing, Food and employment to everyone at an affordable Price? Since these areas all suffer greatly under the Market (not the same as Capitalism which is the Accumulation of Capital) and the need for profit and making money on the back of the disadvantaged and weak. Cause you can make more money if you put a price tag on basic needs or keep a shortage of them as fulfilling them would lower your baseline profit, while at the same time People die of starvation, just cause it's not profitable to feed them. People are Homeless but there are a lot of empty houses right next to them they can not use because they do not own them.
For me the biggest thing is healthcare. What's the cost of let's say a herniated disk for a minimum wage earner in the US. Several MRI, surgery, medications, 2 months of rehabilitation? Can Steve pay for it? If he cannot what will he do? Because he wont work at McDonalds for sure. For Max there would be $0 cost and he gets 100% of his pay plus his job back at the end.
I suffered that in Austria in fall 21. I am well above minimum wage here so I have to do copay which minimum wage workers do not habe to shoulder. For two weeks in hospital, surgery, then 6 weeks of sick leave followed by 6 weeks of rehab at a rehab center (= 14 weeks all together) - my copay for everything was about 600.- Euros (basically the money I would have spent on food had I not been in hospital/rehab center). and, btw: Zero Euros - naught, niente, nada, rien - income loss for those 14 weeks of sick leave, of course.
"If he cannot what will he do?" Easy. GoFundme and/or ask relatives/friends for help. In many areas of normal everyday life, the USA are not much different than MadMax...
Australian here . I had ruptured disc between L5 & S1 ,I had family private health insurance @ the time it cost @$5K per annum. The total out of pocket cost to me was $1200.00 AUD . I had 3 months off work fully paid and my employer’s return to work policy was I came back on restricted hours and the hours were increased over weekly reviews . Cheers
My mom went through cancer treatment here in Germany and all together that cost her about 250-300€ for an entire year of different treatments and other things. You only pay up to 2% of your yearly income after all and I was 16 and still living at home so that also counted for her and she paid less because she was my only parent still alive and the only earner. They also calculated those 2% from her Krankengeld so it was less than it would have been in a normal year. She was able to concentrate fully on recovery and still got I believe 85% or so of her monthly income. It's been a while I don't remember all the data it's really been over a decade now. They also helped her with slow reintegration into her job and also still pay for all the small things she still needs to stay healthy like lymphatic drainage massages and more cosmetic things like the prosthetic for her right breast and bras you can put those in. They'll continue to pay for all of that until she dies and she will continue to only have to pay at most 2% in "co-pays" if you can call the 5-10€ that.
You don’t get it fixed and get addicted to pain killers. At least here in the USA. Side note I have 4 permanent injuries that would plague me a lot less if I got it taken care of but wasn’t able to in USA and now that I finally have a good health plan from employer it’s a pre existing condition so I cannot get anything fixed. Guess I’ll just be in really bad pain until I die.
As an empty nester couple over 60 when we arrived in Germany, we found that the cost of living to be slightly cheaper and much more rewarding and secure than our roughly equivalent American lifestyle, Peace of mind while living in Germany is intangible, until it isn't. For example, I was diagnosed with lymphoma in 2019. If we had lived in the States, Frankly, if we were in America we'd have the awful decision between bankruptcy or my death. Instead, our American private health insurance was glad (and required by the German government) to pay ALL of my expenses in Germany without question, because they knew if we returned to the States for the same level of care I received in Germany, the cost for chemo, radiation, etc. would be 6 to 9 TIMES higher. Thus, for us, living in Germany nearly certainly saved my life. We saw this with other American expats as well, and in some cases, with children, which is doubly tragic!
The problem with such calculations is: You can't measure happiness. Things like "public transport" or "social housing", which affect your daily life dramatically - especially if you have a low income - is simply part of the taxes. So you pay more taxes in germany, to get a better quality of life. I guess it is pretty hard to take all of this into consideration. You still did a great job, while avoiding such stuff!
Not to mention peace of mind and more paid time off (which was touched on in the video). She also did some comparisons in the original video that she didn't do here, such as housing and transportation costs.
Re: "You can't measure happiness." Many social scientists would disagree with that premise. I recommend reading "The Spirit Level", where two British epidemiologists used their training to identify some clever ways of measuring happiness, and then went on to correlate that with disparities in income level. They looked at global data to compare countries, and looked at US data to compare states. The common finding was that the more wealth was concentrated in a society, the more one will see social discord and unrest. Interestingly, they made a good argument that high levels of social happiness are possible with wildly divergent taxation policies.
@@risingdough8078 The problem with these methods is, that they aren't actual measurements. They do statistical approximations where they mix up some abstract values(like well-being, quality of life, contentment, ...) and say "voilá, this is happiness!". But that's a problematic claim, because you simply just get these values. You could measure it, if you know and measure related neurotransmitters and if you could measure the related tolerances in the neurons of each person examined. That would be a pretty invasive measurement. Happiness is a scale in some unknown reference frame. Most of the time we don't even know ourselves if we are happy or not. How would you measure that for big crowds - or even globally? So if you say happiness is just having money then yes - you could measure this. But all you are measuring is how much money you have. If you say happiness is the combination of money and quality of life - you can measure that too. But you still just measure money and quality of life. All you are doing is "renaming" happiness. So if you could measure it, we would totally have some SI-Unit for each person and the whole discussion would be pointless. We wouldn't say "i am very happy" but instead something like "i am at 17.4 happy points".
@@delqyrus2619 Agreed, there are no direct measures of individual happiness. Even metrics based on self-reporting fail. But to say that there are no objective measures of individual happiness means one can't at least get a sense of collective happiness seems shortsighted. There are plenty of proxies for collective happiness, or even collective unhappiness. The authors of The Spirit Level provide a lot of thoughtful insights on the subject. (And no, they never introduce any of their metrics with "Voila! This is happiness.")
3 things to mention: 1. Monthly work hpurs accordind to McDonalds in germany is 169 compared to 172 for a 40 hour workweek. 2. Entitlement of 5 days educational leave per year per person. 3. paid (at least to a certain degree) time off for a child up to 20 days per year IAW RVO (specific conditions have to be met). Furthermore "Kur", Reha, Education towards retirement and and the list goes on and on. I have tought german labor laws to american supervisors. After a class most of them just could not believe it.
My fellow Americans fool themselves that not having these security nets makes them “free”. When one is perpetually in debt bc they’re getting fleeced for things like education & healthcare, one isn’t very free.
@@jaehparrk the gigantic cost are mainly paid by the employer. If they would be so gigantic no company including McDo would be competitive on the market. Strangely they are and the pices at McDo in Germany are cheaper than in the US and not even talking about Germanys exports. Maybe there are paybacks beeing social?
Those US health insurance plans are scary! The main point of health insurance is to cover large expenses, not the occasional doctor's visit. The caps on these policies are so low it's almost not worth having insurance at all.
Yes we were SHOCKED when we were learning more about these "mini-healthcare plans" - apparently they are growing in popularity amongst the Big-Box stores and not just fast food.
yes they are really scary - you dont need much to get over the limits. Even in germany you would be easy above the limits. I broke my arm last year and the bills sum up to around 6000 Euros - just for 2 days of hospital including a surgery. In the US it would be even more expensiv.
@@hansweith4947 you are right, but he only has to upfront that money and will get it back later on. And if you are with AOK or other public insurances, its only 10€ a day.
Childcare in Germany (in public institutions) is free of charge or the fees depend on the income of the parents. Also, I think you should have compared two poor families: Max works full time at McDonalds and Mila is a housewife with a cleaner job and makes $520 a month.
I actually like the fact that in Ashton's [edit: corrected name] example, Mila is making the bulk of the income. Even with kids, there is no need that the female partner has to give in on her career. My partner makes way more as I do, and in part, this is because we did not put her career on pause when we had our first child 24 years ago.
@@SwissPGO I agree on this aspect, so having the women earn more was totally fine for me. However, I agree that in comparison to the original video, it would have been a lot more interesting with keeping the family in a lower income range, maybe both shift managers or something like that
@@SwissPGO I agree on liking the fact that Ashley put Mila as the bread winner in the family. But as of a realistic representation of a German family, It´s more likely that Mila would have a part-time job on a low income level with something from minimum wage up to 12,50 EUR max. Sad but true.
@@SwissPGO Think of it this way: It doesn't matter which spouse earns more, the fact that one partner is earning significantly more than the other, which allows the family as a whole to have much higher wages, is not as useful as a comparison. What if Mila made 40K a year? She's still making more, but that significantly changes the income. Or, what if Stephanie was hourly instead of salary and therefore couldn't offer a family health insurance plan?
Earning more and spending less on taxes - nice! Having peace of mind and not to worry about losing everything if something halfway serious happens with your health - priceless.
I lived in Germany for 6 years. Most of the same people who worked at the local McDonalds when I left were the same people who worked there when I left. They get 5 weeks vacation, first year, they have universal healthcare, and they get a living wage
Don't even know how you can produce such great quality videos with data pretty much weekly is mind boggling. Grew up dirt poor in Texas, worked in the back of Tex-Mex restaurants for 5 years after high school and yeah being paid min wage is just what life is for some people. Was really eye opening as teacher how the state dealt with covid and the Texas freeze, seeing the lower socioeconomic students and their families get shafted because no real social safety nets. After a long journey I'm teaching in Latvia planning to get Masters. Seeing what EU has to offer pretty much solidified my thoughts of never living in the US again.
Tell your friends and family at home! That's important, because "something" has to happen in the US before collapse. I don't want the US turn more right as it is and was. You may think "What? Democrats aren't considered right!" That's true, think about that as deeply as it can get!!
My daughter received a tuition free Masters in Biology in Germany and is currently in Medical School in Germany where the tuition is about a couple thousand Euros a year. Tuition or lack thereof varies from state to state in Germany, but it is saving her hundreds of thousands of dollars. But while the Masters program didn't require German since it was an international program taught in English, Medical School does require fluency in German, so speaking the language is required. German universities also limit the number of slots for international students so it is competitive and the competition is students from all over the world. Her government health plan in Germany is about 150 Euros a month and Germans have no concept of what a copay, deductible or in-network are. No one is bankrupted because of a hospitalization in Germany. And it covers dental and vision. But her student visa limits the amount of hours she can work, so to do this requires having funds saved to pay for expenses to live. Since sharing apartments is common for young single people there, cost of a place to live runs about $400-1000 a month depending on the location in Germany as places like Munich or Frankfurt can cost more than other areas. A non-shared apartment can cost 2 to 3 times the cost. While they pay more in taxes, Europeans get a much higher quality of life, less stress, more societal support and are generally happier.
@@gauloiseguy Yes definitely. People want good roads, good schools, clean streets and life saving affordable healthcare when they need it, but want it all for free. I'm so tired of people talking about "government stealing my money" as if their name is on those dollars. The amount of unrealistic expectations borders on delusion with a lot of people, at least in the US.
I'm loving this series. As someone who lives in KC who recently lost their 6 figure job and now gets $320/wk (the max amount in MO) in unemployment to support a family of 4, the stark contrast in earnings is spot on. [Not here for sympathy, thankfully we were smart with our money and should be ok for a bit. Just here to agree with what Ashton was saying.]
the 75k number or 6250/month also happens to be the very top end at which UI maxes out. The payout of unemployment is 2774/Month for a maximum of 12 months, which is not 67% of the 6250 - but 63% of the 4300€ that someone who makes 6250 with 2 kids in BW would make after tax - go up to a 6 figure salary, the 2774 stays put. MO seems like a low UI state by your account - California is higher - and during general downturns the 26 weeks of normal UI get expanded to up to 99weeks (germany ends at 52 weeks, no matter the economic condition) and in times like Corona, federal money can be added on - which does not happen in Germany. My furloughed brother in California was taking home significantly more than 2774 in Corona times
If not too private, aren't such dream salaries only available to highly skilled workers who are in demand -> it should be easy to find a job with a similar salary ?
@@janreichenbach265 quite the opposite actually. There are few jobs that demand a skill set that pays that high. I've been job hunting since August (bc I knew layoffs were likely), and I've only had two or three interviews. I'm not even looking to match or come close to my former salary. Most jobs want you to have experience, but they aren't willing to compensate for it.
Does not seem so. When I work at night, I have SOME of those hours "steuerfrei". May payslip even says "...davon steuerfrei: XX EUR". The "davon" is the keyword. EDIT: Not "some of the hours" is not taxed, I mean a fraction of the "Nachtzuschlag" is taxed. E.g. (random, but realistic numbers) : Nachtzuschlag: 60,00 EUR davon steuerfrei: 28,60 EUR. Means that I still pay taxes on the remaining 31,40EUR on my night hours.
Don't forget the full PTO ("Mutterschutzlohn") Mila received the 6 weeks before and 8 weeks after each child birth and the "Elternzeit" with up to 14 months (combined) "Elterngeld" Max and Mila could have applied for. So Mila as the main breadwinner could have taken two months "Elternzeit" and Max the other 12 month to bond with the newborn and avoiding daycare costs.
Hi, great video! I love how there are so many things you include! Of course, there are so many options to calculate this, people will never be satisfied (for example, I would have taken hours away from Steve that he would not work if he got sick/went on holiday rather than adding them to Max). Really, this series of videos should be a book :)
The German public health system saved my life 20 years ago when it cured my cancer, at a cost that probably exceeded a million euros. My comparable salary in the USA would have enabled me to buy private health "insurance" that would not have covered the diagnosis, let alone any treatment. Thank you so much, Ashton, for your outstanding work in exposing the "American Dream" to be just that: a dream....because you must be asleep to believe in it.
Hi Ashton and Jonathan, first of all I'd like to thank you for your high quality videos which to me are entertaining and educational. As a German who works from Germany for an American company and has a lot of American co-workers I am highly interested into all the topics you bring up. It helps me a lot to understand the actual similarities and differences between both our countries beyond the common clichés. Honestly I sometimes learn something about my own country as well. 🙂 I might have an idea for a future video of yours (if you haven't already covered that and I missed it): In today's video when Jonathan talked about using your sponsor's app in a train I thought that is almost a lie 😉, because internet coverage is pretty bad in Germany. And that reminded me of a discussion I once had with my colleagues when the pandemic hit us and all of the sudden all kids needed to be home-schooled. The outcome of that discussion was that the home countries of all of my co-workers world wide including India seemed to be much better prepared to that scenario than we were here in Germany. Long story short: What I am aiming at is digitalization: Network coverage, availability of services offered by public administration, use of digital learning in school, etc. It might be interesting to compare Germany to other countries in this regard. Thanks.
This series is quickly becoming a "must watch" for anyone looking to better understand the differences between the US and Germany/EU. You mentioned "peace of mind" that some of these social programs bring you which made me wonder if there are more "intangible" benefits either society offers? Anyways can't wait for the next episode.
Its interesting - we just had a conversation last night with another American family about this - So many facets are interconnected. For example, we were discussing why the US doesn't seem to promote trade/technical jobs (in contrast to University degree positions) - and in addition to cultural norms, another big factor is just that there are greater income disparities in the US and less security from a job standpoint - unemployment, vacation, sick leave. etc. In a way, the current state of the US education system is also a product of the lack of social programs.
@@TypeAshton hum that is a very interesting point and one I had not considered but does seem logical I.e. to compensate for the lack of social programs (livable wage?) more people try to get the highest possible degree (and maybe even in a field they don't actually feel passionate about?).. Which makes me wonder how is going to university presented in high school compared to trade schools etc (I know most 90's "comedy movies" where based in university (think revenge of the needs etc).
Germany and the EU can't be dealt with in the same pan. Germany, the Scandinavian and Dutch speaking countries are quite unique. The northern countries are relatively poorer in terms of assets but richer in terms of income. The absence of assets for most Germans is offset by the social security system. The main purpose of assets is securtiy in harsh times. Not all but a lot of it is covered by the state in terms of health, unemployment, education. You don't have to save for your kid's education. The same is not true for Eastern and Southern Europe. The differences inside Europe are much more pronounced than inside the united states. Latvia, Bulgaria, Greece, Portugal are still a worse places to live than Mississipi and Alabama. And it is not that easy to move from a poor to a wealthy country as languages are still a significant barrier. Moving to another language will in most cases drastically downgrade your job and the professional prospects of your children.
@@awijntje14 American colleges are a scam. "University" degrees in the states and the apostrophes are no typo, don't pay, even over a whole lifetime. Starting your life at minus 200.000 $ with 4 years of income lost will never be made up in your lifetime. With compound interest this would have translated to one and a half million before retirement at real value. Even if your parents pay, they could otherwise have inherited the amount. Especially if you study anything but science, engineering law or medicine to the doctor. Nobody pays a decent salary for English literature or social studies. Study plumbing not at college but at a professional school or learn to code on youtube. Even Biden recognised it with his loan forgiveness which is not a good thing because he distributes/funnels the money through the relatively affluent finally into the pockets of super rich universities running his progressive agenda instead of nationalising education. Paying 2k a year on a loan just for the college's football team is immoral Good education does not need that much money. The ETH Zurich or the EPFL Lausanne and even German universities produce superior results compared to the Ivy League and are free. Many successful American personalities have either not studied at all in the States (Jobs, Gates) or studied abroad. (Einstein, Tesla, Van Neumann and more or less all of the Manhattan project). The American economy has consitently depended on imported brain over the whole of last century and continue to do so. The tycoons of tomorrow will have studied in India and China. The fact that money does not solve problems is not limited to education. Health care costs by far most in the states, with the lowest life expectance in the developed world. It is sad that Canada is moving towards the American way and not vice versa and it is even sadder that this happens with leftist politics.
If your health care etc are not tied to your employer it must make it easier to move between employers (I am from UK so that is my assumption). I assume that the employer would have to pay more towards the insurance if their employees were less healthy so maybe people with fewer medical conditions would find it easier to keep a job even if they are no better at it (even if that is against some discrimination laws). It is good for everyone if the employee can work at the best job for them.
This channel and the quality of the information you share, PLUS the quality of how it is presented, is absolutely phenomenal. I'm with my jaw on the ground in awe of the time and effort you take to share this with us. Germany is 100% in my plans. It'll take a couple years to get things in order, but thank you so much for making these in depth comparisons. Ready to work to get some peace of mind 💪🏼
Just one for the algorythm before watching. Ashton, just keep it rolling that way. I see you are having fun obviously and its refreshing that your joy seems to be grounded in research and education. The quality of your presentation cant be better and you are doing that at home. Probably wont make you rich, but the wealth of honest education is priceless. Thank you.
I think any German/European that even thinks about moving to USA should watch your videos. Even if the information is not 100% accurate, as there are always slight deviations based on circumstances and micro location (let's say 95%+-5% accuracy), it paints more than a clear picture of differences between Germany/Europe and USA. Thank you! P.S. Although it may be too much, are you thinking about making differences like these between various EU countries? There would definitely be an audience for that!
I'm afraid that by the time Ashley would have finished the analysis for the last EU country, the situation would have changed in some other countries already. As a bi-national, having worked in several countries, the situation becomes even more complex, if you consider your options for retirement.
The short answer is that you should only ever consider moving to USA for job if you have a long education and already have a job offer. Any job with lots of people able to do is not worth doing in USA instead of somewhere else.
And once again, a great video! I really enjoy your academically approach to the topic and your presentation of this. As you know both, the „system“ in the US and in Germany you present it in a way (probably) either US-Americans as well as Germans can understand. Keep on with the great work, looking forward for the next video already 😊 Greetings from Freiburg
@@mindpilotthepilot9140 There is. Other example would be Canada, Mexico, Brazil, basically everything in South *America* And they're talking about the USA, so the people there are US-Americans.
Very thorough comparison. It is always nice to see how you go into detail and still manage to keep things both precise and easy to follow. However, I think you forgot "Kindererziehungsjahre" regarding "Rentenversicherung"; if one has kids born after 1992, there is a benefit for raising them, which is that this accounts for 3 more years of contributions to Rentenversicherung (The amount is as if in those years one would have earned the average income. For kids born until 1992 it is 2.5 years. The years are for both parents together.) This is not only raising parents income in old age a bit, but helps them reach certain treshholds regarding the number of years worked.
Is it possible to work in a "tragic" moment for each character's calculations that would paint a more realistic picture? Something like a sports accident for the single characters (broken hip after skiing accident, surgery, 8 weeks sick leave) and what (financial) consequences this would have in the US and in Germany? And the same goes for the "older" couple: a chronic illness, which means monthly costs for medication and doctor visits, something like asthma and migraine for Stephanie and Mila and high blood pressure and diabetes for Max and Steve? And for one of the children also a small accident, where he breaks his arm and one of the parents has to stay at home for a few weeks?
That would be interesting, for sure. It would make a difference also as to which hospital the skiier lands in, in Colorado. I've heard that patients sometimes ask to be transfered, or the insurance company will transfer a patient due to coverage.
I think that could be quite interesting. In the future, one video I would like to also make is just looking from the perspective of a minimum wage single parent - just to get a good comparison on what kinds of social services are available to help support those living below the poverty line with kids in each respective country.
What you propose doesn't render a "more realistic picture", since none of the events is - from a stochastic perspective - likely to happen. The higher propability for an average person or family is that these factors will NOT influence the equation. Which makes it a (scientifically) perfect idea NOT to take them into consideration, if you want to make a general statement, based on an average setting.
@@TypeAshton Um, no? This is not about poverty or low-income earners. I had the opportunity to go to the USA about 20 years ago and earn almost twice as much as I do here in Germany... but ultimately my decision NOT to go to the US was based on what WOULD happen if I got sick. It doesn't matter if you make a lot of money if you have to spend a lot of money to try to stay alive in case of a more serious illness or injury. And in the last 20 Years, I GOT sick (Asthma, High Blood pressue. I had to go to the hospital twice by ambulance because of injuries etc) After all, you are not poor yourself, and if you lived in the US and your husband were to be struck by a truck, for example, the costs to both of you would certainly not be as easy to put away as they are here in Germany, even and especially if he were to lose his income because of the accident. Unless you pay a fortune for health insurances in the USA (of if you are lucky and your employer pays). What I mean to say is: add to your calculations, which are about "who earns more or less where", scenarios that are true to life.... namely illness, accidents and the resulting costs. If an American earns $5000 more a year than a European, that's one thing. But if he, as a family man, is afraid to call an ambulance because he is financially strapped afterwards. just because his son broke his ankle while playing Basketball in the backyard, then that is a calculation that no longer works for a European.
Thank you, Ashton, for another well researched video. Again, it is so refreshing to see info with background sources cited, calculations included, rather than emotional and politicized outbursts. What I've noticed is that while there may be a small number of such emotionally based comments under your videos, a significant number of intelligent and sourced replies seem to be the norm, rather than the exception. That should tell you something about the demographic of your target audience. Again, I'm impressed that you either filter the replies so carefully or, as I assume is more probably the case, you attract a more reasonable and mature (rather than childish) audience. Now I am stoked for part 3 comparing the living costs for your single employees, and the family of four. One thing I have noticed is that tax returns are not included in either calculation. Agreed, with the vast differences of taxation in both countries as well as state-to-state, it will be very difficult to even approach any kind of fair or reasonable comparison I do have hopes and trust in your abilities of research. Just food for thought. Maybe. 😃🤔
Thank you so much for all your videos. They’re well made and researched. My son is considering schooling in Germany or Belgium and my husband and I plan to move to Europe once he graduates from high school next year. Your videos are giving us a lot to consider!
I found you on the Dual ciz video and this came next in the feed. I have to say, the way you address, break down, and provide complete detailed analysis is one of the best I have seen in years. Even though it is 51 minutes, you made it go by so fast. I am sure it took way longer to develop this content. So Thank you so much.
The one thing that makes these comparisons even more complex is that the EUR to USD conversion rates are currently the lowest they've been. If you use the rates from 10 years ago, things look much better for the German families. While this tends to play into the cost of "luxuries" like electronic goods and to an extent fuels, it doesn't play so much into groceries, which I suspect is going to show up in your next video...
Yeah this has been fascinating for us to experience. Jonathan will celebrate his 10 year anniversary of moving to Germany in May, and since we go back and forth to the US quite frequently (and send money back and forth) its quite astonishing how much this exchange rate can affect cost of living.
Purchasing power is still messy. The cost of essentials like food and accommodation are generally driven by local forces. Fuel costs are driven by exchange rates and the global markets. The cost of things like electronics is often driven by the value of the dollar at a fixed point in time in the past. (Some companies are even just set the Dollar price equal to the Euro price)
To me, the main difference is that even if they earn just about the same, the peace of mind you get alongside your earning in Germany is priceless. And the German system ensures that young people, who tend to think themselves invincible are forced to plan for the future. Maybe you should also include an example of Max and Steven getting to 75 and what their financial situation would be then, after having experienced an assortment of minor and major illnesses, accidents and life adversities. Let's say Max had an MI at age 63 and Mila had breast cancer at 50.
The early mention of a BigMac's price in Freiburg and Zürich should include a mention that both cities are in different countries with different currencies. Very interesting analysis!
Yes, of course - but even adjusted for the exchange rate the cost is still double. Funny enough, we took our American co-workers to McDonalds near the Zurich Hauptbahnhof once... because they paid with American credit cards, the screen automatically showed the currency exchange rate... and they were FLOORED at how expensive it was.
If, additionally, social security is measured in money,you will easely see the monetary differences between Europe/Germany and the US. Because..... "IT" matters! AND, you did a great job explaining the whole topic in a professional way, AGAIN! Thank you! ❤️
Another really great topic and video. I hope that you continue doing these good explanations. One note to your viewers is that this is about Germany, not the entire EU. Benefits and what/what level provided does vary a lot. The comparison between say France and Poland is pretty wide apart. Looking forward to next week.
As an American looking to move to Germany to work, this is helpful to know. It is good to know that I would likely still have a similar take home pay even with the higher taxes and social contributions if I was payed around the same I am now.
US Americans really need to see this all laid out like this after all the propaganda you've been fed about how most European systems work. It sounds more expensive at first glance but it really isn't for most people because we also have a lower cost of living usually and all these benefits an US American only gets if they are lucky and have a decent employer. Here it's just the law and it doesn't matter if a company wants to do it or not. We can also always get more but never less than the legal minimum. I for example get 30 days of paid vacation and of course all the other things like paid sick leave and so on.
@@DieAlteistwiederda yea but it would mean that 10 to 20 % of the highest income earners in the US would actually have to pay their fair share of taxes, and we wouldnt want that now, would we ?
A video on comparisons on mobile phones, property taxes, car insurance and cable TV and home internet would be interesting. I was shocked at the costs for those in the US.
Whow, a lot of heavy stuff to think about, but numbers are not everything. The personal life situation is an important thing. The time has beaten us with a lot of things, heavy illness for me and my wife, losing jobs and other bad things. Germany has a lot of mistakes too, but I'm living far happier here than I would if I'd be living in the US. We're still alive, even with our health problems. And for you Ashton: Chapeau for the hard work.
Great work Ashton! Like always, the approach you take to keep a constant and high quality is amazing! I wonder if anyone ever tried to compare those numbers for people that suffer from extreme consequences. Ex-prisoners, immigrants (immigration via asylum), long-term/chronically I'll people, people with no degree, illiterate, deaf and/or mute, handicapped, etc. I really don't know how this would affect the comparison. I don't think it would change the number at global comparison but it still would be so interesting.
Mind blowing how much effort was put into researching this topic. And an easy to follow presentation just makes this video another excellent contribution from the BFF. Thank you for this. 👍
As always Ashton what a video and so much work, bravo! I have so often read the argument that the people who do "low skills" jobs are all students and young professionals! Which I realized can't be true, just from the numbers that McD, Walmart & Co. employ! I was so shocked when the US railroad workers went on strike for 7 sick days (wtf) and the government intervened. Then the Ohio disaster a short time later. The working people just don't have a lobby, power in US Inc. Here everyone would be in the streets, not homeless, but demonstrating: 🙋♂🙋♂🙋♂🙋♂🙋♂🙋♀🙋♀🙋♀🙋♀🙋🙋🙋🙋🪧🪧🪧🪧
It is also important to mention, that the 6 weeks of sick leave in Germany are counted per illness. If you break your leg and are 6 weeks out and 2 month later you have some other broken bone or other illness you again have 6 weeks with 100% payment sick leave. Additionally if your illness takes longer you get a 70% payment continuation from the health insurance for up to another 72 weeks of sickness.
I watch your videos on and off and sometimes come back to them. Your presentation is always top notch. One can see all the care that goes into producing them. And I guess they are also a form of self-therapy, considering how eye-opening many things must have been to yourself when you experienced them.
once again great work Ashton. I like that you two try to look beyond the obvious and therefore give a better comparison between the US and Germany. As with many things in life, things are more nuanced and complicated. I still would love to see a comparison for the low end of income (not to have a way above earner). It would be good to show all the social programs Germany has to help people making ends meet, e.g. Aufstockung, Wohngeld, etc.
Hut ab. Thank you for another impressively thorough video. I believe it's a good thing to have us viewers follow you through all of these numbers and calculations. Life, after all, is complicated. Thank you so much!
❤ Great work to make such an apples to pears comparison actually make sense. I wish someone would make a similar comparison for switzerland... including the extreme case of living in canton Zug.
I like your videos alot, your channel among others are the reason i appreciate germany more than i did before. My wife got very sick and we are highly dependend on the "pflegegeld" which in america would probably made me needing a gofundme. Alone her meidactions of fentanyl and morphine among others probably very expensive medication in america... Cant even imagine. Maybe it would be nice to see a version of a family where someone infact does get quite sick and calculate that, because i think thats where people will see a huge difference. Atm i am full time caring for my wife, partially working from home (when i have time for it) My wife needs constant medical attention, preparing artificial food etc. Couldn't even imagine having that in america. Not taking into account how often i had to call the amubualnce bringing her into the ER several times a year. Alone in a year (about 5 years ago) my wife got flewn to the hospital with a helicopter after an car accident (which made her that sick), had atleast 15 emergency vehicle transports into hospital, all in one year. In total that number is alot higher. To be fair, me on the other hand i dont have much medical issues. And i get it maybe we are the minority, but people get very sick and i am happy we live in germany so we can get throught this crisis without having to worry too much about financial issues. In anyway i am very looking forward for part 2
One thought I had is about part-time. I've heard that big chains in the US often limit employment to part time. "we can't offer full time, but we can give you almost full time hours" to limit benefits etc. And since what constitutes as full time is up to the company to decide/define that seems very sketchy and very exploitable. I would expect that low wage employment such as at McD or say Wallmart would see a lot of that type of behavior. What would the effect be of working say 2 hours less than full-time in this scenario. What would the difference between USA and Germany be then? But I guess that might be to much of a side track/deep dive to what is already a quite long and in depth video.
In most parts of Europe and UK part time workers have to be treated the same pro rata, ie the hourly rate can't be lower for part time workers all benefits must be the same so if someone working 40 hors per week gets 30 days holiday someone working 20 hours gets 15 days, if someone works 5 x 8 hours days they get 30 8 hour days annual leave if someone works 5 x 5 hours days they get 30 5 hour days annual leave, etc etc
As always, I watched your presentation with great interest. You have become a regular part of my Sunday routine - thank you for that. However, I would like to talk about the special features of sick pay in Germany. 1. in case of illness the employer pays 100% of the last salary (he gets a part back from the health insurance). 2. after 6 weeks you get either 60 or 67% from the health insurance - as you said depending on whether you have children or not. This sick pay then-for one illness - max 78 weeks. :That means in Germany you get a total of 84 weeks for an illness (6 weeks 100% and 78 weeks 60 or 67%). Special feature : If you get the 60/67% you don't have to pay taxes. This means that at 67% you almost get your last salary. If you are ill with different diseases, you get the maximum 6 weeks 100% several times. If you can no longer work in your old job, you can retrain or receive a partial or full pension from the pension fund after 78 weeks
Grest Video as usual, but I was missing 2 things. I would have been interested in how paid leave days would have effected the married Couple and how overtime regulations and nightshift aswell as Holiday bonuses would have affected the outcomes. I feel the might have made a major difference
Oh of course! If you have to work a nightshift in Germany you get a nightshift bonus, for holidays sometimes up to 100% of your hourly wage. That's why I always worked on holidays when I was a call center agent...work one day get paid for 2! I don't remember the exact bonus but for nightshifts it was something like 50%. Also in Germany when you're on a 40h/week Job you can legally just work 8 hours overtime per week and your employer has to make sure to schedule your required 11 hours rest between shifts. Also mostly you can choose what happens with your worked overtime you can get it payed out on your monthly wage to get a little boost if needed or you can take the free time for a better work-life balance in a follow up month.. There are tons of worker protections and regulations here in Germany and also a lot of European countries...maybe with a more detailed scenario if you're really interested in I can give you a glimpse of what the difference would be here in Germany
@katha wenzel Beeing from Germany my self my interest is more in the US side. I heard that on Salary pay worker in US work far over 60 hours wich would change the balance extremely. Also I am not sure if there are Holidays and Nightshift Bonuses over there.
@@Samueras oh my bad! Sorry! And yes that are topics I really wanna see a deep dive video also! As if now there where really good situated persons and families within the calculations...but I'm also interested in those fields where it comes down to a more realistic approach like the average family...and yes I heard of your scenario also a lot of times and I wonder how this comparison would turn out!
I'm Finnish, not German, but I'm under the impression that our salaries should be somewhat similar on average and 75k€ sounds way too high for a manager of a restaurant. I think that pays like 40k here in Finland.
Yes! I agree her salary for Germany seems very inflated to start with. My mom just got a union contract on the second highest level and will be making just shy of 80k/year… and that’s in a big chemical company. And she has a PhD and around 20 years of experience. A manager for a small McDonnalds I cannot imagine making more than 40k…
Guys - there is no such thing as "small mcdonalds". General manager is basically the one running it for franchise owner. Ordering articles, hiring staff, scheduling, all included. As she said - you have 160kE profit per franchise, extremely low risk. If you have 10 franchises you need 9 managers, otherwise youll burn out. At 160k / year profit paying 70kE for a manager is ok. With typical OOP opening costs at 500kE / restaurant it still amounts to just under 20% yearly ROI. P.S. My good buddy was a manager of a well known restaurant in Dubrovnik Croatia for 4 years. He had 10kE / mo salary + bonuses. He quit and came to 2kE salary in IT. He was 29 at the time and said - he burned out and chose his health over the money.
Although it helps understanding salaries, it's not just about how many dollars you get paid and how much disposable income you are left with. You could even be in a scenario where each month you are left with (for example) $2000 in the US vs $1000 in Germany (converted from EUR), and yet those $1000 will go a lot further when milk, bread, eggs, supplements and clothing are all cheaper.
At the end of the day, the WORRIES you save in the German system alone, are enough bonus for me, not even considering the equivalent money I have to spend in the US. If I could I’d trade that money in an instant for the peace of mind knowing that ALL HEALTH, Unemployement, education, etc, are taken care by the system and I wouldn’t have to worry about it.
Thank you again for a very informative and well presented video!! Why Uni Freiburg or national television havn't already hired you is beyond me. Love the use of McDonalds as a kind of international standard unit. This actually happened before, albeit on a less complex level: Shortly after the introduction of the Euro the price of a BigMac was used (by the Bundesbankpräsident, I believe) to compare the new currency's buyingpower in different countries. And just a few weeks ago someone used Pizza Margarita for a similar purpose. Keep doing what you do, the world is sorely in need of good educational content like yours! Greetings from the Ruhr district!
These are really good videos and thank you for presenting them! Just as a factual note, you have slightly understated single worker Steve's federal income taxes. The right way is to take his income, subtract the standard deduction, $12,500, and use the tax table from the IRS instruction book for 2022. This will show that his federal income tax is actually an even $1,700. For Steve and Stephanie, your federal income tax calculation is spot on as far as it goes, but you would need to allow them $4K of child tax credit for their two children, making their federal income tax $13,744. If you ever decide to provide an edited version of this video, you could make these corrections. One other note: If Steve lived in MD, he would have to add in a local county tax rate of 2.25% and 3.2% depending on the county. I don't know if Colorado has a local county tax like this, but it is another factor to consider either when calculating his tax or when comparing American tax rates nationwide.
What about the scenario where the hourly worker is hit by a car on their way to work? Getting picked up by an ambulance, treated at the ER, xrays, fixing a broken bone, etc. Without insurance the american worker would be financially bankrupt.
on the way to work, it would be an Arbeits unfall in Germany, which means all medical treatments are at no cost ! Reha Klinik and 100 % pay when you can't work !
The US seems to be better if you are lucky and young. How many are unlucky and the financial effect would be interesting to know. If 5% of 25 year olds have a $20000 average bill then that is $1000 off the net income of 25 year olds plus the effects of possible job loss.
Happend to me, walking to work breaking a leg real bad on ice --- in germany this is a work accident every company needs a spezial healthinsurance (Berufsgenossenschaft) for workmishaps , normal healthinsurance pays to make or keep you healthy for as low a cost as possible , In my case wih broken leg would been this outside wire hold the bone together repair with long weeks laying in hospital and long rehab.... not the easy way but managable... But because on way to work is the same as at work for insurance reasons So the Beruffsgenossenschaft is paying the bill and this insurance pays for the way that gets you working fastest.... meaning they pay for more expensive operations , Startet rehab aftewr 4days in hospital and was back at work after 6 Weeks....
@@hansdiesl actually there is a comparable requirement for all US employers called Workers Compensation. Although I do not believe it would cover "on the way" incidents in the USA. (some states might - there is variation how its managed, its a Federal law but details are managed at state levels)
Es erstaunt mich immer wieder, dass wir Teil der Routine von jemandem geworden sind. Wirklich demütigend und wir sind so dankbar, dass Ihnen unsere Inhalte gefallen.
@@arnodobler1096 Google likes to translate "humbling" as "demütigend" - which is correct in general. But, as you mentioned, you wouldn't phrase it that way in german. I think "we feel honoured" would be closer to what a german would say.
@@peter_meyer geehrt fühlen ja stimmt. Voller Demut ist auch etwas altmodisch und unterwürfig vielleicht 🤔 deepL ist der bessere Übersetzer finde ich. Servus
I have watched and enjoyed all the videos you made so far in this series. Also recommended them to a few friends. Keep it up, you are doing excellent work!
Don‘t calculate taxes in Germany by Lohnsteuerkarte but the final tax declaration, which usually result in a significant repayment. Furthermore, insurance for health, unemployment and indemnity as well as pension contributions reduce taxes in Germany as well.
Another really solid piece. ❤. I would like to see the impact of cumulative debt on this picture. What is the average debt each character would need to service and what would that cost?
In germany you don't have to go in debt. If you don't go to university or go but don't need the bafög-loan (for cost of living etc.) which you have to pay back only partly and in very low rates, you earn from the first day of apprenticeship.
@@agnes1250 that’s very much at the root of my question; American life does seem to force debt. The cost of that debt is part of the equation to understand the true comparisons between the two countries.
Hello Ashton, happy Sunday. Interesting and well research topic as usual! At one point I'm not sure if you are 100% correct. When german workes has as 260 working days, there must be some Sundays and bank holidays be included where he should get a Sonn- und Feiertagszuschlag to his wage. But may be that's not the case at McD. I'm not Sure. Best regards Ralf
Hi there Ralf - Happy Sunday! I factor this in as part of a section in the video - it ends up working out to approx. 230 working days for the German employee. Interestingly, American workers are not entitlted to those days off and if the store is closed, they don't have to be paid.
@@Finndu @SirHeinzbond it's actually the opposite. Sonn- and Feiertagszuschlag is completely voluntary but between the hours if 11pm and 6am there has to be payed one. ArbZG paragraph 6(5) has the nighttime pay rules and ArbZG paragraph 10 has the sonn- and feiertag rules (no mandatory pay increase)
@@SirHeinzbond Due to the "Manteltarifvertrag für die Systemgastronomie" there is only Feiertagszuschlag for Feiertage which are on a Werktag, there is no Zuschalg for working on Sundays. A minimum 10 Sundays during a year must be off work.
Great job with all the number crunching at comparing things which are truly hard to compare. I also appreciate that you had a look at the rather lower end of the social spectrum, at least for the single worker.
In the end, it doesn't count if you are taxed 3/5 or 4/4 (with factor) during the year. All the income of the couple is put together and taxed. But this is only for married couples. If Max and Mila aren't married, they will be taxed by their own and pay more taxes.
Married couples are taxed as high in Germany as two singles who together earn as much as the couple and each of the two singles receives the same wage (couples have to take care of each other before the state does, so they are treated as one unity for tax purposes) . Because equal pay among couples is rare, there is in reality an advantage for married people. This is all the greater, the greater the difference between the two salaries.
The taxation system often confuses a lot of people, particularly impats :) the tax classes are only designed to come close to the final calculation of taxes in the tax returns, particularly the combination 3/5 shall account for the - in the days common - single earner household. it would be batter not to emphasize the classes to much. The only real non-temporary impact of the Steuerklassen is the calculation of unemployment benefits and Elterngeld. Therefore it is beneficial (subject someone has liquidity) to change the partner who will leave the job the longer time to class 3 pre/during pregnancy as the net-income of the person increases and this results in a higher base for the Elterngeld (of course the net-income of the other partner decreases until the difference is repaid with the tax return)
@@AFFoC What are you talking about? A third of parents of newborns aren't married. It's totally normal not to get married in Germany. Tax has to shift from benefitting married couples towards families.
Love your videos. Re: childcare - there are still many expenses for child care even if they go to school. School finish at 2 or 3 pm and after school is not free ( I used to pay 80$ weekly for before and after school). In addition to that there are so many days off school - $50 per day. Spring break, Christmas break and of course summer break cost parents nowadays about 220$ a week ( plus $60 registration fee).
Good morning Ashton. Not to forget, it would be very likely that the american families (of this and last week's video) had to pay a least $10k for the delivery of each of their children ..... Grüße aus der Südpfalz, auch an die Männer!!
how do manage to do such great research? I am starting a YT channel (not so similar), and while I could consider myself great in information research, it still comes nowhere close to this level.
"Over a half of our executive team started in our restaurants" doesn't say anything. It's like "Our CEO went to school". You have to know the percentage of people that rise in that profession.
When you work in shifts in germany you get an additional Bonus depending on the time you work. In generaly it is a +% you get tax and social cpntrobution free Bonus. How is that in the USA? Is every day the same or is there a Bonus für sunday, holiday or night work?
It depends greatly on the employer. Neither of us got any form of bonuses like you mention - but some employers will do "time and a half" pay for holiday work on Thanksgiving and Christmas. But if the store is normally open on Sundays (like Walmart, for example) this is normal pay and not subject to 1.5 times your normal rate.
@@TypeAshton surcharges for night shifts and Sunday work are quite common (sometime mandated) in Germany, because that can - to an extend - be granted free of tax and social contributions.
My last traditional hourly job paid shift differentials of 10% for evenings and 20% for night shifts. That one also paid 10 US holidays - in most cases our client was shut down. If you were required to work you got the holiday pay and the hours as well. (skilled work that back in 2005 paid about what McJobs pay today -- $15 base pay and I worked nights with differential) We were 24/7 operations support for a bank mailing center. This was a large well known US company that had a "employer managed union" format. So it ran sorta like a Union in practice, but there were no contract negotiations and they set rates. (in general all the bad parts of the union experience and non of the good parts - esp pay and benefits) I quit for a job that paid twice as much with no benefits at all (contract.) They had a decent self-pay medical, this was pre-AHA.
Nice to discover the Chanel. I'm a German who just Moved to the US/ New York City of all places. Man.. this is quite the ride. Good to see it the other way around.
I'm a bit confused. You're planning to look at the mid to low end of incomes and then each of the families has not only two earners, but one of them earning 100k+?
There are a number of factors to consider - and ultimately my decision to give one spouse a higher income was based on two things: 1) There is 15 years of experience, and I wanted to show that it WAS possible to "work your way up"... and 2) In the family calculation, although earning well above the minimum, this hourly income is still substantially below the median wage in both countries. By providing one spouse with a higher income, I am able to also provide context for a combined household income that is closer to the national median, which can be useful for other financial planning purposes/for other viewers of the video. Again - there are numerous ways to run the numbers, and it is impossible to provide all contexts in one video - but such is life.
@@TypeAshton The main problem I have with that is, that unfortunately these days there seems to be less mixed incomes than in the past. So when looking at a low income earner, there's a pretty high chance the partner is also below average.
I totaly agree, 100k+ ist Not Low or mid class income. This Made this Video Kind of boring, because of the simple income Like in the First Video. One spouse as Shift Manager and one spouse would be a much interesting comparisen. This May Not Show the possibility to Work your was Up, But it's reality for a Lot of people. And as a Side note. Every hast the "Chance" to Work your way Up, but its simply Not possible to do this at the Same time. So this Video ignored the reality for the Most people how Work in Low income Jobs. This ist Kind of pity thats Ashton Mist the Chance to Show that.
@@TypeAshton The Americans $146,000 income is more than twice the household median of around $69,000. Only 20% make more than $150,000 so once again you're comparing upper income households. It would be nice to see a comparison where the U.S. household makes $35,000 which is the 25th percentile, or $50,000 which is the 36% percentile. This would show how much lower income families struggle in the two countries and how well the two safety nets functions. Thank you for the hard work put into the three comparison videos and I look forward to more of your content.
@@HaldaneSmith The only issue with using a flat salary instead of a job title is that in most cases any comparable job in the USA pays more than the same job in Germany as far as base pay. 20 years ago I was a direct employee of an Austrian company in the USA. My salary was hourly but ended up at about $43K/yr. My exact job was a $35K salary position back in Austria. They are different countries, but they are more alike than they are different. Now if you want to use median numbers that would be fair. It has been consistent throughout this series that the US workers make more money up front, but are expected to work more hours and pay a lot more of the costs.
I can tell you right now in Vienna they hire for 1340 EUR after tax full time, which is not a decent living wage. Account in that they force everyone to work "part time", but are actually working over time. A convenient 2 hour "break" mid shift etc.
When I see these videos and comparisons, I always think for america: "Yeah so far so good. But what if you get sick and need constant care. Then everything changes". Just like you mentioned the gofundme website. Maybe make a comparison, what happens when actually a person gets cancer in germany vs a person in the US. Then we see the real differences.
You forgot one little thing. The majority of us (in DE and AT) are getting a 13th and a 14th salary. It's not a federal law, but it's part of the "Kollektiv-Vertrag" which is also covering minimum wages. We call it "Urlaubsgeld" and "Weihnachtsgeld" because it will usually be paid in June/July and December. In Austria the taxes for the 13th and 14th are very low. Plus, there is a family allowance in Austria. It goes from 120 EUR by the age of 0, up to 174 when the kid is 19 and it lasts as long as your kid is going to school or to the University. For every single Kid you have! BUT: The more Kids you have, the higher the monthly payment will be. 2 Kids: +7,50 (x2) 3 Kids: +18,40 (x3) 4 Kids: +28,00 (x4) up to 7 Kids: 55,00 (7). For 7 Kids you wil get approx. 1365 EUR per month!
For example....If you work on Sundays, the salary is doubled or at least much more higher. Same at Night. Extra or Double Salary on December/christmas (Weihnachtsgeld). Extra money for Holidays (Urlaubsgeld). I think you didnt add the average days of sickness to the pay of time, which ist paid in Germany. And you might get back some Tax at the end of year for your way to work 30 Cent/Kilometer, doesnt matter by car, bus, bicycle.. (Entfernungspauschale/Werbungskosten)
@@TypeAshton I think, Thomas related to something different. In Germany you usually get more money at night shifts or when working on Sundays / Holidays. Regarding McD, I found the following: Deutschland zahlt Mc Donalds an Feiertagen 200% des normalen Stundenlohns, nach 20 Uhr gibt es einen Zuschlag von 15%, Sa u. So zählen als normale Arbeitstage in der Systemgastronomie und werden in der Regel auch nie besser bezahlt.
Thank you for that interesting comparison. I will put that for my US-partner to watch, as I have this discussion ALL the time 🙂. And thank you for your work and accuracy in this video.
@@TypeAshton Yeah, ok, maybe not ......? it is already pretty obvious after watching the previous ones. Let's see where we end in next weeks video. Oh, and brilliant work, again!
Рік тому
I agree - what about a worker with minimum wages, three kid (two of them not in school) and the mother at home, not working. There are benefits for this famiilie which double his income ( Kindergeldzuschlag, Wohngeld). What would happen to such a family in the US?
I'd like to make this as a separate video in the future - looking at the differences in public programs to help low income families with children.... then we could start calculating in WIC (which helps low income mothers afford food), food stamps, etc. in contrast to Kindergeldzeschlag and Wohngeld.
You make the classic mistake. In Germany the healthcare contributions cover the children regardless & if the wife stopped working she'd still be covered, in America you have to cover each person separately
I'm confused - how is this mistakenly calculated in the video? The US family uses a "family medical" plan - which is substantially more than a single plan.
Adding a bit more extra data to this great video. A starting job in a Danish McDonal's pays €21.47 / $22.73. Working nights and weekends pays extra. Work schedule must be set for a minimum of four weeks ahead, changes must be announced a minimum two weeks (one week on special circumstances). Also there must be a minimum of 11 hours time off between shifts and shifts can not be longer than 13 hours. Any overtime is pays 50% for the first two hours, more than that pays a 100% extra. All overtime past midnight pays 100% extra. Also worth remembering is that working in Denmark also comes with a minimum of 5 weeks paid vacation, paid sick days (independent of vacation days), a years paid maternity leave per kid...
nice vid. For peace of mind you need, to remember everyone get at least ones or more really [hospital]sick in a lifetime ! so its not if I get sick but when!
The medical expenses you gave for the Colorado workers felt very best-case to me, and injury is somewhat inevitable. It probably would've been more representative of actual cost if you were to estimate their lifetime medical expenses and amortize that over their lifetimes to get an effective monthly cost that they would need to set aside to avoid future hardship.
I agree. Reducing the income with the costs of taxes and not taking into account how this will benefit doesn’t paint the full story. Would love to see a worst case scenario comparison. Getting fired, divorced, very sick, needing much medication, needing surgery, being in an accident, etc. I expect the differences will be stunning.
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Will Lingoda be useful if I need to become conversant in my field of electrical engineering?
Ashton, your videos are among the best researched, best written, and among the best produced and present I've seen anywhere on UA-cam, and I've seen a lot of videos by a lot of people. You're in a class of your own. Bravo for consistently producing such amazing and thought-provoking content!
""being able to accrue up to 5 days off after a year", damn that sound straight out of the advertising from Cyberpunk 2077, only missing the 20 year loyalty pledge (aka no working for anyone else) and an 80 hours work week
i works at mcdonalds for years and 2020 new hiries would get 12 € + tax free night sunday and special day which would be 25 % 50 % and 100 % if you works nornal every shift you would get 15-18 € and this is at every mcdonalds in germany !! i was a shift leader and would get only 14 € fix not at hourly rates. as a normaly mcjob you can make enough money to live a good live in germany becaus every year you get an raise of est. 0,50 €
I have been working since approx. 15 years on and off in various projects in the US and the condition people are working there are often unthinkable in Germany. I have seen people coming to work with food poisoning, chills/fever, broken right wrist, so the colleague had to operate keyboard with his left hand. And these were not low income jobs but well paid IT jobs. When I had my first project in the US in around 2010 I cancelled my 'dream' of working in the US permanently. Most Germans complain about things but don't really appreciate what they have cause they don't really know what's going on outside their own country.
THIS...
We appreciate these things. But at the same time in our point of view these things are basic human rights.
I still remember watching a TV show from USA, Tough jobs or dirty jobs. First episode I watched the presenter was making roof shingles at a timbre mill. Cutting thin planks to size standing in front of a massive 6ft diameter saw blade, no blade guards, no safety cage, no laser stop sensor, no pressure safety sensors, no supervision, no off switch, no PPE, no blade clutch. Just blew my mind, what do the employers think will happen if he, slips, falls, faints, collapses, the blade explodes, packing strap goes into the blade or it jams on debris?
@@glanciaeltro1271 "what do the employers think will happen if he, slips, falls, faints, collapses, the blade explodes, packing strap goes into the blade or it jams on debris?" Nothing.
Most are not even employed so their employer - another independent company - would have the liability. If something like this happens the lawyers glee and get much money in the ensuing process. Sometimes the worker wins and gets a million US$. The lawyer gets 5 million when he wins. And 4 million when he looses...
@@glanciaeltro1271 My family works in insurance. I was told of this guy who lost 3 digits on his hand. He was told by his employer and his worker's comp that they would not cover all 3 fingers. He had to choose which ones went in the trash and which he would keep. The guy was 19 and had a mental breakdown. The company told him he will keep his index, middle and part of his ring finger went into the trash. This is America. You don't even get to keep your body parts in the event of a sawblade incident. It would be socialism if you said otherwise. Even worse if you mentioned unions and God forbid safety regulations. You sound like a Marxist.
The mentioning of „6 weeks of paid sick leave“ in Germany was a bit incomplete: it‘s six weeks per illness. So if you are really unlucky and break a leg in January and then break your other leg in June, this would be two different illnesses and the counter starts anew for the second leg. If you need more than 6 weeks to recover, you will also still receiver money: 60% (?) of your normal income is paid by your health insurance.
which children 68%
Nope, sickpay from health insurance, which lasts for up to 72 weeks, is about 70%.
It's 70% of the regular gross income (but no taxes deducted), and maximum 90% of the net income. With children, the numbers are a bit higher. That's for the 72 weeks after the initial 6 weeks at full pay, so, for a total of 18 months.
It could even be the same leg, just not the same injury.
@@Thiesi yes exactly. You could break your leg just a couple of centimeters further up or down a week after the other break healed and it technically would be a new injury.
I noticed one big difference that was not mentioned when you loose your job. As I understood you will loose your healthplan the moment you loose your job in the US. This is not the case when you loose your job in Germany, the unemployment pay covers your health-insurrence.
And this goes also for your pension. That is also covered by the unemployment pay.
Correct!
That isn't really correct because it depends on the state. Most states in the US expanded Medicaid under the Affordable Care Act, so if you live in one of those states you can get Medicaid and not pay anything for your health insurance. If you live in a state that didn't expand Medicaid, then you probably won't qualify. However, if you replace that job with a low-earning job, you can get a government-subsidized health plan and if your earnings are low enough, you either don't pay anything or else you pay a fraction of the cost.
Another thing that is missing is the Hartz IV (now Bürgergeld) which covers all that plus rent even after you have been unemployed for over a year. Here in Germany, if you are homeless, it usually is by choice or not willing to accept the offers you get.
Yes, because the only other option in the US is to foot the whole bill in the marketplace. Effectively, every employee is a contractor in the US, but we don't actually get to sign contracts with an employer ensuring basic rights and severance unless you're a top level executive.
You can also continue to pay for the employer-sponsored insurance yourself under a plan called COBRA. We did this when my husband lost his job. It was cheaper to put the family on COBRA than to add them to my firm’s insurance, which isn’t subsidized. All of these are substantial considerations with any job change.
As a German with quite a few of international friends I had discussions about this topic again and again. Bring socialised here and security inclined, I mostly preferred our system over one were you are more 'free' were to put your income.
I did not become rich but also not destitutely poor and feel better knowing that health insurance is covered if I lose my job as well as for all the others around me. The system is far from perfect and needs reforms, but still....
Ganz richtig, es ist noch weit weg von prefekt, aber das zeigt dann auch auf welch hohem niveau wir dann von Verbesserungen reden. Während in den USA muss das erst mal überhaupt eingeführt werden. Deswegen ist trotz aller Mängel immer noch ein Leben in Deutschland bevorzugenswert. Aber klar ist auch, es muss immer noch massiv verbessert werden, und nur weil es wo anders schlechter geht, heißt es nicht, dass man mit den Brotkrumen sich dankbar abfinden muss!
One needs to remember a lot of government in the US functions at the state and local level. You’ll see huge variations in social benefits, minimum pay rates, taxes, and living costs between states. If one were to compare a state like Massachusetts to Germany as well as Mississippi vs Germany, the results would be startling different with one state being much closer to the overall benefits seen in Germany.
You're "free" to put your income in places, but not everyone has the time or money to pay a financial advisor to say yes put the money here or there.
@@KRYMauL Just eductate yourself and don't waste money on financial advisors. It's not that complicated. Go by the rule 'nobody between me and my money'.
@@rathbone8052 Like I said not everyone has the time or money to do that.
Those numbers are still very big! I live in Missouri and my husband worked a management position in a small restaurant for 3 years and never made over 11k a year.. But that wasn't corporate so he left for a corporate job with less pay for benefits and full hours. I started my own business and only made about 20k in profit my first two years but it's improving every month. Wild to see these numbers. Your last video opened my eyes to how deep in poverty we've been living so I decided I want to try to go to school in my 30s. Wish me luck!
Good decision! Good luck!
"benefits".......
11k a year? In a management position? That's missing a decimal...
What how can you live on 11k a year?
sounds like you married a loser
I like Ashton's academic approach to economic and social matters so much! We need more statements supported by empirical data and less abstract stuff like "nothing is better than free market" blah-blah.
Awe thank you so much. ❤️ I'm really glad you enjoy our content and approach style.
You mean a scientific approach - in contrast to the emotionally charged political debate? It shouldn't be as remarkable as it unfortunately is.
@@Warentester exactly.
The free market / capitalism is a very very powerful tool to improve economy and thus living standards. HOWEVER you always have to remember that improving the live of the people is the reason, so if you are in a situation where capitalism isn't working (anything with infrastructure), do not force it. A free market is only free if someone can enter the market and with reasonable investment start competing against existing companies. Meaning you must be able to get a return on your investment after at most 20 years for low risk or much earlier when high risk. So if you have a market that naturally trends towards a monopoly or a localized-monopoly/oligopoly then no one can enter the market and there is no real competition and thus it is not a free market. Capitalism doesn't work here.
@@_aullik So you mean healthcare, the Pension System and fulfilling basic needs like providing Housing, Food and employment to everyone at an affordable Price?
Since these areas all suffer greatly under the Market (not the same as Capitalism which is the Accumulation of Capital) and the need for profit and making money on the back of the disadvantaged and weak. Cause you can make more money if you put a price tag on basic needs or keep a shortage of them as fulfilling them would lower your baseline profit, while at the same time People die of starvation, just cause it's not profitable to feed them.
People are Homeless but there are a lot of empty houses right next to them they can not use because they do not own them.
For me the biggest thing is healthcare. What's the cost of let's say a herniated disk for a minimum wage earner in the US. Several MRI, surgery, medications, 2 months of rehabilitation? Can Steve pay for it? If he cannot what will he do? Because he wont work at McDonalds for sure. For Max there would be $0 cost and he gets 100% of his pay plus his job back at the end.
I suffered that in Austria in fall 21. I am well above minimum wage here so I have to do copay which minimum wage workers do not habe to shoulder. For two weeks in hospital, surgery, then 6 weeks of sick leave followed by 6 weeks of rehab at a rehab center (= 14 weeks all together) - my copay for everything was about 600.- Euros (basically the money I would have spent on food had I not been in hospital/rehab center). and, btw: Zero Euros - naught, niente, nada, rien - income loss for those 14 weeks of sick leave, of course.
"If he cannot what will he do?"
Easy. GoFundme and/or ask relatives/friends for help. In many areas of normal everyday life, the USA are not much different than MadMax...
Australian here . I had ruptured disc between L5 & S1 ,I had family private health insurance @ the time it cost @$5K per annum. The total out of pocket cost to me was $1200.00 AUD . I had 3 months off work fully paid and my employer’s return to work policy was I came back on restricted hours and the hours were increased over weekly reviews .
Cheers
My mom went through cancer treatment here in Germany and all together that cost her about 250-300€ for an entire year of different treatments and other things. You only pay up to 2% of your yearly income after all and I was 16 and still living at home so that also counted for her and she paid less because she was my only parent still alive and the only earner. They also calculated those 2% from her Krankengeld so it was less than it would have been in a normal year.
She was able to concentrate fully on recovery and still got I believe 85% or so of her monthly income. It's been a while I don't remember all the data it's really been over a decade now.
They also helped her with slow reintegration into her job and also still pay for all the small things she still needs to stay healthy like lymphatic drainage massages and more cosmetic things like the prosthetic for her right breast and bras you can put those in. They'll continue to pay for all of that until she dies and she will continue to only have to pay at most 2% in "co-pays" if you can call the 5-10€ that.
You don’t get it fixed and get addicted to pain killers. At least here in the USA. Side note I have 4 permanent injuries that would plague me a lot less if I got it taken care of but wasn’t able to in USA and now that I finally have a good health plan from employer it’s a pre existing condition so I cannot get anything fixed. Guess I’ll just be in really bad pain until I die.
As an empty nester couple over 60 when we arrived in Germany, we found that the cost of living to be slightly cheaper and much more rewarding and secure than our roughly equivalent American lifestyle, Peace of mind while living in Germany is intangible, until it isn't.
For example, I was diagnosed with lymphoma in 2019. If we had lived in the States, Frankly, if we were in America we'd have the awful decision between bankruptcy or my death. Instead, our American private health insurance was glad (and required by the German government) to pay ALL of my expenses in Germany without question, because they knew if we returned to the States for the same level of care I received in Germany, the cost for chemo, radiation, etc. would be 6 to 9 TIMES higher.
Thus, for us, living in Germany nearly certainly saved my life. We saw this with other American expats as well, and in some cases, with children, which is doubly tragic!
The problem with such calculations is: You can't measure happiness. Things like "public transport" or "social housing", which affect your daily life dramatically - especially if you have a low income - is simply part of the taxes. So you pay more taxes in germany, to get a better quality of life. I guess it is pretty hard to take all of this into consideration. You still did a great job, while avoiding such stuff!
Not to mention peace of mind and more paid time off (which was touched on in the video). She also did some comparisons in the original video that she didn't do here, such as housing and transportation costs.
To be honest she was talking about this in her other videos.
Re: "You can't measure happiness." Many social scientists would disagree with that premise. I recommend reading "The Spirit Level", where two British epidemiologists used their training to identify some clever ways of measuring happiness, and then went on to correlate that with disparities in income level. They looked at global data to compare countries, and looked at US data to compare states. The common finding was that the more wealth was concentrated in a society, the more one will see social discord and unrest. Interestingly, they made a good argument that high levels of social happiness are possible with wildly divergent taxation policies.
@@risingdough8078 The problem with these methods is, that they aren't actual measurements. They do statistical approximations where they mix up some abstract values(like well-being, quality of life, contentment, ...) and say "voilá, this is happiness!". But that's a problematic claim, because you simply just get these values. You could measure it, if you know and measure related neurotransmitters and if you could measure the related tolerances in the neurons of each person examined. That would be a pretty invasive measurement.
Happiness is a scale in some unknown reference frame. Most of the time we don't even know ourselves if we are happy or not. How would you measure that for big crowds - or even globally?
So if you say happiness is just having money then yes - you could measure this. But all you are measuring is how much money you have. If you say happiness is the combination of money and quality of life - you can measure that too. But you still just measure money and quality of life. All you are doing is "renaming" happiness.
So if you could measure it, we would totally have some SI-Unit for each person and the whole discussion would be pointless. We wouldn't say "i am very happy" but instead something like "i am at 17.4 happy points".
@@delqyrus2619 Agreed, there are no direct measures of individual happiness. Even metrics based on self-reporting fail. But to say that there are no objective measures of individual happiness means one can't at least get a sense of collective happiness seems shortsighted. There are plenty of proxies for collective happiness, or even collective unhappiness. The authors of The Spirit Level provide a lot of thoughtful insights on the subject. (And no, they never introduce any of their metrics with "Voila! This is happiness.")
3 things to mention: 1. Monthly work hpurs accordind to McDonalds in germany is 169 compared to 172 for a 40 hour workweek. 2. Entitlement of 5 days educational leave per year per person. 3. paid (at least to a certain degree) time off for a child up to 20 days per year IAW RVO (specific conditions have to be met). Furthermore "Kur", Reha, Education towards retirement and and the list goes on and on. I have tought german labor laws to american supervisors. After a class most of them just could not believe it.
My fellow Americans fool themselves that not having these security nets makes them “free”. When one is perpetually in debt bc they’re getting fleeced for things like education & healthcare, one isn’t very free.
all of those come at gigantic costs
@@jaehparrk the gigantic cost are mainly paid by the employer. If they would be so gigantic no company including McDo would be competitive on the market. Strangely they are and the pices at McDo in Germany are cheaper than in the US and not even talking about Germanys exports. Maybe there are paybacks beeing social?
Those US health insurance plans are scary! The main point of health insurance is to cover large expenses, not the occasional doctor's visit. The caps on these policies are so low it's almost not worth having insurance at all.
Yes we were SHOCKED when we were learning more about these "mini-healthcare plans" - apparently they are growing in popularity amongst the Big-Box stores and not just fast food.
yes they are really scary - you dont need much to get over the limits.
Even in germany you would be easy above the limits.
I broke my arm last year and the bills sum up to around 6000 Euros - just for 2 days of hospital including a surgery.
In the US it would be even more expensiv.
@@gonzo6450 you talk about private insurance.
Unfortunately, the main point of health insurance in the USA is to make profits for the insurance companies and their investors.
@@hansweith4947 you are right, but he only has to upfront that money and will get it back later on. And if you are with AOK or other public insurances, its only 10€ a day.
Childcare in Germany (in public institutions) is free of charge or the fees depend on the income of the parents. Also, I think you should have compared two poor families: Max works full time at McDonalds and Mila is a housewife with a cleaner job and makes $520 a month.
I actually like the fact that in Ashton's [edit: corrected name] example, Mila is making the bulk of the income. Even with kids, there is no need that the female partner has to give in on her career. My partner makes way more as I do, and in part, this is because we did not put her career on pause when we had our first child 24 years ago.
@@SwissPGO I agree on this aspect, so having the women earn more was totally fine for me. However, I agree that in comparison to the original video, it would have been a lot more interesting with keeping the family in a lower income range, maybe both shift managers or something like that
@@SwissPGO I agree on liking the fact that Ashley put Mila as the bread winner in the family. But as of a realistic representation of a German family, It´s more likely that Mila would have a part-time job on a low income level with something from minimum wage up to 12,50 EUR max. Sad but true.
@@SwissPGO Think of it this way: It doesn't matter which spouse earns more, the fact that one partner is earning significantly more than the other, which allows the family as a whole to have much higher wages, is not as useful as a comparison. What if Mila made 40K a year? She's still making more, but that significantly changes the income. Or, what if Stephanie was hourly instead of salary and therefore couldn't offer a family health insurance plan?
@@kathawenzel8033 Same in America.
Earning more and spending less on taxes - nice!
Having peace of mind and not to worry about losing everything if something halfway serious happens with your health - priceless.
I lived in Germany for 6 years. Most of the same people who worked at the local McDonalds when I left were the same people who worked there when I left. They get 5 weeks vacation, first year, they have universal healthcare, and they get a living wage
Don't even know how you can produce such great quality videos with data pretty much weekly is mind boggling.
Grew up dirt poor in Texas, worked in the back of Tex-Mex restaurants for 5 years after high school and yeah being paid min wage is just what life is for some people. Was really eye opening as teacher how the state dealt with covid and the Texas freeze, seeing the lower socioeconomic students and their families get shafted because no real social safety nets. After a long journey I'm teaching in Latvia planning to get Masters. Seeing what EU has to offer pretty much solidified my thoughts of never living in the US again.
Welcome to the EU :)
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Tell your friends and family at home! That's important, because "something" has to happen in the US before collapse. I don't want the US turn more right as it is and was. You may think "What? Democrats aren't considered right!" That's true, think about that as deeply as it can get!!
My daughter received a tuition free Masters in Biology in Germany and is currently in Medical School in Germany where the tuition is about a couple thousand Euros a year. Tuition or lack thereof varies from state to state in Germany, but it is saving her hundreds of thousands of dollars. But while the Masters program didn't require German since it was an international program taught in English, Medical School does require fluency in German, so speaking the language is required. German universities also limit the number of slots for international students so it is competitive and the competition is students from all over the world.
Her government health plan in Germany is about 150 Euros a month and Germans have no concept of what a copay, deductible or in-network are. No one is bankrupted because of a hospitalization in Germany. And it covers dental and vision.
But her student visa limits the amount of hours she can work, so to do this requires having funds saved to pay for expenses to live. Since sharing apartments is common for young single people there, cost of a place to live runs about $400-1000 a month depending on the location in Germany as places like Munich or Frankfurt can cost more than other areas. A non-shared apartment can cost 2 to 3 times the cost.
While they pay more in taxes, Europeans get a much higher quality of life, less stress, more societal support and are generally happier.
Tax is the price we pay for civilization.
My honest opinion.
@@gauloiseguy Yes definitely. People want good roads, good schools, clean streets and life saving affordable healthcare when they need it, but want it all for free. I'm so tired of people talking about "government stealing my money" as if their name is on those dollars. The amount of unrealistic expectations borders on delusion with a lot of people, at least in the US.
I'm loving this series. As someone who lives in KC who recently lost their 6 figure job and now gets $320/wk (the max amount in MO) in unemployment to support a family of 4, the stark contrast in earnings is spot on. [Not here for sympathy, thankfully we were smart with our money and should be ok for a bit. Just here to agree with what Ashton was saying.]
the 75k number or 6250/month also happens to be the very top end at which UI maxes out. The payout of unemployment is 2774/Month for a maximum of 12 months, which is not 67% of the 6250 - but 63% of the 4300€ that someone who makes 6250 with 2 kids in BW would make after tax - go up to a 6 figure salary, the 2774 stays put. MO seems like a low UI state by your account - California is higher - and during general downturns the 26 weeks of normal UI get expanded to up to 99weeks (germany ends at 52 weeks, no matter the economic condition) and in times like Corona, federal money can be added on - which does not happen in Germany. My furloughed brother in California was taking home significantly more than 2774 in Corona times
If not too private, aren't such dream salaries only available to highly skilled workers who are in demand -> it should be easy to find a job with a similar salary ?
@@janreichenbach265 quite the opposite actually. There are few jobs that demand a skill set that pays that high. I've been job hunting since August (bc I knew layoffs were likely), and I've only had two or three interviews. I'm not even looking to match or come close to my former salary. Most jobs want you to have experience, but they aren't willing to compensate for it.
@@amandanoel619 I wish you the best with your future job, hope it'll be at least 60k US$ a year for you.
@@janreichenbach265 thank you!
You forgot a very important aspect! TAX FREE additional pay for night shifts in germany! 25-30% tax free on top from 8pm - 6am
Does not seem so. When I work at night, I have SOME of those hours "steuerfrei". May payslip even says "...davon steuerfrei: XX EUR". The "davon" is the keyword. EDIT: Not "some of the hours" is not taxed, I mean a fraction of the "Nachtzuschlag" is taxed. E.g. (random, but realistic numbers) :
Nachtzuschlag: 60,00 EUR
davon steuerfrei: 28,60 EUR.
Means that I still pay taxes on the remaining 31,40EUR on my night hours.
Don't forget the full PTO ("Mutterschutzlohn") Mila received the 6 weeks before and 8 weeks after each child birth and the "Elternzeit" with up to 14 months (combined) "Elterngeld" Max and Mila could have applied for.
So Mila as the main breadwinner could have taken two months "Elternzeit" and Max the other 12 month to bond with the newborn and avoiding daycare costs.
Hi, great video! I love how there are so many things you include! Of course, there are so many options to calculate this, people will never be satisfied (for example, I would have taken hours away from Steve that he would not work if he got sick/went on holiday rather than adding them to Max). Really, this series of videos should be a book :)
The German public health system saved my life 20 years ago when it cured my cancer, at a cost that probably exceeded a million euros.
My comparable salary in the USA would have enabled me to buy private health "insurance" that would not have covered the diagnosis, let alone any treatment.
Thank you so much, Ashton, for your outstanding work in exposing the "American Dream" to be just that: a dream....because you must be asleep to believe in it.
I'm glad that you're doing well, and have not gone bankrupt!
it probably would tbh, 300 dollars a month, or free if you have a good job
Hi Ashton and Jonathan, first of all I'd like to thank you for your high quality videos which to me are entertaining and educational. As a German who works from Germany for an American company and has a lot of American co-workers I am highly interested into all the topics you bring up. It helps me a lot to understand the actual similarities and differences between both our countries beyond the common clichés. Honestly I sometimes learn something about my own country as well. 🙂 I might have an idea for a future video of yours (if you haven't already covered that and I missed it): In today's video when Jonathan talked about using your sponsor's app in a train I thought that is almost a lie 😉, because internet coverage is pretty bad in Germany. And that reminded me of a discussion I once had with my colleagues when the pandemic hit us and all of the sudden all kids needed to be home-schooled. The outcome of that discussion was that the home countries of all of my co-workers world wide including India seemed to be much better prepared to that scenario than we were here in Germany. Long story short: What I am aiming at is digitalization: Network coverage, availability of services offered by public administration, use of digital learning in school, etc. It might be interesting to compare Germany to other countries in this regard. Thanks.
This series is quickly becoming a "must watch" for anyone looking to better understand the differences between the US and Germany/EU.
You mentioned "peace of mind" that some of these social programs bring you which made me wonder if there are more "intangible" benefits either society offers?
Anyways can't wait for the next episode.
Its interesting - we just had a conversation last night with another American family about this - So many facets are interconnected. For example, we were discussing why the US doesn't seem to promote trade/technical jobs (in contrast to University degree positions) - and in addition to cultural norms, another big factor is just that there are greater income disparities in the US and less security from a job standpoint - unemployment, vacation, sick leave. etc. In a way, the current state of the US education system is also a product of the lack of social programs.
@@TypeAshton hum that is a very interesting point and one I had not considered but does seem logical I.e. to compensate for the lack of social programs (livable wage?) more people try to get the highest possible degree (and maybe even in a field they don't actually feel passionate about?)..
Which makes me wonder how is going to university presented in high school compared to trade schools etc (I know most 90's "comedy movies" where based in university (think revenge of the needs etc).
Germany and the EU can't be dealt with in the same pan. Germany, the Scandinavian and Dutch speaking countries are quite unique. The northern countries are relatively poorer in terms of assets but richer in terms of income. The absence of assets for most Germans is offset by the social security system. The main purpose of assets is securtiy in harsh times. Not all but a lot of it is covered by the state in terms of health, unemployment, education. You don't have to save for your kid's education. The same is not true for Eastern and Southern Europe. The differences inside Europe are much more pronounced than inside the united states. Latvia, Bulgaria, Greece, Portugal are still a worse places to live than Mississipi and Alabama. And it is not that easy to move from a poor to a wealthy country as languages are still a significant barrier. Moving to another language will in most cases drastically downgrade your job and the professional prospects of your children.
@@awijntje14 American colleges are a scam. "University" degrees in the states and the apostrophes are no typo, don't pay, even over a whole lifetime. Starting your life at minus 200.000 $ with 4 years of income lost will never be made up in your lifetime. With compound interest this would have translated to one and a half million before retirement at real value. Even if your parents pay, they could otherwise have inherited the amount. Especially if you study anything but science, engineering law or medicine to the doctor. Nobody pays a decent salary for English literature or social studies. Study plumbing not at college but at a professional school or learn to code on youtube. Even Biden recognised it with his loan forgiveness which is not a good thing because he distributes/funnels the money through the relatively affluent finally into the pockets of super rich universities running his progressive agenda instead of nationalising education. Paying 2k a year on a loan just for the college's football team is immoral Good education does not need that much money. The ETH Zurich or the EPFL Lausanne and even German universities produce superior results compared to the Ivy League and are free. Many successful American personalities have either not studied at all in the States (Jobs, Gates) or studied abroad. (Einstein, Tesla, Van Neumann and more or less all of the Manhattan project). The American economy has consitently depended on imported brain over the whole of last century and continue to do so. The tycoons of tomorrow will have studied in India and China.
The fact that money does not solve problems is not limited to education. Health care costs by far most in the states, with the lowest life expectance in the developed world. It is sad that Canada is moving towards the American way and not vice versa and it is even sadder that this happens with leftist politics.
If your health care etc are not tied to your employer it must make it easier to move between employers (I am from UK so that is my assumption). I assume that the employer would have to pay more towards the insurance if their employees were less healthy so maybe people with fewer medical conditions would find it easier to keep a job even if they are no better at it (even if that is against some discrimination laws).
It is good for everyone if the employee can work at the best job for them.
This channel and the quality of the information you share, PLUS the quality of how it is presented, is absolutely phenomenal. I'm with my jaw on the ground in awe of the time and effort you take to share this with us.
Germany is 100% in my plans. It'll take a couple years to get things in order, but thank you so much for making these in depth comparisons. Ready to work to get some peace of mind 💪🏼
Just one for the algorythm before watching.
Ashton, just keep it rolling that way. I see you are having fun obviously and its refreshing that your joy seems to be grounded in research and education. The quality of your presentation cant be better and you are doing that at home. Probably wont make you rich, but the wealth of honest education is priceless. Thank you.
Thank you so much, it really means a lot. ❤️❤️
I think any German/European that even thinks about moving to USA should watch your videos.
Even if the information is not 100% accurate, as there are always slight deviations based on circumstances and micro location (let's say 95%+-5% accuracy), it paints more than a clear picture of differences between Germany/Europe and USA.
Thank you!
P.S. Although it may be too much, are you thinking about making differences like these between various EU countries? There would definitely be an audience for that!
I'm afraid that by the time Ashley would have finished the analysis for the last EU country, the situation would have changed in some other countries already. As a bi-national, having worked in several countries, the situation becomes even more complex, if you consider your options for retirement.
@@SwissPGO Ashley? Ashton.
@@peter_meyer thanks for correcting me - I'm bad at names - yours is easy for me :-)
@@SwissPGO You're welcome
The short answer is that you should only ever consider moving to USA for job if you have a long education and already have a job offer. Any job with lots of people able to do is not worth doing in USA instead of somewhere else.
And once again, a great video!
I really enjoy your academically approach to the topic and your presentation of this. As you know both, the „system“ in the US and in Germany you present it in a way (probably) either US-Americans as well as Germans can understand.
Keep on with the great work, looking forward for the next video already 😊
Greetings from Freiburg
Thank you so much! These long-format videos always take a lot of planning and time, but reading comments like this make it worthwhile.
It's just American. No such thing as a 'US-American'
@@mindpilotthepilot9140 There is. Other example would be Canada, Mexico, Brazil, basically everything in South *America*
And they're talking about the USA, so the people there are US-Americans.
Very thorough comparison. It is always nice to see how you go into detail and still manage to keep things both precise and easy to follow.
However, I think you forgot "Kindererziehungsjahre" regarding "Rentenversicherung"; if one has kids born after 1992, there is a benefit for raising them, which is that this accounts for 3 more years of contributions to Rentenversicherung (The amount is as if in those years one would have earned the average income. For kids born until 1992 it is 2.5 years. The years are for both parents together.)
This is not only raising parents income in old age a bit, but helps them reach certain treshholds regarding the number of years worked.
Is it possible to work in a "tragic" moment for each character's calculations that would paint a more realistic picture? Something like a sports accident for the single characters (broken hip after skiing accident, surgery, 8 weeks sick leave) and what (financial) consequences this would have in the US and in Germany? And the same goes for the "older" couple: a chronic illness, which means monthly costs for medication and doctor visits, something like asthma and migraine for Stephanie and Mila and high blood pressure and diabetes for Max and Steve?
And for one of the children also a small accident, where he breaks his arm and one of the parents has to stay at home for a few weeks?
That would be interesting, for sure. It would make a difference also as to which hospital the skiier lands in, in Colorado. I've heard that patients sometimes ask to be transfered, or the insurance company will transfer a patient due to coverage.
Yes!
I think that could be quite interesting. In the future, one video I would like to also make is just looking from the perspective of a minimum wage single parent - just to get a good comparison on what kinds of social services are available to help support those living below the poverty line with kids in each respective country.
What you propose doesn't render a "more realistic picture", since none of the events is - from a stochastic perspective - likely to happen. The higher propability for an average person or family is that these factors will NOT influence the equation.
Which makes it a (scientifically) perfect idea NOT to take them into consideration, if you want to make a general statement, based on an average setting.
@@TypeAshton Um, no? This is not about poverty or low-income earners. I had the opportunity to go to the USA about 20 years ago and earn almost twice as much as I do here in Germany... but ultimately my decision NOT to go to the US was based on what WOULD happen if I got sick. It doesn't matter if you make a lot of money if you have to spend a lot of money to try to stay alive in case of a more serious illness or injury. And in the last 20 Years, I GOT sick (Asthma, High Blood pressue. I had to go to the hospital twice by ambulance because of injuries etc)
After all, you are not poor yourself, and if you lived in the US and your husband were to be struck by a truck, for example, the costs to both of you would certainly not be as easy to put away as they are here in Germany, even and especially if he were to lose his income because of the accident. Unless you pay a fortune for health insurances in the USA (of if you are lucky and your employer pays).
What I mean to say is: add to your calculations, which are about "who earns more or less where", scenarios that are true to life.... namely illness, accidents and the resulting costs. If an American earns $5000 more a year than a European, that's one thing. But if he, as a family man, is afraid to call an ambulance because he is financially strapped afterwards. just because his son broke his ankle while playing Basketball in the backyard, then that is a calculation that no longer works for a European.
Thank you, Ashton, for another well researched video. Again, it is so refreshing to see info with background sources cited, calculations included, rather than emotional and politicized outbursts.
What I've noticed is that while there may be a small number of such emotionally based comments under your videos, a significant number of intelligent and sourced replies seem to be the norm, rather than the exception. That should tell you something about the demographic of your target audience. Again, I'm impressed that you either filter the replies so carefully or, as I assume is more probably the case, you attract a more reasonable and mature (rather than childish) audience.
Now I am stoked for part 3 comparing the living costs for your single employees, and the family of four.
One thing I have noticed is that tax returns are not included in either calculation. Agreed, with the vast differences of taxation in both countries as well as state-to-state, it will be very difficult to even approach any kind of fair or reasonable comparison I do have hopes and trust in your abilities of research. Just food for thought. Maybe. 😃🤔
Thank you so much for all your videos. They’re well made and researched. My son is considering schooling in Germany or Belgium and my husband and I plan to move to Europe once he graduates from high school next year. Your videos are giving us a lot to consider!
I found you on the Dual ciz video and this came next in the feed. I have to say, the way you address, break down, and provide complete detailed analysis is one of the best I have seen in years. Even though it is 51 minutes, you made it go by so fast. I am sure it took way longer to develop this content. So Thank you so much.
Thank you so much!! Really glad you enjoyed the video.
The one thing that makes these comparisons even more complex is that the EUR to USD conversion rates are currently the lowest they've been. If you use the rates from 10 years ago, things look much better for the German families. While this tends to play into the cost of "luxuries" like electronic goods and to an extent fuels, it doesn't play so much into groceries, which I suspect is going to show up in your next video...
Yeah this has been fascinating for us to experience. Jonathan will celebrate his 10 year anniversary of moving to Germany in May, and since we go back and forth to the US quite frequently (and send money back and forth) its quite astonishing how much this exchange rate can affect cost of living.
@@TypeAshton What is your preferred method to send/change money back and forth?
Currently, we use Wise. (Formerly TransferWise)
The total amount not relevant anyways. It only matters what you can purchase for it. So you need to adjust for purchasing power.
Purchasing power is still messy. The cost of essentials like food and accommodation are generally driven by local forces. Fuel costs are driven by exchange rates and the global markets. The cost of things like electronics is often driven by the value of the dollar at a fixed point in time in the past. (Some companies are even just set the Dollar price equal to the Euro price)
To me, the main difference is that even if they earn just about the same, the peace of mind you get alongside your earning in Germany is priceless. And the German system ensures that young people, who tend to think themselves invincible are forced to plan for the future. Maybe you should also include an example of Max and Steven getting to 75 and what their financial situation would be then, after having experienced an assortment of minor and major illnesses, accidents and life adversities. Let's say Max had an MI at age 63 and Mila had breast cancer at 50.
So what? Let's make a video about every possible scenario? 😂
The early mention of a BigMac's price in Freiburg and Zürich should include a mention that both cities are in different countries with different currencies.
Very interesting analysis!
Yes, of course - but even adjusted for the exchange rate the cost is still double. Funny enough, we took our American co-workers to McDonalds near the Zurich Hauptbahnhof once... because they paid with American credit cards, the screen automatically showed the currency exchange rate... and they were FLOORED at how expensive it was.
@@TypeAshton they earn like x3 more in the switz
Switzerland is still not in the EU and has ALWAYS been crazy expensive as far as I can remember 😊
If, additionally, social security is measured in money,you will easely see the monetary differences between Europe/Germany and the US. Because..... "IT" matters!
AND, you did a great job explaining the whole topic in a professional way, AGAIN!
Thank you! ❤️
Another really great topic and video. I hope that you continue doing these good explanations. One note to your viewers is that this is about Germany, not the entire EU. Benefits and what/what level provided does vary a lot. The comparison between say France and Poland is pretty wide apart. Looking forward to next week.
Good point!
As an American looking to move to Germany to work, this is helpful to know. It is good to know that I would likely still have a similar take home pay even with the higher taxes and social contributions if I was payed around the same I am now.
And you have paid vacation (usually 5 to 6 weeks a year, minimum by law are 4 weeks), paid sick leave, parental leave and and and.
US Americans really need to see this all laid out like this after all the propaganda you've been fed about how most European systems work. It sounds more expensive at first glance but it really isn't for most people because we also have a lower cost of living usually and all these benefits an US American only gets if they are lucky and have a decent employer. Here it's just the law and it doesn't matter if a company wants to do it or not. We can also always get more but never less than the legal minimum. I for example get 30 days of paid vacation and of course all the other things like paid sick leave and so on.
@@DieAlteistwiederda yea but it would mean that 10 to 20 % of the highest income earners in the US would actually have to pay their fair share of taxes, and we wouldnt want that now, would we ?
A video on comparisons on mobile phones, property taxes, car insurance and cable TV and home internet would be interesting. I was shocked at the costs for those in the US.
Whow, a lot of heavy stuff to think about, but numbers are not everything. The personal life situation is an important thing. The time has beaten us with a lot of things, heavy illness for me and my wife, losing jobs and other bad things. Germany has a lot of mistakes too, but I'm living far happier here than I would if I'd be living in the US. We're still alive, even with our health problems. And for you Ashton: Chapeau for the hard work.
Great work Ashton! Like always, the approach you take to keep a constant and high quality is amazing!
I wonder if anyone ever tried to compare those numbers for people that suffer from extreme consequences. Ex-prisoners, immigrants (immigration via asylum), long-term/chronically I'll people, people with no degree, illiterate, deaf and/or mute, handicapped, etc.
I really don't know how this would affect the comparison.
I don't think it would change the number at global comparison but it still would be so interesting.
Mind blowing how much effort was put into researching this topic.
And an easy to follow presentation just makes this video another excellent contribution from the BFF.
Thank you for this. 👍
As always Ashton what a video and so much work, bravo!
I have so often read the argument that the people who do "low skills" jobs are all students and young professionals! Which I realized can't be true, just from the numbers that McD, Walmart & Co. employ!
I was so shocked when the US railroad workers went on strike for 7 sick days (wtf) and the government intervened. Then the Ohio disaster a short time later.
The working people just don't have a lobby, power in US Inc.
Here everyone would be in the streets, not homeless, but demonstrating: 🙋♂🙋♂🙋♂🙋♂🙋♂🙋♀🙋♀🙋♀🙋♀🙋🙋🙋🙋🪧🪧🪧🪧
Lobbying is REALLY one of the videos I look forward to making in the near future!
26:55 wish, it didn’t take 25 minutes to get to where the story actually begins
It is also important to mention, that the 6 weeks of sick leave in Germany are counted per illness. If you break your leg and are 6 weeks out and 2 month later you have some other broken bone or other illness you again have 6 weeks with 100% payment sick leave. Additionally if your illness takes longer you get a 70% payment continuation from the health insurance for up to another 72 weeks of sickness.
I watch your videos on and off and sometimes come back to them. Your presentation is always top notch. One can see all the care that goes into producing them.
And I guess they are also a form of self-therapy, considering how eye-opening many things must have been to yourself when you experienced them.
once again great work Ashton. I like that you two try to look beyond the obvious and therefore give a better comparison between the US and Germany. As with many things in life, things are more nuanced and complicated. I still would love to see a comparison for the low end of income (not to have a way above earner). It would be good to show all the social programs Germany has to help people making ends meet, e.g. Aufstockung, Wohngeld, etc.
Hut ab. Thank you for another impressively thorough video. I believe it's a good thing to have us viewers follow you through all of these numbers and calculations. Life, after all, is complicated. Thank you so much!
❤ Great work to make such an apples to pears comparison actually make sense.
I wish someone would make a similar comparison for switzerland... including the extreme case of living in canton Zug.
My first job was McDonald's. That was a long time ago. Your new video is even more eye opening than the original video. Thank you for sharing.
Glad you enjoyed it! Thanks for watching!
I like your videos alot, your channel among others are the reason i appreciate germany more than i did before. My wife got very sick and we are highly dependend on the "pflegegeld" which in america would probably made me needing a gofundme. Alone her meidactions of fentanyl and morphine among others probably very expensive medication in america... Cant even imagine.
Maybe it would be nice to see a version of a family where someone infact does get quite sick and calculate that, because i think thats where people will see a huge difference. Atm i am full time caring for my wife, partially working from home (when i have time for it) My wife needs constant medical attention, preparing artificial food etc. Couldn't even imagine having that in america.
Not taking into account how often i had to call the amubualnce bringing her into the ER several times a year. Alone in a year (about 5 years ago) my wife got flewn to the hospital with a helicopter after an car accident (which made her that sick), had atleast 15 emergency vehicle transports into hospital, all in one year. In total that number is alot higher. To be fair, me on the other hand i dont have much medical issues. And i get it maybe we are the minority, but people get very sick and i am happy we live in germany so we can get throught this crisis without having to worry too much about financial issues.
In anyway i am very looking forward for part 2
Gute Besserung für deine Frau!
@@arnodobler1096 Danke dir, aber da ist nicht mehr viel zu machen. Wir versuchen es ihr zumindest so angenehm wie möglich zu machen.
@@mJrA83 Tut mir leid 😢
Never understood why we even need a minimum wage for new workers while the wage hardly covers the minimum lifestyle? Scare them about their future?
In Danmark the minimum wage for a mcdonald worker is 22$ from the først Day of work and 5 weeks of paid holiday. 😊
One thought I had is about part-time. I've heard that big chains in the US often limit employment to part time. "we can't offer full time, but we can give you almost full time hours" to limit benefits etc. And since what constitutes as full time is up to the company to decide/define that seems very sketchy and very exploitable.
I would expect that low wage employment such as at McD or say Wallmart would see a lot of that type of behavior. What would the effect be of working say 2 hours less than full-time in this scenario. What would the difference between USA and Germany be then?
But I guess that might be to much of a side track/deep dive to what is already a quite long and in depth video.
In most parts of Europe and UK part time workers have to be treated the same pro rata, ie the hourly rate can't be lower for part time workers all benefits must be the same so if someone working 40 hors per week gets 30 days holiday someone working 20 hours gets 15 days, if someone works 5 x 8 hours days they get 30 8 hour days annual leave if someone works 5 x 5 hours days they get 30 5 hour days annual leave, etc etc
As always, I watched your presentation with great interest. You have become a regular part of my Sunday routine - thank you for that.
However, I would like to talk about the special features of sick pay in Germany.
1. in case of illness the employer pays 100% of the last salary (he gets a part back from the health insurance).
2. after 6 weeks you get either 60 or 67% from the health insurance - as you said depending on whether you have children or not.
This sick pay then-for one illness - max 78 weeks.
:That means in Germany you get a total of 84 weeks for an illness (6 weeks 100% and 78 weeks 60 or 67%).
Special feature : If you get the 60/67% you don't have to pay taxes. This means that at 67% you almost get your last salary.
If you are ill with different diseases, you get the maximum 6 weeks 100% several times.
If you can no longer work in your old job, you can retrain or receive a partial or full pension from the pension fund after 78 weeks
Grest Video as usual, but I was missing 2 things. I would have been interested in how paid leave days would have effected the married Couple and how overtime regulations and nightshift aswell as Holiday bonuses would have affected the outcomes. I feel the might have made a major difference
Oh of course! If you have to work a nightshift in Germany you get a nightshift bonus, for holidays sometimes up to 100% of your hourly wage. That's why I always worked on holidays when I was a call center agent...work one day get paid for 2! I don't remember the exact bonus but for nightshifts it was something like 50%. Also in Germany when you're on a 40h/week Job you can legally just work 8 hours overtime per week and your employer has to make sure to schedule your required 11 hours rest between shifts. Also mostly you can choose what happens with your worked overtime you can get it payed out on your monthly wage to get a little boost if needed or you can take the free time for a better work-life balance in a follow up month..
There are tons of worker protections and regulations here in Germany and also a lot of European countries...maybe with a more detailed scenario if you're really interested in I can give you a glimpse of what the difference would be here in Germany
@katha wenzel Beeing from Germany my self my interest is more in the US side. I heard that on Salary pay worker in US work far over 60 hours wich would change the balance extremely. Also I am not sure if there are Holidays and Nightshift Bonuses over there.
@@Samueras oh my bad! Sorry! And yes that are topics I really wanna see a deep dive video also! As if now there where really good situated persons and families within the calculations...but I'm also interested in those fields where it comes down to a more realistic approach like the average family...and yes I heard of your scenario also a lot of times and I wonder how this comparison would turn out!
Maybe a Video about the difference in Workerlaws. And how they effect your Time off and relative Pay?
I worked in McDonald's in London, and it was a lot fun.
I'm Finnish, not German, but I'm under the impression that our salaries should be somewhat similar on average and 75k€ sounds way too high for a manager of a restaurant. I think that pays like 40k here in Finland.
Yes! I agree her salary for Germany seems very inflated to start with. My mom just got a union contract on the second highest level and will be making just shy of 80k/year… and that’s in a big chemical company. And she has a PhD and around 20 years of experience. A manager for a small McDonnalds I cannot imagine making more than 40k…
Guys - there is no such thing as "small mcdonalds". General manager is basically the one running it for franchise owner. Ordering articles, hiring staff, scheduling, all included. As she said - you have 160kE profit per franchise, extremely low risk. If you have 10 franchises you need 9 managers, otherwise youll burn out. At 160k / year profit paying 70kE for a manager is ok. With typical OOP opening costs at 500kE / restaurant it still amounts to just under 20% yearly ROI.
P.S. My good buddy was a manager of a well known restaurant in Dubrovnik Croatia for 4 years. He had 10kE / mo salary + bonuses. He quit and came to 2kE salary in IT. He was 29 at the time and said - he burned out and chose his health over the money.
Although it helps understanding salaries, it's not just about how many dollars you get paid and how much disposable income you are left with.
You could even be in a scenario where each month you are left with (for example) $2000 in the US vs $1000 in Germany (converted from EUR), and yet those $1000 will go a lot further when milk, bread, eggs, supplements and clothing are all cheaper.
At the end of the day, the WORRIES you save in the German system alone, are enough bonus for me, not even considering the equivalent money I have to spend in the US. If I could I’d trade that money in an instant for the peace of mind knowing that ALL HEALTH, Unemployement, education, etc, are taken care by the system and I wouldn’t have to worry about it.
Thank you again for a very informative and well presented video!! Why Uni Freiburg or national television havn't already hired you is beyond me.
Love the use of McDonalds as a kind of international standard unit. This actually happened before, albeit on a less complex level: Shortly after the introduction of the Euro the price of a BigMac was used (by the Bundesbankpräsident, I believe) to compare the new currency's buyingpower in different countries. And just a few weeks ago someone used Pizza Margarita for a similar purpose.
Keep doing what you do, the world is sorely in need of good educational content like yours!
Greetings from the Ruhr district!
As always a great presentation and as neutral as possible. Thanks
Glad you enjoyed it!
Yeah, sure, Stephanie making 110k p.a. stays with Steve making 36k? Not in that universe... ;)
18:08 German city with most public holidays: Augsburg with 14 public holidays 🙂
Amazing!
The island of Reichenau with its villages, in Lake Constance, also has 2 holidays more than the rest of Baden-Württemberg. Work and school holidays.
These are really good videos and thank you for presenting them! Just as a factual note, you have slightly understated single worker Steve's federal income taxes. The right way is to take his income, subtract the standard deduction, $12,500, and use the tax table from the IRS instruction book for 2022. This will show that his federal income tax is actually an even $1,700. For Steve and Stephanie, your federal income tax calculation is spot on as far as it goes, but you would need to allow them $4K of child tax credit for their two children, making their federal income tax $13,744. If you ever decide to provide an edited version of this video, you could make these corrections. One other note: If Steve lived in MD, he would have to add in a local county tax rate of 2.25% and 3.2% depending on the county. I don't know if Colorado has a local county tax like this, but it is another factor to consider either when calculating his tax or when comparing American tax rates nationwide.
What about the scenario where the hourly worker is hit by a car on their way to work? Getting picked up by an ambulance, treated at the ER, xrays, fixing a broken bone, etc. Without insurance the american worker would be financially bankrupt.
on the way to work, it would be an Arbeits unfall in Germany, which means all medical treatments are at no cost !
Reha Klinik and 100 % pay when you can't work !
The US seems to be better if you are lucky and young. How many are unlucky and the financial effect would be interesting to know. If 5% of 25 year olds have a $20000 average bill then that is $1000 off the net income of 25 year olds plus the effects of possible job loss.
Happend to me, walking to work breaking a leg real bad on ice --- in germany this is a work accident every company needs a spezial healthinsurance (Berufsgenossenschaft) for workmishaps , normal healthinsurance pays to make or keep you healthy for as low a cost as possible , In my case wih broken leg would been this outside wire hold the bone together repair with long weeks laying in hospital and long rehab.... not the easy way but managable... But because on way to work is the same as at work for insurance reasons So the Beruffsgenossenschaft is paying the bill and this insurance pays for the way that gets you working fastest.... meaning they pay for more expensive operations , Startet rehab aftewr 4days in hospital and was back at work after 6 Weeks....
@@hansdiesl actually there is a comparable requirement for all US employers called Workers Compensation. Although I do not believe it would cover "on the way" incidents in the USA. (some states might - there is variation how its managed, its a Federal law but details are managed at state levels)
Here we go again....and its Sunday again,obviously;) thanks for another wonderful in-depth video
Glad you enjoyed it!
Es wird langsam meine Sontag morgen. Kaffe und die Schwarzwald Familie :)
Again, another good video. Thank you
Es erstaunt mich immer wieder, dass wir Teil der Routine von jemandem geworden sind. Wirklich demütigend und wir sind so dankbar, dass Ihnen unsere Inhalte gefallen.
@@TypeAshton Ashton, nicht demütigend (humiliating)😉, eher: demutsvoll oder erfüllt uns voller Demut
@@arnodobler1096 Google likes to translate "humbling" as "demütigend" - which is correct in general. But, as you mentioned, you wouldn't phrase it that way in german. I think "we feel honoured" would be closer to what a german would say.
@@peter_meyer geehrt fühlen ja stimmt. Voller Demut ist auch etwas altmodisch und unterwürfig vielleicht 🤔
deepL ist der bessere Übersetzer finde ich.
Servus
@@arnodobler1096 Psssst, du kannst doch auf einer Google Plattform nicht die Konkurrenz empfehlen....
I have watched and enjoyed all the videos you made so far in this series. Also recommended them to a few friends. Keep it up, you are doing excellent work!
Thank you so, so much!
Thank you Ashton, US sunday school also for us germans, i love it, i feel so intelligent always 🧐😉
Really glad you enjoyed it. Thanks so much. ❤️
Don‘t calculate taxes in Germany by Lohnsteuerkarte but the final tax declaration, which usually result in a significant repayment.
Furthermore, insurance for health, unemployment and indemnity as well as pension contributions reduce taxes in Germany as well.
Lohnsteuerkarte no longer exist. Your employer receives your tax date via the Elstam thingie online from the tax authority.
Another really solid piece. ❤. I would like to see the impact of cumulative debt on this picture. What is the average debt each character would need to service and what would that cost?
In germany you don't have to go in debt. If you don't go to university or go but don't need the bafög-loan (for cost of living etc.) which you have to pay back only partly and in very low rates, you earn from the first day of apprenticeship.
@@agnes1250 that’s very much at the root of my question; American life does seem to force debt. The cost of that debt is part of the equation to understand the true comparisons between the two countries.
And conversely, the impact of hard assets like homeownership, which is more common here in the US.
Thank you for a series of interesting videos. As a norwegian, it is actually interesting with the insights into both countries.
Hello Ashton,
happy Sunday.
Interesting and well research topic as usual! At one point I'm not sure if you are 100% correct.
When german workes has as 260 working days, there must be some Sundays and bank holidays be included where he should get a Sonn- und Feiertagszuschlag to his wage. But may be that's not the case at McD. I'm not Sure. Best regards Ralf
Hi there Ralf - Happy Sunday! I factor this in as part of a section in the video - it ends up working out to approx. 230 working days for the German employee. Interestingly, American workers are not entitlted to those days off and if the store is closed, they don't have to be paid.
Hi Ralf i am totally sure Sonn- und Feiertagszuschlag is Mandatory for every Job in Germany that happens on Sonn- oder Feiertags....
@@SirHeinzbond that seems to be correct. But night shift Bonus is Not. It should be "angemessen"
@@Finndu @SirHeinzbond it's actually the opposite. Sonn- and Feiertagszuschlag is completely voluntary but between the hours if 11pm and 6am there has to be payed one. ArbZG paragraph 6(5) has the nighttime pay rules and ArbZG paragraph 10 has the sonn- and feiertag rules (no mandatory pay increase)
@@SirHeinzbond Due to the "Manteltarifvertrag für die Systemgastronomie" there is only Feiertagszuschlag for Feiertage which are on a Werktag, there is no Zuschalg for working on Sundays. A minimum 10 Sundays during a year must be off work.
Great job with all the number crunching at comparing things which are truly hard to compare. I also appreciate that you had a look at the rather lower end of the social spectrum, at least for the single worker.
In the end, it doesn't count if you are taxed 3/5 or 4/4 (with factor) during the year. All the income of the couple is put together and taxed. But this is only for married couples. If Max and Mila aren't married, they will be taxed by their own and pay more taxes.
Married couples are taxed as high in Germany as two singles who together earn as much as the couple and each of the two singles receives the same wage (couples have to take care of each other before the state does, so they are treated as one unity for tax purposes) . Because equal pay among couples is rare, there is in reality an advantage for married people. This is all the greater, the greater the difference between the two salaries.
If you have two kids together but still aren't married, you're the problem, not your taxes.
The taxation system often confuses a lot of people, particularly impats :) the tax classes are only designed to come close to the final calculation of taxes in the tax returns, particularly the combination 3/5 shall account for the - in the days common - single earner household. it would be batter not to emphasize the classes to much. The only real non-temporary impact of the Steuerklassen is the calculation of unemployment benefits and Elterngeld. Therefore it is beneficial (subject someone has liquidity) to change the partner who will leave the job the longer time to class 3 pre/during pregnancy as the net-income of the person increases and this results in a higher base for the Elterngeld (of course the net-income of the other partner decreases until the difference is repaid with the tax return)
@@AFFoC What are you talking about? A third of parents of newborns aren't married. It's totally normal not to get married in Germany. Tax has to shift from benefitting married couples towards families.
@@juliaclaire42 A bandwagon fallacy won't make it any less pathetic.
Love your videos. Re: childcare - there are still many expenses for child care even if they go to school. School finish at 2 or 3 pm and after school is not free ( I used to pay 80$ weekly for before and after school). In addition to that there are so many days off school - $50 per day. Spring break, Christmas break and of course summer break cost parents nowadays about 220$ a week ( plus $60 registration fee).
Good morning Ashton. Not to forget, it would be very likely that the american families (of this and last week's video) had to pay a least $10k for the delivery of each of their children .....
Grüße aus der Südpfalz, auch an die Männer!!
Such a well done and informative video. Great production value. Thank you so much for all the hard work you put into it. New sub here for sure.
how do manage to do such great research? I am starting a YT channel (not so similar), and while I could consider myself great in information research, it still comes nowhere close to this level.
"Over a half of our executive team started in our restaurants" doesn't say anything. It's like "Our CEO went to school". You have to know the percentage of people that rise in that profession.
When you work in shifts in germany you get an additional Bonus depending on the time you work. In generaly it is a +% you get tax and social cpntrobution free Bonus. How is that in the USA? Is every day the same or is there a Bonus für sunday, holiday or night work?
It depends greatly on the employer. Neither of us got any form of bonuses like you mention - but some employers will do "time and a half" pay for holiday work on Thanksgiving and Christmas. But if the store is normally open on Sundays (like Walmart, for example) this is normal pay and not subject to 1.5 times your normal rate.
@@TypeAshton surcharges for night shifts and Sunday work are quite common (sometime mandated) in Germany, because that can - to an extend - be granted free of tax and social contributions.
My last traditional hourly job paid shift differentials of 10% for evenings and 20% for night shifts. That one also paid 10 US holidays - in most cases our client was shut down. If you were required to work you got the holiday pay and the hours as well. (skilled work that back in 2005 paid about what McJobs pay today -- $15 base pay and I worked nights with differential)
We were 24/7 operations support for a bank mailing center. This was a large well known US company that had a "employer managed union" format. So it ran sorta like a Union in practice, but there were no contract negotiations and they set rates. (in general all the bad parts of the union experience and non of the good parts - esp pay and benefits)
I quit for a job that paid twice as much with no benefits at all (contract.) They had a decent self-pay medical, this was pre-AHA.
Nice to discover the Chanel. I'm a German who just Moved to the US/ New York City of all places. Man.. this is quite the ride. Good to see it the other way around.
I'm a bit confused. You're planning to look at the mid to low end of incomes and then each of the families has not only two earners, but one of them earning 100k+?
There are a number of factors to consider - and ultimately my decision to give one spouse a higher income was based on two things: 1) There is 15 years of experience, and I wanted to show that it WAS possible to "work your way up"... and 2) In the family calculation, although earning well above the minimum, this hourly income is still substantially below the median wage in both countries. By providing one spouse with a higher income, I am able to also provide context for a combined household income that is closer to the national median, which can be useful for other financial planning purposes/for other viewers of the video.
Again - there are numerous ways to run the numbers, and it is impossible to provide all contexts in one video - but such is life.
@@TypeAshton The main problem I have with that is, that unfortunately these days there seems to be less mixed incomes than in the past. So when looking at a low income earner, there's a pretty high chance the partner is also below average.
I totaly agree, 100k+ ist Not Low or mid class income. This Made this Video Kind of boring, because of the simple income Like in the First Video. One spouse as Shift Manager and one spouse would be a much interesting comparisen. This May Not Show the possibility to Work your was Up, But it's reality for a Lot of people. And as a Side note. Every hast the "Chance" to Work your way Up, but its simply Not possible to do this at the Same time. So this Video ignored the reality for the Most people how Work in Low income Jobs. This ist Kind of pity thats Ashton Mist the Chance to Show that.
@@TypeAshton The Americans $146,000 income is more than twice the household median of around $69,000. Only 20% make more than $150,000 so once again you're comparing upper income households. It would be nice to see a comparison where the U.S. household makes $35,000 which is the 25th percentile, or $50,000 which is the 36% percentile. This would show how much lower income families struggle in the two countries and how well the two safety nets functions.
Thank you for the hard work put into the three comparison videos and I look forward to more of your content.
@@HaldaneSmith The only issue with using a flat salary instead of a job title is that in most cases any comparable job in the USA pays more than the same job in Germany as far as base pay. 20 years ago I was a direct employee of an Austrian company in the USA. My salary was hourly but ended up at about $43K/yr. My exact job was a $35K salary position back in Austria. They are different countries, but they are more alike than they are different.
Now if you want to use median numbers that would be fair. It has been consistent throughout this series that the US workers make more money up front, but are expected to work more hours and pay a lot more of the costs.
I can tell you right now in Vienna they hire for 1340 EUR after tax full time, which is not a decent living wage. Account in that they force everyone to work "part time", but are actually working over time. A convenient 2 hour "break" mid shift etc.
When I see these videos and comparisons, I always think for america: "Yeah so far so good. But what if you get sick and need constant care. Then everything changes". Just like you mentioned the gofundme website.
Maybe make a comparison, what happens when actually a person gets cancer in germany vs a person in the US.
Then we see the real differences.
You forgot one little thing. The majority of us (in DE and AT) are getting a 13th and a 14th salary. It's not a federal law, but it's part of the "Kollektiv-Vertrag" which is also covering minimum wages.
We call it "Urlaubsgeld" and "Weihnachtsgeld" because it will usually be paid in June/July and December. In Austria the taxes for the 13th and 14th are very low. Plus, there is a family allowance in Austria. It goes from 120 EUR by the age of 0, up to 174 when the kid is 19 and it lasts as long as your kid is going to school or to the University. For every single Kid you have!
BUT: The more Kids you have, the higher the monthly payment will be. 2 Kids: +7,50 (x2) 3 Kids: +18,40 (x3) 4 Kids: +28,00 (x4) up to 7 Kids: 55,00 (7). For 7 Kids you wil get approx. 1365 EUR per month!
For example....If you work on Sundays, the salary is doubled or at least much more higher. Same at Night. Extra or Double Salary on December/christmas (Weihnachtsgeld). Extra money for Holidays (Urlaubsgeld). I think you didnt add the average days of sickness to the pay of time, which ist paid in Germany. And you might get back some Tax at the end of year for your way to work 30 Cent/Kilometer, doesnt matter by car, bus, bicycle.. (Entfernungspauschale/Werbungskosten)
This is in a separate section (section 4 or 5 I think?) It ends up averaging to only 230 working days for the German employee.
@@TypeAshton I think, Thomas related to something different. In Germany you usually get more money at night shifts or when working on Sundays / Holidays.
Regarding McD, I found the following:
Deutschland zahlt Mc Donalds an Feiertagen 200% des normalen Stundenlohns, nach 20 Uhr gibt es einen Zuschlag von 15%, Sa u. So zählen als normale Arbeitstage in der Systemgastronomie und werden in der Regel auch nie besser bezahlt.
Thank you for that interesting comparison. I will put that for my US-partner to watch, as I have this discussion ALL the time 🙂. And thank you for your work and accuracy in this video.
Here we go again! More data! :D
YES! woo! 😆
yes after 20 years at a mcdonalds you can move up to mowing lawns
Hmmmmm, Ashton, i think you should do another video......considering Max & Mila and Steve & Stephanie both earning low wages.
😉😉😉😉
@@TypeAshton Yeah, ok, maybe not ......? it is already pretty obvious after watching the previous ones.
Let's see where we end in next weeks video.
Oh, and brilliant work, again!
I agree - what about a worker with minimum wages, three kid (two of them not in school) and the mother at home, not working. There are benefits for this famiilie which double his income ( Kindergeldzuschlag, Wohngeld). What would happen to such a family in the US?
I'd like to make this as a separate video in the future - looking at the differences in public programs to help low income families with children.... then we could start calculating in WIC (which helps low income mothers afford food), food stamps, etc. in contrast to Kindergeldzeschlag and Wohngeld.
It was literally made for heads of households though
You make the classic mistake. In Germany the healthcare contributions cover the children regardless & if the wife stopped working she'd still be covered, in America you have to cover each person separately
Correct. Even if you are long-term (forever) unemployed, the government will pay your healthcare insurance 100%.
I'm confused - how is this mistakenly calculated in the video? The US family uses a "family medical" plan - which is substantially more than a single plan.
Adding a bit more extra data to this great video.
A starting job in a Danish McDonal's pays €21.47 / $22.73. Working nights and weekends pays extra. Work schedule must be set for a minimum of four weeks ahead, changes must be announced a minimum two weeks (one week on special circumstances). Also there must be a minimum of 11 hours time off between shifts and shifts can not be longer than 13 hours.
Any overtime is pays 50% for the first two hours, more than that pays a 100% extra. All overtime past midnight pays 100% extra.
Also worth remembering is that working in Denmark also comes with a minimum of 5 weeks paid vacation, paid sick days (independent of vacation days), a years paid maternity leave per kid...
nice vid. For peace of mind you need, to remember everyone get at least ones or more really [hospital]sick in a lifetime ! so its not if I get sick but when!
Very true.
Wow, what a huge amount of research and work you did there, impressive!
The medical expenses you gave for the Colorado workers felt very best-case to me, and injury is somewhat inevitable. It probably would've been more representative of actual cost if you were to estimate their lifetime medical expenses and amortize that over their lifetimes to get an effective monthly cost that they would need to set aside to avoid future hardship.
I agree. Reducing the income with the costs of taxes and not taking into account how this will benefit doesn’t paint the full story. Would love to see a worst case scenario comparison. Getting fired, divorced, very sick, needing much medication, needing surgery, being in an accident, etc. I expect the differences will be stunning.
Don't forget the cost of owning a car vs public transit