I watched Eric’s video. I knew from that the CNC’d heads were lacking tremendously. Check it out here. ua-cam.com/video/ti4RZOQrMvk/v-deo.htmlsi=cpiQ3Y85-Iy6nc2_
15 year's ago when I was working on Toyota head we used the New-Way cutter's, I thought they worked really well, thanks for sharing, all the best to you and your loved ones
Great video!! Why no unshroud the chambers. The time to it is when its in front of you . Remember david vizard says pretty is not important but shape is!
Thanks brother. I am at a place in life where “time is money”. These are my own heads, and the longer I spend on them, it actually increases the amount that I paid for them. Basically taking away from customer jobs and losing me money, that I could be saving for a nicer set of heads, or Kids Christmas gifts 🎅🏼
I saw that. He was plunging them into the bowl to help smooth out the port work from the carbides. I liked the hard edge on the discs. It helped me kind of pinpoint the raised edge. Then I could switch to one that was worn on the edges to transition with.
Nice work - great tip from Andy. Considering a set of stealths for my 406, or a set of performance world heads - actually cheaper with living north of the border. Be interesting to see how they compare to your worked Eddies.
Thanks for posting this idea. I have to work on a set of heads to clean them up and contacting the seat would be awful. Here is an idea for a possibly better seat protector in terms of longevity. I haven't made this yet so I do not know what pitfalls I will encounter. Using a section of 1/4" steel rod, could be all-thread, use the tape method to get it snug in the guide. For the seat protector, get a steel disc and lay out a center hole and drill through. Trim the steel disc so it covers the seat. I could be thinner than the fiber or rubber backing pad. Original thought is to double nut the plate onto the rod but it may cause interference with the grinding process to work on a chamber. My second thought is to weld or braze a washer on the rod, cut off the excess and us a nut on the other side of the plate and it should not cause interference with removing metal from the chamber floor. Might hold up for doing more than one set of heads and how many do you plan on doing. This is basically made from scrap unless you purchase discs from ebay or possibly McMaster Carr.
That's a lot of dickin' around. I use a Sioux stone holder with a shallow-angle grind on the proper diameter stone on the appropriate sized pilot. Of course, it would take 2 different stones; one for intake and one for the exhaust. But you could probably do all 16 seats in 30 mins, without boogering- up anything.
The home gamer such as myself has to follow the masters. I saw your good comment under Eric’s video about using stones and being a competent machinist. I have been researching the process quite a bit. I ran across David Vizard’s video as well, after Andy told me to knock down the lips in the chamber. That’s what this video was about, Knocking down the extreme lips that were around the seats. I am one of the few that realizes that port work is useless without a decent valve job. I believe that this set of heads being manufactured with a the angles it had, was a bit off after I ported it. The one crude angle that I added seemed to blend the factory angles into my port work. I realize it’s not professional, but it will burn tires.
Very nice tip Joe. Andy had a great idea and or tip. I like that alot better now. Always worth the effort on head work. Heads look great all freshly assembled. Thanks for sharing. 👍
Excelent job un this heads, wirh this arrive in the market years ago receive a lot of bad opinions, but this recent years Edelbrock to , the quality control Is not the same . All this inspection, preparation , etc that you made un this heads Is mandatory 🍺. Really this heads can perform a 550 hp motor Easy 🍻
Man, the 440 source heads dont get enough credit. They are a really damned good option for the price and so far they need considerably less work than the nearest price competitor. Its probably too late now but I was going to suggest polishing up the rest of the chamber surface since you are already in there (or are you the kind of guy that likes a little rough surface in there for turbulence?). My dad showed me the 20 oz pop bottle trick. Cut a bottle off a bit larger than the valve diameter and knock it into the hole. Takes a little experimentation to get it right buts its pretty hard to knock it looset. Then you can use the part sticking up as a tool rest for the shaft of a die grinder for that tad bit extra control. I also saw someone once cut a valve head off then use the stem as a tool rest similar to the shaft insert when you grind seats with the spring plunger tool. Is that rubber pad trick you used safe enough to use a die grinder? nonetheless sir, those heads are looking amazeballs! (ps you have a line on a set of mopar performance big block valve covers? i cant find any at all! new or used! ebay doesn't count)
@@JustMoparJoe Until you go to order them for an outrageous price of 300$ and they do that thing where they say they have them, but then refund you and say "sorry we are on back-order". :(
@@JustMoparJoe i was pretty pissed about it too, believe me! They are still one of the best sources for mopar stuff but I will always call for "in stock" purposes after that.
Why not take one intake and exhaust valve and modify it on a lathe, so that when installed it only protects the valve seat, but allows for grinding on the unwanted chamber step?
Is it possible to get 425-450 hp from a 400 build like yours with 9.5-1 compression with these heads, and a cam with .234/.244 @.050 with around 530/540 lift, Rpr performer dual plane and exhaust manifolds? Or would headers be needed.
@@GeneralLao I think it’d be great for that. Even is manifolds took away 40 horse power, the cam specs are pretty similar. I would guess the stealths are down 10-15 from the Edelbrocks.
@@JustMoparJoe I am interested in keeping the engine looking as factory as possible, so heads and headers would be around 510 hp, Source heads and manifolds be around 440-450hp. still decent power for a charger street car. make around 475-480 Tq I would think.
I used to buy source heads…. used too. What a poor product for any company to sell. Fully worked they can be ok, but ootb that’s terrible quality. No excuse to sink the seats like that. Plenty of small block heads that can outflow source big block heads.
I believe it. But these 440 source heads will outflow stock 906’s, and weigh half as much. That’s what I wanted. Did you know that a 508 with aluminum heads weighs less than 20 pounds more than a 408 with iron heads? I think I’m off of small blocks for a while.
@@JustMoparJoe I agree, they actually flow great 280cfm+ mildly worked vs stock heads 220ish cfm. I’ve seen them flow over 300cfm, then again I’ve seen the same out of fully worked small block heads. I’m not knocking them completely, I actually have a build with them rite now, but with a little effort on their part, they could be a lot better than currently offered.
@@JustMoparJoe I agree, they actually flow great 280cfm+ mildly worked vs stock heads 220ish cfm. I’ve seen them flow over 300cfm, then again I’ve seen the same out of fully worked small block heads. I’m not knocking them completely, I actually have a build with them rite now, but with a little effort on their part, they could be a lot better than currently offered.
@@JustMoparJoe I agree, they actually flow great 280cfm+ mildly worked vs stock heads 220ish cfm. I’ve seen them flow over 300cfm, then again I’ve seen the same out of fully worked small block heads. I’m not knocking them completely, I actually have a build with them rite now, but with a little effort on their part, they could be a lot better than currently offered.
You'll know for sure when it's running but looks like some extra HPs from your work to me! Good stuff Joe!
Thanks brother. I think it’ll burn rubber either way! But only because mopars belong at the front!
Hey Joe, try using a 1/4" ball burr to blend the seat into the Chamber until the lip is gone, than use the rolok to smooth
I’ve got a few. Some with cross cut and the others that have the wide flutes
Good information Joe.
Glad it was helpful!👍🏼
Nice work Joe. 😎👍
Thanks brother
Brilliant!!
Thanks brother!
Really nice brother! Thanks to you and Andy 😊
Thanks, Ryan
Every little bit helps
Absolutely! Thanks brother
Thats a great tip, thanks Joe and Andy!
Thanks brother. Andy was nice enough to give me some constructive criticism. Ed also gave me feedback on my work.
I purchased the cnc version of these heads. Saves a lot of pokin and hopin.
I watched Eric’s video. I knew from that the CNC’d heads were lacking tremendously. Check it out here. ua-cam.com/video/ti4RZOQrMvk/v-deo.htmlsi=cpiQ3Y85-Iy6nc2_
@@JustMoparJoe yeah not building a race car. Spicing up my RoadRunner I have owned since 92.
@@franksrok5843 awesome!
The exhaust seats appear to be elevated Joe 😯
On some I’m sure. There is some precision lacking here
15 year's ago when I was working on Toyota head we used the New-Way cutter's, I thought they worked really well, thanks for sharing, all the best to you and your loved ones
Thanks, Donald! Have a good weekend
nice work. i am stuck on TFS myself. hope you make some big numbers with your work. thanks for sharing.
Thanks brother. I know that these are a few steps behind the TF heads, but they’re about half the price. I’ll get 270’s someday for the 512 💪🏻
Looks good to me!
Thanks buddy!
Great video!! Why no unshroud the chambers. The time to it is when its in front of you . Remember david vizard says pretty is not important but shape is!
Thanks brother. I am at a place in life where “time is money”. These are my own heads, and the longer I spend on them, it actually increases the amount that I paid for them. Basically taking away from customer jobs and losing me money, that I could be saving for a nicer set of heads, or Kids Christmas gifts 🎅🏼
Looks great! You are much braver than me! I probably would have hit the seat
Haha! I enjoy messing around and learning. This set of heads gave me some good motivation to
Nice job Joe..thanks
Thanks 👍
Some Monroe County head work. I bet it will run fine.
Haha! Some times it’s better to just leave the camera off 😂
Cool hack!
Thanks, John!
Great hack!! I would have never thought of it.
For sure. It actually worked well. Even when I hit it, it just spit black rubber. Seats were saved!
DV cuts those like a windmill cut, that makes them flexible Joe. So they can take the shape of where ur grinding better
I saw that. He was plunging them into the bowl to help smooth out the port work from the carbides. I liked the hard edge on the discs. It helped me kind of pinpoint the raised edge. Then I could switch to one that was worn on the edges to transition with.
Maximum gains for a reasonable amount of work!! These will work well!!
Thanks brother
You got them looking better, keep up the good work.
Thanks Jeff!
I think you'll gain from it!
Thanks, Tim!
Awesome hack
Thanks brother!
Nice work - great tip from Andy. Considering a set of stealths for my 406, or a set of performance world heads - actually cheaper with living north of the border. Be interesting to see how they compare to your worked Eddies.
Thanks, brother. I believe these will be milder, but won’t ever go into my racecar. I have something else fun planned for them 💪🏻
Thanks for posting this idea. I have to work on a set of heads to clean them up and contacting the seat would be awful. Here is an idea for a possibly better seat protector in terms of longevity. I haven't made this yet so I do not know what pitfalls I will encounter. Using a section of 1/4" steel rod, could be all-thread, use the tape method to get it snug in the guide. For the seat protector, get a steel disc and lay out a center hole and drill through. Trim the steel disc so it covers the seat. I could be thinner than the fiber or rubber backing pad. Original thought is to double nut the plate onto the rod but it may cause interference with the grinding process to work on a chamber. My second thought is to weld or braze a washer on the rod, cut off the excess and us a nut on the other side of the plate and it should not cause interference with removing metal from the chamber floor. Might hold up for doing more than one set of heads and how many do you plan on doing. This is basically made from scrap unless you purchase discs from ebay or possibly McMaster Carr.
Very cool. I like this idea, because I think I’ll very rarely do this kind of work. But it’s nice to have a quick option
Sure are a lot of details.
For sure. I know I missed a few, but my cameraman always needs fired!
That's a lot of dickin' around. I use a Sioux stone holder with a shallow-angle grind on the proper diameter stone on the appropriate sized pilot. Of course, it would take 2 different stones; one for intake and one for the exhaust. But you could probably do all 16 seats in 30 mins, without boogering- up anything.
The home gamer such as myself has to follow the masters. I saw your good comment under Eric’s video about using stones and being a competent machinist. I have been researching the process quite a bit. I ran across David Vizard’s video as well, after Andy told me to knock down the lips in the chamber. That’s what this video was about, Knocking down the extreme lips that were around the seats. I am one of the few that realizes that port work is useless without a decent valve job. I believe that this set of heads being manufactured with a the angles it had, was a bit off after I ported it. The one crude angle that I added seemed to blend the factory angles into my port work. I realize it’s not professional, but it will burn tires.
Very nice tip Joe.
Andy had a great idea and or tip.
I like that alot better now.
Always worth the effort on head work.
Heads look great all freshly assembled.
Thanks for sharing. 👍
Hello Ed
@@robertmagni7201 hello Robert.
How are you?
Good to hear from you. 👍👍
Thanks for the support and answering my questions. Your video’s and advice have have helped with the project!
don't forget to use protection😆
It worked! 😂
Excelent job un this heads, wirh this arrive in the market years ago receive a lot of bad opinions, but this recent years Edelbrock to , the quality control Is not the same .
All this inspection, preparation , etc that you made un this heads Is mandatory 🍺. Really this heads can perform a 550 hp motor Easy 🍻
Thanks brother. I may never know how or if I truly improved the flow, but I know they’re ready to run!
Man, the 440 source heads dont get enough credit. They are a really damned good option for the price and so far they need considerably less work than the nearest price competitor. Its probably too late now but I was going to suggest polishing up the rest of the chamber surface since you are already in there (or are you the kind of guy that likes a little rough surface in there for turbulence?).
My dad showed me the 20 oz pop bottle trick. Cut a bottle off a bit larger than the valve diameter and knock it into the hole. Takes a little experimentation to get it right buts its pretty hard to knock it looset. Then you can use the part sticking up as a tool rest for the shaft of a die grinder for that tad bit extra control. I also saw someone once cut a valve head off then use the stem as a tool rest similar to the shaft insert when you grind seats with the spring plunger tool. Is that rubber pad trick you used safe enough to use a die grinder?
nonetheless sir, those heads are looking amazeballs! (ps you have a line on a set of mopar performance big block valve covers? i cant find any at all! new or used! ebay doesn't count)
Haha! Thanks brother. The rubbers worked well with this set of heads. No babies were made 🫣. As for the valve covers, I always here Mancini has them
@@JustMoparJoe Until you go to order them for an outrageous price of 300$ and they do that thing where they say they have them, but then refund you and say "sorry we are on back-order". :(
@@cjm5002 that’s crap! I need a pair for my 512. I’ve been patching up and making them work
@@JustMoparJoe i was pretty pissed about it too, believe me! They are still one of the best sources for mopar stuff but I will always call for "in stock" purposes after that.
Man I wish you had a flow Bench that you could have put those on to see how they responded.
I agree. In my mind they are much better. Won’t ever really know I guess.
Why not take one intake and exhaust valve and modify it on a lathe, so that when installed it only protects the valve seat, but allows for grinding on the unwanted chamber step?
That’s the proper way. I was in a hurry and don’t own a lathe. This was a fun experiment
Is it possible to get 425-450 hp from a 400 build like yours with 9.5-1 compression with these heads, and a cam with .234/.244 @.050 with around 530/540 lift, Rpr performer dual plane and exhaust manifolds? Or would headers be needed.
@@GeneralLao I think it’d be great for that. Even is manifolds took away 40 horse power, the cam specs are pretty similar. I would guess the stealths are down 10-15 from the Edelbrocks.
@@JustMoparJoe Thank you for the reply.
@@JustMoparJoe I am interested in keeping the engine looking as factory as possible, so heads and headers would be around 510 hp, Source heads and manifolds be around 440-450hp. still decent power for a charger street car. make around 475-480 Tq I would think.
@@GeneralLao that’s definitely the best reason to use those heads over stock. Not to mention the 52 lbs of weight savings off the front!
Probably a original 440 valve would cover the seat enough, while working on it.
I believe these are 11/32 stems
5 angle valve job is 3 on the seat, and 2 on the valve. 7 angle is 5 angles in the seat, not necessary in most applications.
I got my info here. Start at the 8:00 mark. ua-cam.com/video/vrrdPZq7A_o/v-deo.htmlsi=95XP-Snp-gyA3Ix5
I bet you didn’t color outside the lines when you were younger .
😂 maybe a few times
👍🏻💯🇦🇺⛽️👍🏻👍🏻👍🏻👍🏻
Thanks brother
I used to buy source heads…. used too. What a poor product for any company to sell. Fully worked they can be ok, but ootb that’s terrible quality. No excuse to sink the seats like that. Plenty of small block heads that can outflow source big block heads.
I believe it. But these 440 source heads will outflow stock 906’s, and weigh half as much. That’s what I wanted. Did you know that a 508 with aluminum heads weighs less than 20 pounds more than a 408 with iron heads? I think I’m off of small blocks for a while.
@@JustMoparJoe I agree, they actually flow great 280cfm+ mildly worked vs stock heads 220ish cfm. I’ve seen them flow over 300cfm, then again I’ve seen the same out of fully worked small block heads. I’m not knocking them completely, I actually have a build with them rite now, but with a little effort on their part, they could be a lot better than currently offered.
@@JustMoparJoe I agree, they actually flow great 280cfm+ mildly worked vs stock heads 220ish cfm. I’ve seen them flow over 300cfm, then again I’ve seen the same out of fully worked small block heads. I’m not knocking them completely, I actually have a build with them rite now, but with a little effort on their part, they could be a lot better than currently offered.
@@JustMoparJoe I agree, they actually flow great 280cfm+ mildly worked vs stock heads 220ish cfm. I’ve seen them flow over 300cfm, then again I’ve seen the same out of fully worked small block heads. I’m not knocking them completely, I actually have a build with them rite now, but with a little effort on their part, they could be a lot better than currently offered.