I DIDN'T EXPECT THIS.. (Trident 68 Console VS Warm Audio WA73)
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- Опубліковано 11 кві 2023
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Throw the video on 4k for best listening experience, and share the video with a family member who needs this today. Love you guys.
Oh and Preamp 1 is Warm and Preamp 2 is trident.
Trident, it’s not even close...
My grandma says hi
waiting now for the eq engaged video
Coz I listen WITH MY EYES!!! 😂 Great shoot-out. #2 sounded more open and better fidelity, imho.
I'm a gear junkie and have worked mostly with analog mixers and gear doing live sound for a band and then in churches. I got out of that before the digital gear took off, but I'm super impressed with the sound coming from both. Those preamps are awesome, but I love the Trident sound a little more. Great job Andrew. Just found your channel from Rhett Shoal's. Subbed🎸
Guess I'm the lone ranger here but I prefer the Warm Audio sound. Especially on the snare. Side note...I thought it was funny how the Trident accentuated the ring in the snare.
Trident just showed more details. Hands down, but I also preferred the warm audio on the drums.
agreed - I liked the WA's - really tightened up the SD nicely....
I like warm audio as i use 500 series pres on all my toms and wa tone Beast on snare bottom pluss wa 73 eq on kit but love get some 500 series trident eqs in my studio. I also just taken my 52 channel mixing console out my recording studio
I prefer the Warm too.
Let’s be honest. Both sound fantastic! But i am definitely digging the Trident for sure!! awesome vid!!
i have seen every video since the first one you upload , and i can hear your drum sound evolution , better every time , congrats and thanks for this demo , blessings
I would definitely go all Trident, sounds great! There’s also something to be said about having a cohesive sound for a recording, getting the all glued together feel of everything going through one set of preamps, just like they used to do it! Thanks for the video!
I like both a lot. Really liked how the trident handles the low end in both the kick and the snare. The overall picture sounded more lively to my ear with the warm. Both are fantastic.
Hey Andrew, I noticed what you said about the low end. I wouldn't describe it as hitting harder. It's just much snappier and tighter. I loved them through the trident. Very pleasing sound!
Oh my Lord! What a demo! Huge logistics there. Thank you!
im never not blown away how good your drums sound! Thanks for this video Andrew!
Here hear!
the guy rules at tracking drums. id like to hear him mic up a kit with some distant room mics in a large room. i did my albums drums at AIR in london which has a big room, ill bet andrew would kick ass in that studio
I already had interest in the 68 and this helps a lot - much appreciated
I identify as having watched this video - and I’d like to say I feel both traumatized by how delightful the drums sounded and also bewildered by how brash your assessment of the trident preamps was. I was EQUALLY as brash! The tridents reign supreme like a kingly clam on the ocean floor.
and that's an understatement :)
Starting at 8:19 if you listen to the low end in the kick drum and compare between the two pres, the Warm Audio pres have a slightly “saturated” sound to the decay on the kick drum. The transformers are definitely adding a nice “fuzz” or “growl” to the kick. Where the Trident preamps provide a more “straight forward” sound of the kick.
You can also hear how the Warm Audio preamps tend to “sit back” ever so slightly compared to the Trident preamps. Especially once the room mics are in at 8:42
This is great to give things more “girth” or “weight” or have elements “pop” forward more depending on the preamps you use.
Because they affect the frequency ranges differently, you can mix and match to make elements in a mix naturally stick out compared to the rest, or even create subtle shifts moving from verse to chorus.
Very fun stuff to mess with and get creative!
When I heard your drum tones I had to subscribe. Really impressed with the sound you get at a home studio. I know those mics aren't the cheapest, but they're not expensive either. You have obviously spent some time fine tuning that setup!
I gotta go for the warms on this one! Cool comparison!
I think I prefer the Warm Audio. The Trident seemed to have more low end, but the Warm had a more shimmery top to me.
I tend to like my music on the brighter side though. So it's sort of a matter of taste and the way your ears work. Also, the Tridents sounded better on the sections that were heavier with cymbals because of the rolled-off top end. So I can see the Warm initially feeling more exciting to me, but the Tridents growing on me over time.
It's really interesting you say that, I usually associate trident with shimmery hi end
Very good comparison. I’d like to see a version where you mix with EQ, and see the results based on how the EQs inspire the end product. At this price point, the Trident is getting pretty interesting for me.
I liked the vibe and punch of the kick with the Trident but for the snare I liked the Warm.
My exact thoughts
Great video Andrew. I have a Trident 68, as well as API 3124V’s, Vintech 73’s, Pacificas, etc. I was shocked at how much I liked the Trident Pres too. Now I always use some of that Eq on the way in but particularly like what they do to toms. I agree about the “round” sound. Really present yet controlled low end, punchy mids (not API punchy but..) and detailed highs.
Nice. I used to have a Trident Trimix, API 3124 and Vintech 473 (plus a smathering of others isa 428, chandler germanium, UA LA 610, True Systems prec 8)
For drums id almost always go API on snare/kick in and OHs.. the rest split between the 473 and Trident (I had bought all the redundancy pres before getting the console)
It was still nice to have 34/35 pre's to choose from even though my Antelope interface only had 32 inputs and I rarely went over 25 inputs at a time, Though id go ape micing drums at time and have over 20 mics on a 5 piece. (scratch 2 x Guitars, 1 x Bass was how U was getting up the 25 tracks at once)
Trident all the way! To my ears there was more energy and they sat in the mix better. Nicely done!
Man, the Trident squeezed down on the length of the transients in an extremely pleasant way. Listen to the length on that kick drum in each comparison. Sick console, dude~
It's the Tridents faster slew rate because of the higher impedance, the Tridents have a higher impedance which equates to a more open sound. While the Neve style preamps use a lower impedance around 600 to 1200 ohms which lengthens the note but also squashes the transient due to the slower slew rate. Good ears that you noticed that. Cheers!
Trident Pre'sare instantly recognisable. You can use either pre amps for drums, you can't go wrong, but Tridents do sound rather spectacular on percussive elements. From the track comparisons, you can hear the "vintagness" if that is even word, on the Warms. I mean, that's what they are supposed to do anyway! And this comparison in a strange way highlighted that wonderful aspect of their pres, they do exacly what they are supposed to do, as do the Tridents. Two different flavours from two amazing pre amps. Lovely!
The sound for this song goes to the warms. The trident is a more rounded sound so it’s very pleasing to the ear, but the feel I’m getting from the warms.
"feel" = W
he chose the trident because he paid big money for it
Def Warm took the W it sounds way more ALIVE
GREAT video🔥 both sound fantastic
I thought (through my car speakers) the Warm sounded bigger while the Trident sounded punchier. Both great depending on what fits the song.
Your comment pretty much sums up what I heard.
Man your drum sound is just first class man! Seriously! That kit, those mics, you've really honed an amazing sound!
The tridents sounded like I expected them to, a bit posher, more hi fi and smooth! (I'm a big fan of trident pres!!) The warms are a bit edgier, bit more bite in the 1-3k region and leaner on the bottom. I do think its a bit of a shame you didn't hit the rooms on the trident pres input a bit harder, that woulda balanced out the end result a bit.
I think the ULTIMATE combo would be to use the trident pre's for everything EXCEPT kick in and snare top. I would love to hear the warms on snare top and kick in with trident on everything else. I think that will give that upper mid bite that 73s are known for and the tridents can shine on all the detailed smooth stuff... rooms, overheads etc.
PS.... how do you set pre levels and play the kit at the same time?! lol
DUDE, Do more videos on the 68, there isn't enough out there and im on the fence. Thanks heaps for all the content bro. much appreciated.
Trident definitely had more overall punch, I would imagine that the warm audio with the added eq would cut through, but overall, you are good. You can have the kick and toms go through the Trident, and the warm can be snare and cymbals ... the options are so many .. sick rig !!!
Now that is a thorough comparison - good stuff. Either way you have both now.
im a huge fan and this demo says why the trident 68 rocks and looking at their 88 model:) great demo andrew!
Yes!! Thanks for this!
Loved this video! I am surprised by your results as well. Jack says he doesn’t like your drum face lol.
Not sure oif it's the UA-cam compession but I'm liking the Warms over the Trident. Both are great though and I'd be happy with either. Hmm, I think I'n still considering the wall of Warms for my setup...
From freakishly chilly and wet Ireland! ☘💪🏽👀👍🏽☘
Trident for sure. Could really tell by the kick drum. REally liking you new console!
Crazy tonal change when AB soloing the drums. Trident feels more full in low mid and gives that snare more punch. The 73 is a little more top end oriented, but still sounds great
Both sound so good... I find the Warm sounds a little more "open" on the snare. That's pretty much the only place I spot a noticeable difference. I prefer the Warm's clarity... great video and such a killer drum sound!
Man that first comparison in the mix context really showed the difference. The Warms definitely had what I would call a generic radio ready sound, but once the trident kicked, it just clicked, I could hear the singer in my head instantly and the song really had this "old dirt roads" vibe
Great as always!
Definitely going with the trident pre amps for sure. I love it and if if you listen closely 2 both takes the warm audio kick drums sound a little more boomy and open more so saturated the trident kick take sound a bit more punchy and clean. Pretty interesting.
Well first, fantastic sounding drums and tuning! The Trident won for me, and I think having that cohesive console thing helps the cause. Something about the imaging felt more pleasing as well. Thanks for doing this video!
Dude first A/B test I really liked the Trident, but when you added the (Warm) bus comp and eq I thought the Warm's were the winner! Such a tough thing to decide on though, and would be 100% satisfied with either setup!
Excellent video. You are blessed having all that equipment. Both pre-amps sound amazing. The Trident does have like a "special sauce" when listening on good headphones / monitor speakers. I do have Warm Audio WA73EQ. I like the the Avalon pre-amps too. I use both most of the time.
Btw, that song sounds fantastic. Can you share the link to listen it?
Andrew, your one of the reasons, why I have gear from Warm audio and Trident, thx for the comparison... :)
Great video! I love the comparison. I LOVE my WA73-EQ and use it on all guitar, bass, vocals and (most all) drums. Paired with the WA76, I don't think you can beat it for the price. I also always have the Bus-Comp and EQP's on my master bus... pure magic.
@NTPL Worship I do! I have a handful of videos on my channel talking about how I use my analog gear with my recording setup.
Very cool video! I really like this 1/2 normalized test. I could see using both pres together on this for certain aspects on this song. I hear the difference for sure but I think there's some compelling sounds overall to both & maybe you can dig into that to bring the entire song to a place persay. I'm curious to hear those 73s inline on the mix bus with the GComp & EQP's. Anyway video kinda makes me want to 1/2 normal some mic's! Although dosen't this change the mic's outputs by splitting it? IDK? Excellent video!!
Hey Andrew, great video! Really liked how the Trident preamps sound, the Warms are nice as well, but the Trident just sounded better with your drums, in my opinion :)
I wonder if you would be able to do a comparison like this but adding perhaps a set of API and a set of Neve preamps? Maybe sweetwater could help you out with some gear for such a test? 👀🙏🙏 something like the 1073 OPX and a couple of API 3124s?
Could be some interesting content, and of course it depends on many other factors, but it would be a great starting point for a comparison.
Wish you all the best!
When I was younger and coming up at Sound Kitchen here in Nashville (where we had an SSL 4000G, API Legacy Plus as well as a Neve 88VR) an engineer/producer once told me about something called "Slew Rate". He explained to me that the Slew Rate was how fast the preamp was able to reproduce transients (basically), the quick and dirty he told me was that at Sound Kitchen, the API was mega fast, the Neve was the slowest and the SSL was somewhere in the middle. I've learned over the years and the Trident is EVEN SLOWER, I talked to the owner of Tiny Tape room here in Nashville and he told me their Trident is modded to sound more like an API because he told me that after a while the previous owner of the console was tired of everything sounding so "slow" and having so much low-end. I think we are hearing the Slew Rate of the two preamps here more than anything, because the Trident drums sound like they almost have a little bit more "compression" (if you wanna call it that) across the whole kit, whereas the Warm 1073s sound faster, bright and more "modern."
Super amazing video Andrew!!!
Even on my iPad mini it’s very obvious! As a drummer and composer also my studio gets the same sort of use, except I don’t have a lovely trident 😢😢 Tama drums and a Yamaha O2r 96 desk and Dante. Clean enough for me, great video as always…. Cheers, Rob
Hi Andrew, both are great and I don't think any good mixing engineer would have a problem mixing any of them. I personally prefer the warm audio as I feel it is closer to the way I love to mix. Great video. Keep it up :)
Super comparison. Gotta go with the Warm though, and the final glue of the Warm on the Buss really brought it all together in a big way. Although I am really impressed by the Trident as well. Very happy to hear this comparison. I may be the world's biggest fan of the "Neve" sound, which Warm really brings home I think, but the Trident does sound like a great contender for a console solution, when considering costs and features. Using a console in recording at least in my mind ultimately is the glue for any recording, because all the tracks are given the same treatment "across the board". Thanks for producing this video.
I agree, the trident mic pres sound better immediately. The kick has more deep low end and the snare a little bit more punch, perhaps in the low mids.
For me it was most clear on the snare. The trident sounded woody but lacked the snap. On the warm audio I got a really strong snap sound but less of the woody character. Both are super usable but different. Love the content!
The Trident sounded punchier than the Warm.
I was really surprised by the comments. To me there was no comparison between the two. The Trident Pres were in a completely different league than the Warm Pres. I think it might become more obvious to your viewers if you did the exact same comparison recording vocals. Years ago I came into a little extra cash and decided to buy a couple of Vintech x73i Pres (faithful recreations of the Neve 73s). I completely expected to return them, expecting there was no way they could sound that much better, given the price difference. I was absolutely stunned at the difference in clarity, warmth and fatness. Given that most songs consist of dozens of tracks, the cumulative difference is huge. There's a reason why the most iconic recordings from bands like the Beatles, Pink Floyd and Steely Dan, just to name a few, have been recorded through these Hi-end preamps like Neve, Trident and others. They're simply sound the best, by far. Great Video.
Great video! However it sounds like there might have been a phase issue with on the snare on the Warm pres. Could be a bad patch cable or a switch. Pre's can make a big difference as we heard but that snare sound change was a bit greater that I would expect.
Love the crack of the snare on the warm. Makes the track sound more like Oasis.
Andrew…never have i ‘ smashed ‘ that like button faster, harder or enthusiastically 🤘🤪🤘 !!!
absolutely perfect 👌
not only very well executed, normally i’m focused on the gear nuances, needing to filter the youtube compression via my brains unique algorithms hahaha, but this time, watching your expression was all i needed, man… eyes don’t lie, is laid to rest by your video ✅
thank you for this.
would really enjoy having a cup of coffee on a tuesday afternoon with you and like minded creative people !
all the best & have a great day.
NIce comparison, I am going to try using my desk pre's now on drums now to see the difference with my setup (desk vs standalone pres)
The snare sound is so smooth on the Trident. 🤑
The price point on the Trident is excellent. The LED metering vs VUs and absence of transformers on that model make it a more affordable option to the 78 and 88.
Thanks for all your videos! Great stuff. I think the Warms do snare better- more depth after the transient.
Warm audio sounds more compressed which I take to be a 73 pre trait. The snare rings out more and the whole sound is brighter with a little less beef. The trident is a little darker and more meaty with less snare rattle ring out. They both sound great, but to me the 73 sounds like it already mixed. Great video, and very much a matter of preference rather than better or worse
Agreed…The Warm gave the drums an open sound and the Trident seemed masked in all frequencies. Yes, the Trident sounded thinker, but that was from hiding the upper mids and highs from my ears. I don’t own Warm pres either…smile. If I had the Trident track, I would have to drop some lows and boost the highs to fit in the mix and no obfuscate the bass and other instruments on the mids and lows. Toward the end of the video when you played the kit without overheads, I could hear definition on the snare with the Warms and the Trident covered up the transients…just my ears.
The Warm Audio WA-412 are the preamps that would be a much closer comparison to the Trident pre's than the WA73. The console preamps are punchier in this instance, because they are definitely cleaner in relationship to saturation/distortion. Distortion removes the peaks of the transients, which is what a 1073 is doing. To get 1073's punchy they have to be dialed low on gain, high on trim/fader. The Trident is much closer to an API or even a Focusrite console than a Neve sound.
Agree 👍
Excellent comparison. I'm struggling to hear any major tonal problems (perhaps some very slight differences, not better or worse either way), there are some level imbalances (more likely the difference between my monitors and yours). A very handy video for me as we're right in the middle of planning a full digital console swap with hardware outboard (we've found the lack of recall a growing problem in our analog desk).
It would be cool if you did a video comparing something like the Tascam Model 24 to your console. Obviously totally different, but you could educate those of us who don't understand the detailed difference. I think you'd do a great job illustrating the difference in quality, workflow, etc.
Totally excellent idea. I would also add the Soundcraft Signature MTK series, which have professional grade channels and are used by a lot of people out there. A comparison between these models would be ace.
Fantastic video, thanks a lot! Two different flavours for sure. The WA73 sounds a bit warmer, definitely has that vintage 73 vibe, whereas the Tridant sounds a little more clean and modern. Both sounds fantastic! Thanks for a great review.
Beautifully recorded as well!
Andrew, thanks so much for making this video! Great comparison. Wondering if the coloring of the Trident is not just the preamps but coming from also the other components in the board? I'm asking this because if you think it's just the preamps I would definitely consider getting a pair of the Trident A range pre/eq's they sell for recording my drumkit. What are your thoughts? Thanks
Thanks again man
the room mics actually sound great.. nice
Both sound great. For drums my go to is API as it always sounded so fat and punchy. Haven't AB'd anything else in a long time! Great setup for the comparison thanks.
Trident sounded more punchy, and Warm more... err... fluffy (but in a good way). I don't know if there's one better than the other. It's just different. I like the EQ's on a Trident, and have 4 modules in 500 series myself.
Great video, great drum groove too! To my ears : Warm's preamps sound more "diffuse" and Trident 's more snappy, more focused and detailed too. Both sound good but I kinda prefer the Trident for those reasons. Maybe for strings and brass - and background vocals? - the more diffuse sound of the Warm would get my vote. Dunno.... Anyway, thanks again and have a great day! ;-)
lovely video 🎉
I used to own a Trident. We replaced with a Neve, a really good one too!
We all missed the Trident.
Dude you must be stoked... the Trident seems to grab and do something great to the transients.... I want one.
Now for the technical test. Solo the paired channels, invert the phase and sum. Listen to the difference. You will need to match the levels for max cancellation.
Actually this would be a great way to match the playback levels too. Add a “trim” plug and adjust for a perfect match. I can hear mix differences which will be construed as sonic differences.
The Trident sounds a bit brighter and more forward, but I can easily imagine there will be plenty of times with this particular kit, that you decide the Warms are more what is needed. Both sound very good, no reason to complain of either.
The warms sound clearer and detailed. The trident sounds a little more hefty. 2 different sounds. Both sound great! I could use either and be happy for life!
wow. Thats a huge difference. Trident was rounder in the transients. Very insane.
Hey @AndrewMasters, just keep reminding yourself (as I know you do) that this is all subjective. I preferred the WAs. But that's MY ear. I recorded two albums on Tridents years ago and loved it. But the WAs somehow, to my ear, manage to bring a little more air while maintaining luscious low-mids. Love what you do, and thank you for doing it. For the record, I watched initially with my eyes closed....I could definitely hear a difference. It's subtle and simultaneously remarkable. Like I said, subjective by nature.
Both sound amazing! I slightly prefer the Trident but I'm old and it could be I'm biased towards consoles.
I’m only listening on AirPods, so gonna watch this at home in the studio later, but on first impression, 1 sounds like the WA-73’s. I have the non-EQ model and 1 reminded me of the same kind of harmonic distortion.
I liked everything thru the trident except snare. Took off a little too much transients which I found pleasing from the warm audio pres. love this nerdy stuff! Keep it up
mic splitting is usually done by transformer or active circuit. Your method is changing impedance. The two preamps react differently to this condition.
Diferent types of PREs. both sound cool, TWO different color pallets basically, I'll use one for more crunchy sounding stuff, and the other when I want something more organic.
Wow! The Trident sounded huge, punchy, better separation.
Tridents sound like they have built in tape distortion, but without the hiss. Thanks for he video.
I quite like both. I have a Warm Audio WA73 EQ on order...
I love your setup man! I’m a LUNA user with a similar setup to how you used to have yours. I’m at a crossroad, I try and work as hybrid as possible, which is oddly kinda difficult with LUNA. I’m looking at either integrating a Neve 8816 summing mixer with my current AMS NEVE 1073 pre’s, UF8 etc… Or ditching that idea and getting the Trident 68 16 channel… Thoughts?
Cool test!
It really sounds like there are some phase issues between the single mics on the Warm examples though. Especially between the snare close mic and some other mics (overheads I guess).
The Warm was smoother sounding, richer in low mids. The Trident sounded more hi-fi and punchy, really defined low freqs. The snare really popped through on the Trident though. That’s what sold me. Different flavors :)
The dude is a professional audio engineer. Seriously.
trident on my ns 10 speaker...great video
great video, i'm looking after this trident, i like warm audio, and i think you cannot actually compare these 2, i mean, did you drive them both the same? both input and output wise? cause i own a wa273 , no eq, and the difference in sound is massive, from going in gently and really pushing the input, especially with transient material like drums, same goes for every preamp, m ore or less, so it would be nice to see the input and output attenuations of both pieces,
cheers
On drums i prefer the Trident Pre. They had more thump and punch as drums should sound to my ears. While the 73 were more round, smooth and warm (Which can be nice on pianos n stuff)
But for drums i would go for the Trident 68. Thats just what my ears picked up here. But really nice video Andrew! Keep it up 😀
Shotgun mic to record voice at the desk, nice choice! UA-camrs typically use a lav or an LDC mic. The issue with an LDC is it has to be very close to the source. The issue with a lav is that they are typically rather poor mics, even the best of them, that tend to be "all about that mid" because the capsule is so small. A shotgun mic however, if used (placed and gain structured) properly will produce excellent audio without needing to be a few inches from the source.
I think the Trident had a more focused low end and a faster transient, that's why when I hear it through my Focals it sounds snappier or more crack. but Man I love those Warms. both are great sounds.
I'm curious since the 1st preamp sounds like it has a low impedance like between 600 ohms to 1200 ohms and the 2nd preamp sounds like it is higher around 2000 ohms. The older Neve preamps had a switch for 2 different settings and the 600 ohms setting would squash a sound and this is what many people equate to the the Neve mic preamp sound but the internal switch doubled the input impedance for a cleaner less squashed sound. So the Neve style preamps had a more heavy slew sound that draws out the mid-range in most things while more modern preamps that range from around 2 kilo-ohm to around 5 kilo-ohms have a more polished linear quality that brings out the detail and has far less slew. An easy way to hear this in mic preamps is the darker more quote "squashed" something sounds in the overall tone on average the lower the impedance is, the more "sparkly & open" the higher the impedance.
I’m surprised you didn’t encounter any loading issues by splitting the mic signal passively at the patchbay. Would be interesting to repeat the same test with an active mic splitter..would probably sound even better!
I don't know these sorts of electrical details but it would be interesting to know how the impedance of going to two mic preamps (rather than just one) changes the sound. If the impedance of the preamps aren't identical then the impedance changes might favor one over the other. A bigger issue for a dynamic mic than a condenser, too, which is maybe why we heard more instantly apparent differences in the kick/snare than in the overheads.
To me, the Warms sounded a little like the transformers were soaking up the low end while the Tridents were letting everything through. Super interesting, though, that's for sure!
I must say at the end of the day both recordings sound great
I just got my first outboard mic pre the BAE 1073MP. It's KILLER. I think the console sounded better than the Warms as well
That's the real deal! API 312 as well. Game changer!
@mixxmann man it really is. I love it. Even made me not hate going direct when I need to. Great sound. And yes API also