Benstoeger.com Benstoegerproshop.com for gear PSTG.US for in person classes and digital coaching Ben Stoeger books on Amazon: www.amazon.com... Podcast from pstg: traininggroupl...
Colt going out of business, CZ buying them, and then handing the reins over to what's left of Colt and letting them take CZ down with them makes no sense to me, but here we are.
Finally someone talking about the downfall of CZ-USA. One of the worst gun experiences I've ever had was with CZ, I got a new P-07 in 2023 and loved it, but kept having slide lock problems. After sending it back to their customer service multiple times it kept coming back with even more problems from their gunsmiths, and their very rude and dismissive customer service was anything but helpful. Nearly an entire year of dealing with them and talking to the head of customer support showed me this is sinking ship of a company to avoid
Mass produced anything is subject to QC problems. When I worked in manufacturing, the first thing to get cut when money got tight was Quality Assurance personnel…
Mfg workers themselves should be the QC/QA, but that idea is rare in 21st Century. Corner cutting is the 21st Century model and it is destructive, long term.
The gun "community" gets butt hurt about everything! Strong opinions low commitment described us best. When a man fires 40k+ rounds a year over multiple platforms has input, I listen. Even about my beloved Glocks. Anyways this is why I'm a gun guy who pretty much hates all gun guys.
All qc is down everywhere on everything. Period. Idk if people just have checked out or what. Not just firearms ammo cars planes etc etc. It's 2024 everything fuckin sucks bud.
A FRiend of mine bought a brand new colt ar that had frequent hammer follow out of the box. I've personally had issues with multiple rugers, taurus, amd kahr (of course). All brand new, can't trust shit these days.
Why are people’s accounts on reliability of “their” guns are so wide? Is it because people don’t really shoot with their guns or is it buyers bias? I want to switch over to shadow 2 competitively, but then I seen the unreliability in person. But people still simp for them.
I hope future manufacturing of cz75s dont take on the spotty shadow 2 quality. Im curious as to what is the nicer piece, an sp01 after going to cajun or a shadow 2?
The only difference you’d notice is about a pound heavier trigger pull on DA with the SPO1 and about the same on SA vs the Shadow 2 the reset on SA will also be a little longer on SPO1 due to the firing pin block safety but it’s only about 2 mm difference. If both guns go to Cajun they’ll both be top notch performers and reliable. But if you’re comparing a stock S2 to a Cajun SP01 the Cajun gun will beat it every day
This is not a CZ or Staccato only problem, the 10/22 rifles are distinct in quality, depending on if they were made pre 2020 or 2020 and later. I had to replace everything on mine to make it reasonably reliable on the 2021 mfg dated one, the 2018 10/22 is still rock solid with stock parts. It gave me an excuse to build a race gun out of the newer 10/22.
@@IvanRiveraStagea They know the new immigrant demographics don't know crap about guns, and will gladly pay for a lessened product. Literally told this by an insider once.
QC talk only gets people fired up that don't shoot a lot. Shooters will always complain about lack of QC. Case in point, LMT. If you don't shoot, you probably think LMT is great. If you shoot, you know LMT's quality control has slipped a ton, and would likely think twice about buying one.
@@echofoxtrotwhiskey1595 Was shooting a match this past weekend when someone with a new LMT piston 5.56 had their front trigger pin walk on them, and also had feeding issues due to the upper not getting the fitting-bumps filed down properly.
@@echofoxtrotwhiskey1595 The firing pins were replaced under warranty, the heat treating was bad and done by an outside vendor that has since been replaced in house. Same for some of the parts in the firing group.
@slick4415 really? Because you train with 1 gun, you get used to this gun so if you use any other gun your performance is worse because your training isn't performed with this other gun. Doesn't this make sense? You train with what you use in competition, nothing else. Muscle memory and everything will be worse if you switch.
Ben, I think the TTI Combat is series-built by Canik (that's why customer service is handled by Century Arms). Taran Butler has his name on it because he developed the design.
A ratio of something like 1 in 1,000 for guns with defects is acceptable for modern manufacturing. Something like Six Sigma will talk about 4 defects per million but that is for individual parts. When you look at a pistol with 30 to 100 parts, CZ is doing pretty well.
I started running P-10 F, C and S two yrs ago, never an issue and my backup / duplicates are sitting in wait. Several thousand rounds thru F and C no issues; about 650 rds thru S, no issues.
I purchased CZ and Dan Wesson from 2011 to 2017. Sad to hear things have gone down hill. I'm never selling, remember the old ones are the good ones when they come up in estate sales.
I own a CZ Shadow 2 and CZ P-09. I haven't had any issues with them but I wonder if that's because I always Cajunize my CZ with the pro upgrade kits from Cajun Gunworks?
CZ Quality is pretty nuts, owned 2 shadows 1 had 0 issues, even after 30k on one gun. Than switched to Tactical Sport orage, got 2 of them 9mm and a 40. no issues on the TS. But! Of you compare the quality they visibly different, specially the 40 . Slide has some lack in the slide mount, is simply moving up and down. Annoyes me. Friend of mine had the tactical sport 2 broze, imsgin you have to shoot more than a 1000 rounds to make it running. When the shadow 2 came out, lot of shooters had issues and went back to the old shadow 1. keep in mind back in days it was a „cheap“ gun did the job, With the new series they price politics went to the sky and the quality droped. Fact Me personal view, i‘ll keep my old TS, since they the old gen but imm more happy since o swapped to glock. Interesting fact somehow
Quality Control with everything has declined since the pandemic. The older experienced people retired and got out and were replaced with younger, less experienced people (those that actually want to work).
Ive had probs with all guns and they literally all malfunction about the same lol. Glocks are about as reliable as any other platform from my experience
Around three years ago I had a little chat with Ernest Langdon and he told me he believed that Glock is one of the few manufacturers that have pretty much been pretty stable with the QC. Take that for what it's worth, but I believe it. I've bought a couple competition Glocks and they've been pretty problem free even compared to some LTT Berettas.
QC in the gun industry right now is garbage. I'd wager close to half of the guns I've purchased in the last year have had something wrong with them out of the box. At this point, if I buy a new handgun, I have to assume something big, or small will be wrong with it. What's frustrating is sometimes the problem won't make itself known until you're 1,000 rounds in on the gun. It's honestly cheaper sometimes just to get a new gun than to waste money on parts and ammo chasing down a gremlin in the gun.
I had good luck with CZs so far but I bought mine years ago. Things change and QC changes also. The only issue i had was the trigger return spring breaking in my P09 and Shadow 1. Bought some Cajun Gunworks springs for them.
My P10F manufactured 2022 had a broken firing pin at 250 live rounds and 1000 dry fires with snap caps. The main housing was canted in the guns frame. Trigger was inconsistent after brake in (before that it was so gritty, you wouldnt have noticed). Actually the trigger feel and break changed the lower the number of rounds in the magazine was. Less than 5 and you could feel each pull would move the slide up and down due to lower magazine spring tension. Not a huge deal for fast shooting, but for accurate shots and muscle memory it sucked. Tried to remedy the problem with a trigger job and some custom parts but was essentially a thing of tolerances stacking up. What made things worse one reason for me buying the cz was I thought since Iam in europe I could get spares easier - cz has a web shop. first thing: they didnt care about the broken firing pin or any other problem, simply didnt answer my requests. And second the replacement parts I ordered by myself were of bad quality. Striker had a very bad burr in the sear engagement sureface, the new trigger bar/sear I ordered had casting marks literally on the sear surface. On that flat part there was a stap of approx half a millimeter on the engagement Trigger felt way worse with these parts with lots of creep after the wall. And you guessed it: customer service didnt care. Sold the thing and replaced it with da VP9 (which is much better made btw, significantly more complicated internally though)
One of my favorites for the range is a Sig P320 and I get so much crap talk about using it. So many claim it's going to blow up in my hand or I will somehow drop it and kill half of the bystanders. Anyway, it is interesting to listen to the last several videos of other brands with QC or build issues. I did just get the Shadow 2 Compact as my first CZ and started my reliability tests. Only 100 rounds into it, but happy with it so far. I am enjoying this QC series.
Bingo Price goes up quality goes down thems the rules. Companies ride on their initial reputation until it’s absolutely fucked and then get bought by foreign money and down the drain it goes
I got a lemon Glock 10mm long slide. Replaced various parts including recoil spring assembly to no avail. Ended up just trading in at LGS. No confidence in that one
My first S2 has about 30K rounds without problems other than a broken slide release at 20K. My second S2 has about 20K on it and I just broke a slide release. They both start to hang up on feeding at about 1500-2000 rounds without a hose down. They both like to be slightly wet. Other than that no stovepipes or ejection problems. I know that someday I’ll have to replace an extractor but not yet. So my series of 2 have performed splendidly.
It does appear to have dropped off in recent years. My guess is that CZ have worked out exactly how much the need to spend on their quality control to a point where it's "acceptable" and no more.
Totally agree with your QA/QC perspective, Ben. Stovepipes -- can they be a slide speed/recoil spring issue? I have had them only with weak loads, that's why I ask.
Seems that some people just want to resist liking the PDP. Especially if you elude to the fact that they are more reliable than what they paid for their CZ or any other high priced gun. Perhaps they are just purchase justifying or have never really shot the Walther PDP. I’m not a rich guy, money is usually tight. But I liked my first full size 5 inch PDP so much, I bought a second one. One for irons and one for an optic.
@@aperson4057 I think you’re talking about how you would get a dead trigger after trying to fire with it slightly pressed out of battery and the trigger wouldn’t reset. I’ve heard they addressed it but I have one that is less than six months old and it still has the issue. So I’m not sure if they really addressed it yet. But since I’m not law-enforcement and will most likely not need to press my weapon against someone, it doesn’t really concern me too much.
I want to like mine, but my 5" is really snappy. I went down the rabbit hole of people saying they're over/undersprung, tried springs, Springco, brass backstrap, etc. and it's still too snappy. Makes me mad because I think their frame is my top 3 favorite feeling frames on any gun, been trying hard to make it work.
@@London_Mule Define snappy. Because mine sure isn’t. Maybe we have different definitions of “snappy”. I know both of mine return to target just as quick as any pistol I own and I can shoot it all day and my hands and wrists won’t be any worse that shooting any of my Glocks. 🤷🏼♂️
@@CitizenCarrier The muzzle climb is significantly worse when compared to my PPQ/Glocks/P10. Returning on target takes too long compared to the others, splits are way worse.
I have nothing but good things to say about my P01. Picked it up a couple years ago, pre Colt I guess, and it has functioned flawlessly. I've maybe 2500 rounds through it with no stovepipes, or anything going wrong. Keep in mind I don't mess around with a lot of different ammo. If I did, I might have a different story. As is, about all that I've used in it is Belom 124, Norma 124 and a handful of CCI. Wish I could say the same about my retired Canik. It suffered from not just occasional ammo issues, but also managed to break the chamber indicator. When that broke, it was down for the count.
Good thing CZ released the P-10, a striker fired pistol is gonna be way harder for the American facilities to fuck up, or at least I haven’t heard of nearly as many problems with those
Glawk is the bestestest everrrrrrr. Jk they relatively are horrible but they work. Cz’s are an intro into race guns. They need maintenance and love like an exotic flower, but when you have one set up right it’s nice
Meh. Gen 5 Glocks are actually pretty good and in my experience CZ's don't need much maintenance or love - just add ammo & lube them every once in a while. If you start swapping out springs, ignition parts etc. might be a different story.
People get butthurt about QC due to their lack of critical thinking skills, lack of usage, making said firearm their entire personality and dressing them up like a barbie doll. Instead of using it as the tool it is. #isaidwhatisaid
I’m looking at buying a barely used CZ 75 TSO for a very good price, For my first race gun. With the problems CZ is having with QC should I take the chance or look at purchasing or a different gun?
Don't take chances, get a cheap bore scope, check videos on how to check function, shoot it if possible before purchasing. Also look into if you actually buy a tactical sport orange and not a different orange model.
Recently talked to a Beretta rep and told him I had been looking at the LTT 92s. We both agreed they are pricey, but nice. He mentioned Beretta has a new frame mounted decocker only model and explained how it works. I said that sounds more complicated and asked why it is better than the slide G model decocker. He really never gave a good reason why it might be better, but I came away thinking companies are more worried about marketing new and improved models than making sure the current products work well.
Because they finally saw the market for a DS 1911 style pistol. We asked for a 92 that was single action with the safety on the frame like a 1911 back in 1996. The safety on the slide was easily engaged when clearing malfunctions.
It's better cause the market asked for it for years. The ones that didn't buy one that could decock or put on safe while racking the slide might buy some now. Th ones that already have a 92 might get one of those too. They created some waves pushing the competition models and the others now have to surf on that. How well the split decocker works we'll see. I don't think they'd risk their reputation of the main model without extensive testing.
Those are the twin-sear models. Aside from ergonomics, moving the decocker to the frame allowed them to eliminate the transfer bar/rod for the firing pin. This reduces friction by quite a bit; those new designs can take a mainspring that is 2lbs lighter while getting the same ignition reliability.
@@randyreviewsit To be fair, the GTS comes with the Xtreme-S trigger group that is already very good out of the box. A match hammer and maybe a lighter hammer spring on that will get it to a very sweet form (basing on my experience with 92X Performance models that share the same components minus the twin sear).
For bullets nosediving a common cause can be the slide outrunning the magazine spring. Try re-springing the mags with some wolff extra power springs, might fix the issue. Speaking of CZ quality control, this has happened with factory CZ mags too. Not so much on the big guns but I also have a little 2075 RAMI which has a bit more narrow window of operation. Factory full size magazines fit and kinda work in the gun but towards the end of the mag you will start getting nosedives if they have factory springs. The shorter 10 and 14rd mags that come with the gun are fine and anything I have re-sprung with Grams springs or something works fine.
Appreciate the candor. Solid point there time & $$ to correct problems. This is why brands matter - trust the brand to get it right. Bad QC damages the brand. QC problems are cyclical & fixable - pointing out problems like this is important, encourages manufacturers to fix their processes. Thanks!!
Colt going out of business, CZ buying them, and then handing the reins over to what's left of Colt and letting them take CZ down with them makes no sense to me, but here we are.
Finally someone talking about the downfall of CZ-USA. One of the worst gun experiences I've ever had was with CZ, I got a new P-07 in 2023 and loved it, but kept having slide lock problems. After sending it back to their customer service multiple times it kept coming back with even more problems from their gunsmiths, and their very rude and dismissive customer service was anything but helpful. Nearly an entire year of dealing with them and talking to the head of customer support showed me this is sinking ship of a company to avoid
Mass produced anything is subject to QC problems. When I worked in manufacturing, the first thing to get cut when money got tight was Quality Assurance personnel…
It’s the same with low number production too.
Mfg workers themselves should be the QC/QA, but that idea is rare in 21st Century. Corner cutting is the 21st Century model and it is destructive, long term.
Ive NEVER witnessed a company not have QC problems.
The gun "community" gets butt hurt about everything! Strong opinions low commitment described us best. When a man fires 40k+ rounds a year over multiple platforms has input, I listen. Even about my beloved Glocks. Anyways this is why I'm a gun guy who pretty much hates all gun guys.
Also, gun people are so used to loosing in the legal world, they don’t know how to win in any other category. To them, everything’s just always bad.
Gun people are just people and most people are intolerable to be around.
You're not alone, brother.
Ben seems realistic and down to earth. Not to mention....he shoots out multiple pistols every other year?
@@jadedclone6728 My favorite part about him is he is a master of low key trolling the fudds and high estrogen types.
All qc is down everywhere on everything. Period. Idk if people just have checked out or what. Not just firearms ammo cars planes etc etc. It's 2024 everything fuckin sucks bud.
Inflation is not only showing up in price but definitely in quality. Actual inflation is much much higher than official numbers.
A FRiend of mine bought a brand new colt ar that had frequent hammer follow out of the box. I've personally had issues with multiple rugers, taurus, amd kahr (of course). All brand new, can't trust shit these days.
Why are people’s accounts on reliability of “their” guns are so wide? Is it because people don’t really shoot with their guns or is it buyers bias? I want to switch over to shadow 2 competitively, but then I seen the unreliability in person. But people still simp for them.
Everything breaks, good products break less.
I hope future manufacturing of cz75s dont take on the spotty shadow 2 quality. Im curious as to what is the nicer piece, an sp01 after going to cajun or a shadow 2?
The only difference you’d notice is about a pound heavier trigger pull on DA with the SPO1 and about the same on SA vs the Shadow 2 the reset on SA will also be a little longer on SPO1 due to the firing pin block safety but it’s only about 2 mm difference. If both guns go to Cajun they’ll both be top notch performers and reliable. But if you’re comparing a stock S2 to a Cajun SP01 the Cajun gun will beat it every day
This is not a CZ or Staccato only problem, the 10/22 rifles are distinct in quality, depending on if they were made pre 2020 or 2020 and later. I had to replace everything on mine to make it reasonably reliable on the 2021 mfg dated one, the 2018 10/22 is still rock solid with stock parts. It gave me an excuse to build a race gun out of the newer 10/22.
I agree. The entire industry is heading that direction.
I have older Ruger 10/22 and they are horrible in terms of being jam o matics too
@@IvanRiveraStagea They know the new immigrant demographics don't know crap about guns, and will gladly pay for a lessened product. Literally told this by an insider once.
QC talk only gets people fired up that don't shoot a lot. Shooters will always complain about lack of QC. Case in point, LMT. If you don't shoot, you probably think LMT is great. If you shoot, you know LMT's quality control has slipped a ton, and would likely think twice about buying one.
Prove it
The same could be said of BCM as well, stuff made in 2020 is not on par with older BCM uppers.
@@tmgjurassic3738Seriously dude ? Did you not hear how LMT completely fumbled the first batch of NZ rifles?
@@echofoxtrotwhiskey1595 Was shooting a match this past weekend when someone with a new LMT piston 5.56 had their front trigger pin walk on them, and also had feeding issues due to the upper not getting the fitting-bumps filed down properly.
@@echofoxtrotwhiskey1595 The firing pins were replaced under warranty, the heat treating was bad and done by an outside vendor that has since been replaced in house. Same for some of the parts in the firing group.
Typical non competitive shooters are always surprise by us buying multiple of the same make and model for competition.
That’s because they buy 20 different guns and never shoot them, practicing is foreign to them.
Depends on the people you talk to.
I still dont understand it
@slick4415 really? Because you train with 1 gun, you get used to this gun so if you use any other gun your performance is worse because your training isn't performed with this other gun. Doesn't this make sense? You train with what you use in competition, nothing else. Muscle memory and everything will be worse if you switch.
Do you have a point?
Ben, I think the TTI Combat is series-built by Canik (that's why customer service is handled by Century Arms). Taran Butler has his name on it because he developed the design.
A ratio of something like 1 in 1,000 for guns with defects is acceptable for modern manufacturing. Something like Six Sigma will talk about 4 defects per million but that is for individual parts. When you look at a pistol with 30 to 100 parts, CZ is doing pretty well.
I started running P-10 F, C and S two yrs ago, never an issue and my backup / duplicates are sitting in wait. Several thousand rounds thru F and C no issues; about 650 rds thru S, no issues.
I purchased CZ and Dan Wesson from 2011 to 2017. Sad to hear things have gone down hill. I'm never selling, remember the old ones are the good ones when they come up in estate sales.
I own a CZ Shadow 2 and CZ P-09. I haven't had any issues with them but I wonder if that's because I always Cajunize my CZ with the pro upgrade kits from Cajun Gunworks?
CZ goes more over quantity instead of quality because the came so popular….
Some Engineers left and created KMR Precision Arms 😉
CZ Quality is pretty nuts, owned 2 shadows 1 had 0 issues, even after 30k on one gun. Than switched to Tactical Sport orage, got 2 of them 9mm and a 40. no issues on the TS. But! Of you compare the quality they visibly different, specially the 40 . Slide has some lack in the slide mount, is simply moving up and down. Annoyes me.
Friend of mine had the tactical sport 2 broze, imsgin you have to shoot more than a 1000 rounds to make it running.
When the shadow 2 came out, lot of shooters had issues and went back to the old shadow 1.
keep in mind back in days it was a „cheap“ gun did the job, With the new series they price politics went to the sky and the quality droped. Fact
Me personal view, i‘ll keep my old TS, since they the old gen but imm more happy since o swapped to glock. Interesting fact somehow
Boy I'm surprised by these opinions of CZ and the problems now found in them. I always thought they were like steel Swiss clocks.
My last Cz was a P01...10 years ago. It was awsome. I would have to find an older model to buy another.
Quality Control with everything has declined since the pandemic. The older experienced people retired and got out and were replaced with younger, less experienced people (those that actually want to work).
Ive had probs with all guns and they literally all malfunction about the same lol. Glocks are about as reliable as any other platform from my experience
When I got serious with competitive I would buy 2 of the same and like you one would become a match other practice/backup.
Around three years ago I had a little chat with Ernest Langdon and he told me he believed that Glock is one of the few manufacturers that have pretty much been pretty stable with the QC. Take that for what it's worth, but I believe it. I've bought a couple competition Glocks and they've been pretty problem free even compared to some LTT Berettas.
People get butthurt if you point out any deficiency, shortcoming or undesirable feature of their favorite gun.
QC in the gun industry right now is garbage. I'd wager close to half of the guns I've purchased in the last year have had something wrong with them out of the box. At this point, if I buy a new handgun, I have to assume something big, or small will be wrong with it. What's frustrating is sometimes the problem won't make itself known until you're 1,000 rounds in on the gun. It's honestly cheaper sometimes just to get a new gun than to waste money on parts and ammo chasing down a gremlin in the gun.
Love my PDP!
Colt went downhill when cz bought them then infected cz with the bad
😂 you really know how to get clicks.
I had good luck with CZs so far but I bought mine years ago. Things change and QC changes also. The only issue i had was the trigger return spring breaking in my P09 and Shadow 1. Bought some Cajun Gunworks springs for them.
Did he say 15k rounds across 100 different guns? I don't doubt he didn't get a malfunction when he only put 150 rounds in each.
My P10F manufactured 2022 had a broken firing pin at 250 live rounds and 1000 dry fires with snap caps. The main housing was canted in the guns frame. Trigger was inconsistent after brake in (before that it was so gritty, you wouldnt have noticed). Actually the trigger feel and break changed the lower the number of rounds in the magazine was. Less than 5 and you could feel each pull would move the slide up and down due to lower magazine spring tension. Not a huge deal for fast shooting, but for accurate shots and muscle memory it sucked. Tried to remedy the problem with a trigger job and some custom parts but was essentially a thing of tolerances stacking up.
What made things worse one reason for me buying the cz was I thought since Iam in europe I could get spares easier - cz has a web shop. first thing: they didnt care about the broken firing pin or any other problem, simply didnt answer my requests. And second the replacement parts I ordered by myself were of bad quality. Striker had a very bad burr in the sear engagement sureface, the new trigger bar/sear I ordered had casting marks literally on the sear surface. On that flat part there was a stap of approx half a millimeter on the engagement Trigger felt way worse with these parts with lots of creep after the wall. And you guessed it: customer service didnt care.
Sold the thing and replaced it with da VP9 (which is much better made btw, significantly more complicated internally though)
One of my favorites for the range is a Sig P320 and I get so much crap talk about using it. So many claim it's going to blow up in my hand or I will somehow drop it and kill half of the bystanders. Anyway, it is interesting to listen to the last several videos of other brands with QC or build issues. I did just get the Shadow 2 Compact as my first CZ and started my reliability tests. Only 100 rounds into it, but happy with it so far. I am enjoying this QC series.
Ben, is Glock the best gun?
The term I've heard that applies at @2:30 is "enShitification of everything"
Everything is getting worse, and it'll only keep getting worse.
Try going to a hospital if you really want to see piss poor QC...that is if you survive the visit.
Bingo
Price goes up quality goes down thems the rules. Companies ride on their initial reputation until it’s absolutely fucked and then get bought by foreign money and down the drain it goes
"CZ quality control isn't very good." *Laughs in Tanfoglio*
Not holding any punches! Love it!
Side question: what made you move away from the Tanfos? The QA you mentioned? Just trying something new?
Perhaps the change in distribution? They used to be imported and marketed by EAA.
@@IvanRiveraStagea
Who does it now?
@@onpsxmember”Italian Firearms Group”
He was sponsored by EAA. EAA is no longer the importer for Tanfoglio. EAA imports Turkish pistols now
I got a lemon Glock 10mm long slide. Replaced various parts including recoil spring assembly to no avail. Ended up just trading in at LGS. No confidence in that one
My first S2 has about 30K rounds without problems other than a broken slide release at 20K. My second S2 has about 20K on it and I just broke a slide release. They both start to hang up on feeding at about 1500-2000 rounds without a hose down. They both like to be slightly wet. Other than that no stovepipes or ejection problems. I know that someday I’ll have to replace an extractor but not yet.
So my series of 2 have performed splendidly.
It does appear to have dropped off in recent years. My guess is that CZ have worked out exactly how much the need to spend on their quality control to a point where it's "acceptable" and no more.
There’s no way it’s possible over 100 pistols and 15,000 rounds a year. You never had a single issue with either one of those.
Where were your CZ guns manufactured? In the Czech Republic or in the US?
Totally agree with your QA/QC perspective, Ben.
Stovepipes -- can they be a slide speed/recoil spring issue?
I have had them only with weak loads, that's why I ask.
Well glad we got to experience the obligatory “i have 1 million rounds through 15 different pistols and never had a single stove pipe” comment guy 😂
The only manufacturer who’s upped their qc game is Taurus lol. Every else just got worse.
there's several firearms companies who's QC sucks. plainly they slap them together and let the customer find the problems.
My competition Glock is a G17 G5 and I haven’t had a single failure with it. I have a G4 that had a failures that I use for practice only
I like your videos. You need less controversial topics LOL
Seems that some people just want to resist liking the PDP. Especially if you elude to the fact that they are more reliable than what they paid for their CZ or any other high priced gun. Perhaps they are just purchase justifying or have never really shot the Walther PDP. I’m not a rich guy, money is usually tight. But I liked my first full size 5 inch PDP so much, I bought a second one. One for irons and one for an optic.
This one also had issues that prevented them from being adopted by agencies (though Walther later addressed it).
@@aperson4057 I think you’re talking about how you would get a dead trigger after trying to fire with it slightly pressed out of battery and the trigger wouldn’t reset. I’ve heard they addressed it but I have one that is less than six months old and it still has the issue. So I’m not sure if they really addressed it yet. But since I’m not law-enforcement and will most likely not need to press my weapon against someone, it doesn’t really concern me too much.
I want to like mine, but my 5" is really snappy. I went down the rabbit hole of people saying they're over/undersprung, tried springs, Springco, brass backstrap, etc. and it's still too snappy. Makes me mad because I think their frame is my top 3 favorite feeling frames on any gun, been trying hard to make it work.
@@London_Mule Define snappy. Because mine sure isn’t. Maybe we have different definitions of “snappy”. I know both of mine return to target just as quick as any pistol I own and I can shoot it all day and my hands and wrists won’t be any worse that shooting any of my Glocks. 🤷🏼♂️
@@CitizenCarrier The muzzle climb is significantly worse when compared to my PPQ/Glocks/P10. Returning on target takes too long compared to the others, splits are way worse.
I have nothing but good things to say about my P01. Picked it up a couple years ago, pre Colt I guess, and it has functioned flawlessly. I've maybe 2500 rounds through it with no stovepipes, or anything going wrong. Keep in mind I don't mess around with a lot of different ammo. If I did, I might have a different story. As is, about all that I've used in it is Belom 124, Norma 124 and a handful of CCI. Wish I could say the same about my retired Canik. It suffered from not just occasional ammo issues, but also managed to break the chamber indicator. When that broke, it was down for the count.
It’s called en-shitification and describes how things have become crappier over the years. It’s a term used to describe AI too.
The movement of manufacture might explain why mags for p10 were difficult to find. May still be.
Would you shoot your XC in a match? Sorry if you addressed that in another post. ✌️
The P10 series is solid all around. Hard to find issues with it online in my experience
Good thing CZ released the P-10, a striker fired pistol is gonna be way harder for the American facilities to fuck up, or at least I haven’t heard of nearly as many problems with those
Anyway they did. I left a comment in Ben's previous video regarding my P10C
Glawk is the bestestest everrrrrrr. Jk they relatively are horrible but they work. Cz’s are an intro into race guns. They need maintenance and love like an exotic flower, but when you have one set up right it’s nice
Meh. Gen 5 Glocks are actually pretty good and in my experience CZ's don't need much maintenance or love - just add ammo & lube them every once in a while. If you start swapping out springs, ignition parts etc. might be a different story.
Talk about Atlas
Free views!
People get butthurt about QC due to their lack of critical thinking skills, lack of usage, making said firearm their entire personality and dressing them up like a barbie doll. Instead of using it as the tool it is. #isaidwhatisaid
I’m looking at buying a barely used CZ 75 TSO for a very good price, For my first race gun. With the problems CZ is having with QC should I take the chance or look at purchasing or a different gun?
No, you’ll be fine. Get the CZ.
Buy it with confidence, they are great guns. No matter what you go with, have a backup.
Don't take chances, get a cheap bore scope, check videos on how to check function, shoot it if possible before purchasing. Also look into if you actually buy a tactical sport orange and not a different orange model.
Recently talked to a Beretta rep and told him I had been looking at the LTT 92s. We both agreed they are pricey, but nice. He mentioned Beretta has a new frame mounted decocker only model and explained how it works. I said that sounds more complicated and asked why it is better than the slide G model decocker. He really never gave a good reason why it might be better, but I came away thinking companies are more worried about marketing new and improved models than making sure the current products work well.
Because they finally saw the market for a DS 1911 style pistol. We asked for a 92 that was single action with the safety on the frame like a 1911 back in 1996. The safety on the slide was easily engaged when clearing malfunctions.
It's better cause the market asked for it for years. The ones that didn't buy one that could decock or put on safe while racking the slide might buy some now. Th ones that already have a 92 might get one of those too. They created some waves pushing the competition models and the others now have to surf on that. How well the split decocker works we'll see. I don't think they'd risk their reputation of the main model without extensive testing.
Those are the twin-sear models. Aside from ergonomics, moving the decocker to the frame allowed them to eliminate the transfer bar/rod for the firing pin. This reduces friction by quite a bit; those new designs can take a mainspring that is 2lbs lighter while getting the same ignition reliability.
@@randyreviewsit To be fair, the GTS comes with the Xtreme-S trigger group that is already very good out of the box. A match hammer and maybe a lighter hammer spring on that will get it to a very sweet form (basing on my experience with 92X Performance models that share the same components minus the twin sear).
For bullets nosediving a common cause can be the slide outrunning the magazine spring. Try re-springing the mags with some wolff extra power springs, might fix the issue. Speaking of CZ quality control, this has happened with factory CZ mags too. Not so much on the big guns but I also have a little 2075 RAMI which has a bit more narrow window of operation. Factory full size magazines fit and kinda work in the gun but towards the end of the mag you will start getting nosedives if they have factory springs. The shorter 10 and 14rd mags that come with the gun are fine and anything I have re-sprung with Grams springs or something works fine.
Appreciate the candor.
Solid point there time & $$ to correct problems.
This is why brands matter - trust the brand to get it right. Bad QC damages the brand.
QC problems are cyclical & fixable - pointing out problems like this is important, encourages manufacturers to fix their processes. Thanks!!
I think you like to trigger the fan boys that are attached to their so called “tool” like it’s their child. I love it Ben keep up the good work