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My favorite part is the scene where they are being sieged by angry watchers and Ciara hears her own voice from outside and says, "Is that one of them?" Like girl, who else would it be???
Yeah, too often is it some ambiguously evil force or it's demonic. Never enough fey, it's a whole other aesthetic and almost feels more grounded in a way? Like Fey feel like an unnatural natural part of the world.
I was just going to say that I think the next book will reveal that Mina's mother was a daywalker, and that's why they have been watching her: some to ensure her safety, and the others for their nefarious purposes. I wouldn't be surprised if it turns out the bird job was the others luring her to the changelings' domain. I think you're right about the changelings/twins thing, but it could turn out that Mina doesn't have a sister at all and the twin she hasn't talked to is just her subconscious mind, which has control over her shapeshifting.
@@gregoryvn3 Media of right now would ruin that premise instantly. If its written by a competent write than I would welcome it but it of its not, well sorry to say that's gonna crash real hard
I find "broke artist still having an apartment after 2 months" more believable than "university kept a dead guy's office in tact" and that says something considering the housing market in most cities
Rich directors' idea of a 'struggling artist' is always entertaining to see. It's always some chik flat in an expensive district, as if that's not the DREAM of someone struggling🤦♂️
I agree! I actually really like over the top bad movies because they become entertaining. Or if I can feel they at least really tried for something interesting, even if it doesn't come together well. This just fumbled the premise
Especially in the horror or thriller genre. It's so much easier to fuck up than to be bland. Like please at this point if you know you're being bland accept it and dial up the camp or the stupid. It's so easy.
@@alexv3372 in a lot of cases, movies, (especially cheap ones) are actually used to launder money, not necessarily waste it. But since time is also money and people waste time by watching them...😢
It’s been said before, the worst thing a movie can possibly be is boring. Even a bad movie can be entertaining, but a boring movie will swiftly forgotten.
While it's nice to see Ishana following her dad's foray into filmmaking, it seems like she's inherited his ability to create stories with interesting premises, muddled execution, and overall waste of potential.
I got the impression in the book that she almost had begun to think of herself as Madeline. That her being Madeline for so long made it almost forget she was anything other than this woman, and that she helped them escape because she was so committed to the role it didn't occur to her to do anything else.
As a habitual Wikipedia bug I gotta say I'm a big fan of Ishana's page being so informative that it basically says "look shes either 24 or 25. Here's two possible years she may have started existing that's the best we can do"
and yet gets a full budget production because nepotismmmmm. normally im pretty reserved on calling someone a nepo baby if they actually show skill and talent (even if thats party because it's fostered by their environment) but this is just a straight up nepo baby production.
@@Fleato I wholeheartedly agree with your deduction of nepobabies. Some are genuinely talented and actually earned their spot, at least more than others. Look at Stella McCartney, she's got a whole ass luxury fashion brand that she started from scratch and she's *hella* talented - even though fashion isn't really my cup of tea. Then we have people like this woman, who's father has made one or two good movies _(in my view, some people adore his style),_ and she gets an entire full-length movie to play with when there are *soooooo* many people who are better suited to take control over the project. That just pisses me off.
@@Fleato And heck even when they have talent in their own right there are times the nepotism is still fairly open for interpretation. Joe Hill has written some good stuff but lets be honest dude looks just like Stephan King in a different font so ya have to wonder how much the name change actually avoided preferential treatment
insane to say she isn't a nepo baby when I'm willing to bet the majority of people who watched this movie did so because she's shyamalan's daughter (me included!!)
+ her last name is featured heavily in local posters, the font far bigger than the the font of her given name. it's so very obvious that's the reason she was able to make this movie. and of course it doesn't help that she's actively trying to make a copy of her father's work.
I didn’t know my son picked it at the theater because the title is interesting flipped a coin it was this or Garfield lol 😂. This was not bad or good but he liked it so win win.
AND she's not even doing a good job at it, sadly. But I ascribe that to her being still inexperienced. I really hope that she manages to find her own style/vision and goes her own way creatively. I see no point in being a nepo baby without using all those opportunities as freedom to carve your own path the easier way.
Considering she had worked behind the scenes of his films, it’s not really shocking she picked up on his decent and worst qualities in execution for the whole
Like daughter like father both making movies that will either hit well with audiences or will completely miss the mark. Unfortunately she started off poorly with a great concept tho.
You just have to ignore that this island of Ireland has Europe's least amount of forests, and that even an immigrant in Galway or any rural area would soon know allllllll the townlands and rural areas within 50 miles of them, so getting lost in Ireland would require about the same amount of determination and plausibility as drowning in the shower, and Then you can, uh, I feel I'm supposed to type 'enjoy the film' there.
the book (by an Irish author) has it listed as something in Connemara forest, not sure if that would check out lol - I didn't mention but the forest itself, at least in the movie - does have some weird magic effect where once you get deep enough, you can't get out without a compass, or a guide like the bird - her car disappears once she gets a bit too far away from it and probably why dude in the beginning ended up back where he started
@@AmandaTheJediIt's fine. It's the kind of thing that foreigners wouldn't know (my mum is from down that whole Connemara direction, so we had a Lot of holidays down at Granny's as kids) - but Connemara, Mayo, Galway regions are particularly unforested areas, but are intricately crisscrossed with rural roads - so much so that that part of the island has miles and miles of The Burren area (think: the moon, crossed with Iceland). By comparison, one of our filmmakers might as well have headed off to Utah to set a film in the, err, lush rainforests there, or made their protagonist get lost in Pennsylvania's infamous deserts. Anyway. Only Irish people will scoff at the film's setting, and it Is just a film at the end of the day. Keep up the great channel work - longtime viewer, here in my distinctly monster (and forest) free part of Ireland!
@vercoda9997 came here to say this, no forest in Ireland (esp the west) is nearly big enough for it to make logistical sense and I can't stop picturing that they're 2 minutes away from a marked trail with people jogging and dog walkers :') I'd maybe accept it being set in a bog? But even then, you'd be able to see a road or someone's house in the distance...
@@JackalopeBunny While running to the boat, Mina takes the time to stop and let the bird out of the birdcage...only to keep running with the birdcage. I guess she didn't want to bang the bird around while running but why keep the cage when 1) you're literally running for your life and 2) if the bird even comes back to you, you probably don't even need the cage at that point...?
Me too she's genuinely one of my favourite reviewers. I like her comparisons, details, pointing out plot holes/inconsistencies and added judgement and humour.
@@NotAnotherKuromi even when she’s critical she brings up fair arguments and isn’t bashing just to hate on something and tear it apart. Very refreshing.
Please tell me I'm not the only one who watched this waiting for a plot twist where it turns out that either Mina herself or her twin sister is also a changeling who somehow came from these woods. Like. It's such a perfect setup considering the themes of the movie it would've made SO MUCH sense especially with the context of Mina being watched even before being put in the forest like maybe they were trying to get back one of their own who had been long lost or maybe they were trying to get rid of her sister's counterpart I feel like that reveal could've made the movie just a little bit more interesting but then again if there's a sequel maybe they'll explore that later on still
I got super hung up on the building of the bunker… so how exactly did the professor find 13 workers a day and how bloody long did this take? Let’s say 2 months because I doubt he found a ready built bunker on Amazon. He sacrificed almost 800 workers and NO ONE found out? I mean where did he find these workers (must have been somewhat local), how did the construction companies deliver the goods (address: creepy fairy forest, stop where your mobile phone stops working?) I just can’t with this 🤣
Yes, in watching the video, I also got fixated on questions about how the bunker was built. Somebody had to get in and out every day for a while to build it ...
those are my thoughts most times when super-special buildings are brought up. like who built the villain lair or bat cave, and who's responsible for their upkeep? there's no way you could get away with just straight up murdering all those people and keeping things hidden.
As an Irish person, we have a ton of fascinating lore that I'd love to see explored more in the horror genre. This movie really could've been something special. It sucks that 2024 in general has been a pretty disappointing year when it comes to horror films.
I don’t mind Nepo babies as much if they actually have the talent. Sure, their name got them in the door and/or hired, but at least be good at whatever you’re doing. Like Nicholas cage, he tried changing his name, but I’m sure they all knew who he really was
I agree! There's lot's of people that I'm a fan of that back up the foot in the door. As long as they're willing to acknowledge the foot in the door I'm totally cool with it and don't blame anyone for taking advantage of things offered to them when it would be almost impossible not to.
Would no one have questions as to why so many people are missing in this particular forest? Like it seems like a preserved board full of decades of missing people posters would be more infamous.
The Watchers would be a lot better with a rewrite. Cut out the opening section, cut out the ultra heavy exposition, and during the scene with the main character and the old woman are locked out, have them hide BEYOND the barrier. This does two things; first, they’ll be safe to explore somewhat as we’re assuming the fairies aren’t looking for them there (why would you look that far when you know nobody would go there because they’d never make it back), and second, it casts doubt on the old woman (why does she know so much, how can she survive so long). Sending them beyond the barrier also helps keep the fairies hidden, and only reveal then when they get to the boat, which ends the movie with ambiguity, and actually end it there. The entire end act of the university and beyond is useless. This is one of the few instances where the book ends shit and the movie could have ended better.
I wanted so badly for this movie to be good. Also I suspected from the start that Madeline was a watcher/changeling, but I wasn't thinking about the fact that they can't come out in daylight so I kept wondering why any of them trusted her/weren't suspicious of her until that point was brought up again when Mina was discovering that there were half-human half-watcher things. Also it made me irrationally annoyed that the sisters are named Mina and Lucy because with the whole 'we could cheat death' thing, I had a moment where I thought like what if Lucy actually also died in the crash and Mina had a struggle with wanting to bring her twin back (and then there would be slightly more of a justification for this random Dracula reference). I know that wouldn't make sense in the narrative the way it's written and that Mina's shoehorned backstory was already adding too much but idk at least that would have been something more compelling and thought-provoking.
This hurt honestly because the trailer did look SO good and it’s like the story was tailor made to my interests!!! and then….That. 😖 I changed my mind, I never want A Book of Tongues adapted into a movie
"being able to look back at the little things that end up building up to what the twist ends up being" - oh, you mean like when Benoit Blanc looks down at Marta's shoes literally the first moment he meets her? A tiny little gesture so natural that you still might not clock it on a second watch, but he does, and it's *chef's kiss.* So many movies could learn so much from Knives Out. Goddamn.
I love how the professor was able to sacrifice 13 building contractors a day while making his box with the basement underneath without anyone noticing. Like, let's say the construction takes a couple of months (which is a VERRRY generous estimate considering it's a full build including groundworks, power that seems to be on an internal generator & specialised features like a massive wall of glass etc). Basic concrete foundations for example, take about 25-28 days to fully set. Plus, each worker is essentially on site only ONE day, so it's not likely work would move quickly with each of them having to figure out what stage the previous day's workers were up to. That's about 700 people - gone in 2 months. & they're ALL builders/electricians/contractors. In real life there've been about 60 missing people NOT FOUND in all of Ireland since 2022. But suddenly, all these workers, all from the same industry, who're all doing a job in some random forest, go missing at once after their first day & it seems to go unnoticed. Like, there are flyers up saying 'where are the missing people?' But you'd think Ireland would be like, 'why aren't there any builders left in our country?' way before then.
00:58 Okay, so I haven't watched "Abigail" or watched any videos about "Abigail", but I'm gonna go ahead and guess that the person referenced in this clip (Sammy) was trying to find the vegetable or whatever that repels vampires and went with onions instead of garlic. Was I right?
I saw this in the theater, and I thought we were going to see that Mina wasn’t actually talking to her sister and that she replaced her when the car crashed because she didn’t want to say that she was the one who caused it?
I like when she is in the car in the morning, talking to the bird about her sneaky, sneaky, night out in a wig. Then, you see her car pull away from the THEATRICAL COSTUMES STORE - So, she RENTED the wig?! She couldn't just BUY a wig on amazon!?
I had no idea this was based on a book, I just saw the name "Shyamalan" on the poster and was like "Hell yeah, that'll do me for a bad horror movie!" (I try to watch the worst horror movie in theaters every month or so). I couldn't say it was bad, but it was so…so…I don't know, sloppy? Several scenes of high tension needed a few more seconds to breathe but were cut short, and several scenes that really weren't needed went on way too long. Stilted dialogue was something I was expecting from Shyamalan (I didn't realize this was his daughter, I thought it was the man himself), so I let that slide, but yeah, the twist made no sense. Because of Mina's thing posing as someone else at the start, when halflings came up, I thought the twist was going to be that SHE was a halfling, that would have been a much better twist! But I guess if the book did it better I can forgive it in hindsight. All in all, the only thing I cared about throughout the movie was that the bird had to live, I was far more worried about the bird than any of the human or faery characters lol. XD
I think what might have helped is if there wasn’t a drawn out intro, like if this more closely resembled the movie “circle”. No explanation, right into the thick of things and we get semi-backstory later. But something I really love about the movie circle is that you don’t actually get to know anyone because you learn very few names and can only see who these people are in the worst circumstance.
I hate when there’s a book that effectively does the horror, and then they make it into a movie and the movie’s like “this isn’t scary enough! Let’s add more scary things!” Like let there be *some* subtlety.
Most of Europe has strong renters protection. It's practically impossible for her to have lost her apartment in two months. And if she was officially declared missing I'm sure there would be even more red tape.
we really need a nice satire movie where all the creepy horror tropes are avoided and they live out a boring life. "going into this creepy wood with creepy signs all around and no cell phone coverage? nope!". "going outside alone in the middle of the night to investigate a creepy noise? nope!" "staying in this creepy abandoned house to wait out the rain? nope!" call the movie 'common sense of surviving' and be done with is.
So Shyamalan actually funds his own movies with Blumhouse style budgets, then Universal does the distribution because they're always profitable even when people don't love them. Low budget, high reward.
I could not get over the logistical nightmare that would have been building that bunker. Unless it was built in a few days, people would have definitely noticed the amount of people necessary to build it, go missing. How did they get the materials in? How did he keep hiring people without anyone wondering where the last crew is? I can suspend my belief pretty far, but this one bridge to many.
Shyamalan's scenes can seem like film scenes to me. It's like I can hear him say, "...and action!" It's not the actors; it's his directorial style. @4:51 is an example. Dakota is a pro, but here, it's like she's reading a script. It's not just the text. It's the flat delivery. She could be reading the dialog off flashcards for the first time. It's not every scene, but there's always a few.
I’m gonna come back to the video after I finish reading the book (I’m about an hour into the book) but one thing that immediately stands out as a missed opportunity is the fact that they stripped any personality or character from Mina. In the beginning of the novel she is sad, yes, but she’s also sassy and funny, and even kind. She goes as far as planning to ration her water for the parrot to be able to have some as she carries the cage through the woods. The book version of Mina seems better suited to be telling the story than the movie’s portrayal of her and is more entertaining to follow then whatever bad direction poor Dakota was giving Edit: absolutely recommend the book for anyone curious about what this premise looks like when executed well!!!!
@@AmandaTheJediand it’s a double bummer since it’s not even executed well. It feels like a lot of horror directors lately are trying to copy movies with tragically monotone female characters (hereditary, the boogeyman, etc) without understanding how and why it works with the movies the theme is popular with.
I was astounded by the amount of hand holding in this movie. My favorite was when Mina firsts gets separated from her car - she looks behind her, realizes she's lost, and says aloud "I'm lost". It then starts to get dark; "it's getting dark" she says. Also idk how tf that bird managed to stay alive in that tiny cage all that time. I honestly thought it got released offscreen or smth bc there's a huge chunk of the movie where they completely forget about it. But no, it is Plot Device Bird so it's not only alive but healthy enough to fly at the end lmfao
gonna be honest, until the 3.30 mark i thought this video was about humane, which is cronenberg's daughter's debut film. but in my head all i could remember was nepo daughter, one word title film, so it must be that :') edit: 10 minutes later i realise 'the watchers' has two words, not one, but somehow i completely skipped over 'the'. wrong on ever single count here lads
I feel like folks who find the premise of this movie interesting but the execution lacking should deffo try the podcast The Silt Verses - amazing folk horror / fantasy.
Just watched this last night. I kept laughing at how often they say “the watchers.” At the end I was just like… okay lol. There was only one shot I really liked which was when Dakota was mirrored on the tinted glass- I think in the tapping scene. I also liked Darwin because he’s a beautiful yellow bird. The movie doesn’t accomplish what it set out to do - no real suspense, no real focus on atmosphere, no real characterization. It felt like a super cut of cliché
small point of interest. Mark Twain's office is intact and on display (where you can look through things like in this movie) at Elmira College. Really cool. But, I'm sure people only really fundraise/save an office of really famous people (aka Mark Twain's office)
There were elements I liked about this movie/plot: 1) the scenery; 2) the bunker; 3) the mystic mystery. Outside those three elements, the plot felt very uneven. I remember thinking the movie invested waaaaaaaay too much time depicting Mina’s life in Dublin, when it should have started with her leaving to deliver the bird. Once in the forest, the movie invested waaaaaaaay too little time focuses on the changelings, and instead became a survivalist subplot. Like I said above, the bunker was one of the most intriguing aspects going into this movie, as depicted in the trailers. Mina should have discovered the lab maybe in the second night. Mina was the catalyst of chaos and I have no idea why the movie tried to integrate her into the bunker’s exhibitionist routine as a major plot point. Instead, we should have gotten “The Ring” paranormal research in the basement lab and exploration into the forest have gone from there. Again, super uneven movie that was afraid to take plot points from the book and ADAPT them to work in a movie medium.
I feel like if someone had life altering trauma resulting in their mother's death for 'not following the rules', they would turn into the world's strictest rule follower
I didn’t think it was terrible. I do feel bad because I feel that just because it was his daughter people already went into it with a jaded opinion. I don’t think I would watch it again but I feel like if it had another rewrite it would have been worth maybe a rental.
I might be a psycho for this but it was so fucking funny when ‘I HATE YOU I HATE YOU’ *hand gets crushed by window* *car crash*. It happened so fast and so unexpectedly that I found it hilarious
I watched this movie with my mom last week; and my parents own a pet conure. We absolutely had to make sure it was identified correctly(it was) but my favourite part of the movie was just that - it features a type of bird my parents own. SPOILER but the best part of the movie to me is how the ending confrontation with the *fairy* literally boiled down to "Dude you're actually a half fairy" "Wait what holy shit you have a point nevermind we good fam bye"
This movie especially pissed me off because the fae make AMAZING horror movie villains (see The Hallow for a better/actually Irish example of this), and she made them... the most generic monsters ever, I guess.
I really enjoyed the movie but now that I saw your review I REALLY hope they do an extended cut with the guys backstory, it would have elevated the story 10 fold!
I liked this movie a lot, but it lost me during the exposition dump at the stone circle in the escape because the lore sounded more like something from the New Afe section rather than any of the changeling lore I know by virtue of being a mythology nerd. And the big twist with Mina, while it could have been fun, was just used to make her a generic monster for a single scene.
Its like the reverse of The Village. Where people are pretending there's monsters trapping them. Where this one has people being the monsters and trapping fea creatures.
@@Acme633 a lot of movies gloss over things they don't find "essential" like most ignore bathroom usage. Some of the world building too wouldn't make sense if there were fairies that can't stand metal, then people could go out and about as long as they put some metal around their body, but for the story itself they don't really bother thinking through scenarios. (Especially some zombie movies where its like a ladder would prevent the whole thing)
@@chaosryans "Bathroom usage" is not an appropriate comparison - that was simply not shown. For people who were stranded or trapped (like Tom Hanks in Castaway), you have to show how they managed to survive.
@@Acme633 yeah, unless the story teller doesn't think that it's important. Castaway shows his survival and sanity etc, but they only mention the actual duration of his absence at the end 1 time since the story works out essentially the same if it's 6 months, 1 year, or 3 years.
THANK YOU! Had a horror movie sleepover with my best friend (highly recommend) and this was one of his two choices. I made the same comments about the dialogue and the talking to the bird and he kept making excuses for it. Another thing that really pissed me off was the introduced a plant that helps with blood loss or something and I commented to my friend “wow I wonder if that will ever come in handy”. AND GUESS WHAT. NEVER DID. Bad writing 😂 It was nice to see Dakota Fanning though.
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They could of followed the book.
I wanted to use this but they don't offer Japanese 😢💔
amanda why are you so cool :)
I love how you sound like an Acadian when you are speaking French, it is chef’s kiss. 🤌🏻
My favorite part is the scene where they are being sieged by angry watchers and Ciara hears her own voice from outside and says, "Is that one of them?" Like girl, who else would it be???
It's Flo from Progressive!
😂😂
If I’m me… and that’s also me… who’s piloting the plane??!
💀 not Flooo.
@@AmandaTheJedi Have you seen the trailer for Mark Wahlberg's new film 'Flight Risk'? I was completely distracted by Mark's new hairline 😂
Fairy folklore is terribly underused in thriller/horror stories! It could be so cool and creepy if it was done right.
Yes! Fae can be so terrifying in their capricious inhumanity.
I think Pan’s Labyrinth did it super well, creating the perfect dark fairytale lol
I super strongly Agree!!
Yeah, too often is it some ambiguously evil force or it's demonic. Never enough fey, it's a whole other aesthetic and almost feels more grounded in a way? Like Fey feel like an unnatural natural part of the world.
Correct, which is why I'm hoping the monsters in From are fae.
Gotta love she’s keeping up the tradition of starting out strong and flaming out spectacularly.
This didn't even start out strong, to be honest.
Too mean 😂😂😂 but not really
Nah this movie was man butt from beginning to end.
Don't forget in Irish folklore that twins are generally thought to be a bad omen. And that one of the twins is a changling child.
I was just going to say that I think the next book will reveal that Mina's mother was a daywalker, and that's why they have been watching her: some to ensure her safety, and the others for their nefarious purposes.
I wouldn't be surprised if it turns out the bird job was the others luring her to the changelings' domain.
I think you're right about the changelings/twins thing, but it could turn out that Mina doesn't have a sister at all and the twin she hasn't talked to is just her subconscious mind, which has control over her shapeshifting.
@@alphalancer Ohhhhhhhh that is much more in line with the feeling of the book!
that sounds really horrible, I betcha many twins suffered from this folklore.
@@benzaiten933 twins are considered bad omens in a couple of cultures unfortunately.
My mom thinks that identical twins share a single soul and is really creeped out by them lol
my dyslexia really messed up this time because I read the title as "slenderman's daughter" and not "shyamalan's daughter". was very confused at first
amanda should review that one too /j
That would have been way more interesting.
@@gregoryvn3 Media of right now would ruin that premise instantly. If its written by a competent write than I would welcome it but it of its not, well sorry to say that's gonna crash real hard
idk if I’d call that a mess up, that sounds like a more interesting movie lmao
"Slenderman is a proud father" -- Strange Aeons
I find "broke artist still having an apartment after 2 months" more believable than "university kept a dead guy's office in tact" and that says something considering the housing market in most cities
Rich directors' idea of a 'struggling artist' is always entertaining to see. It's always some chik flat in an expensive district, as if that's not the DREAM of someone struggling🤦♂️
In Galway no less too
@@criminalsen2441 whats chik
@@criminalsen2441 ohhh its probably another spelling of chic sorry
"Bland" movies are probably the worst kind of movies you can make. Like if it's shit people would at least engage with it by making fun of it.
I agree! I actually really like over the top bad movies because they become entertaining. Or if I can feel they at least really tried for something interesting, even if it doesn't come together well. This just fumbled the premise
I wish there was law against these kinds of movies
You’re wasting money and people times
Especially in the horror or thriller genre. It's so much easier to fuck up than to be bland. Like please at this point if you know you're being bland accept it and dial up the camp or the stupid. It's so easy.
@@alexv3372 in a lot of cases, movies, (especially cheap ones) are actually used to launder money, not necessarily waste it.
But since time is also money and people waste time by watching them...😢
It’s been said before, the worst thing a movie can possibly be is boring. Even a bad movie can be entertaining, but a boring movie will swiftly forgotten.
While it's nice to see Ishana following her dad's foray into filmmaking, it seems like she's inherited his ability to create stories with interesting premises, muddled execution, and overall waste of potential.
And suck the life out of other people’s stories through adaptation 😒
I mean it's based on a book so she didn't really "create" anything, she just adapted it.
@@SjofnBM1989directors still create
Turns out incompetence is hereditary
I'm surprised that many people don't like this film, it's not that bad I want a sequel or prequel for no reason 😭
“Please send book” me to the library
I got the impression in the book that she almost had begun to think of herself as Madeline. That her being Madeline for so long made it almost forget she was anything other than this woman, and that she helped them escape because she was so committed to the role it didn't occur to her to do anything else.
As a habitual Wikipedia bug I gotta say I'm a big fan of Ishana's page being so informative that it basically says "look shes either 24 or 25. Here's two possible years she may have started existing that's the best we can do"
and yet gets a full budget production because nepotismmmmm.
normally im pretty reserved on calling someone a nepo baby if they actually show skill and talent (even if thats party because it's fostered by their environment) but this is just a straight up nepo baby production.
@@Fleato I wholeheartedly agree with your deduction of nepobabies. Some are genuinely talented and actually earned their spot, at least more than others. Look at Stella McCartney, she's got a whole ass luxury fashion brand that she started from scratch and she's *hella* talented - even though fashion isn't really my cup of tea.
Then we have people like this woman, who's father has made one or two good movies _(in my view, some people adore his style),_ and she gets an entire full-length movie to play with when there are *soooooo* many people who are better suited to take control over the project. That just pisses me off.
@@tessiepinkman Jack Quaid and Maya Hawke come to mind as well, have famous parents but they're damn good at what they do.
@@Jake-wi1wv I love Jack Quaid, he's great
@@Fleato And heck even when they have talent in their own right there are times the nepotism is still fairly open for interpretation. Joe Hill has written some good stuff but lets be honest dude looks just like Stephan King in a different font so ya have to wonder how much the name change actually avoided preferential treatment
insane to say she isn't a nepo baby when I'm willing to bet the majority of people who watched this movie did so because she's shyamalan's daughter (me included!!)
I thought it looked interesting before knowing it was her, but yeah I really hoped him being her father would have given this an edge in some areas
i just saw shyamalan and thought it was his film until the credits
In the trailer of a new M. Night's movie you can see a billboard promoting "The watchers" strategically placed in one of the shots lol
+ her last name is featured heavily in local posters, the font far bigger than the the font of her given name. it's so very obvious that's the reason she was able to make this movie.
and of course it doesn't help that she's actively trying to make a copy of her father's work.
I didn’t know my son picked it at the theater because the title is interesting flipped a coin it was this or Garfield lol 😂. This was not bad or good but he liked it so win win.
I know it's not really fair to compare Ishana to her father, but it feels like she's TRYING to copy all his tropes, for better AND worse
He's probably been her mentor. So she would have less gotten less than stellar advice.
AND she's not even doing a good job at it, sadly. But I ascribe that to her being still inexperienced. I really hope that she manages to find her own style/vision and goes her own way creatively. I see no point in being a nepo baby without using all those opportunities as freedom to carve your own path the easier way.
Considering she had worked behind the scenes of his films, it’s not really shocking she picked up on his decent and worst qualities in execution for the whole
Like daughter like father both making movies that will either hit well with audiences or will completely miss the mark. Unfortunately she started off poorly with a great concept tho.
Sadly the concept wasn't even hers so she can't really take credit for that either
@@AmandaTheJeditrue I suppose
I wish she could've started with an original story cause it give her more freedom to work with
@@AmandaTheJedishe can take credit for being m night’s daughter though
The book was awful.
You just have to ignore that this island of Ireland has Europe's least amount of forests, and that even an immigrant in Galway or any rural area would soon know allllllll the townlands and rural areas within 50 miles of them, so getting lost in Ireland would require about the same amount of determination and plausibility as drowning in the shower, and Then you can, uh, I feel I'm supposed to type 'enjoy the film' there.
the book (by an Irish author) has it listed as something in Connemara forest, not sure if that would check out lol - I didn't mention but the forest itself, at least in the movie - does have some weird magic effect where once you get deep enough, you can't get out without a compass, or a guide like the bird - her car disappears once she gets a bit too far away from it and probably why dude in the beginning ended up back where he started
That sounds like a challenge my negative sense of direction would gladly accept!
@@AmandaTheJediIt's fine. It's the kind of thing that foreigners wouldn't know (my mum is from down that whole Connemara direction, so we had a Lot of holidays down at Granny's as kids) - but Connemara, Mayo, Galway regions are particularly unforested areas, but are intricately crisscrossed with rural roads - so much so that that part of the island has miles and miles of The Burren area (think: the moon, crossed with Iceland).
By comparison, one of our filmmakers might as well have headed off to Utah to set a film in the, err, lush rainforests there, or made their protagonist get lost in Pennsylvania's infamous deserts.
Anyway. Only Irish people will scoff at the film's setting, and it Is just a film at the end of the day.
Keep up the great channel work - longtime viewer, here in my distinctly monster (and forest) free part of Ireland!
Fun fact! It used to be 80% forested, reaching a low of 1% in the early 20th century. It’s up to 11% now, the lowest in Europe
@vercoda9997 came here to say this, no forest in Ireland (esp the west) is nearly big enough for it to make logistical sense and I can't stop picturing that they're 2 minutes away from a marked trail with people jogging and dog walkers :')
I'd maybe accept it being set in a bog? But even then, you'd be able to see a road or someone's house in the distance...
"So what's your story? What are you running from?"
>hard cut to a parrot staring blankly at her<
The snort laugh that came out of me omfg 😂💀
I felt the parrot was under used and honestly I felt awful it was stuck inside a tiny cage.
@@JackalopeBunny While running to the boat, Mina takes the time to stop and let the bird out of the birdcage...only to keep running with the birdcage. I guess she didn't want to bang the bird around while running but why keep the cage when 1) you're literally running for your life and 2) if the bird even comes back to you, you probably don't even need the cage at that point...?
I just find Amanda's critical analysis so exceptional. I especially appreciated all the comparisons to the book version.
Me too she's genuinely one of my favourite reviewers. I like her comparisons, details, pointing out plot holes/inconsistencies and added judgement and humour.
@@NotAnotherKuromi even when she’s critical she brings up fair arguments and isn’t bashing just to hate on something and tear it apart. Very refreshing.
I also appreciate when reviewers take the source material into account.
Please tell me I'm not the only one who watched this waiting for a plot twist where it turns out that either Mina herself or her twin sister is also a changeling who somehow came from these woods. Like. It's such a perfect setup considering the themes of the movie it would've made SO MUCH sense especially with the context of Mina being watched even before being put in the forest like maybe they were trying to get back one of their own who had been long lost or maybe they were trying to get rid of her sister's counterpart I feel like that reveal could've made the movie just a little bit more interesting but then again if there's a sequel maybe they'll explore that later on still
Yeah felt like a setup to a sequel that would have led to just that happening
I got super hung up on the building of the bunker… so how exactly did the professor find 13 workers a day and how bloody long did this take? Let’s say 2 months because I doubt he found a ready built bunker on Amazon. He sacrificed almost 800 workers and NO ONE found out? I mean where did he find these workers (must have been somewhat local), how did the construction companies deliver the goods (address: creepy fairy forest, stop where your mobile phone stops working?) I just can’t with this 🤣
Yes, in watching the video, I also got fixated on questions about how the bunker was built. Somebody had to get in and out every day for a while to build it ...
It's explained more in the book. The professor was ruthless. The book encapsulates all of the survival horror and the twisted mind of the professor.
@@ashanein the film has really turned me off from reading the book, so you’d say it’s worth reading it?
those are my thoughts most times when super-special buildings are brought up. like who built the villain lair or bat cave, and who's responsible for their upkeep? there's no way you could get away with just straight up murdering all those people and keeping things hidden.
Does it explain how he sacrificed hundreds of people and none noticed? Or how he got the materials there? @@ashanein
"Don't be emo to the bird."
I legitimately kept getting this confused with “The Strangers: Chapter 1” and assuming it was the start of a franchise
As an Irish person, we have a ton of fascinating lore that I'd love to see explored more in the horror genre. This movie really could've been something special. It sucks that 2024 in general has been a pretty disappointing year when it comes to horror films.
I don’t mind Nepo babies as much if they actually have the talent. Sure, their name got them in the door and/or hired, but at least be good at whatever you’re doing. Like Nicholas cage, he tried changing his name, but I’m sure they all knew who he really was
I agree! There's lot's of people that I'm a fan of that back up the foot in the door. As long as they're willing to acknowledge the foot in the door I'm totally cool with it and don't blame anyone for taking advantage of things offered to them when it would be almost impossible not to.
I have a similar opinion, like the name can open a door but it won't guarantee you staying for long.
Would no one have questions as to why so many people are missing in this particular forest? Like it seems like a preserved board full of decades of missing people posters would be more infamous.
Especislly considering it's in a wierd place. Like why not put it in a city or maybe like a ranger station?
“Ah, not citizens of vape nation” made me LOSE it
The Watchers would be a lot better with a rewrite. Cut out the opening section, cut out the ultra heavy exposition, and during the scene with the main character and the old woman are locked out, have them hide BEYOND the barrier. This does two things; first, they’ll be safe to explore somewhat as we’re assuming the fairies aren’t looking for them there (why would you look that far when you know nobody would go there because they’d never make it back), and second, it casts doubt on the old woman (why does she know so much, how can she survive so long). Sending them beyond the barrier also helps keep the fairies hidden, and only reveal then when they get to the boat, which ends the movie with ambiguity, and actually end it there. The entire end act of the university and beyond is useless.
This is one of the few instances where the book ends shit and the movie could have ended better.
I wanted so badly for this movie to be good. Also I suspected from the start that Madeline was a watcher/changeling, but I wasn't thinking about the fact that they can't come out in daylight so I kept wondering why any of them trusted her/weren't suspicious of her until that point was brought up again when Mina was discovering that there were half-human half-watcher things.
Also it made me irrationally annoyed that the sisters are named Mina and Lucy because with the whole 'we could cheat death' thing, I had a moment where I thought like what if Lucy actually also died in the crash and Mina had a struggle with wanting to bring her twin back (and then there would be slightly more of a justification for this random Dracula reference). I know that wouldn't make sense in the narrative the way it's written and that Mina's shoehorned backstory was already adding too much but idk at least that would have been something more compelling and thought-provoking.
This hurt honestly because the trailer did look SO good and it’s like the story was tailor made to my interests!!! and then….That. 😖 I changed my mind, I never want A Book of Tongues adapted into a movie
"being able to look back at the little things that end up building up to what the twist ends up being" - oh, you mean like when Benoit Blanc looks down at Marta's shoes literally the first moment he meets her? A tiny little gesture so natural that you still might not clock it on a second watch, but he does, and it's *chef's kiss.* So many movies could learn so much from Knives Out. Goddamn.
I love how the professor was able to sacrifice 13 building contractors a day while making his box with the basement underneath without anyone noticing.
Like, let's say the construction takes a couple of months (which is a VERRRY generous estimate considering it's a full build including groundworks, power that seems to be on an internal generator & specialised features like a massive wall of glass etc). Basic concrete foundations for example, take about 25-28 days to fully set. Plus, each worker is essentially on site only ONE day, so it's not likely work would move quickly with each of them having to figure out what stage the previous day's workers were up to.
That's about 700 people - gone in 2 months. & they're ALL builders/electricians/contractors. In real life there've been about 60 missing people NOT FOUND in all of Ireland since 2022. But suddenly, all these workers, all from the same industry, who're all doing a job in some random forest, go missing at once after their first day & it seems to go unnoticed. Like, there are flyers up saying 'where are the missing people?' But you'd think Ireland would be like, 'why aren't there any builders left in our country?' way before then.
Is it symbolic that a fly decided to get stuck in my fridge while watching this?
I'd sell the house....
@@atticstattic 🤣🤣🤣🤣
Definitely symbolic.
Because of the cord from your microphone, I thought your shirt had Jacob holding a light saber on it 🤣
I thought the same! Glad it wasn't just me haha
I definitely like the idea of trying to use changelings in horror, there's definitely untapped potential.
00:58 Okay, so I haven't watched "Abigail" or watched any videos about "Abigail", but I'm gonna go ahead and guess that the person referenced in this clip (Sammy) was trying to find the vegetable or whatever that repels vampires and went with onions instead of garlic. Was I right?
I saw this in the theater, and I thought we were going to see that Mina wasn’t actually talking to her sister and that she replaced her when the car crashed because she didn’t want to say that she was the one who caused it?
Hell yeah just got home and got my food ready and now i got a new video to watch! You the best !
I got an early copy of the sequel "Stay In The Light" and OMG yes it's very good. Explains a lot of mysteries & lore.
Joel why would you do this to me JOEL WHY DO YOU HAVE BOOK
Joel! Pls send book!
I'm convinced the Shyamalans are aliens on this planet trying to mimic human behaviour.
this movie was really just a biopic of how their family entered the human society
This is the wildest possible interpretation of the changelings of Irish folklore what the hell 😂
Yeah it was pretty insane lol. I figured from the trailer it would involve changelings but they’re… interesting. Very interesting lol.
I like when she is in the car in the morning, talking to the bird about her sneaky, sneaky, night out in a wig. Then, you see her car pull away from the THEATRICAL COSTUMES STORE - So, she RENTED the wig?! She couldn't just BUY a wig on amazon!?
Realistic wigs are very expensive
I had no idea this was based on a book, I just saw the name "Shyamalan" on the poster and was like "Hell yeah, that'll do me for a bad horror movie!" (I try to watch the worst horror movie in theaters every month or so). I couldn't say it was bad, but it was so…so…I don't know, sloppy? Several scenes of high tension needed a few more seconds to breathe but were cut short, and several scenes that really weren't needed went on way too long. Stilted dialogue was something I was expecting from Shyamalan (I didn't realize this was his daughter, I thought it was the man himself), so I let that slide, but yeah, the twist made no sense. Because of Mina's thing posing as someone else at the start, when halflings came up, I thought the twist was going to be that SHE was a halfling, that would have been a much better twist! But I guess if the book did it better I can forgive it in hindsight. All in all, the only thing I cared about throughout the movie was that the bird had to live, I was far more worried about the bird than any of the human or faery characters lol. XD
For the entire second half all I could think about was how inauspicious it is to name your twin daughters Lucy and Mina.
If nothing else the slate of bland to bad horror movies of 2024 is giving Amanda good material.
The name A.M. Shine is driving me bonkers
The video was great but I could not stop looking at the 'bella where the hell have you been loca' t-shirt. Iconic.
I think what might have helped is if there wasn’t a drawn out intro, like if this more closely resembled the movie “circle”. No explanation, right into the thick of things and we get semi-backstory later. But something I really love about the movie circle is that you don’t actually get to know anyone because you learn very few names and can only see who these people are in the worst circumstance.
I was going to go see this in theaters but canceled last minute due to the weather. Good to know I dodged a bullet.
I hate when there’s a book that effectively does the horror, and then they make it into a movie and the movie’s like “this isn’t scary enough! Let’s add more scary things!” Like let there be *some* subtlety.
Most of Europe has strong renters protection. It's practically impossible for her to have lost her apartment in two months. And if she was officially declared missing I'm sure there would be even more red tape.
Wait this explains it, they were able to keep the professors office intact because he had it listed as a residence!
Thank you for sitting through this for us!
"Generative AI monster" killed me.
M Night never disappoints me in always disappointing me and apparently his daughter got the same skill lol
We need more black people's horror movies because that car shit were not waiting around we been driving away ASAP
With the quickness! 🚗💨
we really need a nice satire movie where all the creepy horror tropes are avoided and they live out a boring life. "going into this creepy wood with creepy signs all around and no cell phone coverage? nope!". "going outside alone in the middle of the night to investigate a creepy noise? nope!" "staying in this creepy abandoned house to wait out the rain? nope!" call the movie 'common sense of surviving' and be done with is.
I recommend the movie The Blackening. It's a dark comedy, and they do fall for some of the horror movie clichés but it's a fun watch.
@@Chaosqueenngami lol but even when they do they are self-aware that they're doing it haha if you remember the very first time you saw Scream
Why does the entertainment industry keep investing in Shamaylan and his nepo baby when neither of them can make good movies?!
So Shyamalan actually funds his own movies with Blumhouse style budgets, then Universal does the distribution because they're always profitable even when people don't love them. Low budget, high reward.
He studied under Uwe Boll?
I could not get over the logistical nightmare that would have been building that bunker. Unless it was built in a few days, people would have definitely noticed the amount of people necessary to build it, go missing. How did they get the materials in? How did he keep hiring people without anyone wondering where the last crew is? I can suspend my belief pretty far, but this one bridge to many.
So fascinating because we entirely need more fairie horror stories man there’s so much potential
I was talking to my husband the other day about how if a movie relies solely on a twist, it's not a good movie.
this movie would have redeemed itself if it turns out Mina was the changeling!! i mean it was all there! the hints/build up was there for that twist!
Shyamalan's scenes can seem like film scenes to me. It's like I can hear him say, "...and action!" It's not the actors; it's his directorial style. @4:51 is an example. Dakota is a pro, but here, it's like she's reading a script. It's not just the text. It's the flat delivery. She could be reading the dialog off flashcards for the first time. It's not every scene, but there's always a few.
This is his daughter’s film btw :)
@@lazerbrownies865 Yes, I know, but it has the same style. I suspect he plays a strong role in her development as a director, at least now.
The Hole In The Ground did almost this exact premise in 2019 and by the looks of it was so much better with $28 million dollars less budget 👀
Never thought I would see a “Back That Azz Up” reference in one of your videos, but hey! It’s a vv pleasant surprise 🤣
I’m gonna come back to the video after I finish reading the book (I’m about an hour into the book) but one thing that immediately stands out as a missed opportunity is the fact that they stripped any personality or character from Mina. In the beginning of the novel she is sad, yes, but she’s also sassy and funny, and even kind. She goes as far as planning to ration her water for the parrot to be able to have some as she carries the cage through the woods.
The book version of Mina seems better suited to be telling the story than the movie’s portrayal of her and is more entertaining to follow then whatever bad direction poor Dakota was giving
Edit: absolutely recommend the book for anyone curious about what this premise looks like when executed well!!!!
Also true! stripped a lot of personality to just hone in on that added tragic background
@@AmandaTheJediand it’s a double bummer since it’s not even executed well. It feels like a lot of horror directors lately are trying to copy movies with tragically monotone female characters (hereditary, the boogeyman, etc) without understanding how and why it works with the movies the theme is popular with.
Am I early still, if so, I absolutely love your videos and would love if you say hi. -A fan all the way from Nigeria.
Howdy!
@AmandaTheJedi Holy sht, hi. You just made my day ong!
I needed 2.5 business days to recover from the random "mY nAmE iS jEfF!" 😂😂😂
I was astounded by the amount of hand holding in this movie. My favorite was when Mina firsts gets separated from her car - she looks behind her, realizes she's lost, and says aloud "I'm lost". It then starts to get dark; "it's getting dark" she says.
Also idk how tf that bird managed to stay alive in that tiny cage all that time. I honestly thought it got released offscreen or smth bc there's a huge chunk of the movie where they completely forget about it. But no, it is Plot Device Bird so it's not only alive but healthy enough to fly at the end lmfao
gonna be honest, until the 3.30 mark i thought this video was about humane, which is cronenberg's daughter's debut film. but in my head all i could remember was nepo daughter, one word title film, so it must be that :')
edit: 10 minutes later i realise 'the watchers' has two words, not one, but somehow i completely skipped over 'the'. wrong on ever single count here lads
I feel like folks who find the premise of this movie interesting but the execution lacking should deffo try the podcast The Silt Verses - amazing folk horror / fantasy.
Love seeing your videos come out about movies I don't want to watch 😂
i thought you were talking about a donkey when you said climb into a burrow. i had to listen a few times lol
Just watched this last night. I kept laughing at how often they say “the watchers.” At the end I was just like… okay lol. There was only one shot I really liked which was when Dakota was mirrored on the tinted glass- I think in the tapping scene. I also liked Darwin because he’s a beautiful yellow bird.
The movie doesn’t accomplish what it set out to do - no real suspense, no real focus on atmosphere, no real characterization. It felt like a super cut of cliché
small point of interest. Mark Twain's office is intact and on display (where you can look through things like in this movie) at Elmira College. Really cool. But, I'm sure people only really fundraise/save an office of really famous people (aka Mark Twain's office)
There were elements I liked about this movie/plot: 1) the scenery; 2) the bunker; 3) the mystic mystery. Outside those three elements, the plot felt very uneven. I remember thinking the movie invested waaaaaaaay too much time depicting Mina’s life in Dublin, when it should have started with her leaving to deliver the bird. Once in the forest, the movie invested waaaaaaaay too little time focuses on the changelings, and instead became a survivalist subplot. Like I said above, the bunker was one of the most intriguing aspects going into this movie, as depicted in the trailers. Mina should have discovered the lab maybe in the second night. Mina was the catalyst of chaos and I have no idea why the movie tried to integrate her into the bunker’s exhibitionist routine as a major plot point. Instead, we should have gotten “The Ring” paranormal research in the basement lab and exploration into the forest have gone from there. Again, super uneven movie that was afraid to take plot points from the book and ADAPT them to work in a movie medium.
I feel like if someone had life altering trauma resulting in their mother's death for 'not following the rules', they would turn into the world's strictest rule follower
Trauma isn't logical
Eh. As someone who had searing trauma over a death, I was in no way the cause of, the brain does wacky shit sometimes.
I love how much info and insight you pack into every episode.
"Don't be emo to the bird" is a tshirt just waiting to be printed
I didn’t think it was terrible. I do feel bad because I feel that just because it was his daughter people already went into it with a jaded opinion. I don’t think I would watch it again but I feel like if it had another rewrite it would have been worth maybe a rental.
I didn't even know they made a movie about it. I abolutely adored the novel.
Oh yay!! I was so hoping you'd make a video for this one. Can't wait to watch!
I kind of liked the conclusion with the notion that we all have à monster inside trying to blend in but cant never run away from.
She's definitely a half breed or like her mom was.. or maybe her ancestors was like Van Helsing or something
with the book ending I definitely thought she might have some in the blood but who knows honestly
Her twin sister is a watcher. Hence the evil smile over her mother’s body. And the constant hint at her being a double, the mirror etc.
I might be a psycho for this but it was so fucking funny when ‘I HATE YOU I HATE YOU’ *hand gets crushed by window* *car crash*. It happened so fast and so unexpectedly that I found it hilarious
I watched this movie with my mom last week; and my parents own a pet conure. We absolutely had to make sure it was identified correctly(it was) but my favourite part of the movie was just that - it features a type of bird my parents own.
SPOILER
but
the best part of the movie to me is how the ending confrontation with the *fairy* literally boiled down to
"Dude you're actually a half fairy"
"Wait what holy shit you have a point nevermind we good fam bye"
You’re doing great.
This movie especially pissed me off because the fae make AMAZING horror movie villains (see The Hallow for a better/actually Irish example of this), and she made them... the most generic monsters ever, I guess.
*Amanda the Jedi* post from 4 minutes ago absolute day maker
Hello to everyone else using Amanda's backlog of videos to cope with life. ❤
I couldn't continue watching this movie....so I went straight to your channel to get the full story in your fun way.
I cannot legally forgive you for putting "where the hell you been, loca?" Back in my vocal stim rotation
i ALWAYS finish a movie I start. I could barely make it to the half point with this one. Dakota's performance left a lot to be desired.
Thank you very much for providing commentary on this film! But I looked at the thumbnail and just thought 'OH, NO' 😅
Fantasizing about Amanda whisking me away on a boat to the south of France wasn’t on my 2024 Bingo card, but here we are.
the "pls send book" cracked me up way too hard, i love your style of humour
I had so much hope for this movie! Thanks for the review and rundown. Saved me a few bucks I’ll wait for it to be out of theaters
Not surprised after The Servant, I somehow made it through all of that..
I really thought the twist was going to be that Mina was a halfling and that's why she was a twin
I really enjoyed the movie but now that I saw your review I REALLY hope they do an extended cut with the guys backstory, it would have elevated the story 10 fold!
I liked this movie a lot, but it lost me during the exposition dump at the stone circle in the escape because the lore sounded more like something from the New Afe section rather than any of the changeling lore I know by virtue of being a mythology nerd. And the big twist with Mina, while it could have been fun, was just used to make her a generic monster for a single scene.
Its like the reverse of The Village. Where people are pretending there's monsters trapping them. Where this one has people being the monsters and trapping fea creatures.
The scenario was even less realistic than the village, Here the 4 people never farmed or looked for food but survived for months.
@@Acme633 a lot of movies gloss over things they don't find "essential" like most ignore bathroom usage. Some of the world building too wouldn't make sense if there were fairies that can't stand metal, then people could go out and about as long as they put some metal around their body, but for the story itself they don't really bother thinking through scenarios. (Especially some zombie movies where its like a ladder would prevent the whole thing)
@@chaosryans "Bathroom usage" is not an appropriate comparison - that was simply not shown. For people who were stranded or trapped (like Tom Hanks in Castaway), you have to show how they managed to survive.
@@Acme633 yeah, unless the story teller doesn't think that it's important. Castaway shows his survival and sanity etc, but they only mention the actual duration of his absence at the end 1 time since the story works out essentially the same if it's 6 months, 1 year, or 3 years.
THANK YOU! Had a horror movie sleepover with my best friend (highly recommend) and this was one of his two choices. I made the same comments about the dialogue and the talking to the bird and he kept making excuses for it. Another thing that really pissed me off was the introduced a plant that helps with blood loss or something and I commented to my friend “wow I wonder if that will ever come in handy”. AND GUESS WHAT. NEVER DID. Bad writing 😂
It was nice to see Dakota Fanning though.