A few decades ago, we had a problem in the ICW here in Florida. There was a permit window for people in small boats to catch shrimp. That in itself was not a problem, but what was a problem is that dozens and dozens of these shrimping boaters would just anchor in the channel. No matter how often we explained to them that it was dangerous and illegal, and how often we complained to the Sherrif, the Game Commission and the Coast Guard, there was absolutely no even occasional attempt to get these people to not anchor in the ICW and other channels. Then, one day there were two elderly guys out anchored while shrimping, on the north side of a bridge. A tugboat came up the river and suddenly encountered the shrimpers, whom they couldn't see from the other side of the bridge. The shrimpers, instead of cutting their anchor line or tossing it, tried to haul it up, but were run over by the tugboat. From that point on, people anchoring in the channel were finally made to stop anchoring. It's too bad that it took two useless deaths to get those responsible for our safety on the water to actually act responsibly themselves. We had a casino boat that went out of Ponce Inlet around that time, too. It was a flat bottomed, terrible handling boat, and watching it yaw side to side of the inlet channel when there were even just moderately big seas coming in was a pretty scarry sight. I was taking a charter out in my sailboat and came across a guy anchored right square in the middle of the channel. As we went by, I told him that he wasn't allowed to anchor in the channel. He told me that he would anchor anywhere he damned well wanted to. I explained that that was the same thing as parking on I-95, that it was dangerous. I got a few expletives and a single finger salute before I suggested that he turn his head and look out the channel. There, almost totally not under control was the casino boat struggling to just stay in the channel coming in less than 100 yards away. My newfound expletive spouting friend became very animated as he rushed to pull up his anchor. He made it, just.
Sailing with your son: This is the most important lesson of the day. Those most precious hours are irreplaceable for teaching character and making memories that last a lifetime. Tim continues earning my utmost respect
2:54 my home port! ;) I've learned in those waters that these guys are out there earning their living while I'm sailing recreationally. It's good to know the rules, but I respect these guys enough to give them their space anyway. Thanks for the video!
Where I sail, the lower parts of the St. John River and Kennebecasis River in NB, it seems like a lot of people have little knowledge of right of way. That, or they don't care. There used to be an annual run of go-fast boats that came down from further up the river and it wasn't safe to be on the water that day in any boat. I was out that day a few years ago and was passing by another sailboat coming in the opposite direction with about 100 feet between us and one of the go-fasts threaded between us at probably 50+ knots. We had some of his friends play chicken with us and more than one of these guys came in close at high speed to give us the middle finger. I should add that where we were was wide and deep. These guys could have easily yielded ROW and gone by us at a safe distance. Even regular powerboaters often won't yield ROW. Maybe this is my biases showing, but I suspect that since sailing requires experience that most sailors know the rules but that since anyone can jump in a 24' bowrider with no experience that they are less likely to know the rules. And while I'm beating up on power boaters, a few weekends ago I was out and saw a jet ski maybe 500' away and the two people on it waved frantically. We quickly hauled down the sails, fired up the motor, and headed over to assist. So in a Tanzer 26 with an 8 HP outboard, we had to tow these two young kids to the nearest safe marina - all while multiple power boats had already gone by them. As we were approaching the channel to go into the marina, a go-fast came out. He caused us to have to adjust our approach into a marina we'd never been in and offered no help. It seems to me that if you aren't aware of what may be the most important rule on the water - the obligation to provide assistance if you can, then it isn't likely these boaters have a clue about ROW. Rant over.
What it boils down to even if you have right of way do you want to damage your boat! The other vessel may not care or know the rules on the water. Awesome idea of a video!
ICW in South Florida on a holiday weekend - all drunk. Say a prayer. When I lived in the keys locals wouldn't even go out on the water, and try not to leave the house if they could help it, on a big holiday weekend.
In the U.K. commercial fishing bots do show day marks… all the time which is frustrating as you often treat them as stand on wrongly when they are not actually fishing. This only leads to then neglecting their responsibility’s and not keeping a proper look out.
I always looked at it like this. if it's bigger, I get the hell out of the way, unless otherwise discussed with the other Capt. The proper rules should be obeyed, but I do that to be safe. Always be aware of your surroundings, and get clear. Take care, Tim. Fair winds
Great video but, without wanting to be pedantic, under the col' regs' there is no such thing as a 'right of way'. If you are the stand on vessel you are still obliged to take whatever action is necessary to avoid a collision. Applying the idea of a 'right ov way' as applies on the highway can lead to a sense of entitlement to hold your course or even that you must hold course. I find this, particularly with novice or infrequent sailors who may tend to read the col' regs' like the highway rules that they are more familiar with. Useing the proper term of 'stand on' helps reinforce the distinctions
There are a lot of commercial fishing and crabbing boats here in the lower Chesapeake. If they are working and I'm just recreating I consider myself to be the give way vessel. Then there's the navy and they are very touchy about their submarines and carriers. I had a run in with a sub once. I was restricted by draft and had to (safely) not be able to give them their 500(!) Yards of clearance. Homeland security visited me the next day. They understood. (They also seemed to know a lot about me)😮
One of the most common confusions is about commercial vessels. Whether or not a vessel is "commercial" has NO bearing on the rules of navigation, even though vessels such as the Baltimore water taxis act as if they had a priority.
Good job of addressing an often sensitive issue. I've been cursed at before by one crabber on the Little Choptank but most are friendly. I basically do what you advise which is often not adhering to the rules strictly - just be courteous and understanding - especially of those trying to eek out a living from the Bay.
I hate the silly fishers anchoring in our narrow channel. I am a solo sailer and life get agitated enough because of prevailing winds and an s bend . And I get plenty of tirades for getting too close to their barges. Their lack of understanding of the challenges they put me through is without bounds. I keep well away from them when It is safe for me to do so (sometime I even start the outboard). Thank you for an excellent Video.
In general, even though a vessel might not be RAM, if I see that they aren’t moving so that they can maneuver I treat them as stationary and avoid them. Being in a sailboat typically cruising at 6 kts, I’m practically stationary to most other boats and expect them to just drive around me. In open water I change course far enough out to where it’s never an issue.
This is a very unusual COLREGs video, it actually applies to the typical experience of coastal sailors. The absence of day marks on restricted maneuverability fishing vessels is also my experience in the FL panhandle and Chesapeake. I don't understand that - seems like pro fishermen are risking insurance losses.
Thanks for asking us to post comments. Today, just outside of the Annapolis harbor and West of the moored ships, we were on a starboard tack with full sails. Coming at us was a mid-sized Island Packet with full sails on a port tack about 60 degrees off our bow. He didn't change course or adjust in any way. It was far too close for my comfort, so we went upwind about 5-10 degrees momentarily. I just don't understand why people -even with serious offshore and cruising sailboats- don't follow the rules. Thanks again, Jeff (Skyward, HR46)
As always great video choc full of great info. However, just a nomenclature specification… today we talk about “Stand-On Vessel vs Give-Way Vessel”. As a Sail Canada Sailing instructor, I like to emphasize the difference as “Right of way” sounds as if I’m in the Right as oppose to others and get out of my way mentality. Many if not most use “Right of Way” …. Never too late to pick up new habits! 😊
Coming into Charleston inlet on my 47ft sailboat after an all night sail, while hugging the right side of the channel I had a shrimp boat about run me over head on. I guess they had a course set and that’s where they were going. I waited as long as I could before I turned sharply to port so they could clearly see me turn and not make the same turn last second. I didn’t have time to try and hail them on the radio because I expected they would eventually correct their course.
While this video is a knowledgeable and practical discussion of the relevant COLREGS, it does not discuss an overtaking situation. Rule 13a says that when vessels can see each other, "any vessel overtaking any other shall keep out of the way of the vessel being overtaken." So it would not matter whether a sailing vessel is overtaking a vessel engaged in fishing or vice versa, the overtaking vessel must keep clear. Please note that the overtaking rule, and all the other rules that establish stand on/give way vessels, only apply when vessels are in sight of one another. When vessels cannot see each other (e.g. in fog) a different set of rules apply and nobody is a stand on vessel. Although that may be what the rules say, one of the things I really appreciated about this video was value placed on common sense and common courtesy and their role in keeping everyone safe. I enjoy learning from this channel.
Mnemonics are fun, but I find this one is easy enough to recall without them - use to determine pecking order: NUC, RAM, FISH, SAIL. As you can see, SAIL is the least privileged of the specially privileged vessels. You are quite correct to point out that trolling, unless it interferes with maneuverability, does not confer the special "fishing" privilege. And of course, unless the correct day/night signals are used, no privilege exists either.
Several years ago, I was in a sailboat race on my Hobie Cat on a southern Ontario lake, and encountered a fisher just before the start of the race. As I was jockeying around to get a good position for the start, I noted a couple 14 ft aluminum skiffs sitting 100 yards or so off the windward (and favored) starting flag. As I was on my final approach (still about 150 feet from both of these skiffs), one started screaming and waving his arms at me. I heard his fishing rod scream as I was heading away from them towards the flag. As my boat only draws about 2 feet of water (my two rudders), I kicked up and reset my windward rudder; with no luck. With about 60 seconds before the start, the rod was still screaming. I made my final tack towards the flag and now on the other side of the boat, I was able to kicked up and reset the second rudder. This time the rod stopped screaming. I then continued and crossed the start line on time (and in good position - just by the flag). As I was sailing away from the start line, heading for the windward mark, one of these fishers came at me; within inches of me. I mostly ignored him but he then started waving and threating me with a gaff hook. As it turned out, he did not have the horsepower to keep up and he was soon being left in my wake (and surrounded by about 20 other catamarans coming at high speed). The fisher turned to avoid the other cats, and I never saw him again. But after completing the race (actually, I think I won the race), I was asked about this encounter by most of the other racers. I was then told that there was a long standing conflict between the fishers and the sailors in this lake: and that several of the sailboats have been rammed and attacked by fishers for similar situations. I still can't understand, why a boat that only draws 2 feet of water, hooked a fishing line about 150 feet away from the skiffs. And since the fishers should have known where their lines were, why they did not real them in when they saw several sailboats in close proximity to their lines. I was not the only boat in that area (although, I think I was the only boat that caught a line).
Nice summary. I have had a small fishing boat pull up in front, 100' or so, of me while I was sailing home, hard on the wind, drop a line in the water and claim right of way. I suspect he was showing off to the other passengers who where not fishing. I passed close enough to tell him he was wrong. I have always wondered if this is taught in the boating classes.
I can compare two areas - Northern sea (B, NL) where there is a lot of commercial (container) traffic, there rules seems to be enforced and adhered to (well - do you know how much is a fine when hindering a container ship?). Another situation is in mediterian (Hr, Me) where local fishers just don't give a sh*t and you can see from far away the boat is not manned (drifting) and all others just have to keep clear
Many years ago when I raced with the Winthrop Harbor Yacht Club on Lake Michigan we regularly had problems with fishermen trolling through our race course on Wednesday evenings. The course was a permanent one of eight marks set at compass points at one mile radius from a central start mark. Apparently the marks and their ground tackle attracted fish which, of course, attracted fishermen. The fishermen obviously didn’t understand the rules as they would consistently complain about us not yielding. I’m not sure why they didn't at least figure out that it was only Wednesdays at 18:00 when we were out racing and just stay clear then….
Live and let live. I make a wide berth around fishing vessels not because they have right of way, which often they don’t, but because it’s less hassle to insist on my rights. I know that sets a poor precedent, but I’m only out to have fun and they are out to provide for their families. It’s hard work. And I’m not a confrontational person.
All the time... I give trawling "fishing" boats a wide berth but still get the occasional dirty look, and yes, I've never seen a day shape on these smaller boats. For the most part it's common sense and accident avoidance at all costs, and a bit of etiquette which is sadly lacking with some. What I will say is that a large container ship altered course to give us more room as we were under sail in light air, my AIS said we would miss by more than 1Nm but respect to the captain - we both altered course by a small margin and it was a non event, which makes for a nice relaxed sail.
How about a 50’ fly bride motoring into port @18kts in a channel that is about 45’ wide and outside is 2’ deep. Me on a powerboat at idle trying to stay on the edge of the channel while hitting bottom. Then yelled at cause the captain would not have wanted me enter the channel until he exited. Found the experience disturbing and the solution could have been fixed if the other vessel would have slowed to “safe operating speeds” while inside a restricted channel. For context the channel is about 500yds long. No reason for a fishing charter heading back to port to fly through when port is only a 30yds from channel of the channel.
Great Lakes has no shortage of 10-20 lines off the back of charter fishing boats a few miles offshore following the same lines as coastal cruising boats. No shortage of them cursing me for "cutting them off" when I hadn't changed heading in the last 4 hours... 😂
Long time ago there was an article in the Pacific Yachting by a professional captain regarding same issues after I stopped buying the magazine for quite a while. He believed that a sailing boat has the right of way over a fishing troller while pulling the salmon gear. Imagine the boat pulling the six lines with heavy lead balls just over the bottom following the isobath with hundred hooks at two knots. It is an imperative to know the rules of the road but common sense is always important in asessing the situational awareness. Even the professionals, especially without emotional intelligence, make grave mistakes. There are many ignorant and arrogant people between proffesionals and amateurs.
ROW on the ICW is like a circus act now that its summer. Weekends make it a no rule in areas were you have motor , jet,pontoons' and large craft & paddle boats. No Wake rule seems to be the only rule many try to obey.
I wish everyone would stop using the term “right of way”. It implies that only one boat has any obligation. In a collision situation, both vessels have responsibilities. One boat is the “stand on” vessel and must maintain course and speed. The other vessel, the give-way vessel, must alter course and speed.
Agreed. The COLREGS do not use the term “right of way”, which would imply a “not at fault” case. I suppose that was intentional. Stand on/give way cover what vessels should do in a given situation, assuming it is safe to do so. I don’t think stand on should be interpreted as right of way.
I'm an ex merchant seaman who owns a "bass boat" and use it often. It's appalling how many recreational boaters and yes, bass boaters, have no clue about the rules of the road. I give them all a wide berth, even stop when they turn left in front of me. I'm in central Virginia.
UK professional fishing boats invariably have the day shapes permanently mounted, amateur small boats just have a landing net stuck up where it can be seen. No one bothers about this until there is an incident then the insurance pay-out becomes dicey and the authorities become very keen to prosecute, it was always thus.
A common issue I've encountered in my area (SF Bay ) Are wind surfers and kite surfers in a narrow channel nearby the Marina I use. Recently, I was coming in wing on wing in about 18 knots when a kite boarder went down right in front of my boat, and the channel is only about 2.5 boat lengths wide. So, as I understand, these types of water craft aren't even considered "vessels" and therefore not covered under these rules for right of way. Besides using common sense and, yes avoiding a down human in the water, what other thoughts are there related to this sort of traffic in a narrow channel?
The sacred right of way is one thing, to end up in a collision is another thing. Rule no one ; stay clear of professional activity when you are sailing.
Ha! In all fairness to him, I don't think that it can be controlled from the cockpit on a Laser and I'm going to presume that when the left the beach that it was 2 knots, tops. Credit where credit is due, he didn't go for a swim, though.
@@davidbrayshaw3529 very definitely lasers have easily adjusted outhaul. But the point of the discussion is that too many of us boaters do not know the right of way rules. That’s why most of us have to take safe boater courses. Will that change the confusion at sea? All those charter boat fishermen have licenses and yet they still yell at sailboats and motor between racing sailboats. As they say, be careful out there.
@@romaniandracula I wasn't sure about the ease of use of the out haul on the laser. I don't remember any other trimming line on them. But you are right. We don't know the rules, as a generalization. If I became an active sailor again, I would most certainly have to revisit the regs. The frightening thing is that my power boat license is still valid! Charter boat operators weren't anywhere to be seen where I used to sail. Jet skis were our curse. Best to stay clear of the lot of them.
Right of way or out right harrasment? couple of years ago I was leaving Middle river Maryland in my 43 foot sailboat. As usual the area was littered with crab traps, and yes in the channel. We are making the best of it weaving through the traps to get out. There was a crap boat that didn't appreciate us there. he came flying at us as fast as he could, as telling by the huge bow wake he was making! (passing traps as he went - not activly fishing) I altered course a bit to get away form some traps and he continued to track me. he ran right up at my port beam and made an abrupt turn, and then without a smile, waved at us. could he possible thought I was going to raid his traps from a sailboat?
Wouldn't a boat that is "hove to" be constrained? Or at the very least be the overtaken vessel so they are stand on regardless of what tack their boom may be on?
It’s usually the pastime sailors and not the professionals who are the problem. You ask them about colregs and they look at you blankly. There are colregs relating to etiquette in channels and I don’t see anywhere in the colregs that says people can anchor up in shipping channels. There is the lame duck etiquette relating to who can give way and rules for crossing and proceeding along the channel. Also when does a fishing boat become professional? When it’s displaying daytime shapes and nighttime lights.
Even though I have a sailboat .. I also have a kayak .. I have had problems with powe boats that want to run at high speeds even when they see us with or flags and lights ... It seems they want to swam kayaks just for a laugh .. It always gets me pissed .. Most powerboaters feel the don't have to have any curtsy for othes wether theyare sailboats or kayaks
I think you mean "right of way"? (Not an actual thing - although some poorly educated ferry-boat captains around here, might disagree). Also, not true. Depends on whether or not maneuverability is significantly impacted, and correct use of day shape, or R/W lights. Similarly, diver-down flags have the same import, regardless of whether or not the particular diver is getting paid.
There is sooo much arguing about this subject and I’m sure your comment section is littered with people saying “right of way” isn’t anywhere in colregs. Here in Texas we have oil tankers, smaller container ships, cruise ships, and shrimp boats to worry about.
As an avid fisherman and sailor on the upper Chesapeake... People are assholes and everyone thinks they have the right-of-way until its a ship or barge. Unbelievable. I cant rell you how many times ive been anchored off Pooles island in a 23 or 27' express with a hardtop, outriggers (not exactly easy to miss) clearly fishing and a 50 foot sportfish comes rolling by within 100' on plane. Ive had my spread runover by a "blowboater" as the ignorants say. Hell, ive been flat out cut off by other people trolling. The commercial charter guys will litterally run you off into the shallows if you let them meanwhile screaming they are "commercial fishing" because they have a TFL. Theres a whole bay out there folks. Just be a decent person.
I think a clarification/correction is needed starting at 4:24 - sailboat on starboard tack is only the stand-on vessel under racing rules. “Starboard tack” is a reference to wind direction. In Colregs the vessel on starboard of the OTHER vessel is the stand-on vessel, regardless of wind direction. If the wind is coming from port (port tack) the vessels to starboard of an approaching vessel would still have right of way.
you are incorrect, this rule applies in all sailing crossing situations: RULE 12 Sailing Vessels (a) When two sailing vessels are approaching one another, so as to involve risk of collision, one of them shall keep out of the way of the other as follows: (i) when each has the wind on a different side, * the vessel which has the wind on the port side shall keep out of the way of the other;* (ii) when both have the wind on the same side, the vessel which is to windward shall keep out of the way of the vessel which is to leeward; (iii) if a vessel with the wind on the port side sees a vessel to windward and cannot determine with certainty whether the other vessel has the wind on the port or on the starboard side, she shall keep out of the way of the other. (b) For the purposes of this Rule the windward side shall be deemed to be the side opposite to that on which the mainsail is carried or, in the case of a square-rigged vessel, the side opposite to that on which the largest foreand-aft sail is carried. ** And the overriding rule is always stay out of the way..if you cant determine, or if it looks like they will not be following the rules, just move so as to avoid a collision. Be a good Captain**
I'll tell you what's maddening...recreational fishermen that know NOTHING about any rules. They get on their powerboat and push go. Drop gear in channels. Speed by working boats and sailboats under power or anchored. Newport Oregon is littered with this kind of crap.
I have gotten occasionally in shouting matches with bassboats hogging the middle of a very narrow pass 2 or 3 at the time. Not even mentioning colregs (that would have flown way over their heads...) but arguing solely on basic human decency. But they might be assholes driving their pickup trucks too.
Much like riding a motorbike and coming acroos big vans and trucks, you dont play games with bigger vessels just because you are the stand on vessel. Especially fishing boats crewed by generally unsavoury characters (not all of course, but definitely a good amount). Anything big and scary looking I just stay tf away from.
I'm am not a maritime legal expert by any means, but it is my understanding that if you hit other boats and you had a chance not to, if you survive, you'll be held accountable regardless of "right of passage". The ultimate measure at law of culpability comes down to whether you could foresee and avoid a collision.
Careful, let us not support the hysteria "they shouldn't be here anyway." That attitude is never helpful. And then, drift fishing is NOT anchored but how can you tell they are not anchored over an underwater freshwater spring hole or underwater tidal eddy current around an obstacle and preferred lay for any mature fish and where any educated fishing enthusiast WILL sit for hours at anchor..., making any channel littered with obstacles a popular fishing hole for drift and anchored fishing. Any channel will magnify wind, currents and waves and quickly become an unexpected challenge further escalating the tensions of any on the water amateurs and expert alike, blame and name calling does not help. I understand that any regular obstacle to popular recreation quickly finds a bias leaning heavily toward the type of animosity usually reserved for thieves and murderers and worse. Seems to me there are lots of gray areas that are solved with a mature and considerate evaluation. First, every watercraft has a right to use the water in any way they chose and are not a nuisance nor inconsiderate and should always be treated with respect. If when people are out for a day of fishing and/or ending a three day sailing tour - if any encounters are not going as smoothly as they should, record the episode and report it. Unfortunately the solution may eventually and regrettably become to haul in the sails and motor through any narrow or difficult channels. Out on the open seas, the difficult fishing boats will be either anchored or trolling. Yes, anchored in the middle of the ocean. On the other hand if trolling, you are correct any quick turn can irretrievably tangle hundreds to thousands of dollars in line and gear and put an end to the day of fishing. I am only a lake sailor and an ocean fisherman where i've sat for many hours anchored of Jeffery's Ledge, Maine/Nova Scotia and lobster fished many of the rocky and deepwater shoals and where sailors and power-yachts always give a wide berth. I have Not fished Chesapeake Bay, nor sailed any of the East Coast Sounds etc where partial shelter from oceanic winds and waves make these prime for all recreation. I don't believe difficulties are the type of watercraft nor their intended use. However, as populations continue to expand any difficulties now will certainly become more difficult. I've seen the type of impatience and animosity that ruins everybodies day. Education is always the answer.
The less maneuverable vessel has the right of way. Sailboats are usually less maneuverable than power boats. The tonnage rule should always apply, regardless of right of way.
It comes down to the relative manoeuvrability of the two types of vessels. The above presentation is something to consider if you're not familiar with yachts. When it is a windward shore or port and there is a narrow channel to navigate, a yacht may have to perform multiple tacks along that channel in order to reach safe harbour. While navigating around boats isn't usually a problem in this situation (although it can be), when you start expanding the foot print of a vessel by adding anchor rode and fishing lines, things can become overly tight for a yacht navigating to windward under sail. At the end of the day, we all want fellow boaters to get home safely, in one piece. And if that isn't enough motivation to do the right thing, we all want to be not held accountable for a fatality that was a consequence of our actions, inactions or hubris. If you're sitting in a market channel, anchor down and lines out and someone comes unstuck and drowns as a consequence, you'll find that unlike the criminal courts that you're familiar with, maritime courts the world over don't suffer fools. They expect you to "get it right", and if you don't, you generally receive harsh punishments... and then there are the civil legal implications. The world is 70% water, most of it not channels. Do the right thing. It's easy.
A few decades ago, we had a problem in the ICW here in Florida. There was a permit window for people in small boats to catch shrimp. That in itself was not a problem, but what was a problem is that dozens and dozens of these shrimping boaters would just anchor in the channel. No matter how often we explained to them that it was dangerous and illegal, and how often we complained to the Sherrif, the Game Commission and the Coast Guard, there was absolutely no even occasional attempt to get these people to not anchor in the ICW and other channels. Then, one day there were two elderly guys out anchored while shrimping, on the north side of a bridge. A tugboat came up the river and suddenly encountered the shrimpers, whom they couldn't see from the other side of the bridge. The shrimpers, instead of cutting their anchor line or tossing it, tried to haul it up, but were run over by the tugboat. From that point on, people anchoring in the channel were finally made to stop anchoring. It's too bad that it took two useless deaths to get those responsible for our safety on the water to actually act responsibly themselves.
We had a casino boat that went out of Ponce Inlet around that time, too. It was a flat bottomed, terrible handling boat, and watching it yaw side to side of the inlet channel when there were even just moderately big seas coming in was a pretty scarry sight.
I was taking a charter out in my sailboat and came across a guy anchored right square in the middle of the channel. As we went by, I told him that he wasn't allowed to anchor in the channel. He told me that he would anchor anywhere he damned well wanted to. I explained that that was the same thing as parking on I-95, that it was dangerous. I got a few expletives and a single finger salute before I suggested that he turn his head and look out the channel. There, almost totally not under control was the casino boat struggling to just stay in the channel coming in less than 100 yards away. My newfound expletive spouting friend became very animated as he rushed to pull up his anchor. He made it, just.
Sailing with your son: This is the most important lesson of the day. Those most precious hours are irreplaceable for teaching character and making memories that last a lifetime.
Tim continues earning my utmost respect
2:54 my home port! ;) I've learned in those waters that these guys are out there earning their living while I'm sailing recreationally. It's good to know the rules, but I respect these guys enough to give them their space anyway. Thanks for the video!
Where I sail, the lower parts of the St. John River and Kennebecasis River in NB, it seems like a lot of people have little knowledge of right of way. That, or they don't care. There used to be an annual run of go-fast boats that came down from further up the river and it wasn't safe to be on the water that day in any boat. I was out that day a few years ago and was passing by another sailboat coming in the opposite direction with about 100 feet between us and one of the go-fasts threaded between us at probably 50+ knots. We had some of his friends play chicken with us and more than one of these guys came in close at high speed to give us the middle finger. I should add that where we were was wide and deep. These guys could have easily yielded ROW and gone by us at a safe distance. Even regular powerboaters often won't yield ROW. Maybe this is my biases showing, but I suspect that since sailing requires experience that most sailors know the rules but that since anyone can jump in a 24' bowrider with no experience that they are less likely to know the rules.
And while I'm beating up on power boaters, a few weekends ago I was out and saw a jet ski maybe 500' away and the two people on it waved frantically. We quickly hauled down the sails, fired up the motor, and headed over to assist. So in a Tanzer 26 with an 8 HP outboard, we had to tow these two young kids to the nearest safe marina - all while multiple power boats had already gone by them. As we were approaching the channel to go into the marina, a go-fast came out. He caused us to have to adjust our approach into a marina we'd never been in and offered no help. It seems to me that if you aren't aware of what may be the most important rule on the water - the obligation to provide assistance if you can, then it isn't likely these boaters have a clue about ROW.
Rant over.
What it boils down to even if you have right of way do you want to damage your boat! The other vessel may not care or know the rules on the water. Awesome idea of a video!
Good topic buddy. I've spent my life on the lake and sea. When it comes to who is the stand vessel, I never want to be dead right
Cheers
ICW in South Florida on a holiday weekend - all drunk. Say a prayer. When I lived in the keys locals wouldn't even go out on the water, and try not to leave the house if they could help it, on a big holiday weekend.
In the U.K. commercial fishing bots do show day marks… all the time which is frustrating as you often treat them as stand on wrongly when they are not actually fishing. This only leads to then neglecting their responsibility’s and not keeping a proper look out.
I always looked at it like this. if it's bigger, I get the hell out of the way, unless otherwise discussed with the other Capt. The proper rules should be obeyed, but I do that to be safe. Always be aware of your surroundings, and get clear. Take care, Tim. Fair winds
Great video but, without wanting to be pedantic, under the col' regs' there is no such thing as a 'right of way'. If you are the stand on vessel you are still obliged to take whatever action is necessary to avoid a collision. Applying the idea of a 'right ov way' as applies on the highway can lead to a sense of entitlement to hold your course or even that you must hold course. I find this, particularly with novice or infrequent sailors who may tend to read the col' regs' like the highway rules that they are more familiar with. Useing the proper term of 'stand on' helps reinforce the distinctions
Good point. Thanks for making it.
There are a lot of commercial fishing and crabbing boats here in the lower Chesapeake. If they are working and I'm just recreating I consider myself to be the give way vessel. Then there's the navy and they are very touchy about their submarines and carriers. I had a run in with a sub once. I was restricted by draft and had to (safely) not be able to give them their 500(!) Yards of clearance.
Homeland security visited me the next day. They understood. (They also seemed to know a lot about me)😮
One of the most common confusions is about commercial vessels. Whether or not a vessel is "commercial" has NO bearing on the rules of navigation, even though vessels such as the Baltimore water taxis act as if they had a priority.
Good job of addressing an often sensitive issue. I've been cursed at before by one crabber on the Little Choptank but most are friendly. I basically do what you advise which is often not adhering to the rules strictly - just be courteous and understanding - especially of those trying to eek out a living from the Bay.
I hate the silly fishers anchoring in our narrow channel. I am a solo sailer and life get agitated enough because of prevailing winds and an s bend . And I get plenty of tirades for getting too close to their barges. Their lack of understanding of the challenges they put me through is without bounds. I keep well away from them when It is safe for me to do so (sometime I even start the outboard). Thank you for an excellent Video.
In general, even though a vessel might not be RAM, if I see that they aren’t moving so that they can maneuver I treat them as stationary and avoid them. Being in a sailboat typically cruising at 6 kts, I’m practically stationary to most other boats and expect them to just drive around me. In open water I change course far enough out to where it’s never an issue.
One of my favorite gripes is of the antics of south Florida offshore kite fishermen. You see some interesting ROW issues with that bunch.
This is a very unusual COLREGs video, it actually applies to the typical experience of coastal sailors. The absence of day marks on restricted maneuverability fishing vessels is also my experience in the FL panhandle and Chesapeake. I don't understand that - seems like pro fishermen are risking insurance losses.
Thanks for asking us to post comments. Today, just outside of the Annapolis harbor and West of the moored ships, we were on a starboard tack with full sails. Coming at us was a mid-sized Island Packet with full sails on a port tack about 60 degrees off our bow. He didn't change course or adjust in any way. It was far too close for my comfort, so we went upwind about 5-10 degrees momentarily. I just don't understand why people -even with serious offshore and cruising sailboats- don't follow the rules. Thanks again, Jeff (Skyward, HR46)
As always great video choc full of great info.
However, just a nomenclature specification… today we talk about “Stand-On Vessel vs Give-Way Vessel”. As a Sail Canada Sailing instructor, I like to emphasize the difference as “Right of way” sounds as if I’m in the Right as oppose to others and get out of my way mentality.
Many if not most use “Right of Way” …. Never too late to pick up new habits! 😊
Coming into Charleston inlet on my 47ft sailboat after an all night sail, while hugging the right side of the channel I had a shrimp boat about run me over head on. I guess they had a course set and that’s where they were going. I waited as long as I could before I turned sharply to port so they could clearly see me turn and not make the same turn last second. I didn’t have time to try and hail them on the radio because I expected they would eventually correct their course.
While this video is a knowledgeable and practical discussion of the relevant COLREGS, it does not discuss an overtaking situation.
Rule 13a says that when vessels can see each other, "any vessel overtaking any other shall keep out of the way of the vessel being overtaken." So it would not matter whether a sailing vessel is overtaking a vessel engaged in fishing or vice versa, the overtaking vessel must keep clear.
Please note that the overtaking rule, and all the other rules that establish stand on/give way vessels, only apply when vessels are in sight of one another. When vessels cannot see each other (e.g. in fog) a different set of rules apply and nobody is a stand on vessel.
Although that may be what the rules say, one of the things I really appreciated about this video was value placed on common sense and common courtesy and their role in keeping everyone safe.
I enjoy learning from this channel.
Good to see you here
Mnemonics are fun, but I find this one is easy enough to recall without them - use to determine pecking order: NUC, RAM, FISH, SAIL. As you can see, SAIL is the least privileged of the specially privileged vessels. You are quite correct to point out that trolling, unless it interferes with maneuverability, does not confer the special "fishing" privilege. And of course, unless the correct day/night signals are used, no privilege exists either.
Several years ago, I was in a sailboat race on my Hobie Cat on a southern Ontario lake, and encountered a fisher just before the start of the race. As I was jockeying around to get a good position for the start, I noted a couple 14 ft aluminum skiffs sitting 100 yards or so off the windward (and favored) starting flag. As I was on my final approach (still about 150 feet from both of these skiffs), one started screaming and waving his arms at me. I heard his fishing rod scream as I was heading away from them towards the flag. As my boat only draws about 2 feet of water (my two rudders), I kicked up and reset my windward rudder; with no luck. With about 60 seconds before the start, the rod was still screaming. I made my final tack towards the flag and now on the other side of the boat, I was able to kicked up and reset the second rudder. This time the rod stopped screaming. I then continued and crossed the start line on time (and in good position - just by the flag).
As I was sailing away from the start line, heading for the windward mark, one of these fishers came at me; within inches of me. I mostly ignored him but he then started waving and threating me with a gaff hook. As it turned out, he did not have the horsepower to keep up and he was soon being left in my wake (and surrounded by about 20 other catamarans coming at high speed). The fisher turned to avoid the other cats, and I never saw him again.
But after completing the race (actually, I think I won the race), I was asked about this encounter by most of the other racers. I was then told that there was a long standing conflict between the fishers and the sailors in this lake: and that several of the sailboats have been rammed and attacked by fishers for similar situations.
I still can't understand, why a boat that only draws 2 feet of water, hooked a fishing line about 150 feet away from the skiffs. And since the fishers should have known where their lines were, why they did not real them in when they saw several sailboats in close proximity to their lines. I was not the only boat in that area (although, I think I was the only boat that caught a line).
This was a very useful video! Like many of your videos! Thank you!!!
Nice summary. I have had a small fishing boat pull up in front, 100' or so, of me while I was sailing home, hard on the wind, drop a line in the water and claim right of way. I suspect he was showing off to the other passengers who where not fishing. I passed close enough to tell him he was wrong.
I have always wondered if this is taught in the boating classes.
I can compare two areas - Northern sea (B, NL) where there is a lot of commercial (container) traffic, there rules seems to be enforced and adhered to (well - do you know how much is a fine when hindering a container ship?). Another situation is in mediterian (Hr, Me) where local fishers just don't give a sh*t and you can see from far away the boat is not manned (drifting) and all others just have to keep clear
Prudent seamanship sounds a lot like common sense, the latter of which is not allowed on UA-cam.
Jokes aside, loving the video format!
Many years ago when I raced with the Winthrop Harbor Yacht Club on Lake Michigan we regularly had problems with fishermen trolling through our race course on Wednesday evenings. The course was a permanent one of eight marks set at compass points at one mile radius from a central start mark. Apparently the marks and their ground tackle attracted fish which, of course, attracted fishermen. The fishermen obviously didn’t understand the rules as they would consistently complain about us not yielding. I’m not sure why they didn't at least figure out that it was only Wednesdays at 18:00 when we were out racing and just stay clear then….
Good thoughts. Would love to have had a summary at end of vid.
Good video. Your son sails that Laser like a keelboat. The Laser wants to sail flat. Heeled the weather helm is strong and slows the boat down.
Live and let live.
I make a wide berth around fishing vessels not because they have right of way, which often they don’t, but because it’s less hassle to insist on my rights.
I know that sets a poor precedent, but I’m only out to have fun and they are out to provide for their families. It’s hard work. And I’m not a confrontational person.
All the time... I give trawling "fishing" boats a wide berth but still get the occasional dirty look, and yes, I've never seen a day shape on these smaller boats. For the most part it's common sense and accident avoidance at all costs, and a bit of etiquette which is sadly lacking with some. What I will say is that a large container ship altered course to give us more room as we were under sail in light air, my AIS said we would miss by more than 1Nm but respect to the captain - we both altered course by a small margin and it was a non event, which makes for a nice relaxed sail.
Great video
How about a 50’ fly bride motoring into port @18kts in a channel that is about 45’ wide and outside is 2’ deep. Me on a powerboat at idle trying to stay on the edge of the channel while hitting bottom. Then yelled at cause the captain would not have wanted me enter the channel until he exited. Found the experience disturbing and the solution could have been fixed if the other vessel would have slowed to “safe operating speeds” while inside a restricted channel. For context the channel is about 500yds long. No reason for a fishing charter heading back to port to fly through when port is only a 30yds from channel of the channel.
Document it (video) and report the vessel.
@@davidbrayshaw3529👍
He basically answered this exact question in the video
Great Lakes has no shortage of 10-20 lines off the back of charter fishing boats a few miles offshore following the same lines as coastal cruising boats. No shortage of them cursing me for "cutting them off" when I hadn't changed heading in the last 4 hours... 😂
Long time ago there was an article in the Pacific Yachting by a professional captain regarding same issues after I stopped buying the magazine for quite a while. He believed that a sailing boat has the right of way over a fishing troller while pulling the salmon gear.
Imagine the boat pulling the six lines with heavy lead balls just over the bottom following the isobath with hundred hooks at two knots.
It is an imperative to know the rules of the road but common sense is always important in asessing the situational awareness.
Even the professionals, especially without emotional intelligence, make grave mistakes.
There are many ignorant and arrogant people between proffesionals and amateurs.
ROW on the ICW is like a circus act now that its summer. Weekends make it a no rule in areas were you have motor , jet,pontoons' and large craft & paddle boats. No Wake rule seems to be the only rule many try to obey.
My Grandfather taught me as a child that 'Right of Way' always gives to 'Right of Weight'... no problems since.
I wish everyone would stop using the term “right of way”. It implies that only one boat has any obligation. In a collision situation, both vessels have responsibilities. One boat is the “stand on” vessel and must maintain course and speed. The other vessel, the give-way vessel, must alter course and speed.
Agreed. The COLREGS do not use the term “right of way”, which would imply a “not at fault” case. I suppose that was intentional. Stand on/give way cover what vessels should do in a given situation, assuming it is safe to do so. I don’t think stand on should be interpreted as right of way.
I'm an ex merchant seaman who owns a "bass boat" and use it often. It's appalling how many recreational boaters and yes, bass boaters, have no clue about the rules of the road. I give them all a wide berth, even stop when they turn left in front of me. I'm in central Virginia.
I didn't know it was that complicated. interesting.
UK professional fishing boats invariably have the day shapes permanently mounted, amateur small boats just have a landing net stuck up where it can be seen.
No one bothers about this until there is an incident then the insurance pay-out becomes dicey and the authorities become very keen to prosecute, it was always thus.
Also keep in mind overtaking. If you are in a sailboat and you are overtaking you have to keep clear.
As they say in the Caribbean, the mon with the biggest boat, him got the right of way.
A common issue I've encountered in my area (SF Bay )
Are wind surfers and kite surfers in a narrow channel nearby the Marina I use.
Recently, I was coming in wing on wing in about 18 knots when a kite boarder went down right in front of my boat, and the channel is only about 2.5 boat lengths wide.
So, as I understand, these types of water craft aren't even considered "vessels" and therefore not covered under these rules for right of way.
Besides using common sense and, yes avoiding a down human in the water, what other thoughts are there related to this sort of traffic in a narrow channel?
The sacred right of way is one thing, to end up in a collision is another thing.
Rule no one ; stay clear of professional activity when you are sailing.
Excellent discussion. And by the way, tell your son about outhauls!
Ha! In all fairness to him, I don't think that it can be controlled from the cockpit on a Laser and I'm going to presume that when the left the beach that it was 2 knots, tops.
Credit where credit is due, he didn't go for a swim, though.
@@davidbrayshaw3529 very definitely lasers have easily adjusted outhaul. But the point of the discussion is that too many of us boaters do not know the right of way rules. That’s why most of us have to take safe boater courses. Will that change the confusion at sea? All those charter boat fishermen have licenses and yet they still yell at sailboats and motor between racing sailboats.
As they say, be careful out there.
@@romaniandracula I wasn't sure about the ease of use of the out haul on the laser. I don't remember any other trimming line on them.
But you are right. We don't know the rules, as a generalization. If I became an active sailor again, I would most certainly have to revisit the regs. The frightening thing is that my power boat license is still valid!
Charter boat operators weren't anywhere to be seen where I used to sail. Jet skis were our curse. Best to stay clear of the lot of them.
Right of way or out right harrasment? couple of years ago I was leaving Middle river Maryland in my 43 foot sailboat. As usual the area was littered with crab traps, and yes in the channel. We are making the best of it weaving through the traps to get out. There was a crap boat that didn't appreciate us there. he came flying at us as fast as he could, as telling by the huge bow wake he was making! (passing traps as he went - not activly fishing) I altered course a bit to get away form some traps and he continued to track me. he ran right up at my port beam and made an abrupt turn, and then without a smile, waved at us. could he possible thought I was going to raid his traps from a sailboat?
Best rule is to steer away no matter what!
Wouldn't a boat that is "hove to" be constrained? Or at the very least be the overtaken vessel so they are stand on regardless of what tack their boom may be on?
It’s usually the pastime sailors and not the professionals who are the problem. You ask them about colregs and they look at you blankly. There are colregs relating to etiquette in channels and I don’t see anywhere in the colregs that says people can anchor up in shipping channels. There is the lame duck etiquette relating to who can give way and rules for crossing and proceeding along the channel. Also when does a fishing boat become professional? When it’s displaying daytime shapes and nighttime lights.
Even though I have a sailboat .. I also have a kayak .. I have had problems with powe boats that want to run at high speeds even when they see us with or flags and lights ... It seems they want to swam kayaks just for a laugh .. It always gets me pissed .. Most powerboaters feel the don't have to have any curtsy for othes wether theyare sailboats or kayaks
Only commercial fishing vessels have right away not recreational fishing
I think you mean "right of way"? (Not an actual thing - although some poorly educated ferry-boat captains around here, might disagree). Also, not true. Depends on whether or not maneuverability is significantly impacted, and correct use of day shape, or R/W lights. Similarly, diver-down flags have the same import, regardless of whether or not the particular diver is getting paid.
There is sooo much arguing about this subject and I’m sure your comment section is littered with people saying “right of way” isn’t anywhere in colregs. Here in Texas we have oil tankers, smaller container ships, cruise ships, and shrimp boats to worry about.
The Salmon Spectacular derby on Georgian Bay is 10 days of the worst sailing and way to many examples of horrible boat handling.
As an avid fisherman and sailor on the upper Chesapeake... People are assholes and everyone thinks they have the right-of-way until its a ship or barge. Unbelievable. I cant rell you how many times ive been anchored off Pooles island in a 23 or 27' express with a hardtop, outriggers (not exactly easy to miss) clearly fishing and a 50 foot sportfish comes rolling by within 100' on plane. Ive had my spread runover by a "blowboater" as the ignorants say. Hell, ive been flat out cut off by other people trolling. The commercial charter guys will litterally run you off into the shallows if you let them meanwhile screaming they are "commercial fishing" because they have a TFL. Theres a whole bay out there folks. Just be a decent person.
I think a clarification/correction is needed starting at 4:24 - sailboat on starboard tack is only the stand-on vessel under racing rules. “Starboard tack” is a reference to wind direction. In Colregs the vessel on starboard of the OTHER vessel is the stand-on vessel, regardless of wind direction. If the wind is coming from port (port tack) the vessels to starboard of an approaching vessel would still have right of way.
you are incorrect, this rule applies in all sailing crossing situations:
RULE 12
Sailing Vessels
(a) When two sailing vessels are approaching one another, so as to
involve risk of collision, one of them shall keep out of the way of the other as
follows:
(i) when each has the wind on a different side, * the vessel which has the
wind on the port side shall keep out of the way of the other;*
(ii) when both have the wind on the same side, the vessel which is to
windward shall keep out of the way of the vessel which is to leeward;
(iii) if a vessel with the wind on the port side sees a vessel to windward
and cannot determine with certainty whether the other vessel has the
wind on the port or on the starboard side, she shall keep out of the way
of the other.
(b) For the purposes of this Rule the windward side shall be deemed to be
the side opposite to that on which the mainsail is carried or, in the case of a
square-rigged vessel, the side opposite to that on which the largest foreand-aft sail is carried. ** And the overriding rule is always stay out of the way..if you cant determine, or if it looks like they will not be following the rules, just move so as to avoid a collision. Be a good Captain**
Your comment applies to vessels (sailboats or power boats) under power. The rules governing sailing vessels apply always whether or not racing.
I'll tell you what's maddening...recreational fishermen that know NOTHING about any rules. They get on their powerboat and push go. Drop gear in channels. Speed by working boats and sailboats under power or anchored. Newport Oregon is littered with this kind of crap.
I have gotten occasionally in shouting matches with bassboats hogging the middle of a very narrow pass 2 or 3 at the time. Not even mentioning colregs (that would have flown way over their heads...) but arguing solely on basic human decency. But they might be assholes driving their pickup trucks too.
There is no "right of way vessel"!! Just "stand on vessel" and "give way vessel"! In case of collision both are to blame!!
noo wayyyyy😱😱😱
Much like riding a motorbike and coming acroos big vans and trucks, you dont play games with bigger vessels just because you are the stand on vessel. Especially fishing boats crewed by generally unsavoury characters (not all of course, but definitely a good amount). Anything big and scary looking I just stay tf away from.
Don't hit the other boats.
I'm am not a maritime legal expert by any means, but it is my understanding that if you hit other boats and you had a chance not to, if you survive, you'll be held accountable regardless of "right of passage". The ultimate measure at law of culpability comes down to whether you could foresee and avoid a collision.
Something very fishy going on here 🤔
Careful, let us not support the hysteria "they shouldn't be here anyway." That attitude is never helpful.
And then, drift fishing is NOT anchored but how can you tell they are not anchored over an underwater freshwater spring hole or underwater tidal eddy current around an obstacle and preferred lay for any mature fish and where any educated fishing enthusiast WILL sit for hours at anchor..., making any channel littered with obstacles a popular fishing hole for drift and anchored fishing. Any channel will magnify wind, currents and waves and quickly become an unexpected challenge further escalating the tensions of any on the water amateurs and expert alike, blame and name calling does not help.
I understand that any regular obstacle to popular recreation quickly finds a bias leaning heavily toward the type of animosity usually reserved for thieves and murderers and worse.
Seems to me there are lots of gray areas that are solved with a mature and considerate evaluation.
First, every watercraft has a right to use the water in any way they chose and are not a nuisance nor inconsiderate and should always be treated with respect.
If when people are out for a day of fishing and/or ending a three day sailing tour - if any encounters are not going as smoothly as they should, record the episode and report it. Unfortunately the solution may eventually and regrettably become to haul in the sails and motor through any narrow or difficult channels.
Out on the open seas, the difficult fishing boats will be either anchored or trolling. Yes, anchored in the middle of the ocean. On the other hand if trolling, you are correct any quick turn can irretrievably tangle hundreds to thousands of dollars in line and gear and put an end to the day of fishing.
I am only a lake sailor and an ocean fisherman where i've sat for many hours anchored of Jeffery's Ledge, Maine/Nova Scotia and lobster fished many of the rocky and deepwater shoals and where sailors and power-yachts always give a wide berth. I have Not fished Chesapeake Bay, nor sailed any of the East Coast Sounds etc where partial shelter from oceanic winds and waves make these prime for all recreation.
I don't believe difficulties are the type of watercraft nor their intended use. However, as populations continue to expand any difficulties now will certainly become more difficult. I've seen the type of impatience and animosity that ruins everybodies day.
Education is always the answer.
It's not the 18 hundreds sail boats should never have right of way
Why? A sailboats maneurability is no different than it’s ever been?
The less maneuverable vessel has the right of way. Sailboats are usually less maneuverable than power boats. The tonnage rule should always apply, regardless of right of way.
It comes down to the relative manoeuvrability of the two types of vessels. The above presentation is something to consider if you're not familiar with yachts. When it is a windward shore or port and there is a narrow channel to navigate, a yacht may have to perform multiple tacks along that channel in order to reach safe harbour.
While navigating around boats isn't usually a problem in this situation (although it can be), when you start expanding the foot print of a vessel by adding anchor rode and fishing lines, things can become overly tight for a yacht navigating to windward under sail.
At the end of the day, we all want fellow boaters to get home safely, in one piece. And if that isn't enough motivation to do the right thing, we all want to be not held accountable for a fatality that was a consequence of our actions, inactions or hubris. If you're sitting in a market channel, anchor down and lines out and someone comes unstuck and drowns as a consequence, you'll find that unlike the criminal courts that you're familiar with, maritime courts the world over don't suffer fools. They expect you to "get it right", and if you don't, you generally receive harsh punishments... and then there are the civil legal implications. The world is 70% water, most of it not channels. Do the right thing. It's easy.
If you feel that way, never own a boat. You're not a responsible enough person to handle one.