Finkelstein Says He Was Unhinged In The Destiny Debate
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- Опубліковано 9 кві 2024
- Destiny reacts to Norm Finkelstein admitting he was out of control in his debate with Destiny on the Lex Fridman podcast to Briahna Joy Gray...
Norm Finkelstein UNLOADS on Destiny, the latest on Gaza
► • Norm Finkelstein UNLOA...
Date: 9 Apr, 2024
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#destiny
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#debate
Shapiro Should Be Questioned And Labeled!
►ua-cam.com/video/2dI4ZRBsb2Q/v-deo.html
Destiny's entire argument falls apart when he keeps repeating the already debunked lie that there were rapes, there is no evidence
@@ilmatzothat would be a legit point, if that were his main point. I keep hearing that talking point on other channels, y’all just seem like y’all coping lol
@@ilmatzo Also, the fact that he uploaded this video _after_ the murder of the World Central Kitchen aid-workers demonstrates his Zioblindness. Apparently, the precision slaughter of aid-workers does not quite rise to 'malicious intent' in the 'mind' of My Botulism.
@@T_Time_ Now someone who defends Destiny on this issue accuses others of Coping?, the irony. The point about "rapes" is an extremely important point,
@@undercoveragent9889 good point,
He is willing to defend even what the idf does not do
YOU'VE FINKEL'D YOUR LAST STEIN, MR BARONI
🦍
Don't change the subject Mr Destaroni
"Mr. Ricearoni, I humbly invite you to leave this debate room and join your family in the local zoo. I will happily supply fresh bananas."
*twinkelstein dual wields gun and knife and lunges over desk at 35 year old male stephen "destiny" versaci*
Your wikipedia tactics won't work here Mr. Jabroni
No más Finkles to be Steined for Dr Spamoni…🤷🏼♂️🦧🦦🦥
The scariest part was watching how many people blindly glazed Finklestein. Its so over
This was a sign of pure leftist brainrot and I don't even necessarily agree with destiny
no-one is "Blindly" glazing anyone... its just really funny to watch someone get bodied...i know you get it you are a destiny Stan
Can you point out the thing that destiny was incorrect about? How did he get "bodied"? Be precise. (Since you're not following blindly, this should be easy to answer) @STIKY55
And you edge yourself to every word Finkel says @@STIKY55
@@STIKY55 Sad to see that you're so twitter brained you don't know how a debate works. 😢
This shows finklestein’s trash character perfectly. I don’t care what you think about destiny this was so disrespectful to everyone else involved who took it serious who made the effort & he threw it in everyone’s face for a personal vendetta. Cheap.
It’s funny how non political people like YourRage can see that but the political hobbyist Twitter warriors can’t.
Finkelstein is a hack and got exposed
Your autistic obsession with destiny won't make him any less incompetent
COPE
Exactly, just showed how disrespectful he would be if any of us “wiki warriors” would dare question his opinion. I’ve usually found the loudest ones in the rooms are the dumbest and Finkelstein was certainly the loudest. If he was as intelligent as he believes himself to be, he would’ve realized how stupid he was making himself look. No wonder DePaul refused his tenure!
Norm is unbelievably dumb and tragically childish... it would be funny if it weren't so sad.
They literally named the show "bad faith." You can't make this stuff up
You’re lying there’s no way 💀💀
One thing they are honest about is themselves there.
Brainlet take.
I noticed that too and I feel like I’m in a fever dream.
It’s an obvious satirical show and that name was chosen for irony
EDIT: Let me be in denial and cope. after denial comes anger. its this or i black pill.
Started watching you after I heard about the norm debate. Couldn't believe how an academic admitted to not even wondering how the Israeli military functioned. It's scary that an academic can study a topic for forty years, gain media appearances, and not even have interest in the central questions involved.
Because he didnt. He quotemined books and statements to reaffirm his own belief.
@@CrestOfArtorias and people somehow take him seriously just because of how outwardly confident he is in his own BS. Fecalstein is the epitome of the Dunning-Kruger effect, the highest form of evolution an NPC can reach.
@@viysnjor4811 Finkelstein is a bit like the awkward kid in your friend group that everyone sorta props up because you know he is having a hard time but there is a limit to how much you are willing to do it when you are pushed on it. That is essentially Finkelstein and the lefty academia sphere.
Among academics his "position" is respected, that being "opposition to towards the state of Israel", he is not. They will praise him for holding to "correct" position but when pressured on their position towards him they will abandon him faster than rats abandoning a sinking ship.
Welcome
Because it isnt relevant infornation... the idf functions as a conscript army, their headquarters is located in a civilian shopping mall... 2 years of service is mandatory. Nothing outside of that is relevant but ill add that idf doesnt patrol with a round in the chamber because they dont trust their trigger happy conscripts... theyve been at it since october 7th and have more civilian casualties than the what 2+ years of russian invasion in ukraine?!?! If your civilian considerations are worse than fucking russia, your morals and your military are completely fucked!
This guy is shaping up to be a good Destiny villain for the rest of the season. I just hope the writers don't retcon him like they did Demon Mama
Destiny described her own life as Death Note. I can definitely see her being the anti-hero to her own narrative.
Hopefully they bring back his ultimate villain.
Ficklesteen is a flash in the pan in general.
@@MsHojat
A life long scholar?
@@lumpyrex007"scholar" is a weird way to say "Grifter"
Joe Rogan 'calling out' Destiny for using Wikipedia is like a caveman mocking Thomas Edison for using a light bulb to see in the dark.
PERFECT analogy
I mean Joe can just get an expert on whatever he wants to explain it to him so it's not one to one.
@@4o467well it is, considering he believes anything that an "expert" he likes says without double checking. I am not sure he can even read.
@@4o467The issue is that he is not capable of selecting the experts and instead have Twitter noisemakers talking about vaccines etc. I like Rogan a lot, but his intellect is not a reason to.
Imagine a horse paster like slow Rogan calling someone else out for not being an expert. 🤡 Joe clearly respects and demands expertise except when a broscience idiot prescribes Ivermectin.
I wonder how long Fecalstain will be obsessed with Mr. Cornelli
As long as he has fans that he is misleading… it isn’t a matter of “obsession” he’s just pollutes the discourse
Um... And how many vids as Mr Botulism done on Finklestein? LMAO You guys are so self-unaware. lol
@@erikanderson1402
Your man’s literally admitted to refusing to argue the merits of Destiny’s argument. So he did literally nothing to helping the discourse. If anything, he made it worse.
@@e-man7418 … Bro he did, how many more shots does destiny get lol?
@@erikanderson1402
How?
How does someone help the discourse by “getting out of control” to the point your waiting for the moderator to stop him?
Funny how finlkledik doesn't realize that Benny was laughing at how absurd HE was.
he actually believes that benny respects him. that is how delusional he is
I think he is probably a narcissist, so this is why he acts like this. @@thewkovacs316
we will never know until we ask Benny. Each side thinks he is laughing at the other side. I would say he was laughing at the situation and not in harm of someone. A streamer vs a scholar has never happened in the history of the conflict
@@TheTeeProd hard to call finklestick a scholar. A smart person assumes there is something to learn from the person he's talking to. The way he acted screams idiot with a degree.
nobody really had a particular bone to pick with destiny: it's all just "he's read books and destiny was so out of his league just reading a wikipedia article" like nobody has an original thought or criticism on anything Destiny said. I feel like I'm taking crazy pills reading the tiktok comments etc.
Exactly. Finklesteins supporters are just like him. All ad hominem, zero substance.
I have talked with countless Pro Pal
They know little. It's all just a "feeling" that Isr is wrong. Never anything more. No added detail, nothing... maddening
Yeah laughing about how genocide is the best solution didn’t make anyone dislike destiny
@@TheRainsRuined Ive experienced this with people who grew up in Egypt. Once you asked at what point in history the conversation starts you can see the wheels spinning.
@@nothing-to7iy This event shows me that most just believe whatever they absorbed First
I cannot reason someone out of a position - They never reasoned themselves into. It's impossible
Oh okay.
So I’m expecting a more genuine and lengthy post from Finklestein in regards to how he used his spot on one of the most viewed podcasts, hosted in good faith by Lex, to waste everyone’s time for 5 fucking hours.
Instead of using the chance to elucidate the complicated parts of the conflict and convince people on the other side of his stance, he just thought he’d show up some internet personality, as he loops trying to debate the guy he actually considers to be one of the foremost authorities on this because he can’t string a coherent argument together.
Let’s also acknowledge the absolutely incoherent and non-conducive way Fink continues to speak in these debates. It is beyond a Joke. I don’t care if you are “choosing your words carefully”. You need to be able to formulate your responses and dictate them at a more appropriate pace, for the sake of your own arguments if nothing else.
Glad Fink took one his best chances to engage in a good discussion on this, to simply have a laugh.
What a fucking hilarious waste of everyone’s time.
Mr Borelli did nothing wrong.
It's worse than a waste of time, Destiny is 100% right that he doesn't care a lick about dead and suffering Palestinians, they're just a ticket to fame and paychecks for him.
its because finklestein realized he is out classed by destiny which hasnt been doing work on this topic that long, compared to the to others in the room. finklestein also probably realized how stupid he is and how much he doesnt understand about this subject, now slowly realizing he wasted his whole life on something and not reaching the level a person could reach by a okay amount of reading
@@itsmechrispy6083You know, I think this should be mentioned more. I understand Finklestein is obviously dumb, but how can you expect him to admit any of this when it’s his life and admitting he’s wrong is admitting he wasted his life and is incompetent at what he was pursuing. No one would admit this without having an extreme degree of self esteem and confidence, which he clearly does not have
@tomjames
Yeah, it’s like watching mean girls after a weekend party with BJG and Finkelstein here. The giggling is beyond cringe
@@itsmechrispy6083 definitely! Norm’s understanding of Ukraine he discussed with Ben Burgis was unwatchable. Ben respected him, while NF treated him like a scholar and his student. Just painful, considering Ben was more knowledgeable
YOU'RE NOT SLEEPING TONIGHT, MR. MORELLI.
🦍
@@Bmoney1337 Secret WSB user Finkelstein
🍌 time
Mrs*
IF I DONT SLEEP, YOU DONT SLEEP
Finkledick having credibility at all after admitting to being pro-Ukraine invasion is so fucked
What’s wrong with him advocating for that? Liberals love when the US flexes it’s military muscle
Peafy
"Most Zionists don't believe that God exists but they do believe he promised them Palestine" - Ilan Pappe
@waynewayne8419 his whole hatred of israel revolves around virtue signaling but russia is doing to ukraine everything finkie accuses Israel of doing to arabs.
So he's a hypocrite and a self-hating Jew
@@waynewayne8419@waynewayne8419 his whole hatred of israel revolves around virtue signaling but russia is doing to ukraine everything finkie accuses Israel of doing to arabs.
So he's a hypocrite and a self-hating Jew
Finklestein debates like a religious zealot
"I read it in a book!"
"you totally misunderstand the point of that book"
".... But, but it said it in the book!"
Reading the book. Yes reading......
Mr. Banal said straight out that reading books is a waste of time. Wait, what?! Excuse me?!
Funniest part of him reading the books was when the guy who wrote the books was correcting him on what he read lmao
@@transmogrification245comprehension is more important. Finklestein proved his incompetence at comprehension, but he sure can read.
Not only that but while sitting across the table from the guy who wrote the book you claim to have read that is frequently disagreeing with you. That is largely in agreement with a guy you spend all your time calling a wiki warrior.
I still can't get over the fact that they thought Benny was laughing at Destiny and not WITH Destiny
Me neither but then again I don't expect people on the spectrum to fully understand social cues
bruhhh benny was definitely laughing at destiny and holding back his laughter, tf u mean
@@dave4468 Lol he was laughing at Norm's reactions. Clearly you've never been in a situation where somebody loses their cool and comes off unhinged at somebody else in the room creating a funny/awkward situation or you just don't pick up on social cues very well.
@@toedrag-release bruh read the comments on the video of the debate. It wasn't just benny, it was the entire audience. u in denial or what? u and mr morelli are the incels that people laugh at and cope that people are actually laughing with you
@@dave4468 if Fifty million people say a foolish thing, doesn't mean it's not a foolish thing. Anybody with half a brain sees that Benny isn't laughing at Destiny in the situation rather laughing at somebody becoming unhinged. Benny and Destiny agree on most things, Benny frequently nodded pointing at destiny as well as stated "he has a point" and "Steven is correct" many times.
Ironically they are calling ad hominem attacks winning a debate.
You wouldn't have people from all sides of the aisle using ad homs if they weren't at least a bit effective. And "a bit effective" is an understatement.
Who is they? Ad homs arent always the death of the argument, some people dont deserve the time given to them because they arent arguing or debating in good faith. Destiny is a fine target for this as he is essentially just a diet ben shapiro for moderate liberals.
Considering the whole world called Rabbi Shmuley a clown loser for going ad hom against Finkelstein, but when Finkelstein goes ad hom he’s a winner and the whole world praises him.
There was no debate, just because Mrs Stratiaciella memorized a few facts, and came at someone who read 15000 pages 4 times, and gets dunked on; it doesn't mean there was a debate. How would Mr Borellia cope with 1-3 following ups?
@@mollykyoto5220 then why did he respond to his facts by calling him an imbecile and refusing to refute them with better facts and logic?
Honestly, I dont really buy that Norm wanted to troll the entire time. This guy will waste 5 hours of his life just to fuck around while he otherwhise takes himself 100 % seriously?
Imo the performance we saw was just the best he could do, he is just mental.
Brianna should be asking him why he would waste everyones time when there are more and more children dying in Gaza.
Never seen a troll as big a Finklestein. He brought shame to the entire Borelli lineage.
He’s not a troll, he doesn’t do things for laughs, he’s just insane.
Mr Vermicelli please don't disrespect the professor like that
" Mr Spaghetti I may have been denied Tenure, but I assure you - I am very trustworthy and respectful when the time comes "
Dickrespect, actually*
Dinklestein is a fool.
He's not a professor.
@@theonlychadman he's a profesaur, those scrawny arms can't even hold a microphone
Destiny thank you for exposing Briahna and Norm, I absolutely loathe them for their true character. I think it is absolutely obvious they do not honestly care for Palestinians, one is a bad judge of character and bad faith actor and the other only cares about his provenance. The gleeful laughing was disgusting. They’re having the time of their lives.
We all had the time of our lives at Borelli's expense.
Anybody who unironically listens to Brianna joy grey or whatever for political takes is absolutely braindead
@RenNightshade-uk8pghow old is your humor?
Thank u for posting this comment. I feel exactly as u do. Just so u know, majority of S. Koreans support Israel.
I can see Jewish ppl feeling as Ethan does lol. Yes, I'm weird.
"It was a long time since any one had spoken to him as kindly as Mrs Hale. Most people were either indifferent to his troubles, or disposed to think it natural that a young fellow of his age should have carried without repining the burden of three crippled lives. But Mrs Hale had said ‘You’ve had an awful mean time, Ethan Frome,’ and he felt less alone with his misery."
- Edith Wharton
@RenNightshade-uk8pg your parents must be very proud 😊
I gotta give Finkelsteiner credit for this PR move. Anyone who didn't watch the debate would walk away from this thinking he did an amazing job.
I wouldn't give him credit for it though. It seems more like these other channels are doing damage control for him, so they get the credit for it. lol
I watched the debate, more than one time now. Destiny looked like a little kid of his depth. Just look at the comments on the debate video, read the room u creepy little sycophant
@@deschain1910 You people are living in another dimension lmfaoo. Fanaticism at its finest lol.
@@JrocTheReal
Projection at its finest. 😆
This was a weird debate,. All I saw was ad hominem attacks directed at Destiny but not a single point Destiny made was refuted. If Norm is the teacher and Destiny is the student, then this class was basically the teacher telling the student how much smarter he is and how dumb the student is without ever actually diving into the lesson. It was weird as hell. Why did Norm even show up if debating Destiny was beneath him?
It was a crap debate
He said why in this interview. He said it would make him look like a coward when Benni is also invited
Because norm likes to pretend to be an intellectual, but he is not. He thought this debate would make him seem smart becuse he miss read the situation
Because Norm is highly emotional pretend-to-be expert. He cares about how he looks more than the content of the debate.
black woman acting like 13 year old me when my crush told a joke, pathetic
very proud black women who grovels at the feet of an old white man
She was kicking her feet under the table for sure.
@@Saltyoldguy-actually lold
Sucks that they are dismissing Destiny strictly because of his lack of a formal education in general.
didnt he attend a post high school music program?
pretty formal to me
They're dismissing him because they disagree, they're not actually operating off of any kind of confidence that they understand the issue better than he does, it's just a cope because without a stronger argument then the next best thing is to pretend they're above it. If they had any substance, they'd be arguing on the substance.
It's not that they are dismissing Destiny because of his lack of formal education. They are dismissing him because they disagree with him.
If Destiny was pro-Palestine, and was on Finkles side in that debate against Benny and whoever they would pick for Pro-Israel side, Destiny from 'wikipedia reading moron that shouldn't be in the room' would become 'passionate young man that spent countless hours over months to be Palestines strongest warrior.'
@@bartoszkrawczyk5921, Good point.
@@devinhoyt2935 True, I agree.
2:24 it looks like August reused the splash screen from a previous video lol
He misedited
Let August live his life. Let him freeee
I didn’t notice at all 😂
August, if you're reading this, you have let me down. I no longer accept you. Things will never be the same.
The fact that Finkelstein describes his research process with the sentence "I know this argument is wrong, but I need to find out why" is absolutely insane. Fundamental misunderstanding of how academic research and science in general works. Clearly not a man interested in finding the truth or engaging in earnest debate.
i have said this before but he researches like i did in undergrad when i knew what i wanted to write but just needed a quote to agree with me.
I was just trying to get that piece of paper but Norm is supposedly a real academic\.
Not going to lie - when I want to assess Finkelstein's academic research, a person like you, who is known only for posting video game videos on UA-camr, is not the person I'm going to ask. I'd rather ask, I don't know, all the history academics and professors around the world who put his book on their curriculums (and still do).
24:55 dude just admitted he does mental gymnastics to get to his conclusions because "he knows they're wrong"
Also he constantly talks about his memory fading and he doesn't even remember half of the facts he read on the subject
And he literally got mad at you for laughing for 5 minutes while praising muine and Benny for laughing every second.
@@AlexisGarcia1872AGya the memory fading is weird as hell. He goes:
“I’ve read your book THREE TIMES Mr Morris… I know it very well”
2 minutes later when challenged:
“I read it a long time ago, I do not remember the context of the quote”
@@Calico983 Finkle did same thing with the SA report when dolus specialis was brought up. He read it 4 times. Meaning he'd cross the term at least 16 times
Destiny's listeners live in their parents' basements but Norm on the other hand lives in his deceased parents' apartment
rent controlled apt....ny law is keeping him from being homeless
only state where one can inherit a rent controlled apt
and dont forget, he ethnically cleansed an hispanic family so that he could read his books in peace and quiet
@@thewkovacs316he needs the government to keep him from going homeless?
@@whatoh3407 do you know anything about rent control in ny?
@@thewkovacs316 really what did he do to the hispanic family ?
@@hunterthompson6737 destiny has a full rundown...search for the vid
This exactly. Him not being able to bury you in a debate despite you being a "wiki warrior" speaks lowly of him since he's so SCHOLARLY and an EXPERT. When people load their qualification like that they open themselves up hard.
EXACTLY.
Thats not how debates work... this is why fink had nothing but contempt for destiny. The idea that debates have winners and losers just shows how little you understand about the debate process... its about sharing and exchanging ideas in order to help the viewer come to their own conclusions...
@@g00gleisgayerthanaids56 Nope. Not at all.
@@g00gleisgayerthanaids56 It has nothing to do with that whatsoever.
@@g00gleisgayerthanaids56 I disagree it's about swaying the audience to your point of view. What your talking about is a conversation.
Kinda wild to see this kind of gaslighting going on from someone who is supposedly an academic. Even if you're on his side you should be honest enough to admit that he barely even engaged Destiny on the merits of his arguments.
It's not really that surprising. He did the same stuff even when he was still a relevant academic. Reading through his history is wild. Unironic paid shill. He formed a specific opinion and ran with it because he was financially rewarded for it. It never mattered if things were ever right or wrong since people were forced to take him seriously due to how much he was propped up as the go to guy
I will reiterate it forever. There is a reason he lost his tenure position and has slowly become a political pundant. No one takes him seriously in academia anymore so he instead he abuses' his outdated credentials to legitimatize himself outside of academia. Since we've unfortunately moved into the position of "believe all experts" on the left. Even if their credentials are either outdated or irrelevant
The only person who came away from this debate looking really bad was Norman Finkelstein. They both know that, hence why they have made an entire video devoted to trying to make Destiny look bad. It does not matter how many forced and fake laughs Briahna Gray gives to what Mr Finkelstein is saying to her, it’s clear as pie 😂. Also, Mr Finkelstein isn't "respected" or "great" as she Brianna Gray likes to claim. Serious academics want nothing to do with Mr Finkelstein and have long since was washed their hands of Mr Finkelstein. The only place Mr Finkelstein gets any respect is in the comment section under his videos, because he tells people what they want to hear which is a very different thing to THE TRUTH. If Destiny was just an ignorant gamer who embarrassed himself then why do they feel so threatened by him, to the extend that they have to talk about him for hours on end, with Brianna Gray forcing laughter and reverting to idiotic insults rather than addressing points they disagree with Destiny on? Mr Finkelstein has been damaged and this video they have put out about the debate, is an attempt at "damage control" .They MUST make Destiny look bad so no one will take him seriously, despite him coming out of the debate extremely well.... Note how Brianna Gray is lauding Finkelstein up to the eyeballs by calling him "The Great Mr Finkelstein" 😂.... It's so transparent and FAKE! The fact they think the people who follow them won't pick up on this shows that they do not think the people who follow them are particularly intelligent.
Norm is a good example of why our world is in the state it is. The crazies have all escaped the asylums
he is why our universities are the way they are
guys like him earn phd's for crap
@@thewkovacs316 Tbf Finkelstein was kicked out his University professorship for his ad hominem attacks. He has no respect among academics.
@@thewkovacs316 a bit of a reach... Norm might be popular among students, but he isn't unanimous among scholars (last time I checked at least). He seems to be a controversial figure in academia.
@@PixelPenguin77 how did he earn his phd? look it up. he is everything that is wrong with liberal arts today. ask him his field of study....he said it during the interview.
he is the only one in the field because it doesnt exist
reading books and pulling them apart is what a critic does....it is not a legit field of study....
his books have no original material in them
the closest one was "the holocaust industry' that was roundly debunked for it's lack of scholarship
dersh never should have organized to have him denied tenure.....turned him into a martyr....he should have gotten tenure, to further expose the joke that liberal arts in university is
the man has never written a single peer reviewed study in his entire career
destiny showed how he cherry picks and depends on using the authority of others to prove his points....that isnt scholarship....it's propaganda, that he learned how to do from his "mentor" noam chomsky
@@thewkovacs316nuking Gaza is not genocidal according to destiny
I fucking knew it. I knew the reason why Finkledork was acting that way in the debate was because he felt insulted that Destiny was even allowed to participate.
How childish on his part…
That's cope. He was embarrassed he was getting roasted. Otherwise, he would have tried to bury Destiny under questions that required knowledge he didn't have to embarrass him.
@@zwoope
Destiny has no skin in the game. He's coming from a place of bad faith.
@@lumpyrex007You have no skin in the game. You’re coming from a place of bad faith.
This is the most ironic comment I've seen in a long time @@lumpyrex007
How does anyone take Finklestein seriously when his entire career is meant to be an intellectual especially on this topic and yet self admittedly gets unhinged, insults and interrupts during every debate he does on the topic?
To me, that's no different than Ben Shapiro being labeled as an intellectual and "facts over logic" before going on unhinged rants about "woke hollywood" or whatever. If you're pretending to be an academic or intellectual, act like it.
You had no idea who any of these people were before this. You've never seen any other debate with this man involved.
@@thundabearz5092And why do you think everyone else did know him? This is a lot of ppls first impression of him
Ben Shapiro has a law degree and was a practicing lawyer for years. Part of a lawyers job is using the knowledge he has in a particular manner, i.e. arguing his clients case one sidedly, in a setting with strict rules of engagement. It is as much verbal bloodsports as any public debate, but theres less behind the scenes character assassination.
He indeed got famous using less his knowledge of law, but his skills to EFFECIVELY argue an often unfavourable position by being rhetorically strong advocate of your position.
At the very least in the beginning before this devolved into a full on culture war and idp partisan fight where what he delivered wasnt important as long as you could clip it into "libs getting owned" content, he made a point of saying that outside of university "safe spaces" which were a new huge controvercial thing at the time, you will be met with ideas and positions you find offensive.
The problem at the time as well as today that the college students were incentiviced to feel offended because on campus that alone granted them priviledge not to further argue their position.
The Ben Shapiro of that time argued to the kids that outside of their very insulated campus bubble, merely being offended would not just not work, but actively cause them harm. They would have to learn to defend their positions EFFECIVELY. In the process of doing so by employing both their knowledge of the subject matter and the rhetorical means to deliver their mesage, would they be ready to face the larger world.
Think what you will of the accuracy of Bens predictions, but the concept, the initial idea at the time wasnt this twisted thing it has become. Sure, Ben Shapiro is to blame for continuing the originally educational format turned clip farming, despite being aware of the cultural shift and what the footage was now primarily being used for. But could he have stopped the large cultural shift that was already happening and is continuing to happen? No, he would have been buried and gone. Also, sort of in his defense: It did earn him a mighty fine pile of shekels over the years.
Brihanna, a lousy Harvard graduate, and Norm, a failed historian, lack synthetic thinking to participate in debates. Destiny is a synthetic thinker. That’s why he is good in debates. One survey demonstrated that only 5% among honor students possess synthetic thinking.
Excuse my ignorance but could you explain what synthetic thinking is?
@@edmaldonado8207 It's a cognitive ability to piece together facts into a cohesive or coherent whole. For example, in order to solve a physics word problem, you need a synthetic thinking to analyze data, put the facts together, and solve the problem. Had Destiny had passion for physics, he would have been an excellent physicist.
@@akakipappatacci4235 How cognitive was destiny when he said "I'm pro-genocide" or videos of dying Palestinians is simply pallywood, but let me guess I'm taking that out of context or it was a joke by him.
@@GearedGaming76899how does this have anything to do with him being a synthetic thinker?
@@GearedGaming76899 Yes you are. He said that because he knew he'd be clipped out of context. And people keep falling for it, demonstrating how bad faith certain people are. This is why many of us who do watch Destiny and do know his positions often laugh at the left or the right (they both do this) when they keep falling for the bait. Its how we know when certain people literally have no idea what they're talking about.
Imagine being so old and childish at the same time to not have the ability to be polite without the need for admonishment from someone much younger than you.
Finks contempt for destiny is justified.
Abby Martin answers that question like there's a Hamas gunman just off screen holding a rifle on her.
i find the whole divide to this debate fascinating tbh, and its made me genuinely question my own sanity.. in fairness to both sides, the debate went practically nowhere.. and anytime they came to an impasse it really just came down to my "feels" over any real facts. but it kinda hurts my brain to think that a large number of people see this as destiny getting "dunked" on to the point theyre having an interview and cackling about it. i just want one clip of finklestein stumping destiny.. show me the own! i need this for my own sanity please
They can't show you any such clip, not without deepfaking it themselves at least, on account of the bit where you're perfectly sane: that moment they're crowing about *never happened* - an entire swathe of people on the internet who agree with Norm's politics are just outing themselves, like he did, to be his fellow intellectual morons, after they watched clips of a man in his 70s behaving like a toddler, engaging in the worst of faith, employing logical fallacy after logical fallacy... and called that "him dunking on Destiny".
to use it as one's only source is a mistake
to use it to assist in digging deeper into a subject is just fine
and that is what destiny does
Sincere suggestion for your sanity. Stop watching Destiny.
@@metathorn_square judging by your comment you've thrown your hat Into the ring , can you give me some examples during this debate that would warrant me no longer watching destiny's content? Or anything at all about his content in general?
@@foossy9 No hat. No ring. Like I said, a sincere suggestion, as you are questioning your own sanity. Something to consider...why is my proverbial hat important to you anyways? Are you hoping I'm some kind of Finkelstein fan from another community looking for an argument?
Finkelstein said hating Jews is part of the human condition. If Destiny said hating Muslims was part of the human condition, what would Team Palestine say?
Destiny says verbatim he’s Islamophobic, team Palestine just plays the clip. Not a good example
@Unclejamsarmy islamophobia is a term made up by the muslim brotherhood to silence criticism of Islam.
Jews are a PEOPLE.
Antisemitism is a conspiracy theory and Norman is saying believing in conspiracy theories is acceptable.
He thinks lying is ok.
@@Unclejamsarmy Even if someone says he's Islamophobic it's not same as hating Jews as Islam is a mutable characteristic and being a Jew is not.
@@_sayan_roy_ Islamophobia is about prejudice against Muslims, now you might not like the term having Islam in it, but this same semantic BS that the other side does with well how can I be anti-Semitic when I'm an Arab and Arabs are Semites. We both know what the term means historically and pretending otherwise simply comes from a place of dishonesty.
I was already of the opinion that Dinkelstein was evil. Now, I’m certain. You can actually see he can interact and speak as a normal person when he wants to, but when he trying to mind bend his opponent with ridiculous arguments, besides going around the topic he turns on his 0.25x speed mode, that elongates the answer to a point where you don’t even know where you are.
So, clearly this is his strategy. It is purposeful and deliberate, hence I can only conclude is malicious.
it's also him trying to impersonate chompsky, his god and savior
MR.BOROCINNICELLI
Mr Divorcelli
Bro wtf this gave me a headache thanks a lot
@@Dsmith551 it's made of three parts: "Boro", then "Cinni" (pronounced "Chini") and finally "Celli" (like the music instrument but with an "i" instead of an "o")
She is insufferable
Bro having to listen to Brianna joy gray talk....
She's the worst of the worst
She is absolute worst. She needs to be debated by a proper speaker.
I was becoming homicidal just listening to her cackling
@@jessecharity5179 she the wicked witch of the tankies
What I imagine hell would be like
Deferring to a scientific expert is fine, but no one should give automatic deference to anyone in the field of liberal arts. That would mean that we just accept Norm's point of view. You don't need credentials or specialized knowledge to read and understand the Israeli-Palestinian conflict. Unfortunately, Norm and friends have used this idea of "expertise" as a sword and shield against Destiny. They say he's a moron who shouldn't be at the table and then dole out self-praise for their academic accomplishments. These were the best Ad hominem attacks that I have ever seen, so much so that Norm didn't have to rebut anything Destiny said. He just won by calling him a moron and mispronouncing his name.
Destiny has no place in the discussion... he brings nothing to the table other than regurgitated talking points. Thatd be like bringing in a comedian to a political townhall presidential debate...
Liberal arts is just the idea of being well rounded. Its the reason why you take a science, histiory, math, and english regardless of your major.
Amazing when people admit their unhinged nature and people flock to them like they're in the heavens gate cult is gross.
It’s always ok when their side does it…
Dr Norman Finkelstein came out of the debate looking incredibly weak. From reading between the lines it is clear Finkelstein and Briahna Joy Gray are now annoyed by this. Intellent-thinking people will see that. It does not make their side of the argument look good. This is why they have made a video discussing it at length. They do this to try and discredit Destiny and make him look bad. They obviously feel threatened. Destiny has a large audience. If they didn't feel threatened, they wouldn't be bringing it up like this and making videos about it, would they?. Note how they revert to petty insults and name-calling rather than try to address the relevant points they disagree with Destiny on. It's easy to see what is going on. You'd have to be in denial or deluded to think Mr Finkelstein looks good from any of this. What makes it all the more embarrassing for Finkelstein is that it has been done by a relative newcomer to the debate :)
This is all the downstream effect of social media. The next 20 years are going to be pretty bonkers.
Would Lex even bring back Finkeldick after saying all of this?
Because Lex has a strong left-wing bias. After interviewing Netanyahu, the prime minister of Israel, he felt he needed to balance it with Muhammad Al Kurd, an online influencer, who openly celebrates and incites to the massacre of Jews. Lex casted the sides in the debate unfairly. He casted the pro-Israel side to be compromising and softcore. While he chose hardcore ppl to
Represent the pro-Palestinian side
@@dinuraboody1249 An interview and a debate are 2 different things. Similar things or worse are said about Piers Morgan, but they've both given to the public record more than most other interviewers, corporate or independent. The point was that Finkeldick went into a discussion with the intent (the content mens rea lol) to agitate and undermine. That doesn't just tarnish Finkel's credibility (if he had any left), it takes the performative aspect of debate, something Lex has specifically tried to avoid, and forever associates him with it.
@@dinuraboody1249lex does not got a strong left wing bias. he’s a clout goblin, whoever gets him views he will platform.
he has no stance and no backbone.
Spot on@@dinuraboody1249
@@instantsus_ everyone has a bias to some extent. The format of Lex's podcast is nothing close to other clout goblins (Keemstar, Candace Owens, Joe Rogan, etc) so labeling him as one is kinda begging the question if you have a comparison or two in mind. UA-cam is a business venture but his podcasts are more like Alex O'Connor or Chris Williamson.
If you're certain there's no backbone involved I recommend his Ye interview. While other channels made a spectacle out of his Nazi deep throating Lex made it more educational and personal at times. Be careful letting one experience define your entire outlook.
Benny becoming Destiny’s favorite uncle has made this whole debacle worth it. I saw this performance and reaction from Finkle from a mile away. Dude is lost inside his own arrogance. And they called it a lack of respect for Destiny just showing up? Crazy.
That fat zi0nist was laughing at destiny the whole time 😂😂
This Finkel person is either completely delusional or a psychopath. And Brianna is not far from that so it seems
I admire Destiny managing with all this saying he finds comfort in how he held his own in the debate, and how they barely addressed him. He believes the fact they wouldn’t shows more about the weakness of their position, which I agree with.
It shows how much experience he’s gained over the years and how well it’s tempered him because FUCK ME I WOULD BE LOSING MY MIND IF I WERE HIM.
Its so hilarious how Twinklestein is mumbling incoherent words but the female host is just laughing along. As someone that works with customers a lot, that's precisely what you do when you have no idea wtf they are saying and just want to build rapport with them
Muine and Finklestein were playing husband and wife the entire 5 hour debate
Unlike Mr Divorcelli who cant even play that
I could only get through about half of this one. Finklestein really showed his ass here and no one should take him seriously at this point.
The channels name that the Finkelstein interview happened is appropriately called bad faith 😂
If you're 'condemning' Israel for civilian deaths in a war that Israel didn't start, you are genuinely unintelligent
I just wanna say I'm pretty grateful that Destiny covers these topics. I am pro palestine, already due to my background being half Iraqi with roots in palestine.
Hearing destiny bring contra arguments definetly helped me have a more moderate opinion and not be polarized in this very polarizing conflict.
I appreciate his content a lot
Destiny made me question the idea of Israel starving GAZA..He made Alex podcaster find facts/sources on aid trucks gettn thru and the specific amounts of food! I even looked online and saw AIPAC, (of all sources! I hate them politically), w a detailed list of items let in. It also stated GAZA has their own water sources+ grows a decent amnt of their own food) and claimed Israel supplies a huge bakery in Gaza than can make 2 million rolls etc a day. Also, there were statements showing 4/5 ths of requested food aid had gotten in to GAZA. But problems were listed about HAMAS taking some food supplies etc. Also, it was stated Israel supplied GAZA hospitals w generators, fuel, + a number of incubators. I know much destruction/ displacement but Destiny digging for facts made me have a more nuanced view of GAZA "famine". There is great stress n displacement but now I look for real proof of "famine"/ starvation. I don't just assume that's an accurate account. And I support a ceasefire or halt to bombing + allowing enough food in to feed all Gazans.
24:46 “im a forensic scholar, I’m looking to analyze the text and find out what’s wrong with this argument. I know it’s wrong, but why?”
In other words: “I make up my mind before I read the text and then I go looking for confirmation of my bias.”
Yes definitely a historian, and totally not a polemicist 🙄
That's a bizarrely giddy exchange. Manic even. Like they're flying high on the attention dead Palestinians have afforded them.
I love how D got these goofs all twisted up. Ive liked Rogan for ever but he's gotten a little wonky on stuff. You can tell he just repeats stuff more often nowadays but when I pull a multi hundred million dollar payday I won't know what the hell destiny's is really doing anymore at all
Someone older than me once said "First they ignore you. Then they ridicule you. And then they attack you and want to burn you. And then they build monuments to you." You are between the ridicule and attack stage. Finkle will be forgotten.
I’ve had enough, we need a debate about the debate. We need one of these finkle riders to come on and back up their belief that twinkle owned destiny so hard. We need receipts.
These kind of self congratulating mud slinging convos are not supposed to be had publicly. Embarrassing
I was thinking the same thing, this is done in poor taste, and I have lost all respect for these two people.
Glazing one's self is disgusting
I'm quite pro Palestinian in this conflict, but the tankie BS in this whole debate infuriates me, and the talking point that "why is everyone expected to condemn hamas" is INSANE. You're shocked that people want you (not destiny, the woman in the Piers interview) to condemn a terrorist attack that killed hundreds of people, if not over a thousand?
I want a ceasefire ASAP like I think most people would want on either side, but this is ridiculous. I don't see how it's ANY different than the people defending the bombing of children that these same people are rightfully horrified by.
Because no one asks Israel supports to condemn stern gang or Irgun, who did actually put babies in ovens and then later became leaders and govt officials of Israel, or even if they condemn the IDF for their recent and current actions. It’s just pretending that Hamas is some unique evil that has no equivalent on the Israeli side. That being said my answer would be just that - “I condemn Hamas, do you condemn the founders of Israel who killed grandmas and burned babies in ovens and became their modern political parties?”
Not to mention hamas still won't release remaining hostages. So not only is it insane that nobody will even condemn their terror attack (because they did it to jews)... but when calling for ceasefire, completely refusing to talk about why it hasn't happened. Would any other country be vilified after being massacred by terrorists and would any other country be told to ceasefire while terrorists were still holding hostages? Thank you for a moment of logic and decency. I didn't think anyone could be 'pro Palestine' and actually have a grip on how depraved it is to glorify and defend barbaric terrorists.
you support hamas
you supported what happened on 10/7
how effed up you are
@@Unclejamsarmyirgun and stern gang? Wtf? Some anti-british underground that disbanded? Never had more than a few hundred members?
Not comparable to genocidal Muslim fascists with jihadist armies.
Always VICTIM..
Because they never ask Israel supporters to condemn stern gang or Irgun - terrorist groups that targeted children and became Israel’s modern political parties
I genuinely LOATHE Finkelstein.
Shows how good Finkelstein knows his audience tho. He delivered exactly what he wanted for them to run around and praise him for how "good" he was.
Briahna forcing that face laugh was cringe
Briahna is cringe 100% of the time
17:09 - I am 60 years old, graduated with a degree in physics, worked for 35 years in information systems - and I think Destiny is great
you have a real degree
you have nothing to prove
people like norm have joke degrees and have to spend their entire life proving that they deserve to be called "doctor"
Finkelstein is truly a clown. Probably the best outcome of your debate with him.
All he had was ad homs truly a clown 🙃
Wow, this makes Finkelstein look so disingenuous. Why would anyone include him in a debate again??
his prejudice against younger generation only watching p0rnhub and play game in the basement is literally showed his "elders complaining everything about younger generation" and his prejudice and hypocrisy toward what is literate, so i guess even if i read books and did my research, and just because i was young or i use techs to read, i am still the type to watch p0rnhub and play games and illiterate about a certain subjects????
People these days are so hypocrite to the point of insanity, just because a guy is on the same team as you, everything that this guy said is right when this guy is literally unfaithful to the debates and straw mans his ways out.
you are talking about a guy who lives in his dead parents rent controlled apt and who hasnt had a steady gig for over a decade
he was cut off from the israel hate movement when he came out against bds, because he wasnt the leader of that cult
this is the most time he has spent on any platform since 2014 and he is loving it
I mean norm is not wrong.
@@BowlSoHard How old are you? If you are young and agreed with what he said then does that mean you and your friends only did what he assume which are masterbating and playing games? If yes, then i think it is better for you to get a new friend group and change your life style because most of the youngsters aren't like that.
@@VietTran-IAMV oh come on … don’t be so naive 😂🤣
@@BowlSoHard And he is right? by being 1.unfaithful in a debate 2.denying Destiny points even he is right 3. Lying about Benny Morris not agreeing w Destiny and laughed at Destiny 4. Talked sh1t about youngsters and didn't counter argue any logical counter arguments, dude is literally the meme "because i read books so i am right". I have downloaded and read so many books about this topics from Anna Archive from the basic like "from beirut to jerusalem" by friedman and to the new ones like "eighteen days in october" but i guessed because i read it through tech then i am illiterate like what doc Finkelstein said huh?
Finkelstein looks like a malnourished Colonel Volgin
There’s a “man on fire” from MGS5 joke in there somewhere…
"Bad faith" is a very fitting name for the Finklestein-Podcast
Fecalstain was hilarious throughout that debate. He is supposedly knowledgeable on this topic and had to resort to being an asshat when he was having trouble articulating.
This has just highlighted that Captain Twinkle is just an immature brat, an attitude that is glorified by his base because they all have it in common, regardless of the degree to which he does or doesn’t know what he’s talking about he clearly has the social intelligence of a shoe and such colossal ego that it’s just laughable (which at least imo isn’t something to brag about)
If he’s so obsessed with reading 3 Wikipedia articles maybe he should try reading 3 Wikipedia articles about how to have a conversation without coming across as an actual toddler, his behaviour is a disgrace to actual professionals
My favorite part of the video was when BJG said HAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHHA AHAHAHHAHA and her noise filter cut Norm out.
Can't tell if Fink is a liar or just approaching senility. Could be both.
The utter refusal to condemn Hamas is the strangest phenomenon I've seen in a long time. Even if you fully support Palestine it should be the easiest thing in the world. I guess you could always follow up by asking whether they think Hamas has Gaza's best interest at heart.
Briahna looks like she might have a thing for Norm.....
Never Forget Twinklestein's apartmentied. 😔✊
i super love debate! A hundred years ago I was on the debate team at my H.S. & learned both the classic rules of debate but also how to identify logical fallacies. Studying lists of these is super helpful.
This is so ridiculous, you can't criticize someone for reading Wikipedia. Criticize their statements not their source!
Mr.bernelli isnt going to make it out of this one with pissing off the jewlumni
You need to do a video with Benny Morris talking about how great he did during the debate, and you guys can share actual laughs about how it went because every cackle coming from bad faith is so thought out and prepared, she has to stop mid laugh becausw she forgot shes having a conversation and not just making Finklestein seem charismatic when he is just delusional
That will come off as “cringe and cope”
@@Drdirtydee yeah if you believe that. Others need to be shown that Benny wasn't laughing at Destiny, he was laughing with Destiny. Benny disagrees with Norm on every point, but Norm isn't saying that at all. As it stands Norm is being interviewed on how great he did, on how he told destiny off, how Benny laughed at destiny, and Norm was just taking the piss the entire conversation. Destiny has to clear up this mess other wise it seems like Benny Morris was on Norms side
@@Drdirtydee there's just no world where Norm says "okay, destiny was right, and Benny was on his side." Destiny has to be the one to step up and present his case that Benny was with him during the debate. To everyone on the otherside, it looks like Destiny is a lunatic and Norm is running laps. He has to defend himself with Benny right behind him otherwise Norm wins in the court of public appeal
@@Drdirtydee what's cringe is this idea that defending yourself from slander and obvious lies is cope. Destiny has to defend himself because Norm won't concede even if he is proven wrong. Destiny already has the support of his base, he needs to start attracting people who don't know who he is, he needs to also attract people who think Norm won. It's just not possible without Benny publicly announcing that Destiny was well versed in the topic. What's cringe is expecting Norm to show humility, Destiny is coping by just reacting and not responding in kind. He has to respond in kind.
@@AlexisGarcia1872AG he's already defending himself at every turn but what that looks like is him going LOOK AT ALL THESE PEOPLE WHO AGREE WITH ME LOOK SEE BENNY TELL THEM YOU AGREED WITH ME , destiny doesn't need new converts or prove anything, like that's only red meat for a weird part of the Internet that's probably gonna fizzle hard like red pill did after destiny walked into it.
In terms of circlejerky interviews or conversations I have to say the Krassenstein brothers would be a welcome addition to have them on with some regularity. I liked their appearence of Bridges and in the Alex Jones debate.
3:00 the moment in this interview where he says to Hijab : « you can look me in the eyes »
And Hijab just looks away is truly hilarious
I mean the podcast is called Bad Faith...
Bri giggling like a prepubescent teenage girl at everything Norman Finkelstein utters is so cringe. “Tell me more about how you crushed, Mr. Bonoboelli ?that time, Norm. Teehee”
"Divorcediny" made me chuckle
Saw a guy on another video say Mr. Divorcelli lmfao.
It makes sense why he didn't want to lose on actual merits, now he can just say he didn't try
Abby not condemning Hamas for killing innocent civilians isn't hypocritical. I'm 99.9% sure she thinks the civilians weren't innocent. When you take that perspective, she is 100% consistent. And that's why she didn't say anything xD
Amazing video. 🎉 Now make it into multiple shorts for the guys laughing. That's the only way that I think they could understand.
In a trolley problem scenario where one track has an innocent guy and the other has Finklestein and four other tankies I'd pull the lever to save the one guy without a second thought
Most moral option really
You'd feel righteous, but you'd make no difference.
@@thundabearz5092 Why, because nothing of value was lost?
@@thundabearz5092 kinda like a tankie
@@e-man7418holy shit this couldn’t be more accurate
I really believe in the authenticity of those typed out deportation threats to his upstairs neighbor now
Just the strong emotion that finkledink is exhibiting towards destiny proves that he fears/respects him. Keep this in mind Destiny.
Now i feel bad for Lex lol.
Lex during the intro: this is an important conversation, not for the views or the money, but for conciliation for all humanity.
Meanwhile Norm is openly meming,
And then he even indirectly calls Lex a pussy for not stopping him
16:36
Yes you said I'm reading from the UN/ICJ report.
Mr. Bourberelli 🤌
Crazy how many people thought he did a great job in that debate 😂
great work once again mr. bonelli!