Destiny Squashes Feud w/ Pro-Palestine Journalist After Incredibly Good Debate
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- Опубліковано 15 бер 2024
- Destiny and Nate Robinson have a really good debate on Israel and Ukraine after their brief twitter feud...
Date: 15 Mar, 2024
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#destiny
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#debate
Pro-Palestine Journalist Shocks Destiny w/ Best Israel Convo Ever
►ua-cam.com/video/7p1D1IqYflw/v-deo.html
Finkelstein LOSES IT In Our Debate On Lex Fridman's Podcast
►ua-cam.com/video/gJRCUfyyoLs/v-deo.html
Americans fund like three genocides just by owning phones.
I have such disappointments towards Destiny at times....
What if I'm just tired of Israel having any say over our government and traitors taking foreign money to do foreign bidding?
Also, Destiny, the literal holocaust museam/memorial's definition of that word, everything Israel is doing fits the definition. Why ignore this?
@Vicioussama
When you and your friends run out into the street in Uyghur colors shouting "from the Yangtze to the Yellow Sea, the Uyghurs shall be free" is when the rest of us will believe your sincerity on the issue of genocide
@@Vicioussama
Israel would be better off without the so called “foreign aid.” Had the US not blocked Israeli from manufacturing and selling their own military products (The Lavi fighter jet in the 1970s for example) Israel would be in a much better position today. The fact is our government (The US) did the right thing by looking out for own own interest.
The Holocaust museum’s definition of genocide doesn’t include German civilians dying during WWII.
WHEN A STREAMER TRIES TO BE A WANNABE HISTORIAN. YOU GET A MIDGET.
This is the moment where Mr Bonell became Mr Borrelli
I thought it was Monelli?
Señor Spaghetti?
I’m not too big a fan of Mr. Boodrelli
He's a 35 year old man!
Don't cancel me but Mr. Borelli does sound cooler
It takes courage to wear super expensive white clothing without fear of stains, I wish I had that courage.
Well, that jacket might only cost like 40-50 dollars.
@@Maelthorn1337still
@@Maelthorn1337wait, hold on. I get pissed when I stain my white t from a pack of fitted Hanes that I complain about the price of, and I have a high income. How loaded are you? Lol
@@WaffleStomper69 HAH. I only have one suit jacket, not white, and a bunch of dress shirts. I just wear'em when I know I'm not going to be eating. Did Fiverr spokesperson videos for a little while and it was only a few minutes to throw the stuff on, even with tying a tie.
So if I'm being really realistic, he probably got dressed up because he knew he'd be on stream.
You think he is brave enough to eat Chipolte in tighty whites.
Autism vs adhd FIGHT
Assumptions fight!
Lol
Autism vs *stimulants
Pretty funny 😅
Autism wins.
"Date with Destiny" is a good name for a podcast.
My dinner with Destiny
“Moment with Morelli”
@@ayeoneup7645Brunch With Borelli feat. Destinys Chef
I would only watch that if destiny makes an only fans where he shows him getting fucked in the ass by whoever comes in. Can you imagine a Dinner with Destiny with Finkelstein? God that sounds amazing
It would be like kick or keep but instead the panel would be judged on their rizz levels with each other
Bro came in full goblin mode and ended up being a good sport. Him and Marc Lamont Hill have been great convos tbh
Thank for your comment. Just started and this is unbearable. Glad it gets better
@@Ringringcodyphone2020sexual tension really builds up
Just a headsup, when Marc went on Hamasabi’s stream, he was a little unhinged. It felt like he’d been hiding his power level a bit with gnomey.
@@Ematchedyou don’t understand what hiding power level means
He doesn’t seem unhinged because he was hiding his power level, he seems unhinged to you because there is not an Israel point of view being represented. The same way that destiny seems unhinged sometimes when he goes and only represents the Israel side. Doesn’t mean destiny is unhinged, it means he is defending a point of view
Destiny brought the goblin energy until Destiny used the Ukraine conflict as a litmus test.
I think Ukraine is an incredibly good test for I/P convos. Although I am biased in that opinion, because I am right about Ukraine and I'm right about Palestine.
It’s unfortunate that he didn’t preface that he only deals in facts
He also completely forgot to call Fibonacci a fantastic moron
It’s the day after the Finkelstein debate dude; that jokes already old.
@@sweetcell8767im sorry to hear that but mr borellie is going to see this joke for the next couple of years most likely
Exactly. Now I have to treat everything he says as unfactual garbage.
Very….. slowly
27:00 "It would have involved transfer of people off a property, not necessarily violence" unbelievably naive and stupid take from Destiny, Nate's laugh echoed through my soul
I have no clue how Destiny reconciles that with the definition of violence he has used before. Getting forcibly kicked out of your house by the authorities is not violence? Bruh.
And yet, the Hamas leadership wants to forcibly evacuate all Jews from their houses.
@@MrRazmut he is too dumb to realize he is being used as a useful idiot to the regime.
Bro is literally the embodiment of wealthy New Orleans journalist man with that suit and mid 1900’s accent.
No one in New Orleans talks that way legitimately. This guy is spectruming hard
A transatlantic accent in a socialist is pretty funny, but he moved from England to America as a kid, so at least he has an excuse.
@@loverofbigdookies He definitely isn't from New Orleans. But the combo of that suit with that pseudo posh accent brought to my mind, some old money, mid 20th century journalist, that took a job at a publication in the south, so he could teach unlearnt, southern country bumpkins, like myself how we should think about the world. And maybe how to have a conversation without run on sentences.
Don’t know what that has to do with the debate i guess thats destny fans
@@Haytch-hw2hu who asked
Bet this guy doesn't call ICE or CPS on his neighbors over their children making noise.
The power of roof knocking
Not sure you could say the same for _his_ neighbors though ;)
Ey Paulie! Good to see ya
He did fire the staff of his socialist magazine for attempting to unionize.
Israelis do roof knocking, Norm does door knocking to warn of impending destruction.
This is Destiny's son Nathan Bonneli Robinson
Mr ravioli, never forget destiny is a mourelli name!
Why does this guy say everything with the same energy that Willy Wonka says "Good Day, Sir!"
It's all there black and white, clear as crystal. You broke the negotiations, you left office which has now been replace, with someone else, so the Palestinians get NOTHING! YOU LOSE! good day sir!
I'm trying to figure out the accent. It's almost trans-atlantic media accent from 100 years ago
@@jlspracherHe's British, but apparently went to Harvard, Yale and Brandeis, which probably explains both the quizzical accent and the commitment to dressing like Orville Redenbacher
I cackled
Jesus the chat is horrific in this video. Seeing somebody actually capable of debating and still behaving like it's Alex Jones ranting and raving.
Dude was kinda annoying when he just kept talking and then interrupting. And saying "Yes" after every sentence little D would say.
no seriously.... was pissing me off
right wing ladies who value relationships and good parenting skills, take note - this is the best litmus test you'll ever have for choosing a right-wing partner - the posters who have it in them to like an obviously decent person, vs the ones who react by getting mad, mean spirited, derisive and bullying
@@kevinescobar237 I mean they both interrupted a fuck ton lol/ Plus Destiny does the ADHD thing of "I have to get my point across now or it's fucking gone" and has to SCREAM over him. I know, I do it too lmao.
@@kevinescobar237so? This was a good ass debate
This guys personality was actually a lot of fun, good sport
Bit of goober, a good sport maybe just obnoxious reasoning.
My word! A man of culture, rather kind individual as well.
@lampad4549 for sure a goober
Bro, when I saw his tweets, I was NOT expecting this person when he started speaking LMAO
He’s William F Buckley’s rebellious son
dgg chatters will see a man apologize for being rude and say "HES ALREADY WALKING BACK OMEGALUL"
Unfortunately, accords between countries CANNOT be left vague.
Leaving terms and conditions vague for "future discussions", is the historical recipe for war. If anything is left for "future discussions", it must be left out of the paper, to avoid confusion.
Like, who the hell writes.
"Oh, and also maybe all/some/nobody will be able to return to their homeland, we will talk about it later"
That's literally selling air. It only impedes negotiations, no one will accept that, what the hell
Did not know Napoleon Dynamite became a pimp
Check him out
Robinson has Tucker Carlson physiognomy.
Tucker x Devin Nash x Alex Stein
Pleiadian features
Palestinians do not have "total autonomy." anywhere... Jesus Christ Destiny! You can't be this dense.
Even within Israel "proper" there are different laws for jews and Arabs. Destiny is wrong again
That is true. Arab Israelis are exempt of doing military service. Arabs are entitled to affermative action in civil service jobs and acceptance to university. I guess there is apartheid against the jewish people in their homeland.
Bcoz muslim want Sharia law
There literally isn't. Tell me you've never been to Israel or around Arab Israelis. JFC
@@alisaglem The Nation State Basic Law says that only Jewish people have national rights, so that seems pretty straightforward? The same law also enshrines West Bank settlement as a national value.
@@Ssalamanderrisn’t it that only Jews are allowed to move to the Westbank and own something there?
This guy is wacky I like him already
Michael Malice's alter ego has lept from the comic book nerd's part of his mind into the internet. Which interestingly enough, sounds like a fun 90s comic book series.
Really? His weird voice he starts with drops when he actually debates and his entire persona felt like contrived intellect.
@@AjaxDGonzo yeah and it comes back when he gets zesty sometimes lol it reminds me of the joke voice I do when I'm trying to be fancy
@@AjaxDGonzo The curse of English-Americans 😂
He sounds like some D&D wizard or something
Look at this Tim Burton ass character bruh lmao the Destiny Orbit gettin' wild
It's Wonka bruh, don't disrespect, bruh
This guy is actually a pretty successful journalist.
@@MrPbaydari Because he didn't allow his Oompa Loompas to organize.
This is how everyone is in Louisiana
It’s funny bc I’ve read Robinson’s work in college level history courses. Still haven’t watched a destiny debate in a class tho
Destiny man "YOU JUST SAID THE ONLY WAY IS TO GO BACK TO THE OLD BORDERS" when this dude has reiterated about 50 times that isn't his position fucksake
Destiny was to busy interrupting him to actually understand his position.
Why people keep listening to this guy is beyond me. He doesn’t know sht about the conflict. Only monetization.
1:48:54 These hypotheticals nicely illustrate the different gradations of intent in legal practice: The first scenario, i.e. indiscriminately firing a gun into the room, constitutes "dolus eventualis" (the weakest form of intent, basically one step above gross negligence) while the second one, i.e. the shoot-to-kill scenario, implies "dolus directus" (direct intent to bring about the elements of the crime). So both of them do qualify as criminal intent, yet they indeed are different in a legally meaningful way.
This convo was 100% better than the Norm debate
@@mastereppsreturns6586go away, Norm
@@mastereppsreturns6586you could’ve summarized that yapping in one sentence
@@mastereppsreturns6586 “I was annoyed by how hostile destiny started that debate compared to this one” then quoted him if no one believed you 🙂
@@mastereppsreturns6586You mean that unhinged, old, fake scholar that kept calling Steven a moron, idiot, imbecile, interrupting him every time he tried to talk because he knew he couldn't counter or defend any of his unhinged garbage past or present? That guy?
@@jebalitabb8228ur a weirdo
What a fun way to speak, and I genuinely mean this
literally, i was wondering the whole time is this just some bizarre hyper localized accent or is it a character, and either way i would like more of it
@@brittlebowl4130 strikes me as a guy who likes old talkies/the great gatsby a lot and likes to affect an old style of speech. I don't mind it though, its fun
It ground on nerves. Perhaps its because I watched Gilligan's Island as a child. (Thurston Howell III).
It's a mix of accents, he's essentially americanized brit.
Watched the video in the background and thought he was debating Austin Powers.
It would be so hilarious if Nathan J. Robinson became a Destiny orbiter after this.
He’ll start rotating out with Pakman
He'll be summoned when levee construction or cockroach behavior is in question
This guy rolled in with the Southern Gentleman swag and it seems to be working
He's British
He’s not southern?
Asperger's level, 1 million.
It’s literally the two types of asperger’s kids in one video lmao
First half of the convo I thought he was drunk.
Your comment displays an incredible amount of ablism, just showing how prejudiced you are. Well done. Perhaps go after an intellectual position rather than pathetic ad hominem attacks.
@@quintwolf7185 Agreed, but I'm really curious, what do you think about Finklestein?
@@EdiblePlutonium depends what the question is doesn't it?
Such a breath of fresh air after the finklestein disaster. Good convo D man
Norm abused Mr BORNELLI.. it was sad. Even the Zionist on his side a was laughing at him at one point
Finklestein made destiny and his dgg'rs look like a bunch of degenerate bums out of their element. It was great.
Did you mean the Twinklestein debate?
Yeah destiny embarrassed himself
I don't this. We seen the new side of Finkelstein. @@omarsabir1210
The bottom line is that Israel wants to sustain the asymmetry in the conflict, its demography, millitairy strength, political power & economy by any means.
Unironically one of August's better thumbnails
Easily the most stylish individual for destiny to ever debate
I have to agree with you. People he debates usually have no drip at all haha.
This guy was chill and i like ppl that have a good debate and not diss each other. You can learn new things and get new perseption.
LOL I almost wonder if this title is intentionally the opposite of the usual clickbait as some kind of an experiment.
Title is fairly clickbaity, just a different kind.
The point of clickbait is to make you click it. The fact that it's different means that it's more likely to get your attention. Kinda like how advertisements became about being whacky therefore an ad coming out that wasn't got your attention. If every title is clickbaity, then none of them are.
@@runelt99 sort of like how if every dude you bang has a giant penis, then none of them do
@@runelt99 I'm not sure if I buy that. The titles we're accustomed to are clickbaity precisely because those titles _do_ get people to click on them more. They are just the most extreme possible interpretation of the content of the video with some capitalization thrown in, typically. It could be the case that the clickbait titles are all succeeding, with that success being divided up between a million of them, and that titles like these fail to get any traction. It's not zero sum, as someone can always spend more of their 24hr day watching videos than they currently are if they want to.
@@mackhomie6 I'm not saying that these will take over the titles, just saying that such a subversive title on Destiny's who you would expect to have hostile debates, is very notable to any viewer that knows Destiny.
The apartheid thing is so frustrating, arguing apartheid that isn't about how you treat non-citizens is so wrong. Apartheid SOUTH AFRICA literally did exactly the same thing! The majority of the black population was turned into non-citizens specifically to maintain the apartheid system. For one to find an example of apartheid being de facto maintained through use of citizenship laws, the example is... apartheid! The first one!
1:28:00 nathan j robinson is literally describing 1970s and 80s South Africa here
So are all the Arab states apartheid states? Or are you going to state that if immigration rules shift the ethnic make up of say Saudi Arabia, they would let it happen? What about other ethnic majority states? China (unrealistic I realize)? Japan?
When you start to blur the lines to score cheap points, words start to lose meaning.
china is an apartheid state@@orion00
japan used to be an apartheid state in its treatment of koreans although now it is not@@orion00
the argument that israel is apartheid because of their immigration laws is squashed when you realize that existing arabs in israel can vote, run for office, become supreme court judges and so on... something that you can't do in most arab/muslim states @@orion00
"Symbolic Right of Return" like come on.
Come on what? Why is it ridiculous?
@@MrRazmut Its absolutely disingenuous and doesn't put an end to the conflict .
@@MrRazmut "Just because you're an adult doesn't mean you're grown up. Growing up means being patient, holding your temper, cutting out the self-pity, and quitting with the righteous indignation.'
'Why do so many people seem to love righteous indignation?'
'Because if you can prove you're a victim, all rules are off. You can lash out at people. You don't have to be accountable for anything.”
@@jayspin8093 Why is it disingenuous, and who the hell ever said it would magically end the conflict?
What are you quoting at me in your second response, and how is it relevant?
@@MrRazmut because the language of it does not make it symbolic in any way, shape or form
because the palestinian sentiment is that it is NOT symbolic (because it isn't and wouldn't be)
because it's kind of like someone pointing a gun at you and threatening you, so you wrestle the gun out of their hand and their immediate response is "ok ok you win. But let me just hold the gun, symbolically, I won't use it but let me just hold it" there is a 0% chance that you're handing him back the gun
I kind of want to side with this guy just because I like his whole outfit.
Look up his convo with Christopher Rufo, Robinson won on fashion and conveying his arguments
You should also side with him because he's 100% correct.
Or because he is actually right.
Well he is right it wouldn't be that hard to side with him
Lol what he's right about? Destiny wiped the floor with him 😂
Why do i feel like this was a better conversation than the Twinklestien debate>
Still coping from that one?
bro, there is no worse conversation than that one
that's literally the worst conversation destiny has ever had in his life
@@fran13r I mean it was pretty bad, but come on, this is Destiny we're talking about here. He's had some crazy debates in the past.
It's a low point in the 2024 dgg calendar not because D man did poorly but because the payoff wasn't worth the effort put into it
@@viziontrex Exactly, he WASTED days if not weeks of his streaming time reading a ton of shit for quite literally no reason cause that stupid old man didn't engage at all.
The most interesting part of the comments here is how few of Destiny's audience have even heard of Nathan, who is widely known on the American left. His magazine Current Affairs is probably the second most influential socialist publication, after Jacobin.
Destiny: “people support Palestine because they hate America”
This might be one of the dumbest things I’ve heard destiny say, and that is really saying something. Finkelstein was right, you are painful to listen to.
@_Social.Liberalist thats a lot of inferring. I can tell from your name that youre also insufferable
Why is it dumb? Surely you're not just another hate watcher that has literally nothing to add to anything other than some Ad hominem then never replying again.
Finkelstein: "I read 1000s of books"
Also Finkelswine - cant remember a name he was told 5 minutes ago.
Not defending Finkelstein but I always had trouble remembering names in contrast to content/story, which could lead to some very awkward social situations when a person just told me their names. So, yeah, he could have the knowledge of 1000s of books and sux at names at the same time.
@@50043211I mean he also had trouble with quoting Benny Morris’ books despite going on and on about how much he’s read all of his work.
Long term memory ≠ Short term memory
I for sure thought that too. Oh not so normal norm.
I think he probably only retains important information.
I needed a palet cleanser after the norm garbage. Glad someone could actually engage on the arguments for a change.
This was a good discussion.
Would love to see Destiny and Mark Lamont Hill have another discussion too.
Lol historians r talking rubbish let me listen to a gamer 👏🏾
@Haytch-hw2hu discrediting a figure rather and making personal attacks than engaging with the argument or evidence. Yeah, classic norm fan.
@@Haytch-hw2hu Stinkerstein is not a historian.
27:06
Get this mouth breather away from this topic!!
It only got better when he realized he didn't like Netanyahu
this was awesome, man! i had been hoping someone would have Scott on for a long format conversation.
If this is an incredibly good debate inspite of the unearned smugness and the oblivouseness to the obvious double standard, just shows how low the bar is for this subject.
The pro palisinian side saying 'it's Israel's fault for not coming to an agreement because the USA has elections every 4 years' is a new one for me.
Settlements
Current Affairs is actually a damn good magazine. Robinson’s piece on Jordan Peterson-“The Intellectual We Deserve”- should be required reading.
Maybe Destiny should go now and visit Gaza and then come back abd tell us how wonderful it is. Bet he'd find it horrifying.
Self inflicted. As I wrote to another commenter. There has not been one Jew in Gaza in nearly 2 decades. It was left to self determination. Israel even supplied power, water etc.... The Arabs could have taken the hundreds of millions of dollars that come in from around the globe and made their lives better with infrastructure, economic development, land development and so on. They chose a different path. Thousands of rockets fired at civilians at a pretty much regular pace, development of terror tunnels and terrorists and the election of a deviant militant group. So the wall goes up. Again, security. How could Isreal not build that wall. The rockets continue and Isreal gets charged with creating an open air prison and your erroneous term, apartheid. What a joke. "There will be peace when the Arabs love their children more than they hate us" - G. Meir. Truer words have never been spoken.
@@CotesDuQ "It was left to self determination" There's no self determination if their imports/exports are managed by another state, they cannot have a standing military, cannot form alliances/trade partners without Israel approval, do not control their own borders or airspace and don't even have their own airport. Everything following this incorrect point becomes nonsense if you recognize the reality of life in Gaza inflicted by Israel. Israel specifically blockades the tools they would need to do any of those things ffs. You mention the rockets from Hamas but Israel still kills more Palestinians yearly. The rockets kill next to nobody and Israel terrorizes the West Bank too where Hamas isn't even present. Your bias is insane.
@@Vizardog Yes, I am biased......mostly because I do not now, nor have I ever believed that the Arabs want peace with Israel. River to sea and all. When Hamas states in its very charter that its goal is to destroy Isreal, I believe them. And they have shown that they mean it. You can make all the excuses you want but until they get rational, reasonable leadership their misery will continue.
And by the way, stating that the rockets don't really do much damage is beneath the otherwise reasonable points you are making.
@@CotesDuQ What an idiotic comment. Gaza is completely controlled by Israel. The shoreline is controlled by Israel, all borders. Every resource that enters Gaza is completely controlled by Israel, even on the Egyptian border. Egypt must get an ok from Israel to bring in any resources. No one in Gaza can leave unless with certain permissions from the Israeli government. It is literally a prison.
The Israeli policy for food resources going in is to keep Palestinians to just above a starvation diet. 50 percent of Palestinians live under severe food instability, and that's prior to the current raid on Gaza. It is worse now and could possibly become a famine. 90 percent of the water is undrinkable and there are many diseases effecting Palestinians because of it. That's just part of it.
If any of this is ok with you, you are a lunatic. You are then an apologist for State Terrorism, the highest crime in the world court.
Hi, can someone drop the name of the software Destiny is using to organize his research and stuff ? Thanks.
I think i’ve seen him using obsidian for note taking
@@lachiemaxwell yes it's Obsidian
Actually one of the best (if not the best) Destiny convos I've ever seen in terms of genuinely listening to each other and responding in good faith. Also a Palestine supporter that's not blind to reality is so awesome to see.
He seemed pretty blind to me. Destiny had to push him on so many things, and the guy had almost no facts to back up anything he was saying. It was all emotion and hyperbole.
What are you talking about? He talked over Destiny nonstop every time Destiny tried to clarify a position, ignored any request to stop talking, dodged questions, cut destiny off 4 words in constantly. I think you're seduced by the accent, this is the same schlock as every other conversation.
I don't think any pro-Israel supporter is aware of reality, though. To Israel, everybody is Hamas, including the UN, SA, ICJ, ICC, journalists, researchers, medical staff, and so on. That's the extreme of distortion, and I fail to see common sense in this.
@@gallavanting2041 firstly, both sides talked over each other constantly; in a few of the cases, I can just chalk it up to internet lag, but I would say that there were more instances where this guy stopped talking to let Destiny speak than there were of Destiny letting the other guy speak. Also, @AjaxDGonzo , most of the time both of them had pretty good understandings of the facts, the difference was either the interpretation of the information or their own views of practicality with regards to said information. For instance, I think this guys view on Isreal and Palestine coming to agreements made more sense than what Destiny was saying, but Destiny disagreed on the likelihood.
@@gumballwatterson3231the guy was describing what’s happening with no evidence to why Israel is the one to blame. That’s Destinys main point is that there is no accountability or responsibility for the other side. I agree they both have consistency, but this other guy lacks all the compelling and especially the clarity needed for whatever he was arguing. It seemed to represent this vague argument that no one ever really pinpoints. Aside from, “from the river to the sea” sort of statements.
I love watching Destiny get owned over and over
Take just one thing like water away from Americans for a few days and see how horrific they find it. The disconnect is ridiculous.
Pin
Where is this dudes accent coming from, I’m pretty sure he said he’s American, but has a strange British affect.
I mean Christopher Hitchens became an American citizen before he died. Nathan Robinson was born in England and then became American.
New Orleans 1870
Asians and black folks who are North American have their own accents… same shit with the Brit’s brotha… believe it or not 🫢 😂
But it is wayyyy more acceptable to be racist to us Asians rather than white Europeans with their accents. Pls don’t lie 🫢😂
I was born here and faced every piece of racism the world has to offer ahaha 😢
Might have moved or could be put on a bit I've noticed a lot of autistic yanks like to put on some kind of southern English accent guess they think it makes them sound more intelligent if only they knew the truth lol.
Convo exceeded expectations.
where do you find these people? I wish you can have a chat with either Eugene Kontorovich or Dr. Einat Wilf
Kontorovich talking about incorporation of Balfour into San Remo, San Remo into UN charter, and therefore into international law regardless of partition resolution, would be really interesting for Destiny, I imagine.
I didn't know there was anyone left with a transatlantic accent
There isn't, that's why it drops when he actually starts thinking and isn't just playing a character.
@@ehs7208 Lol he was born in England so still has a partial English accent. Just so you know, you can google things when you don't know something
I’ve watched over 100 hours of content on this subject and this is by far the best conversation I’ve heard. The fact they have no direct skin in the game makes it better.
The only issue I have is as both secular intellectuals they don’t understand the religious aspect and are speaking purely from western ratjonal and logic which can only go so far.
Nathan is really good at this. His patience is astounding.
My favorite part of this video ist the chat comment at 18:32
"he's like if Tucker Carlson was cute" - quality meme community Mr Barilla!
is it really 2.5 civilians for every hamas opperative? cause if that is true, in an area as densely populated than tokyo, that is astounding.
Yup. It's indeed true. You can search it easily
we dont know, neither side has credible numbers
idf currently says they think they have killed 10-12k militants
hamas says that around 30k palestinians were killed, without distinguishing militants from civillians, there is also a 6k militant deaths number but that comes from a hamas official that's in fucking qatar
neither side provided any real proof, for obvious reasons
92% of the martyrs are non-combatant civilian persons
That is under the assumption that every male killed is Hamas, which is unlikely
It's a lie hhhhhhh so all Gaza is 2 millions it means more than 500 k fighter is just some racist claims
Destiny defending ‘Israel retaining its Jewish character’ and prioritising Jewish immigration over non Jewish immigration as well as flippantly stating that ‘Palestinians Muslims can convert to Judaism to immigrate to Israel’
Proves he supports ethno-nationalism when it comes to Israel.
He supports preferential treatment of Jewish people over non Jewish people in the state of Israel.
However if a Republican were to advocate for “the United States retaining its Christian character” or “the United States retaining its white character” he’d call them a racist and a bigot.
He’s so disingenuous and disgusting.
DGG- "this was such a good faith debate"
ME- 🤔
The bar for a good faith debate is pretty low nowadays
I know right! I'm a fan of Destiny, and it's obvious to me he was acting WILD this debate. He was hyper aggressive, he wasn't listening to his debate opponent, and he was overtalking very often.
One of his worst debates ever, in my opinion.
I’m really new this your channel so could anybody give me an answer on Destinys stance on this war?
The most painful part of this was accidentally reading the stream chat occasionally.
Waiting for the mr borrelli meme to die
damn i was just watching your king video and the next thing i see you here 👀
But it’s funnnyyyyyyyy
I know it's gonna get old soon but right now i can't get enough of it 😂
It will probably go on for years and years, just like destiny is a girls name joke.
No
I love how destiny thinks talking over someone is the same as winning.
Destiny only started talking over the guest when it became clear that the guest kept interrupting him. I dare you go to back and compare how long Destiny lets the guest speak uninterrupted vs vice-versa. If destiny hadn't started talking over him, he would never have been able to talk for more than 20 seconds.
@siIverspawn For example, at around 44:33 in the discussion. The guest was accusing Destiny of not only going by the facts. But that Destiny was unfairly accusing the Palestinians aggression, and giving Isreal aggression as a pass. Destiny response was well, Isreal has a history of peace, and Palestinians dose nothing but launch rockets. Knowing full well if the logic is applied in the reverse direction, he could call him an antisemitic.
Therefore: the logic for winning the debate is to announce loudly why the Palestinians deserved their suffrage during the last 70 years by the hands of their occupier. But if you were to extend the timeline to 1939 (Europe) or to 1860(Russia)... and about every previous century in different sections of Europe to about 1000A.D. Then, say maybe there is a pattern here. This would be taboo and antisemitic. Therefore, a free get outta jail card whenever the argument is turning against him
@@brianroth9175 none of this has anything to do with what I said
The other dude talked over Destiny way more, he'd ramble for 5 minutes, Destiny would try to respond, only to get immediately cut off and talked over.
@Rat-King27 re watching it was more even than my first impression.
The most outlandish arguments in support of an ethnostate - Destiny edition.
This conversation was so illuminating. I really like Destiny. But I have been so frustrated with how he has been covering this conflict. He's largely accurate on the historical matters (not 100%) but the way he's been discussing this conflict has been laughably unproductive. So Destiny has been hyper-fixating on assigning blame to the Palestinians because there's no shortage of condemnation for Israel? Does he not see the problem there? I'm glad Nathan was able to get some clarification on some key matters and hopefully Destiny is able to move forward and have a more productive conversation that helps to solve the problem instead of create new ones.
He is very far from being historically accurate and I feel he will change his mind when it is more financially profitable and drives more attention to his channel. For now, the pro Israel side has been more financially attractive.
Props to Nathan to sit and have the patience to debate this worm
2:04:05 one of the farmers who was killed on october 7th, was interviewed a few months before, regarding the work next to Gaza.
Among his herd were many calfs raised specifically for Gaza, for Kebabs.
There was no dog food mentality.
If I had to wager, prior to october 7th it wasn’t about not letting excess aid in, but about making sure enough aid is entering.
Israel had a policy of “putting Gaza on a diet.” They deliberately kept the amount of calories coming into Gaza at a subsistence level. Any amount of “normalized obesity” present can be explained by Hamas’ success at smuggling in contraband items from Egypt. You can hear tale after tale from Palestinian children in Gaza of their dreams of one day tasting ice cream. Israel’s siege and effective occupation of Gaza was cruel and unusual enough to provoke the October 7th massacre. A truly non-biased mind can perceive this quite easily.
Israel has literally monitored the amount of calories that entered Gaza, they called it "putting Palestinians on a diet." They were open about this, it's not a secret.
This guy engaged in a fair bit of moral grandstanding, but other than that he was a pretty excellent interlocutor. Clearly smart and actually compassionate unlike a good majority of the larpers/grifters that screech about this topic from both sides.
Is there a link to all those notes?
im at the beginning and this man is so nervous its actually freaking me out
About halfway through Steven claims Nathan’s argument is doomer, whereas Nathan, while conceding the serious difficulties and obstacles involved in brokering a peace negotiation, retorts that actually, it is Steven who is being fatalistic. The truth is all policy paradigms shift over time-reforms inexorably take place-and in turn attitudes of people groups downstream from new governance arrangements change, too, sometimes gradually and others drastically. I share Nathan’s pragmatic optimism and believe that, in this instance, Steven was clearly projecting. We should be careful not to underestimate the extent to which reforms like enfranchisement, civil rights, and basic codified equality go toward transforming us/them enmity. Normalization is possible, to assume otherwise is fatalistic. Now, Steven went on to make valid points about disparate perceptions of responsibility and culpability, which, to be fair, do present further obstacles to a just settlement. That said, these points do not detract from Nathan’s pragmatic argument, which is that the US ought to make greater use of the levers at its disposal to broker negotiation.
That library destiny is using with all dates and docs about the issue...
Any way to access it?
You should make some Mr. Borelli merch
Why is Nathan Robinsons name not in the title? Why the lame framing?
destiny seems to care about basic forms of civility and decency in debates only if it suits him...
Don’t think Destiny writes the titles
@@coenhealy-johnson5194 so an agency does?
@@sensationsuperthrust think his editor does the titles, thumbnails etc
@@coenhealy-johnson5194 interesting
Compelling moral arguments for both side.
This guy gets it
I can’t tell if you’re joking. Just curious, what is the compelling moral argument for Islamic Jihad?
I really enjoyed this conversation
One cool thing about Destiny’s stream is that it instructs on how radicalizing and hyperbolic Twitter is. Nathan is like the fourth person that I’ve seen tweeting awful things for years who then comes on stream and is an actual normal human person. Funny enough, Destiny himself was one of those
naive to suggest that isreal somehow would have stopped at the 1948 partition, if the arabs accepted it. when have legal borders stopped them before ?
Their greater country project involves parts of other countries as well
Really? Why is it naive? Did Israel expand into Egypt and Jordan after the peace treaties? You have 0 facts
Every time it their acquisition of land wasn't due to a war initiated by the other party. Seems if you want Israel to remain within their borders, other countries should probably stop attacking them. Of course, supporting such attacks does the opposite. How is this hard?
@@thisisone9529 What about illegal settlements in the West Bank? Those have been built continuously, not just after wars. Also what do you think of Netanyahu showing off his map of "Greater Israel?"
@@Ssalamanderr "illegal" is an interesting term, here, considering these aren't "laws" that have been broken, they're claims by parties with no power, since Israel hasn't signed over its sovereignty to the ICC. You might notice that these organizations seem to care so much about what Israel does, but not so much about what anyone else does, considering there are resolutions condemning Israel for doing the same thing that other countries do, even when Israel goes above and beyond what those other countries do to protect civilian life. Why do you think this double standard exists? In reality, Israel has made agreements and stayed within the bounds of them until it is shown that the other party has violated them. Why do you hold Israel to terms but not the other parties?
How are quotes from the founders of zionism “random”? They said what they were going to do and exactly what they said happened.
Are you implying they are prophets? The land was taken through war, after ISRAEL was attacked. The only way your logic works is if you go down the rabbit hole of conspiracy theories thinking that the decades that led up to this were all carefully orchestrated plans to gain the land. That’s so ridiculous and you lack any evidence, aside from people saying stuff, which NEWS FLASH, is not definitive proof.
Y’all cling to quotes bc you can’t point to policy.
@@joellecohen679 Cling to quotes of....
Checks notes*....the creators of Zionism who's policies guided the establishment of the state
@@joellecohen679 THEY CREATED THE STATE???? It baffles me that you act like the opinions of the founders of zionism and PMs of israel arent relevant!
@@joellecohen679 Israel has literally enshrined their illegal settlement policy in their Basic Law (similar to a constitution) and consider settlement (ie displacing Palestinians and taking their land) as a national value.
My guy August... You squash a grape, you quash a feud
Love the pinstripe suit and the pink tie
Genocide debate is what happens when people can change meaning of terms.
Ppl still think it’s a genocide lmao restarts
Welcome to far left wing politics
Welcome to human languages, where the meaning of words changes over time.
@@Sendobren that's dishonest. This is an intentional misrepresentation of the word in an attempt to be emotionally manipulative.
But fine, let's say the word is gradually changing meaning over time. That's all well and good but we then CANNOT keep the ramifications of fitting that word the same as they were when the word was coined, because if genocide means "killing a lot of people during time of war" then every nation that has ever been in a war is, in fact, genocidal. If "murderer" changes to mean "someone who punches somebody in the face" then we can't still treat the new "murderers" like we treat the old murderers, that's asinine.
@@reddillon8425 I don't know where I am being dishonest. I agree with everything you said.
I just think that complaining about words changing their meaning over time is a waste of time.
If you have a legal definition, apply it in the legal context, it's fine
But in common parlance words are going to change, nothing you can do about it.
Here before the hate watchers
This debate has a tinge of the dynamic between Christopher Hitchens and Robert Emmett Tyrrell Jr. in William Buckleys show.
It’s actually quite sad to see how unhinged Steve has become.
It really is, I'm shocked he actually has fans still. I used to like his stuff but it didn't take me long to realize he is literally just in it to debate for optics, he does not care about any of the topics he talks about. He was pro-palestine/anti-ethnically cleansing like 4 years ago, he knows he's wrong on this topic and yet he argued these points because he knows in the political sphere he can be inflammatory about it and will get lots of coverage for it
Let's go to Coney Island, old sport
Why did your mods block me from addressing any points?
I'm assuming time marks don't work. Around the 1hr mark, this guy is suggesting to backstab Israel via USA using it's means to make deals with Arab-palestinians. Sure, Israel would just add America to it's list of enemies and turn to the mindset of 1947-8. Everyone keeps thinking that if Israel put the breaks on it's might, then everything will be koombaya. Israel's neighbours are like sharks, if they smell blood (weakness), they will come to munch off it's flesh. This does not mean Israel only wields with might, but it MUST be there as a way to keep the sharks at bay...
Agree with Destiny: terms like "apartheid" "open-air prison" "genocide" become distractions. The argument becomes about the validity of using those words and their definitions, which can be argued endlessly, rather than clearly describing what is happening in an even-handed way.
But isn’t that what destiny is arguing against in the first place?
As far as I can tell the political and media class does everything it can to avoid acknowledging those descriptions, as even acknowledging them would associate Israel with apartheid, genocide, and open-air prison conditions for Palestinians. The only people I see centering arguments around those terms are people like Destiny or groups like the ADL or Canary Mission that smear people as anti-Semites for accurately describing the conditions Israel imposes on Palestinians. You don’t hear Fox News or CNN debating whether Israel is an apartheid state, they just ignore the charge altogether
The words usage is valid. It’s a distraction for people who deny their validity.
There’s literally no international debate about this. No disagreement between the human rights organizations. There’s no controversy anywhere except in the depraved expansionist apartheid dreams of genocidal Zionists who believe putting Palestinians in concentration camps is good, or at least okay.
Said Zionists and their allies are merely more repulsed by the label they inherit by their beliefs and policies than the repulsive beliefs and policies themselves. Hence, the inner conflict projected outward on the rest of human decency and the inherent resentment which springs forth from that burden 🤷🏻
Btw Nathan Robinson sort of made Briahna Joy Grey a somebody in the political commentary sphere before she became Bernie's communications manager, eince she was a writer for his magazine.
He also got mega-cancelled for trying to prevent his employees from turning his business into a co-op.
I was hoping this would come up in the conversation, but I can't stand the sound of his voice.
Who gives a shit
It's just absolutely an unfair characterization by Destiny to act like because Israel stole land and applies laws evenly to all those in the stolen land in west bank that it can not be aparthied. Israel is wrongfully occupying land it doesn't own in west bank and applying different rules/laws to those under stolen land compared to the rest of the west bank. I don't know nor understand how UN and others can classify palestine as being totally occupied by Israel, I don't agree that is correct usage of an occupation, but under that structure it would indeed be apartheid.
Wait so if a country strips citizenship of a group of people and then enacts some things for what would be apartheid then "technichally" per Destiny it wouldn't be aparthied as it's restricted to citizenship. That is nonsense and just means it wouldn't techinchally count.
He's not saying that what Israel does is fine, just that it's not Apartheid, because the occupied territories aren't part of Israel.
@@fl4g Robinson already dismantled this argument by asking which country the West Bank is part of. It's not an immigration issue because everyone in the area is administered by the same government, but have different rights. That's apartheid.
@@fl4g So what country are they a part of? Try googling the word "Bantustan" sometime.
@@Ssalamanderr occupied Palestine? It's really not that complicated.
@@fl4g have you googled Bantustan yet?
If it's a country, then why do people keep talking about a 2 state solution? According to you it's already a state?
I always get the feeling watching this content that the whole conversation could have been hashed out in like ten minutes.
Thanks D Man Im glad your working your way into a more mainstream audience. I think your line of thinking is a breathe of fresh air and checks the reactionary takes of most people.
The Palestinians in the West Bank do not want Israeli citizenship and would not accept it if it were offered.
Want their own state yes??
43:51 what evidence is there that the Palestinians have a strategy to wait until presidents leave
Is that what Austin Powers looks like today?
'Everybody knows... You' ve been faithful, give or take a night or two... '
It's painfully obvious that Destiny doesn't really care about any of this, on a human level.
Sure, he likes to reasearch, make arguments, win arguments , prove how clever he is...but he said it himself in this conversation, at the end of the day, he doesn't actually care that much.
He is incredibly cold and dismissive about the suffering of this "war" , it's all just a mind-game he enjoys playing, that ultimately serves his ego.
90% of people outside of the region don't actually give a shit on either side
And Hamas doesn’t care about their citizens when they use all their resources to prolong the fight instead of protecting their people
i would say you are the same, he just does not feel the need to hide that
@@leoyoman what exactly are you basing that on? You're assuming my feelings. Funny, the only evidence you have for that, is me commenting about the issue..which would point to the opposite of you're claim.
@@ehs7208 just because you don't care, doesn't mean other people don't. Surprisingly many people see dead and maimed children daily and actually do care