But the part you are missing is that Rey’s father was a clone of Uncle Palps. But what Ryan is saying The Senate has been cloning Plagueis this entire time. So which happened first: Plagueis being cloned, or Palpatine?
My main emotion about this is sadness, how hard Filoni and Favreau have to work to fix the ton of bullsh*t created by idiots making the sequel trilogy, especially episode 9.
I think your correct with his goal, but not there yet cuz if you look at the last episode all the troopers were different heights and builds and therefore not clones
I can't tell you how grateful I am for Screen Crush and Ryan's breakdowns, the Star Wars saga is an excessively big, complicated Universe and there are so many threads to keep track of, without your breakdowns I would be utterly lost. So please don't stop. Thank you for the superb research on all the characters and all the back stories.
This is the first video of his that I’ve seen & he does an excellent job at breaking each concept in detail, providing an intellectual perspective, & doing it in a structured manner.
Very impressive Ryan. Lucasfilm need to hire you immediately as you have such a canny knack of making all their creative failings sound vaguely coherent.
@@kylewolfe_ yeah, the theory starts pretty plausible but when Doug lists a bunch of reasons it can't work and Ryan comes up with rebuffs it's like... The dog looks smarter than the man right now. I don't think Lucas Film think about Plaguis half as much as Ryan does. I think it's more fan fiction wish list than theory.
I'll admit it's a pretty thin theory, but it plays out well IF you agree to a few retcons. As for Ryan being a genius...he explains it well but it's been on reddit for years.
Worse; Palpatine was brought back because the original Skywalker storyline was killed JJ Abrams wanted to do. Kennedy probably had influenced the rewrite.
Palpatine coming back and Rey being his grandchild was thrown together at the last second because of how AWFUL 8 was. Everything that comes after is their attempt to "cannon-ize" 9. All they had to do was make movies out of the EU books.
@@blakedavis4209 not good story telling. LOTR is a great movie trilogy. With never reading the books you can follow the story and like the characters with no background.
I believe Gideon is 100% going to be the one to create Snoke in an attempt to grab power and counter Luke or any other force users. Palpatine is going to sense this emergence, take control and influence over Snoke, and possibly instruct him in the ways of the dark side. In the end Gideon’s own creation is going to be his ultimate downfall.
Hmm... If they go this route, I'd like Thrawn to appear in the Ahsoka series, but get stuck in time released at a known set date or similar. This way anything post episode 9 can be about Thrawn returning, with Palatine truly dead... You could do an actual Heir to the Empire (of course no Luke would make me salty I guess)
I’m starting to get frustrated. I think we need some damn answers and I mean soon. The problem is, nobody knows. I mean I don’t think even Dave Filoni or John Favreau know. Hell, did George Lucas even know? Shit.
I wish Mando wasn't explaining any of this, but instead a new thread that would eventually unveil a whole brand new original and fun trilogy where everything made sense and the characters were well developed... Such as Thrawn, Ahsoka, Sabine, Ezra, Din, Grogu, Hera... And that in the end, the sequels would be just considered Legends. Is that really too much to ask?
If only there were someone at Disney who cared enough about connection and continuity for this to be so. But, nothing they have done since buying the franchise has shown me that such a person exists. Great video!
Science fiction requires us to suspend belief from time to time when telling an entertaining story. But I just cant get past a guy being thrown off the top of a 500 foot tall shaft inside a space station that gets blown up 10 minutes later into the vacuum of space. How did they capture his conscience to pair with his clone in Exegul?
"You probably should have led with that"... Both PRICELESS and an incredibly cool idea that a remnant of Plagueis resided within Anakin through the process of his creation. SUBSCRIBED!
I know right. Like it really does make sense for his character. Had to kill his master before he was able to transfer his essence for immortality, and then had to figure out to become immortal himself through powerful clone bodies. It really does fit
@@azuresky2200 not to mention how that played into his paranoia that Vader would betray him one day and he’d need a back up plan in that case. He always sensed the conflict in Vader and had to constantly remind him of making sure he knew where his priorities lied. His arrogance that his plan would play out perfectly, as well as letting his clone (Rey’s dad) go, was his downfall
Since episode nine, I keep thinking to myself "This was all told much more interestingly in Dark Horse's Dark Empire Trilogy." Which is now almost 30 years old. I don't understand why Disney didn't use this story as a template.
So there's a great theory that the Rule of 2 was created so Bane could essence transfer into his apprentice, take another apprentice, and eventually do the same thing over and over again. But it didn't end up working the way he expected. He wanted to take control of his apprentices body and essentially kill their spirit or soul. This isn't what happened, Bane joined with his apprentice, passing his knowledge and influence and desires, but not extinguishing the individual he was taking over. Instead, they merged into 1. A real Tuvix type situation - spiritually. As the rule of 2 continued, all Sith were compiled into 1 body, living forever and merging with their next apprentice when the time came. So when Palpatine says in Rise of Skywalker, "I am ALL Sith" he literally means it. He holds all the knowledge and experiences of the former Sith who were in the succession of their master by killing the master and taking on his/her essence. This being the case, Palpatine IS in many ways Plageous now since he killed him. His plan was to allow Anakin to kill him when Anakin got tired of being #2 when he was indeed so powerful as the chosen one. But when he was defeated by Obi-Wan and shredded up he was no longer a viable candidate for succession. Forcing Palpatine to wait for Luke to grow up and be the next candidate. But he didn't know Luke existed, and while he may have sensed an opportunity to continue the Sith line (which is also why he really wanted the lists of force sensitive children, a clone wars show arc and the Fallen Order plot) he wasn't sure he would find a suitable force weirder who would be powerful enough to want to take over. Anakin has the highest M count ever recorded. He was the perfect candidate for the Sith to continue growing their power. Anakin in full healthy form would have been the most powerful Sith who ever existed. But Palpatine didn't know about Luke, and thus wanted to have a viable body to transfer to in case of his death, which he foresaw the possibility of, but it wasn't clear enough to know who kills him, or when. However, he was already working on combining clones with force abilities. The Dark Forces/Jedi Knight video game series has been absorbed by the current Canon, just taking out Kyle Katarn. Rogue 1 was basically the Dark Forces opening mission plot. Steal the plans for the death star. Then the Dark Trooper Program is revealed by Gideon, and it's phase 2 comparible to the dark troopers from Dark Forces, only without any biological component (I think phase 2 was a cybernetic hybrid). Now phase 3, cloned, force sensitive troopers. While I doubt Gideon was able to imbibe himself with medichlorians to use the force, he mentions the jedi Contribution, which would be Grogu and his M count, they extracted midichlorians from grogu and inserted them into their clones, making force sensitive clone soldiers. Which is what happens in Jedi Knight II: Jedi Outcast. Kyle Katarn has to defeat an army of cloned dark jedi. Filoni and Favreau have been referencing all the video games through their new material. The Outrider from Shadows of the Empire is referenced in Rebels when Iron Squadron is flying a YT-2400 The first episode of Mandalorian season 2 was a straight rip of a mission in Kotor 1. The Dark Trooper Program from Dark Forces and the death star plans being stolen from the beginning of that game. Andor and Jyn are Kyle and Jan Ors with mixed up details and no force powers like the first Dark Forces game. So I'm betting Palpatine had a whole mess of "unnatural" projects going on and when Anakin was defeated started project Necromancer as a worst case scenario.
But the part you are missing is that Rey’s father was a clone of Uncle Palps. But what Ryan is saying The Senate has been cloning Plagueis this entire time. So which happened first: Plagueis being cloned, or Palpatine?
They say Peli is the old woman Rey tells, she's a Skywalker. Possibly leading her to her long lost mother. Imagine Palps and Peli. Lmgdfao I mean she dated a Jawa.
Maybe maybe it was just natural thing to hapend and Palpatine just used it to his own adwantage… … people see nighmares and person who has strong connection to the force sees things that really hapen or could happen.
Hey Ryan, long time viewer, first time commenter. I think you're missing a giant piece of the Sith puzzle revealed in Episode IX: Palpatine is Darth Plagueis. The rule of two is based on essence transfer, and the Sith lords have been body-hopping for millennia. Darth Sidious was bated into striking down his master in anger, allowing Darth Plagueis to take over his apprentice's body. That how I always read the opera scene, and that's what Palpatine meant by "I am all the Sith." The Sith are an ancient malevolent consciousness, Shiev Palpatine was just the host at the time of the trilogies and Anakin/Luke/Kylo/Rey were next in line.
When he determined that Rey was had a great amount of hate, he actually stated it to her. I like this theory. It explains why the emperor kept trying to get the ones he believed with the most hatred to kill him. And, it also explains, imo, how he gave up on possessing Anakin, due to the vast amounts of bodily damage.
I love Star Wars but hate the first order and emperor returning narrative and wish Disney would stop using the shows to fix the terrible writing of the sequels.
Maybe Gideon is trying make *himself* force sensitive. The clones are just test bodies to make sure the transfer of midechlorians works. They’re ultimately disposable. I’d like that better. It makes Gideon ambitious on his own behalf instead of someone else’s.
Pershing specialized in cloning body parts not whole bodies. Could be something like a Grogu full of Midichlorians baby kidney transplant or something.
They just bludgeoning the Star Wars movies. Let Palpatine die, please. It ridiculous. They messed up the storyline on The last Jedi and the Rise of Skywalker. Now they're trying to throw that crap into the new movies.
An idea I’ve had for Snoke’s scar is that he was cloned, then was injured (Leia, Luke and Han know of Snoke in the sequels), then Palpatine realizes that his precious body to stay anonymous is fragile, so then he starts cloning that clone
Every time the Prequels are brought up I just can't get over how dumb the Jedi were to just straight up leave Hayden's mom on Tattooiine. Once they knew he's was strong in the Schwartz the fact they did't turn right around with a million space bucks (TM) and buy her freedom is still one of the dumbest things Lucas ever wrote. Jedi are WMDs trained to murder thousands and they don't do jack to protect the psyche of their people.
He purposely forgets obvious things in his videos so we in the chat can point out he forgot something obvious and get the comments rolling in. It’s pretty smart and he’s been doing it for a while now. That and “mistakenly” saying something false when he meant to say “x” and we all comment the correct thing. In the next video he’ll say “ thank you to everyone who corrected me in the comments that I said the wrong…”
Does any of this change the fact that Han, Leia and Luke become curmudgeonly old useless has-beens that all died stupidly, or that Mon Mothma's glorious rebellion turned into a feckless heap that the Galaxy was well rid of? No? well then...pass.
It's complete bullshit that Filoni and Favreau have to explain anything created by hack writers and directors. Yes, technically the directors may be fine, but the sequel trilogy is 100% what not to do when telling a theatrical story. The Mandolorian should focus on stories not yet written instead of trying to justify the sequels.
It’s crazy how you just made an 18 minute UA-cam video that included more thought on the most important part of the sequels than what we saw in the sequels themselves
The pathetic attempts to retcon the sequel trilogy are dumb. Just fire Kathleen Kennedy and put Filoni and Faveru in charge. They seem to understand what they are doing and actually like Star Wars. If I was in charge of the most anticipated trilogy in history and I didn't think to actually plan out the whole story before filming I would fully expect to be fired.
I think the idea is that Palpatine creates snoke to act like a Dooku type leader for the first order using his own cells. The Snokes on Exegol are on stand by, they were created as force sensitive leaders to be placed in different regions throughout the galaxy. In Ep3, Palpatine said that his master could save others but not himself. Therefore, he never learned the ability to cheat death. Plagues needed that clone element which only hia apprentice Palpatine was able to procure through the cloners on Kamino.
I would just say that rather than complicated and convoluted, this particular story is just incomplete. Palpatine's takeover of the Republic with the clone troopers and Syfo-Dias, and all that was confusing as hell until Season 6 of The Clone Wars. (And even still....) Also, don't forget they could introduce the character from legends who would tie this all together: Your Mom.
The idea that Palpatine would have no backup plan and would just allow himself to be completely destroyed in the same exact way the 1st Death Star exploded... is highly unlikely. Palpatine had amazing foresight. He used to go from being a senator of Naboo to being the Empeor of the entire galaxy. Amazing planning, just to suddenly end when he had ultimate control in the Imperial era? Ha, no, that would be completely out of character.. Great Video Screen Crush 😎💯
Uhhhh, Plagueis was a Muun, aka the species who ran the banking clan. Maybe Snoke was made in an attempt at combining different beings' genes, thus making him what they call a strandcast. Rey's father was a strandcast made using Palpatine's genes. He was considering a failure since he didn't have the potential strength in the force they wanted but kept him around as his "son."
@@cameronbaker97 there's more info that backs my head canon. For example, the reason the clones we've seen in The Mandalorian are disfigured is because of a few factors. One is the level of force sensitivity they achieve in the process somehow caused the disfigurement as if the force itself was rejecting the idea (the scientists in the TROS, episode 9, book mention this thought). Another reason, or something the scientists noticed, for the disfigurement was that it occurred more frequently in clones that had the most diverse sourced DNA (aka from near or non-human alien species). They hadn't even figured it out by the events of episode 9, or else Palps wouldn't have needed Rey for her body. Phrasing, lol
In the novelization of Last Jedi and The Force Awakens, it explains that since Rey and Kylo are connected in the Force when Rey touches him or vice versa they can transfer training. Rey also absorbed Luke and Anakin's training via the lightsaber just by touching it and absorbed Kylo's training by touching his hand in TLJ.
We all assumed Gideon's clone experiments were the precursor to "somehow Palpatine returned" but after the Shadow Council it sounds like Gideon was on his own mission for clone troopers and it's actually Hux with project necromancer that will create Snoke and recreate Palpatine.
That's how I feel about the prequel trilogy... I was in high school, when episode 1 and 2 came out and My friends and I were very underwhelmed by those movies. This is years before social, so you had to go to those Star wars chat rooms to complain about it... But they had to make seven seasons, to try and make the prequels seem a little better. My only problem is by the time the clone wars series came out, I was just hanging on to the OG trilogy and wanted nothing to do with anything prequel related. till about a couple years ago. I finally watched that series.
Ryan I feel like you have been waiting for this video ever since "some how palpatine returned" happened. This is low-key the highest point of this channel in that three year span. You're finally explaining to us how "somehow palpatine returned"
Star Trek Picard Season 3 has been better. Walking up and down and talking with masks on. Plus Grogru’s in the robot saying ‘yes’ all the time is the comic relief no one needed. The bottle episode was the only episode that was actually any good.
I always thought (before ep. 8) that Snoke was Ezra Bridger. The set-up was there. A young, conflicted Padawan who lost his master disappears into the unknown regions with a tactical mastermind. He would have either been imprisoned by Thrawn until he complied with his leadership or took up an alliance with Thrawn in order to survive some new threat.
Ugh! Could we drop the sequel trilogy?! I thought it was going to be retconned anyway. Stop trying to make the Sequel Trilogy from happening - its the Fetch of Star Wars. Send JJ and KK back to film school!
Honestly, I was never a fan of the theory of Snoke being Darth Plagueis, to begin with. I didn't want the Sith to return and I was hoping for a brand-new type of villain. Not to mention bringing Plagueis back in my opinion would've ruined Palpatine's triumph over him. I would also like to point out that in the Legends novel (which is a great book) they weren't necessarily trying to create Anakin, the Force struck back at them when they tried to create life. And if this were Legends, Palpatine did eventually become more powerful than his master by the time of the Dark Empire comics. Also, Palpatine in Episode 9 said he "made Snoke" so it wouldn't make sense if that were Plageuis. But these are just my opinions.
the idea of "soul transfering" is something brought up all the way back in the KOTOR book "Revan" and expanded on in the SWTOR game in the base game and the fourth (?) expansion. the problem with how Disney has been going about this is: -they jumped the gun on the plot -they had no direction going into the new movies -poor writing with the new movies (literally you can cut out the 57 minutes of "the casino adventures of Finn and the fangirl" and lose nothing) -political pandering -too scared to take creative risks -fanservice -continuity errors (if you wanted to show force healing, you could show rey being obsessed with the books and have her take it everywhere with her and be like "ooo i know what i could try!" and have her read how to do it, guarantee she'd have read about it before. hell make that a stronger plot point as to why Kylo wants to get to rey in the first place. get rid of the magical dagger of "thats not how physics works" and have kylo go after the S A C R E D T E X T S) etc etc the sequel plot so far is like pulp fiction but not thought out enough.
When Disney has to rewrite a once Western-inspired TV-show of a lonsome gunslinger to "explain" a movie it is not an accomplishment. It's just bad fixing of a bad movie.
It doesn't matter if everything connects, it still sucks since Disney ruined Star Wars. No matter how much good comes from it, the bad outweighs it 10 fold.
Having the empire know about how snoke was made makes no sense. Because the sequels said snoke was made by palpatine. And if they know how he was made then they also know that palpatine is behind it which makes absolutely no sense because in the ROS, the first order doesn’t even trust palpatine when they learn of his return. What was that about Dave faloni and Jon favreau fixing the sequels? Those crappy movie can’t be fixed. Teir irredeemable. And other shows filling their holes does not automatically make them good. Keep dreaming
That one terrible line has ruined Star Wars in my opinion. Imagine how awesome this era of Star Wars would be if the sequels just never happened. Because now we know Gideon won’t succeed and Thrawne with lose. De-canonizing the sequels would make me so happy but we all know that’s not happening.
Dude you are talking about original and sequel trilogy as if they were actually connected to sequels plot. It's BS. Sequels were made up on the go with a total disregard to Lucas' storyline. You make it sound like Lucas actually setup the sequels. You just couldn't be more wrong.
This bull****** i still think how they brought Palpy back is dumb asf and its a poor excuse for plot devices and retconning seriously jus let this guy stay dead already
Imagine a Rated R Star Wars Movie about Plagueis and Palpatine where we see Plagueis teaching Palpatine how to hide his sith presence, use force lightning and enact a grand plan. Then either the climax or rising action is when Palpatine attacks Plagueis in his sleep and we see how the scar was made, in all it's visceral glory to harken back to Revenge of the Sith and how devastating the damage was. Then we see Palpatine smugly store the body as a trophy while he begins to enact his own, more ambitious version of his master's plan. But the infuriating realization that Plagueis hid the secrets of essence transfer leads Palpatine into realizing he has to play the long game and manipulate the empire into pursuing his desired cloning research (Tantiss, Gideon, Pershing)
Ugg. Disney really played us by tying the Mandalorian into the garbage of the Sequel trilogy. Well done KK, you got what you wanted - the death of Star Wars. Sigh
Write three Star Wars films with ever diminishing returns and then spend years filling the gaps in Disney+ series because the writing was so terrible. It's someway in attempting to repair the 'somehow Palpatine returned' storyline. Money well spent Disney...
No matter what Disney+ releases in the future it will not forgive the sins of The Last Jedi and it will not make The Rise of Skywalker make any damned sense. Just stop it...
Is disney gonna come up with some bullshit explanation of how Leiah flew through fking space without any kind of suit, Because im still waiting for that one
This makes no sense. Why would you create clones of a person that was defeated by Din Djarin in hand to hand combat? He has never shown force sensibility.
This is a lot lol like Star Wars got too complicated and now they’re using the shows to fix the nonsense/bullshit mess they made with the sequel trilogy.
What do you think of Gideon's plan?
It’s the best of a bad situation
But the part you are missing is that Rey’s father was a clone of Uncle Palps. But what Ryan is saying The Senate has been cloning Plagueis this entire time. So which happened first: Plagueis being cloned, or Palpatine?
So technically wouldn't this make Rey a clone?
My main emotion about this is sadness, how hard Filoni and Favreau have to work to fix the ton of bullsh*t created by idiots making the sequel trilogy, especially episode 9.
I think your correct with his goal, but not there yet cuz if you look at the last episode all the troopers were different heights and builds and therefore not clones
Somehow Palpatine returned
Somehow Palpatine returned
@@Old_Star30 Somehow this comment returned.
Somehow "Somehow Palpatine returned" returned
@@daem0nfaust somehow ‘somehow somehow palpatine returned.’
Greatest moment in the history of cinema. Cutting edge writing.
I can't tell you how grateful I am for Screen Crush and Ryan's breakdowns, the Star Wars saga is an excessively big, complicated Universe and there are so many threads to keep track of, without your breakdowns I would be utterly lost. So please don't stop. Thank you for the superb research on all the characters and all the back stories.
AGREED
Amen.
....Also: Doug 2024. 👊
This is the first video of his that I’ve seen & he does an excellent job at breaking each concept in detail, providing an intellectual perspective, & doing it in a structured manner.
Agreed, dude is the goat
Exactly and add in a cute puppy
Very impressive Ryan. Lucasfilm need to hire you immediately as you have such a canny knack of making all their creative failings sound vaguely coherent.
Favreau and Filoni are masters of fixing bullshit.
Idk man this theory is pretty out there...
@@kylewolfe_ yeah, the theory starts pretty plausible but when Doug lists a bunch of reasons it can't work and Ryan comes up with rebuffs it's like... The dog looks smarter than the man right now. I don't think Lucas Film think about Plaguis half as much as Ryan does. I think it's more fan fiction wish list than theory.
I'll admit it's a pretty thin theory, but it plays out well IF you agree to a few retcons.
As for Ryan being a genius...he explains it well but it's been on reddit for years.
@@kylewolfe_ nah. You're incorrect
Palpatine returned because the writers were lazy
Worse; Palpatine was brought back because the original Skywalker storyline was killed JJ Abrams wanted to do. Kennedy probably had influenced the rewrite.
I wonder how season 3 of the Bad batch fits into all of this and if Dr Hemlocks work is ever influential to project necromancy
nobody cares about this crap, disney is CANCER
i think so as it wsould be something he would be interested given his fondness of messed up experiments
@@Theosake if he were to appear it would be great, Giancarlo is a good voice actor too it just works so well
Called it
Ever hear the tragedy of the "Sequel Trilogy" the unwise?
Excellent!
@@rebelalliance77 you're excellent!
Palpatine coming back and Rey being his grandchild was thrown together at the last second because of how AWFUL 8 was. Everything that comes after is their attempt to "cannon-ize" 9. All they had to do was make movies out of the EU books.
Now they are gutting decent books and swapping plots and characters. Boba Fett to Mando. Luke to Rey
You know it's good storytelling when you have to watch a streaming show 4 years later to get the full story.
The Sequels: vomit
Lucasfilms attempts to salvage rhe sequels: Some of the most compelling TV weve watched in years
I cant complain
If someone only watches the movies, yes, it's pretty bad.
But if someone has read the comics or books, they already knew this stuff.
@@blakedavis4209 not good story telling. LOTR is a great movie trilogy. With never reading the books you can follow the story and like the characters with no background.
if you didn't get it 4 years ago its about a 5min read on wookiepedia
Don't forget playing Fortnite. The Dead Speak .... in Fortnite, that's how Palpatine's return was revealed.
I believe Gideon is 100% going to be the one to create Snoke in an attempt to grab power and counter Luke or any other force users. Palpatine is going to sense this emergence, take control and influence over Snoke, and possibly instruct him in the ways of the dark side. In the end Gideon’s own creation is going to be his ultimate downfall.
Plz filoni read this
I thought Palptine hinting that Snoke might've been one of the "failed" clones of him..
Hmm... If they go this route, I'd like Thrawn to appear in the Ahsoka series, but get stuck in time released at a known set date or similar. This way anything post episode 9 can be about Thrawn returning, with Palatine truly dead... You could do an actual Heir to the Empire (of course no Luke would make me salty I guess)
I find the less one makes declarative statements, the less foolish one is apt to look in retrospect.
@@jferares damn these theories get better and better!
I’m starting to get frustrated. I think we need some damn answers and I mean soon. The problem is, nobody knows. I mean I don’t think even Dave Filoni or John Favreau know. Hell, did George Lucas even know? Shit.
I wish Mando wasn't explaining any of this, but instead a new thread that would eventually unveil a whole brand new original and fun trilogy where everything made sense and the characters were well developed... Such as Thrawn, Ahsoka, Sabine, Ezra, Din, Grogu, Hera... And that in the end, the sequels would be just considered Legends.
Is that really too much to ask?
"Is that really too much to ask?"
Yes; waaaaay too late for that now.
Love your videos. Still amazed how JarJar Abrams mucked everything up so bad we need 1,000 hours of retconning and explaining
If only there were someone at Disney who cared enough about connection and continuity for this to be so. But, nothing they have done since buying the franchise has shown me that such a person exists. Great video!
Lol um Dave Filoni very much is 🤦
Science fiction requires us to suspend belief from time to time when telling an entertaining story. But I just cant get past a guy being thrown off the top of a 500 foot tall shaft inside a space station that gets blown up 10 minutes later into the vacuum of space. How did they capture his conscience to pair with his clone in Exegul?
"You probably should have led with that"... Both PRICELESS and an incredibly cool idea that a remnant of Plagueis resided within Anakin through the process of his creation. SUBSCRIBED!
I'm a bit ashamed to admit it, but I'm actually starting to kinda like the whole Palpatine cloning himself thing...
I know right. Like it really does make sense for his character. Had to kill his master before he was able to transfer his essence for immortality, and then had to figure out to become immortal himself through powerful clone bodies. It really does fit
@@azuresky2200 not to mention how that played into his paranoia that Vader would betray him one day and he’d need a back up plan in that case. He always sensed the conflict in Vader and had to constantly remind him of making sure he knew where his priorities lied. His arrogance that his plan would play out perfectly, as well as letting his clone (Rey’s dad) go, was his downfall
Only after they finally explained how it happened
Since episode nine, I keep thinking to myself "This was all told much more interestingly in Dark Horse's Dark Empire Trilogy." Which is now almost 30 years old. I don't understand why Disney didn't use this story as a template.
Did I watch the new star wars trilogy wrong before I turned it off?
Is it supposed to be a comedy?
Knew this was gonna be a good one because of the title…somehow palpatine returned
nobody cares about this crap, disney is CANCER
So there's a great theory that the Rule of 2 was created so Bane could essence transfer into his apprentice, take another apprentice, and eventually do the same thing over and over again. But it didn't end up working the way he expected. He wanted to take control of his apprentices body and essentially kill their spirit or soul. This isn't what happened, Bane joined with his apprentice, passing his knowledge and influence and desires, but not extinguishing the individual he was taking over. Instead, they merged into 1. A real Tuvix type situation - spiritually.
As the rule of 2 continued, all Sith were compiled into 1 body, living forever and merging with their next apprentice when the time came. So when Palpatine says in Rise of Skywalker, "I am ALL Sith" he literally means it. He holds all the knowledge and experiences of the former Sith who were in the succession of their master by killing the master and taking on his/her essence.
This being the case, Palpatine IS in many ways Plageous now since he killed him. His plan was to allow Anakin to kill him when Anakin got tired of being #2 when he was indeed so powerful as the chosen one. But when he was defeated by Obi-Wan and shredded up he was no longer a viable candidate for succession. Forcing Palpatine to wait for Luke to grow up and be the next candidate. But he didn't know Luke existed, and while he may have sensed an opportunity to continue the Sith line (which is also why he really wanted the lists of force sensitive children, a clone wars show arc and the Fallen Order plot) he wasn't sure he would find a suitable force weirder who would be powerful enough to want to take over. Anakin has the highest M count ever recorded. He was the perfect candidate for the Sith to continue growing their power. Anakin in full healthy form would have been the most powerful Sith who ever existed.
But Palpatine didn't know about Luke, and thus wanted to have a viable body to transfer to in case of his death, which he foresaw the possibility of, but it wasn't clear enough to know who kills him, or when.
However, he was already working on combining clones with force abilities.
The Dark Forces/Jedi Knight video game series has been absorbed by the current Canon, just taking out Kyle Katarn. Rogue 1 was basically the Dark Forces opening mission plot. Steal the plans for the death star. Then the Dark Trooper Program is revealed by Gideon, and it's phase 2 comparible to the dark troopers from Dark Forces, only without any biological component (I think phase 2 was a cybernetic hybrid).
Now phase 3, cloned, force sensitive troopers. While I doubt Gideon was able to imbibe himself with medichlorians to use the force, he mentions the jedi Contribution, which would be Grogu and his M count, they extracted midichlorians from grogu and inserted them into their clones, making force sensitive clone soldiers.
Which is what happens in Jedi Knight II: Jedi Outcast. Kyle Katarn has to defeat an army of cloned dark jedi.
Filoni and Favreau have been referencing all the video games through their new material. The Outrider from Shadows of the Empire is referenced in Rebels when Iron Squadron is flying a YT-2400
The first episode of Mandalorian season 2 was a straight rip of a mission in Kotor 1. The Dark Trooper Program from Dark Forces and the death star plans being stolen from the beginning of that game. Andor and Jyn are Kyle and Jan Ors with mixed up details and no force powers like the first Dark Forces game.
So I'm betting Palpatine had a whole mess of "unnatural" projects going on and when Anakin was defeated started project Necromancer as a worst case scenario.
I can’t stress enough how important the big reveal that Doug is the store manger really is.
So glad they are using what used to be a great show to justify their choices of terrible movie plots 🤦🏼♂️🤦🏼♂️
But the part you are missing is that Rey’s father was a clone of Uncle Palps. But what Ryan is saying The Senate has been cloning Plagueis this entire time. So which happened first: Plagueis being cloned, or Palpatine?
I thought Reys father escaped Exogul? Then went on the run and met her mother?
@@murphybegoodAnd who could be Rey's grandmother, Omega? (Crazy theory!)
@@olgak.1139Peli is Reys mom
lol🙄
They say Peli is the old woman Rey tells, she's a Skywalker.
Possibly leading her to her long lost mother.
Imagine Palps and Peli. Lmgdfao
I mean she dated a Jawa.
Not ONCE did I ever EVEN CONSIDER Palpatine was implanting those nightmares into Anakin’s mind. Incredible. 😶
Me either bro lol
Maybe maybe it was just natural thing to hapend and Palpatine just used it to his own adwantage…
… people see nighmares and person who has strong connection to the force sees things that really hapen or could happen.
I always that it was anakin seeing his own future, and by trying to stop what he saw, he ended up causing it.
Hey Ryan, long time viewer, first time commenter. I think you're missing a giant piece of the Sith puzzle revealed in Episode IX: Palpatine is Darth Plagueis. The rule of two is based on essence transfer, and the Sith lords have been body-hopping for millennia. Darth Sidious was bated into striking down his master in anger, allowing Darth Plagueis to take over his apprentice's body. That how I always read the opera scene, and that's what Palpatine meant by "I am all the Sith." The Sith are an ancient malevolent consciousness, Shiev Palpatine was just the host at the time of the trilogies and Anakin/Luke/Kylo/Rey were next in line.
True cuz palpatine is in Rey now right
Exactly why he wanted to bait Luke into killing him in VI
What book did you read this nonsense?
i love this because it would also nicely explain the ending of the darth bane trilogy
When he determined that Rey was had a great amount of hate, he actually stated it to her.
I like this theory. It explains why the emperor kept trying to get the ones he believed with the most hatred to kill him. And, it also explains, imo, how he gave up on possessing Anakin, due to the vast amounts of bodily damage.
Retcon/trying to join the dots created by previous poor writing
This was hands down some of the best theorizing leading to why anakin would have turned. Hands. Down.👍👏👏👏🌟
I love Star Wars but hate the first order and emperor returning narrative and wish Disney would stop using the shows to fix the terrible writing of the sequels.
Maybe Gideon is trying make *himself* force sensitive. The clones are just test bodies to make sure the transfer of midechlorians works. They’re ultimately disposable. I’d like that better. It makes Gideon ambitious on his own behalf instead of someone else’s.
Pershing specialized in cloning body parts not whole bodies.
Could be something like a Grogu full of Midichlorians baby kidney transplant or something.
I’m usually bad at predictions, but I’m glad I was mostly right about this one.
"What's a vergence?" "Most of our audience." lol Well played, sir.
I'm hoping we get more of Moff Gideon in season 4, Giancarlo plays such a good villain.
I agree 👍 he's so sinister
Love to hate him
Hes the new maul fr
He will never truly die probably has clones everywhere throughout the galaxy
We need a shirt with Doug on it that says... ITS ALL CONNECTED
They just bludgeoning the Star Wars movies. Let Palpatine die, please. It ridiculous. They messed up the storyline on The last Jedi and the Rise of Skywalker. Now they're trying to throw that crap into the new movies.
An idea I’ve had for Snoke’s scar is that he was cloned, then was injured (Leia, Luke and Han know of Snoke in the sequels), then Palpatine realizes that his precious body to stay anonymous is fragile, so then he starts cloning that clone
Every time the Prequels are brought up I just can't get over how dumb the Jedi were to just straight up leave Hayden's mom on Tattooiine. Once they knew he's was strong in the Schwartz the fact they did't turn right around with a million space bucks (TM) and buy her freedom is still one of the dumbest things Lucas ever wrote. Jedi are WMDs trained to murder thousands and they don't do jack to protect the psyche of their people.
Ryan, you forgot to mention how Rey's father is one of Palpatine's failed clone experiments. It would have added to the convolutedness!
He purposely forgets obvious things in his videos so we in the chat can point out he forgot something obvious and get the comments rolling in. It’s pretty smart and he’s been doing it for a while now. That and “mistakenly” saying something false when he meant to say “x” and we all comment the correct thing. In the next video he’ll say “ thank you to everyone who corrected me in the comments that I said the wrong…”
And that clone experiment and Snoke have already been alive for 20+ years too by the time of The Mandalorian. :#
Does any of this change the fact that Han, Leia and Luke become curmudgeonly old useless has-beens that all died stupidly, or that Mon Mothma's glorious rebellion turned into a feckless heap that the Galaxy was well rid of? No? well then...pass.
In the Pershing speech he mentioned combining the best parts of DNA, and splicing it. I actually think snoke is a combination of plagueis and sidious.
Agreed.
I also think that splicing method is how Rey's father was created.
It's complete bullshit that Filoni and Favreau have to explain anything created by hack writers and directors.
Yes, technically the directors may be fine, but the sequel trilogy is 100% what not to do when telling a theatrical story.
The Mandolorian should focus on stories not yet written instead of trying to justify the sequels.
It’s crazy how you just made an 18 minute UA-cam video that included more thought on the most important part of the sequels than what we saw in the sequels themselves
The pathetic attempts to retcon the sequel trilogy are dumb. Just fire Kathleen Kennedy and put Filoni and Faveru in charge. They seem to understand what they are doing and actually like Star Wars. If I was in charge of the most anticipated trilogy in history and I didn't think to actually plan out the whole story before filming I would fully expect to be fired.
Even if it reveals how Palpatine returned, Poe' line "Somehow Palpatine Returnes" is the greatest line in cinematic history
Most of the lines in Star Wars IX are absolute thrash but, hey with a few beers and nanar mode activated, they become quite funny ^^
What a mess. How much do you need to read and watch just to make one kinda bad film just make sense (but excellent job connecting the dots!)
I think the idea is that Palpatine creates snoke to act like a Dooku type leader for the first order using his own cells. The Snokes on Exegol are on stand by, they were created as force sensitive leaders to be placed in different regions throughout the galaxy. In Ep3, Palpatine said that his master could save others but not himself. Therefore, he never learned the ability to cheat death. Plagues needed that clone element which only hia apprentice Palpatine was able to procure through the cloners on Kamino.
I would just say that rather than complicated and convoluted, this particular story is just incomplete. Palpatine's takeover of the Republic with the clone troopers and Syfo-Dias, and all that was confusing as hell until Season 6 of The Clone Wars. (And even still....)
Also, don't forget they could introduce the character from legends who would tie this all together: Your Mom.
The idea that Palpatine would have no backup plan and would just allow himself to be completely destroyed in the same exact way the 1st Death Star exploded... is highly unlikely. Palpatine had amazing foresight. He used to go from being a senator of Naboo to being the Empeor of the entire galaxy. Amazing planning, just to suddenly end when he had ultimate control in the Imperial era? Ha, no, that would be completely out of character..
Great Video Screen Crush 😎💯
And still Loses to rey😮💨
“Somehow” is the best plot device JJ has ever thought of
Uhhhh, Plagueis was a Muun, aka the species who ran the banking clan. Maybe Snoke was made in an attempt at combining different beings' genes, thus making him what they call a strandcast. Rey's father was a strandcast made using Palpatine's genes. He was considering a failure since he didn't have the potential strength in the force they wanted but kept him around as his "son."
Maybe.
@@cameronbaker97 there's more info that backs my head canon. For example, the reason the clones we've seen in The Mandalorian are disfigured is because of a few factors. One is the level of force sensitivity they achieve in the process somehow caused the disfigurement as if the force itself was rejecting the idea (the scientists in the TROS, episode 9, book mention this thought). Another reason, or something the scientists noticed, for the disfigurement was that it occurred more frequently in clones that had the most diverse sourced DNA (aka from near or non-human alien species). They hadn't even figured it out by the events of episode 9, or else Palps wouldn't have needed Rey for her body. Phrasing, lol
Reading these comments, i think you were right about the virgin thing. Hahaha jk
Oh I love this whole theory! I can just picture Favloni watching these videos and saying, “how do they keep finding these obscure connections?!?”
Lame
Not gonna lie the what’s a virgin line nearly had me spit out my coffee. Well done lol
"What's a Virgin?"
"Most of our audience"
LMFAO😂😂😂😅😅😂
Okay so we're done with rehabilitating the sequels now?
Thanks for the well put argument. 💯
Love the vids. The shirts are also dope ❤
nobody cares about this crap, disney is CANCER
Snoke is a palpatine clone. The scar is from when they found Palpatine's burnt corpse on the death star
In the novelization of Last Jedi and The Force Awakens, it explains that since Rey and Kylo are connected in the Force when Rey touches him or vice versa they can transfer training.
Rey also absorbed Luke and Anakin's training via the lightsaber just by touching it and absorbed Kylo's training by touching his hand in TLJ.
Same with the mind probing ability in TFA when Kylo interrogates Rey
@@OhioKing_Z yup
LOL please throw all of this into garbage
Worst plot line in movie history
We all assumed Gideon's clone experiments were the precursor to "somehow Palpatine returned" but after the Shadow Council it sounds like Gideon was on his own mission for clone troopers and it's actually Hux with project necromancer that will create Snoke and recreate Palpatine.
That's how I feel about the prequel trilogy... I was in high school, when episode 1 and 2 came out and My friends and I were very underwhelmed by those movies. This is years before social, so you had to go to those Star wars chat rooms to complain about it... But they had to make seven seasons, to try and make the prequels seem a little better. My only problem is by the time the clone wars series came out, I was just hanging on to the OG trilogy and wanted nothing to do with anything prequel related. till about a couple years ago. I finally watched that series.
We know how Palpatine returned. They explained it in the Rise of Palpatine: "SOMEHOW". No need to add a backstory to it ;-)
Pressed for no reason huh? Not even giving anything a chance. 📸
Ryan I feel like you have been waiting for this video ever since "some how palpatine returned" happened.
This is low-key the highest point of this channel in that three year span. You're finally explaining to us how "somehow palpatine returned"
According to canon, Palpatine was resurrected on Exagol almost instantaneously after his death
I thought palpatine returned “somehow”
Can’t wait for the mandalorian season 3 finale!!!
nobody cares about this crap, disney is CANCER
🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
"Most of our audience"
Maaaaan!!!! I'm dying, what a great joke!!!
Thank you!!!!😂😂😂😂😂😂😂
I'm laughing the shit out of me!!!
Need a most of our Audience shirt😂
nobody cares about this crap, disney is CANCER
The biggest mistake they made in rise of skywalker was bringing back palpitating instead of it being Darth Plagueis.
Really enjoyed the connecting of the dots. I would have never been aware of half of this. Great breakdown of the history.
Disney films are not CANON ! Stop this nonsense !
It’s all a big mess trying to retcon all of the destruction the morons who had no plans did with the sequels.
Oh dear that's a shame....seeing as the sequels were total crap
My head canon will always be that Darth Bane figured out soul transfer and has been the sith master all along.
Somehow I'm not buying that explanation
Star Trek Picard Season 3 has been better. Walking up and down and talking with masks on. Plus Grogru’s in the robot saying ‘yes’ all the time is the comic relief no one needed.
The bottle episode was the only episode that was actually any good.
I always thought (before ep. 8) that Snoke was Ezra Bridger. The set-up was there. A young, conflicted Padawan who lost his master disappears into the unknown regions with a tactical mastermind. He would have either been imprisoned by Thrawn until he complied with his leadership or took up an alliance with Thrawn in order to survive some new threat.
Ugh! Could we drop the sequel trilogy?! I thought it was going to be retconned anyway. Stop trying to make the Sequel Trilogy from happening - its the Fetch of Star Wars. Send JJ and KK back to film school!
Jesus christ' WHO cares at the point?
Disney Star Wars is the McDonald's of the Entertainment industry. Specifically the dollar menu.
Honestly, I was never a fan of the theory of Snoke being Darth Plagueis, to begin with. I didn't want the Sith to return and I was hoping for a brand-new type of villain. Not to mention bringing Plagueis back in my opinion would've ruined Palpatine's triumph over him. I would also like to point out that in the Legends novel (which is a great book) they weren't necessarily trying to create Anakin, the Force struck back at them when they tried to create life. And if this were Legends, Palpatine did eventually become more powerful than his master by the time of the Dark Empire comics. Also, Palpatine in Episode 9 said he "made Snoke" so it wouldn't make sense if that were Plageuis. But these are just my opinions.
the idea of "soul transfering" is something brought up all the way back in the KOTOR book "Revan" and expanded on in the SWTOR game in the base game and the fourth (?) expansion.
the problem with how Disney has been going about this is:
-they jumped the gun on the plot
-they had no direction going into the new movies
-poor writing with the new movies (literally you can cut out the 57 minutes of "the casino adventures of Finn and the fangirl" and lose nothing)
-political pandering
-too scared to take creative risks
-fanservice
-continuity errors (if you wanted to show force healing, you could show rey being obsessed with the books and have her take it everywhere with her and be like "ooo i know what i could try!" and have her read how to do it, guarantee she'd have read about it before. hell make that a stronger plot point as to why Kylo wants to get to rey in the first place. get rid of the magical dagger of "thats not how physics works" and have kylo go after the S A C R E D T E X T S)
etc etc
the sequel plot so far is like pulp fiction but not thought out enough.
When Disney has to rewrite a once Western-inspired TV-show of a lonsome gunslinger to "explain" a movie it is not an accomplishment. It's just bad fixing of a bad movie.
It doesn't matter if everything connects, it still sucks since Disney ruined Star Wars. No matter how much good comes from it, the bad outweighs it 10 fold.
Having the empire know about how snoke was made makes no sense. Because the sequels said snoke was made by palpatine. And if they know how he was made then they also know that palpatine is behind it which makes absolutely no sense because in the ROS, the first order doesn’t even trust palpatine when they learn of his return. What was that about Dave faloni and Jon favreau fixing the sequels? Those crappy movie can’t be fixed. Teir irredeemable. And other shows filling their holes does not automatically make them good. Keep dreaming
That one terrible line has ruined Star Wars in my opinion. Imagine how awesome this era of Star Wars would be if the sequels just never happened. Because now we know Gideon won’t succeed and Thrawne with lose. De-canonizing the sequels would make me so happy but we all know that’s not happening.
Dude you are talking about original and sequel trilogy as if they were actually connected to sequels plot. It's BS. Sequels were made up on the go with a total disregard to Lucas' storyline. You make it sound like Lucas actually setup the sequels. You just couldn't be more wrong.
This bull****** i still think how they brought Palpy back is dumb asf and its a poor excuse for plot devices and retconning seriously jus let this guy stay dead already
Imagine a Rated R Star Wars Movie about Plagueis and Palpatine where we see Plagueis teaching Palpatine how to hide his sith presence, use force lightning and enact a grand plan. Then either the climax or rising action is when Palpatine attacks Plagueis in his sleep and we see how the scar was made, in all it's visceral glory to harken back to Revenge of the Sith and how devastating the damage was. Then we see Palpatine smugly store the body as a trophy while he begins to enact his own, more ambitious version of his master's plan. But the infuriating realization that Plagueis hid the secrets of essence transfer leads Palpatine into realizing he has to play the long game and manipulate the empire into pursuing his desired cloning research (Tantiss, Gideon, Pershing)
Ugg. Disney really played us by tying the Mandalorian into the garbage of the Sequel trilogy. Well done KK, you got what you wanted - the death of Star Wars. Sigh
Ohh This was DEEEEEP
But all very Plausible... Did Disney hire you as a co-writer?
Just ignore the sequels, you can’t redeem them. Anything with a link to them should be boycotted instead of supporting that travesty.
Maybe Anakin and Grogu are a force dyad. They are the same age. Darkness and light, both created by Plagueis and Sidious.
Write three Star Wars films with ever diminishing returns and then spend years filling the gaps in Disney+ series because the writing was so terrible. It's someway in attempting to repair the 'somehow Palpatine returned' storyline. Money well spent Disney...
No matter what Disney+ releases in the future it will not forgive the sins of The Last Jedi and it will not make The Rise of Skywalker make any damned sense. Just stop it...
Bringing Palpatine was trash and totally undermines everything that came before it…I’m not counting legends.
Doesn't matter what they do. All of it negates what George Lucas said about The Chosen One prophecy.
Darth Bane- Path of Destruction, Rule of Two, and Dynasty of Evil covered this and I have a thought that this is Bane's essence over 1000 years.
Is disney gonna come up with some bullshit explanation of how Leiah flew through fking space without any kind of suit,
Because im still waiting for that one
I don’t like how they are trying to make sense out of the stupid sequel trilogy. Just leave it alone and forget about it
i'm sorry but, if the build up for the Mandalorian is the the creation of snoke, I'm going to be disappointed, same for bad batch
This makes no sense. Why would you create clones of a person that was defeated by Din Djarin in hand to hand combat? He has never shown force sensibility.
I wish we could just bury the Disney trilogy. It ruined the entire saga of Anikin.
This is a lot lol like Star Wars got too complicated and now they’re using the shows to fix the nonsense/bullshit mess they made with the sequel trilogy.