Yes but to be fair. Some people do use these only for servers. But I agree desktop has grown considerable. I had that bias because I stopped using linux 10 years ago. But now I see how much it improve.
@Foxy I'm fine with OSX, ive never used it myself because i dont really want to spend thousands for a computer thats not worth it. But from what i know it works better than windows. I just hate windows, I have to fix a lot of issues caused by software bugs at work. Its a nightmare.
@@xxmountaindewxx7893 I prefer Linux but sadly I have experienced that Windows seems to be more stable than Linux when it comes to software etc. for me
@Smt Miserible I don´t know about your apps, but 1440p-good-fps in some old games like Quake and Urban Terror are more than I need, and I probably didn´t get it without a good GPU-driver. And Firefox says it has all HW-support available. Check out openports.se if you want to know more about available ports. The stuff you lack are mostly proprietary. But it´s totally worth it. The folks that make OpenBSD are not messing around. It´s as"fully tested" as software ever can be. If you try it and then still don´t think everything else is broken, you probably "holding it wrong". Just remember that the defaults are VERY security-focused. So you need to do some tinkering if you want good performance. But when I say "tinkering" I don´t mean the chaos of tinkering with Nvidia in Linux. More like very simple stuff in minimalistic and extremely well-documented text-files.
@Digital Crow I don't know about your GPU. But OpenBSD documentation in OpenBSD is the best there is. So just Google it. With OpenBSD there are only two variants. 1. They support the device and you will never have a problem. Not a single question. It just works. Or 2. They don't support it=Your out of luck. With Nvidia it's nnumber 2. Nvidia are a**holes to all of open source. They have their proprietary driver which is not ok with the OpenBSD team. Regarding Noveau, it's not there. I guess it quickly failed OpenBSD hard requirements for correctness and/or stability/security. KM's are not a thing in OpenBSD. They had their own driver "nv" for many years ago, but stopped development because Nvidia wasn't willing to disclose anything. So only about a decade old Nvidia stuff will work. You can say that OpenBSD was the thing that I loved so much I preferred to throw the wrong hardware away. I use it now as my own compatibility list of sorts. Kind of "If it's good enough for OpenBSD, it's good enough for me." But I wouldn't be surprised if your AMDGPU workes right out of the box. Check out their website openbsd.org and you will soon know. Just be prepared for some new mindsets. When you get used to it, you never use anything else again.
@Digital Crow Seems strange. What kind of network cards do you have? And what does it say about the packages? Not all wifi-cards are supported but all ethernets I have seen worked. Did you install with ethernet cable connected? It's normal for wifi to complain about firmware during install if you set it up. If lan works it will aautomatically download the nonfree-binarys needed at first start. Tell me more about the things you did and I be happy to try to assist.
I would love to see you living in a BSD system like openbsd or freebsd for a week or so. It would be interesting to see what problems you would face compared to linux. If any ;)
@@DistroTube this is just a lack of knowledge on your part. Bsds are not linux, and you have to understand that going in. It's going to take you more than four days to get it setup. I doubt it took you 4 days to get your current Linux setup. More likely it took you years. But again you shouldn't implied that openbsd can't do something just because you lack the knowledge. It is too stereotypical.
I installed your gitlab dwm repository on Freebsd it works very well just configuration is bit different from default but I will get used to it. Thank you DT you are my saviour ✌️
but it’s true Windows or MacOS is a superior desktop experience in terms of usability and stability It happened so often to me on Linux that some driver wasn’t working right, printer isn’t working, screen tearing, issues with external devices, energy saving mode not properly working etc. .. and I used Linux for like 10 years But on Windows things like that never happened Some distros cause less issues than others but the overall experience is better on Windows or MacOS
That is actually simpler than Arch Linux installation. When I installed Arch Linux, I had to boot from USB again in 90% of cases because I forgot something to install, and GRUB shows error or I cannot connect to my network. + And of course, I have to mount my rootfs again and do chroot after booting from USB.
In terms of security, OpenBSD > FreeBSD In terms of hardware compatibility, NetBSD > FreeBSD Inexplicably (given the above), in terms of supported applications and utilities. FreeBSD > any other BSD
BSD is just not recognized as UNIX officially but it is UNIX. Why would they waste a ton of money licensing it if it already is UNIX? The recognition is just a seal of approval, everyone that has ever used BSD knows it’s UNIX.
Great video, FreeBSD kinda has potential for a desktop usage, it even have some type of compatibility layer with linux that makes some linux apps run on bsd Tip for a more minimal installation that you guys might want Instead of pkg install xorg, run pkg install xorg-minimal
From the NomadBSD website (nomadbsd.org/): "NomadBSD is a persistent live system for USB flash drives, based on FreeBSD®." Not saying that it can't be used as a desktop, but it seems it's more for live USB purposes.
Why people insist *BSD's are server os's? For example FreeBSD has almost 40000 ports plus you can also emulate some GNU/Linux software. What are you using for youtube? OBS, Kdenlive, audacity, etc. are in ports. PS: uname -vm FreeBSD 12.1-STABLE KERNT430 amd64
BSD user here. It's true though, the main development goal for FreeBSD is IT applications (firewalls, routers, NAS, datacenter usage, web servers, etc). The developers however eat their own dogfood and use the system as a daily driver and therefore make it more enjoyable to use as a desktop if you have the right hardware (and the community keeps it going too). Desktop, Laptop hardware compatibility is nowhere near what Linux has. FreeBSD doesn't work very well on my Laptop and is an unstable mess, OpenBSD works perfectly though. You mentioned the FreeBSD ports tree having 40000 ports, although this may be true a huge amount of those ports are horribly outdated and or unmaintained. OpenBSD and NetBSD have better ports trees in this regard. NetBSD development targets embedded tech more, and OpenBSD is a research OS that mainly seeks to innovate security technology and secure coding. Several security features on your Android Phone, IPhone, Windows 10 have their genesis in the OpenBSD project. Many of the mainstream web browsers and open software have less bugs and better code thanks to OpenBSD users bugging upstream developers to fix their code because in doesn't build or run under OpenBSD strict memory safe environment. People insist that BSD's are server OS's because it's used in professional environments more than just causal desktop use.
@Chexier Chromium is at the latest version on FreeBSD, Firefox core dumps most likely because you didn't start the DBUS daemon and NetBSD I can't answer for as they are a different OS.
Try running Chrome (not Chromium), Java and Java based apps, and Visual Studio Code on FreeBSD? I use these everyday. Until then FreeBSD will live ... in a VM
Thank you. I'd tried OpenBSD and ran into some issues, but it sounds like FreeBSD is the one for me, since I want to run a desktop. So far, so good. I'm a Linux guy, but wanted to try something different.
There is an easier way. Type in terminal(Alacritty also works in FreeBSD) "sysrc dbus_enable=YES sysrc hald_enable=YES sysrc sound_load_enable=YES sysrc sddm_enable=YES sysrc snd_hda_load=YES" Almost everything(sound,mouse etc.) will work without problem. SDDM is the login screen, it installs "doas pkg install -y sddm" 🤣
I used FreeBSD exclusively from about 1996-2005 or so. It was always so frustrating that it never caught on as much as Linux. Oh well. At least Apple saw the talent of Jordan Hubbard.
Replace "BSD" with "GNU/Linux", "NetBSD" with "Debian", "OpenBSD" with "Red Hat Linux", and "FreeBSD" with "Ubuntu", on 0:05 to 1:06 and you'll get the opinion of most windows users on Linux.
Ooooh, *BSD. Gotta love that stylish installer, really brings me back. Maybe I should give FreeBSD a go, getting time to reinstall my main desktop soon.
To me is better than many linux distros out there. I use freebsd with dwm as a daily driver and I can't complaint, they have linux-kernel translation layer so you can run whatever is made for linux-distros. I highly recommend it.
FreeBSD is only a good daily desktop driver if you're happy to have a system which is less secure than just about every other OS that isn't MS-DOS. In 2017 they were still considering implementing exploit mitigations which every other OS has had for many.many years (Source: wiki.freebsd.org/DevSummit/201708/Security_mitigation) In 2019 they finally introduced ASLR as an option but last I checked, not a default, unlike on every other major OS. Also, no proper W^X enforcement like Linux, Windows, macOS and OpenBSD has As of 2021: They do not include Mandatory Access Control (MAC) lockdowns on key daemons by default, Fedora/RHEL had this for decades with SELinux, macOS has this with their sandboxing, OpenBSD uses pledge() and even Windows has Service Hardening Tokens. FBSD still does no cryptographic checks of application binaries at runtime and therefore has no solid means to block malware. No ransomware protection either (macOS blocks access to personal files by default, Windows has Controlled Folder Access, Linux has many ways to limit what apps can touch). Even worse, there's no per application network firewall, only standard per-port/IP firewalls. If you're a desktop user, there's almost certainly no benefit to using FreeBSD over Linux, macOS or Windows in terms of performance, security, reliability or tooling. Choose something else. On the server side of things: FreeBSD is also a questionable choice for servers these days, since it lacks a proper secure impersonation API to allow processes to handle different user requests per-thread across a multi-domain environment which includes cross-domain trusts. This excludes it from many internal enterprise server roles, like large corporate file servers subject to proper auditing controls. Even ignoring that, not having common exploit mitigations baked in and relying on sysadmins to implement a combination of MAC lockdowns by hand across multiple, stacked modules makes it a bad choice for public-facing servers, where Linux does a much better job. I only use FreeBSD for two things these days: NAS drives to hold encrypted backup data and pfsense network appliances. It is honestly an inferior choice for a lot of common roles these days.
If anyone is having trouble getting mouse support in a VM (VirtualBox), you need to add moused_enable="YES" to rc.conf and make sure the mouse service is running by running "sudo service moused restart." This seems independent of Window Manager and Desktop Environment since I had the same issue and fixed it for twm and xfce.
Great video, though the *BSDs aren't strictly server operating systems at all! FreeBSD in particular kinda shines as one, but it is just as capable as the others as a desktop. What's the argument for them being server operating systems? They all have ports of pretty much every open source Linux desktop application, every WM, etc. They all have drivers for most hardware configurations you throw at it with some edge cases. Also, you installed 11.4 which the base of which is kinda old, you should have gone with 12.1 :D
ZFS is one of the major arguments in favor of BSD on a server due not so much to its 128-bit nature, but to its security measures implemented by default. Linux really suffers from a »not invented here« syndrome. I really think the supposed incompatibility of the CDDL with the GPL is regrettable. Ay the same time, I feel they need it to push BtrFS as the only viable alternative. As Greg Kroah-Hartmann put it himself, he is »really sorry, but he couldn't care less, even if ZFS was the best file system ever invented«. As much as I love Linux, this is an idiot attitude, really.
In Freebsd you can find many programs that you can't even dream of on linux, for example: zfs, bhyve, jail. And if I'm missing something from linux.. I install it in bhyve or jail and done
Thank you so much. It got me off the ground. Installed 13.1 from BD (iso does not fit in DVD) It looks like you are using an EV RE27 microphone. Commonly used in broadcasting. I have used it for amateur radio and for narration of old 16mm home movies.
Try FuryBSD. It's FreeBSD 12.1 RELEASE but someone did the heavyweight and you can choose XFCE or KDE. It's like what Antergos or ArcoLinux is for Arch
I hope they can keep it going! As cool as the Fury name is, it’s super annoying when someone reports/talks about it and calls it FurryBSD (as in your favorite four-legged animal). Edit: Oh UA-cam, will your markdown formatting *ever* work properly?
I'd have a FreeBSD installation, but it requires primary partitions (if I understand the docs correctly), and I have none to spare. However, Nomad BSD on a USB stick is pretty sweet.
FreeBSD is a gaming OS. Game consoles use it. In 2020, we got proton steam support. In 2022, it became a fancy and a race to make the ultimate gaming PC OS, yielding at leat 8% more fps than SteamOS and Arch. No systemd. Linux better catch up, FreeBSD is taking over. It can also run most everything made for Linux, natively.
@c6ampprobably referring to: `The jail mechanism is an implementation of FreeBSD's OS-level virtualisation that allows system administrators to partition a FreeBSD-derived computer system into several independent mini-systems called jails, all sharing the same kernel, with very little overhead.' ~ wikipedia
@@SunnyGabe Sorry for the late reply...it is something like: there was unix, then bsd was developed as a variation of unix, and after that linux was written "trying to imitate" unix but with different code because licenses and stuff... so basically they are different on many levels, but since they work similarly it's reasonably easy to adapt source from one to the other...I know I probably got some details wrong but I hope this explanation is enough
I found and installed UWM to take a look. It had an octagon icon that was tricky to navigate. It didn't have any appealing attributes so I removed it. TWM is better but 3 xterms ?
Used to have a hugely hacked config for twm back in the university days, in first half of 1990:th. Changed both shell and WM a couple of times back then. To blody lazy this days for that.
Linux is bloat! I'm positive DT will love FreeBSD if drivers don't bite him. I always found it more straightforward. Setting a static ip in Linux has turned into a chore!
I am running OpenBSD on my Thinkpad. It is technically a desktop OS, but man it seems like everything is just harder. I can't run many of my programs. Others just behave weird like Firefox that still can't figure out it is my default browser.
If you like FreeBSD You should check out RoboNuggie's channel! I really like his content, his daily driver is FreeBSD and he does a bunch of FreeBSD and other BSD content!
Great video! Could you pls make a dedicated video on the pkg installer please? Your explanation is very straightforward and nice. I've heard that FreeBSD is a bit faster and secure than Linux. So i really want to try it out.
Any UNIX derived system can be used for whatever purpose the end user has for it. Once you install any variant of Linux or BSD, you have free reign over the whole system. There are no real 'server' or 'desktop' UNIX systems, as in they can _only_ be used for one or the other purpose. You can easily use Linux Mint or Elementary OS as a server OS, or even use SUSE Linux Enterprise or OpenBSD as a home computer or workstation OS. Sure, Linux Mint may be far more user friendly than OpenBSD, but they are equally capable. It's better to say that FreeBSD and OpenBSD are more 'geared towards' server use, rather than that they are 'server operating systems.'
Remind me of install Debian lenny back in the day. No real difference except on bsd, I start in the termial which I prefer. Type in startx to start your gui if memory serves. Good times.
DT, I'm surprised you are not more interested. Linux is bloat. Use BSD! I used to use it in 99 to early 2000s. It dominated servers back then. Enjoyed it more than Linux, but lack of drivers for consumer equipment forced me away. ZFS is the most awesome feature it has had over Linux up until recently.
Donald, it's not editing video that's the problem. There are plenty of FOSS video editors available for FreeBSD. My issue is everything that comes BEFORE the video editing...namely recording audio/video. The last time I tried to install a BSD on my production machine (installed GhostBSD like a year and half ago), I spent 4 days trying to get the cameras and mics to work. Finally got OBS to recognize my camera and capture device. But I never had a working microphone in those 4 days. Spent hours trying to figure out it out. Ultimately, after not making any content that whole time, I had to ditch that idea and go back to Linux. GhostBSD has undergone a lot of changes since then. Maybe it would work now. Maybe FreeBSD would work for me. But I know Linux works. ;)
The romance with the simplicity and elegance of BSD goes away as soon as you run into driver issues. It is sad, but DT has no chance of remaining sane with his new computer + FreeBSD. Arch is the next best thing to BSD if you ask me. Most of the elegance and an overwhelming amount of software and drivers that are super easy to install.
It’s actually quite a pain to get a usable desktop out of FreeBSD. From arstechnica.com/gadgets/2020/04/not-actually-linux-distro-review-freebsd-12-1-release/ : With all of that said, let's get back to the hilarious masochism involved in installing a FreeBSD desktop. And it goes downhill from there...
I use Gnome 3.36 on OpenBSD. Works well! I haven’t tried Gnome on any other BSDs, and I don’t think it’s quite as up-to-date as on OpenBSD, but it should be available. FreeBSD has Gnome 3.28 iirc. I haven’t tried Gnome on illumos or Unix based operating systems. Similarly, non-systemd Gnome can be installed on Gentoo, although it requires a shim. Non-systemd Gnome is generally very performant and slightly lower in ram usage. Although being an unofficial release, one would have to talk to the package maintainer regarding any bugs or features.
Gnome 3 without systemd is extremely snappy and low in resources: around 500 MB of RAM after cold boot on Void and about 550 MB of RAM after cold boot on a pure Gentoo!!!
I liked freebsd 6.1circa 2008! It comes with gnome,kde twm,fvwm and maybe some other desktops,and has a better partition manager them the current version.Although it is probably to old and limited for huge terabyte drives to format! Version 12 or 11,It will not let me partition my drive my way,and if you use the auto install it takes the whole drive! That's too much on a 1 or larger terabyte drive! Not what I wanted . I want a small os install,a large var or web space to run web pages or massive email server.Further to that I do not like the UUID disk identifier,prefer the old ssd/sda,sdb,sdc drive system etc! Can it be reset to that blkid? Freebsd 6.1 is a 32 bit os!Version 11 or 12 requires one to be online for a pkg and gui install !not everyone is online! I used my cell phone or wifi on laptop to download version 11. Pkg manager should come installed along with a gui and a better partition manager like gparted for freebsd! Version 12 will not work on a Dell r240 server for some reason! I can't get past install or format part,I don't use checksum maybe that's the problem! I've never bothered to figure out how to use checksum and downloads are usually fine without it, and I cant see a man in middle attacking an os download! I hope Freebsd.org reads my comments as they seem out of touch with users and I don't see a comment page,have to go check! Why has freebsd.org not included a desktop and pkg manager?
You want your Ubuntu Openbox distro? It was a pain to make. You only try to install lightdm, xorg and openbox, and it wants to install gnome-shell. Had to use the --no-install-recommends flag.
FreeBSD is my 2nd fav after GNU/Linux. There are some great but also nasty attributes to freebsd but overall Linux wins in terms of good vs evil compared to freebsd.
Since it uses the BSD kernel and so does OS-X, is it possible to get a FreeBSD desktop to install and run third-party OS-X driver-software packages for USB connected accessories?
The only bsd I want is a bsd without demons... gib me fugu! xD (pufferfish) But really though, the bsd projects I'm interested in is pfsense and freenas (though I'd rather learn how to make a nas with linux). I only see bsd as an os for specialized functions.
eehhh... Well I think what makes it popular is what makes people remember it and I don't think that's a bad thing. Once they grow some interest about it, then they would research it. Though the demon thing really turns me off, I really don't like my software to be related to good/evil. sorry no sorry xD (still a linux newb, no bulli)
The way you view freebsd is the way most people view linux.
Really... This is SO ironic! I feel like windows user!
@Digital Crowtry OpenBSD
The irony...
@@godnyx117 It's all layers.
@@vogonp4287 Yeah. Creating your own kernel is the end ;)
The 'it's just for servers' phrase is the same thing people that don't use linux say about linux
Yes but to be fair. Some people do use these only for servers. But I agree desktop has grown considerable. I had that bias because I stopped using linux 10 years ago. But now I see how much it improve.
@Foxy I'm fine with OSX, ive never used it myself because i dont really want to spend thousands for a computer thats not worth it. But from what i know it works better than windows.
I just hate windows, I have to fix a lot of issues caused by software bugs at work. Its a nightmare.
@@xxmountaindewxx7893
I prefer Linux but sadly I have experienced that Windows seems to be more stable than Linux when it comes to software etc. for me
@@martinsauer8856 try administering Windows machines and you'll very quickly find Linux is more stable when it comes to software
@Foxy macOS is simply not the same thing as using OpenBSD
DT: BSD is only for servers.
Me: Watching this video on my laptop with OpenBSD, in bed via Wifi.
Also watching on OpenBSD with Openbox...or...OpenBSDbox ;)
OpenBSD is fantastic! It's also the lightest system that I've ever personally used. :)
@@miyolinux Fvwm here. If it's good enough for Theo... ;)
@Smt Miserible I don´t know about your apps, but 1440p-good-fps in some old games like Quake and Urban Terror are more than I need, and I probably didn´t get it without a good GPU-driver. And Firefox says it has all HW-support available. Check out openports.se if you want to know more about available ports. The stuff you lack are mostly proprietary. But it´s totally worth it. The folks that make OpenBSD are not messing around. It´s as"fully tested" as software ever can be. If you try it and then still don´t think everything else is broken, you probably "holding it wrong". Just remember that the defaults are VERY security-focused. So you need to do some tinkering if you want good performance. But when I say "tinkering" I don´t mean the chaos of tinkering with Nvidia in Linux. More like very simple stuff in minimalistic and extremely well-documented text-files.
@Digital Crow I don't know about your GPU. But OpenBSD documentation in OpenBSD is the best there is. So just Google it. With OpenBSD there are only two variants. 1. They support the device and you will never have a problem. Not a single question. It just works. Or 2. They don't support it=Your out of luck. With Nvidia it's nnumber 2. Nvidia are a**holes to all of open source. They have their proprietary driver which is not ok with the OpenBSD team. Regarding Noveau, it's not there. I guess it quickly failed OpenBSD hard requirements for correctness and/or stability/security. KM's are not a thing in OpenBSD. They had their own driver "nv" for many years ago, but stopped development because Nvidia wasn't willing to disclose anything. So only about a decade old Nvidia stuff will work. You can say that OpenBSD was the thing that I loved so much I preferred to throw the wrong hardware away. I use it now as my own compatibility list of sorts. Kind of "If it's good enough for OpenBSD, it's good enough for me." But I wouldn't be surprised if your AMDGPU workes right out of the box. Check out their website openbsd.org and you will soon know. Just be prepared for some new mindsets. When you get used to it, you never use anything else again.
@Digital Crow Seems strange. What kind of network cards do you have? And what does it say about the packages? Not all wifi-cards are supported but all ethernets I have seen worked. Did you install with ethernet cable connected? It's normal for wifi to complain about firmware during install if you set it up. If lan works it will aautomatically download the nonfree-binarys needed at first start. Tell me more about the things you did and I be happy to try to assist.
I have switched from GNU/Linux to *FreeBSD* as my desktop 2 years ago been very happy smoothest OS I have ever ran and fast.
what about mirror download speeds
I will never get bored of watching operating systems installation
I'm into installation voyeurism too :)
Sounds like ASMR
The best desktop system ever with FreeBSD.I replaced the linux on my laptop a few months ago with freebsd and it's great and stable.
I would love to see you living in a BSD system like openbsd or freebsd for a week or so. It would be interesting to see what problems you would face compared to linux. If any ;)
Already done this on the channel. I was never ever able to record a video, never had a working microphone. After 4 days, I had to give up on the idea.
@@DistroTube Next OpenBSD, NetBSD and living for a week or so with two.
@@DistroTube you probably Googled, that's why. everything you need is in the man pages.
@@DistroTube this is just a lack of knowledge on your part. Bsds are not linux, and you have to understand that going in. It's going to take you more than four days to get it setup. I doubt it took you 4 days to get your current Linux setup. More likely it took you years. But again you shouldn't implied that openbsd can't do something just because you lack the knowledge. It is too stereotypical.
"some people somehow manage to use freeBSD as a daily desktop"
Mac users : You called?
Trouble is though, is that many Mac users won't have a clue that they're actually using a BSD based system!
Mac doesn't count. It's completely proprietary
@@slamislife74 Mac is to BSD, the same as Android is to Linux.
@@torspedia That makes more sense. The open-sourcr Android kernel is really out of date
MacOS is a joke compared to the real BSDs.
I installed your gitlab dwm repository on Freebsd it works very well just configuration is bit different from default but I will get used to it.
Thank you DT you are my saviour ✌️
0:15 to 0:44 sounds a LOT like what windows users say about linux
but it’s true
Windows or MacOS is a superior desktop experience in terms of usability and stability
It happened so often to me on Linux that some driver wasn’t working right, printer isn’t working, screen tearing, issues with external devices, energy saving mode not properly working etc. .. and I used Linux for like 10 years
But on Windows things like that never happened
Some distros cause less issues than others but the overall experience is better on Windows or MacOS
@@martinsauer8856 true but I'll still "try" to switch to Linux because my hardware isn't the best..
@@martinsauer8856 what linux distro did you use?
That is actually simpler than Arch Linux installation. When I installed Arch Linux, I had to boot from USB again in 90% of cases because I forgot something to install, and GRUB shows error or I cannot connect to my network.
+ And of course, I have to mount my rootfs again and do chroot after booting from USB.
BSD is used a lot in IoT due to its emphasis on security, for instance in electric control systems
I wanted to try FreeBSD, but I was unsure of the installation. Then this pops up in my recommended. Good video, DT. Subbed.
In terms of security, OpenBSD > FreeBSD
In terms of hardware compatibility, NetBSD > FreeBSD
Inexplicably (given the above), in terms of supported applications and utilities. FreeBSD > any other BSD
FreeBSD has a built-in Linux compatibility layer so not it's not so surprising
NetBSD has more width of compatibility across architectures but FreeBSD has more depth on the most common platforms in terms of devices supported.
I have wanted more about BSD....
Thank you so much for this tutorial!
@Donald Mickunas
Oh...
Sounds interesting...
Finally a UNIX video!
:P
This is the boomer centric content we've all been waiting for. :D
freebsd is a unix like OS like gnu+linux is ! UNIX is a trademark from the OPenGroup
BSD is just not recognized as UNIX officially but it is UNIX. Why would they waste a ton of money licensing it if it already is UNIX? The recognition is just a seal of approval, everyone that has ever used BSD knows it’s UNIX.
@@accelerat0r747 GNU/LINUX is MINIX which uses some unix-like principles ported to modern hardware
BSD is unix
Great video, FreeBSD kinda has potential for a desktop usage, it even have some type of compatibility layer with linux that makes some linux apps run on bsd
Tip for a more minimal installation that you guys might want
Instead of pkg install xorg, run pkg install xorg-minimal
Thank u
There are FreeBSD desktop OS available, like Ghost and Nomad.
From the NomadBSD website (nomadbsd.org/):
"NomadBSD is a persistent live system for USB flash drives, based on
FreeBSD®."
Not saying that it can't be used as a desktop, but it seems it's more for live USB purposes.
@@alecstewart212 Install option in the menu (onto harddrive).
I love FreeBSD. It's a shame more people don't explore it. It's a lot simpler than Linux IMO.
is not !
Why people insist *BSD's are server os's? For example FreeBSD has almost 40000 ports plus you can also emulate some GNU/Linux software. What are you using for youtube? OBS, Kdenlive, audacity, etc. are in ports.
PS: uname -vm
FreeBSD 12.1-STABLE KERNT430 amd64
BSD user here. It's true though, the main development goal for FreeBSD is IT applications (firewalls, routers, NAS, datacenter usage, web servers, etc). The developers however eat their own dogfood and use the system as a daily driver and therefore make it more enjoyable to use as a desktop if you have the right hardware (and the community keeps it going too). Desktop, Laptop hardware compatibility is nowhere near what Linux has. FreeBSD doesn't work very well on my Laptop and is an unstable mess, OpenBSD works perfectly though. You mentioned the FreeBSD ports tree having 40000 ports, although this may be true a huge amount of those ports are horribly outdated and or unmaintained. OpenBSD and NetBSD have better ports trees in this regard. NetBSD development targets embedded tech more, and OpenBSD is a research OS that mainly seeks to innovate security technology and secure coding. Several security features on your Android Phone, IPhone, Windows 10 have their genesis in the OpenBSD project. Many of the mainstream web browsers and open software have less bugs and better code thanks to OpenBSD users bugging upstream developers to fix their code because in doesn't build or run under OpenBSD strict memory safe environment. People insist that BSD's are server OS's because it's used in professional environments more than just causal desktop use.
@Chexier I know this is right even though it hurts to admit. I have started looking at other browser because of this.
@Chexier "All serious web browsers run like shit in it." - Please provide data to back this statement.... I'm curious....
@Chexier Chromium is at the latest version on FreeBSD, Firefox core dumps most likely because you didn't start the DBUS daemon and NetBSD I can't answer for as they are a different OS.
Try running Chrome (not Chromium), Java and Java based apps, and Visual Studio Code on FreeBSD? I use these everyday. Until then FreeBSD will live ... in a VM
Great training video! One of the best I've seen. And, you install it exactly as I do.
I know a bunch of people that use OpenBSD as their daily driver / desktop (and of course also server) OS, it's definitely doable and not hard at all.
Thank you. I'd tried OpenBSD and ran into some issues, but it sounds like FreeBSD is the one for me, since I want to run a desktop. So far, so good. I'm a Linux guy, but wanted to try something different.
For desktop -next step it is very easy:
edit /etc/rc.conf
dbus_enable="YES"
hald_enable="YES"
lightdm_enable="YES"
pkg install mate mate-desktop
what each of those options does?
@@alexxx4434 he is enabling stuff to start up when he power on the pc and installing mate DE
@@akkakagooglrispoopkaka3759 I SEE THAT. I asked what each one does in detail.
There is an easier way. Type in terminal(Alacritty also works in FreeBSD) "sysrc dbus_enable=YES sysrc hald_enable=YES sysrc sound_load_enable=YES sysrc sddm_enable=YES sysrc snd_hda_load=YES" Almost everything(sound,mouse etc.) will work without problem. SDDM is the login screen, it installs "doas pkg install -y sddm" 🤣
Finally bsd content 🖤🖤🖤
I used FreeBSD exclusively from about 1996-2005 or so. It was always so frustrating that it never caught on as much as Linux. Oh well. At least Apple saw the talent of Jordan Hubbard.
Thanks so much! I just installed it! I love it already!
Replace "BSD" with "GNU/Linux", "NetBSD" with "Debian", "OpenBSD" with "Red Hat Linux", and "FreeBSD" with "Ubuntu", on 0:05 to 1:06 and you'll get the opinion of most windows users on Linux.
Finally some REAL UNIX 😈
Ooooh, *BSD. Gotta love that stylish installer, really brings me back. Maybe I should give FreeBSD a go, getting time to reinstall my main desktop soon.
I didn't know hank schrader was also interested in computers other than rocks and minerals! Anyways thanks for the video!
To me is better than many linux distros out there. I use freebsd with dwm as a daily driver and I can't complaint, they have linux-kernel translation layer so you can run whatever is made for linux-distros. I highly recommend it.
As soon as you get the base system installed just run: "pkg install desktop-installer". Then run it.
can you explain more in depth what it's about?
FreeBSD is only a good daily desktop driver if you're happy to have a system which is less secure than just about every other OS that isn't MS-DOS.
In 2017 they were still considering implementing exploit mitigations which every other OS has had for many.many years (Source: wiki.freebsd.org/DevSummit/201708/Security_mitigation)
In 2019 they finally introduced ASLR as an option but last I checked, not a default, unlike on every other major OS. Also, no proper W^X enforcement like Linux, Windows, macOS and OpenBSD has
As of 2021: They do not include Mandatory Access Control (MAC) lockdowns on key daemons by default, Fedora/RHEL had this for decades with SELinux, macOS has this with their sandboxing, OpenBSD uses pledge() and even Windows has Service Hardening Tokens. FBSD still does no cryptographic checks of application binaries at runtime and therefore has no solid means to block malware. No ransomware protection either (macOS blocks access to personal files by default, Windows has Controlled Folder Access, Linux has many ways to limit what apps can touch). Even worse, there's no per application network firewall, only standard per-port/IP firewalls.
If you're a desktop user, there's almost certainly no benefit to using FreeBSD over Linux, macOS or Windows in terms of performance, security, reliability or tooling. Choose something else.
On the server side of things:
FreeBSD is also a questionable choice for servers these days, since it lacks a proper secure impersonation API to allow processes to handle different user requests per-thread across a multi-domain environment which includes cross-domain trusts. This excludes it from many internal enterprise server roles, like large corporate file servers subject to proper auditing controls. Even ignoring that, not having common exploit mitigations baked in and relying on sysadmins to implement a combination of MAC lockdowns by hand across multiple, stacked modules makes it a bad choice for public-facing servers, where Linux does a much better job.
I only use FreeBSD for two things these days: NAS drives to hold encrypted backup data and pfsense network appliances. It is honestly an inferior choice for a lot of common roles these days.
I’m Running FreeBSD on my laptop, it runs well. Hardware support is not cutting edge like on Linux, but when it runs, it is rock stable.
No flaky hardware for us Remi :-)
My Thinkpad T470 took to freebsd like a duck to water :)
Thanks man for testing these systems ❤
If anyone is having trouble getting mouse support in a VM (VirtualBox), you need to add moused_enable="YES" to rc.conf and make sure the mouse service is running by running "sudo service moused restart." This seems independent of Window Manager and Desktop Environment since I had the same issue and fixed it for twm and xfce.
Most useful comment out here....giving solutions instead of opinions
Great video, though the *BSDs aren't strictly server operating systems at all! FreeBSD in particular kinda shines as one, but it is just as capable as the others as a desktop. What's the argument for them being server operating systems? They all have ports of pretty much every open source Linux desktop application, every WM, etc. They all have drivers for most hardware configurations you throw at it with some edge cases.
Also, you installed 11.4 which the base of which is kinda old, you should have gone with 12.1 :D
ZFS is one of the major arguments in favor of BSD on a server due not so much to its 128-bit nature, but to its security measures implemented by default.
Linux really suffers from a »not invented here« syndrome. I really think the supposed incompatibility of the CDDL with the GPL is regrettable.
Ay the same time, I feel they need it to push BtrFS as the only viable alternative. As Greg Kroah-Hartmann put it himself, he is »really sorry, but he couldn't care less, even if ZFS was the best file system ever invented«. As much as I love Linux, this is an idiot attitude, really.
Well, it's that or possibly getting sued unfortunately
@@spicybaguette7706 We'll see, now that Ubuntu and Manjaro offer the option of native ZFS support on the root partition.
i believe that both projects are now one, ZFS on linux.
In Freebsd you can find many programs that you can't even dream of on linux, for example: zfs, bhyve, jail. And if I'm missing something from linux.. I install it in bhyve or jail and done
Imagine if FreeBSD became the main OS instead of Windows, what would the Universe be like?
No aids, no wars, fully automated communism.
@@guyincognito5663 What?
@@bradleypearl2986 Exactly.
Pretty bad for everyone, as their crap license would enable big corps to make their enhancements propietary.
@@elimgarak3597 exactly
Thank you so much. It got me off the ground. Installed 13.1 from BD (iso does not fit in DVD)
It looks like you are using an EV RE27 microphone. Commonly used in broadcasting. I have used it for amateur radio and for narration of old 16mm home movies.
Thank you, Derek.
Oh boy, FreeBSD installation process is the same like it used to be 20 years ago! Still have to install GUI manually.
Try FuryBSD. It's FreeBSD 12.1 RELEASE but someone did the heavyweight and you can choose XFCE or KDE. It's like what Antergos or ArcoLinux is for Arch
I hope they can keep it going! As cool as the Fury name is, it’s super annoying when someone reports/talks about it and calls it FurryBSD (as in your favorite four-legged animal).
Edit: Oh UA-cam, will your markdown formatting *ever* work properly?
I'd have a FreeBSD installation, but it requires primary partitions (if I understand the docs correctly), and I have none to spare. However, Nomad BSD on a USB stick is pretty sweet.
classic setup from the 90s... all linux and others were like that.... nice!!
"Nobody uses TWM"
I beg to differ :D
If it exists, probably someone is using
then beg
I use it.... it's great wm.
@@RoboNuggie I know you do :D
Not even Tom would use TWM because reasons...
12:22 “nobody’s gonna use twm”. HEY!
FreeBSD is a gaming OS. Game consoles use it. In 2020, we got proton steam support. In 2022, it became a fancy and a race to make the ultimate gaming PC OS, yielding at leat 8% more fps than SteamOS and Arch. No systemd. Linux better catch up, FreeBSD is taking over. It can also run most everything made for Linux, natively.
not gonna happen until someone makes a bsd just works as a graphical desktop with a graphical installer.
Man stop coping Game consoles use it because it has a horrible stupid license if it was Licensed under GPL it would have been good.
Love the videos bro. Keep making quality content
Installing FreeBSD is the first step to winding up in jail.
I'll see myself out.
Ha, ha, ha!!!
Hope it got a good container...
@c6ampprobably referring to:
`The jail mechanism is an implementation of FreeBSD's OS-level virtualisation that allows system administrators to partition a FreeBSD-derived computer system into several independent mini-systems called jails, all sharing the same kernel, with very little overhead.'
~ wikipedia
@@orion55 That was a very unexpected answer, I had no clue. Thanks.
@@camthesaxman3387 I think I understand the differences, but between bsd and linux, what are they? Packages?
@@SunnyGabe Sorry for the late reply...it is something like: there was unix, then bsd was developed as a variation of unix, and after that linux was written "trying to imitate" unix but with different code because licenses and stuff... so basically they are different on many levels, but since they work similarly it's reasonably easy to adapt source from one to the other...I know I probably got some details wrong but I hope this explanation is enough
TWM (Tom's Window Manager) is fancy compared to the original window manager for X. UWM, Ultrix Window Manager. TWM replaced it in 1987.
I found and installed UWM to take a look. It had an octagon icon that was tricky to navigate.
It didn't have any appealing attributes so I removed it.
TWM is better but 3 xterms ?
Used to have a hugely hacked config for twm back in the university days, in first half of 1990:th. Changed both shell and WM a couple of times back then. To blody lazy this days for that.
I think Derek is finally seeing the light...
Linux is bloat! I'm positive DT will love FreeBSD if drivers don't bite him. I always found it more straightforward. Setting a static ip in Linux has turned into a chore!
@@avongil what? In what distribution do you have problem?
‘Nobody is going to use TWM anyway’
I use TWM.
On a daily basis.
😂😂😂
I am running OpenBSD on my Thinkpad. It is technically a desktop OS, but man it seems like everything is just harder. I can't run many of my programs. Others just behave weird like Firefox that still can't figure out it is my default browser.
no body whants to use tom's window manager except tom
If you like FreeBSD You should check out RoboNuggie's channel! I really like his content, his daily driver is FreeBSD and he does a bunch of FreeBSD and other BSD content!
Hey dt, would you like to make video about how lxqt is lighter than xfce and how it will replace it in near futute.
Great video and installation guide, thanks!
Sure it might have been easy to install it in a VM. But getting the open source amd driver to work on a UEFI installation is a PITA.
0:33 Hello from FreeBSD desktop on my laptop :DDDDDDDDDDD It's my daily driver OS :))))))))
Great video! Could you pls make a dedicated video on the pkg installer please? Your explanation is very straightforward and nice. I've heard that FreeBSD is a bit faster and secure than Linux. So i really want to try it out.
You should review nomad bsd. It runs entirely on flash drives. It is ment to go on any system.
Any UNIX derived system can be used for whatever purpose the end user has for it.
Once you install any variant of Linux or BSD, you have free reign over the whole system.
There are no real 'server' or 'desktop' UNIX systems, as in they can _only_ be used for
one or the other purpose. You can easily use Linux Mint or Elementary OS as a server OS,
or even use SUSE Linux Enterprise or OpenBSD as a home computer or workstation OS.
Sure, Linux Mint may be far more user friendly than OpenBSD, but they are equally capable.
It's better to say that FreeBSD and OpenBSD are more 'geared towards' server use, rather than
that they are 'server operating systems.'
And this is the moment the channel converts to a BSD channel
The most popular BSD OS is actually macOS
no
That's like saying ChromeOS / ChromiumOS is linux.
yup
man thank you so' much for this very well explained tutorial, ! sir you have schooled me :)
Wait...you're not a sysadmin?
Remind me of install Debian lenny back in the day. No real difference except on bsd, I start in the termial which I prefer. Type in startx to start your gui if memory serves. Good times.
Thx Sr. Just what I needed.
Killall twm
Openbox --replace
👍
As a server system, FreeBSD is divine. As a desktop I use Arch.....BTW!
DT, I'm surprised you are not more interested. Linux is bloat. Use BSD! I used to use it in 99 to early 2000s. It dominated servers back then. Enjoyed it more than Linux, but lack of drivers for consumer equipment forced me away. ZFS is the most awesome feature it has had over Linux up until recently.
Donald, it's not editing video that's the problem. There are plenty of FOSS video editors available for FreeBSD. My issue is everything that comes BEFORE the video editing...namely recording audio/video. The last time I tried to install a BSD on my production machine (installed GhostBSD like a year and half ago), I spent 4 days trying to get the cameras and mics to work. Finally got OBS to recognize my camera and capture device. But I never had a working microphone in those 4 days. Spent hours trying to figure out it out. Ultimately, after not making any content that whole time, I had to ditch that idea and go back to Linux. GhostBSD has undergone a lot of changes since then. Maybe it would work now. Maybe FreeBSD would work for me. But I know Linux works. ;)
The romance with the simplicity and elegance of BSD goes away as soon as you run into driver issues. It is sad, but DT has no chance of remaining sane with his new computer + FreeBSD. Arch is the next best thing to BSD if you ask me. Most of the elegance and an overwhelming amount of software and drivers that are super easy to install.
@@camthesaxman3387 In that case you can go with Manjaro which is based on Arch and releases only after dust settles on Arch
It’s actually quite a pain to get a usable desktop out of FreeBSD. From arstechnica.com/gadgets/2020/04/not-actually-linux-distro-review-freebsd-12-1-release/ :
With all of that said, let's get back to the hilarious masochism involved in installing
a FreeBSD desktop.
And it goes downhill from there...
Dt, my respects....Did you use FreeBSD-12.1-RELEASE-amd64-disc1.iso?
WOW! Finally!
dude, there is 12.1 and 12.2 incoming, how often does distrowatch update?
How to set up fullscreen mode? I already installed virtualbox-ose-additions and enabled vboxguest_enable and vboxservice_enable.
Why everyone always stops in the most important part of the installation of bootloader and session manager services ?
I thought it gonna be harder to install
It's kinda easy... I'd like to see how GNOME would perform on a non-systemD system like that.
I use Gnome 3.36 on OpenBSD. Works well! I haven’t tried Gnome on any other BSDs, and I don’t think it’s quite as up-to-date as on OpenBSD, but it should be available. FreeBSD has Gnome 3.28 iirc. I haven’t tried Gnome on illumos or Unix based operating systems. Similarly, non-systemd Gnome can be installed on Gentoo, although it requires a shim. Non-systemd Gnome is generally very performant and slightly lower in ram usage. Although being an unofficial release, one would have to talk to the package maintainer regarding any bugs or features.
Gnome 3 without systemd is extremely snappy and low in resources: around 500 MB of RAM after cold boot on Void and about 550 MB of RAM after cold boot on a pure Gentoo!!!
Serge whoa! That’s impressive. I need to try this! 😮
I liked freebsd 6.1circa 2008!
It comes with gnome,kde twm,fvwm and maybe some other desktops,and has a better partition manager them the current version.Although it is probably to old and limited for huge terabyte drives to format!
Version 12 or 11,It will not let me partition my drive my way,and if you use the auto install it takes the whole drive!
That's too much on a 1 or larger terabyte drive!
Not what I wanted .
I want a small os install,a large var or web space to run web pages or massive email server.Further to that I do not like the UUID disk identifier,prefer the old ssd/sda,sdb,sdc drive system etc!
Can it be reset to that blkid?
Freebsd 6.1 is a 32 bit os!Version 11 or 12 requires one to be online for a pkg and gui install !not everyone is online!
I used my cell phone or wifi on laptop to download version 11.
Pkg manager should come installed along with a gui and a better partition manager like gparted for freebsd!
Version 12 will not work on a Dell r240 server for some reason! I can't get past install or format part,I don't use checksum maybe that's the problem!
I've never bothered to figure out how to use checksum and downloads are usually fine without it, and I cant see a man in middle attacking an os download!
I hope Freebsd.org reads my comments as they seem out of touch with users and I don't see a comment page,have to go check!
Why has freebsd.org not included a desktop and pkg manager?
You want your Ubuntu Openbox distro? It was a pain to make. You only try to install lightdm, xorg and openbox, and it wants to install gnome-shell. Had to use the --no-install-recommends flag.
@Tatu already openbox distros for Arch and Debian
IMO you should always use the --no-install-recommends flag, as recommends are abused a lot in Debian. You could set it as default in apt.conf
FreeBSD is my 2nd fav after GNU/Linux. There are some great but also nasty attributes to freebsd but overall Linux wins in terms of good vs evil compared to freebsd.
Well, if you wanna be pracmatic - FreeBSD is a better structured system with a lot of better technical benefits.
Start your PDP-11's and VAX's. Because today we're going to run BSD UNIX.
Thanks
Imo, Freebsd is better system then any major Linux distro but drivers are problem.
Drivers are just getting to FreeBSD slower, but works fine when it gets there.
How I can install intel driver on FreeBSD (not xf86-video-intel)?
dedicated card or onboard video? for uhd630 the xf86 is ideal, but haven't used Intel dedicated gpus yet.. might have to check on that.
12:56 SPEEDS AREN'T FAST?? I get 60 kb/s on arch (to get mirrors I used a script that tested each mirror and picked top 2 fastest)
Since it uses the BSD kernel and so does OS-X, is it possible to get a FreeBSD desktop to install and run third-party OS-X driver-software packages for USB connected accessories?
Funny when it is said that *BSD are server OSes while watching this video on FreeBSD with xfce4 no problem whatsoever
10:43 doas is probably already installed.
Holy shit Derek installed a bsd
FreeBSD is up to 12.1
There is even Imunes OS based on BSD for networking simulator with GUI...
The last time I tried installing freebsd I wasted days trying to get internet working, never did
I have fully running DWM and there are no complications converting scripts to BSD, may sound more scarier than it is...
converting scripts? x)
@@tentaclearcade8087 yup. if your make file is located towards wrong directories
@@caubert oooh so just changing path. ;)
The only bsd I want is a bsd without demons... gib me fugu! xD (pufferfish)
But really though, the bsd projects I'm interested in is pfsense and freenas (though I'd rather learn how to make a nas with linux). I only see bsd as an os for specialized functions.
@Donald Mickunas We should work to disabuse the world of that silly notion :) On both counts.
eehhh... Well I think what makes it popular is what makes people remember it and I don't think that's a bad thing. Once they grow some interest about it, then they would research it. Though the demon thing really turns me off, I really don't like my software to be related to good/evil. sorry no sorry xD (still a linux newb, no bulli)
I cut my teeth on FreeBSD, Solid OS.
Gonna use this to make a blackm market at my school
Yes look at the BSDs on desktop
thanks good information