He managed to do something dumb, fake his death, and upload a terrible apology all within a few days. He's speedrunning being a tiktok influencer, this guy's going places
The fact that’s he’s presenting how he got infected and all the dangerous health complications with a smile on his face literally says everything. He’s there for the view count and he knows this is gonna increase it
If people start saying "He was very brave/smart for doing that" First off, your standard is low. Secondly, that guy would be remembered by many as "the idiot who gave himself tape worms". And if he's desperate enough, he'll get more infections just to keep the views until it becomes too sick for him or his audience.
Yeah, he had me going thinking he was a freak medical case, but he’s just a normal TikTok NPC. Literally so stupid he doesn’t understand basic animal survival instincts to not eat the live parasites in a fish
i thought commens help the algorythm, thats why most youtubers ask a question in the video tell you to comment it, not because they actually want to read it
My aunt is an ER nurse and surprisingly, things like this are common. People will eat things that aren't meant for consumption and are shocked when they have parasites, diseases and poisoning. One time, a bunch of teenagers went into an abandoned house and thought it would be funny to eat the decades old moldy food for UA-cam. Life is a strange thing
People have always been like this, it's just incentivized now. My mom's friend and his idiot buddies went swimming in a lake after being thoroughly warned about "brain-eating" amoebas in the water; the other guys got lucky but he died a fucking horrible death. That was before the Internet, let alone social media. They had no real motivation to take the risk. 🤷🏻♀️ Humans are natural selection's greatest failure.
He "died" faster than some people die from brain eating amoeba. I was under the impression that it takes many months for the worst case scenario of worms getting to vital organs, not less than a week to die with meds and medical attention.
Fish tapeworms take weeks to develop, and the only way they're really dangerous is if they cause chronic malnutrition. I think these were probably something similar to anisakis worms, which cause symptoms within hours. Neither are really all that dangerous, and with anisakis, you'll go to the doctor pretty soon after getting them. They burrow in to the walls of your GI tract, and it hurts a LOT. Remember, if the host dies, the parasite dies, so parasites don't generally kill their host.
I’ve seen prints of these really old ads selling tapeworms as a weight loss aid. These ads are from the 1920 - 1930s or so. They had some weird medicine in those days.
@@annenelson5656 They also marketed cocaine and meth as weight loss or hunger suppressants. Sold that shit over the counter. Housewives were *tweaking* 100 years ago.
What a coincidence! SmugAlana uploaded _"Atozy React"_ about YandereDev just 30 minutes ago, very close with this video's, and it's recommended right below this video.
I have an absolutely huge fear of worms and parasites (not earth worms, just the parasitic stuff) and I can’t even imagine thinking about eating the fish much less straight up eating the worms
you dont really need to worry all too much, its still no good, but parasites don't kill you they just eat your nutrients and waste and they can be easily killed with 1-2 tablets not whatever that guy showed
At this point, I genuinely think that all social media sites should come with mandated warning labels that tell users that prolonged use of social media may result in inhibited judgment and self-destructive behavior, the same way some countries put warning labels on cigarettes saying how your lungs will turn black if you smoke them.
I get what you're saying, but I don't think social media directly causes people to have impaired judgment. I think that social media amplifies impaired judgment in the people who already have problems with that. I've used social media for about 10 years now, every day, a lot, like too much, admittedly. but I would never ever do any of the things that people like this guy do
@@navigatingjxss I have to disagree. People typically underestimate how effective social influences have on individual behavior. A person's cognition will be radically affected if their brain is led to believe it will receive greater social rewards from engaging in self-destructive activity. You can take a completely normal person and expose them to a constant stream of social media activity and provide financial incentives for prioritizing attention-seeking behavior, and most people will fall prey to that temptation. The biggest mistake a person can make is to believe that they're too smart to fall this far. One who does that overestimates their own brain and underestimates the overwhelming power of social programming.
I mean this from the bottom of my heart- I’d rather light myself on fire than have a tapeworm. I regularly eat garlic in various forms and also papaya seeds because intestinal parasites can’t stand them, just in case. “Oh you think you can make yourself at home? I’ll take us both down, neither of us will get to use the digestive system, don’t try me.”
Tape worms dont stay in the digestive tract they can migrate to arms , spine and the brain There are people who've pasted away because the tape worm started eating away at the spinal disc
I love how he says 'I think i have got tape worms, i am concerned' with a smile like a toddler who just shat in his own mother's lap. Really sells how concerned he is
The most sickening thing is.. how positive and happy he looks. Like bro, you just ate tape worms and are like: "HAHAHA YOU BETTER DONT EAT TAPE WORMS😂😂😂"
@@splishsplash3492 i had the same question but we both know some people really be doing stuff like this. Like the guy who made his girlfriend shoot him thru a book
I genuinely can’t fathom how much damage platforms like TikTok, Twitter, Reddit, etc. have done to people. Every time I see someone do something stupid online, I want to live in this world a little less
My second greatest fear of all time is contracting a parasite. The idea of having any living thing less than fully sentient inside of me is fcking horrifying. And this absolute genius did it WILLINGLY
You have skin mites all over you, as well as bacteria that isn't inherent to the human body inside you that you got from swimming around in your mom's afterbirth (which includes poop). Parasites are cohabiting with your body right now, and some even help you out! Especially gut bacteria. Hope that helps!
@mopedgubbe1059 yeah but the thing is, those parasites are good and help contribute to our health. meanwhile we have the ones like in this video, and I 100% agree with the original commenter- I'm not trying to have some living sentient thing in me that'll cause me to live in the bathroom, or worse
@@lemonbreadutYou have billions of bacteria inside your body that are BAD and negatively impact your health. The good bacteria keep them at bay for the most part but some people have issues with bad guy bacteria getting out of control.
I think the biggest issue with the initial meal and what gave him the tapeworm was him putting the finished fillet literally on top of the uncooked fish with parasites in it. Theoretically, if you cooked the fish thoroughly enough at temperture for long enough you'll kill any eggs or larvae in the meat and even any adults at that point. (Pork is a great example of a meat that sometimes can be infectes with a certain type of parasite, which is why cooking it very thoroughly is very important just in case your meat was exposed.)
Trichinosis is the parasitic disease, caused by eating undercooked carnivorous game (coyote, wolf, bear) or undercooked pork (wild or domestic) infected with the Tichinella parasite
My dad told me to avoid eating freshwater bass in any season except the winter since they'd be right full of worms. Looks like he was right, if only this guy knew that.
I’m confused. As a fishmonger in a high-end culinary market, I know that people buy fish all the time that have parasites. It’s incredibly common. Thats why they need to be cooked to a certain temperature. Otherwise you could eat most fish raw (farmed salmon can be eatin raw because they have no chance of getting parasites from the kibble they are fed). So I think this is just a case of not cooking the fish to the proper temperature because if he had it would have killed the parasites making the fish safe to eat. Thats why he says in the video “I looked it up and if you cook the fish thoroughly the tape worms shouldn’t affect you” 1:34 Cheers to the folks that took the time to read!
Cheers to you too. I’m pretty sure the tape worms may have came from the fact he ate his cooked fish on a plate that had the raw tapeworm infected fish 😭😭😭 so probably cross contamination
To answer Charlie's bear áss question, bears eat a lot of salmon and since they always have tapeworms on them (when eaten raw), what happens over time is the tapeworms get so long that they excrete when the bear defecates and get stuck in there to live out their lives
Being an amateur historian, i know that intentionally getting tapeworms isnt new. But im still impressed that he did it dumber than the victorians, they at least sanitized their worms.
I’m so glad Charlie was also like, “I’ve never seen that beer clip” before and was also equally as offended to having been assumed to have seen it too. I’ve never seen that video and I was like “wtf do you mean everyone has seen it?”
@@ChrisShafferOfficial be quiet, you are probably busting to Charlies simply massive content right now. He has made you scream and cream as he fills you with entertainment.
So let me get this straight... The man intentionally eats a tape worm, then when he gets sick he questions whether or not he has a tape worm in his stomach? Yes, dummy, you have a tape worm in your stomach. That's where it went *after you ate it.*
Most tapeworms don't even cause symptoms 🫣 he probably has something else (Fr. The reason we (vets) even treat dogs and cats for tapes is because they are gross. The pets are fine)
TikTok audiences are pretty dumb, not entirely out of the realm of possibility that his would find it funny. Frankly not the dumbest gamble a TikTok influencer has ever made and, if we are being brutally honest, not even the dumbest thing a TikTok influencer has ever done. People film themselves committing actual crimes there. At least the only person in danger here was this idiot, and not some innocent person being threatened/harassed. TikTok’s bar is about as low as a limbo pole.
Found this guy on insta just now, saw the tape worm bit and instantly remembered him from this video. His current era on his page is brutally killing animals on camera and saying “oh guys they don’t feel pain” and “they’re not alive that’s just their nerves moving” after going Julius Cesar on their asses. Class act
@@ridgevolleyclips2199 I mean he did it in such a way that it was slow and definitely brutal, rather than quick and painless. He was making a spectacle over killing it.
@@causticscarab4155 not brutal, stop being a drama queen😂. that's exactly how u kill crabs, lobsters. those limbs moving are muscle cramps. its natural
I was actually really sad that he didn’t go through with the funeral open to the public. This is the perfect stealth meet up and, if he’s gone so far as to eat tape worms, he might as well go the rest of the way and hold a fake funeral for himself where he can jump out and join the party at some point during the wake. Wasted opportunity, smh.
I love how despite Charlie calling this guy a massive idiot, he still gave him props for showing him that bear with a tapeworm clip, even talking about just how interesting it is, lol
Probably round worms tbh. Most fish have them. They're usually removed, cooked out, etc. You can sometimes go to a fish market and find them inside the meat. That's why it's important to cook you fish thoroughly as the eggs are too small to see with a naked eye.
Those aren't tapeworms, which are in the intestinal tract (not the meat); the guts are always removed from fish & meat animals. Many fish (Cod, for example) have worms in the meat, which are killed by cooking. The doctor probably gave him anti-parasitics (like ivermectin) because they're incredibly safe & clean out many problems you get from fishing in waters of warm climates. I had awful gut distress after catching a bass in a FL pond (didn't eat it); doctor said it was likely a bacteria - so probably that's why the guy got sick (assuming he actually did).
thank you for this reply lol. i can't believe how people seem to straight up know nothing about tapeworms, like I don't think anybody in this comment section even knows what they look like apparently
Thank you so much, I just had this happen to me buying a store bought fish. These aren't tape worms, the colloquial name is cod worms. They die when cooked at the right temp. It did freak me out so bad of course! But I'm glad someone else said they weren't tape worms
@@misaetmi It looks a lot more like roundworms to me. They are semi-transparent and have no "head" area. They also aren't flat and segmented like tapeworms.
IF YOU EVER CATCH AND COOK AND NOTICE PARASITES... remove the parasite filled organ, put them in a baggie and freeze them... if there were eggs or parasites in the flesh, and you somehow missed them with cooking, you will have the exact parasite sample in your freezer if you need medicine you can bring a sample of what you ate that for sure has the parasites. Worms are common in wild fish guts, but there are so many you'll end up on 3-6 medicines if they dont know the target species. Always inspect wild caught fish.
@@thereoc they’re long, but thin and flat (hence why they’re called TAPEworms) so they coil up fairly small, to the point where even a large one can fit within the roughly 26 or so feet of the human intestinal tract
For those wondering, it's actually fine to eat MOST fish parasites if they're cooked properly. He served a cooked filet RIGHT next to the raw carcass. But ling cod, greenling, sea bass, flounder, halibut, Cabazon, salmon and trout often get worms and even tiny snails in their meat. Cook it thoroughly and avoid cross contamination and you're fine.
This is what I'm thinking as well. 100% safe to eat this bass but somehow he must have gotten some eggs due to cross contamination, but even so surely he must have rinsed/removed the tapeworms from the fish itself? And it's not like he ate the entire fish fillet and that the entire fillet was in contact with it. Either he actually faked getting tapeworms for views or he must've gotten eggs on his hands and not washed only to put his hands near his mouth and shit.
Where i live are some hundred parasitic fish worm species and just one is able to infect people if one cooks it to less then 50°C in middle. Also its babies in fish are invisible to human eyes in muscles of fish and it grows to visible forms only in some mammals. If he filmed this where i live all this would be fake most certainly.
Also, and this isn't important at all, the worms shown weren't tapeworms. They were fish roundworms, a class of parasite that is barely noticeable in humans at worst. There's never been a case of transference. You could actually eat THAT bass raw and likely not suffer any effects.
those aren’t actually tapeworms. they’re intestinal tract. most fish already have worms that r killed when u cook them. however when u kill any animal, its guts r removed for this reason
I'll say- the worms in the fish don't look much like tapeworms. Not flat enough. They look more like- some kinda roundworm. As well as that- theres only a few species of worm that will burrow into the eye, most notably the raccoon roundworm. I believe some species of tapeworm can eventually affect the eyes, as well as the brain, but it takes a long time and the infection going untreated for that to happen.
I think it could be trichanella... they are parasites that barrow into the muscles and tendons of a animal and is found most likely in bear, boar, pork and wild deer, so could have been a flood and the bass at the infected meat. It has also been known to be zoonotic. However, I think roundworm is the likely answer here. So I agree.
4:33 From what I recall from highschool biology, tape worms tend to be pretty long and flat (like tape, hence the name). Looking further into it, they anchor themselves to the intestinal walls of the host and absorb nutrients as it passes so they get about as long as your intestines will allow. They also can't produce their own lipids (which they need to reproduce so they are dependent on host) and detach when their uterus is full of eggs (it's a LOT of eggs, also tapeworms are hermaphrodites so if there isn't another tapeworm present, they can self-fertilize). So what we are seeing from that bear is a very pregnant tape worm. However I believe that species that the bear hosted is the aquatic variety which disperse there larva into the water (one reason you don't drink water from a lake/river/pond without thoroughly boiling) since the bear most likely got it by eating an infected fish, so those baby tapeworms probably didn't make it.
The momentum though! It's a masterclass of generating content. Viral clip > medical update > publicity stunt > apology video. All from one fishing trip.
@@KP_Gem I'm actually doing pretty good in life, no need to worry. I have good friends and family, strong social bonds with people. I drink a little more than I should but it doesn't negatively affect my behavior. All in all I'm very content.
6:48 I'm not even surprised lmao 💀. Literally before this I said "I wouldn't be surprised if he's faking it because Tiktokers are not above faking their won death" and I was right lmao.
Taking off warning labels ain’t gonna do shit except give idiots a chance to get rich. Warning labels aren’t just for safety, they make it so you can’t sue the company if you fuck up.
I thought it was probably fake--but then he said the doc said there was a tapeworm or some sort of parasite. The stool tests they use are fairly nonspecific, so the fact that he said the doctor gave a nonspecific answer actually makes me think he actually did get worms.
The biggest problem to this 'prank' is it was streched for too long. If his buddy had said he passed away and literally a second later he open the door to contront his buddy, pretty sure no one would have been mad.
I always appreciate UA-camrs putting a couple seconds before they show something nasty on screen. You've gained respect from me and my stomache Mr. White.
To win a Darwin Award, one needs only to remove themselves from the gene pool, and yes, most do so by dying. If this moron eats something that makes his nuts fall off for clout, he'll qualify. @@bsmoove1031
I like to think of Charlie as the Internet Newsman. He gives us the news of the present day and Internet Historian is sort of like if Internet Explorer was a newsman.
I was genuinely shocked and saddened when I thought he had actually died. I don't get how someone could fake something like that and then think it's funny.
yo Charles, the plot twists in this video are phenomenal keep up the work man.... My popcorn spilled 4 times in a row. I don't know how I kept eating that popcorn when hearing about tapeworms
He managed to do something dumb, fake his death, and upload a terrible apology all within a few days. He's speedrunning being a tiktok influencer, this guy's going places
"he wanted you to know" (telling details of his funeral), damn he planned it quick before dying
bro learned Tiktok career progression from the Kerbal Space Program School of Smashing Every Button Until Something Happens
And two of those things were the same video
Yeah some awful awful places
Probably the grave soon, knowing how all trends on tiktok go.
he'll forever be known as "that guy who ate tapeworms"
what a legacy
Until everyone forgets about him in a month like the gorilla glue hair lady
@@jrmtwI absolutely forgot about her
@@jrmtwwho?
Don't hold your breath. I'm sure there's plenty more stupid shit he's capable of for views.
@@jrmtw😂 you're goddammit right
Wow. The phrase "you are what you eat" really is more accurate than we thought
The parasite ate some parasites
For the future, you could leave the final explanation bit out. Spelling out the joke always detracts from the delivery. Great comment though
are you the comedy police@@Kyle_Schaff
@@ameliab5730self proclaimed comedy police
@@kanari-the worst type of joke police, explaining a joke which was just a punchline and saying the punchline was unnecessary 🙏
@@Kyle_Schafffar too critikal.
presenting to the emergency room... 🐟🪱
Good seeing you here! Love your videos!
A man ate parasite infested fish. This is what happened to his organs...
We getting a vid on this? 👀 /s
I had to stop watching your videos. They are great but I'm a hypochondriac
Emia = Presence in blood
The fact that’s he’s presenting how he got infected and all the dangerous health complications with a smile on his face literally says everything. He’s there for the view count and he knows this is gonna increase it
He looks goofy
If people start saying "He was very brave/smart for doing that"
First off, your standard is low.
Secondly, that guy would be remembered by many as "the idiot who gave himself tape worms". And if he's desperate enough, he'll get more infections just to keep the views until it becomes too sick for him or his audience.
Unironically “sup gamers today we’re gonna be eating some tapeworms straight from a bass”
As if he had no idea what he was talking about yet believing he was gonna get out of this without consequences.
Yeah, he had me going thinking he was a freak medical case, but he’s just a normal TikTok NPC. Literally so stupid he doesn’t understand basic animal survival instincts to not eat the live parasites in a fish
The worst part is that he is literally so joyous to tell everyone about how he is making his life so hard for no reason
where’s the guy with farts better than charlie’s farts?
@@dadogdoin1360 Off spamming on somebody else's videos, I imagine, not that it'll be missed once it gets shut down for good.
Women do that
@@Brodcwho hurt you
@@The_Guy_Who_Asked72He’s right thogh. There are people that give themselves tape worms to lose weight.
always ask tiktok comment section for medical advice rather than going to a doctor...what the fuck lol
I’m one of the only humans in this thread but I just wanna hop on the bot trend and say I am also better than Charlie ✅
Facts ticktock is the home of intellectual beings
i thought commens help the algorythm, thats why most youtubers ask a question in the video tell you to comment it, not because they actually want to read it
after the last 4 years I dont trust doctors.
Lmao American healthcare check ✅
the way he was smiling ear to ear while saying he had tapeworms id literally be screaming and crying if i found out i had a parasite
Frl I’d be making myself throw up to try and get it out of my stomach💀
like why the fk does he keep smiling? people on social media are weird man
fr, once when i was younger i THOUGHT i had one and just the possibility made me cry myself to sleep every night for almost a week
@@Hane_.._-someone on social media
A lot of people have them.. sadly
If the tape worm fed on his brain, it would’ve died of hunger.
Lmao
Nice one moisty member
Fr I don't care if I got a guaranteed billion views I'm still not doing it😂
"i got a brain parasite once, poor fella died of hungry"
@@TheRealSuperKirby exactly what I was thinking about
I'm not even surprised anymore. We have already seen how far people are willing to go for TikTok views, this is just natural selection at work.
bro u did NOT watch the video that fast 💀
@@skoosh4616You don’t need to watch when the title has TikTok
@@skoosh4616yea he didnt it took about 10 seconds to understand what was going on....
@Fourmann Be quiet, your probably jacking and busting merely to seeing Charlies massive video
@OfficerBMT Be quiet, your probably jacking and busting merely to seeing Charlies massive video
My aunt is an ER nurse and surprisingly, things like this are common.
People will eat things that aren't meant for consumption and are shocked when they have parasites, diseases and poisoning.
One time, a bunch of teenagers went into an abandoned house and thought it would be funny to eat the decades old moldy food for UA-cam. Life is a strange thing
@@whitehallminutt I don't give a flying fuck
@@whitehallminuttse u soon
@@whitehallminutt yep at your house
People have always been like this, it's just incentivized now. My mom's friend and his idiot buddies went swimming in a lake after being thoroughly warned about "brain-eating" amoebas in the water; the other guys got lucky but he died a fucking horrible death. That was before the Internet, let alone social media. They had no real motivation to take the risk. 🤷🏻♀️ Humans are natural selection's greatest failure.
Pfft, "HEY THERE SUBSCIBER NATION, TODAY I HEAD INTO THE EMERGENCY ROOM FOR A PLAUSIBLE CASE OF BOTULISM!"
This would make a great Meatcanyon sketch. The hollowness of the acting. The gruesome subject matter. He could easily cook up a banger with this.
69th liker (kill me)
@@Simplisti.THIS IS AMERICA 🇺🇸 🇺🇸🇺🇸🍔🍔🦅🦅🦅💥💥💥‼️‼️👴🏻👴🏻
@@Simplisti.VIVA MEXICO‼️ 🇲🇽🇲🇽🇲🇽🌮🌮🌯🌯☀️💯
@@Simplisti. FRANCE 🇫🇷 🇫🇷🇫🇷🥖🥖🥐🥐🥐🏆⚽️⚽️💥💥
@@P0ll_100 are you alright...
thank you for not censoring, you're a real one.
@Fourmann Be quiet, your probably jacking and busting merely to seeing Charlies massive video
@CrewmateComplexXP Be quiet, your probably jacking and busting merely to seeing Charlies massive video
@CrewmateComplexXPyour not💀💀💀💀💀 @Fourmann yu don't 💀💀💀💀
Where's the fart bot?
These bots goddamn
He "died" faster than some people die from brain eating amoeba. I was under the impression that it takes many months for the worst case scenario of worms getting to vital organs, not less than a week to die with meds and medical attention.
It. Probably varies from case to case
Fish tapeworms take weeks to develop, and the only way they're really dangerous is if they cause chronic malnutrition. I think these were probably something similar to anisakis worms, which cause symptoms within hours. Neither are really all that dangerous, and with anisakis, you'll go to the doctor pretty soon after getting them. They burrow in to the walls of your GI tract, and it hurts a LOT. Remember, if the host dies, the parasite dies, so parasites don't generally kill their host.
That's the thing, though. You know your stuff. His audience is likely a buncha kids and young adults that don't know anything.
I mean typically you wouldn’t start out with worms that big so it could have been faster 🤷♂️
I had a brain eating amoeba once, poor fella died of hunger
I honestly feel bad for the tape Worms that had to sit in a stomach filled with such a large amount of bullshit
Lmfaoo
I’ve seen prints of these really old ads selling tapeworms as a weight loss aid. These ads are from the 1920 - 1930s or so. They had some weird medicine in those days.
underrated comment
@@annenelson5656 They also marketed cocaine and meth as weight loss or hunger suppressants. Sold that shit over the counter. Housewives were *tweaking* 100 years ago.
Think his eyes are safe as even tapeworms wouldn't get through the amount of bs in his head
I dont look up "bear ass" either. But "bare ass" is a different story.
Lmao
yep only if you misspelled it
Guys, I need more research. I need to see "beer ass".
“I’m afraid I might have tapeworms in my stomach” says the man who ate tapeworms two days prior. Absolute big brain moment there.
What if the tapeworm has a tapeworm in its stomach and that tapeworm has a tapeworm in its stomach and it just keeps going like mirrors forever
@@_Listen_to_Solar_Kama_Sutra tapeworm TikTok is now going to live rent free in my head forever, thanks.
@@_Listen_to_Solar_Kama_SutraYeah.. tapeworms lay eggs and they get passed in the toilet
@@infinitehexingtonthat's fucking terrifying
@@infinitehexingtonuh 😢
Him: “I am extremely concerned”
Also him: can’t stop smiling while expressing his concern
Leaving a comment here so it's not only bots. What a pathetic display.
Charlie inspires me.. My parents said if i get 60K followers They'd buy me a professional camera for recording..begging u guys , literally
Begging...
@@ivon1671me too movement
What a coincidence! SmugAlana uploaded _"Atozy React"_ about YandereDev just 30 minutes ago, very close with this video's, and it's recommended right below this video.
It’s the clout drug.
tiktok moment
UA-camrs saying another platform is garbage. Imagine that (incoming UA-camr glazers)
@@EyeMaMoeRahnso?
@@EyeMaMoeRahn UA-cam is still miles ahead of TikTok though?
@@EyeMaMoeRahnPlease rot your brain with TikTok quietly please.
@@EyeMaMoeRahnI don't have to imagine cause it just happened. And it's true. Tiktok is far worse than UA-cam.
I have an absolutely huge fear of worms and parasites (not earth worms, just the parasitic stuff) and I can’t even imagine thinking about eating the fish much less straight up eating the worms
Then don't dare to eat stupid rare /medium bullcrap meat
Me too, I have bad obsession/compulsions with it
@@Your_Local_Bushmanno you don't, you just don't want to eat worms... like most people
If you eat fish you’ve eaten worms… they are all kinds of fish
you dont really need to worry all too much, its still no good, but parasites don't kill you they just eat your nutrients and waste and they can be easily killed with 1-2 tablets not whatever that guy showed
We need a world's stupidest social media disaster tier list.
Thank you for being a member. I'm proud of you. 🌈
ok
@@robertschnobert9090what
That’s not a bad idea. Maybe an internet hall of infamy.
That list would be unimaginably massive.
At this point, I genuinely think that all social media sites should come with mandated warning labels that tell users that prolonged use of social media may result in inhibited judgment and self-destructive behavior, the same way some countries put warning labels on cigarettes saying how your lungs will turn black if you smoke them.
@repzysyzoth208no it’s inhibited. Dis-inhibited judgement would mean normal judgement. Owned nerd.
@@nasaten "Disinhibition refers to the inability to withhold an inappropriate or unwanted behavior"
I get what you're saying, but I don't think social media directly causes people to have impaired judgment. I think that social media amplifies impaired judgment in the people who already have problems with that. I've used social media for about 10 years now, every day, a lot, like too much, admittedly. but I would never ever do any of the things that people like this guy do
@@navigatingjxssI agree. You point a stupid cannon at a stupid person and they get more stupid.
@@navigatingjxss I have to disagree. People typically underestimate how effective social influences have on individual behavior. A person's cognition will be radically affected if their brain is led to believe it will receive greater social rewards from engaging in self-destructive activity. You can take a completely normal person and expose them to a constant stream of social media activity and provide financial incentives for prioritizing attention-seeking behavior, and most people will fall prey to that temptation. The biggest mistake a person can make is to believe that they're too smart to fall this far. One who does that overestimates their own brain and underestimates the overwhelming power of social programming.
I mean this from the bottom of my heart- I’d rather light myself on fire than have a tapeworm. I regularly eat garlic in various forms and also papaya seeds because intestinal parasites can’t stand them, just in case. “Oh you think you can make yourself at home? I’ll take us both down, neither of us will get to use the digestive system, don’t try me.”
Fun fact, Garlic is also super helpful for relieving tooth pain
Tape worms dont stay in the digestive tract they can migrate to arms , spine and the brain
There are people who've pasted away because the tape worm started eating away at the spinal disc
@Fourmann Be quiet, your probably jacking and busting merely to seeing Charlies massive video
@@JcoleMc holy shit this comment made me shiver
@Fourmann Be quiet, your probably jacking and busting merely to seeing Charlies massive video
Hope he enjoys his 2.12 pay check from TikTok, he must feel so proud of what hes accomplished
I love how he says 'I think i have got tape worms, i am concerned' with a smile like a toddler who just shat in his own mother's lap. Really sells how concerned he is
The most sickening thing is.. how positive and happy he looks. Like bro, you just ate tape worms and are like: "HAHAHA YOU BETTER DONT EAT TAPE WORMS😂😂😂"
"Oops ! Looks like I lied about being dead 😂😂😂"
We need a new word for this, cringe isn't strong enough.
@@EugeneOneguineswindler, fraud, con-man
I doubt he actually ate it but who knows
@@TjallieBrrr he def didnt why would he
@@splishsplash3492 i had the same question but we both know some people really be doing stuff like this.
Like the guy who made his girlfriend shoot him thru a book
He's even got that voice you wanna punch.
His face just screams punch me
Charlie inspires me.. My parents said if i get 60K followers They'd buy me a professional camera for recording..begging u guys , literally
Begging...
@LordTommyParkyVEVOyeah right
@@namantherockstarhope you don't make it
A man with vocal fry... not much worse than that
*eats tapeworms*
"i think theres literally a tapeworm in my stomach"
you’re the biggest tapeworm to ever infest this planet
What is going on inside their brains….?
@@protection1391 prob that there might b a tapeworm in their stomach
@@burnerffx true, what do they expect what’s gonna happen 💀💀💀💀
I genuinely can’t fathom how much damage platforms like TikTok, Twitter, Reddit, etc. have done to people. Every time I see someone do something stupid online, I want to live in this world a little less
Social media is a fucking cancer.
@@kosmiquetell that to the brainrotted people still watching the stupid people in question
@@kosmiquesure we might stop, but the vast majority still will.
Dummies will be dummies. All these platforms do is capture it
no one ever did anything stupid before the internet. wildboyz and jackass never existed
My second greatest fear of all time is contracting a parasite. The idea of having any living thing less than fully sentient inside of me is fcking horrifying. And this absolute genius did it WILLINGLY
you have millions of microscopic organisms living in and on you right now. some percentage of them are benign parasites.
You have skin mites all over you, as well as bacteria that isn't inherent to the human body inside you that you got from swimming around in your mom's afterbirth (which includes poop).
Parasites are cohabiting with your body right now, and some even help you out! Especially gut bacteria.
Hope that helps!
@mopedgubbe1059 yeah but the thing is, those parasites are good and help contribute to our health. meanwhile we have the ones like in this video, and I 100% agree with the original commenter- I'm not trying to have some living sentient thing in me that'll cause me to live in the bathroom, or worse
@@lemonbreadutYou have billions of bacteria inside your body that are BAD and negatively impact your health. The good bacteria keep them at bay for the most part but some people have issues with bad guy bacteria getting out of control.
I have bad news for you bud, you have thousands of living things inside you right now.
I think the biggest issue with the initial meal and what gave him the tapeworm was him putting the finished fillet literally on top of the uncooked fish with parasites in it.
Theoretically, if you cooked the fish thoroughly enough at temperture for long enough you'll kill any eggs or larvae in the meat and even any adults at that point. (Pork is a great example of a meat that sometimes can be infectes with a certain type of parasite, which is why cooking it very thoroughly is very important just in case your meat was exposed.)
Trichinosis is the parasitic disease, caused by eating undercooked carnivorous game (coyote, wolf, bear) or undercooked pork (wild or domestic) infected with the Tichinella parasite
Hehe in case your meats exposed
@OfficerBMT This doesn't even make sense
@OfficerBMT😐
At a certain point it doesn't matter how much you cook it. You're eating bacteria shit even if the bacteria is dead
My dad told me to avoid eating freshwater bass in any season except the winter since they'd be right full of worms. Looks like he was right, if only this guy knew that.
Just avoid eating that in general.
Bass are good any season. you can very easily tell if the bass you are eating has worms, though so if you are suspicious just throw it away
i learned something new today
I’m confused. As a fishmonger in a high-end culinary market, I know that people buy fish all the time that have parasites. It’s incredibly common. Thats why they need to be cooked to a certain temperature. Otherwise you could eat most fish raw (farmed salmon can be eatin raw because they have no chance of getting parasites from the kibble they are fed). So I think this is just a case of not cooking the fish to the proper temperature because if he had it would have killed the parasites making the fish safe to eat. Thats why he says in the video “I looked it up and if you cook the fish thoroughly the tape worms shouldn’t affect you” 1:34 Cheers to the folks that took the time to read!
Cheers to you too. I’m pretty sure the tape worms may have came from the fact he ate his cooked fish on a plate that had the raw tapeworm infected fish 😭😭😭 so probably cross contamination
he ate it next to the raw parasites and ptobably had cross contamination
Cross contaminó
Yes, his infection is 100% due to cross contamination, I have zero doubts about it.
yeah it doesn't really seem like he was doing this specifically for views. the fact that he pretended he was dead is fucked up though
To answer Charlie's bear áss question, bears eat a lot of salmon and since they always have tapeworms on them (when eaten raw), what happens over time is the tapeworms get so long that they excrete when the bear defecates and get stuck in there to live out their lives
Eww
Yes
imagine you're walking through a forest and suddenly trip over a tape worm hanging out of a bear's anus...
They are regular round worms. Animals have a higher acidic level in their stomach which kills this. This is why humans do not eat raw flesh.
@@Username-f5p almost as if we aren't supposed to eat flesh..🤔
Being an amateur historian, i know that intentionally getting tapeworms isnt new. But im still impressed that he did it dumber than the victorians, they at least sanitized their worms.
He probably ate so many eggs....
He's the reason we need the "do not do this" signs for things that should be obvious not to do
I’m so glad Charlie was also like, “I’ve never seen that beer clip” before and was also equally as offended to having been assumed to have seen it too. I’ve never seen that video and I was like “wtf do you mean everyone has seen it?”
i wish i had seen it, it was a monumental tapeworm
I haven't either and assuming he saw that before eating the tapeworms why did he proceed with eating them knowing how bad it could get.
@@ChrisShafferOfficial be quiet, you are probably busting to Charlies simply massive content right now. He has made you scream and cream as he fills you with entertainment.
You’ve seen it now haven’t you?
So let me get this straight... The man intentionally eats a tape worm, then when he gets sick he questions whether or not he has a tape worm in his stomach? Yes, dummy, you have a tape worm in your stomach. That's where it went *after you ate it.*
@@whitehallminuttwho even are you bruh 😭😭
Yeah I pretty much said the same thing in my video 🤣 I did a video on this before Charlie and was hoping Charlie would say the same thing and he did
lmfao 😭 "thats where it went after you ate it" pls
missed opportunity to say "in your tummy" for the rhyme. ngmi
Most tapeworms don't even cause symptoms 🫣 he probably has something else
(Fr. The reason we (vets) even treat dogs and cats for tapes is because they are gross. The pets are fine)
The fact he thought people would actually take this as a lighthearted joke shows how delusional this guy actually is.
TikTok audiences are pretty dumb, not entirely out of the realm of possibility that his would find it funny. Frankly not the dumbest gamble a TikTok influencer has ever made and, if we are being brutally honest, not even the dumbest thing a TikTok influencer has ever done. People film themselves committing actual crimes there. At least the only person in danger here was this idiot, and not some innocent person being threatened/harassed. TikTok’s bar is about as low as a limbo pole.
Wow!!!
Found this guy on insta just now, saw the tape worm bit and instantly remembered him from this video.
His current era on his page is brutally killing animals on camera and saying “oh guys they don’t feel pain” and “they’re not alive that’s just their nerves moving” after going Julius Cesar on their asses.
Class act
Everyone kills crabs and lobsters like that though what do you mean?
@@ridgevolleyclips2199 I mean he did it in such a way that it was slow and definitely brutal, rather than quick and painless. He was making a spectacle over killing it.
@@causticscarab4155 not brutal, stop being a drama queen😂. that's exactly how u kill crabs, lobsters. those limbs moving are muscle cramps. its natural
@brhead thank u
Charlie should buy all social media platforms.
@OfficerBMTwut first warning
@@SussyRobloxLord Be quiet, your probably jacking and busting merely to seeing Charlies massive video
@OfficerBMT Be quiet, your probably busting and jacking to seeing Charlies massive video
@@SussyRobloxLord Be quiet, your probably jacking and busting merely to seeing Charlies massive video
@Fourmann Be quiet, your probably jacking and busting merely to seeing Charlies massive video
The fact he’s smiling while saying all the bad stuff thats happening to him is crazy
I was actually really sad that he didn’t go through with the funeral open to the public. This is the perfect stealth meet up and, if he’s gone so far as to eat tape worms, he might as well go the rest of the way and hold a fake funeral for himself where he can jump out and join the party at some point during the wake. Wasted opportunity, smh.
I doubt the funeral parlor would appreciate that.
Wow!!!
I love how despite Charlie calling this guy a massive idiot, he still gave him props for showing him that bear with a tapeworm clip, even talking about just how interesting it is, lol
Probably round worms tbh. Most fish have them. They're usually removed, cooked out, etc. You can sometimes go to a fish market and find them inside the meat. That's why it's important to cook you fish thoroughly as the eggs are too small to see with a naked eye.
Those aren't tapeworms, which are in the intestinal tract (not the meat); the guts are always removed from fish & meat animals. Many fish (Cod, for example) have worms in the meat, which are killed by cooking. The doctor probably gave him anti-parasitics (like ivermectin) because they're incredibly safe & clean out many problems you get from fishing in waters of warm climates. I had awful gut distress after catching a bass in a FL pond (didn't eat it); doctor said it was likely a bacteria - so probably that's why the guy got sick (assuming he actually did).
thank you for this reply lol. i can't believe how people seem to straight up know nothing about tapeworms, like I don't think anybody in this comment section even knows what they look like apparently
Thank you so much, I just had this happen to me buying a store bought fish. These aren't tape worms, the colloquial name is cod worms. They die when cooked at the right temp. It did freak me out so bad of course! But I'm glad someone else said they weren't tape worms
Really? He filleted the fish himself and the area looked like worms or GI tract to me
I have no idea though. Is that what cod worms look like?
Wow!!!
@@misaetmi It looks a lot more like roundworms to me. They are semi-transparent and have no "head" area. They also aren't flat and segmented like tapeworms.
Let me get this right...
He *cooked* the fish and then **PUT IT NEXT TO THE UNCOOKED FISH** ?!
What's the point of cooking it in the first place then?
Cross contamination. Guy is clearly not an avid cook
yeah i dont think he was smart enough to know how dumb that was@@straightfuckingwater389
Bro fuck that. He SAW TAPEWORMS and kept EATING.
Personal assurance.
@@straightfuckingwater389 Or even a macdonald's trainee
I've never regretted watching youtube while eating so much in my life
Drain Addict
I can't tell you how excited I get when Charlie releases a new video of him shitting on crappy tiktok creators
Didnt ask. I made a Hilarious video of a woman crying about her dog being put to sleep because my content is far superior 😌 🤧
@Fourmann Be quiet, your probably jacking and busting merely to seeing Charlies massive video
@@ChrisShafferOfficial Be quiet, your probably jacking and busting merely to seeing Charlies massive video
@CrewmateComplexXP Be quiet, your probably jacking and busting merely to seeing Charlies massive video
same
IF YOU EVER CATCH AND COOK AND NOTICE PARASITES...
remove the parasite filled organ, put them in a baggie and freeze them... if there were eggs or parasites in the flesh, and you somehow missed them with cooking, you will have the exact parasite sample in your freezer if you need medicine you can bring a sample of what you ate that for sure has the parasites.
Worms are common in wild fish guts, but there are so many you'll end up on 3-6 medicines if they dont know the target species. Always inspect wild caught fish.
or just... don't eat the fish with parasites.. that'd be easier
Tapeworms can get pretty big. Average is “only” from 4-28 inches, but the largest on record in a human was 82 feet
How
@@thereoc they’re long, but thin and flat (hence why they’re called TAPEworms) so they coil up fairly small, to the point where even a large one can fit within the roughly 26 or so feet of the human intestinal tract
@@thereoc your intestines are a very long tube folded in on itself
@@alaranarmstrong3718 Ik that alr but 82 feet is crazy
WHAT THE FUCK PLEASE
I died when Charlie got to the tapeworm bear and was like “I’m not looking up bear ass.” 😂😂😂
For those wondering, it's actually fine to eat MOST fish parasites if they're cooked properly. He served a cooked filet RIGHT next to the raw carcass. But ling cod, greenling, sea bass, flounder, halibut, Cabazon, salmon and trout often get worms and even tiny snails in their meat. Cook it thoroughly and avoid cross contamination and you're fine.
This is what I'm thinking as well. 100% safe to eat this bass but somehow he must have gotten some eggs due to cross contamination, but even so surely he must have rinsed/removed the tapeworms from the fish itself? And it's not like he ate the entire fish fillet and that the entire fillet was in contact with it.
Either he actually faked getting tapeworms for views or he must've gotten eggs on his hands and not washed only to put his hands near his mouth and shit.
Where i live are some hundred parasitic fish worm species and just one is able to infect people if one cooks it to less then 50°C in middle. Also its babies in fish are invisible to human eyes in muscles of fish and it grows to visible forms only in some mammals. If he filmed this where i live all this would be fake most certainly.
Also, and this isn't important at all, the worms shown weren't tapeworms. They were fish roundworms, a class of parasite that is barely noticeable in humans at worst. There's never been a case of transference. You could actually eat THAT bass raw and likely not suffer any effects.
I like how excited he looks cuz he can announce that he has tapeworms from literally eating tapeworms
those aren’t actually tapeworms. they’re intestinal tract. most fish already have worms that r killed when u cook them. however when u kill any animal, its guts r removed for this reason
Wow!!!!
Getting tapeworms are in my top 5 fears ever since I saw that tapeworm episode of Mr. Meaty. So it's actually insane to see someone do it willingly
Mr. Meaty sure was… an interesting show lmao
@@KrigtoofarI was thinking of that exact scene when I found out what this video is about.
It doesn't matter that much if you catch it early, I bet he had it checked right away. It's definitely a dumb thing to do though.
Literally how I learned about tapeworms and I've been scared ever since
@@BenT800 this guy gets it
“I’m not looking up bear ass.” 😂😂😂
Honestly, I wouldn't be surprised if people are going to start recording themselves eating death cap mushrooms to get those sweet juicy TikTok views.
Death cap no cap frfr am I right?
I'll find the door myself
I'll say- the worms in the fish don't look much like tapeworms. Not flat enough. They look more like- some kinda roundworm. As well as that- theres only a few species of worm that will burrow into the eye, most notably the raccoon roundworm. I believe some species of tapeworm can eventually affect the eyes, as well as the brain, but it takes a long time and the infection going untreated for that to happen.
scrolled down for this comment. not tapeworms
It looks like some kind of Anisakis type nematode. Also parasitic, but not a tapeworm. I too, was looking for this comment 😅
Agreed. Not tapeworm. Roundworm. I'd be much more afraid of roundworm than tapeworm.
I think it could be trichanella... they are parasites that barrow into the muscles and tendons of a animal and is found most likely in bear, boar, pork and wild deer, so could have been a flood and the bass at the infected meat. It has also been known to be zoonotic. However, I think roundworm is the likely answer here. So I agree.
@@ThePyroWaffleswhy?
Charlies reactions are just so pure. 6:55 just hits different. Got me crackin like whole 10 to 15 minutes
Nick faking his death is such a disgusting thing. I actually felt bad for him for a second
same it is honestly so fucked up when people do shit like this.
I also felt bad for him for a second. What a piece of shit.
4:33 From what I recall from highschool biology, tape worms tend to be pretty long and flat (like tape, hence the name). Looking further into it, they anchor themselves to the intestinal walls of the host and absorb nutrients as it passes so they get about as long as your intestines will allow. They also can't produce their own lipids (which they need to reproduce so they are dependent on host) and detach when their uterus is full of eggs (it's a LOT of eggs, also tapeworms are hermaphrodites so if there isn't another tapeworm present, they can self-fertilize). So what we are seeing from that bear is a very pregnant tape worm. However I believe that species that the bear hosted is the aquatic variety which disperse there larva into the water (one reason you don't drink water from a lake/river/pond without thoroughly boiling) since the bear most likely got it by eating an infected fish, so those baby tapeworms probably didn't make it.
I do biomed at uni and yeah they're either very juvenile or a different parasite possible a type of helminth
I just hope the bear’s okay 😔 but thanks much for the info
It looks like the bear is lethargic, so hopefully the animal humane society at least gave it anti parasitic medication near where it usually eats at
Thanks bro
@thepubknight6144 I'm choosing to believe this is definitely what happened, and the bear is completely healthy and fine after it.
The momentum though! It's a masterclass of generating content. Viral clip > medical update > publicity stunt > apology video. All from one fishing trip.
It’s actually a common thing that people eat tape worms for weight loss, but knowingly seeing them and eating them regardless is beyond me
80.000 parasites and no medication let me fix that
80.000 parasites and no medication let me fix that
80.000 parasites and no medication let me fix that
80.000 parasites and no medication let me fix that
@OfficerBMT tf are you on about
Thank God, I was about to eat a whole big bowl of tape worms until he told me not to
I genuinely don't think tapeworms could survive in my body with the sheer amount of alcohol I consume.
😂😂
Sad tbh
@@KP_Gem I'm actually doing pretty good in life, no need to worry. I have good friends and family, strong social bonds with people. I drink a little more than I should but it doesn't negatively affect my behavior. All in all I'm very content.
GIVE THIS MAN HIS KEYS
@@TheChosennn 😂😂😂
Charlie's reaction at 6:57 is to die for xD
"Played us like a damn fiddle!" Lol
LIKE A FIDDLE 😭😭😭😭😭
4:15 what a wacky one huh
Bahahaha
“I read that if you cook it thoroughly enough the tape worms won’t be an issue.”
*places the cooked fish touching the wet raw tapeworm fish*
2:50 “mildly concerned”
“im kind of afraid i need a medical professional 👌🙂“ in the calmest voice ever
7:10 You know it's bad when even Charles is speechless
6:48 I'm not even surprised lmao 💀. Literally before this I said "I wouldn't be surprised if he's faking it because Tiktokers are not above faking their won death" and I was right lmao.
didn't take a genius to guess this
4:50 instructions unclear, ate tapeworms out of a trout
Instructions even more unclear. Ate a 30ft tapeworm out of a bears ass💀
@@Buzzbot- we all make mistakes in the heat of passion, jimbo
Thats how you get the superpowers.
Time to take the warning labels off things for a year and let the problem sort itself out
For real though. And lets get the Ebola trend going.
Preach.
Do they even read the warning labels?
Taking off warning labels ain’t gonna do shit except give idiots a chance to get rich.
Warning labels aren’t just for safety, they make it so you can’t sue the company if you fuck up.
Nick really wants that Darwin award.
Nice Goonies profile pic
He needs to try a little harder.
that goes to cameron robbins
Yeah 1st place award
He definitely won it this year such a dumbass
This man is truly a hero -- single handedly taking out the tapeworm population one tapeworm at a time... beautiful
6:17 the fact that they lied tho CRAZYYY 😭
I thought it was probably fake--but then he said the doc said there was a tapeworm or some sort of parasite. The stool tests they use are fairly nonspecific, so the fact that he said the doctor gave a nonspecific answer actually makes me think he actually did get worms.
shit pics or it didn't happen!
I feel if he didn't put the cooked fish next to the raw tape worm fish he wouldn't have gotten tape worms.
The biggest problem to this 'prank' is it was streched for too long. If his buddy had said he passed away and literally a second later he open the door to contront his buddy, pretty sure no one would have been mad.
I like my fish riddled with tapeworms bruh
3:58 GOOD GOD WHAT HAPPENED TO FREDDY???
he ate too many fat kids with tapeworms
@@Davidpoland2005 HAR HAR HARHARHAR
2:38 the TASTE worms
0:35 I sometimes hate having this name
you'll forever be my favorite youtuber. the way you describe stuff is so fucking funny
I always appreciate UA-camrs putting a couple seconds before they show something nasty on screen. You've gained respect from me and my stomache Mr. White.
I love that Charlie gives credit to all of the creators.
Give this man a Darwin Award 🥇
He didn’t die tho lol
@@JoseMolina-jz9hh 😊
You don’t even know what Darwin reward is you just see people comment it. It’s only a Darwin award if he actually died. But he didn’t.
To win a Darwin Award, one needs only to remove themselves from the gene pool, and yes, most do so by dying. If this moron eats something that makes his nuts fall off for clout, he'll qualify. @@bsmoove1031
Unfortunately he didn’t really die.
Yk TikTok has really taught me that common sense really isn’t as common as it should be
I like to think of Charlie as the Internet Newsman. He gives us the news of the present day and Internet Historian is sort of like if Internet Explorer was a newsman.
I was genuinely shocked and saddened when I thought he had actually died. I don't get how someone could fake something like that and then think it's funny.
he is the type of guy who will download a exe on mail and run it thinking it installs more ram
“With the ultimate goof..” Charlie you crack me up so much. Thank you man 😂
Charlie never letting Dino Spumoni die will forever be one of the greatest running jokes on this channel 💀
Yeah I’m sorry Charlie but the moment I heard “this guy is eating tapeworms” I can NOT watch this without getting sick myself
Didnt ask. I made a Hilarious video of a woman crying about her dog being put to sleep because my content is far superior 😌 🤧
Omg the clip of the bear with the tapeworm made me want to vomit (spoilers for anyone who hasn’t seen it yet)
spoilers: theres a part where he pulls them out his bum 🤢
@@UnCreativeDeconstructionism wow! That’s awful!
@@squishy3248 same dude. I always have to go do whatever after seeing that to get it off my mind lmao
Aw dawg… I sit down to eat with your videos and I did NOT expect this ☹️ thank you Charlie 😌
same here :c
damn these bots, youtube be removing dislikes but can't remove actual bad things like this lmao
@@canteensupplier9084 FR
same
s(h)ame
"A lesson I didn't think anyone needed to be taught" hahahahaha, for real though
yo Charles, the plot twists in this video are phenomenal keep up the work man.... My popcorn spilled 4 times in a row. I don't know how I kept eating that popcorn when hearing about tapeworms
It's truly amazing how in this era we can watch natural selection take place in real time.
I love how often Charlie references Hey Arnold in his videos. A man of culture.
DINO SPUMONI
Tik Tok don't even surprise me at this point