Versus Series: Anakin Skywalker Vs. General Grievous (Re-upload)
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- Опубліковано 24 сер 2024
- Clearly due to the sample audio from the 2003 Clone Wars microseries that I included in the final edit, the original upload of Anakin Skywalker versus General Grievous has been blocked. Fortunately, I still have the project file saved in my editing software, which made re-editing exceptionally easy. Furthermore, I decided to take this opportunity to re-record the voiceover, as the original audio was taken while I was dealing with some microphone troubles. However, I will be following the original script, as my opinion on this match-up has not changed.
As I stated in the original, my overall analysis will be based purely upon pre-2008 Legends continuity material, specifically omitting the 2008 Clone Wars animated series. In essense, the numerous and arbitrary retcons of TCW took what was previously one of the most tightly plotted and internally consistent timeframes within the Expanded Universe, where every event and storyline was given an exact date down to the week, and reduced it to a muddled sliding scale continuity defined by simplistic and contrived plotlines centered around a childish moral.
Where the original Clone Wars microseries kept its portrayal of Anakin Skywalker consistent with the films while also going a long way towards salvaging that version of the character, TCW reduced Anakin to a bland heroic charicature, with only the most token lipservice paid to his emerging Dark Side tendancies, and he was otherwise almost completely sidelined in favor of Ahsoka Tano. As for General Grievous, his portrayal remains consistent with the films in the worst possible way, continuing his downward spiral into ineffectual slapstick villainy. Even the episodes where he is meant to be taken seriously reduce him to fleeing for his life or play his dismemberments for laughs.
But more than anything else, my intention with this match-up is to cater to my generation of Star Wars fans, the children of the nineties who grew up with the Prequel Trilogy. This is Anakin Skywalker and General Grievous as they were for someone stepping into the cinema in 2005 after just having finished watching the Clone Wars microseries.
My analysis of Anakin Skywalker and General Grievous will be drawn from their appearances in the Star Wars prequel trilogy, including the novelizations, comics, and visual dictionaries, the Clone Wars microseries and its tie-in digest comics, the 2002 Clone Wars video game, the Star Wars: Republic comic series, the General Grievous comic miniseries, the Visionaries anthology, and the New Essential Guides to Chronology, Alien Species, Droids, Weapons and Technology, and The Force, among many others.
Anakin Skywalker and General Grievous, accomplished warriors and murderous butchers, with hands drenched in blood.
If these two titans of the Clone Wars ever met on the battlefield, who would win?
References & Citations:
The New Essential Guide to Characters - Anakin Skywalker/Darth Vader, Pg 155 - [09:04]
The New Essential Guide to Droids - General Grievous, Pg 196 - [16:57]
The Dark Side Sourcebook - Chapter Five: Dark Side Traditions - Darth Vader, Dark Lord of the Sith, Pg 91 - [19:41]
Lightsabers: A Guide to Weapons of the Force - Anakin Skywalker and Luke Skywalker, Pg 48 - [29:04]
Fightsaber: Jedi Lightsaber Combat (article) - [30:21], [30:31], [33:19]
The Complete Visual Dictionary - [11:19], [14:04], [29:24], [29:49], [35:52]
Attack of the Clones (novelization) - Chapter 8 - [21:28]
Jedi Trial - Chapter 9 - [11:46], [33:50]
Labyrinth of Evil - [13:35], [13:39], [27:17], [34:20], [39:03], [39:19], [39:40], [40:13], [41:16], [43:14], [43:36], [47:01]
Revenge of the Sith (novelization) - [09:52], [10:14], [16:12], [20:14], [20:52], [21:14], [21:46], [30:53], [31:41], [36:04], [36:15], [37:55], [38:15], [38:40], [40:47]
Dark Lord: The Rise of Darth Vader - Part IV: Kashyyyk - Chapter 43 - [17:23]
Star Wars Tech (documentary) - Rob Coleman, animation director, "Episodes I, II, III" - [13:06]
Clone Wars Chapter 22 - [42:01]
Catalogue of Darth Vader's amputations - [11:55]
I'm just a little disappointed that you left out:
"Anakin Skywalker vs General Grievous is a fight that I think we all can agree should have happened. Some of you have asked me if it's possible for me to make a video without complaining about TCW - and my answer is "no" - it's my video, I can do what I want."
Lol that line was great. A shame Jensaarai1 left it out.
Don't always agree with the verdicts but... that line hit real close to home. It's a channel for the more hardcore fans as opposed to the cash in channels like 'star wars theory' that have clearly never read any material.
@@MrSnakekaplan Agreed.
ua-cam.com/video/a1ezl5wDrlw/v-deo.html
@@Jensaarai1 Ask and Jensaarai1 delivers.
I have mixed feelings about TCW anakin. On the one hand it’s the version of the character I think everyone originally wanted to see in the films and is more sympathetic, but it’s impossible to deny that the micro series version gives anakin a deeper emotional depth while maintaining his film portrayal and in a way improves that version of the character we were given.
Agreed. Some friends of mine call tcw Anakin "gary stu Anakin" lol.
Mix of Both honestly. Also Gary Stues never lose, never give in to temptations, always do the right thing?
Anakin is far from that.
@@Nephalem2002 Filoni just straight up skipped his development and worse gets praise by TCW fan boys for it
@@laisphinto6372 Agreed for the most part. We don’t even get to see what led to Anakin becoming a Jedi Knight so early in the war. In fact, there’s a lot of things we never got to see. Like how Obi Wan and Anakin became familiar with Asajj Ventress in this new canon.
@@laisphinto6372 Wdym skip his development? Did you even watch the show at all? He progressively got more aggressive and questioned the Jedi more as the series went on, and he had even more of a reason to then the original ever did.
Obi-Wan: “Anakin, this hand is your life.”
Anakin: “Meh.”
Anakin's right arm has been through a LOT of amputations, hasn't it...
Technically his right arm only went through one dismemberment. All the replacement parts after, yeah they got put through the wringer.
*Jensaarai reuploads*
"It's an older one sir, but it checks out"
This is elite
@@hiqpandorasbox9970 *tips fedora*
Hi jensarai1 I’ve been watching your videos since I was just 9 years old I’m 16 and about to be 17 in 8 days I would just like to say thank you for making these videos and keeping up the good content. You have taught me so much about Star Wars and I would just like to say thank you and may the force be with you.
Thanks man
Started watching around 14 I think... I'm 20 now
Happy birthday Samuel 🍺🍺🤘🤘
Similar for me. Started when I was 9 or 10 or so, and am gonna turn 19 in August. His channel also introduced me to the Expanded Universe, characters like Exar Kun, Malgus, Krayt, etc. His channel is a big part of my development as a star wars fan
@@theoldhermit2601 yep same here thanks to him Darth Malgus has been one of my favorite Sith Lords for awhile now
There's a reason why Palpatine would never allow Grievous and Anakin to meet in a ground battle. Fearing his prized monster would kill his ultimate apprentice.
Lol theres a bot on this one year old video
Yet Sidiious had no issue of pinning Anakin against Dooku who was even more powerful and deadly then Grievous.
@@matthewmann8969
the context for anakin and dooku’s battle was considerably different.
1. Sidious knew anakin would have help from kenobi when facing the count.
2. Much more importantly, Sidious actually gave Dooku instructions to not kill anakin. And goaded him into thinking they’d recruit him into a another acolyte esqe lackey once he was pushed into using the dark side.
@@GreaterGrievobeast55dooku was still trying to fight him near the end as he realized he couldn’t handle anakin power
@@GreaterGrievobeast55I mean still near the end dooku was quite literally fighting for his life
One issue I have with Anakin Skywalker in Legends is ironically the same one I have with his TCW counterpart: his knighting is in the wrong place. If TCW made Anakin turn into his RotS version far too quickly, then Legends made it happen too late. Simply put, by making Anakin's knighting 2 and half years into the war, it stunts his character by making him just a slightly more mature version of his AotC. Then with his knighting, he magically gets hair style change and shifts completely as a character in just 6 months. If Jabiim couldn't change Anakin substantially over two years, then 6 months ain't gonna do it either.
Worse, it contradicts the Micro Series depiction, as it is made very clear that his knighting in the show happens right after the Battle of Hypori as a response to General Grievous' appearance and the lack of active Jedi Knights. I think a better solution would've been to just follow Tartakovsky's depiction, and have his knighting happen at the end of the first year of the war; giving him two years of independent command to slowly turn him into his Revenge of the Sith self.
Additionally, it makes his demand in the movie to be made a master even more ridiculous: he's only be a Knight for months and now he wants to be a Jedi Master? It makes more sense for him to have been a Knight at least for a few years before making such a demand.
Hold on, where does it say his Knighting in TCW happened two years into the war? It's always been a common estimate his Knighting still happened around the same time as his 2003 counterpart. TCW started only about a year into the war.
But isn't that what happens? Wasn't he knighted right after ep 2 than had three years to develop into rots anakin?
It was a shame, the old video got deleted.
But its awesome you re uploaded this.
And oh my, a new TCW rant. Nice.
As for this specific matchup, my stance hasn't changed, this is still a coin toss.
Thank you for the heart Jensaarai1!!!
Btw, while my memory of your original isn't perfect, I do notice some differences in your dialogue.
Previously you called Grevious being a mix of Lucian Draay and Exar Kun and now you consider him a mix of Dooku and Kun.
In general, I like these changes.
@@robgeorge4581 I absolutely love every rant he comes up with. I actually enjoy some episodes of the series but they handled certain characters poorly.
I respectfully disagree about Anakin's utilization of the force in this fight, ESPECIALLY if its late - Clone Wars Anakin. Not only has Anakin been shown to effectively utilize the force in a fight against a physically superior opponent, but he's used it creatively and while enraged. A good first example of this being his win over Durge that was briefly referenced.
First Anakin used the Gen dai's own explosives against him via telekinetic throw. Then Anakin lurged the staggered Durge to an escape pod which he then force propelled into a star. Durge is easily comparable to Grievous in strength and speed, but has better durability and endurance due to his insane healing abilities. Grievous offers nothing that Durge didn't already bring to the table, except lightsabers.
Then you have Anakin's round 2 fight against Asajj Ventriss, where as you suggested Anakin's mental and emotional weakness was exploited by her Dun Moch. BUT instead of doubling down on swordplay as theorized, Anakin just started using the force to finish her. So Grievous getting into Anakin's head isn't going to circumvent his force powers either.
Really the only exception to this is Anakin's fight with Obi Wan on Mustafar, which quite frankly is more due to PIS than any advantage Kenobi had. We all know that plot demanded Obi Wan to survive another couple decades. Otherwise Anakin would simply break Obi Wan's force barrier, like other less powerful force users have and then ragdoll his former master. After which Anakin would shuffle on over to Sidius and call it a night. But like "TPM Maul vs Kenobi", Plot>>>>>>Logic.
its almost like he's biased towards a non-movie prime grievous. All imma say is if you re watch the obi wan vs grievous fight, you'll see how he swings first and thinks later. And if Anakin lasted that long against Obi wan(arguably stronger than him actually), then what would that tell you
@@jpraise6771 i’m confused by your statement of “non-movie prime grievous.” Are you saying movie grievous should be used when it’s more than likely not his prime condition given his recent ling injuries within legends? I might need to rewatch the video again but I thought he was taking the ROTS novel fight into consideration as well, which his move set could be argues as being more thought about albeit still wild. More importantly though he was going much _much_ faster than he was in the movie version as well.
@@GreaterGrievobeast55 yeah I was saying the movie version is the true cannon of grievous, and using the fact that obi wan had defeated him so handedly to prove Anakin's superiority
Hey Jensaarai, just to let you know, I had a copyright claim on one of my videos for a clip I used of Anakin's knighting in CW and I disputed it and won. You might be lucky too, just for future reference
Oh hey ! Fancy meeting you here !
Yes, the Maus keeps being a scumbag....
What I don’t understand is, why is the house of mouse concerned about you or Jensaarai1 using a clip from a Star Wars product they no longer view as part of their canon?
“Dangerous and disturbing this puzzle is.”
its awesome to see you on jensaarai1's videos i always enjoy watching your videos and you actually helped me with learning about pre-3d clone wars lore i love your channel
Hey Thadd, I think you also need to send your visual outline of how TCW wrecked the old EU to Evannova95 and other versus channels. They need to see how much TCW destroyed
Another long-time fan here. Just wanted to say how much I appreciate your video analysis and for keeping not only Pre-Disney, but pre-TCW Star Wars lore alive.
I respectfully disagree regarding Anakin’s portrayal in TCW; I think that was the best portrayal as it balanced both sides of the character pretty well - his human side as well as his dark side. When it showed his dark side, they were always impactful. As for his relationship with Ahsoka, I feel it showed a new side to him, and gave his fall to the dark side more depth.
As for Grievous, while his defeat by Gungans might be ridiculous on the surface, we shouldn’t forget Gungans have a weapon that is highly effective against droids; and Grevious is mostly droid. In fact, hit him with an EMP blast and he’s utterly helpless.
All that being said, having seen the original version of this match-up, let me also say it is awesome, and I look forward to more. And I hope I came off as respectful.
I prefer anakin’s portrayal in TCW as well. Anakin has always been portrayed as a compassionate and kind person as shown in the phantom menace. TCW showed how someone like anakin who cared deeply about his friends and loved ones can be tainted by the dark side slowly over time to become what we eventually come to know as Darth Vader.
The reason that Grievous losing to Gungans was stupid was the fact that he was taunting and toying with them rather than blitzing them or running away. Grievous should know what kinds of weapons they have but instead makes stupid decisions.
Anakin's overall portrayal in TCW is pretty excellent (especially compared to the prequel movies), but it doesn't really tell us anything about him that the 2003 microseries didn't already show us and in a more concise manner. And while I actually enjoy Ahsoka Tano as a character, making her Anakin's padawan was a creative mistake and inconsistent with what we know about his character from the previous material.
I agree, and I would also add that the dark side of Anakin we see in TCW is definitely more Vader like than what we saw before. Heck if this is end TCW Anakin vs CW Grievous this match-up probably goes the other way since that Anakin and focus his anger and he goes for his force abilities and just ragdolls his enemies like the Jedi Grievous faced typically. That Anakin just exploded
I actually agree with Jen's opinion on TCW Anakin. The way the old EU handled Anakin was a slow organic growth from the insufferable teenager in we see in Episode 2 to the Badass we see in Episode 3. The problem with TCW is that it starts Anakin off closer to how he is depicted in Episode 3 and according to the timeline, The Battle of Christophis takes place around a few weeks to a few months after Episode 2. Which doesn't make any sense in how Anakin quickly matured. I like Ahsoka Tano but she should have been Plo Koon's padawan. There was no reason to set her up with Anakin and the explanation for it was really stupid. Every time she is paired with Anakin she takes the spotlight over him. I would also agrue that Obi-Wan had way more character development than Anakin in TCW. The only substantial development Anakin went through was the Mortis Arc(Which was dismissed as a fever dream by Kenobi, Tano, and Skywalker) and when Ahsoka left the order. Overall I feel that Legends does a way better job with Anakin's growth compared to TCW
I’m pissed off at what the clone wars did to Grevious. They made the man weaker than Kit Fisto, Assajj Ventress, and they made him beat Nahdar Veb (Tier 5 combatant) only by trickery. I much prefer the movie, novel, legends, and 2003 clone wars adaptation. He’s most definitely on the levels of Anakin Skywalker (Although in my opinion Anakin wins)
Why do you think he wins? I’m not disagreeing with you, I’m just curious.
@@gameovervirus2384 not win but not get rekt
Just curious, where do you find that Vebb was a Tier 5?
In TCW they pretty much took the ROTS version of Grievous but turned up the dial past ten on him.
@@ironinquisitor3656 what do you mean?
Happy to see this video revived and revamped. I remember the conclusion of this one surprised me but that may be because I spent so long exposed to the absolute joke that is Grevious's portrayal in TCW I'd forgotten he was originally portrayed as a badass general and lethal Jedi killer.
Jensaarai1 before I begin I’d just like to say I’m a big fan and I personally think that you are *the* versus series channel for Star Wars. Your analysis as you have stated yourself is bibliographical, giving us an understanding of the characters over the course of their life. But I think the key aspect of your analysis that is still unparalleled is your ability to figure out the specific strengths and weaknesses in the characters you study, and also figuring out exactly how there fighting style works on an essentially microscopic level. You then take that to the enth degree as you analyze how the two combat styles would interact with each other. While someone like Antoine Bandele or EvanNova95 would simply find who was stronger or had more skills at their disposal, with none of your particular nuance or understanding. An example of what I am going on about is your versus battle of Darth Malgus vs Darth Krayt (vector). Stating that Malgus was essentially a freeform fighter who took inspiration from forms I, III, V, and VII. Essentially Malgus created a fighting style that was a bunch of interchangeable puzzle pieces that could be used to creatively dominate the opponent. While with Krayt he was a Niman specialist who layered multiple skill configurations into one vessel, maximizing the ability of his one distinct style by making it as versatile and powerful as possible.
*This* is why I think you are the best versus series creator out there. But to get to the point I was looking through your versus series videos and I realized their was one popular duelist you have never covered. Darth Sidious. Considering your experience covering extremely powerful characters such as Vader, Yoda, Plagueis, Luke, Bane, and most importantly Krayt, I see no reason why you would have any reservations about covering the character. So Jensaarai1, I challenge you to do Darth Sidious vs. Darth Krayt (post resurrection).
Honestly I’d love to see it. Palpatine is one of those characters that you generally have to one shot or you get one shot. It’s very hard to find a fair match for him. Another video that would be interesting is if the battle against Abeloth would have ended different with Luke and Sideous instead of Luke and Krayt
Which version of Darth Sidious would be the best match for Darth Krayt? If he used the resurrected Krayt from the Legacy: War arc, would he be facing ROTS era Sidious, ROTJ Sidious, or the clone from Dark Empire (a “resurrected” Palpatine of sorts)?
Either way, I too would love to see Jensaarai1 dissect and analyse Darth Sidious in a versus video.
@@ariesstorm9577 I feel like ROTS Sidious and Reborn Krayt are a very even match and that fight could go either way. ROTJ Sidious and DE Palpatine are both superior to Krayt as Force users and are significant threats to him before even picking up a lightsaber.
I come off of work and Jensaari gifts another video.
"This is where the fun begins."
It's an older fun sir, but it checks out.
It’s a reupload. I’m conflicted. Just as anakin was when palaptine ordered him to kill dooku
Since Anakin would be no were near as conflicted in this fight as he was when fighting Obi Wan, he can use his full streangth in the force and since he allready killed Count Dooku when he was send to destroy Grievous, Anakin allready proved that he's more than capeable of beating him.
Obi Wan surely told Anakin of his numerous fights against Grievous, which means Anakin knows what his opponent is capeable of. No four arm supprise, no ignorance regarding his opponent's skill as a duelist, no ambush with undermining Anakin's force abilities by fear tactics.
If he is put under pressure Anakin gets angry as fck and will reduce the General to scrap metal with the force. Since he's not conflicted or blinded by rage or the dark side he will remember Obi Wan's words and therefor Grievous's fighting style+Anakin is familiar with Jar'Kai allready since he learned and used it himself and dealt with it when he fought Ventress.
All what Grievous can do is lightsaber combat paired with hand to hand combat. Against the force of opponents bringing the fight to him he's utterly helpless.
Anakin is not stupid. If he's not fast enough to overwhelm Grievous with his speed alone he will use the force to tear him appart. Since Palpatine wanted him to be his apprentice he would not risk sending Anakin to his death, which can be concidered an unoffical confirmation that Anakin would crush Grievous if he ever faced him.
For everyone refering to the "High Ground": Anakin wasn't thinking clearly since he was blinded by the dark side and emotionally affected by the "treason" of his wife and he even thougt Obi Wan only came to kill him. In the fight against Grievous nothing of this will be a thing.
Mace Windu beeing unable to overwhelm Grievous with Vapaad is no thing here either. Grievous is not force sensitive, therefor no force he could turn back on his opponent. Which means Vapaad became Juyo when Windu faced him. Windu couldn't use his full power because of this fact. Anakins fighting style hasn't this unique limitation.
you do realise he's not using tcw so those times obi wan fought grievous never actually happened in legends obi wan only ever fought grievous in revenge of the sith
@@raphaelhanna8345, I mentioned TCW not a single time in my comment and I don`t have to.
1. On the Invisible Hand Obi Wan said that Grievous will not get away this time, which means both of them must have meet each other at least one time and since the clone wars are a war and not a picknick they certainly fought each other.
2. Even if you go with legends only and disregarding TCW, Anakin fought Ventress at least once( his scar proves that), which means he`s familiar with Jar`Kai.
3 Obi Wan telling Anakin about Grievous`s fighting style is called common sense, because it could have been possible that he or Anakin would encounter Grievous again and must therefor be prepaired or at least familiar with him. And storys about Grievous must have been spread in the Jedi Order because of the battle of Hypori (Clone Wars 2003). All of this means that if the council agreed that Anakin should be the one who destroys Grievous Ki, Adi Mundi and every other council member would have told Anakin about the cyborgs capeabilities, tactics and fighting style.
4. Grievous is not force sensitive and since Anakin is certainly the one who is searching the fight he`s prepaired for battle and that means no intimidation, no scare tactics and no supprises. All Greivous can bring to this fight are unarmed combat and four lightsabers. That`s it.
5. Even someone as hotheaded as Anakin is not that stupid to put his hands into a lightsaber chainsaw/meatgrinder. This is not the Mustafar duel were he`s a cocky dark side lunatic who had to cope with every he did, the "treason" of his wife and the bloodlust that fuled him. He would remember everything the council and Obi Wan told him about his enemy and since he agreed when Obi Wan told him that this time they will fight together when facing Dooku on board the Invisible Hand, Anakin made pretty clear that he learned his lesson.
6. if pushed far enough Anakin`s force powers are truly terrifying: in the novel "Labyrinth of Evil" he detroyed a fcking tower with force scream. When he was crippeld and placed in his armor Anakin/Vader lashed out with the force and ripped the entire room and almost everything within appart.
High Ground and Mace Windu and Vapaad not able to overcome Grievous are no thing here and were adressed before.
@@danmarusan2878 I agree , The channel it is new for me , as others , but they always dished out a more equal way to illustrate and discuss ove an hypothetical duel with verdict , being very aware of the details , and using is own sources , but I did not always agreed with the verdict, and this time by far , It felt to me that while general Grievous was analyzed properly , It reduced General Skywalker to a mere brawler or a " Leroy Jerkins " or whatever , for which It would have never been acclaimed or respected by master Kenobi , second I get it the dislike for the 2008 CW but Anakin was not even in the EU a psychotic , hard head ,mentally unstable individual with only dark side and arrogant child tendencies , he was not a member of the covenant , It was partially that but more to it , kind , tactical and respectful when occurred, It will adapt and not be threatened or destabilize by the general in the slightest , as mentioned by you before Grievous at that point in time would have brought as only advantage to the table a spare sets of lightsabers , thats it. My personal grudge with Gen. Grievous has always being the regarding his nonsensical threat posing to force wilder combatants , considering they were at mid high level knights in EU pretty much demigods , how it could be in a normal setting be a serious opponents, but that is on me personal , I guess in psychological warfare and assault it had an advantage , but only if unfamiliar with him , something Anakin was not . I will still not indulge to talk about the usage of the Force , because it would be abuse , ad frankly I written enough to prove my adhesion to your opinion, respect.
This is lightside Anakin though who was an 8. Dark side anakin is a 9. He needs his rage to be on that level.
Vapaad is a lightsaber form which can theoretically learned by anyone. Mace never used the superconducting loop you are talking about before his duel with palpatine.
32:54 I respectfully disagree with this Statement to a degree. The implementation of ataru and shien to overcome the lack of mobility in my opinion was Anakin’s greatest strength and part of why he’s one of my favorite fighters in the franchise.(specifically in Revenge of the Sith and the first duel with Ventress.) The failure in Anakins style was his tactical mind and emotional weaknesses. Yes it’s harder to keep a defensive posture jumping around, but the defensive techniques and counters of both variations of form V more than make up for it. Dooku and Kenobi didn’t find a weakness in Anakin’s style until they psychologically engaged him and caused him to over extend. Personally I view his hybrid variant of Djem so with Shien and Ataru as brilliant and more energy efficient than other duelist.( not by a large degree, but his more grounded but still athletic style allowed him to conserve more energy than constantly twirling around like yoda. ) I don’t think his technique was perfect by any stretch, I just think his style was well put together and it’s only major weakness was it’s wielder.
I agree with this, Grievous would’ve been defeated just as fast if not faster than he was against Obi-Wan. Anakin made mince meat of Dooku, the greatest duelist in the Order until Anakin took that title. To be the man, you have to beat the man. No one in the Jedi Council could defeat Dooku except Yoda who tied against him. Anakin beat Dooku and took the title of best duelist in the Galaxy. Considering Grievous could never hope to defeat Dooku, Anakin would be an even further stretch. It’s just that simple. I also agree with your point on his emotions, we’ve only seen Anakin/Vader in ROTS onward(his prime) be defeated when he’s fighting friends and not foes(e.g. Obi-Wan, Ahsoka, Luke).
@@mandaloretheultimate4762even though this is old something you should really think about as to why grievous would never defeat dooku is because he trained him and knows everything he does in a way but if they did go all out with grievous's chip he'd probably learn all his moves fast enough to counter them with 4 arms realistically you'd slash from the sides while you use your top 2 to counter his blade and protect yourself i never understood why he didn't just hack at their sides durring binds and other moments which would be lethal
Thanks for spelling it out brother. Children of the 90s who grew up in the 2000s with the prequel era.
I eagerly watched this despite it being a reupload. I love your work and how you analyse each character individually and against each other, while your breakdown of exactly why you don't use certain versions (TCW) is always thought-provoking. I look forward to seeing more from you when you have the chance and I hope you're keeping safe and well in this insane year.
YES! Thank you for re-uploading this Jen'!
5th, I remember being so excited for the first time I saw this video a few years ago, great video as always
Um when has Anakin ever been driven to exaughstion? You know the guy with more reserves then literally every Jedi ever? Also Mace is not stronger nor faster than Anakin and is arguably more skilled. Anakin has also proven to handle anyone on Grievous skill level and beyond. Highly disagree with that. Also Anakin has used strategies just as much as Obi-Wan
Edit:Anyone want to debate me on that?
I thought that when Palpatine suggested Anakin to go fight Grievous in RoTS (which the council denied and sent Obi-Wan instead) it was because at the time Palpatine believed Anakin to be powerful enough to take down Grievous. It is interesting that Dooku can take down Kenobi and Grievous but not Anakin, Kenobi can take down Grievous and Anakin but not Dooku, and Grievous can take down Anakin, but not Dooku or Obi-Wan.
Dooku beat anakin multiple times tbf
Anakin only won against Dooku cuz Obi-wan helped him fatigue the Count, Obi-wan being disabled made him use his rage to boost himself, and encouragement from Palpatine. If a single one of these was missing, he likely would have lost.
@@adamtremblay9126 yeah that’s true too. Dooku wasn’t at his peak either.
No I disagree, Sidious did think he was strong enough but He did not realize that Anakin relied too much on "Jedi Methods" and His saber methods are PERFECTLY countered by Grievouses's style.
Aka being too lightsaber oriented as opposed to using TK more freely, He was right about the power but what good is it if your bad habits stop you from using it.
Sidious wouldve sent anakin to his death.
@@jackalsmalls4995 Idk who u r replying too, but yeah if Anakin was sent to Utapau to fight Grevious without any preparation, he likely would have lost. However, I just realized something. If in that conversation that he had with Obi-wan before Kenobi went to fight Grevious, in a scenario where the knew Anakin was going to fight Grevious, and they discussed the fight, Anakin might taken a different approach. Also remember, Obi-wan also had a conversation with Windu before the fight, where Windu encouraged Kenobi. If Anakin had that convo with Windu, Windu may have realized Anakin would lose in a pure lightsaber duel, so may have encouraged Anakin to use the force more. So tho Anakin would lose on neutral ground, these conversations would help Anakin keep a cool head and fight smart, exactly what needs to be done to beat Grevious, so if the movie played out and Anakin was sent to kill Grevious with Kenobi and Windu's encouragement, he would have a much better chance of winning the fight, maybe even have the better chance of winning.
Love your videos dude! Every time I see your upload or reupload I always smile. Keep up your great work and passion towards the Star Wars EU
Thank you for making great Star Wars content still🙏🏼
While I can’t exactly defend his TCW portrayal, I think we know why Grevious was in the state he was in Revenge of the Sith; Mace Windu. His chest being crushed inhibited his lungs which would naturally slow him down.
Movies and books before Filoni’s crappy clone wars are the only canon Anakin to me.
Could one of the fanalysis council do an analysis of TCW grievous? If nothing else, to determine his threat level, what he is capable of beating, and just how poorly he compares to his legends counterpart
Grievous in TCW is an SOD Maul and TCW Anakin tier character, above the likes of TCW Obi-Wan, Adi Gallia and Eeth Koth as he has defeated or at the very least outfought all of them for most of the show. By consistent feats, Grievous performs better against Obi-Wan than any of the other sub-villains in TCW except for Dooku. He has consistently outfought Kenobi (even though he ends up running away by way of deliberately leaving himself open to a force attack) in comparison to Ventress, Savage Opress and Maul, who have had very split showings against Obi-Wan. Grievous is above Ventress even though he lost to her on Dathomir, only because Dathomir is a dark side nexus that amps the abilities of all Nightsisters on the planet. This caused Ventress to perform significantly better than usual.
Overall, Grievous in TCW is a Jedi Council level threat who can sustain an even fight with pre-ROTS Anakin in the later stages of TCW and Maul in his prime during the SOD comic series. He is above characters like Obi-Wan before ROTS and significantly beneath Dooku, Windu, Yoda and Sidious.
Much weaker than in Legends but still a threat when he isn't being cocky.
Grievous will lose an arm or two but will win after a long fought battle
YES!
This is one of my favourite videos of yours and I'm so happy to see you re-upload it. Damn happy to see this again.
The time has finally come.
Now, one can hope for Ventress vs Sedriss to be reuploaded too...
Last year, I started to get more involved with the Legends Clone Wars content after years of loving the 2003 micro series and read through the Dark Lord Trilogy and got all three Omnibuses for Christmas and my Birthday. Anyone got suggestions for what to read next for Clone Wars content?
Yoda: Dark Rendezvous is a great Clone Wars era novel.
Any number from the Dark Horse Republic comics, or stand alone comics like "Star Wars : Yoda" , "Dooku" , "Mace Windu"
@@yrooxrksvi7142 already read them and loved most.
There are these clone wars books you can get that are done in the same artistic style as the 2003 micro series, with some stories even linking in to the show itself.
If you have the means to play it there is also the clone wars video game that takes place shortly after episode 2 but before the events of the micro series. I mean it’s obviously outdated now in terms of graphics but I remember enjoying it back in the day.
The Darth Plagueis novel and Darth Bane Trilogy are must-reads.
This may be an upload but never stop making these videos! Always enjoy your content
You basically described how I feel about the 2008 Clone Wars. It’s just... a softer style that doesn’t really suit Star Wars. It has its own fare share of good stuff but in the expression of it, it doesn’t feel like Star Wars. To me there’s a real Star Wars which is the one you are talking about. Legends and pre 2008 Clone Wars. In essence I feel the True Clone Wars was that mysterious and raw essence... THAT is Star Wars.
Anakin taking on the bio-droid general?
"Brave of you boy, but I would've thought you had learned your lesson."
Good video like it was before. I'll disagree with some extremely minor things;
I don't think Grievous is weak to getting Force crushed when compared to other Force abilities, but rather that Mace to just too powerful/fast to the point where he could do that when other Jedi couldn't, if a Force crush was that much more powerful than pushes and the like everyone should be doing that to each other to one-shot them. Obi-Wan hardly opening Grievous' chest is more akin to destroying the lock of a door to open it as it's design to do whereas what Mace did is akin to smashing through the door. So, durability wise I believe Grievous is slightly underestimated.
When Mace fought Sidious Anakin only saw them as blurs and had to perceive them in the Force, Mace probably got amped by Vaapad in that fight but the speed was his own, as he jumped back to Vaapad while not using it at one point in it. Grievous was also just about to overwhelm Obi-Wan before he cut one of this arms, but granted, he was still fighting against a style he can be said to be weak against. In other parts of the novel Grievous was just too fast for ObI-Wan and the Force had to literally do the thinking for him. When compared to other speed feats Grievous has I believe it should make him as much of a blur in Anakin's perception, and that Anakin would only be able to keep up with him for as long as he can let the Force do the thinking for him, which should make pretty hard using conscious actions like using Force crush or other abilities. I feel like this huge speed gap should be as much of a problem, if not worst, in this and other match-ups with Grievous.
Yet grevious gets blitz by dooku see. In anakin vs dooku anakin was a blur why would grevious react to anakin when dooku couldn’t?
@@nathanmontgomery1516 That was in training, it's reasonable to believe they weren't going all out.
When I first saw this video I initially disagreed with you, considering Palpatine's confidence in Anakin's abilities and just how willing he was to send Anakin to Utapau I had assumed Anakin would win in a decently prolonged fight. Rewatching it now with a better understanding of Anakin's character and abilities I think I agree with you. Anakin isn't lacking in power, skill, drive, or experience to win but rather his mindset would limit his options to accomplish such a victory.
I'm so glad this is back!
Bring these back!!
Ahhhh the master listens and then obliges. Thanks for bringing this back, Connor.
Jensaarai One: "Anakin vs General Grievous should have been a thing"
Also Jensaarai One: *Explains how the outcome would kill Anakin if it happened*
Jensaari One: I would why it couldn't!
Disclaimer this is all just in good fun the fact J01's reasoning's were so well thought out to the point it made GL's writing LOOK EVEN BETTER/more rich is a testament to his creative abilities
Thank you for using legends sources i hate the new canon (Its been around for nearly 8 years now but ya know)its either really bad or really boring so yea great vid cant wait for the next one!
A surprise to be sure, but a welcome one!
This wouldn't last that long. Both TCW Anakin and 2003 Clone Wars Anakin will use the Dark Side if pushed enough. It would just end with Grievous getting his chest crushed by the Force and Anakin leaving him to die like what happened with Jango and Montross.
Damn, I didn't even get notifications for this :( Glad to see it re-visited though!
Awesome match up. I have been a long time fan of yours, and I truly appreciate the depth and intelligence with which you analyze the characters.
Me personally, I would give the victory to Anakin Skywalker. Thought to preface I would say I am a 2000s kid who grew up on TCW, and always viewed and enjoyed the Star Wars universe as a visual medium centered around George Lucas’ saga, Dave Filoni’s now multiple TV series, the Knights of the Old Republic video game duology (which I now have *both* of on my iPhone at long last), and the Tales of the Jedi comics.
Due to that, when I considered this match on my own, I centered my analysis on Nick Gillard’s rankings of the characters. Nick Gillard who attributed ROTS Anakin Skywalker to being a Tier 9 duelist (so I am one of those fans who consider him *superior* to Mace Windu, a borderline 9 according to Gillard).
Obi-Wan Kenobi in the Gillard ranking gets an 8, though I personally take this as a *cumulative* ranking of his speedy yet straightforward offense - which I estimate to be in Kit Fisto’s league (Tier 7) - and his fully optimized defense - which I estimate to be a *Tier 9.*
When comparing Anakin Skywalker and Obi-Wan, I consider Anakin’s offensive capabilities to be enormously superior to Obi-Wan’s offensive. I consider Anakin’s defensive capabilities to be inferior, but *comparable* to Obi-Wan’s defensive (in ROTS, both Anakin and Obi-Wan parried Darth Tyranus’ strikes with negligible difficulty). And I consider Anakin’s *offensive* capabilities to be on par in speed and slightly superior in strength to Obi-Wan’s *defensive* capabilities.
So I *do* see Anakin as having the speed and strength to overwhelm General Grievous, presuming the cyborg general would take out all four lightsabers to start. Darth Vader on Mustafar gave Obi-Wan a markedly greater challenge than General Grievous did, backing up the idea that the Chosen One *is* faster.
Very true that the last thing Anakin thinks to do is thrust his hand out to unleash his power. In fact, I even go a step further in my personal analysis of him and say that although his physical augmentation and precognitive abilities are clearly superior to Obi-Wan’s, his negligence of all other departments - starting with telekinesis - has left his TK on par with Obi-Wan’s and substantially below Darth Tyranus’ (despite being markedly superior to both in power).
But the way I see it, Anakin really doesn’t need telekinesis. Anakin whips up offensive strikes as fast as Obi-Wan maneuvers defensive parries. I see Anakin overwhelming Grievous in a thirty/forty second long fight - a good length between martial masters - and slashing *Grievous* to ribbons.
All that said, *awesome* analysis on your part. I always enjoy and leave a like, even if I come to a different conclusion.
Hey Jensaarai1. Do you know what happened to Exar Kun Vs Darth Bane?
@Wes Bradley-Taubner He never made it.
Are you sure that match was ever made ?
That seems like a lopsided versus, Bane is way too powerful for Exar Kun
@Emperor Vowrawn Bane was vastly more powerful in the force than Kun, Kun uses an inferior lightsaber style that relies too heavily on surprise and trickery, something Bane is well equipped to handle. Bane has physical superiority with his huge stature, he has superiority in his command of the force, and his Djem So style is extremely refined, considering he was capable of defeating a Jedi battle master and a veteran of the New Sith Wars simultaneously. And as for that comment about Revans rituals, I don't even see how that's important to the discussion
Ya the matchup was planned as a collaboration between Jen and GreyJedi but it never came out
3:00 I believe he changed his name to Grevious because he was tired of people asking how to spell his birth name. When asked why? He didn’t give a Huck!!!
Gnost-Dural vs Darth Bane
I am in the process of listing Jedi based on their classes and specific roles within the Jedi Order (according to wookieepedia) and according to the site Gnost-Dural is a user of Soresu, Djem So and Juyo, the same styles favoured by Darth Bane. And like Gnost-Dural, Bane has shown an immense interest in history (although Bane’s intersect appears to be specifically Sith related whereas Gnost-Dural’s interests cover a broader spectrum).
How would Darth Bane fair against basically a Jedi version of himself?
How about Gnost-Dural vs Atris. Battle of the Archivists
Im glad youre still uploading quality content and not just click bait
Edit: did Anakin use the Force to literally force Padme to fall in love with him? It just so happens that his obsession likes him back? Nope.
Glad to see this return.
First? A surprise to be sure, but a welcome one.
meh, I got to watch it first.
Meh. I'd seen it before, it was good then, it's good now. I was just surprised I made it to first comment.
You and your team never cease to amaze
Nice to see this video come back, Jen. It is one of your best.
I don't know if you're aware, but the Versus Creator Dimond360_ created a second Star Wars Questionnaire for Versus creators. I answered the call on my own channel not too long ago, and I thought maybe you'd like to do the same. :)
Hey thanks for the shoutout
Any time
Will you be doing this for the asajj ventress versus Sadriss video?
That was a collab, right? Might be a little harder to do that.
@@Spellshot693 No it wasn't, he did that solo
Oh yeah, that needs to come back too.
"If he wasn't a main character he'd be a red shirt"
Amen. Anakin had to be around because the audience gets an upgrade in Darth Vader. Calculating, Agreessive, a genius and funny as hell. Vader is everything Anakin is not.
Hence Vader has the fan base. By the way I want to see your take on a Vader vs Grievous match up.
Personally Vader will do what Anakin can't. Vader is just too damn smart, cunning and could pull the General like a moth to a flame.
"By the way I want to see your take on a Vader vs Grievous match up."
I think Vader would just Force Crush him and be done with it.
@@InSanic13 I don't think Vader could beat Grievous in a pure saber fight but he will win because he is much more intelligent, cunning and experienced and will know to abuse the force when necessary.
@@unendingvoid very difficult, because dooku and other grandmasters have beaten him in pure dueling also in a comic he killed a person who had grevious cybernetics and skill level so even In dueling I have to give it to Vader
@@nathanmontgomery1516 Dooku beats Grievous because he has extensive knowledge on how he fights and his tendencies by virtue of being his mentor. The only other Jedi who has defeated Grievous in dueling is Obi-Wan due to a stylistic advantage, and even he had to enter a state of oneness to pull it off and was nearly killed due to his defenses being overloaded. Even Mace Windu, second only to Yoda, was stalemated by a hindered Grievous in the Labyrinth of Evil novel. Vader only fights that Commander Karbin with similar cybernetics to Grievous in Canon. Furthermore, he also doesn't have any of Grievous's experience and is definitely nowhere near as tactical or cunning.
@@unendingvoid idk how high you Star Wars people get when you comment things like anakin or his Darth Vader counterpart having issues with grievous. I dont think you understand how weak most jedi are that aren’t council members. Put grievous up against council members and he will have problems. I didnt say he couldn’t win but i said problems. Darth Vader is the best duelist in canon. And nearly was in legends. Grievous is not touching Vader at all.
You just know Anakin would've _loved_ having a basilisk war droid.
by your own admission Anakin wins this supposedly 2 out of three ways. when he is calm, or when he goes nuts.
Grievious only wins if Anakin fucks up with his recklesness in such a way that he doesnt go avatar state on him....
which quite frankly I dont buy Grievious being able to. especially if this is an Anakin that has had prior engagements with Ventress and Dooku for experience.
And how many of those fights did he maintain a cool head or go ham with force abilities?
@@kingorange7739 he was pretty cool headed for his fights with dooku and with ventress he can just out power her so with an opponent like grevious I feel like anakin would focus
@@nathanmontgomery1516 um Anakin vs Ventress on Yavin, Anakin vs Ventress on Coruscant. Anakin vs Dooku in Revenge of the Sith. Anakin and Obi Wan’s sparring matches, Anakin vs Obi Wan on Mustafar, the list goes on
Imagine how frustrated Vader must have been every time he lost that arm
Heres a weird thought I wonder what jensaarai one and the rest of the council force cast think of the Aurebesh writing as well as the galactic basic language itself. As a kid I never noticed it was letter more than just decorative and actually the vast majority of the time it reads stuff that can (rather easily) be translated directly into English like the fact George Lucas insisted that attention to details in literally EVERY MAJOR viewable form of SW that was not a parody (TCW doesn't count sadly though they are included in using Aurebesh consistently the only thing I can credit them for other than Asohka)
Just thought of a VS matchup, Mara Jade vs Starkiller. Basically the Emperor's hand vs Vader's hand
Starkiller should easily win because of his performance against Vader.
@@unendingvoid Vader has certain weaknesses that make him vulnerable to starkiller. And saying one character would win simply due to their performance against another character is a bit reductive
@@Nikp117 Correct. It's like comparing apples and oranges.
@@Nikp117 Yeah uhm no. Not really. Vader in Legends is actually even less susceptible to lightning than normal humans. You know that barrage of force lightning the Starkiller clone hit him with in TFU 2? That would've killed any Jedi or Sith at Vader's level if they took it head on. He was still able to keep himself up and speaking because he installed insulators in his armor.m
@@unendingvoid Dude Vader was almost entirely incapacitated after being hit by that lightning, what are you even talking about. And just because he's capable of surviving it, doesn't mean he can effectively mount a countermeasure after, that's the point. The lightning shut down his suit, AND nearly killed him. I'm not sure if you remember, but he was entirely at starkillers mercy after that.
I have mixed feelings on TCW Anakin as well and TCW as a whole too. There are things to like but things to criticize on the other hand.
I doubt Anakin wouldn't lash out with telekinesis before getting overwhelmed, he's prescient enough to foresee that happening and Grievous is arrogant enough to gloat before stepping up his game to a level that Anakin can't handle, which would make Anakin mad enough to crush him into a ball.
TCW Grievous? Probably. The most formidable portrayals of EU Grievous? Never. He would cut him down.
Definitely surprised but a welcome one!
my favorite is back!
Oof... There are a few things ima have to disagree with you on chief. You said that Anakin had to rely a lot on Obi-Wan for his strategies, but that is far from the truth. There are several instances when Anakin in TCW had relied on his own wit and abilities in order to carry out hid plan, or see to that his battalion succeeded.
Also there's this line in Matthew Stover's ROTS book:
This is Anakin Skywalker: The most powerful Jedi of his generation. Perhaps of any generation. The fastest. The strongest. An unbeatable pilot. An unstoppable warrior. On the ground, in the air or sea or space, there is no one even close. He has not just power, not just skill, but dash: that rare, invaluable combination of boldness and grace. He is the best there is at what he does. The best there has ever been. And he knows it. Matthew Stover. Revenge of the Sith
Anakin knows what's happening 90% of the time. I'd say that other 10% is knocked down by his emotional vulnerability, as you've said.
I just don't think Anakin is as much as a dumbass as people think he is. 🤨
He disregards TCW and said he is doing the match up to the exclusion of it.
@@kingorange7739, Even Jensaraai`s sources confirm that Anakin Skywalke is: The most powerful Jedi of his generation. Perhaps of any generation. The fastest. The strongest. An unbeatable pilot. An unstoppable warrior. On the ground, in the air or sea or space, there is no one even close. He has not just power, not just skill, but dash: that rare, invaluable combination of boldness and grace. He is the best there is at what he does. The best there has ever been. And he knows it.
Do you know what Obi Wan said to Anakin before he headed to Utapau?
"You are strong and wise Anakin and I`m very proud of you. I`ve trained you since you were a small boy. I have tought you everything I know. And you have become a far greater Jedi than I could ever hope to be." Which outright confirms the line of Metthew Stover`s ROTS book.
If Anakin would be a Leeroy Jenkins like dumbass, Obi Wan never would`ve said something like "You have become a far greater Jedi than I could ever hope to be".
@@danmarusan2878 I never argued with his point. I’m just saying TCW didn’t count as a source
@@kingorange7739, I know. But even if you don't take TCW into account, even the novel Jensaarai is using as a source confirmes what you can see in TCW.
Yay, 2008 clone wars bashing!
Rahm Kota vs Darth Azard. Lord Vindican vs Antares Draco. Sylvar vs Galen Marek. Arcann vs Starkiller(clone). Aryn Leneer vs Jaina solo. Bultar Swan vs A’Sharad Hett.
I was wondering where this one had went. These copyright strikes sure look annoying from the outside.
A Squad of Stormtroopers vs a squad of B2 Battle Droids.
Stormtroopers are tricky because they are either complete buffoons or equal to the clonetroopers. Id say B2 battle droids simply for how much hell they gave the standard clone troopers
Against B2s the Stormstroopers take it.
Against Luke Skywalker, Han Solo and the gang....they might as well go home.
If we are talking the same B2s from Republic Commando, then they absolutely shred. Dark Troopers are more of a match.
RIP Gour and Anakin’s arm 7 times.
Vader vs Grievous is kind of a foregone conclusion although it would be a nice video to demonstrate that Vader was an upgrade to Anakin. Casual fans only get to see Vader as depicted by the technology of the original trilogies time.
Why?
@@397llederson6 Despite Vader's injuries, he far surpassed Anakin.
It may not seem so from provided examples but he also acted much more intelligently.
The easy force crush victory is likely.
Grievous struck fear into the heart of his enemies but unlike Dooku, he was no expert in Dun Moch. Combine this with his lack of connection with Vader and he has very little chance of goading Vader into a prolonged fight.
Particularly in the OT you see Vader treats his fights with purpose and caution.
Vader's armor is also of such a grade that Grievous could not cut him down with a unexpected burst of speed.
@@MrSnakekaplan 1. No he did not
2. Um no he isn't that much smarter
3. Um Anakin is not stupid he wouldn't do that unless he hated Grievous but he has little connection to Grievous
4. Anakin is cautious more than once he has shown this infact he prefered fighting Dooku as a team in ROTS and Mustafar is just the exception
@@397llederson6 Are you a troll, did read the comment?
Anakin at various times does display a reckless nature... although I never declared Grievous the winner, the video did...
Vader is absolutely smarter, more powerful and far far wiser. He learns from his defeats, Sidious and adapts to having the massive responsibilities that are placed on him as he essentially is the 2IC of the galaxy.
Read some of the books before commenting.
@@MrSnakekaplan 1. I did read his book I have a lot of them but George said Vader was not as strong as Anakin, in fact, Anakin was the peak of Vader's magnitude as stated by Lucas. He said more than once Vader lost a lot of power and potential and would never be as strong as Anakin. So you have to argue death of the author which Good luck with that.
2. Most of the time he did it was by a circumstance which the video neglects to mention and it also forgets to mention various times people Grievous fought were reckless too.
3. Smarter is a given as Vader had more knowledge, wiser is arguable as he doesn't display wisdom more like a psychotic mentality hell it would be liking saying the Joker is wise and more powerful is a no.
4.He did but that did not mean he surpassed Anakin, in fact, Lucas intended for Vader to be a shadow of what he was that was why they made the fights better in the prequels to see the peak of Jedi and sith.
Overall if you want to argue Vader is superior to Anakin you have to argue against what George Lucas intended
just asking could you try to elaborate on the issue of anakin being sidelined in favour of ahsoka tano
"Anakin and Obi-Wan were contacted by the Galactic Republic, who delivered grievous news..."
Lol, was that supposed to be a pun???😂
What!? There's no way my obvious pun was deliberate! Lies and slander! 😜
I was literally thinking yesterday why does nobody use halo music in Star Wars videos and then I watch your video
Anakin should be one of the few force users who could get the better of Grievous in Legends but not easily same applies for other slightly betters then Grievous like Dooku, Sidious, Yoda, Mace, And Obi Wan while everyone else should suffer his wrath yeah
Lucien Draay would be a great match for Grevious: like Kit Fisto Draay’s strength against multiple opponents will let him endure Grevious multi saber style, but he’s much more aggressive. Lucien has Anakin’s physical strength and aggression , Kit ‘s skill for besting multiple opponents and fighting skill, and Mace Windu’s willingness to brutalize Grevious with the force. The real question of how long it would take to frustrate Draay into a curb stomp, because unlike starkiller Lucien is more willing to put right attack with the force than use the environment.
Oh so do you think you can make more Star Wars versus series
How about we see what would've been interesting to watch during the Clone Wars finale, but for continuity, could never happen:
Anakin Skywalker in his prime vs Darth Maul (as depicted in season 7, which is when Dave Filoni had claimed Maul had returned to his prime since TPM.)
I figure Evannova or GreyJedi91 would be better for that. I don’t think Jenssari has a high opinion on TCW maul overall either. I don’t think he’ll be happy to watch season 7 TCW at all actually..
(My opinion) - Well, i respectfully disagree with the result. When Anakin uses his anger to fuel his power, there is no chance for his enemies. Obi-Wan bested him on Mustafar because he knew his former Padawan like no one else did. He knew that if he had to cut his old friend down, he would have to turn Skywalker's hatred and arrogance against himself, driving the battle to a place where he could have the advantage to finish the fight (the infamous high ground). But that was not the case for Dooku (Grievous's master) and Ventress (they both got easily defeated by Anakin when he tapped into the Dark Side to keep fighting), and wouldn't be for Grievous. Despite being extremely skilled with the lightsaber, at the end of the day he was nuttin' but another battle droid. He would definetely prove to be a good match, but in the end his limited skills as a droid would be his downfall against the overwhelming powers of The Chosen One.
Anakin hadnt slept or ate in days and was in emotional conflict when fighting Obi-Wan and nearly killed him when he had his mechanical hand around kenobis NECK. I have the book and I….WATCHED the movies unlike every damn Star Wars youtuber. So sick of these youtubers not going in depth of the mustafar fight. Makes me want to make my own channel just to accurately teach the lore to new people instead of listening to clowns on the internet
yes more jabs at TCW please :)
i could listen to you rant about that all day
Even though I like TCW I do agree with a fair few of his assessments including grievous. Its also entertaining as fuck
We miss y'alls work
Where would you tier Darth Caedus as a martial artist and Force wielder?
In my opinion. Tier 1 as a force user. Tier 2 as a martial artist.
@Wes Bradley-Taubner I usually ignore comments in the forums and just read through the feats unbiased
I personally place Caedus as a solid tier 1. His mastery of the force goes beyond classic Jedi and Sith teachings. His dueling skills allow him to complete against other tier 1 duelists like Luke, Jaina and Kyle and give them great duels and sometimes win. And his tolerance for pain is downright superhuman. I don’t see him as better than Sidious or even Valkorion in power but I would consider him amongst the great masters of the force
@Wes Bradley-Taubner Or "Canon" Vader, he's overrated to hell anywhere
@Wes Bradley-Taubner "Canon" Vader looks "more powerful" simply because they completely skipped over the process of rebuilding his style and coping with his prostethics, they changed how the Force works to fit with their narratives, and because they gave him pretty crappy opponents, when compared to the EU. In fact, EVERYTHING else has been nerfed on purpose.
Quinlan Vos vs Lucien Draay. ( Draay is a better offensive duelist and more powerful force user, but Vos is more well rounded with a diverse skill set and powers Draay doesn’t have an answer for. They are equals in hand to hand and force integration and Vos is a more strategic fighter. Plus the vapeed style gives Vos a way to counter Draay’s agression and dark channeling.) Ven Zallow vs Darth Azard. Antares Draco vs cao cen darach. Sora Bulq vs Arryn Leneer. Wolf Sazen vs Darth Maul. Jango Fett vs Das Jenner. Anya Kuro vs Arryn Leneer vs Kit Fisto.
I seriously doubt that Anakin would lose this fight🙋🏾♂️💯
Wasn't one of the reasons Palpatine ALWAYS had Obi Wan fight Grievous and NEVER Anakin, because he didn't want Grievous to "accidentally" kill the to-be Sith apprentice? Grievous is designed to kill reckless and aggressive Jedi.
I don't know if this would be more of your or Evan's style of match @Jensaari One, but I would love to see an Obi-Wan versus FOTJ Leia analysis someday.
Going to start a versus channel. You are my inspiration and I thank you. Watch out for me
I wish they would've kept their characters true and still allowed Anakin's character development as Ahsoka's master.
I wonder if Jensaari can read Aurebesh I can and it makes Star wars feel more immersured
I really like you versus videos. Please consider making the following videos. Darth Maul vs Darth Vindican. Exar Kun vs Satele Shan. Darth Reavan vs Exar Kun. I feel that all of these are solid match ups.
Eh Anakin battles are stupid, too many maybes and ifs. Depending on the version, the mindset, the situation and how he wakes up he can either bully The One’s or get in trouble against Asajj Ventress. Every single fan has a different idea of “baseline” Anakin, and getting Anakin angry might make him vulnerable or it might make him god, we just don’t know.
Darth Kryat vs Exar Kun?
Rob Terra is making that match.
Krayt annihilates Kun. Krayt can compete with Abeloth while Kun is vastly sub Malak.
@@supremeleaderren7681 "Compete with Abeloth"
He wasn't at his peak and was operating Beyond Shadows, using Force Drain, which he never showcased in the Legacy comics.
@@yrooxrksvi7142 He haven't reached his prime when he fought Abeloth, yes. Beyond shadows doesn't make any difference, given they all fought in the same conditions. He didn't use force drain in Legacy, yes. That doesn't mean he can't, though.
@@supremeleaderren7681 The Legacy Campaign Guide doesn't attribute him with Force Drain though.
i think there is no way, Anakin would loose this fight.
In canon Anakin is easily the winner and in legends as well, though it would be much closer.
The main problem i have with this analysis is, that Grieviuos isn't made to face Jedi, that are as aggressive as Anakin, because Jedi like Anakin Skywalker, Plo Koon or Mace Windu are not the typical Jedi for the golden age of the republic, where Jedi focused more on defense than offense. Though it is true, that Dooku and Kenobi defeated Grievious through defensive tatics, it was not, because Grievious isn't made for combating those, it was because Dooku and Kenobi are on an exceptional skill level, that was simply too much for Grievious.
Grievious was made to intimidate Jedi to break their fighting spirits and then spam the hell out of his 2 or 4 arms to ensure a quick victory.
I mean if you are intimidated, you wouldn't rush to fight this thing wouldn't you? And in the rare cases, where weak minded Jedi, like the Scooby Doo guys from CW 2003, would rush in, they would be crushed, because their skill isn't on Grievious level or are you trying to tell me, that someone like Luminara Unduli would win against Grievious, because Grievious isn't made to be on the offensive?
About the Mace Windu duel:
Yeah it was impressive, that Grievious could stand against Windu, eventhough Anakin could do the same, at least for a while I think, but he neither won or did achieve a stalemate, the fight was simply interrupted. You make it sound, like they were equals, which they are not.
So what I think would happen in this match up is, that Anakin would start the duel on the offensive and pressure Grievious, because Anakin isn't that easily intimidated. What would happen is, that Grievious would exploid his Dun Möch against Anakin. Eventhough I'm not sure, that Grievious would "succed" in the same way Dooku did, because they hadn't the same history as Anakin and the Count had, but let's say it works out and Anakin gets angry.
From here on Anakin could either crush Grievious into submission with the force (like you said) or they would keep on fighting, in which case Anakin would win, by cutting of some of Grievious limbs until and killing him outright, like it would have ended in the Mace Windu duel on coruscant, if not interrupted.
Like Dooku said, if Grievious didn't break them from the beginning, he wouldn't stand a chance and besides that, as I said, Grievious was made to combat intimidated, more defensive Jedi, which Anakin is cleary not.
Eventough we have different takes on TCW and this match up, I just wanted to say how much I appreciate your efforts and enjoy your work.
And what evidence suggests this conclusion related to lightsaber combat? Dude not even Windu with Vapaad could overwhelm Grievous. And if Windu ain’t going to be able to do it, neither would Anakin. U r also forgetting that attacking Grievous head on is one of the most stupid moves a combatant could do.
@@kingorange7739, Vapaad turns the force of an opponent back on him/her. The more powerfull the opponent is in the dark side of the force the more powerfull is Mace Windu. Since Grievous isn`t force sensitive there is no force you can turn back on him. Which means that Vapaad becomes Juyo when used against Grievous. In other words a unique handicap prevented Mace Windu from bringing 100% of his actuall power and skill to the fight. Anakin has no such handicaps and can hit Grievous with everything he got.
@@danmarusan2878 I don’t disagree with Vapaad’s lack of ability here. I’m saying even disregarding it’s perk. Windu’s application is very similar to Anakin’s use of Djem so.
@@kingorange7739, very similar but not the same.
Since Mace Windu used the force to defeat Grievous twice, Anakin is capeable of doing the same. Why? Anakin can compete with Mace in regards of force power and he's no stupid, simple minded brute.
But what separates him from Mace is that Mace Windu is more conventional and by the book while Anakin's way of thinking and his actions are entirely unconventional and not what Grievous would expect from a Jedi.
Anakin not only would catch Grievous totally of guard, his intimidation tactics did not work on Mace Windu or Obi Wan and would backfire on him when facing Anakin. But the crucial difference between Mace Windu and Anakin Skywalker is that Mace (while calm) fought to survive while Anakin would go in for the kill.
@@danmarusan2878 Anakin going in for the kill could be his undoing when not being applied correctly. Anakin’s most consistent problem is his arrogance and as shown in most of his fights, when faced in single combat, he is a lot more likely to try to pound a target into submission than try to telekinetically manhandle them
I've always wondered Jen how come no one uses Anakin Solo ??? he's a significantly underrated force user and Jedi compared to his brother and sister and pretty amazing feats.
I could definitely see a tcw Darth maul vs anakin solo or him vs Darth talon.
I can't speak for the others, but in my case, it's because I'm not well versed in post-Ep6 EU material.
My introduction to Star Wars was the Clone Wars multi-media project, and out of the New Republic era, I'm only properly familiar with Shadow of Mindor, Dark Empire, Jedi Outcast & Academy, Legacy of the Force, and Legacy. I've only read 3 of the NJO novels, and I'm a heretic who has never read the Thrawn trilogy.
@@Jensaarai1 I'm with you on the not reading thrawns books but honestly we always here how Jaden and Jaina were amazing force users and swordswomen (respectively)
But due to his early death ( which I blame George the most ) never got close to the others in their early life especially the books stating Anakin was had the most potential out of the three siblings.
Anakin Skywalker vs Darth Maul is one I’m surprised the fanalysis council hasn’t tackled, especially since you all place them in similar skill levels. TPM Maul I feel is a superior tactican to Anakin and uses his skills more intelligently, while TCW Maul has a similar approach to Anakin, skilled stargists outside battle but in battle very straightforward. Also, Sora Bulq vs Galen Marek would be awesome.
I'm fairly certain that depending on the environment, Anakin takes it in either continuity most of the time.
Roan Shryn vs Lucien Draay: an odd match up but I think it would be fun for your unconventional sensibilities. Lucien Draay is an agile powerhouse with a fighting style that either kills his enemy or leaves him wide open. Lucien is undeniably more skilled in all ranges of combat, but Roan managed to hold his own against Darth Vader so while inferior to Draay in raw skill or natural force power, he is a superior tactican and combatant with the force.