Alfa Romeo 4C vs Porsche Cayman vs Toyota GT86 / Scion FT86 - sportscar shootout
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- Опубліковано 5 лют 2025
- The new Alfa Romeo 4C has the right kind of credentials for a sports coupé, but can it really rival the indomitable and equivalently priced Porsche Cayman? Or how about the much cheaper, and less exotic, Toyota GT86?
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The brilliance of the Porsche Cayman and the delicacy of the Toyota GT86's handling is well documented. It is many years since Alfa Romeo build a truly great driver's car befitting of the iconic badge. Autocar's Steve Sutcliffe puts all three of the rear-wheel drive coupés head-to-head on track, in order to find out which one's the best to drive.
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GT86 because light, RWD and manual....all you need in a car.
FR
Sorry but at those price points, the FRS is the most fun/ practical car here!
Cayman is most fun but i'll go for gt86/frs/brz instead
The FRS is a rebadged American GT86
@@ornatehammer661 cayman the most fun to drive? xD i doubt you have driven the 4c
@@philbvb1 no, i haven't, i don't fit in one 😂 even the Cayman is at the limit, but the gt86 it's perfect for tall people
@@ornatehammer661
How can you not fit in one???
I'm aabout 5'11" / 180cm and a good 155kg and I fit in the 4C! Assuming you must be quite tall?
Ok. Porsche makes for many years very good sport cars.Alfa,with the exception of the limited production - most beautifull car ever- 8C made the very good Gullietta and Mito. So now gives us the 4C, a great looking car that weights only 895 kg! and achieves 0-100km/h in 4.5 sec! Just an 1750cc engine and we have a mini supercar. That is for me, a great achievement for Alfa which i would buy.
But the 4C is not as reliable as the GT86 not even close.
Alfa 4C is made for those who cannot afford a Ferrari, Maserati, Lamborghini of McLaren. and it is made incredibly well for the money. Now even us mortals can afford a supercar. Cheers to Alfa!
Love the way everybody can make statements such as "this car has a shitty engine", "the other one has shitty grip", "the other one has shitty gearbox" etc etc... and the people making this assertive comments probably go to work in an SUV, or a VW Polo, or whatever.
Please don't misunderstand me, there is nothing wrong with SUVs and Polos. But stop making comments about cars you never drove, never will drive and probably haven't even seen on the streets.
Absolutly true. There are a lot of extremely immature comments here from people, who sound like they are no more than 12 years old. And maybe they aren`t :-)
pure badge snobbery haha, you talk of the best drivers car, a PURE drivers car, its the GT86 that should be the winner!
"I want to be in _that_ car!"
Happy I get to drive on every day. ;-)
***** At least they included mine. ;-)
***** Ah! But count my Cayman S in as well!
***** the alfas more of an old school approach... its not about precision thats the drivers job not the cars.... the lack of power steering etc, the notion of low weight low power its like the giulietta sprint of the 50's its in my opinion more of a drivers car because its not as easy
TheUglySlug666 hahah. No.
TheUglySlug666 tts? ahahahah horrible car
Maybe, drifting not what you would do to tiny, little 900 kilogram mid-engined car all day long. Despite the fact, that Steve complains a lot about understeer (on a wet track), i think its a quite fun thing to drive on a track. Maybe you just keep it in the garage if its cold and wet out there, not everyone wants to do trackdays at such weather conditions...
In addition, its probably one of the first track-ready Alfa Romeos since the seventies, so why can't we just enjoy... I think its lovely, maybe because I'm driving a Giulietta and don't really care about boring perfection.
Steve Sutcliffe always nails it correctly.
No matter what Sutcliffe says, what I can see in the video is:
- The alfa destroys both cars for raw pace.
- The cayman is more dynamically polished.
watching this now gives me MF GHOST vibes
I see two cars going through a turn at about 40-45 Mph, one of them is smoothly going while the other one is struggling to stay on the tarmac! I think it's all about your preferences, fear of death at 45 or driving calmly at 45.
I own a Brz and I love it. The Cayman is the best car I have ever driven. Nothing else I have touched even comes close. If the 4c can be had for under 60k US it would be my pick. It is like a driving work of art. I wish it had a true N/A Alfa power plant. I would gladly give up 40 hp to hear a true Alfa sing. It would most likely be lighter, have better throttle response and be less expensive with a N/A mill also. How about a manual 4c?
Nobody ever will buy an Alfa because is "the better" car, you buy Alfas because they are Alfas, you buy an Alfa to be the owner of an Alfa. That's why Alfa Romeos have never been too good at anything else but being Alfas :)
Good clip Steve.
yes alfas look good, but they have to drive good as well. Now day i think they lost their magic. looks good but not drive very well.
They just don’t get it unfortunately... shame. If you have to explain why about Alfas... don’t bother lol
By now, I'm sure everyone not living under a rock knows that the GT86/FR-S come equipped with Prius tires, so taking it to the track seems a little unfair, but I get it. Take away the iconic Alfa grille/bumper and you have what could easily pass for a Lotus. A Porsche is a Porsche, having said that, the Alfa appeared to follow the lines that the Cayman and the Toyota were putting down with such ease that it didn't appear to break a sweat (although a little lackluster in its mission, but good for timed track days). At the end of the day, I would gladly take any of these fine cars for completely different reasons.
Yeah but we buy cars for their fun. For regular people, track days are great, you get a lot of run off on most tracks to make mistakes and you aren't burdened two way traffic on normal streets. For me, when i go to the track i like being sideways and us drifters help those who are looking for better lap times by putting a fresh coat of rubber on the pavement on those turn ;P
I love my 86 i can go around at sensible speeds at the track, staying away from the walls and have a blast at 1/2 the speed of the super cars. Super cars are a blast at the track, but at the end of the day you only had fun because the car scared you half to death. but that's the best part of being an auto enthusiast i like to live on the edge of grip, others like to bury their fingernails into the steering wheel and hold on for dear life. There's nothing better than going hard on the brakes and shifting from 6th to 2nd to barley hit a late apex on a hair pin and punching it out the other side.
I would love to buy a Porsche and track it, but i wouldn't want to face the bill of replacing a totaled one. For the price of a Porsche and replacing it if anything were to happen i could buy four 86's. plus a set of rs-3' on an 86 is only 800 bucks for all 4 tires and that's nothing to complain about. my last track car ran upwards of 1400 for a set of brand new rs-3'
As for the alfa, changing the front suspension to be a bit more forgiving would cut out the under steer he was getting. from it's design there just isn't enough weight on the front tires to get grip when turning in to rotate the back so you end up pointing in the direction you want to go.
4C = 1/2 of 458 Italia :)
Yes, a little 458.
The Alfa has character and yes you can drift it as proved on Top Gear! Out of these cars the Alfa will be a classic, the others won't be, because they aren't special. The Alfa IS special
yes it'll be a classic too but not in the same way as the alfa
The last naturally aspirated flat six in regular production Cayman won't be a classic? Mmm don't know if I agree with you there. Judging how the Alfa did in EVOs 2013 coty competition, it doesn't seem like the Alfa is going to be a classic either.
you're wrong ok yes maybe the cayman will be a classic but you're wrong if you think the alfa won't be
+Nathaniel Watson thats depend, example my case, I don't know anything about Alfa Romeo and its nothing special to me at all, to me its overpriced, maybe back in the day it was special cuz not so many cars at that level and technology but today? No, names one thing special about this 4c and other brand doesn't have it, what the diff between this and the MRS Toyota that cost 1/3 of the price. Im speaking for most of ppl now day and I have 0% that you will agree with me, btw, lets see how many of the 4C can sell compare to M3, M4, Audi TT, Porsche Cayman, even RCF and C63 ok, no one thinking this car is worth it unless they are Alfa Romeo fans fr decades
***** Mr2 is a 80' car and cost only 18k at that time, 4c is current technology and cost almost 100k, this reason should explain why the 4c is a better car than an Mr2, back in the 60', 70' or even 80', we have to sacrifice reliability and high maintenance for performance and go with those European brand-name like Alfa, Ferrari, Lamborghini or even Porsche and Aston Martin just because they have no competitors, today, a lot of cars that cost much less, even faster, better and of course more reliable, only those old school or stone headed people still stick with them but they still not enough to save those companies so they either, bankrupted, low sale or they start selling their companies all around the world even to China
I'll dream of that Alfa tonight. Although I love all 3 of these cars.
I can't wait for it to come to the US.
Great video and brilliant cars, they didn't mention though that on a straight line the Alfa walks them easily, not too many people know that using launch control on the 4c and pressing also the left paddle when it's ready on "launch" the revs goes up to 6500 rpm making the car goes in 4.2 sec on the 0-60! That's pretty damn impressive imo and i was impressed by the time it got on the Ring. 8.4 min, same as a 450 bhp Audi R8. The Cayman is better but i'd pick the 4C anyday
Are you guys still seriously using that canned overplayed drum and bass line that comes preloaded on every apple computer ever sold? -50 points production value.
wow you're so cool .....
I'm sorry but the Alfa is 20,000 pounds more than the GT86, you can spend another 10,000 pounds to make the GT86 faster and better looking and is still that much cheaper. That's just my opinion
To be honest, the Alfa looks like it corners better than both of the other cars. Or maybe the other driver likes to drift them a lot. Any how the comparison wasn't really well done in my opinion.
The attractive part about the GT86 is it's really fun to drive it doesn't deserve the hate like the Miata and the GT86 looks really really good looking car compared to the GR86 I prefer the GT86
Drifting sideways matters? Come on Autocar. Not sure people buying a 4C care too much about that. It's all about the exclusivity, design and 0-100.
Driving around a track with no race... :) The Alpha never looked like it was pushed to the limits either, I would have at least liked to see a bigger amount of oversteer or understeer from it.
We'll things haven't changed much do they?
In 1990s, the proper sports sedan to buy is a BMW 328i, but there are these people who would (for little logical reason) purchase a 156 GTA.
Never in history has buying an Alfa Romeo made any practical sense, but petrolheads are always lured in just due to its special attributes. It's the Alfa way
First in the 1990s there was no 330i. The 330 came out in 2000 before it the most powerful 3 series except the M3 were 325i and 328i. Second the 156 GTA is FWD which is a pity because the looks, the sound and the engine of the 156 GTA are just brilliant and if it was RWD it will just be a near perfect driver's car.
Sorry, but in the history of motorsport Alfa won more than Bmw, You cant' talk about Alfa's in this way.. Two F1 title, Le mans, many and many european touring cars championships, an one DTM. And more and more. Respect man. Respect.
danny ring
I didn't say that I don't like Alfa. I have a clue about the history of that brand. But these days the Alfa cars are not the legends they used to be. For me a true Alfa is a rear wheel drive Alfa like Spider and the 75. If for example the 156 or 166 or 159 were RWD I would've bought maybe 5 of them :D
Totally agree with you. Economic problems lead to cheap projects. But now the things are differents. Now, today, Ferrari return to Alfa what in the past Alfa gave to Ferrari: Know how. Infact Ferrari will depelope new engines for Alfa, and we will never see an Alfa with a Fiat engine. Best ragards, Dan.
danny ring God Bless ! I'm dying to see a true GT coupe from Alfa with a Ferrari developed V8 or even the brilliant Alfa V6 or a sports sedan like the Maserati Quattroporte - for me this is the sexiest 4 door car on the planet it looks even better than the Aston Rapide.
This slides that they put the Toyota through in this video...are absolutely sublime.
I will dislike every autocar video I watch where you make me sit through a whole 30sec Audi advert.
Chris Harris/DRIVE drove the Alfa 4c sideways. Just needs a better driver.
i would really love to see like 5 fast laps in a little race with those 3 cars ... i know it might be unfair but it would also be aweseome to see the cars at the limit and the drivers comments about going fast with those cars
Get the GT86 as your daily driver and with the money you saved, buy a BMW S1000rr as your go-fast machine.
or you could get the C7 corvette....
The Porsche Cayman is widely regarded as the best mid-range sports coupe. I'd have to agree, although the GT86 is superb value for money (far more suited to my budget, that is for sure). I like the Alfa too, although I've had enough exposure to that particular marque to steer well clear of them in the future.
The Porsche might be the better car, but we all know we'd take the Alfa
With a shit engine and a shit gearbox? The one thing we shouldn't be doing is picking turbos over the last (emissions regs) atmospheric engines. Add to that this review and EVOs slating of it, and surely we have to conclude that the 4c is shit.
It is quite good looking, but then so is the Cayman. Pick one, I'd take the Porsche. With the manual. Last n/a Porsche with a manual box? Be worth a fortune in a few years.
Malc180s EVO? I think they're the worst reviewer ever now, since Chris Harris out. I watched it already, their reasons sound unreasonable at all, hate it because of 4 cylinders sound? Sound bloody awful? and Malc180s you tell us the turbo engine makes more emissions regs, you're just still live in the 20 years ago world.
I'd be on my way to the Alfa dealer and end up signing at the Porsche dealer. With the kind of driving I know i'd subject the Alfa to i just dont trust them. I know the Cayman (as bland as its looks are) will take the abuse. Damn sexy looking car the 4C is though!!
Malc180s
I'm definitely not arguing that the Porsche is the better car, but the Alfa has those intangible factors that the Porsche doesn't. While you might not be able to justify the Alfa over the Porsche from a technical standpoint, I don't think that's why you buy the 4C. A buyer would be very happy with either
Viking445 I see your point, but I don't think this is the kind of car you buy because its the "smart decision". You buy it because that's what you want, and for the things that don't appear on a spec sheet, you know?
he took money from Porsche for that result,i mean look at the corners and see how the Porsche go side to side try to stay in front when alfa take corners neutral with even closer angle and closing the distance,man do your job right, you are joking with us
4:47 ????? you're in a Alfa!!!. Alfa Romeo's first real sports car in over 20 years and it's amazing and you want to be in a Toyota?? the GT86 is good but.. come on.
8:45 buying a sports car isn't about being sensible.
the Alfa is the car for the real petrol head, also the GT86/BRZ.
what kind of soulless being given the choice would choose the Porsche over the Alfa???
Alex Douglas just because I used the word "soulless"??? but it is true what top gear says about Alfa's though.
I owned a alfa romeo sprint 1966 I loved it awesome car.
and I would rather have that Alfa 4C than most sports double, triple the price.
don't pretend to know shit that you know nothing about.
Alex Douglas you know nothing about Alfa's
have you owned one?
"the Alfa is the car for the real petrol head"
this skipped my mind in the first reply.
also I said the GT86/BRZ was also for the people have been using that term longer than top gear.
the only people who buy Alfa's are petrol heads outside of Italy, not so much in recent years though.
the cayman is may drive incredibly well built quality is great as well but it's boring and dull, I and people like me wont and don't buy cars just based on how well they're made or how well they drive, it's how it speaks to you as a person, it's how I have bought all my cars going to sound like top gear here but I buy cars with my heart not my brain. battery dying got to go until later.
luke hibbird I used to own 2..,my first Alfa was 155 TS 2.0 and it was the newest car i ever had ,60 000 km,2 year old and every time i was shutting the engine,i wasnt sure if it will start again,it was random aaall the time:) Then the lights,one day working,2 days not..,then the AC,then the gearbox,and the rust (2 yr old car!!) and when it made 4 years,it couldnt pass the Katsastetu(car inspection) and i moved to Honda Prelude 1993...driving,driving,and driving for about 4 happy years for which i changed oil,filters and belts,oh,and front left light bulb:) Then i decide to give second chance to Alfa 156 2.0..,and it was another disaster..,burned valve,ECU issues,power windows,immobilizer left me 3 hours in the cold,unable to start the car..,so yeah,i know about Alfa not from the warm coach watching you tube at home,but actually owning few..so before you write how "passionate" and "full of soul" these cars are,i suggest you buy one with your own money and enjoy it...if possible:)
Anubis Ra I did own one and if read the other comments you would have known.
never said they're reliable and it sounds like you had more problems than most.
most people buy cars just to get from A to B, but car enthusiasts "the petrol head" buy cars that speak to them, that catch their eye, no matter how impractical they might be.
I'm very passionate cars, the Alfa that owned was great, but it wasn't my everyday car and it was very unreliable I was always fixing it, but by the time I got it, it was over 40 years old.
I'm never going to get car that doesn't excite me or sparks my interest never will I buy a car just because it's convenient or practical,
just the same way I will only ever own classic cars or sports cars also 4x4's but only the older ones because all new modern 4x4's are shit.
only new car I will ever buy is some kind of performance car, like this new Alfa which I will never end up owning sadly.
I wont go one about how full of passion and soul Alfa's are because I have never said that, I will say however that they are special not all some are just shit.
just like I would jump at the chance own a lancia delta HF or a stratos or a E-type, three cars in my top ten and they would be a pain in the ass to own, just like the good Alfa's but on the days that they are running they're going to give you the biggest smile.
luke hibbird I'll only own it if it's high performance and high maintenance. If it's high maintenance and slow no way would I touch it.
GT86 is great value, Cayman is OK, but..but...the 4C is unbelievably beautiful so...4C wins, no doubt. Who cares about value, speed, noise when your car is that beautiful.
PLUS, the Cayman is a Boxster with a roof, same styling, slightly better engines, and a lot more expensive.
Plus +, my name is supposed to be "Boredest Pie" but I spelled it wrong and can't change it for a while :P
Lol wtf dude, of course we care about value, speed, noise, handling, it's the core of any car ..
Of course you think the 4C is better. You are clearly biased towards it because of your profile pic. I'm not hating, I'm just observing! Cheers
gianhet As the famous Jeremy Clarkson says: Buying a car for its dynamic abilities, is like buying a p**n film for its plot.
Borer Pie
porn...
Borer Pie Jeremy Clarkson is a biased douchebag journalist and if he actually said that then, wow....he just became an even bigger moron.
at 6:30 and beyond, the Alfa is just tracking through the same turns the Cayman is busy getting all bent over. As others have said, the 4C hasn't got the torque or setup to drift, but drifting isn't really a good trait on a street car. I'm sure all three cars could be very simply (tire pressure, tire size, sway bar) tuned to oversteer or understeer. I'm still waiting for a review that doesn't try to compare the 4C to a Cayman. Also, it wasn't long ago that Boxters and Caymans were also rans. What changed every journo's mind about that car. I've only drive an early Boxter and it wasn't fun at sane speeds.
895kg!
Bloody hell, regardless of how the steering feels the 4C must be able to pull some serious lateral G force.
The alfa is faster, cheaper, better looking then the beatle
Does anyone ever buy an Alfa Romeo because it is practical ?
I agree with you, but having a boot would be nice :/
***** if you need a boot you can't afford it. Prerequsite: cargo hauling second car.
Two F1 title, Le mans, many and many european touring cars championships, an one DTM. And more and more. Respect FOR ALFA. Respect.
Blokes' attitudes towards cars tend to be very similar to their attitudes towards women, they go for the good-looking ones. Therefore, the Alfa wins by a mile.
the GT86 is a sign that the fun cars like the silvia rx7 supra and skyline are returning in japan and that's great news
1080p, finally. Way to go Autocar, welcome to the 2010s.
Good video.. Only thing instead of the Toyota you should have included the Lotus Elise SC. Just a thought...
The Alfa Romeo looks sensational indeed...I want one...badly...Yellow color please !!!
Long story short: If you are a snob (like this guy), you buy the Porsche but if you are pasionate, you buy the Alfa.
Dodo M And If you want to be reliable buy the GT86!
+john marsh I had a chat with a lady the other day. She had a red 2014 plate S40 Volvo on her driveway. I said to her, nice car to wich she replies: "i am bored of it already". Why? "I want a Jag". Why? "Well, everyone wants one, who doesn't like a Jag".
If you can drive, Alfa is faster round the track than the Porsche. That says enough.
the alfa is more stable in the corners, it's really a mini supercar the others move around the curves too much which for me says a lot about the supremacy of the alfa. And the 4c looks really really good
The GT-86 is a great car for the money. But it seems like a kids car. Appreciated by 15 year old boys, who loves playing Forza Motor Sport on the Xbox. And thinks "hellaflushing" is "hella awesome"...
The Cayman is a car that loves to do everything right. But that's also its downside. Because it seems to take things a little too seriously. It's like that guy who always walks around with a sour look on his face, and can be a bit smug.
The 4C is beauty and poetry in motion, Italian soul and passion. But it lacks the dramatic sound of its older sibling the 8C. And it's not offered in a proper manual. Which is what most people who buys these kinds of cars are looking for.
All of these cars have different floats. Different floats for different boats. Me? Personally? I'd go with the Alfa. I can't pass up on that Italian charm. It's just so sexy. And filled with so much emotion. Although it lacks some of the drama of it's older brother in the sound department. It's still the car, I'd fall deeply in love with. Sure. It isn't "perfect" like the Porsche. And it's more expensive than the Toyota. But all of that pretty much becomes irrelevant, once you chose the car you most desire. And I'm sure 4C owners will be very proud of their purchase.
Well man,well said.
No. The Alfa is junk, and people it's amazing because of this Soul and Passion BS. If mass production and horrible reliability is "Soul and Passion" that means the car with the most "Soul and Passion" a Lada Riva. Also the Alfa is head turning for the wrong reasons (IMO)
camouflagecamaro99
How can I take your opinion seriously. when you like Camaros?
krocialblack because a Camaro doesn't fall apart after 5 minutes of ownership.
camouflagecamaro99 "mass production"? 3500 a year will be made and they're finished in Modena at Maseratis manufactory, mainly build up per hand ... sorry, but get your facts right, before talking shit. You highly likely never drove an Alfa, but you sure can repeat untruth parrot-fashion.
Alfa's headlights look like shit, it doesn't sound good at all and his comment on the steering wheel feeling numb sorry but no thanks. I've driven both 86 and cayman and those two are great drivers cars. Cayman is more of a luxury product, the 86 something that you can drive everyday.
In 2 years when they've hopefully sorted out the steering/chassis, the Alfa may then be a true contender.
Great review, and thanks again. Hello from Seattle!
Buy the Scion FR/S! And what you save on it you can invest in making it blow the others off the track!
Also I have never understood the obsession with stock performance...when I looked a sports car I found that loved the way the fd rx7 looked so I got one and built it up and now it's great
I'd rather take the 4C knowing I'm not going to pull up to a traffic light and see the same car to my right, left, behind and in front of me. Not to mention the looks - the other two were designed by a committee and look rather basic while the Alfa was designed by a man by the name of Lorenzo Ramaciotti. Sound familiar? No? Well, he designed the Maserati Gran Turismo as well as the Ferrari Enzo.
I don't know how this test driver can find defects in driving an Alfa 4C... Typical English nonsense complains about an Italian masterpiece. On track that's simply a perfect balanced car, with almost perfect grip and surgical precision in turns. At 3.55 it is visible how much over steering has a Cayman on same turns with a 4C attached behind it... Alfa 4C is the best and sorry for you that it is not an Lotus...
Just out of curiosity, why wasn't the Lotus Elise or possibly the Exige included in this test? Wouldn't it be important to compare the Alfa to the Cayman anddd the Lotus? They all sort of have the same goals (small, mid-engine *apart from brz*, light weight, not excessive power) so it seems important that the Lotus be included...
One of these days I'd like to see a similar comparison, but with a supercharged GT86 that's equipped with some sticky summer tires. The steering on the Toyobaru is out of this world, so... what if you give it comparable power and grip?
+Mike Doolittle Toyobaru; love it!
It is just unbelievably funny how based this review was. You first noticed when he talked about being 'safe'. So you talk about you know what your rear does and that it is much more secure while sliding through a corner while the Alfa ON THE SAME SPEED is directly behind you without losing grip. That is such a good review. Then you talk about how the Porsche's gearbox is much mor 'crisp' when suddenly accelerating while you can see the Alfa still directly behind him. So funny. Thumbs down (;
The sort of review that has nothing to do with 99% of us. Commentary based on traction off, wet and dry track driving, and drifting. To be fair, this review is all about Steve, not the 4C.
So at the end of the day it's a matter of, "Which would you rather drive?" I'd have to agree on the fact that having a joyful ride is what matters. If you want to get your car sideways, GT86 all day. You want a pretty car, 4C. You want the MR performace, the Cayman. All comes down to what you want.
I was looking at the GT86 or Scion FR-S as it's called here in the states, but I don't think I can justify getting one with as much as it snows in the Chicago-land area. I'm probably going to end up going with a Subaru WRX just because the winter has been horrible this year, and I'm assuming the WRX will perform worlds better than the FR-S in the snow.
Vortex1988 With good winter/snow tires on, the FRS is quite liveable in the winter, check out the regional forums on ft86club.com, tons of guys there from Canada and their winters are much worse that Chicago. Good luck with your decision! :)
Vortex1988 I drove mine all winter here in Iowa. Daily drove it, actually. Never lost control and, with the proper tires, you can have a lot of fun and still move around better than most SUVs… :) (I did put a couple of sandbags in the trunk for good measure)
***** I might have to take it for a test drive and reconsider. I'm having second thoughts on the WRX anyway just because it seems like it would be a little too expensive to live with. I was starting to think more along the lines of a Ford Focus ST, but maybe I'll have to give the FR-S or BRZ a second look.
When the other 2 cars are already going sideways you can clearly see the 4C behind them at the same speed with yet some grip left, and it could easily do another 20km/h in the corners. I don't see a point in this test, and no mention that the 4C is clearly faster than the Porsche?
Exactly!
Second! Well done Cayman, and not even a S :)
NICE VIDEO STEVE!
It is a pity, that such a promising car ends up with under steering. What happened Alfa???
Porsche at this point. cannot be beaten with the final setup of the cars.
Alfa most likely put the under steer there for safety. I felt zero under steer in the Cayman.
I don't think, that Alfa put under steer as safety feature. For such a car it would be stupendous. I just think, that the dimensions [very short wheel base and comparable very wide] and set up is responsible for that.
To be "fun"-beaten by the GT86 is a big deal - as it is so much cheaper.
I hadn't got a doubt, that the Cayman is beating the hell out of it - as it is considered one of the best handling cars currently available [even in comparison with the 991 it is doing very well].
Dominik MJ car dynamics aren't that simple.
Still, with some setup and a different tire option you can change a bit the way the Alfa behaves. The thing is... would you?
This is a car that can satisfy you in the same intensity that an Elise can when driving in a B road, but it has the looks and the charm that no Lotus can give you.
The Porsche is a better car. But it is also a different car. I don't think of them the same way.
Renan Martinuzzo You are definitely right. But setting it up more neutral [with some a chance to slightly oversteer] would actually make it a legendary car. Like it is, it makes it only to an interesting option.
Is it enough to sell? Yeah definitely - you can have enough fun with it - and it is anyway produced in small numbers. And a lot of people go anyway more over style than substance.
But it is also disappointing. Alfa almost in any generation, amazing cars, which just lacked the final bit, to help the brand to emerge. And they had always quality issues... It doesn't seem, that they integral changed that...
I would say Lotus may have the edge on them.
Who have ever bought an Alfa with their "sensible hat" on really ?!? ;D
Bit of a disappointment that it didn't perform better (in this review) though but still a GREAT leap in the right direction for Alfa that have been hold back by fwd FIAT platforms for far to long. Anyways good that FIAT stepped in and we still have them around, the car world would be a much more boring place without Alfa Romeo.
PS: Dry track and LAPTIMES PLZ !!
Forza Alfa !! :)
Your final comment says it all. Great review!!!
0-60 in 86 is accually 6.2 not a hellish 7.7 if you get the proper version (manual)
Is the Alfa better than the RCZ-R that they were raving about the other day?
Well, I am looking forward to driving the 4c. For me going sideways is not critical and turbo lag is surely not much of an issue if you keep the revs up. Also I think that small fast cars are normally set up with initial under steer. Everybody knows Alfa cannot go from the dross they have previously been responsible for to perfection in one hit - but this looks pretty good to me.
How would the 4C handle with 225 width tires all around? Maybe the venerated over steer would come out to play so journalists would rate it higher. The Alfa is certainly the most interesting car of the bunch and by far the best looking.
I get my FR-S sideways every time I drive it. I keep saying I need to stop but its so fun and easy.
The new 981.2 Caymans will be turbo and will completely eliminate any comparison to an 86 chassis and rightfully so. I'd still like to see a tuned 4c up against a Cayman. It's something about an Italian designed sports car and a carbon fiber tub that makes me scratch my head. However the 4C loses out on practicality,but even with that deficiency it's an awesome package.
That Alpha is a damn beautiful car. Why can't we have them here in the U.S!
you mean alfa lol
LoL, oops. Yes.
It's coming later this year. At over 60k.
Lotus yes, but wtf GT86/FT86 was doing in this vs .
Is Drifting a reason to buy between 4C and Cayman ?
Couldn't miss the point more in this video ,
We need track times, braking distance, acceleration times, repriz, looks, materials, design etc ... not noob drifting lol lol lol
That's the correct, both Porsche and Alfa were designed to stay on the track. Why would someone want to drive car that wants to kill them at 40 Mph, while they can just calm take those turns?!
4C always. Don't understand people who would rather have Porsche or Scion. Only car better than Alfa is Maserati, and Ferrari of course. Thank you God for Italy.
The people who take the porsche is because they want something more refined and everyday usable.
God bless you. cijev-
Good review. And I absolutely agree! It's amazing Alfa makes that car but you just cannot not go for the Cayman!
Toyota GT86 Is the KING!
4c and cayman vs gt 86?????😐😐😐😐 are you kidding me or are you drunk?? 50.000_70.000$ cars vs 20.000 $ car????? 5.5_4.5 0.100 vs 8 sec 0.100??? Can you other Comparison like this??? Like hurcan vs ford fista??? Or like this?? 🤣🤦♂️
I still like HONDA S2000. Manual with NA engine!!!
I think Hammond has been the only one to really praise the Aha. I personally really like it, but I can't understand how it isn't a better driver's car. I mean your cousins are Ferrari and Maserati and they know a thing or two about properly building a brilliant car in the road and track. Still the Alfa will always feel special.
Does this guy work for Porsche? No, even Porsche wouldn't do this kind of biased review. There's a Porsche in every review he does and it always comes out on top with perfect marks. It's a great shame these reviews are a complete waste of time.
86 & Cayman > 4C for one particular reason: MANUAL TRANSMISSION.
I have to say I'm a tuner guy and been looking at the 4c...I think I'll go with the c7 stingray. Same price, looks more aggressive, and more hp
You buy the Alfa with your heart, the Porsche with your head.
Everyone always goes on about how much fun the 86 is but can you still have fun on public roads with it ?
Well yes until it all goes horribly wrong and you smash sideways into a ditch and get arrested for reckless driving .
Lap times? It is a nice review of handling, but we need to see which is faster on the track.
Sutcliffe you mean it doesnt drift 240hp 900 kg? Really steve? really? how the hell chriss harris did it and loved it..Really sutcliffe? Well you can do better ,i am sure
Great vid as always from Autocar.
But some thoughts.....
Anybody can see that the Porsche is more "car" (and more GT) than the Alfa, and that comes at a price (see the vast Porsche option list, the fuel consumption, maintance costs, road tax, production numbers; here in the NL the featured Cayman is easily 30 to 40% more expensive than the 4C.
And is the Alfa really intended to be a Cayman rival ?? It seems that the British car press avoids any comparison with the 4c's more natural rivals; the Lotus Elise and Exige...
Judging both cars dynamics, its seems the Porker moves around more/has more bodyroll than the Alfa. And the damp/mildly moist track certainly doesn't favor the lightweight 4C.
And really; does the electro assisted steering in the Cayman offer more feedback and feel than the non-assisted steering in the 4C ??
No laptimes ???
A tip for Alfa, try not to make a car that sounds like Gran Turismo games, it's not a good thing.
You may say that the Cayman is better than the 4c, but from the pictures one can easily conclude the opposite: the 4C rides rings around the Porsche, its wheels go like in rails and in a track and for a sportscar that is what matters. Besides its way lighter and it would leave the Porsche miles behind if it went for a small race.
I really think that the mazda based roadster may be more fun than the 4c. FRD cars are more fun than mid engine to me.
My god I see the alfa... have a massive grip :P and it's too fast and more equilibrate, the cayman it's an elephant with a doggy rear ... I understand that the driver is too Old for understand XD a "cheap" (like carbon,prof. suspension, only1750cc) supercar that the alfa build for everyone, (for young peolple, for sports people for tuning peolple ) he want the confort, the brand etc..... ok... but the test is with the lotus... the porsche and the Subaru it's too much different
I am bias I know that, but the Porsche don't have nothing on the Alfa.
Alfa 4C is way faster, better looking and it has passion.
I¨ll take the 4C any day.
I maybe about to buy a '70 Spider (think The Graduate) but maybe I'll save a bit more for a 4C. He was just cruising in the review...
I'm quite shocked about all the negative comments against what is clearly the best sports car money can buy. It's quicker, track or otherwise, it handles as flat as a pancake when travelling at speed when cornering, it sounds amazing and no I don't have the sports exhaust, it's practical, 2 suitcases, 2 overnight bags, 2 rucksacks and 2 people on a recent trip for two weeks in Scotland, it's reasonable to insure and if you really want to drive within the limits you can get 40mpg (I know I've done it without kerb crawling). It will also be worth more in 5 years, check out the used prices for the old model. Now get real and go and drive the PORSCHE or better still buy one before posting ridiculous comments on You Tube with no basis in fact whatsoever and no I'm certainly not a snob.
I'll have the alfa any day, even if it's slower or it breaks down.
u can go side ways in the 4c. Chris said so in his review. The car with 2 personalty. Hes even going sideways with the 4c at the end of the video....
I suppose it's more about the weight distribution. The alpha is mid engine.
The fact I'd prefer the significantly cheaper 86 despite the way the way the Alfa looks and sounds says it all really. Of course money no object I'd go the Porsche every time :-D