Link's Awakening, Remakes, Art Styles, and OPINIONS
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- Опубліковано 28 лют 2019
- Link's Awakening is getting a remake, and opinions on the art style are split. So let's talk about the game, the hubbub surrounding it, and even about opinions themselves.
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/ arlostuff
TWOOTER: @ArloStuff
BOOKFACE: ArloStuff
This video was edited by the lovely Kane!
/ farfetchdreviews
Thank you to all of the wonderful channels who allowed us to use their footage: GameXplain, Chuggaconroy, Wanderbots, Masae Anela, ZackScottGames, Game Grumps, World of Longplays (Tsunao, Tarosan, RickyC, and Spazbo4), Scykoh Plays, BearBear, and packattack04082!
drive.google.com/file/d/1HqZN...
"Reloaded Installer #11" by LHS.
/ @lhschiptunes - Ігри
There was a miiverse guy who reviewed the water in every Wii U game he could get ahold of.
What was his favorite Water
Adam Mills He seemed quite indifferent about any kind of water. He got aroused about Black Flags oceans just as much as with same-colored puddles in your everyday GBA games.
That's one heck of a -gimmick- passion
I remember him playing a Lego game and saying "For a Lego game, that some realistic water"
BUT WHY?
Well, I mean, that's just your opinion...
Nice opinion
is this alex from nintendo life here?
Big lebowsky reference?
mannn!
I love that we can have these philosophical debates on a youtube page for a muppet who reviews video games.
Muppet ? He's from sesame street ! How DARE you bring up...
the "Other guys"...
Real though
ua-cam.com/video/rDpW135jscY/v-deo.html
Here’s an actual debate there’s time stamps in the pinned comment. Arlo doesn’t seem to understand the definition of arguments. They are something you make to support your point of view not just people yelling insults. It’s perfectly fine acceptable and polite to make arguments against another stance it is not inherently insulting to make reasoned arguments.
It feels more clay-like than plastic to me. Clay sculptures painted and glossed, with some ceramic tilework thrown in for good measure.
I like it.
The art style is a HUGE call back to the Japanese commercial for Links Awakening on Game Boy.
It is also a style that mirrors the original game.
In that context the art style is not all that surprising.
It's nice that the video addresses your exact points.
I forgot to add this. ua-cam.com/video/Trl0cvBFgCk/v-deo.html I think it's pretty cool to see how the commercial is represented in the remake.
To those in the comments, I'm not arguing with anyone. Just offering context as to why Nintendo might have gone with the style.
also with the shift in style between the opening and the game kinda makes sense if you know the twist.
it's all a dream, and dreams hardly look realistic.
my one ask is that at least the artstyle used during the intro is used at least one more time.
when link reads and reacts to the relief of the southern face shrine.
Then by that logic, LTTP should be a rap dance remake.
ua-cam.com/video/cjpHzLYHkwA/v-deo.html
...... Actually that would be pretty sweet to see just as like a side quest thing..
In this video a man spends an inordinate amount of time talking about how much he dislikes the way people dislike other people disliking things.
An earthbound remake in the style of Links Awakening would be perfect
I have never agreed with anything more in my entire life
PK stfu Ω too bad Nintendo doesn’t care about earthbound anymore
Eustace Bagge you just completely went against the point arlo is trying to say literally in this video
That would be awesome
Ive been thinking about this all week
"accuracy shouldn't always be the end goal of a remake". CAN YOU PLEASE TELL DISNEY.
IKR that’s why the lion king remake was so weird, it’s like I love the lion king but I don’t want a shot for shot remake
Someone told disney and they made that mulan garbage. How could you!
@@ethanhendershot6254 its not a shot for shot remake...no dress in drag doing the hula
They don't even do that, they lazily recreate the visuals and the songs while also missing key details that prove they don't understand what made them work the first time, and every so often they'll make some needless little changes that actually take away more than they add.
Or they make a Mulan.
Which is arguably worse.
My dad always told me that when people result to attacking your character, they have lost the argument.
See flat earthers? People who have intelligence win!
@@TheRegularHedgehog575 Or Suspicious0bserver followers. ESPECIALLY them.
Let's be real we all just want Zelda to go back to the first two Zelda CDI games' art style
*shudders*
It sure is boring around here
@@popnson6037 Mah boi...
This peace is what all true warriors strive *for*.
what could possibly go wrong?
FamilyTeamGaming *"I'm so hungry I could eat a Dodongo!"*
Something to keep in mind is that everyone can have their opinion, but that doesn't mean all opinions are created equally. It might be someone's "opinion" that The Shawshank Redemption is a horrible movie, but without facts, arguments, or logic to back that opinion up - it can easily be labeled as a poor opinion or at least a poor manifestation of an opinion.
In particular, if someone sends their opinion into a public sphere, such as Twitter or UA-cam, they should reasonably expect that opinion to be questioned and even criticized. In fact, people often benefit from this as it encourages them to consider how different viewpoints interact with their own leading to a more comprehensive perspective. Opinions ought to be challenged and discussed. Robust discussion and disagreement are often how good ideas flourish and bad ideas wither.
Opinions are not some sacred standpoint that protects you from criticism. I do agree with you that people should refrain from namecalling or attacking others during disagreement, but it seems to me like your standpoint is discouraging lively conversation. If someone says "the new Zelda art style is trash," without any logic or evidence, I think it's appropriate to say their opinion is underdeveloped or poorly thought out.
This comment is underated
😑
no u
😉 you make good points. Especially about what is expected when one puts their own opinion into the public sphere.
Agreed, though I don't think that was quite Arlo's conclusion-more "even if you think your opinion is better thought out, you can't expect that to necessarily change someone's mind, or think that your opinion is 'objectively' better".
Agreed
Exactly, once you give arguments for your opinion they can be debated.
You can say "I like Mario 64 it's the best game ever" and that's fine. People might question how well thought out your opinion if it's based on you thinking that because the moon is made of cheese, you liked the final boss against the saxophone monster, and you only played the game for 5 minutes in your cousins house back in 1997.
I like the new look, I think it has a unique style. If they made a game series with the same graphics over and over, each game wouldn't have its own unique feel and design, plus this might give the game the ability to stand up to time just like games that were made in a cell shaded style back then.
Also it's just adorable. It's all so goddamn cute I love it.
Like new super mario bros
I honestly like the art style, aside from the way the characters look. The claymation aesthetic is kind of neat.
I love the art style and the characters, I just wish there was some diversity in the square for square assets- for example, a forest of the same trees and perfectly cut grass
I get more of a claymation vibe from it and personally I dig it
Plus the puppets
This!
Glad to hear someone else thinks this too (love the claymation style) - besides, there is no sense in repeating the original graphical style. That game already exists. Why not try something a bit new?
You're objectively wrong in your subjective opinion. You only feel that way because you such and such.
In all seriousness, I'm not really a fan of the style. But thinking of it as claymation makes it a little easier to swallow.
Either way, I'm going to love the heck out of this game regardless of art style.
I like the art style fine.
Personally I'm just happy to get a new Zelda game.
This is a new golden age for Nintendo fans.
Switch online dont look like gold.
So, how do you feel today?
I think it looks alright excited to play it !
"New".
Absolutely, this is a great year to be a Nintendo lover.
The BRILLIANCE of Zelda games is they have different art styles yet they all work so well. It follows Nintendo's design philosophy strictly, form follows functions.
If the Links Awakening remake was in black and white though...
What function is this form following?
I adore the art style they went to in the remake. It’s so adorable. I wanted to play it because it looked so cute.
I’m excited as I’ve never gotten to play this game before.
Discorded Spectrum I never got that far, but I love Koizumi’s other Nintendo games, so I hope it’s faithful!
Luckyu
@@chiefexecutivebutttaster1758 Dude I was about to talk about how I was excited to rediscover everything too, but then you felt the need to write that horrific second paragraph. Why did you have to put these things into my mind? who hurt you???
you're in for a treat.
i will say, as someone who has started with the original game: i can think up of one really good story-related reason as to why koholint looks so... plastic-y.
Same here
Yeah but that's just, like, your opinion, man
This aggression will not stand
Pai has a very punchable face
Joe moe... your profile picture is...
Came looking for this in the comments
Lebowski rules!
Lol
I'd leave a comment but I wouldn't want to be accused of being "closed minded" or "immature" for discussing someone's opinion.
You are truly stunning and brave...
or literally Hitler, who am i to judge? Both can be true. I mean are true. And valid.
@@KorporalNoobs there are no more comments because as Arlo said we aren't supposed to comment back against a comment because of that dumb free speech thing
@Fluffynator There's a major difference between trying to tear down an opinion and debate it reasonably.
This is a great video, but there's two things I wish you would have mentioned:
Objectivity exists. Not all opinions are equal because not all of them are well informed. This doesn't matter when talking about something like an artstyle, but it does in other subjects.
The second thing ties into the first. Saying "I don't like this" is completely reasonable. You're just stating an opinion and you don't even really have to be able to defend it. When someone says "this is bad" though, you're not longer saying what you think, you're phrasing it like what you're saying is objectively true. This is also fine, but in this case you need to be able to back up what you're saying. If you say something's bad, "it's just my opinion" doesn't explain how said thing is bad.
Anyways, I hope this game has new content they just haven't shown us yet. I'm super excited regardless though.
EDIT: just remembered, the split doesn't really seem 50/50. It seems like most people like how the game looks, and a large chunk of people who said they don't ended up just not liking Links eyes. It's not everyone, but I don't think there's a huge divide
Well... Recently quantum physicists discovered evidence objective reality may not actually exist after all.... xD
(go search for it ;-) )
By the way, if you say something's bad, "it's just my opinion" just clarifies the statement was not meant to be stating a fact. There's nothing wrong with that either. In fact, it fully excuses someone to back up what they were saying since they made it their own opinion. That in turn also means it fully excuses others to have/keep their own opinion on the matter.
There's nothing wrong with stating an opinion in a way that seems like stating a fact. And saying "it's just my opinion" is a perfectly valid clarification afterwards. ;-)
@@LittleLionRawr I disagree. "It's just my opinion" doesn't explain why something is bad. And again, it's possible for someone to be wrong, objectively speaking, when they state an opinion. It's a lot easier to say "I don't like this" because someone can't argue that you *do* like it. I guess the phrasing just shows if you're willing to debate the topic.
I think a good example of this would be someone saying "breath of the wild is the worst game of all time." Objectively speaking, they're wrong. If someone says "I think breath of the wild is the worst game of all time." You can't argue that. It's possible to disagree, but you couldn't argue that they *don't* think that
@@PinkKips No it doesn't explain why it is bad. It doesn't even try to do that. It explains the person making that statement has the _opinion_ that it's bad. It explains that it's a subjective statement, not an objective one. In their opinion it is bad (i.e. they dislike/disagree with it for some reason). It's a clarification.
Well you might find it easier to say "I don't like this" but really that's easier for the reader/listener. What's most easy for the writer/speaker of the statement is just expressing their opinion however they want. So if they say _"this is bad"_ and really _mean_ "in my opinion this is bad" it's just their way of saying it. Inconvenient for you, especially if you take things literally and only as opinion if it's explicitly stated as opinion. But lets be real, most opinions aren't.
90% -(*warning arbitrarily chose percentage)- of opinions are expressed in a fact form. And most of the time it's not done to show a willingness to debate, but rather just nonchalant expression. Clarifying that it's their opinion afterwards shows a clear _unwillingness_ to debate that opinion (or at least an unwillingness to change it).
Frankly, being very specific about stating your opinions in opinion form shows more of a willingness to debate. Since you're explicitly making that distinction. ;-)
Rember we dont talk zelda politics around family
Energetic force especially when...... Dear God smirking !
@@bandicootsauce4569 o and dont forget hyrule has the longest dictitorship in history
You know, it was wrong for them to deport those interlopers. They just have wants like everyone else. People should stop comparing all Twili to Zant
I completely agree with you Arlo. Also as someone studying to be a geologist I can firmly say that BotW has the best rocks of all.
I don't know. Rock of ages has some good ones. Namely the titular ones.
Wouldn't you like to know *ROCK BOI*
"But it's a rock."
"I KNOW IT'S A ROCK! Don't you think I know a rock when I see a rock? I've spent a lot of time around rocks!"
- Flik and Dot, A Bug's Life
I feel that the skyward sword art style would have really fit the Link's Awakening remake really well. I always felt that the art style felt very dreamlike.
But with a top view angle? I don't know.
4:12 But if you built your house in the hills and your neighbor built theirs in the trees...
They wouldn't be your neighbor
That's true.
I still like the example.
@@pokefanlight its kinda a shitty example though because its a blatant bad faith exaggeration since a confident person would just argue not be insane like how he sees it
A Super Mario RPG remake with this toy artstyle would be perfect!
hell no
Hell yes
Actually I agree.
The renders for the game and the sprites themselves have this stiff toylike feel that would be amazing if made toylike in a remake.
Just... hold off the shininess on everything. That's my only problem with the remake's artstyle.
It should look like the concept art, like the game cover.
I'd need to see concept art with it to agree... but intriguing idea.
I like the art style but I felt cheated when there was a cool hand drawn style opening for the trailer I thought we were getting a hand drawn two dimensional zelda game.
I think that's the main problem. A lot of people thought the game was going to be more like the cinematic, but i honestly don't think that particular style would fit Link's Awakening.
I think that's the part that a lot of people had a problem with.
It's like Diablo mobile all over again. You made them expect one thing and give them something entirely different.
You can't blame the customers for that.
I mean, the original back on the gameboy had the exact same thing with the opening. And this kind of artstyle matches the game perfectly, based on what the original looked like.
@@dtothee8730 thats the whole point of links awakening especially when you see the puppetry of the japanese commercials
Universal Sketch
You've a neat profile picture.
I believe the Zelda franchise has always been a big giant collection of different art style that in theory shouldn’t be able to work in one continuity and yet... it isn’t really bothersome. I just see it as different artists giving their own art style to add variety and contribute to that big artwork that is the franchise. If I don’t like the art style this time around, well I can sit this one out and maybe next time I would get something more fitting for my taste (such as BOTW 2 for example).
good point, and I really think that works for the Zelda franchise as a whole. each game is that age's retelling of the eternal story of Link's triumph over evil. it makes sense for Windwaker, for example, to look like a fun whimsical adventure because that's exactly how a seafaring, pirate- esque civilization would recall that story over a few rounds of rum
I would love to see Oracle of Ages and Seasons remade for the Switch.
Hell yes.
I am officially sick of watching link swing his sword at that chubby fish and missing it!😑😑😑
Every single time I think, "This time he'll get it!"
I just want a majoras mask like sequel for BOTW.
Hudson Dunn you said it brother
well botw already had only 4 dungeons that were all terrible and swords that broke after 50 hits
@@yourehereforthatarentyou lmao, sadly you couldn't wear the faces of the deceased champions though
Do you mean a sequel that is similar to majoras mask, or a sequel to botw the way oot had a sequel which was majoras mask
Oh boy, ABSOLUTELY I would be on that.
in my opinion, i like the style for the game, it makes the game feel more new and glossed over like a toy ( like you mentioned ) but your opinion is also understandable, it is a little over the top maby sometimes
Maybe*
"You are not the thot police." -Arlo, on May 1st 2019
Ain't it March though
I was not expecting this going into the comments but I can't say I'm disappointed, well done sir
I personally really like the art style. If you dislike the style, that's fine. More power to you. But I really enjoy it, and hope more games adopt a similar style (cough EARTHBOUND REMAKE cough)
Yeah, this looks totally MOTHER-y. Didn't those games also have clay artworks?
Actually that's not a terrible idea, in fact, that is the best idea I ever heard for a remake. In fact, I got a better idea, what if the Mother trilogy was released digitally for the Switch to bring old fans and new fans into the series, but months later, they announce remakes of the original trilogy fully remastered for the Switch just like Crash Bandicoot N Sane Trilogy but with the Link's Awakening remake art style!!
That sounds good, but I can't really see how they could recapture the eeriness of giygas with that artstyle
Honestly had a dream that they remade the mother trilogy in that art style lol
Jhozan the final boss would be ruined with this art style
I feel like I got a lecture on opinions rather then a discussion about links awakening.
Edit: When I clicked on the video I didn't see opinions in the title in capital letters and I didn't read the description. I didn't expect such a large portion of the video to be dedicated to opinions and I was considering getting link's awakening and it would've been my first Zelda game. I understand that I should have known a large part of the video would be about opinions so I shouldn't have expressed disappointment as there was no reason for me to have it.
True, but the whole thing is about opinions on Link's Awakening.
Edit: After thinking about it, I do agree and I wish the video was more centered around Link's Awakening and not a philosophical discussion.
i got to the 5 minute mark and was wondering what the hell i was doing wasting my time. I think i'm getting a bit bored of these videos where he just rambles about mostly nonsense
@@swinefluwillkillu I think he actually made a very good point about the manner of opinions and the culture surrounding them in video games. At least, I found it really fun and interesting to listen to.
@@swinefluwillkillu pretty much in his videos that arent reviews are just 20 minuets of rambling.
Ya I’m a fan of his but this video did not need to be 22 mins...
I really didn't see the "toy" look of the aesthetic until you mentioned it. Still think it's adorable as all get out.
The art style is fantastic.
TOMMY.TV I disagree. The art style is kiddy, unoriginal and jarring. I don’t like it.
@@happymaskedguy1943 I can see why, But I kinda disagree, it look's decent (although I'd prefer the link between worlds style for this tbh). but I'd like to wait for the final release before completely judging it.
I think it looks fine. Definitely like how they translated the original to 3D. Really like they're keeping so true to the original.
I also think the shiny unrealistic style fits with a story that's not happening in regular reality.
I would definitely also like to see a Zelda in the anime style of that intro but I don't mind this one isn't that. In fact, I'd rather have a completely new Zelda in that art style so that the game can be designed from the ground up with that art style in mind...
I definitely don't think the art style is unoriginal/jarring. Maybe child like, but that's not an issue. There's really nothing wrong with that.
The art style's fine for what it is- definitely just the exact same game, but they took the sprite sheet and converted it to 2.5d. and for a zelda with mario elements in it, I think it fits well enough. Mario loves being plastic and I love plastic mario.
To me zelda can be any art style, I don't think it has a set identity in that department. If this had been a brand new game, no one would have raised an eyebrow. This one just feels kind of jarring, for a remake? when they remade majora and oot and windwaker that was nicer, because thats how good I thought it looked when I was a kid. they didn't completely change the style of them. which, by the way, there's nothing wrong with trying new art styles. they're everywhere and zelda does it ALL THE TIME. but if you're remaking something and you want it to be completely faithful, I don't get why that would be the one element to make a complete departure.
Personally, if i want to play the exact same game i enjoyed as a kid, I'll just go pick up the exact same game i had as a kid, or emulate it. i don't want brand new graphics because thats part of the charm. but a lot of people do, they want their old games to look just as good as all the new ones. so just update the sprites so they look modern. It's not like 2-d, pixellated games don't sell anymore. fix the colors, add more frames to the animations, update the pixel count- improve what you already have. thats the whole point of a remake, isn't it? if you keep everything the same except the style, then whats the point? Why wouldn't you keep making changes? that would be like them only changing the music. or just changing the mechanics of the game. either do a faithful remake, or go all out with a reimagining. These half-way things just seem to put people off, and they give me a weird vibe, personally.
I don't know, those are just my thoughts on the situation. I'm not huge on remakes anyway, since I figure the games already been done, why do it again? and actually I kind of always hope it'll end up being what the developers would've made if they had done it today, instead of way back when.
I know thats not at all what anyone but me wants to see, but its always a little disheartening. maybe it feels a little like wasted potential? I just want new games from nintendo, not more of the same old. again though, thats just me.
like seriously, Ive yet to see another nintendo fan, aside from Arlo, who wants to see something brand spanking new and exciting for these awesome franchises. which is why he so fun to watch. we can get super hyped and raise our hopes impossibly high, and then be disappointed together :p
@@LittleLionRawr
It is just trying to keep as faithful to the original as they can while giving it more than just a slightly noticeable in it's artistic change. First time I saw it I thought this was weird. Now looking at it especially compared to the original it actually does make sense trying to keep the feel of the original which was a great charm of the original.
take a shot every time he says “opinion”
Do you want people to die from alcohol intoxication?!
I'm too drunk to taste this chicken.
Dpn t d7 this mu bran hrats jnbjhdtnthjhgku,djjvhfbdkdcpfkfnnf
@@zogwort1522 ?
2:45 You went a little too hard on the mid-path thing. Conversation should be civil, of course, but arguments made in bad faith should be labeled as such in conversation. If they don't know how that opinion sounds, tell them how it sounds. You don't have telepathy, but you have ears and eyes.
It’s pretty stupid what he was saying, you shout be able to call out hateful and toxic opinions (racism, sexism etc). Obviously I agree when I comes to links awakening but not all arguments/opinions
Also, it is valid to "attack" an argument; "I like the new art style because of X", "But X is not true for the art style"
@@defeqel6537 i like X artstyle despite what people might say.
(: p)
Hateful and misinformed opinions should be called out, and Arlo says as much at 21:27. But his main point is that you should be MINDFUL-- we're often too quick to assume different opinions/arguments are made in bad faith, when really they're just... different.
Agreed. Especially when those kind of assumptions are being made from opinions formed out of bite sized comments online. Be mindful and also try your best to respect someone's differing view point, regardless of what it is.
Man your analysis of the art style and how wrong it is for this game is spot-on. I am in mourning over what they've done with Link's Awakening and I was actually looking forward to a remake of LA. :(
The art style is so cute! I'm 5 months away from being 31, and it kind of brings me to my childhood, sitting on the floor with my toys all over the place. I love it. Wait, you don't like SS's art style? I respectfully disagree with you and still want to be your friend, but you deserve a disapproving frown. The Wii made some games look very blurred and washed out. TP is a very good example, and to me, SS's aesthetics were an improvement.
I love the newer intro with the weird noises!
The Luigi’s mansion three one is the best
Slothster 0612 There was a recent Arlo intro that was just like ‘waoha ’ and it’s great
They’re all great
on the rare occasions he now uses the Switch snap sound I'm a little saddened because that means half a second of less Arlo goodness in my life :'(
[Insert comment ironically invalidating Arlo's opinion]
RayFlyer What do you mean
16:10 "Accuracy shouldn't always be the end goal of a remake. I think capturing the spirit of the original and expanding on it, overall improvement, should be the goal."
I hadn't thought of it that way before. Remakes sometimes bug me when they change things from the original material, but in hindsight, that's a surface-level reading of a work. That quote's a good one to remember.
My only problem with this game is Link's face... 😅
HOOGY SPOOKY!!!!!!!
I'm not going, I just felt left out.
Arlo should reference the rocks in a game in every review
@@WaluigiisthekingASmith That's very unrelated.
Thank you so much Kane for putting my 100% very real tweet in Arlo’s video 0:20
(I’m BenBen)
You rascal, you feel like having a rough sadomasochistic three way with our boi Arlo later?
You're one of my favourite commenters on UA-cam. It genuinely warms my heart to see Arlo has such dedicated fans. My little sisters are 6 and 9 and they love Arlo, so your comments always make me think of them, I think that's why I always like seeing you. Like neither of them has a switch but they will watch Arlo videos because they love him and how he acts on camera.
Terry Beardmore :’)
AUGHHH ITS BENBEN ITS ME YOUR BIGGEST FAN!!!
I agree with everything you said Arlo except I feel you didn't condemn some of the actions on the other side or show that the other side of the argument has been guilty of many of the things you condemn the liking side of doing as well. Also I feel there is also some people who have taken a step over criticizing the game over to just insulting it and I don't think that that is a very constructive way to share criticism and that should be address too.
I just think it’s funny people will dislike cartoony/cutesey Zelda when ...
THE FREAKING GORONS
I feel like the phrase "you do you" is often used to justify any act.
There could be a murderer and some people would be like "Well to him, murdering is okay. Who are we to judge? You do you."
That was just an extreme example to make a point. I don't really think people would go that far Lol
people all condescendingly saying "you do you" as if theyre okay with you having your opinion but they clearly are not is like legit one of my biggest pet peeves
like one time i said that i thought kirby games sucked and one guy was like "yeah, youre wrong but you do you"
You do you as long as it isn't actively harming those around you.
@@thevioletbee5879
What if the person's opinion is based on something that is wrong? Should i tell them why is wrong or do what Arlo said and respectfuly disagree, leading nowhere.
It's a fucking video game art style that does not compare to murder you fucking walnut
@@matti.8465 You can argue, but they have the right to share it.
I don't love the glossy look of the trees but I do like the look of the castle. My biggest beef is that Link doesn't seem to have any emotion in his face and that his head is so large. He looks like an elf from the old Rudolph the red nose reindeer movie. That being said, I'll most likely get it.
Well, before Wind Waker there was also that EPIC trailer (with Gohma or something in 2001 if I remember right) and gave people an idea, and then WW was the opposite of that idea. I love this cute art style for Link's Awakening, and I don't see why it's controversy is compared to WW. Even so, everything at the beginning you said about turning discussion into an argument is quite true.
Context is definitely important. I have mixed feelings on Link’s Awakening’s art style, largely because it’s a remake. If this art style were used for an entirely new top-down Zelda, I think I would be much more accepting of it (although I’m not a fan of the toy style used in games like Yoshi’s Crafted World and this new Link’s Awakening - it just doesn’t gel with me at all). But because it’s in a remake, I would prefer something more like ALBW HD. The anime intro to the trailer looked amazing and it was jarring to then be thrown into a plastic toy looking box of a game. I’ll still buy it, I will probably enjoy it, but... I def have mixed feelings on the style
That's funny because I actually have the opposite opinion. I'm very accepting of the new Link's Awakening art style BECAUSE it's a remake. If they had announced a completely new 2D game and it had this art style? I think I would have been more resistant or disappointed by it. I don't know what it is, but I guess because it is a remake, nostalgia factors into it a great deal. And so the toy aesthetic makes sense to me because we also associate toys with feelings of nostalgia and it all comes together nicely for me. It's like, I dunno, breaking out my old Lego collection and building something with it.
Alex Peraza That’s fair. Actually I can kinda get behind that idea too, since the change in art style (whether one likes it or not) could be much less jarring if it’s just a remake since that’s more of a side project for them while they work on the big stuff. I still feel meh on the toy styled design, but your analogy is a nice way to think of it.
I honestly really like it's cute chibi art style 😁👌
I wish I can like it but I personally just dislike it as it is to cartoony for me ( still getting it prayers to like it)
Tbh I am fine with most things just not link the dream girl is adorable but link is to cartoony in my opinion
Edit I mean in people design not the world design
It's not the chibi character that's the problem though, it's the plastic.
Cool I hope the $60 dollar price tag is also cute 😁👌
Yea it's wonderful
This is the internet. We dont do opinions here
Imagine walking into gamestop and seeing Link's Awakening right next to Breath of the Wild, both $60
The style reminds me of frosty the snow man 90's cartoon
I didn’t realise there was a split opinion - the HD miniature look of this new game is incredible. I wasted something similar in Pokemon!
It's incredible, yes. But does it fit the game? Maybe.
@@blinkingberry9591 Yes it does with Link's awakening, the adventure is the dream of a child. So the toy-like art style is okay. But with pokemon? Nah.
I thought that too I thought people would love the artstyle
That would be cool
It’s the dream of a whale but also the dream of a child but it might’ve been the dream of a whale being had by a child
I dlnt really like the art style but i dissagree with the people who say that nintendo is just being lazy which i personally dissagree with.
I’m so sick of Arlo disregarding stuff he isn’t a fan of as lazy. That word is starting to lose its meaning
According to Arlo, you're close-minded and insecure if you disagree with him.
The style is new, fresh and unique. I like it, would feel good playing it.
I tend to gravitate towards darker grittier mature games but I honestly love this art style. Day one buy for me
if they did this game in the anime/manga art style in the intro then mmmmmmmnnnnn this would be perfect
I didn't watch the video yet(I'm doing it once I'm done writing, I swear), but that graphic style is the exact same as the photographs you could collect in the original, which, as photographs, were actual depictions of what the characters looked like. So they're being true to the source material in a legitimately cool way, and as a result, while I'm not all that fond of it, I think it was a completely justified choice.
Edit: Actually, the photographs were introduced in the DX version, but eh, I think the point still stands.
CyclonSilver But not really tho because the actual reason that the game looked like that is because it was on a handheld.
@@star_toast right. And since limitation creates art, it makes sense to evolve on that art instead of creating a totally new art, not that the latter would be worse. Mario's mustache was born of graphical limitations, but I'm glad they stuck with it instead of dropping the mustache as soon as they were able to better render a face onscreen.
@@star_toast On the photos? I don't think so, since they're drawings(granted, 8 bit ones, but still) they could have gone with a much more realistic style, which is what they did for the intro, incidentally. And interestingly, the new intro reflects that too.
To some extent it could have been limitations still, since more realistic pictures would take more space, but it seems fair to assume they had some wiggle room and went for that style in spite of that.
@@CyclonSilver Looking at the photos in the game I can see that, they did have a cartoony feel to them and the photograph element of Link's Awakening wasn't added to the DX version which was on the game boy color in December 1998, just one month after Ocarina of Time. Not sure if Ocarina of Time started the trend of Zelda games should look and be serious because one later another zelda game comes out with serious opening but interlaced with cartoony picture shots during Link's going kind of shows that Nintendo was still experimenting, or if it should be A Link to The Past that defines seriousness of a Zelda game from story than so much art style then yeah we can't really get mad at the style.
I do see an issue with the plasticy look of the switch version because like the video mentioned it's novelty is of running out. If the game has picture moments like added to gbc because of the game boy printer just instead send them to your Nintendo account or something of the sort then maybe a third art style would be seen in game, and I get people don't like chibis but to me looking at the high quality art style they went for the opening similar to older versions but DX version after photos that are cartoony I see a combination of those two styles for the switch and don't know if chibi is the right word for cutesy cartoon style that kind of tries and draws elements from the opening.
Or since they added the photos to show off the game boy printer maybe they add some new feature in the game to show of the switch. The only thing we know is the game will be released this year and it will probably gets some amiibo.... There is literally an Animal Village in the game...AN ANIMAL VILLAGE!!!! Sorry for yelling, but imagine (this is dumb I don't care) you tap the Mabel Amiibo to the switch go the new vacant house in animal village new folks are always "renting then mysteriously disappearing after" and you talk to Mabel and she offers to stich a new design e.g. plaid with green like her apron (or change to other options not sure if you make your own designs or not though), or maybe if you tap in K.K. Slider then he will offer to play Ballad of The WindFish on his guitar allowing you to walk around with Marin in more parts of the game (though if you enter a dungeon or tap in a new amiibo then she might comment on how she should get back to the village.
Ok I got waaay off topic.
TL;DR I get where their inspiration came from, but I don't like the toy look but chances a third art style is included as well as Switch marketable added features to the game.
@@seanhannan5415 It bears mentioning that to a lot of people, Awakening DX is the definitive edition of that game, since it only added to the original(afaik), though it's true that photographs were mainly in for the printer, as you pointed out. I just don't think it really takes away from their significance in terms of legacy, as many of us can remember collecting them for fun. They may have been included for questionable reasons, but they were still well integrated within the game and made for a legitimately cool sidequest.
Also just to be clear I'm not saying no other art style could have worked better, I just think copying the photographs is a pretty neat idea. And I wouldn't hold my breath for a third art style, personally, but we'll see.
While I like the style of the remake on its own, I do feel that creators really missed out on this old school cartoon aesthetic, that Zelda games around that time had going for them (which is beautifully captured in the remade intro for Awakening). I do appreciate all of the visual designs of Zelda games, and how they seemingly never really had unified style, but at the same time, I would really love a Zelda game, original or remake, that emulates those ilustrations in Link to the Past, Oracle games and Link's awakening.
It’s adorable, I want it
Also:
#WhereIsWindWakerSwitch
Oh my God yes.
Here we are at Zelda’s 35th anniversary, still asking this question lol. But heyyy Skyward Sword and joy cons! 🤣
Isn't it complaining to complain about the complainers?
There’s a load of people complaining about other people complaining about the art style. Yet I’ve seen very few complaints with the art style.
We’re perpetuating a problem that doesn’t even exist with videos like this.
He's not saying we shouldn't complain about anything, just that we should be stating reasons instead of calling the other person to be 'idiots', 'fanboys' etc, which you see from a lot of video game debates. Just look at the Pokemon Let's Go fights XD
@@ThePersonAwesome I mean, by definition a complaint is a negative opinion. So, technically, Arlo is complaining about the art style in this very video.
Everyone thinks the opposing side is the bad one. Arlo as well.
To me, whomever says "you don't get to challenge my opinion" is the tumor of the problem.
You wanna express? That's means somebody's gotta listen.
You express to the public, the public is going to express back.
If you don't want that, don't express your opinions to the public in the first place.
Nice and simple.
Calling names is out of the question though. Don't get me wrong.
Galaxy brain
Arlo: You're not a mind reader, don't assume things about people just because they do something you disagree with.
Also Arlo: Doing that means you're immature and probably don't have confidence in your opinions.
This is somewhat hyperbolic but the sentiment holds up. There's a hypocrisy in the text of what you're saying here, and it cheapens your point.
@@civiridian7540 yeah, I thought that too.
That’s exactly what I got from this video too
Yeah, he should of phrased it better. I think he was trying to say "If you attack other people's opinions and not respecfully disagree then you're immature." But I think he should have focused viewpoints more on the context of link's awakening and not as life as a whole, because I could find examples of people being wrong, and it being necessary to call them out on it.
Well, you are going down a paradoxical road that will never get to where anyone wants. He was just trying to help people understand that it is okay to dislike something and not get angry at people who like it or vis versa.
I personally adore the plastic toy art style of this remake. It brings me back to my childhood joys of playing with toys and creating my own Legend of Zelda adventures. Also, I have a good feeling Nintendo's going to surprise us with a few unexpected twists to make it an extra special remake.
Looking back at this, I think it was made to look like this to fit the story - it's a dream world
Just FYI here: "Free Speech" only means you can't be punished by the government for expressing your opinion (specifically your opinion of that government). It doesn't mean that you can be a jerk and not expect consequences for it.
Lu YES! Why is it so damn hard for people to understand this?
Jordan Shafer by “consequences” they mean people have every right to dislike you for something you say, businesses are allowed to kick you out, you can be banned from something for something youve said. Freedom of speech does not make you immune from those.
That's a bit of an oversimplification, but yes. The government is not allowed to impose force on you for expressing an idea, but they can impose force on you for defamation and libel. This also doesn't mean that because you're not a part of the government you're allowed to impose force on people for expressing idea either though.
Exactly, I agreed with Jordan. Depending on what you mean, those "consequences" could be considered illegal, such as defamation and tortious interference. As an example, say Person A makes an offensive joke. Person B in the same industry calls them a nazi or something and starts a movement to get them fired and break any business contracts they may have. As far as my understanding of the law (I'm not a lawyer), Person A would have a solid case against Person B.
@@charlespate5639 Some people use it as an excuse to justify censorship. I've seen instances of people using this very argument to defend cases of assault and slander which are still considered illegal.
One thing I missed you talking about is how people give unwanted hate towards a game because they don't like it.
Saying the new Zelda is bad because of the art style is just plain wrong, saying you don't like it is just.
Yeah that's the thing. When some people say they dislike something, they act like that thing is utter garbage that needs to be thrown away. They get extremely insulting which is why a lot of people get defensive. But like Arlo said, there is a lot that does the reverse.
Really appreciate the use of Faron Woods in the video. Takes me wayyy back.
I’m actually ok with the art style mainly for the reason of “It’s a dream, it doesn’t have to look real” and I’m willing to give the game a chance.
It’s also ironic how this video is policing the policing of others lol.
“Hey you’re wrong for saying you dislike the art style”
“Hey you’re wrong for saying they’re wrong for disliking the art style...you shouldn’t tell others what to say or do even tho that is exactly what I am doing with this video!”
Not saying it’s wrong or not okay, it’s just ironic and I don’t know if you were aware of it
That’s just the paradoxical nature of respecting opinions/free speech
Nicktendo 1 “hey you’re wrong for having that opinion”
“Hey you’re wrong for telling them they’re wrong for having that opinion”
“Hey you’re wrong for telling them they’re wrong for telling that other person they’re wrong for having that opinion”
Because you are wrong for saying someone feelings are wrong, it's that simple. You can say you don't agree with them, but saying they have wrong opinions? Uh? Okay?
Serponge Geometry Dash I mean I get it and agree, but when does it end when do we stop telling people what they’re doing or saying is wrong, easier just to ignore the people who are saying that
I think it’s wrong to scream at your child but I don’t go around telling every parent it’s wrong for them to yell at their kid, and I don’t go around telling people that it’s wrong to tell parents how to parent their kids
And I don’t tell people that it’s wrong to tell people wether or not they can or can’t tell people what to tell parents about raising their kids
@@MasonOfLife right. The best thing is to just ignore, the comment I did here was mostly there just to say why I think it makes sense for some to call out people calling out on other opinions, but in the end it would just be better to let it go. At this point I'm not too sure if this makes any sense anyway, oh well
4:49
Arlo: "Not naming names here!"
Also Arlo('s editor???): Puts pictures of tweets with names.
EDIT: Apparently they're fake tweets.
Yeah... _facepalm_
Pretty sure those were just made up tweets
@@amazingtoaster9606 Yeah, either that, or the names were probably altered
those weren't real tweets, they were made up for the video
“Kenny killed his brother when he threatened to tell Kenny’s girlfriend when she was cheating”.
“I respect your opinion, but this is mine.
Kenny never killed anyone. The “blood” on his hands was jam and what his mother saw was just a dream. She was drunk”.
“Well. I respect that, your opinion matters. But I believe...”
Link's Awakening takes place in a dream, and the "different" art style compliments that perfectly. It feels like you're in an unfimiliar world, as it should.
I just wish they would of taken a page from Alundra for the dream. This doesn't look unfamiliar to me, it just looks fake. Eh, I'll just replay the original.
I really liked the Watchmen movie :'(
Me too. It was great!
@Francisco Aceves--
That's cool! He's not saying don't like it because he doesn't like it. That was the point of his speech earlier -- it's OK to not like things others might like, or to like things others might hate. What's NOT cool is invalidating the person and making them feel like shit because they dare to like that thing.
All I got out of that movie was damn Malin Ackerman was really hot. Other than that it sucked.
@@ScarletImp Whether you think that is okay or not is in fact an opinion though. So why are you acting like the thought police now, hmmm?
The big thing that Nintendo did to botch the Winder Waker reveal was showing that Ocarina render at Space World. Everyone was so pumped to see that Link.
That eventually did happen at E3 when Twilight Princess was revealed which ranks among the biggest gaming moments I've experienced in my life.
After watching the whole video, the first second makes me laugh even harder
The art style for this looks so amazing, and makes me want to play it even more.
It’s totally okay to criticize aspects of games, and if anyone is unironically upset about people criticizing a game’s art style than that person needs to seriously grow up.
Yet, there are some brash loudmouths who express really ignorante assertions as if It were Gospel, withouth any argument or proof.
MrBKainX I feel like this comment is borderline a paradox.
… how dare I ask? @@thespeedyyoshi
Likewise, people can criticize other’s opinions. If anyone is unironically upset than that person needs to seriously grow up.
@@sajanpatel4956 well then that's an endless loop and likewise someone can criticize you criticizing the opinion of people criticizing the art style. All that sounds lovely 👍
To anyone trying to comment first: blue shell
But them "first" folks have stars and mega horns
@@krush333 Two racers have used boos and have stolen both items and there remains no protection.
*spiny
They get to a random block, and get a mushroom boost out of the way
Nicely contradicting yourself there buddy.
If anyone thinks he sounds off on his reasoning this has been immortalised in EFAP 62 53:15 onwards
🦏🥛
He got Maulered.
Just came from there.
Aw shit, long man fans have found Arlo
Who's EFAP, and how does Arlo contradict himself?
I think the art style is absolutely incredible. No complaints
Personally I think the art style is gorgeous 😍!!! Sorry Arlo but you are wrong sir 😐.
You're both close-minded and insecure
You do you, boo.
oh wow hi
THANK YOUU holy moly, I hate that sharing an opinion is treated as an invitation for personal insults. I just dont like the art style, regardless of why they used it. Also seeing the art at the beginning of the trailer made me get my hopes wayyyyy up
It's good if people challenge another's opinion, but insulting a person over it is just wrong. I hope that you don't have to deal with that every time.
Idem for the last sentence. I thought they were gonna do a hand drawn Zelda game.
Yeah, liking or disliking a design choice is NOT synonymous with understanding the reasoning behind it.
The reasoning gives us perspective, but it's the face value that ultimately matters to me.
I would personally love the art style if were less plastic-looking and more stylized with cell shading.
The toy-like concept is really interesting, but right now the shiny rendering makes the environment look kind of barren.
Sounds like something who is consistently called out for being petty would say.
Same here. Look at the Zelda Indie game "Tunic" they have a similar artstyle, but It fits way better
I feel like this is even more relevant now with the Diamond and Pearl remakes announced. The whole thing about “let people also be allowed to be dissatisfied as long as they’re not attacking anyone, and don’t attack them either”...
The Diamond and Pearl remakes is the reason why I’m here, funny enough. Been curious how people felt with the artstyle of Link’s Awakening when it first came out since both games are going for a more faithful look. Seems Link’s Awakening also had some mixed thoughts of its artstyle.
But yeah, I agree on the “letting others feel dissatisfied as long as they’re not attacking anyone, and don’t attack them either” thing. Even if there are thoughts that take the dissatisfaction too far, I’m trying to keep that from bringing down my hype for the games. I failed to do that with SwSh, so I’m trying not to make that mistake twice
When that observatory music came on, man oh man!
3:10
BEGONE, THOUGHT!
"Not naming names here"
Proceeds to show the names
Huh
Im pretty sure those tweets are fake.
@@alejandrofinol5709 Maybe. But then why put names on it. It's confusing. I rarely use twitter so I thought the same thing.
They are indeed fake tweets. Hyperbolic goofy reconstructions, if you will.
- kane the editor
@@dtothee8730 I found them kinda obviously fake, for comedic effect
This is a nice conversation
I like arlos comment section
Honestly, the graphics are cute! It may not be super highly extremely detailed like people would normally expect. When Nintendo does curve balls like this, its a delight! Just takes some getting used to when you see the finer details they do with these remakes.
That said, I hope we get some actual anime style cutscenes like the trailer we saw!
Not all opinions are equally valuable. We all have different levels and areas of expertise. My opinion on car maintenance is worthless as I am not a mechanic and know next to nothing about cars, but I have an educational and professional experience as a musician, my opinion on matters musical is much more well informed and valuable. Music, like gaming, is a subjective medium but I’d suggest to you that while someone who knows nothing about music/gaming may well have a right to their opinion (making it technically valid) that opinion worth less than that of a trained and studied musician/gamer who has dedicated their life to analysis and thoughtful criticism of their medium.
You should be able to defend your opinion and it’s thru critique and analysis of informed opinions that we expand our understanding of complicated issues. Ad hominem arguments are counter productive, and obviously people will like what they like, but that doesn’t mean that there’s no purpose to argument or debate over fundamentally subjective topics.......of course that’s just my opinion.....I could be wrong
I appreciate this comment I was going to write something similar! Do you believe there to be some sort of objective truth in seemingly subjective fields such as art?
Chris Cisneros hard to say. It definitely seems that way when you discuss things like Shakespeare, Beethoven, or any number of things deemed high watermarks of human achievement. By many seemingly objective standards a game like BOTW is a good game. Anyone trying to argue that it is a bad game and poorly designed would have a hard time making that argument, and the same would be true if you were to argue that Jimi Hendrix was a shitty guitar player, for example. It can be hard to disaggregate ones personal preferences from analysis which makes the whole enterprise of evaluating works in an objective medium fraught with peril. Ultimately I’m tempted to say that whether or not objective beauty exists doesn’t really matter, and that for conversation’s sake we can act as tho it does and arrive at a more or less a consensus on these matters through informed analysis.
Wyatt Best I like that! Without accepting the idea of an objective beauty then discussing such matters just seems to devolve into “well its my opinion” which halts all interesting conversation imo. Thanks for your well thought out reply man 🙏 hope you are well!
I love ya.
Butt....
When you make an argument against someone else's opinion, you are criticizing it. That what arguing is.
An implied stand point from criticizing something, like "LinkAwake's art style sucks", is that you argue that it could have been better if it were something else.
I think what you're looking to say is that arguing badly is a problem. Ad hominem arguments are where you criticize the person making the argument instead of the argument itself.
It just kinda grinded-up me gears slightly to hear you talk about criticizing like it was something awful, to then just go and do it.
Hes telling you to defend your own point instead of attacking others. You missed the point.
Ok no that is not arguing, arguing is when you try to attack someone's opinion which arlo does not do he simply stated his feeling, arlo does not argue because he just doesn't go against someone else's veiw
@julie martinez No he's calling him a hypocrite even though he didn't do anything hypocritical. Arlo didn't do anything he said not to do in the video. He didn't attack people who said that the art style was good, he gave his reasons to why it wasn't without insulting anyone who thought it was good. shut up.
Yeah, what you said was definitely the point, but it wasn't made too clear.
@@pirateguykarl The very nature of the majority of this video is hypocritical. He tells people not to be the thought police, so he takes it upon himself to become the thought police because some Twitter drama annoyed him. He's too caught up on semantics of discussion and arguing, which arguing isn't the equivalent of name-calling nor does it burgeon some sort of savagery, in fact, it engenders useful discussion that is worthy of rumination. And so, he says that stating an opinion and elucidating it a little bit is a mark of confidence, which I disagree with. I think it is much more confident too empathize with someone else's point of view while still holding your own. And then he gives his beloved UA-cam cattle instructions on how to present their opinions in a fashion he finds satisfactory. And then he talks about Zelda a little bit which is the fucking highlight of this shitty video. And then proceeds to do the very thing he decries, by shitting on two movies and having the fucking gall to defend his unsubstantiated opinion with "Don't @ me."
I don't use Twitter, but I think the very nature of the platform leads people to just write the conclusion of their thought process, instead of the thought process itself, which Arlo and every other agreeable human being would prefer to see. It's obvious he cares about Zelda, so the "drama" over the art style gets to him, but to make a preachy video about how to fucking state opinions in a manner he finds agreeable simply because some trivial Twitter shit annoyed him is utterly pathetic. Arlo's fucking elucidation of opinions is so banal, I cannot see how anyone that doesn't know the first thing about argumentation would find this to be anything other than annoying and unneeded. Like, I don't who this video is for. For children? For teens-to adults, which he seems to mostly gear his content to, despite the Sesame Street-esque muppet that undoubtedly attracts the stray literal Nintenyearold to his channel? Why do you not think the majority of this was a waste of time? How do you not see the hypocrisy? Why do you go out of your way to defend someone that'll never appreciate it? I became invested in this, before you ask me, to see your response more than to shit on Arlo's shitty video, which speaks for itself.
HOOGY SPOOKY!!!!!!
(I can't come to any event you said but typing that looked like fun)
MINISH CAP 2!!!!!!!!!!! Yes! THAT is what the world needs, now! I look forward to seeing your video on this. ❤️❤️❤️❤️
I love everything about the art style, I have been waiting for a Zelda game that looks like this forever!
I thought this was a really well worded video. Arlo for president. 2020. Let’s remind people what compassion is
Trump 2020 babyyyy
Really? I thought it was his worst video thus far. He came off very condescending and hypocritical at times. I got the feeling he's one of the one's taking things a bit too personal.
T. Riley Roo I felt that way at 1st too. But I felt towards the end he was coming from a really good place, as this is a family oriented channel, listening and being respectful when having a discussion is a great lesson for young interneters
Lol could you imagine a puppet getting up on stage... oh wait.
Just seems like he is advocating for arguing against the opposing viewpoint in the beginning of the video. He's saying that you can't oppose opinions at all, and doesn't believe there are any criticisms.
I agree and disagree. On something subjective like an art style it’s totally okay to like or dislike it...and to try and say someone is wrong for disliking or liking the art style and they only feel how they feel for some “stupid reason” isn’t warranted and is uncool
But on certain other stances where opinions are based out of ignorance or from an uninformed stance, a stance with a very limited perspective, I feel to encourage growth in the individual and to spread awareness of the bigger picture, so that the whole picture is available for people to see is a very good thing to do.
For example, if someone who only likes comedy movies, makes a video about how the Godfather is a bad movie, a boring movie...I feel it’s appropriate to at least offer them the opportunity to see why it is a well made movie. You can say but look at the acting, the editing, the score, the writing, the camera work, the character arcs, the symbolism, etc, etc. And just because they don’t see all of those things or don’t hold any value in them they say the movie is bad...even though it’s pretty much an objective truth that that movie was well made, even if it’s not to a certain person’s tastes, to say it isn’t well made is frankly, wrong.
And so I believe it depends on the situation whether or not opinion policing is appropriate or not.
There is often so much that a person just doesn’t see that leads them to hold the stance they do
If a man starts saying “hey I want to eradicate allJews I believe they are inferior beings” it is crucial to band together and speak out against that person (maybe not violently unless necessary to prevent violent acts on the innocent) and maybe don’t make them the “enemy” try to help them understand why killing millions of innocent people may be the wrong stance to take, how there is a perspective they are not embracing, (being the perspective of “these people are people and have value and rights just like I do just like my family does”)
If they don’t change, maybe don’t foster hate against them (hate held in the hearts of anyone is a poison) but be sure to stand and state your position and stand together with those who share it, being watchful that the person who stands against you doesn’t commit any harmful acts.
But anyways went off rails a bit there...
The point being in some cases it’s okay to just have two different opinion and not try to sway the other, in other situations it’s important to offer an educated view on the subject to prevent the opportunity for growth in that person and for the broader view of the subject by the masses to be understood with more depth and nuance.
Your idea of "growth" is also just an opinion. We have an innate desire to try to force people to "understand" art the way that we do. Which is a selfish, narcissistic thing to do, and so we make up excuses and lie even to ourselves. We say "its for the betterment of society" or "cultural enrichment". But really, its just our personal perspective that we are trying to force on others. The Godfather is not an objectively good movie. Its just a movie that a lot of people really appreciate. Art is subjective. Live and let live.
TheAlibabatree well firstly, progress and expanse is growth, not an opinion, you are growing your mind when you are expanding the information you hold in it and expanding your awareness of the intricacies of something, it is a calculable growth. My opinion on what is good or not good is an opinion though.
To want people to make decisions from a larger base of information is a personal subjective value I have, but I’m happy enforcing that...it’s called EDUCATION
In terms of art being subjective...some art is more subjective than others....film is very much more objective than subjective...wether a person enjoys a movie is subjective but wether or not it is well made is 90% objective.
You can go to school and study what makes an actors performance good, what makes a character well written, deeply written, accurately written to human psychology...you can understand the skill that goes into the composition of a movie’s music, and the many, many more intricacies of making a film, with a depth of understanding in all these different areas you will find that objectively good films very much do exist. It’s a cop out to say art is subjective, only someone who hasn’t studied film would say that... sure wether or not a person enjoys them is subjective, but wether or not they are skillfully made or well made is mostly objective. It’s like cooking....You can cook a meal well or badly...that is different from wether a person likes your meal or dislikes it...but in terms of cooking it depends on the tongue of the eater, where a lot of times the viewer of a movie can make decisions based out of ignorance. It’s not a physical thing like taste buds, it’s the awareness and knowledge of the nuances of film. Not knowing what goes into the writing, editing, cinematography, acting, etc they decide wether or not a movie is good based on wether it has cool action and hot girls...which is fine but just because they didn’t like it, doesn’t mean it was poorly made..and if they knew more, they could like it
But nevertheless I agree you shouldn’t be telling someone how to feel, just in certain situations it can benefit people to make more educated opinions
@@TheAlibabatree Dude, if we can't agree on "growth is a good thing" as a concept, then we can't live together as a society.
It feels like you're too caught up in the "everything is subjective" mindset. I used to think like that so I kind of see where you are coming from.
When you try to break down even the simplest, basic values of how we think and what we are as a society, saying "Everything is subjective so you don't get to criticize any of my opinions", then there's no where for us to go.
Like, what's your point? Yeah is saying his opinion is subjective. We all know it's subjective. Your opinion is subjective. I know you know that your opinion is subjective. I actually subjectively agree with your subjective opinion.
So why did you comment that as a reply to Yeah's comment? Again, what's your point?
@DtoTheE I agree with most of your statement, but breaking down the simplest values is not the same as claiming that everything is subjective. One example: the idea that god made man and woman and that man and woman were meant to be together used to be so common and such a core part of life that many didn't even consider the possibility that it could be different.
Breaking down that idea has lead an increasing acceptance of homosexuality and recently non-binary gender identities, wich in my book is definitely a step in the right direction. So I'd suggest trying to break down even the simplest, basic values to critically examine wich ones are worth holding on to.
This.
I’ve always loved Nintendo for having some of the best rocks in the industry, but I’ve gotta say, the rocks in Link’s Awakening were really lackluster. I’m going back to Breath of the Wild to live amongst the Gorons.
That whole intro about how to properly have a debate without it turning into an argument is why i keep coming back to this video. Its just so beautifully worded, and applies to so many different games.