Tigana & Tress of the Emerald Sea: A Dual Book Review (Guy Gavriel Kay, Brandon Sanderson)
Вставка
- Опубліковано 6 сер 2024
- How do you like these two authors?
VIDEO MENTIONED: ua-cam.com/users/liveO_3XTXM4...
CHANNELS MENTIONED:
@Johanna_reads
@jakebishop7822
@thelibraryladder
SUPPORT THE CHANNEL/SEND ME A BOOK
Amazon Wish List: www.amazon.com/hz/wishlist/ls...
FIRESIDE DISCORD
/ discord
TWITTER/X
@BooksFury
GOODREADS
goodreads.com/redfurybooks
Please LIKE, COMMENT and SUBSCRIBE! And check out some of my past videos!
Thanks for watching!
I enjoyed this video very much, Josh! I’ll be rereading Tigana later this year, and listening to your thoughts on it brought back a lot of memories. I probably won’t read Tress, but I’ll be reading books four and five of The Stormlight Archive later this year too. I strongly agree with your insights, especially your appreciation for the contrasting prose of these authors. Thanks for the video!
Thank you, Philip! I'll definitely be interested to see you get into GGK. I think Jake mentioned something like he's so confident you'll love Sarantine Mosaic that he'll eat his copy if you don't LMAO
@@RedFuryBooks It might be worth pretending not to like it just to see that! 😁
I feel like you would like Tress quite a bit, Philip. Maybe one day I'll convince you haha
@@RedFuryBooks I too shall eat my copy if Philip doesn't love Sarantine Mosaic. And mine is signed.
@@PhilipChaseTheBestofFantasy Rude! But also, I think you trying to pretend to dislike Sarantine will break your brain and would be funny, so ya do that
I liked the compare-and-contrast approach! Our discussion got me thinking that Tigana might’ve not had the strongest characters, but it had some very strong character moments. I still get emotional thinking about certain scenes, and I agree that Dianora was a standout. So jealous that you can read so fast! 😄
That's a good point - the characters might not have been as strong, but there were definitely some great moments for all of them.
It's brilliant to review the two books together and give depth of talk. Sanderson is very popular in my country - Taiwan, but when i read the first page of Mistborn, I decided not to choose it as my book club reader for the reason of prose. Also my group of middle-aged women don't like magic too much but he has a law of magic. Lately i found reviews about GRISHA TRILOGY and i think it may serve a starter point for me and my group to read fantasy. It was also rated under lexile 800, so it'll be quite accessible.
Yes, like any author or work, Sanderson isn't for everyone. I often say that I like him in spite of his prose style.
Love this style of comparison. I read both and totally agree with your points.
Awesome, thank you!
Great reviews! I really enjoyed Tress immensely, and although I agree with you regarding the humor--it's not Sanderson's strong point at all--Tress reminded me why I became a Brandon Sanderson fan in the first place. I'll be sure to add Tigana, and GGK generally, to my TBR! Also, for prose, try Robert Victor Mills, specifically Man of Swords: it's some of the best prose I've ever encountered, and about the only comparison I can reach for is The Odyssey and The Iliad.
Oh, thanks for the recommendation! And I hope you enjoy GGK as much as I have!
I really enjoy the C&C format. It was very accessible and well thought out. Thank you
Glad you enjoyed it!
Please review Sobers Rodrigues sci-fi adventure "Alien from Earth". It's so amazing.
18:05 That part of RoW was my favorite! It was a page turner when Navani was doing those science experiments! The experimenting was my favorite part of Tress too!
Yeah, I have a good friend that loves that part, too. I just didn't connect with the experiments in RoW as I felt it ground the narrative to a halt.
Really interesting format for a review, I have also read both and generally agree with the stylistic differences. I think my favorite example of Sanderson writing with more stylized prose is the death rattles you see in the chapter epigraphs of Stormlight, and sometimes in the story. I think Sanderson has probably spent so much time writing as he does that if he tried to fully switch he would almost certainly be much worse at it. The same way I would definitely be worse at anything I have tons of practice in if I tried to completely switch my style. Sadly we can never see the alternate reality Sanderson who has been trying to write in a more stylized fashion from the start.
That's a good point - Sanderson probably hasn't flexed those "prose muscles" in so long that he probably couldn't write differently, or it would at least slow him down considerably. I marvel at authors who can write very different from book to book, like Roger Zelasny.
I really enjoyed the comparison of the two books. I am currently re-reading Tigana; honestly, my first read was so long ago that it feels like a new read 😜. Great video!
Thanks! I hope you enjoy the (re)read of Tigana!
Excellent reviews! I can appreciate each author for what he brings to the table. I reread The Lions of Al-Rassan a few years back, over a decade after having read it the first time, and was delighted to discover how well it held up for me. As for Sanderson, everything goes on the back burner when a new Stormlight book is released. In terms of prose quality, The Emperor's Soul and Shadows for Silence in the Forests of Hell are probably his best, but clarity and simplicity don't necessarily amount to "bad" prose, IMO; it's a legitimate choice. Not every writer needs to be Patricia McKillip (whom I love).
One thing that does bug me about Tigana is the treatment of sex and sexuality, and the fact that every female character's arc revolves around it. Kay's writing in general is sex-positive, which is hardly a bad thing, but at least in Lions, Jehane has a profession as well as an active sex life. In A Song for Arbonne, Lisseut (whom I wish had played a much larger role) is a musician. I still need to read River of Stars, but I understand that in this novel, the female lead is an aspiring poet. But in Tigana, every female character's journey revolves around sex in some way, and while I agree that Dianora is a very well-drawn character, I couldn't help finding the narrowness of scope of the women in general a bit disappointing. Still a great book, though.
Yes, I agree that clarity and simplicity doesn't equal bad prose, and hope I was clear in the review that the two approaches with Kay and Sanderson both worked for me, despite being such vastly different manners of storytelling. ESPECIALLY in regards to the prose style!
@@RedFuryBooks Your review did make that clear. But like you, I've heard a lot of talk that Sanderson qualifies as "YA" because of his straightforward prose style. I admit that YA can sometimes be difficult to identify, but simplicity of prose doesn't automatically make a book YA. That's why I reiterated your assertion.
Loved the shout-out to Charlotte Bronte!
I largely agree about the characters in Tress. I love Tress herself but feel most of the side characters aren't amazing. Alessan is probably to me the most interesting character in Tigana, but I also remember thinking he did a very good job developing characters who didn't get a lot of page time, ex. Alais and the sculptor guy from the prologue (Saevar?) I also kind of liked Devin, to be honest...
One thing that's interesting about Sanderson's themes is it seems to me that he takes different approaches in different books. Tress' themes, while in my opinion not bad, are pretty transparent and obvious. Yumi does something similar, although is actually one of my favorite Sanderson books and in my opinion has some of his strongest thematic work. In that book I think they are more nuanced and leave the reader with some room to interpret, but they are still for the most part pretty easily discernible while still being extremely powerful and accurate to the human experience. In Mistborn and Stormlight, however, a significant portion of the interpretation is left up to the reader. In those books there's this sort of odd mix I haven't seen in many other places, of both very obvious messaging and extremely ambiguous theming, with a lot of asking and exploring questions without just telling the reader what to think.
You mentioned Kay being able to make a seemingly innocuous sentence in the middle of a paragraph very powerful, while Sanderson would make that sentence its own paragraph and maybe even exaggerate it in order to get its importance across. This is not something I have consciously thought about before watching, but it is a very good point that I feel explains both author's writing styles very well. Of course, Stormlight specifically also has a lot of hidden things that are very purposely put in but are easy to pass over, but I'd say he has a very different way of doing that, in that most of those things are probably just little easter eggs and bits of foreshadowing that won't hurt your enjoyment if you don't get them.
You definitely have me more eager to pick up Yumi. I had heard good things about that one. And yes, I hope I was clear on the point that I didn't think Sanderson was unclear with his themes, just that he makes it VERY CLEAR to the reader and they lack nuance (at least in this book). Thanks for the comment - this is outstanding food for thought, especially the next time I pick up Sanderson!
I have just bought few of Guy Gavriel Kay book thanks for the push to try his books, I remember watching a vid on the Library ladder about Kay it was very interesting but by the sound of it you watched the same vid and found a new author you loved that what I love about book tube finding new author to try out keep reviewing it was a great take on to very different book👍
Indeed Library Ladder was the first time I had heard about this author, let alone the high praise he had for him, as the "best modern" fantasy author!
@@RedFuryBooks my guy Gavriel Kay books have turned up under the heaven, ysabel, children of the earth sky I think under Heaven will probably be first, but please keep doing review on GGK I would love to hear more Way your going you probably will have read all his book in next year or so enjoy 👍
@@grahamguy4656 oh yeah, I'll be reading much more Kay this year!
I haven’t read GGK but I’ll put that on my eventual TBR. I did really enjoy Tress and while Hoid was annoying in the book I was able to put that aside and just appreciate the story and characters overall (and I loved the twist at the end) and ended up really enjoying the book
Yes, I also enjoyed the book in spite of Hoid!
I really like the “two birds, one stone approach” you took with this video and comparing and contrasting the two books really enhanced the review of each. I plan to read Tigana next month for a buddy read and Tress some time later this year. I definitely agree with your overall insights about each author, and I look forward to seeing how my overall impression of each book align with or differ from yours.
Thanks! I'd be interested in hearing your thoughts on both books. I hope they both work for you in different ways that they did for me!
Wow, I love the compare and contrast idea!! I haven’t read Tress yet, but I loved Tigana!!! I can’t believe you haven’t read Sarantine Mosaic yet!
Thanks, Madison! I'll read Sarantine later this year whenever Johanna says so lol
@@RedFuryBooks I will definitely let you know! 😁
This kind of review is fun because it gives people who have read the books already extra incentive to watch since it's a fresh approach at a book review. I've read both and far, far, far enjoyed Tigana, but Tress wasn't bad. On the fence about trying Yumi or not. Will you?
I'll definitely read Yumi, probably later this year. I have heard from a lot of people that it's their favorite of the secret projects.
I very much like your compare and contrast of these books. I can certainly see the difference in the prose. I read an excerpt of A Song for Arbonne on the Barnes & Noble website and the prose is BEAUTIFUL. I ordered the book and it’s arriving today so I’m excited! I have only read The Final Empire from Sanderson and the writing is fine and would appeal to the masses as you indicated. Speaking of, I thought The Final Empire was…ok. I did really like the ending. Probably won’t continue but would like to try another Sanderson book but not sure which one.
Oh I hope you love A Song for Arbonne as I do!
Plenty on your shelves to keep you busy there. Hope you get some great reads. I'm currently on page 913 of the Count of Monte Cristo. Still got some way to go. Happy reading to you.
Thanks, you too!
Thanks for the compare and contrast style. Most effective. I will be reading Tigana soon so this was helpful but Sanderson is an author I have never felt compelled to pick up. I don't know why and it's definitely irrational, but my gut feeling is that I would not care for his writing.
Sanderson isn't for everyone, and I totally get it. I often say I like Sanderson in SPITE of his actual writing.
This was a neat idea Josh! I just started Tigana today, and I agree the prologue is magnificent. Tress was pretty good for me, but not his best work for sure.
Oh I hope you love Tigana!
I just started it too. I'm about 50 pages into it. The Prologue was amazing, but although the world and political intrigue is interesting, the only POV character I've met so far isn't.
@@hannahbrennan2131 I felt very similar at that point too.
Great job, Josh.
I very much prefer GGK's approach to both theme and prose, I don't find Kay dense at all, I find it a rich and smooth experience. Sanderson is like riding a bicycle on an untarred road at times.
I find Sanderson is more popcorn entertainment, Kay is the masterpiece but both are great to experience.
I connected Tigana's themes of cultural and linguistic erasure to Ireland and its experience with British colonialism, which we're still recovering from.
I was worried I wouldn't but I'm really enjoying my re-read of the Way of Kings, and depending on how the rest of Stormlight goes I might open myself up to retrying the rest of the Cosmere.
That's a great point of Sanderson vs. Kay being more popcorn entertainment vs. master works. And I can also see British colonialism written into the text of Tigana.
This was a good review style. I'm glad I've read both of these books. They are completely opposite, as far as fantasy books go. I enjoyed both, but in this case, I think Tress wins for me. I think Tigana is good but not great. I do plan to give GGK another chance so maybe he'll have a winner for me soon.
Tigana is not the most indicative of Kay's greatness in my opinion. I hope whatever you tackle next works well for you!
Wow, super cool video concept!! And very well executed. Great book choices with strong contrast
I haven’t read any Kay yet but he’s relatively high on my TBR (Abercrombie currently, then Hobb, then probably Dandelion Dynasty and Green Bone saga. Then maybe Kay!!). But I love hearing when people love Kay - I’m 99% sure I’m gonna love him too. I will say, I thought strongly of Erikson and Malazan when you talked about prose. I hope you’ll feel the same way when you pick up MoI again soon :)
And I must say you’re kinda lucky you still enjoyed Tress despite the humor bouncing off you lol. It’s a pretty big part of the book and from what I’ve seen, when people don’t like it overall, it’s usually because of the humor (which I liked btw but that’s besides the point). So anyway good on you for you being to look past that and find all the other enjoyable things about Tress!!
Thanks! I daresay you can squeeze in one by GGK somewhere in there! Since they are all stand alones. And yes, I survived Hoid's humor (that should be a t-shirt).
@@RedFuryBooks haha be the T shirt you want to see in the world!
But also great point, they’re all standalones… RotE is 16 books all by itself, it’ll be months before I read any GGK if I wait… okay you’ve sold me I’ll squeeze one in sooner than later!!
Oh awesome! Let me know how it goes!
Can’t wait to read both of these! Would you recommend Tigana as a fine place to start the GGK journey, or elsewhere? Love the video as always!
Thanks! I wouldn't start GGK with Tigana. Both Jake Bishop and Library Ladder have some great videos talking about GGK's starting points, but I can definitely recommend my first one: The Lions of al-Rassan. It's fantastic!
I agree the prologue of Tigana is absolutely excellent. I kinda agree with Jake except its not that I don't buy the premise of Tigana, I don't buy the execution. I specifically thought of the Eastern European countries too, but the difference with those ethnic cleanings is that none of those cultures are just names. Kay uses the name of Tigana as a standin for an entire culture and everyone is so focused on recovering the NAME of Tigana and how important the NAME is and all that it stands for and it just never really felt real to me, which is a shame because of how great Kay is at cultural aspects in novels. It's like, the name of a culture is not nearly as important to its people as its language, death rituals, cuisane, religion, songs, traditions, etc. And nobody in Tigana ever felt like they cared about those things. They just want the name Tigana back. It felt like a superficial examination from an author I know can do better.
...but it's still a good book 🤣 I agree Dianora is fantastic. It's just puzzling to me that it remains his most popular and beloved novel.
Really liked Tress. I don't think I agree that the side characters in Tress were two dimensional but they weren't his strongest. I liked some of the Hoid humor in this book but damn I HATED the Tosher chapter with every fiber of my being. Can't believe it made it into the published novel.
I like this format of review! These are two of my top five favorite authors and people are always acting like appreciating different parts of the spectrum is difficult. Kay is not trying to be a Sanderson and Sanderson is not trying to be a Kay (although I do think you are selling his prose in this novel specifically short - not that it is suddenly flowerly, but it definitely is more wordy and full of metaphors etc than an average Sanderson novel, he said he was specifically trying to practice his Hoid voice - which results may vary on)
That's a really valid point. I don't think Kay dismissed those other aspects of culture - the part where he mentioned the destruction of all the Tiganan sculptures hit me hard because of Saevar in the prologue - but he definitely did focus on the word/name Tigana the most.
Glad you liked this different format! These two books and authors honestly could be more different, and it was fun to think about how different they are but I enjoy them both tremendously.
I recently re-read Tigana.
Things I liked:
1. Kay's prose is beautiful.
2. The setting is interesting.
3. Worthy themes and ideas are explored.
4. Dianora's storyline.
5. The two sorcerer-kings are both very memorable in their own way.
Things that I didn't like:
1. Horrible depiction of romance and intimacy (omg that closet scene is one of the cringiest things that I've ever read)
2. The melodrama can be a bit much
3. The main storyline involving the rebels restoring Tigana was serviceable. It wasn't bad, but it was hardly spectacular. There were other places and storylines (like Dianora's arc) that I wish were explored more.
4. The character Erlein. The book wants us to see him as this apathetic fence-sitter whom the heroes are coaxing into doing something useful for once. I just saw some poor guy who they kidnapped and bullied regularly.
Thank you. Justice for Erlein.
I agree with all of these, save maybe the storyline about restoring Tigana. I guess I bought into the romance of it all.
@@RedFuryBooks That's fair. I think that I was so taken with Dianora's storyline that the main story involving the rebels felt a bit lacking to me. It's like comparing a great tragedy with a feel-good, adventure flick. Neither is bad, but one demands a greater emotional response than the other.
Awesome breakdown. You're right, you couldn't have picked two authors further on the spectrum than these two, and yet they somehow both work 😂
Right? It's definitely nice to experience some quality works that are so different.
How about contrasting and comparing Empire of Silence with Deathstalker, now that would be one great space opera match up!! Hadrian Marlow vs. Owen Deathstalker, two aristos “duking” it out. It would be similar to Indiana Jones taking out his revolver to those 3 swordsman assassins.
Maybe when I finally get around to them!
Tress of the Emerald Sea would have been one of my favorite books if it weren't for the Hoid narrator.
Alas...
What’s your ranking of GGK?🎉
As an author? Definitely a top 5 at this point.
@@RedFuryBooks books of his you’ve read!
@@caitlinl2750 Ha! Sorry. My GGK ranking of books so far: 1. A Song for Arbonne, 2. The Lions of al-Rassan, 3. Under Heaven, 4. River of Stars, 5. Tigana
@@RedFuryBooks thank you!
huh. interesting compare 🤔💟
Thanks for checking out the video!
My problem with Tress is that I really disliked Sanderson's humor.
I'm re-reading Way of Kings, and the humour is worse than I remembered, and i didn't find it funny then either.
Yep. I enjoyed the book in SPITE of Hoid's humor.