Oh yeah.... it ends up feeling degrading. When we as the betrayed say hey I came across this video, ect and they're like ok I'll watch it when I have time.
Won’t focusing on unfaithful s perception of themselves make them more self centered, focus more on their own desires/comforts. That is what they do by default. The lack is in their ability to keep their spouse in their mind.
Thank you for your thoughtful comment. Both have to happen concurrently. They have to understand (learn about) Betrayal Trauma and always put their partner first because the power differential in acting out secretly has to be balanced - this requires that the Betrayed be their first though - considering not just intent but IMPACT. So, if the Betrayed wouldn't be able to wholeheartedly go along with what the Unfaithful, in their Recovery, is saying and doing, the Unfaithful need to not do it and consider what, then, they will do that will put their partner's safety first - working to balance the power differential that they created. At the same time they need to be resolving the shame/attachment wounds that drove their harmful behaviors or they will end up relapsing or repeating those same behaviors (acting out is not only sexually, it is also emotionally and it can be very subtle - so, gaslighting is acting out - Acting Out can be defined as "acting outside of our integrity."). Very importantly here, in further answer to your thought, is that if the shame cycle (the attachment wounds) are not repaired then the blaming and resentment gets, wrongfully, pointed outside of themselves and lands, most often, on the Betrayed Partner. If that is happening, then the Betrayed will not be put first in any meaningful way (meaning it might look like it but, as long as they are resented by the Unfaithful - which is a projection of the Unfaithful's self-resentment on to the Betrayed - then it is placating/checkboxing). On one last note, and I believe that we said this in the episode but it really bears repeating that self-forgiveness (perhaps better termed as Shame Resilience) is NOT self-permissiveness. It cannot be mistaken (by the Unfaithful) for letting oneself off the hook. This is so that the recovering Unfaithful can take full ownership and make a living amends to the Betrayed. Being self-permissive allows, as you have pointed out, the Unfaithful to stay in their self-centeredness.
My husband won’t do any work. He did for about 2 visits. My therapist is recommending he not go to counseling anymore. He lies is an alcoholic and in major denial and accountability
My husband wants to better himself, is individual counciling alone enough? He says he doesn’t have an addiction, but he’s had an affair twice now in our 20 years of marriage. One in the beginning and then recently. He’s also flirted and texted other woman throughout our marriage. He says he developing a more mature mindset. I just feel like he should be doing more than just individual counseling. We did 10 sessions of marriage counciling but I think we did it too soon because he was still lying and in contact with his AP over the phone during that time. He claims that’s when he was having a hard time letting the AP go but he no longer feels the lust for her that he once did and that it was a process he had to go through.
I'm terribly sorry. That's incredibly wounding to you. I think coaching is a good start, but it has to be something that sticks and is consistent. Without consistency and hard work, he's not going to find much healing, self awareness or even be able to develop a relapse prevention plan.
Hi there. I would perhaps say something like 'honey I've been watching a podcast that has been very helpful for both betrayed and unfaithful. They gave some practical insight I think we both can use the other day. They both are unfaithful and experts. Would you like to watch it with me as I think it will help both of us?
Oh yeah.... it ends up feeling degrading. When we as the betrayed say hey I came across this video, ect and they're like ok I'll watch it when I have time.
agreed 100 percent. I'm sorry for that.
Another wonderful session Sam and James. Always something to learn.
Won’t focusing on unfaithful s perception of themselves make them more self centered, focus more on their own desires/comforts. That is what they do by default. The lack is in their ability to keep their spouse in their mind.
Thank you for your thoughtful comment.
Both have to happen concurrently. They have to understand (learn about) Betrayal Trauma and always put their partner first because the power differential in acting out secretly has to be balanced - this requires that the Betrayed be their first though - considering not just intent but IMPACT. So, if the Betrayed wouldn't be able to wholeheartedly go along with what the Unfaithful, in their Recovery, is saying and doing, the Unfaithful need to not do it and consider what, then, they will do that will put their partner's safety first - working to balance the power differential that they created. At the same time they need to be resolving the shame/attachment wounds that drove their harmful behaviors or they will end up relapsing or repeating those same behaviors (acting out is not only sexually, it is also emotionally and it can be very subtle - so, gaslighting is acting out - Acting Out can be defined as "acting outside of our integrity.").
Very importantly here, in further answer to your thought, is that if the shame cycle (the attachment wounds) are not repaired then the blaming and resentment gets, wrongfully, pointed outside of themselves and lands, most often, on the Betrayed Partner. If that is happening, then the Betrayed will not be put first in any meaningful way (meaning it might look like it but, as long as they are resented by the Unfaithful - which is a projection of the Unfaithful's self-resentment on to the Betrayed - then it is placating/checkboxing).
On one last note, and I believe that we said this in the episode but it really bears repeating that self-forgiveness (perhaps better termed as Shame Resilience) is NOT self-permissiveness. It cannot be mistaken (by the Unfaithful) for letting oneself off the hook. This is so that the recovering Unfaithful can take full ownership and make a living amends to the Betrayed. Being self-permissive allows, as you have pointed out, the Unfaithful to stay in their self-centeredness.
My husband won’t do any work. He did for about 2 visits. My therapist is recommending he not go to counseling anymore. He lies is an alcoholic and in major denial and accountability
My husband wants to better himself, is individual counciling alone enough? He says he doesn’t have an addiction, but he’s had an affair twice now in our 20 years of marriage. One in the beginning and then recently. He’s also flirted and texted other woman throughout our marriage. He says he developing a more mature mindset. I just feel like he should be doing more than just individual counseling. We did 10 sessions of marriage counciling but I think we did it too soon because he was still lying and in contact with his AP over the phone during that time. He claims that’s when he was having a hard time letting the AP go but he no longer feels the lust for her that he once did and that it was a process he had to go through.
I'm terribly sorry. That's incredibly wounding to you. I think coaching is a good start, but it has to be something that sticks and is consistent. Without consistency and hard work, he's not going to find much healing, self awareness or even be able to develop a relapse prevention plan.
How do I present this to my husband.
Hi there. I would perhaps say something like 'honey I've been watching a podcast that has been very helpful for both betrayed and unfaithful. They gave some practical insight I think we both can use the other day. They both are unfaithful and experts. Would you like to watch it with me as I think it will help both of us?