Nice job on reviewing the caster camber gauge Jerry. It looks like you have a good understanding of math too! Practical applications make math attractive to people who might otherwise shy away from it. Good job!
Sometimes math comes in handy. Like the 3,4,5 rule - that guy comes in real handy when squaring up a deck to the house - getting that first board perfectly square to the house. Always a pleasure hearing from you Bluesman - Jerry
Going to have to get one of those. Gravel roads here in Manitoba this winter just have me flinching every trip out. Kills shocks, bruises tires, knocks subframes into next week and messes up alignments. Thanks for this, probably not going to be aligning stuff myself but this can be my early warning tool. Like a dipstick for engine oil.
This is great. I just bought the same item, then found your video! I put a new steering rack on my pickup, and new upper control arms with balljoints. I must've had it set okay using just a level for camber, then a 2x4 on jackstands for toe adjustment. The tires haven't worn in several months. I'm about to do lower balljoints because they have play. I'll just set it with this when I'm done. I've found that alignment shops only want to sell me suspenion work. Guys who do their own work are not a cash cow for alignment techs. Any shadetree can do a satisfactory alignment just knowing the particular vehicle specs.
Had a front wheel alignment done by a tire shop with an accurate precision laser machine. I checked their results with the same tool in this video. The caster measurement DOES NOT need to multiplied by 1.5 and the tool displayed the same angular measurement of 4.7 degrees!!! BTW, 1 degree = 60' = 3600".
Good day, Great brief Vid. and purchased the tool. Just did not understand "zero the guage in relation to the video" as the camera close up does not show what you are doing or how to do it., please explain for those of us whome are challanged. thank you.
If your vehicle is setting on un level ground, you want to set your tool to the same un levelness :) Follow the instructions or the video to set your tool to the same plane as the car or truck. Let me know if that makes sense :)
FYI On a Servex wheel aligner ,, old school mechanical machine First square up car to machine on slip plates to get both wheels pointing straight ahead Then mark "0" on turntable ,,, THEN TO ZERO Caster [run yourself over BY 20 degrees] CASTER read by turning wheel into vehicle 20deg [from the straight ahead position ] Equals caster .......... Donot multiply this works ............
Thanks for the information. I'm not an alignment specialist but I have done quite a few of my own alignments older pickups, etc. String, tram gauge, etc.
Cool I’ve got the non-digital budget version. Used it and it kinda tells you a ballpark figure. Problem is the fancy new cars have no adjustments.🙄. You kinda eyeball aftermarket shim things based on some magnet gizmo.🤷♂️
Right I learned that my 2004 INFINITI G has no camber or caster adjustments. You fix those by replacing control arms or bushings that are worn out. Then it's right. Then you pay for a whole alignment just to adjust toe...
You need to multiply the "caster" measurement you have shown by 1.5 to get the true caster angle as would be measured on an alignment machine. If you look at bubble gauges, the scale is 1.5 times larger on the caster scale compared with the camber scale. Otherwise a good instructional video. Thanks.
I'm a beginner but I'm not sure I can agree with that statement. A degree of angle change is a degree of angle change. If the digital measures that, then it's measured. The bubble gauges have more degrees change available in the caster bubble just for the capability. The camber scales are less degrees available to give more precision. I'm sure the arc of the glass tube in each is adjusted for the different scale. It still measures degrees of angle change. I'll bet both scales show the same degree change- until the camber scale runs out of range. Cheers.
@@bw1841 Schnitzer is correct. It is a trigonometry math equation. If you measure the angle of the caster at 90 degrees, you would not have to do any math. You turn the wheel out 20 degrees and zero the reading so that when you turn the wheel in 20 degrees, you get the difference between the out and in reading at exactly 20 degrees. Then multiply that by 1.432 (1.5 is the industry standard) and get the true angle. The farther the wheel is turned, the higher the gauge would have read. You can do the same thing by turning the wheel 15 degrees in each direction, but then you have to multiply by 2 because your measured reading is lower by not turning the wheel as far. There are digital gauges that do the math for you, but they have a caster button on them. you turn the wheel out 20 degrees, press the caster button, then turn the wheel in 20 degrees and get the true reading calculated for you, but this one is only an angle finder and it does not do the math for you.
@@CoroPlanesLLC This is an excellent explanation and a very helpful answer. It's exactly what I needed to know to complete my alignment with a simple castor bubble gauge.
So I interpret what your saying correctly . The steel was just stuck down using masking /painters .tape ? I guess simple but works . After reading double sided adhesive tape , this sounds like it yes ?
How much can it effect caster measurement if you don't use a slip plate when moving tires back and forth? My thought for DYI'ers if performing on garage floor, spread out a small amount of very fine sand under the tires so when you turn them back and forth to perform caster measurement, they slide on the sand with out 'sticking' to the floor.
When he did the caster measurement, did he forget to multiply the 4.4 degrees by 1.5 like it is suggested in other videos? Or when he leveled the tool, did it factor that in?
I think when you level and zero the tool out you're good - you don't have to multiply by 1.5. Were they using the exact same tool? Could be that their tool can't be zeroed out?
When you say level the tool in relation to the vehicle does that mean that you don't have to have level ground because the tool considers the ground you are starting at level?
@@nahyoxsoldier3264 believe it or not,alignment machines are a newer concept,the people that taught me were some of the first people to use an alignment rack
Yes. When you zero the gauge out in relation to the vehicle, you are putting the gauge in the same plane or "world" as the truck or car. In other words if the vehicle is not perfectly level, that's OK, we can set the gauge to that same "unlevelness". If that don't make sense ask again :)
This is tricky, assuming the ground is the same plane under all four wheels. Concrete will usually be the most level but even then might not be perfect (forget about your asphalt driveway!!). If the spot of ground you use to zero out the gauge is out of plane with the ground directly under the other three wheels you might have a problem. You'll still have this problem if you zero out on the ground by each tire. Realistically, setting it once should apply to all four adjustments, but real world? I dunno. This is why laser alignments will never be matched in the wild, they create their own plane.
@LakesideAutobody no. Turntable plates allow the front suspension to spread out exactly like it was going down the road. After each or any adjustment we grab the front bumper and bounce the car to assume the new driving position. Degree markings allow you to check castor with regard to how the machine is calibrated. Bean equipment 40-50 years ago only turned 15 degrees. Without turntables you can't do any alignment.
I don't think it would make a difference. Usually a "warped" rotor is not really warped, it is microscopically thicker in one spot. When you come off of an expressway at 80 and hit the brakes, then hold the pads against the screaming hot rotor, it can "absorb" some of the pads. That thick spot ends up getting worse and worse obviously because it causes a hot spot right there - more friction every time you brake. At least that's what I read so... at any rate - it's a very small measurement. :)
It is a measuring gauge block (example) www.ebay.com/itm/225290642107?chn=ps&var=524268869458&_trkparms=ispr%3D1&amdata=enc%3A1n6eVlw8RS_q9lEA02K7xAw81&norover=1&mkevt=1&mkrid=711-117182-37290-
OK. bought the gauge. i did the castor check and it shows on left front 0.4 degrees arrow pointing in (negative?) and on the right side it says 0.5 degrees with the arrow pointing out (positive?). How much trouble am I in?
It depends on what the specs need to be for your car. Negative caster will roll straighter but positive caster will steer easier. They should be the same though I would think :)
@@LakesideAutobody Am I correct about which one is negative and which one is positive? I want positive camber. It is a 66 xke so these things are really hard to change.
If I understand, you don't have to measure the floor angle when doing camber check because, you zeroed it perpendicular to the earth with a bubble level for instance, first.?
No - you will "Zero" it out in relation to the level of the vehicle. You can set it on the floor, car lift posts, what ever works best for your situation.
@@LakesideAutobody I have an old Ti-81-THAT DID THE TRICK. Go into MODE, select degrees instead of radians, then proceed to enter exactly as you have written down here on the math. Thank you!
Nice job on reviewing the caster camber gauge Jerry. It looks like you have a good understanding of math too! Practical applications make math attractive to people who might otherwise shy away from it. Good job!
Sometimes math comes in handy. Like the 3,4,5 rule - that guy comes in real handy when squaring up a deck to the house - getting that first board perfectly square to the house. Always a pleasure hearing from you Bluesman - Jerry
Going to have to get one of those. Gravel roads here in Manitoba this winter just have me flinching every trip out. Kills shocks, bruises tires, knocks subframes into next week and messes up alignments. Thanks for this, probably not going to be aligning stuff myself but this can be my early warning tool. Like a dipstick for engine oil.
It´s like a pizza with EVERYTHING !! aligment, math and woodworking in a bite size class, THANKS !!
Nice analogy - thanks James - have a good week :)
This is great. I just bought the same item, then found your video!
I put a new steering rack on my pickup, and new upper control arms with balljoints. I must've had it set okay using just a level for camber, then a 2x4 on jackstands for toe adjustment. The tires haven't worn in several months.
I'm about to do lower balljoints because they have play.
I'll just set it with this when I'm done.
I've found that alignment shops only want to sell me suspenion work. Guys who do their own work are not a cash cow for alignment techs.
Any shadetree can do a satisfactory alignment just knowing the particular vehicle specs.
👍🛠✌
I have the same tool but under a different brand. I've used it a couple times and then I forgot bout it, till now.
Have a great week!
Nice job buddy! I appreciate you doing the math for us. Geometry was never my strong suit in highschool.
You're welcome HE - Happy Holidays 🍗🥧❄🎄😊
Thank you Jerry for sharing this tool with us absolutely a tool for the future for the toolbox great job as always
You're welcome Luis. I appreciate the kind works - thanks for watching :)
Had a front wheel alignment done by a tire shop with an accurate precision laser machine. I checked their results with the same tool in this video. The caster measurement DOES NOT need to multiplied by 1.5 and the tool displayed the same angular measurement of 4.7 degrees!!! BTW, 1 degree = 60' = 3600".
Thanks for checking that out - nice job. Others will appreciate the comment too for sure :)
Nice demo. Never knew there was such a device.
Good day, Great brief Vid. and purchased the tool. Just did not understand "zero the guage in relation to the video" as the camera close up does not show what you are doing or how to do it., please explain for those of us whome are challanged. thank you.
If your vehicle is setting on un level ground, you want to set your tool to the same un levelness :) Follow the instructions or the video to set your tool to the same plane as the car or truck. Let me know if that makes sense :)
@LakesideAutobody when setting the Guage to the same "plane" as the vehicle, you are setting it to the plane - left to right or front to back?
Left to right I believe
Thank you Jerry, I like that tool!
Damn finally reverse tan being used properly and i forgot it since hs 😂
👍👍💯 See..... you actually can use math in the real world. I've used it about 3 times in life where it really helped 🤔
FYI On a Servex wheel aligner ,, old school mechanical machine
First square up car to machine on slip plates to get both wheels pointing straight ahead
Then mark "0" on turntable ,,, THEN TO ZERO Caster [run yourself over BY 20 degrees]
CASTER read by turning wheel into vehicle 20deg [from the straight ahead position ]
Equals caster .......... Donot multiply this works ............
Thanks for the information. I'm not an alignment specialist but I have done quite a few of my own alignments older pickups, etc. String, tram gauge, etc.
Cool I’ve got the non-digital budget version. Used it and it kinda tells you a ballpark figure. Problem is the fancy new cars have no adjustments.🙄. You kinda eyeball aftermarket shim things based on some magnet gizmo.🤷♂️
Right I learned that my 2004 INFINITI G has no camber or caster adjustments. You fix those by replacing control arms or bushings that are worn out. Then it's right. Then you pay for a whole alignment just to adjust toe...
Love the vids but I just eyeball my alignment and drive it to the shop about 3 miles away so they can use the laser gear,
You need to multiply the "caster" measurement you have shown by 1.5 to get the true caster angle as would be measured on an alignment machine. If you look at bubble gauges, the scale is 1.5 times larger on the caster scale compared with the camber scale. Otherwise a good instructional video. Thanks.
I'm a beginner but I'm not sure I can agree with that statement. A degree of angle change is a degree of angle change. If the digital measures that, then it's measured. The bubble gauges have more degrees change available in the caster bubble just for the capability. The camber scales are less degrees available to give more precision. I'm sure the arc of the glass tube in each is adjusted for the different scale. It still measures degrees of angle change. I'll bet both scales show the same degree change- until the camber scale runs out of range. Cheers.
@@bw1841 Schnitzer is correct. It is a trigonometry math equation. If you measure the angle of the caster at 90 degrees, you would not have to do any math. You turn the wheel out 20 degrees and zero the reading so that when you turn the wheel in 20 degrees, you get the difference between the out and in reading at exactly 20 degrees. Then multiply that by 1.432 (1.5 is the industry standard) and get the true angle. The farther the wheel is turned, the higher the gauge would have read. You can do the same thing by turning the wheel 15 degrees in each direction, but then you have to multiply by 2 because your measured reading is lower by not turning the wheel as far. There are digital gauges that do the math for you, but they have a caster button on them. you turn the wheel out 20 degrees, press the caster button, then turn the wheel in 20 degrees and get the true reading calculated for you, but this one is only an angle finder and it does not do the math for you.
@@CoroPlanesLLC This is an excellent explanation and a very helpful answer. It's exactly what I needed to know to complete my alignment with a simple castor bubble gauge.
Hi ,how did u mount the magnetic gauge over the alloy wheel centre hole , maybe another magnet ???
I 2 way taped a nice flat machinist block (basically flat piece of steel) to it :)
So I interpret what your saying correctly . The steel was just stuck down using masking /painters .tape ? I guess simple but works . After reading double sided adhesive tape , this sounds like it yes ?
How much can it effect caster measurement if you don't use a slip plate when moving tires back and forth? My thought for DYI'ers if performing on garage floor, spread out a small amount of very fine sand under the tires so when you turn them back and forth to perform caster measurement, they slide on the sand with out 'sticking' to the floor.
Good idea - seems like it would work :)
Use plastic bag with oil in it.
Elementary, My dear Watson 😮
When he did the caster measurement, did he forget to multiply the 4.4 degrees by 1.5 like it is suggested in other videos? Or when he leveled the tool, did it factor that in?
I think when you level and zero the tool out you're good - you don't have to multiply by 1.5. Were they using the exact same tool? Could be that their tool can't be zeroed out?
When you say level the tool in relation to the vehicle does that mean that you don't have to have level ground because the tool considers the ground you are starting at level?
You don't need level ground - you are exactly right :)
set the toe and let it go,all I need is a tape measure,I can eyeball the rest
Yep, I replaced my entire steering and suspension and set it all up myself. Had new tires put on and a year later they still look new.
You didn't do camber, you just did the tore and tires didn't wear out?
@@nahyoxsoldier3264 believe it or not,alignment machines are a newer concept,the people that taught me were some of the first people to use an alignment rack
Can you explain what you mean by ‘zero the gauge in relation to the vehicle’?
Yes. When you zero the gauge out in relation to the vehicle, you are putting the gauge in the same plane or "world" as the truck or car. In other words if the vehicle is not perfectly level, that's OK, we can set the gauge to that same "unlevelness". If that don't make sense ask again :)
This is tricky, assuming the ground is the same plane under all four wheels. Concrete will usually be the most level but even then might not be perfect (forget about your asphalt driveway!!). If the spot of ground you use to zero out the gauge is out of plane with the ground directly under the other three wheels you might have a problem. You'll still have this problem if you zero out on the ground by each tire. Realistically, setting it once should apply to all four adjustments, but real world? I dunno. This is why laser alignments will never be matched in the wild, they create their own plane.
Is the car on jack stands?
No
How can you get any reading without using turntable plates?
Turn table plates show you the degree you turned the wheel - that's it.
@LakesideAutobody no. Turntable plates allow the front suspension to spread out exactly like it was going down the road. After each or any adjustment we grab the front bumper and bounce the car to assume the new driving position. Degree markings allow you to check castor with regard to how the machine is calibrated. Bean equipment 40-50 years ago only turned 15 degrees. Without turntables you can't do any alignment.
What if the rotor is warped, how do you measure something like that? thank you
I don't think it would make a difference. Usually a "warped" rotor is not really warped, it is microscopically thicker in one spot. When you come off of an expressway at 80 and hit the brakes, then hold the pads against the screaming hot rotor, it can "absorb" some of the pads. That thick spot ends up getting worse and worse obviously because it causes a hot spot right there - more friction every time you brake. At least that's what I read so... at any rate - it's a very small measurement. :)
Where did you get the small metal plate to attach to the hub?
It is a measuring gauge block (example) www.ebay.com/itm/225290642107?chn=ps&var=524268869458&_trkparms=ispr%3D1&amdata=enc%3A1n6eVlw8RS_q9lEA02K7xAw81&norover=1&mkevt=1&mkrid=711-117182-37290-
@@LakesideAutobody How did you attach it to the hub, magnet?
OK. bought the gauge. i did the castor check and it shows on left front 0.4 degrees arrow pointing in (negative?) and on the right side it says 0.5 degrees with the arrow pointing out (positive?). How much trouble am I in?
It depends on what the specs need to be for your car. Negative caster will roll straighter but positive caster will steer easier. They should be the same though I would think :)
@@LakesideAutobody Am I correct about which one is negative and which one is positive? I want positive camber. It is a 66 xke so these things are really hard to change.
If I understand, you don't have to measure the floor angle when doing camber check because, you zeroed it perpendicular to the earth with a bubble level for instance, first.?
It was zeroed perpendicular to what the car was sitting on - in this case a 4 post lift - think it was shown near the beginning of the video :)
Do you have to calibrate it first on a spirit level?
No - you will "Zero" it out in relation to the level of the vehicle. You can set it on the floor, car lift posts, what ever works best for your situation.
What did you make your triangle out of?
Just a basic piece of plywood - 3/4"
But would this work if the furnace is on? I don't like to work in 20°.......JK....
Looks like a handy tool.
I get a Tan -1 reading of these numbers as 35 not 20
Make sure the calculator is set to degrees and not radians - let me know if that works for you :)
@@LakesideAutobody I have an old Ti-81-THAT DID THE TRICK. Go into MODE, select degrees instead of radians, then proceed to enter exactly as you have written down here on the math. Thank you!
@@esroot12 You're welcome - should have been a math teacher maybe. Glad it worked 😊