Thanks for sharing this tool, didn't know it existed until your video. Purchased it on their black Friday sale, and tested on one car already, awesome tool. Thanks!
I did my alignment on my 1976 Mini Clubman my self with old school methods with tiles as a nivelling tool, ruler and my Galaxy S7 edge as a degree indicator. Results are as good or better than an alignement shop ! Tire wear and behavior of the car is perfect.
Knowing the Tiger has a solid axel housing my first test would have been to check the alignment of the rear. If it said 0 toe I’d know it was good to go.
Their tests indicate + - .02 degrees compared to industry standard of .05 degrees. I would trust this much more than the janky bubble devices that are available to hobbyists.
Looks like an interesting tool for DIY work. Something I noticed is you didn't utilize a slip plate over your front wheels. Turning the wheels back and forth while stationary will cause the suspension bushings to bind a small amount and not give you dead accurate angles. A super easy DIY slip plate set up is to have a stack of waxy paper sheets (like junk mail) under your tires.
I have the plates but those slick tires on a powered coated surface added with the higher angle of of turning and it being an old car make them unnecessary.
12x12 floor tiles also work well. Picked up a box on Amazon for $10. even better put two faces against each other with sand/salt/etc....between them. I also use them with a water level to get a perfect level surface adding as many as needed to each wheel. Or plastic trash bags work good also.
As a technical trainer and experienced alignment technician, I can’t take videos or products like this seriously. Proper wheel alignment begins with a thorough vehicle inspection and preparation. Ensuring the vehicle is properly loaded onto a level surface and achieving correct and even ride height is also critical for accuracy. The suspension must be jounced on turn plates and/or slip plates at all four corners to eliminate potential binding or compliance issues, as well as any end play in the suspension, steering, or rolling stock. If you’re using the wheels of the vehicle as a reference point, you must measure the runout of each wheel and ensure it is either zero or within an acceptable tolerance that does not exceed the specification you are aiming for. That said, if you start short on these steps, you will end up short on the accuracy and precision that any measurement apparatus can offer. I’ve seen so-called professional alignment technicians either get these steps wrong or skip them entirely, often failing miserably to achieve the desired results, even with real commercial or industrial alignment equipment.
I was an alignment tech for a Goodyear store back in the early 80's and I agree with you 100%. Hunter A111 single post drive on alignment rack with CRT display and 4 wheel mounter sensors was a game changer for me. So there is no way a hand held phone holder can even come close IMHO.
This tool is also complete bullshit, it's relying on absolute attitude reported by the phones IMU, which in the yaw orientation especially is absolutely not accurate as it uses the magnetic compass and a fusion of other relative, (i.e. they only know the rate of change not the true value) sensors. Basically you walking from one side of the vehicle to the other you're almost guaranteed to be a couple of degrees off from even the slightest bit of magnetism in the wheels or panels. A tape measure would achieve far more accurate results for toe in. Camber you can probably get away with using a $10 digital level as it's just the vector offset from where gravity is pointing, but since your toe is affected by changing either caster or camber and vice versa you're still shit out of luck getting a good alignment.
Good stuff! I just saw this advertised on facebook and had to UA-cam it. Your video was the first video that popped up. I have so many cars that this would be a great investment if it works well
I just stumbled onto your channel here.. That car is sharp!! That's coming from an Ford Mustang guy... The tool does look slick.. Though like a few have commented already, we'd need to see a car, getting a full thrust alignment at a known reputable alignment shop, preferably one who's cooperating with this endeavor as well. Then with those numbers in hand for comparison, do the Pepsi challenge with this product... I'll be reasonable, and concede it would be somewhat, just due to where we as the enthusiasts would be doing our testing in our garages and driveways. The outcomes will be dictated by amount of effort expended by each user to get the car level both side to side as well front to back. Lastly, if not an actual mini turntable for each front tire, some bullshit facimile, like two pieces of cardboard or the like.. The gauntlet has been thrown down here.. I am one car guy, with three old Fords, and many friends with more cars than me, and love to tinker.. So gauntlet has been thrown down here... I subscribed, so I'll be watching......
Interesting gadget. I would like to see it compared to a normal garage alignment if that’s possible. I would also do the back axle out of curiosity. It might also show how accurate it is.
The front wheel alignment needs to be based on the rear axle; otherwise, you have four tire tracks on the road while going straight. Also, how do you compensate for wheel deformations and rust on the brake rotors and hubs?
A flat piece of concrete like a driveway or loading dock and if you did it when the concrete is wet you will get less bind in the tires when you have to turn the wheels.
YES, this is a very important part of an alignment and also the hardest to get correct. the toe, camber, and caster are all very simple to figure out with a few simple tools, the thrust angle is a bit more complicated to get perfected
@@ThisWeekWithCars I don’t think it does. That body alignment feature is not the same as thrust angle. But pretty sure they can do it. Just needs some work to add it.
Extremely interesting Steve, thank you very much for posting. I was getting ready to get a Longacre alignment tool, but will look closely at this. Question: apparently this system doesn't require turntables for setting the caster, to turn the wheels a certain number of degrees?
Correct, the phone knows exactly how far the wheel is turned and can work out the math. I think this is also what makes it more accurate, because it is calculating over a longer range.
Turnplates will make it more accurate, but that applies to any alignment method. Without turnplates there will be wind up in the rubber components. But it will get you pretty close. As a budget hack, stick a plastic bin liner or similar under the wheels to reduce friction.
Something I noticed in other videos is that the Caster readout is only a combined total, I'm trying to find out if it will measure both wheels individually
I was a Jaguar dealership mechanic and ever since I left for a new career, I've badly missed having access to an alignment rack. I hate paying other people to do my alignments! I think I'm going to order one of these and give the software a try. Thanks!
I’ve had 3 bad experiences in a row getting my alignment done on my mustang, the last one almost got me dead, as they had my tie rod end only on by 2 threads.. Luckily it was squeaking from movement so I fixed it and aligned the car myself..
It would take way too long to set alignment with this however it wouldnt be a bad option if you are in a bind and just want to put things back after replacing parts.
What about measuring thrust angles, centering the steering wheel, wheel runout, axle offsets, does it compensate for staggered wheel fitments? Would need to see actual full four wheel alignment performed with the tool then the vehicle taken to an actual alignment shop that knows what they are doing for a comparison. I want really this tool to actually work but need the data proving it.
The first thing that stood out to me was that the green diamond on the toe mode doesn't match with the lines of the other modes, giving the impression that the features were developed by different companies. Additionally, I found it difficult to maintain a secure grip and reach the necessary buttons at times. Placing the buttons within easy thumb reach from the most natural holding position could make it more user-friendly.
Unless the size of the wheel is entered in some place, It's not going to give accurate toe. If you put that set up on a 12-in wheel, and then put it on a 22-in wheel, The same angle will have different toe. If the toe is a quarter inch on a 12-in rim, It will be almost a half inch on a 22-in rim.
Wow!! so useful! the tape measure and pins method I use for Toe must go away, now if only I had an application for remembering which way to rotate tie rods on which side to do what, yessss.
Awesome glad to hear this was bought with your own money for once 😊❤ I’ve been eyeing this tool myself but I’m a little iffy about being able to use it on my car since my current wheels don’t have an inner lip or an edge that is protruding slightly for the nubs of the tool to properly butt up against to take the readings. I just feel like I won’t Have a decent point of reference and can’t make repeatable results ?
You point of repeatable results, that is what the levels on the phone are for, it assures that even if it is not in exactly the same place it aligned in a way to get an accurate reading. That is why I showed at some point that I got the same reading whether I measured on the front of the wheel or the rear of the wheel.
I don't get it. I just replaced a tie rod end on one side and it just shows total toe for the front end and not the individual right front wheel. How do I adjust toe on that one wheel since the rest of the vehicle has recently been aligned. I don't want to mess with both sides. I am not an alignment guy and just wanted to make this simple but not sure if it's possible.
On the tie rod you just put on, adjust it until what you call "total toe" is what you want it to be. If you set it to the same degrees of toe it was before your steering wheel should end up straight when driving down the road.
@ThisWeekWithCars Thanks for that! I did not know the degrees prior but I am sure I can spec total tor somewhere. Steering wheel was centered going down the road even after the tie rod end was replaced.
I have known about this tool for a while now and was initially intrigued but I was very turned off by the pricing model for the software. The "hardware" jig that holds the phone also appears to be 3D printed, which is totally fine, I would just prefer to print that myself instead of paying them full retail for it. The real trick is in the software and I would be totally on board if they would sell an inexpensive one time purchase license that would allow me to align all of my cars as many times as I want to and for as long as I want to continue using it. I'm hoping a competitor shows up on the scene with a more reasonable pricing model at some point. As it is this thing isn't even cheaper than the lifetime alignments that I currently buy from the local Firestone shop.
I want to see it compared to a proper aligner, one properly maintained with a competent operator. The lack of runout compensation is a big issue for my applications.
@donhappel9566 Yes, that's a big problem. That's why I actually have my own alignment equipment - a 1970s light based aligner. I even went to a place who exclusively does alignments and has done for decades. He was still useless. Somehow my suspension bushes were nowhere to be seen 1km down the road after leaving. There are competent aligners out there but it's a big challenge to find them.
@@CollectorOfThings Long ago when I lived in Indiana and wanted to do custom alignments for an Alfa Romeo I was road racing I found a tiny little place in my small town that was all in on whatever I needed to do. Turns out the guy running it was named Kinser....as in related to Steve Kinser, King of Sprint Cars. I had no idea, and a funny little Italian road racer has nothing in common with a dirt circle track car, but the man understood the assignment!
If you really do a lot of autocrossing, you need a lot more negative camber. 1/4 inch toe out is fine but you should try for at least 2 degrees camber if you can get the sane amount from both sides.
Any alignment is only as good a the person doing it, even an oldie should have rear end checked, good chance a solid axle can be either bent or out in relation to centre line. You should have turntables under front when doing Caster sweep.
If the graphic representation of the wheels displaying the Ackermann angle was correct (vehicle turning right) then the vehicle has been screwed up by someone, the inside wheel should turn a greater angle than the outside, the only way this could occur is by moving the steering rack behind the axle line, swopping the hubs side to side and keeping the same steering arms on the hubs. Or as he implies the Rootes designers screwed up shoehorning in the V8 engine and had to relocate the steering rack, it would scrub tyres like crazy.
@@murraykilpatrick3029 Bend them or if they bolt on get them from another vehicle from the same manufacturer which has the correct wheelbase, moving the steering rack ahead of the axle line means the track rod ends either hit or run very close to the brake disc which can melt the gaiters. I fitted the front hubs from an HA Viva to an HB Viva because they had disc brakes, the inside wheel turned almost sideways on in tight corners, Midget racers used to do this to hold a tighter cornering line on loose gravel oval tracks.
@JR-o7d as I said anyone who knows the Sunbeam Tiger knows how bad it is. There has been much written about the dreaded Ackerman Angle Problem on the Tiger. Simply put, if you turn left, then the inside wheel, the left wheel, is suppose to have a smaller turning radius than the outside, or right wheel. On the Tiger, the turning radius were reversed, i.e. the inside wheel had a larger turning radius (26 degrees & 5 minutes), that the outside wheel (30 degrees & 15 minutes), at full lock. www.tigersunited.com/techtips/PaulickAckerman/pt-PaulickAckerman1.asp
@JR-o7d here is an article on what some people are doing to try to fix the Sunbeam Tiger, the problem wasn't that they moved the steering rack to fit the V8, they actually went from a recirculating ball steering box to a steering rack and then reversed the steering arms without changing any of the geometry causing the Ackerman problem. www.teae.org/g11-dealing-with-the-tigers-front-suspension/
How about front wheel straight line tracking with respect the rear wheels, I saw something on their web site about taking a measurement off the body of the car, but to me that seems rather inaccurate. On my 73 TR6 the original rack had different thread counts for the tie rod ends making one side ~1/2 inch shorter, the instructions in the Bentley manual say that the length of both tire rod ends should be the same so that when adjusting evenly on both sides the geometry of the steering is consistent for both sides.
Gyraline has two modes for toe: Thrust align and Body align. Thrust align does exactly what you are suggesting - comparing the average rear total toe vector to the front wheel average vector to get (and correct) the steering wheel offset!
I wouldnt trust it. Seems like its relying on the accelerometer in the phone, which should experience a bit of drift over time. That means the zero point isnt consistent, and the measuremens would be out particularly if you took a long time between measurements/rotated the phone a lot. Or is there something i dont know?
I had the timer off but if you do the alignment quickly and when you come back to the first wheel it takes the drift into account because it can compare the two measurements, the first and the last. It has a timer feature in the upper corner you can activate to make sure that you have done it in enough time to account for the drift.
3 minutes into the video, and I paused it for a few minutes because I went and ordered it. 🤣 I'm sick of these ex-convict middle school dropouts over charging for wheel alignments. I was quoted $300 for an alignment on my corvette by a dealership. The service guy was very close to ending up in a body bag and me going to prison. I'm banned from that dealership now. 😂😂
These guys on here yiping about thrust angle read too many comic books😂 Thrust angle on a solid rear axle car is determined by how square the rear axle is mounted on the frame rails. Most people are not going to cut/reweld mount brackets to perfectly sguare the axle, so it is what it is. When total toe is set to what you want, road test, lf steering wheel is off center, adjust tie rod sleeves on each side to bring wheel to center. I would use turn tables under wheels so suspension is not binding when turning for caster measurement. Also you need to know how many degrees your turning the wheels during this measurement. Nice quick check tool, in my mind not a replacement for traditional measuring methods. I know there will be "experts" chiming in, I've been a shop owner mechanic for over 45 yrs. for what ever that's worth 😂
Also I don't know if they realize on an old car you just take the steering wheel off and clock it back to being center, you don't need to take the steering wheel into account when doing your alignment because the wheel can be put on anyway you want it to be.
Not really, most steering shafts and wheels have locator splines. You really want your steering gear, rack to be centered when traveling straight. Also lock to lock should be as close as possible, if both of those things are true and it's actually possible to reorientate the steering wheel to the shaft then that method is ok❤@@ThisWeekWithCars
I had to interrupt my breakfast to write this comment.. IF you have non-flat wheels (off design, no lip, fat lip), you're screwed. IF you have a phone that is NOT flat (cameras sticking out of case) then it won't lay flat inside this case. IF you don't have turn table bases under your wheels, you won't get accurate readings. So, i still use alignment plates and they work out great and for $140, you can get lifetime alignment at most mainstream tire shops like Tire Kingdom and the the rest..
This holder is designed that the cameras and also the buttons on the side of the phone do not interfere, you would have to see it in person but that was all designed into it.
Not any different than the tools you already use in your garage or at the race track. Nobody at the race track has a laser alignment machine to make changes.
I am not very impressed. It does not repeat in my experience. This means you can measure the same alignment twice, three times, or more, and get different results each time. iPhone 16 Pro Max.
No, I'm sorry. Caster / camber math is pretty simple, and all you really need is an accurate angle indicator, which, nowadays, you can buy almost anywhere. I am 76 and 2 years ago converted my 01 Cummins Ram to 4WD. I use an old Ammco caster / camber bubble gauge sometimes, or if cannot fit it up, a digi angle indicator. This is not that hard.
ummm... there is no way this is as accurate as if you had it done on say a Hunter, since it totally omits runout compensation. If you omit runout compensation the alignment angles are totally going to depend on the condition of the wheels and random position as to where they were when you measured them. Runout compensation is absolutely required for a proper alignment.
Absolutely NOT! There is no way that you measured toe that way. I can tell you two things right off the bat. First, the sensors in your smartphone are simply not that accurate. I've worked with accelerometers, GPS, compass, and other smartphone sensors and they are extremely noisy. You will never get mm-level accuracy with a smart phone. Second, tell me how that thing is measuring toe using accelerometers, which only react to gravity, or the compass, which is not only not accurate, but is extremely susceptible to interference from......say the metal components of your car? I am VERY familiar with the compasses on smartphones and they are wildly sensitive to every little bit of interference. This is 100% pure snake oil. Straight from their website "Results are not guaranteed and may vary due to numerous factors." In other words, this technology is pure garbage
![Lp. Сердце Вселенной #60 РОЖДЕНИЕ ЛОЛОЛОШКИ [Финал] • Майнкрафт](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/YoR0pAV9FVQ/mqdefault.jpg)
Thanks for sharing this tool, didn't know it existed until your video. Purchased it on their black Friday sale, and tested on one car already, awesome tool. Thanks!
I had them check my alignment at SEMA. Matched exactly what I thought it should be based on my own alignment. cool idea
I did my alignment on my 1976 Mini Clubman my self with old school methods with tiles as a nivelling tool, ruler and my Galaxy S7 edge as a degree indicator. Results are as good or better than an alignement shop ! Tire wear and behavior of the car is perfect.
Im definitely buying this. I usually use string to set Toe cuz i was so tired of alignment shops never getting it right with my OCD
That Sunbeam Tiger is gorgeous.
Great to see a Rootes Group Car on your channel Steve. The Sunbeam Tiger is a treat for the eyes 😊
The thing’s cool and all, yet without a comparison to an actual laser alignment machine, these are just numbers. Would like to see a side by side.
Like I said that info is on their website, this is a video about how to use it. Here is some of their comparisons gyraline.com/pages/study1
Lazer was invented in 50s .. Lazer in alignment mainstream till mid 90s ..
Old school guys didn't need to no stinky Lazer or phone
Knowing the Tiger has a solid axel housing my first test would have been to check the alignment of the rear. If it said 0 toe I’d know it was good to go.
@@tonypires8816 agreed, that would be a great test I bet!
Their tests indicate + - .02 degrees compared to industry standard of .05 degrees. I would trust this much more than the janky bubble devices that are available to hobbyists.
Just got mine in the mail and plan on trying it out tomorrow on my 72 Celica. Thanks for the demo!
Looks like an interesting tool for DIY work. Something I noticed is you didn't utilize a slip plate over your front wheels. Turning the wheels back and forth while stationary will cause the suspension bushings to bind a small amount and not give you dead accurate angles. A super easy DIY slip plate set up is to have a stack of waxy paper sheets (like junk mail) under your tires.
I have the plates but those slick tires on a powered coated surface added with the higher angle of of turning and it being an old car make them unnecessary.
Could also place 2 pieces of 10"x 10" cardboard under each front tire for easier turning while in that static position.
12x12 floor tiles also work well. Picked up a box on Amazon for $10. even better put two faces against each other with sand/salt/etc....between them. I also use them with a water level to get a perfect level surface adding as many as needed to each wheel.
Or plastic trash bags work good also.
Can't wait for the open-source version software and where you can 3D print your own phone holder.
After using this tool it would be nice to see the actual adjustments being done.
That would be a different procedure on different cars. Most old cars toe is the only thing that is adjustable.
As a technical trainer and experienced alignment technician, I can’t take videos or products like this seriously. Proper wheel alignment begins with a thorough vehicle inspection and preparation. Ensuring the vehicle is properly loaded onto a level surface and achieving correct and even ride height is also critical for accuracy.
The suspension must be jounced on turn plates and/or slip plates at all four corners to eliminate potential binding or compliance issues, as well as any end play in the suspension, steering, or rolling stock. If you’re using the wheels of the vehicle as a reference point, you must measure the runout of each wheel and ensure it is either zero or within an acceptable tolerance that does not exceed the specification you are aiming for.
That said, if you start short on these steps, you will end up short on the accuracy and precision that any measurement apparatus can offer. I’ve seen so-called professional alignment technicians either get these steps wrong or skip them entirely, often failing miserably to achieve the desired results, even with real commercial or industrial alignment equipment.
I was an alignment tech for a Goodyear store back in the early 80's and I agree with you 100%. Hunter A111 single post drive on alignment rack with CRT display and 4 wheel mounter sensors was a game changer for me. So there is no way a hand held phone holder can even come close IMHO.
This tool is also complete bullshit, it's relying on absolute attitude reported by the phones IMU, which in the yaw orientation especially is absolutely not accurate as it uses the magnetic compass and a fusion of other relative, (i.e. they only know the rate of change not the true value) sensors. Basically you walking from one side of the vehicle to the other you're almost guaranteed to be a couple of degrees off from even the slightest bit of magnetism in the wheels or panels. A tape measure would achieve far more accurate results for toe in. Camber you can probably get away with using a $10 digital level as it's just the vector offset from where gravity is pointing, but since your toe is affected by changing either caster or camber and vice versa you're still shit out of luck getting a good alignment.
An Interesting piece of kit and very well explained Steve. Thank you for the post. 👍👍
I just ordered this after watching your video!
Good stuff! I just saw this advertised on facebook and had to UA-cam it. Your video was the first video that popped up. I have so many cars that this would be a great investment if it works well
Did you check it with a regular toe in bar? Thanks in advance
I just stumbled onto your channel here.. That car is sharp!! That's coming from an Ford Mustang guy...
The tool does look slick.. Though like a few have commented already, we'd need to see a car, getting a full thrust alignment at a known reputable alignment shop, preferably one who's cooperating with this endeavor as well. Then with those numbers in hand for comparison, do the Pepsi challenge with this product... I'll be reasonable, and concede it would be somewhat, just due to where we as the enthusiasts would be doing our testing in our garages and driveways. The outcomes will be dictated by amount of effort expended by each user to get the car level both side to side as well front to back. Lastly, if not an actual mini turntable for each front tire, some bullshit facimile, like two pieces of cardboard or the like.. The gauntlet has been thrown down here.. I am one car guy, with three old Fords, and many friends with more cars than me, and love to tinker.. So gauntlet has been thrown down here... I subscribed, so I'll be watching......
Did mine with two jack stand an a string and some cardboard. It better than the car I took to the dealership for alignment.
Interesting gadget. I would like to see it compared to a normal garage alignment if that’s possible.
I would also do the back axle out of curiosity. It might also show how accurate it is.
The front wheel alignment needs to be based on the rear axle; otherwise, you have four tire tracks on the road while going straight. Also, how do you compensate for wheel deformations and rust on the brake rotors and hubs?
Any suggestions for a flat surface if I don't have access to a lift?
A flat piece of concrete like a driveway or loading dock and if you did it when the concrete is wet you will get less bind in the tires when you have to turn the wheels.
Really impressive. But you also need thrust angle to ensure a good alignment. Hopefully they add this to the features.
YES, this is a very important part of an alignment and also the hardest to get correct.
the toe, camber, and caster are all very simple to figure out with a few simple tools, the thrust angle is a bit more complicated to get perfected
This tool also does that.
@@ThisWeekWithCars ok cool, good to know. i must have missed that part... thanks for the demo!
@@ThisWeekWithCars I don’t think it does. That body alignment feature is not the same as thrust angle. But pretty sure they can do it. Just needs some work to add it.
Extremely interesting Steve, thank you very much for posting. I was getting ready to get a Longacre alignment tool, but will look closely at this. Question: apparently this system doesn't require turntables for setting the caster, to turn the wheels a certain number of degrees?
Correct, the phone knows exactly how far the wheel is turned and can work out the math. I think this is also what makes it more accurate, because it is calculating over a longer range.
Correct, Gyraline calculates caster based off of the steered angles you choose. We were tired of the 20 degree limitation!
Turnplates will make it more accurate, but that applies to any alignment method. Without turnplates there will be wind up in the rubber components. But it will get you pretty close. As a budget hack, stick a plastic bin liner or similar under the wheels to reduce friction.
Love the Sunbeam, I had 2 a 67 and a 63
Something I noticed in other videos is that the Caster readout is only a combined total, I'm trying to find out if it will measure both wheels individually
I was a Jaguar dealership mechanic and ever since I left for a new career, I've badly missed having access to an alignment rack. I hate paying other people to do my alignments! I think I'm going to order one of these and give the software a try. Thanks!
I’ve had 3 bad experiences in a row getting my alignment done on my mustang, the last one almost got me dead, as they had my tie rod end only on by 2 threads.. Luckily it was squeaking from movement so I fixed it and aligned the car myself..
It would take way too long to set alignment with this however it wouldnt be a bad option if you are in a bind and just want to put things back after replacing parts.
This is way faster than the other tools I showed
What about measuring thrust angles, centering the steering wheel, wheel runout, axle offsets, does it compensate for staggered wheel fitments? Would need to see actual full four wheel alignment performed with the tool then the vehicle taken to an actual alignment shop that knows what they are doing for a comparison. I want really this tool to actually work but need the data proving it.
holy f*** balls, this is a major game changer for grass root track guys of all kinds
For sure I am not going to the track without it.
Missed this one! Awesome.
Absolutely stellar car and a great overview of the system Steve! Do you have any recommendations for us to make the software better for you?
The first thing that stood out to me was that the green diamond on the toe mode doesn't match with the lines of the other modes, giving the impression that the features were developed by different companies.
Additionally, I found it difficult to maintain a secure grip and reach the necessary buttons at times. Placing the buttons within easy thumb reach from the most natural holding position could make it more user-friendly.
@@ThisWeekWithCars Thank you for the feedback, it really means a lot. We'll work on these for future updates!
How did the measurements compare to an alignment machine or race metric methodologies?? That is the acid test
My nephew autocross’s his v6 swapped MR2, I think I just found the perfect Christmas gift, thank you!!!
Unless the size of the wheel is entered in some place, It's not going to give accurate toe. If you put that set up on a 12-in wheel, and then put it on a 22-in wheel, The same angle will have different toe. If the toe is a quarter inch on a 12-in rim, It will be almost a half inch on a 22-in rim.
Wow!! so useful! the tape measure and pins method I use for Toe must go away, now if only I had an application for remembering which way to rotate tie rods on which side to do what, yessss.
Awesome glad to hear this was bought with your own money for once 😊❤
I’ve been eyeing this tool myself but I’m a little iffy about being able to use it on my car since my current wheels don’t have an inner lip or an edge that is protruding slightly for the nubs of the tool to properly butt up against to take the readings. I just feel like I won’t Have a decent point of reference and can’t make repeatable results ?
You point of repeatable results, that is what the levels on the phone are for, it assures that even if it is not in exactly the same place it aligned in a way to get an accurate reading. That is why I showed at some point that I got the same reading whether I measured on the front of the wheel or the rear of the wheel.
If you sell the app anyway, can we just print the jig you printed at home?
Not sponsored but they'd be wise think about it and soon! Good find!
They are probably a very small company that has no budget for it.
I don't get it. I just replaced a tie rod end on one side and it just shows total toe for the front end and not the individual right front wheel. How do I adjust toe on that one wheel since the rest of the vehicle has recently been aligned. I don't want to mess with both sides. I am not an alignment guy and just wanted to make this simple but not sure if it's possible.
On the tie rod you just put on, adjust it until what you call "total toe" is what you want it to be. If you set it to the same degrees of toe it was before your steering wheel should end up straight when driving down the road.
@ThisWeekWithCars Thanks for that! I did not know the degrees prior but I am sure I can spec total tor somewhere. Steering wheel was centered going down the road even after the tie rod end was replaced.
Wonder if they make a platform to cover go karts.
I have known about this tool for a while now and was initially intrigued but I was very turned off by the pricing model for the software. The "hardware" jig that holds the phone also appears to be 3D printed, which is totally fine, I would just prefer to print that myself instead of paying them full retail for it. The real trick is in the software and I would be totally on board if they would sell an inexpensive one time purchase license that would allow me to align all of my cars as many times as I want to and for as long as I want to continue using it. I'm hoping a competitor shows up on the scene with a more reasonable pricing model at some point. As it is this thing isn't even cheaper than the lifetime alignments that I currently buy from the local Firestone shop.
I want to see it compared to a proper aligner, one properly maintained with a competent operator.
The lack of runout compensation is a big issue for my applications.
I have one and it does not repeat. It will get you close, but you can re-measure without moving anything and will get different results.
"competent operator" - where does one find one of these? Certainly not at the typical tire shop!
@donhappel9566 Yes, that's a big problem. That's why I actually have my own alignment equipment - a 1970s light based aligner.
I even went to a place who exclusively does alignments and has done for decades. He was still useless. Somehow my suspension bushes were nowhere to be seen 1km down the road after leaving.
There are competent aligners out there but it's a big challenge to find them.
@@CollectorOfThings Long ago when I lived in Indiana and wanted to do custom alignments for an Alfa Romeo I was road racing I found a tiny little place in my small town that was all in on whatever I needed to do. Turns out the guy running it was named Kinser....as in related to Steve Kinser, King of Sprint Cars. I had no idea, and a funny little Italian road racer has nothing in common with a dirt circle track car, but the man understood the assignment!
What about thrust angle?
It does that as well.
Great vid! Keep em coming.
If you really do a lot of autocrossing, you need a lot more negative camber. 1/4 inch toe out is fine but you should try for at least 2 degrees camber if you can get the sane amount from both sides.
Which tires are those?
Toyo Proxes R888
I've been using the shop up the street to align my car. 🤣
Any alignment is only as good a the person doing it, even an oldie should have rear end checked, good chance a solid axle can be either bent or out in relation to centre line. You should have turntables under front when doing Caster sweep.
I'd also do the rear just to make sure the thing actually works
Turntables would be nice, but the other thing that would work is to lay out a plastic trashbag under each front wheel for the caster sweep!
Great video thanks for sharing
Haven't seen a tiger since 1986 😁👍🏼
Great video!
How did the measurements compare to an alignment machine or race metric methodologies?? That is the acid test
If the graphic representation of the wheels displaying the Ackermann angle was correct (vehicle turning right) then the vehicle has been screwed up by someone, the inside wheel should turn a greater angle than the outside, the only way this could occur is by moving the steering rack behind the axle line, swopping the hubs side to side and keeping the same steering arms on the hubs.
Or as he implies the Rootes designers screwed up shoehorning in the V8 engine and had to relocate the steering rack, it would scrub tyres like crazy.
Yes you are correct.
Also, I'm not sure how anybody goes about adjusting the Akerman angle, unless they, bend the steering arms or somehow space them?
@@murraykilpatrick3029 Bend them or if they bolt on get them from another vehicle from the same manufacturer which has the correct wheelbase, moving the steering rack ahead of the axle line means the track rod ends either hit or run very close to the brake disc which can melt the gaiters. I fitted the front hubs from an HA Viva to an HB Viva because they had disc brakes, the inside wheel turned almost sideways on in tight corners, Midget racers used to do this to hold a tighter cornering line on loose gravel oval tracks.
@JR-o7d as I said anyone who knows the Sunbeam Tiger knows how bad it is.
There has been much written about the dreaded Ackerman Angle Problem on the Tiger. Simply put, if you turn left, then the inside wheel, the left wheel, is suppose to have a smaller turning radius than the outside, or right wheel. On the Tiger, the turning radius were reversed, i.e. the inside wheel had a larger turning radius (26 degrees & 5 minutes), that the outside wheel (30 degrees & 15 minutes), at full lock.
www.tigersunited.com/techtips/PaulickAckerman/pt-PaulickAckerman1.asp
@JR-o7d here is an article on what some people are doing to try to fix the Sunbeam Tiger, the problem wasn't that they moved the steering rack to fit the V8, they actually went from a recirculating ball steering box to a steering rack and then reversed the steering arms without changing any of the geometry causing the Ackerman problem. www.teae.org/g11-dealing-with-the-tigers-front-suspension/
How about front wheel straight line tracking with respect the rear wheels, I saw something on their web site about taking a measurement off the body of the car, but to me that seems rather inaccurate. On my 73 TR6 the original rack had different thread counts for the tie rod ends making one side ~1/2 inch shorter, the instructions in the Bentley manual say that the length of both tire rod ends should be the same so that when adjusting evenly on both sides the geometry of the steering is consistent for both sides.
Gyraline has two modes for toe: Thrust align and Body align. Thrust align does exactly what you are suggesting - comparing the average rear total toe vector to the front wheel average vector to get (and correct) the steering wheel offset!
It uses gps to find toe?
It’s uses the gyrometer
I wouldnt trust it. Seems like its relying on the accelerometer in the phone, which should experience a bit of drift over time. That means the zero point isnt consistent, and the measuremens would be out particularly if you took a long time between measurements/rotated the phone a lot. Or is there something i dont know?
I had the timer off but if you do the alignment quickly and when you come back to the first wheel it takes the drift into account because it can compare the two measurements, the first and the last. It has a timer feature in the upper corner you can activate to make sure that you have done it in enough time to account for the drift.
I can just say: WOW
3 minutes into the video, and I paused it for a few minutes because I went and ordered it. 🤣 I'm sick of these ex-convict middle school dropouts over charging for wheel alignments. I was quoted $300 for an alignment on my corvette by a dealership. The service guy was very close to ending up in a body bag and me going to prison. I'm banned from that dealership now. 😂😂
Great stuff thanks.
Remarkable
awesome thanks!
I've seen this product before and now you've sold me on it, but I don't own an iphone.
There is an Android version, they suggest downloading it to your phone before buying to see if it will work with your phone.
Should have checked the rear toe and camber to verify the software is accurate, should come up all zeros.
Camber measurement is problematic, you are not parallel to the wheel rim with that small jig
Wow sold
The first thing I'd like to see is the toe and camber of the rear, if it showed 0 then I'd have some faith in this thing.
These guys on here yiping about thrust angle read too many comic books😂 Thrust angle on a solid rear axle car is determined by how square the rear axle is mounted on the frame rails. Most people are not going to cut/reweld mount brackets to perfectly sguare the axle, so it is what it is. When total toe is set to what you want, road test, lf steering wheel is off center, adjust tie rod sleeves on each side to bring wheel to center. I would use turn tables under wheels so suspension is not binding when turning for caster measurement. Also you need to know how many degrees your turning the wheels during this measurement. Nice quick check tool, in my mind not a replacement for traditional measuring methods. I know there will be "experts" chiming in, I've been a shop owner mechanic for over 45 yrs. for what ever that's worth 😂
Also I don't know if they realize on an old car you just take the steering wheel off and clock it back to being center, you don't need to take the steering wheel into account when doing your alignment because the wheel can be put on anyway you want it to be.
Not really, most steering shafts and wheels have locator splines. You really want your steering gear, rack to be centered when traveling straight. Also lock to lock should be as close as possible, if both of those things are true and it's actually possible to reorientate the steering wheel to the shaft then that method is ok❤@@ThisWeekWithCars
I had to interrupt my breakfast to write this comment.. IF you have non-flat wheels (off design, no lip, fat lip), you're screwed. IF you have a phone that is NOT flat (cameras sticking out of case) then it won't lay flat inside this case. IF you don't have turn table bases under your wheels, you won't get accurate readings.
So, i still use alignment plates and they work out great and for $140, you can get lifetime alignment at most mainstream tire shops like Tire Kingdom and the the rest..
This holder is designed that the cameras and also the buttons on the side of the phone do not interfere, you would have to see it in person but that was all designed into it.
You can't use that thing to make real time adjustments (maybe with a helper). You're going to spend quite a while with trial and error.
Not any different than the tools you already use in your garage or at the race track. Nobody at the race track has a laser alignment machine to make changes.
Doesn't work with android
Android version is in testing you can download it and try it out.
@ThisWeekWithCars I have the app doesn't open or work at all... so it doesn't work with android
For a start . You should do Caster first. Then Camber then Toe. This looks like a gimmick.
Do caster and camber kind of like together at the same time
@@tomfoolbee not on older cars. Its two different parts.
I am not very impressed. It does not repeat in my experience. This means you can measure the same alignment twice, three times, or more, and get different results each time. iPhone 16 Pro Max.
Сразу видно что учеб6ик геометрии вы скурили в туалете.
Разница сходимости 1мм на 16 дюймах .
Вы серьезно хотите поймать этот миллиметр на этом? 😂
No, I'm sorry. Caster / camber math is pretty simple, and all you really need is an accurate angle indicator, which, nowadays, you can buy almost anywhere. I am 76 and 2 years ago converted my 01 Cummins Ram to 4WD. I use an old Ammco caster / camber bubble gauge sometimes, or if cannot fit it up, a digi angle indicator. This is not that hard.
ummm... there is no way this is as accurate as if you had it done on say a Hunter, since it totally omits runout compensation. If you omit runout compensation the alignment angles are totally going to depend on the condition of the wheels and random position as to where they were when you measured them. Runout compensation is absolutely required for a proper alignment.
This does that
Sorry but my phone sensors are good to like 5 degrees. $250 samsung.
Did alignments for a gm dealer for thirty years wheels are not perfect you need to do run out to be accurate no way this thing is accurate
Sold me. GYRA10OFF for 10% off. Came to $125.98 shipped.
No turn tables no skid plates no good lol
A cellphone and a piece of string is cheaper...
No thank you
sucks that you gotta have an iphone
Android version is in beta and coming out soon
Cheaper just take it to a wheel alignment place and NO I WILL NOT SUSCRIBE..............
Absolutely NOT! There is no way that you measured toe that way. I can tell you two things right off the bat. First, the sensors in your smartphone are simply not that accurate. I've worked with accelerometers, GPS, compass, and other smartphone sensors and they are extremely noisy. You will never get mm-level accuracy with a smart phone. Second, tell me how that thing is measuring toe using accelerometers, which only react to gravity, or the compass, which is not only not accurate, but is extremely susceptible to interference from......say the metal components of your car? I am VERY familiar with the compasses on smartphones and they are wildly sensitive to every little bit of interference. This is 100% pure snake oil.
Straight from their website "Results are not guaranteed and may vary due to numerous factors." In other words, this technology is pure garbage