Overvolting an electric bicycle motor for more speed! Q&A#7
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- Опубліковано 29 чер 2017
- Learn how to build your own ebike with my book The Ultimate DIY Ebike Guide: a.co/2Yys1kf
Or check out my second book - DIY Lithium Batteries: a.co/jcc2OzV
350W hubmotor: goo.gl/K1mYvR
36V/48V controllers I used: goo.gl/nJBnJP
Throttle: goo.gl/UebsNC
Cycle Analyst: goo.gl/RsmE3N
350W Bafang BBS01: goo.gl/peyiYb
500W Bafang BBS02: goo.gl/EsqHu2
750W Bafang BBS02: goo.gl/k81aVH
1000W Bafang BBSHD: goo.gl/MU69oh
The parts that I use for building batteries:
18650 cells (Sanyo GA 3500mAh): goo.gl/J6ONJV
18650 cells (another Sanyo GA 3500mAh source): goo.gl/f10wHH
18650 cells (Samsung 26F 2600mAh): goo.gl/VhpP7T
18650 cells (Panasonic 18650B 3400mAh): goo.gl/fvwJZQ
18650 cells (Another Panasonic 18650B): goo.gl/tVjREI
18650 positive insulating washer: goo.gl/HBVOuc
Ebike battery cases: goo.gl/W2DLmE
Nickel strip: goo.gl/VIrNQq
Spot welder: goo.gl/KN3Uaw
BMSs: goo.gl/S6gSQx
Silicone wire: goo.gl/xmpbKD
Black 18650 cell spacers: goo.gl/hQxWF6
Vruzend cell spacers: goo.gl/5ReLqA
Large heat shrink tubing: goo.gl/6v1ow9
Small heat shrink tubing: goo.gl/OU3Z6u
Foam sheet for protecting battery: goo.gl/5e71tE
Kapton tape: goo.gl/D6BT57
Chargers: goo.gl/js0T0V
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Wow thanks for answering my question, and what an utterly thorough answer too!
I'll drop you a private message.
Thanks for the list on your bike and the information provided about over-volt-aging the motors. Thanks MikeJ F.
Motors are extremely similar to power supply transformers in design. Both are rated for a certian current continuously based off the size of the windings used in the motor/inductor/transformer. So it is more accurate to look at the continuous current rating and the power rating (KW) when comparing motors for use in an e-bike.
Also it is important to look at the cooling design of the motor and control electronics. Even if a motor or controller is more powerful, if it does not have adequate cooling to run at that power level continuously you will burn it out. Conversely, you can run a smaller motor or controller at a higher power level (to a degree) if you have more than adequate cooling on it. You will take a bit of an efficiency hit doing that though as a somewhat higher percentage of the input power is wasted as heat.
Thank you for the lesson. I am now a subscriber and am awaiting delivery of first my e-bike. Thanks again.
So many of my questions answered in one video! Thank you!
Thanks Mike. I am considering a new build and it is gong to be electric. Your channel and tips will help a lot.
good that you mentioned the controller capabilities. it is important to know what caps you have inside, and keeping the amps down when overvolting. Should be mentioned a motor running at 50 volts/10 amps, is more efficient than a motor running at 36 volts/ 13.8 amps....both using 500 watts. less amps = less heat losses. But going fast is not as important as STOPPING. Even if you do the necessary tweaking to improve performance, please upgrade your brakes on your ride to keep everyone safe, not just you, but the people you are cycling around as well. Getting clipped by a bike going 30 miles/hr is not the same as getting clipped at 20mph.
How can you bring the amps down?
@@Meme_supplier less twist on the throttle….more legpower/lower assist level.
You sure know what you're talking about,' Love your Videos I've been thinking about building a e,bike
Thank you so much for this information! Just got my support ticket back today regarding my technical question from FLX! So pumped to [destroy] modify my Babymaker II settings!
Thank you for this! You just answered a bunch of questions I had. Very informative, love your channel!
thanks..by watching your cleaned explanation video i never have hesitations now for using higher voltage on my ebikes..
Hello there, how wass the overvolted motor? It lasts? Is still alive? 🙂
Whoever asked that question thank you. And thanks for a complete answer also👍🏾
Every new video better then the last!!!! Excellent
Always helpful and Love your book.
thank you mika for all your smarts !
Thank you so much for your time and your help... Tumbs up.
Thanks for your fantastic content. You are really a good teacher.
I've been running my direct drive 36v hub front wheel off a disability scooter as the rear wheel on my DIY disability scooter at about 82 V DC and love the better efficienty that it gave me
Thank you so much for your invaluable information, highly appreciate it, keep it up the outstanding job, have a great day.
I got the 36v brush motor over volted to 48v and the chain drive well aligned. I saw you review after but I have a brushless front so just a bit extra. Check your controller capacitors before over volting!
Great video, Micah! I forgot that you had short hair many years ago. Thank you for working so hard for us all of these years!
I'm 55yr, just getting into e-bikes, thus will be buying your books on Amazon. Thanks for the information Brother...:-)
5 years it’s been good sir, are you enjoying ebikes still?😃
Was going to ask same thing lol
Sweet dude! Binging on the channel tonight!
This was exactly what i needed to know. Thanks
Thanks for the informative piece. I would prefer to hear you talk without the music track in the background, it's distracting.
I bought ur book ..help me a lot but it's still better to understand if ur explained it like this ☺️
Awesome
You’re a Master of ebike to me
I learned a lot from your videos . Merci bien
L,S&S
Great videos, Im watching all of your videos. Ive got one of your books on order, probably order the others.
VEry nice information on motors / controllers in using over voltage setup =)
Like your sea and waves perspective :) and music in your video is great
Finally some love for the music. Someone get this guy tickets to my next show!
Nice and easy explanation, well done 👏 . Keep it up. 👍
thanks, very informative
Very good video, thanks
Its important to note that motor power does not increase with voltage linearly. Certain motors can have a huge increase in RPM with just a little voltage boost. They have a KV value which indicates how much it spin faster when voltage is higher.
Does increasing current just increase torque and acceleration, and voltage the top speed?
love your channel i had been trying to think of things to ask though i haven't had any luck. perhaps a video on the different battery tuypes and there pro's and cons ranging from lypo's to lithium sulfate batteries and beyond. also maby what applications they are each best used for.
thank you this video helped me alot
Thank you for this video!
This video was helpful thank you
This helped out so much holy crap!
doctor of ebikes. ty for answering my questions!
thats finally a good overvolting video!
It has been said that more than 36V(42V) can be dangerous depending on a specific set of conditions.
The speed increase will be a lot less than 44%. 20% is maybe realistic. Rule of thumb is that doubling the speed require 8 times the power.
Hill-climbing is where you will see the biggest benefit.
Overall range as well. Unless you custom make a battery just for higher output with same number of cells. Often a higher voltage pack is also higher total capacity.
To clarify the formula he gave is not off, its just that it gives you the "unloaded speed", or the speed of the wheel spinning in air with no resistance.
Great video all the answers I wanted
Thanks for info!
Thanks that info really gave me a idea for the scrap bike I was about to chuck out. 😊
ty Great vid
A Standard brushless e-bike motor rated at 36V will easily handle a 48V Battery, despite the doom and gloom 'rolling fireball' comments lol - just be sure those capacitors in your controller are rated at 60V and you'll be fine, as you pointed out - its a relatively easy swap-out (basic soldering) if your capacitors are rated too low.
Great video, thank you!!!
Hi, Mike,
very nice video... :)
can you make video from controller, to find out the capacitor how much voltage can take?
best Regards
Good video. I am building my 1st ebike and appreciate all that you have shared. When you mention that current limit should be reduced while overvolting how do you make that adjustment?
Thanks for a very clear and distinct information I finally understand lol!
Motor maximum voltage is defined by the maximum field strength in the stator saturation, heat and isolation strength.
Thank you for your comment. Can you expand on this?
please expand in complicated form and in simple laymen terms
is there any way of measuring saturation?
So, will more copper windings help to increase the voltage?
Until it melts, nice if they all had thermal cutouts.
Thank you.
Great. Was curious about the controller limits. Thanks
Suuuuper helpful. Thank you!
great info
you sir are a PURE GENIUS !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Good information
THIS IS THE EXPLANATION OF THE COEFFICIENT USED IN THE FORMULA:
.1 the tire diameter is 26", multiply by 2.54 to obtain centimeters measure, so 66.04cm. Then you need that measure in kilometers for the calculation of km/h, divide by 100000 so 66.04cm ~= 0.00066km.
- keep note that you multiplied by 2.54 and then divided by 100000 -
.2 the circumference of the wheel is "diameter times PI", that means in a whole turn of the wheel you will travel approximately 0.00066km * 3.14 ~= 0.0021km.
- keep note you multuplied by 3.14 -
.3 RPM by its acronym means Revolutions Per Minute, so to calculate how much you travel in a minute you multiply your motor RPM by the result obtained in .2, and for the sake of semplicity we will use 300RPM and so 300RPM*0.0021 ~= 0.62km/minute.
.4 to obtain km/h just use the result from .3 and multiply it by 60 (infact if you travel X amount in a minute you will then travel 60 times X the amount in an hour), so 60*0.62km/minute ~= 37km/h
- keep note you multiplied by 60 -
All pure numeric coefficients can be treated separately so (2.54 / 100000) * 3.14 * 60 ~= 0.0048
Thank you!! :)
Mike, is it possible to design it to be charged by different chargers at the same time to reduce charge time?
and how much range difference would it be when using highest quality 3500mah 18650 cells vs regular pre-made packs from china?
you always manage to make concise and to the point!! thumbs up
Accurate info well covered! Current kills...people and motors. Most of the insulation is rated 600V or higher. If they made motors with internal liquid cooling, they could be pushed extremely hard! 18650 cells can't deliver high current without many good ones in parallel. That (and smaller wires) are the reason they go higher voltage. 21700 cells can deliver more current and hobby LiPo packs can deliver massive current.
Well explained!!
useful info thanks
i hear those old bionx 350 hubs are actually wound for like 1000 watts . Love to see this retrofit done
Thank you very much
U R De Man when it comes to all things electric
This was a good video, I just need to find some decent motors!
Hi, I heard that the ride control has a limit cut off cable how can we identify this and is there any way to remove this? Thanks
Finally i have an answer thank you sir brilliant explanation
awesome vid! you are the ebike king. Is there a separate formula to determine speed for ebikes with 2 motors? I have an Ariel rider D-class and I'm trying to figure out how much more speed i can get from over-volting
awesome video, insta subbed
ebikes is love
Good info on e-bike 48v controller and overvolting your motor(s). How would you install a generator 12volt?
Mate I've been wondering about that for YEARS, I've had 4 ebikes over 10 years
you can over heat the motor if you put higher voltage. electric motors do have voltage limits due to heat problem. mosfets inside motors can melt when the coils over temp
Thanks for the tip on the 2WD throttle wiring. I think I will build a 2WD 2x1000W bike.
Do you have a step by step video on how to setup your brushless speed control settings with the l.e.d display for the best performance??
Possibly worth noting that the power and voltage ratings are usually just for motor duty cycle. At their rated power the motor should be able to handle a 100% duty cycle. Past that point they will begin to reduce in duty cycle due to the increase in heat generation as the power utilization increases. Well noted though :)
Super customer service
Thanks for the video. I sub'd your channel and bought your book (1st) also. My wife and I bought ebikes, both are 48v. Mine is 750w and hers is 500w, and I was a little surprised that she can do the same top speed as me when we go out riding. She is lighter than me, about 60lbs, which might be making the two bikes about the same. Looking forward to getting the book.
She goes as fast as you cause you both run 48V with similar motors.
Great video, would any one know by over volting would it damage any other components on the bike like the lcd display and the throttle etc. Example 72v system with a 84v battery pack
Can you make a video about how to check how much volt the controller can handle?
Awesome video thank you for doing it!!!!
I just want to add that by removing the screws on the controller, one can open it and look what maximum voltage is written on the capacitors/mosfets. Apart from that, you just need to check the head in the current phase cable (the red one going from the controller to the motor).
If all that is good. All is good. The battery will suffer more of course. I only use it to climb hills at normal speed, so I don't bother traffic. 45km/h is a perfct speed in any other scenario inside the city.
Can you make a video about the use of tork arms for front and rear motors??
Hi pls I want to upgrade my own but I want to know I can use the same speed controller damage without damage?
Hi Micah, I have a peddle assist 24 volt bike. I understand from this video that if I replace the 24V battery and the 24Volt controller both for a 36Volt one without replacing the motor it will function just fine? or are there other things that I should also take into account?
Regards,
Tin
Hi, really enjoying your informative videos. Question: How can I improve the torque (pulling power uphill) on my ebike? (I have a folder with 20 inch wheels, bafang 250w motor, 36v 8.7ah battery) - Thanks
You can buy bafang 48v500w controller an 48v battery that s what i run my 250w bafang much quicker now if you dont wanna spend that much look for 36v higher amp controller that fits your kit bafang or kt controller tho kt controller need be run on there kt display
Great video...can I do the same thing, to the brushed motor, in my electric scooter?
I'm trying to push for efficiency, so I'm trying to get the current as low as I can get. But I wanna know in your point of view and knowledge, which configuration will give me the best efficiency; 500W 48V or 500W 48V(overvolting to 60V)?
Do you have to use separate controllers for each hub motor and how do you program your controller(s)? Great videos BTW, just purchased your bike building book. 😁
you can or i believe he has another video on something that handles both with one controller
I wish you would had added information on the motors and controllers that you chose for this bike especially the rear hub
Hi, I’ve got a I mortar 36v hub all in one unit any idea what voltages it would take? Great video 🏴
Love the video. I have a clean republic 250w 24V hilltopper kit. The battery is pooched. Looking to over-volt it but I think the controller is built into the battery. Any clue what the max voltage is for that built in controller. Should I go with an external controller?
I have 36v motor and 60v batt+controller 26" Top Speed 55km/h. Confirm it work well motor just a little warm only.
some of those 36v bafang kits are sold as 48v kits. my one is 350w @ 36v or 500w @ 48v. according to manufacturer specs
Hello! Awesome channel ive learned much from watching your vids. I have a question.
I hope u can awnser it =). I have a 36V 250W bike. And am thinking of bying new controller. What will hapen if controller is 750W (multi voltage,36 and up)?
What would your thoughts be about overvolting the bafang 750w hub motor to 60v? Is that too high? It seems like the industry is moving up from 48 to 52 with this specific motor and I was hoping you could speak on if taking this motor to 60v would damage it. Cheers and thanks for all the great info!
It should not MOST 48v controllers can handle 63v but be careful not to let it blow up!! Open the controller and see the Capacitor limit I’d be careful
Did you try it?
it works 100%, I run my at 60v
Hi great videos really helping to explain g hings I'm currently building an ebike. I'm building a 20s 10p battery using 18650 30q batteries. I'm I correct in calculating this will give me a 150A battery if the cells are 15A discharge. I'm using an 8000w motor with a 150A sabvaton controller. Do I have to match the BMS to the controller and use a 150A BMS. Many thanks Brian
Hi I just tripped across this and was intrigued by your equation for the speed of the bike so I have questions. Where does the number 0.003 come from? are you talking about brushed or brushless motors? Also I guess you are referring to a theoretical speed based on the voltage supplied by the battery and the quoted speed of the motor at this voltage .I fly electric model aircraft using brushless motors that are quoted in so called Kv or revs per volt.
Great videos. I’m learning a lot. I’m considering upgrading my Bike-E RX recumbent bike to an e-bike. Like many bent bikes, mine has two different wheel sizes, 16” in front and 20” in back. Overvolting seems pretty straight forward for a single motor. What are the extra considerations and problems for installing dual motors and overvolting with different wheel sizes?
instablaster...
I remember reading that the number of windings are also a parameter to determine the speed of the motor vs volts input.
Yes, more turns per copper winding results in slower RPM.
My name's Brenda, and I have a magnum E-Bike classic like rise II and I am trying to find the best way to increase my speeds to maybe 35 mph since the minimum is 24 and also, trying to figure out how to program the display to show battery percentage rather than v. or find a new a new battery that can extend the battery life to at least 5 hours on a full 100% charge. Thanks.