(1) The contribution prices do not include additional shipping, so you'll need to pay for shipping AGAIN! So you paid shipping (and VAT) in the pledge manager after the campaign. Now you pay the contribution and an additional shipping cost, which is insane. (2) This campaign launched DURING the COVID pandemic. Blaming COVID for increased costs and delays is ridiculous.
Not only is the additional shipping insane - the cost itself is ludicrous. It's like they added a 50% profit margin atop of everything. And to gloss over the fact, they want hilariously high shipping and not even deign to include that in the update. Well - if it weren't a shitshow already, it would be now.
@@xtrava24x Personally I think VAT was the whole thing that destroyed DD. The payment was VAT, almost assuredly. Maybe plus a hefty fee from the government. This here is fallout.
I got an email about contribution - they are asking for money based off pledge and add ons, AND shipping. Based off what I got they are asking $170 for my Pledge & add ons + $78 for shipping so yes they are asking for additional shipping
@@IchbinsderBen That's what the rumors say. MG was using a loophole where they only declared the production cost of the games for VAT (which was industry standard at the time) but then the loophole was closed while they had all these open campaigns and all of a sudden they have to pay VAT on the delivery price of the game. It's unclear if they also paid a penalty for this, but that would have eaten a lot of their available money. Add increased shipping and production costs on top of that and it's easy to see how we got here.
I do not think this is about Mythic wanting to get the games to the backers. This is about the management at Mythic wanting to keep getting a paycheck and not have to find a new job. They want to keep their way of life and company despite running it into the ground. Theives.
Know how publishers can avoid rising costs? Go into manufacturing right after the campaign ends and quoted prices are still relevant. That means have your damn game ready for production before you start a damn crowd funding campaign. Mythic and those like them deserve to go out of business.
In fairness, almost no company did this pre COVID. They operated in a seemingly static industry without major hiccups in price for years and years and years. Well before COVID it was already a joke that games took over a year to deliver and we all scoffed at their year estimate. So this ate into the profit of most companies. Most though only had 1-2 games and weren't too terribly big but many indies struggled and companies that had overly large games and multiple campaigns out found it just too much. Mythic Games is one of those.
@@TheKingofAverage Yep, and we now see how unsustainable those business models really were. This is why I think it's best for MG to just go under. They are trying to keep a company on life support that isn't financially viable and I don't think it should be allowed to exist. Yes everyone loses then, but I'd be more content that the message got out to everyone this way to watch out for this kind of business than if they pull through and say "see, everything worked out just fine"
There's also comanies who actually buy the materials and stock them if they expect prices to go up. Some company mentioned this during Covid that they already bought paper etc because they expected the prices to go still go up
@@PRC533why don’t you go throw your money away by yourself instead? How many mythic games have you backed and how much money you got tied up in them? Don’t talk for the rest of us. I don’t mind paying more if I eventually get a game vs nothing.
Another comment I can make, there were a lot of youtubers hyped up Anastyr during the campaign, but those same youtubers stay silent during this issue. You are of the few who is brave enough to discuss on this. Keep on making people aware man!
I would not necessarily trust them that they will reimburse these further contributions just because they SAY they will. They have said a lot of things.
And if they go into liquidation they won’t have any choice who gets paid with whatever $$$ they have left. A trustee is appointed who decides which creditors get paid.
Not gonna pay the $245 they want from me that is insane. Plus they'll probably insult me by selling it at 50 % off or something again and then I could have picked it up cheaper than the contribution from them directly. I'm thrice burned by them already.
Yeah, that sucks man. I was about to back it during the campaign but chicken out at the last moment. I will probably pick it up though from their shop at a discount like darkest dungeon.
Just wanted to give an update: I had already asked for a refund in July 2022 and I was refused back then. After sending that proof on their server, I got a substantial refund. I had not expected that. I guess they really are trying to make good on things? What a shitty situation. :( But I wanted to tell people that, be transparent in the good and bad.
The $40, $99, $129 numbers are lies, even if you didnt choose any extra add ons they are are also charging shipping AGAIN and won't be surprised to hear them asking for it a 3rd time should they weather this storm. $129 was a tough pill to swallow, but the fact they obfusicated how much they really want has turned me off completely.
Mythic will keep coming back to the well if backers are weak. Least worst option now is for Mythic to declare bankruptcy and the names of all its executives to be made public so the boardgames community can ensure they never work in the industry again.
One practical thing people could do is if they've backed other campaigns from Mythic, request a refund from that and insist they allocate part of that refund directly to paying your extra fee on this one. You'll get this game without giving them extra money and probably won't be seeing that next game anyway. They could always say no but it's an absolutely reasonable request to be making. If they say the refund will take months to process as they're going through in order well then you can tell them it'll take months for them to get the extra payment on this from you. What I wouldn't suggest is just paying the extra on a credit card and once it delivers, initiating a chargeback. That would be as morally bad as what they're doing though.
Yeah, I got burned by two Kickstarter scams and learned that KS offers no customer protection whatsoever. Better to just buy stuff on retail. It's also a lot cheaper since you don't have to pay the ever-increasing shipping costs.
Kickstarter should take some accountability. It's ridiculous they offer zero customer protection. I backed 2 scam projects and have become very wary of backing anything anymore. But I didn't see Mythic pulling this stunt. Can't trust anyone anymore lol.
16:05 There is no way they can legitimately promise that you will get back your contribution if they go belly-up. If they have any debts and enter into bankruptcy, those funds will be tied up in bankruptcy and then good luck getting your money back. This smacks of desperation, and I’m afraid sending any additional contribution is just chasing your losses at this point.
Even if they do manage to manufacture the game, if they become insolvent before they deliver those games, then the games become assets of the company that can be fought over in bankruptcy, so manufacture of the game won’t even guarantee that you receive it.
@@ironwolf56 Totally, I understand. I'm not familiar with that meme. I was just literally thinking about Trump asking people for legal and campaign help while being wealthy and already been draining his supporters over the years. The same could probably be said for most politicians :)
How did Dragori manage to deliver Tanares without asking for more money!? The campaign only raised something like 1.5 M just before Covid and although it was delayed I still got 50 lbs of board game and they didn’t ask for another penny even with their pre Covid campaign pricing.
Thanks for the video but I wish you had waited a day. I was ready to pay at the $130 level but when I got my email and it was $250 I just can't do it. I am asking for a refund knowing that I won't see a cent but I know I won't see a cent if I don't pay the $250 and I am very skeptical that I will see a cent if I do see any money if I do pay, but I would be out $650 instead of $400.
Stormsunder being mentioned in your videos as a problematic project is always funny to me as you are the biggest reason I went all-in on that game.. LOL Since I see kickstarter and crowdfunding as a inherrent risk that's also on me i'm happy too take the wait and see approach and if I get burned sometimes its part of the game I suppose. I have enough boardgames still on the shelves anyway. I never comment this but thanks for making videos about these topics. Very informative and lets me make more informed kickstarter decisions.
I went all in for the Monsterpocalypse KS. That has been my only Mythic KS, and honestly when I went in (something like $400) I thought the price was too good to be true even then. So far they aren’t even looking at working on that project AFAIK, so I’ll be surprised if they get to it.
Same. I'm all in and with shipping, that's a lot of money. I'm hoping that they're keeping the buckets separate and trying to manage things but given where they're at now, I'm very doubtful of that.
Wishing us all the best, fellow All In Monpoc backers :( the toral cost I've paid for shipping, addons, and the all in currently are equalling my salary...
If it's any consolation, at least that isn't their own IP so they might have external pressure to produce something. Their own IP's are a bigger concern.
I still dont get why they havent made a proper ks for a solomon kane reprint instead of anastyr or monsterpocalyps... that would have save them I think... so sad.
This is my first time dealing with anything Kickstarter or mythic games and it’s most certainly the last time. I’m unsure if I’ll pay what they’re asking, it’s insane to me that it’s even something I have to do.
A point on DD -- wave *1* was already produced and only needed the contribution for shipping. Apparently wave 2 hasn't been produced yet, so I'm wondering what will happen if enough wave 2 people don't pay the ransom.
I was premium all-in and they are wanting an additional $245 from me...the $129, plus $8 for runner up box, plus $8 for deluxe storage box, plus $10 for 3D color token set, plus $12 for game mat...so $167 is my actual, "Contribution," plus $78 for an additional round of shipping costs....$245 total...
If I had backed, I would file a class action suit against Kickstarter for knowingly allowing a kickstarter that was against their rules of having outstanding campaigns.
Just wanna say thanks for being level headed and explaining your experience with companies. This is my first kickstarter and I don't want to do it again because of this, but it's nice to hear someone talk and understand why Mythic is doing what they're doing. Sucks to pay more but I know 6Siege will be fun to play with the Fiance.
I’m also surprised that Kickstarter is so lassiez faire on all of this. I know failures are a lot more common in other categories than board games, but we’re starting to see some HUGE campaigns fail. But you compare them to a site like EBay. They are extremely meticulous to protect their image and reputation. It’s not an apples to apples comparison, and there’s surely a fine line with how much to hold fledgling creators accountable. But it feels like just a total hands off “if it dies it dies” approach is eventually going to hurt their business.
Honestly though Board games are really safe compared to other products on Kickstarter. Ive been more screwed with vid games on their, were they literally just steal your moeny and you never hear from them.
Completely disagree with you. I think they should decide and stay principled about it though. As it is now they occasionally butt in, mostly not. I feel like they should just deliver the site and service, a la any AWS service or cloud flare etc and just stay out of the rest. It’s a good thing to keep sacred unless you want a completely controlled Internet.
I wish someone would just sue them to prove a point to these game companies, you can’t enter into contracts with buyers, then change the terms after you’ve received your consideration. And I question if being on Kickstarter will protect them along with the click through terms and conditions. I’d love to see these challenged. It would change the landscape of gaming if a company is taken to task and held accountable.
I'd like to know what they plan to do regarding the 2nd SOLOMON KANE Kickstarter. OK, so they're trying to fulfill the 6th Siege KS, but what about the latest Solomon Kane? And also, how about people who pre-ordered Solomon Kane and its expansions direct from their website? Apparently, they handed Solomon Kane off to Monolith, but then what??
I feel your pain my friend. All-in on Anastyr and $150 shipping up front. Nearly $600 on the hook, plus being a Hel backer as well, while watching the disaster that is Mythic Games unfold is a tough pill to swallow. Here's to hoping we see our games some year.
Seems like buying off the second hand market might be a safer option for some of these companies with sketchy business models. You’re paying exorbitant $ anyway, might as well make sure you’re getting something for it.
I was ready to hold my nose and pay the $130 to get a game that is widely considered an excellent implementation of one of my favorite properties. Then I got the $245 invoice and realized that I hadn't accounted for the PM exclusive add-ons OR the additional shipping. Now I (like so many of us) am forced to decide which hurts less. Do I think this is a $700 boardgame? No. But would i rather spend that $700 and have the thing or just write off the initial $460 and walk away with nothing? Guess I've got two weeks to figure that out.
@@TiagoSousa026 I don't believe that refund would ever pay out. There are refund claims in the comments from a year ago that haven't been responded to, and you know this whole deal just pushed a ton more of them to request one. This company goes belly up before all the refunds are honored, it's just a matter of whether or not I get my game before that happens, imo.
@@bluwzrdisgreedy234 Yeah for sure, I don't know where they will find the money to refund because it seems to be a lot of people unhappy based on what I see. Good luck 😥
I believe it used to be 1 at a time, but they removed that a long time ago due to the huge money they were making off companies having a dozen outstanding.
They have to produce at least IPs or they'll open themselves to lawsuits with Ubisoft, Privateer Press, Red Hook. All contracts, I'm sure. They don't want to default on those.
@@sidnusmagnus3144 They're still probably under contract to produce it. If they don't they could be taken to court for breach of contract. Having a license doesn't preclude that.
@TheKingOfAverage I watched your video at work, so I might have missed your decision: are you paying the extra or let your money go? I also "only" paid $99 with shipping so far, but I'm not planning to "contribute" as their approach repells me...
It's annoying how they won't provide the MOQ for production though... Reimbursement or not, if it were in the 40% range it would likely encourage further contribution.... Kinda makes you feel like it's in the 70% range if they are not being open and transparent about it.
This video is not up to date with the final rates that Mythic is asking, an Operator pledge contribution equals to a total of 245 $. I feel this makes a huge difference in the conversation.
Just a very bad look. I paid extra for Darkest Dungeon and I gave Mythic the benefit of the doubt. But after this and Wild Assent taking FOREVER I think backing board games on crowdfunding may be over for me. I don't have the disposable income to back games and then never get them or be extorted for more later. Guess I'll stick to retail for a while.
i wish they'd cut costs like mini trays that take up 1/2 the space of the box in order to deliver more cheaply. They could also put all add-ons in one box instead of separately to save a ton of space/cardboard. cancel people that got only one or two add-ons
I do think the problem comes from bad management. They should have updates prices when shipping went up, they should have updated them for new campaigns as well, especially when the prices of raw materials went up, they should have made less stretch goals (they kinda snowball here). When making new games they should have added up to a 10% margin of error, which can help with shipping if possible. They are so many thing they should have done...
My biggest complaint is that we the backers are being asked for more but the retail backers most certainly are not. I can still pre-order the game on zatu for £54. If i could get my money back i would get it in retail and would be cheaper.
Keep chasing that dragon Mythic. I see the Dave Chapelle meme "Y'all got more of that kickstarter money?". This is throwing good money after bad people.
@The King of Average -- I know you do not have the numbers, but I would love to know the math. For manufacturing, you get one price if you are ordering 100 copies and cheaper price if you are ording 10K copies. If the price they need to complete the compaign is based on N,NNN number of people to pay extra, what happens if only half of what they need to gets funded? It seems like if not enough people pay the extra amount, they are still screwed.
Exactly. I imagine it's one of two things, based on a full print run or based on a similar giving percentage that Darkest Dungeon had. That plus cost of the company until the next contribution is the estimate.
You did not mention VAT, as this will be on top of the extra amount for many countries/territories. It would make the 'all in' supplement just over $154.
What people are missing is crowdfunding is investing not buying - which comes with an inherent risk of the investment outcome not materialising - so Kickstarter doesn't need to care, it is inherent to their business that projects will fail (that is why they say "backing isn't buying"). I'm not saying this is fair but I think people have forgotten this element of risk on Kickstarter - we need to remember we are always at risk of losing are money. However on the other side of this chucking more money at a bad investment rarely turns it into a good investment - so totally agree with those who are cutting their losses at this point
Ideally that's just the case always now. I try to be calmer and more well worded than I used to when I shouted how crap everything/everyone was. I feel it ends up hurting the message.
@@TheKingofAverage Being one of the people that has been against paying more for a game i've already paid the asked price for, I have to be honest and say your video has me second guessing. What I want though is for Mythic games to keep us informed on where they are in hitting the threshold required, that way I'll know whether i'm throwing good money after bad at this point. If they can't do that, i'm probably just out and will no longer support them.
@@rgsniper2 The objectively right decision is not to throw more money at the game. Think about how many other games you could get for that. Don't think of the extra payment as "saving" your original pledge because that money is gone. But don't sacrifice other potential games for it.
Not looking forward to the funding request for HEL and Anastyr....i backed both thinking they could pull it together. Should have listened to the warnings but was too optimistic.
“As for Wave 2 (the rest of the English language expansions as well as the foreign language versions of the entire series), we can confirm that this will be the next major project we will be working on. As with Wave 1, we will be asking for your contributions in September of this year, and will begin production immediately thereafter. Delivery of this Wave 2 will therefore be possible in the first quarter of 2024.” This is from the Darkest Dungeon update page on KS. Seems people will need to cough up more money here as well later this year to get the expansions. Items are not even produced at this point in time.
If you are referring to Darkest Dungeon, they have clarified multiple times after that update: If you paid the first time they asked, you are not paying an additional time for wave 2, this is only for the folk who did not pay the extra fee initially and that now want to do so when wave 2 is ready to ship. I will probably have to let go of my Hel pledge if I want to pay for Middara...their wave 2 shipping price is not additional but it may as well be, it is just way above and beyond what I expected, 4x what I paid for wave 1 shipping.
@@aonline_abridged Yeah that shipping on middara wave 2 was rough but im currently enjoying my duo playthrough of the first wave so much I cant imagine letting it go. Ive backed off on kickstarter a lot though its getting too crazy with the shipping and more stringent VAT rules.
@@aonline_abridged Marco and Amanda have clarified that, but they don't always get told the full truth by Leo and Benoit. Also, the first DD contribution was only for shipping. They are not at the point of asking for money for production as well, and since wave 2 has not been produced yet I would be very surprised if they didn't ask everyone for more money again.
UA-camrs (Content Creators) need to take some blame here too. They hype these games up and may need to start adding on disclaimer statements about the risk involved. I’m proud of BoardGameCo for being up front and apologizing to his audience if his videos led them to back games from Mythic Games.
KoA and BoardGameCo are why I backed Monsterpocalypse!! I unfollowed BoardGameCo because of his overhyping and overselling of ks stuff, it's not sustainable behaviour
And we, the viewers, are supposed to have a brain. It's the classic, "If they told you to jump off a bridge, would you?" Content Creators give us their thoughts. They're not God and don't know everything that's going to happen. They have a right to be excited about things. In fact, we encourage that behavior - those excited videos are the ones we watch most. Unless they corruptly take money to show fake excitement, I don't see how they should take the blame.
I’m on the hook for Darkest Dungeon wave 2, Anastyr and All in Monsterpocalypse. 😬 I for one hope that they are able to get the money. I would rather overpay for a game I can sell for most of what I put in than losing everything and getting nothing.
Same I’d rather pay more than get nothing. People spent like 900 with shipping for middara so I’ll survive getting the game then selling it in a few years when it’s a collectors item
@@ellyari Just hope more people are driven by practicality than anger. Doubt I’d ever back a mythic games game again, but for these I’d like to get them at least. They usually make pretty good games too. 😑
What I want to know is what happened to all of the money from the sale of some of their IP's? Plus the sale of other games like Darkest Dungeon which my son bought outside of the Kickstarter. How big is that financial hole?
I am waiting for the second wave of Darkest Dungeon (which I expect to pay a ransom for again). I'm very close to giving up on Hel: The Last Saga (and even if it does turn up 'm sure they'll want me to pay again as well). After that I'll be glad I didn't back any of their other projects.
I was a sucker on this one and I think I got burned. I had a one dollar pledge but REALLY wanted the game. I reached out and asked if I could pick up an all in as everyone was bailing. They said yes. I did it, and…..i think they took my money and cancelled my order…so, I paid my stupid tax for the year.
I am SO GLAD I did not back any of these Campaigns. They ticked me off with Super Fantasy Brawl so they did not get any more of my money. I could tell with that campaign, and the follow up, that they had poor office management and support. Really apparent now. Sorry for all those that are loosing money.
You know what i think mythic game get our previous money from kickstarter go to invest something like stock market or gold market even nft, but eventually going side way, so they lost their money, and the price they asking right now it almost like the cost they actually need for production, 39 dollar for a game its quite decent production cost and after that they charge for another shipping cost is the real shipping cost. So right now what we pay is actually the real production cost and shipping cost, so ppl not paying will not get their game
Companies can't just keep making more and more Kickstarters to fund previous ones. They passed a new restriction not that long ago that limits companies to only having a certain amount of outstanding campaigns before they can no longer launch new ones. That is why you see a lot of companies starting to use other crowdsourcing programs like Backerkit and Gamefound. They have hit their limit for ourstanding campaigns and had to go elsewhere to launch another one.
It should only be 1 at a time, but that would artificially limit Kickstarter's income from companies like CMON who run multiple Million $+ campaigns at a time.
@@PRC533 I think it is limited to 1 at a time now for new companies, and it raises to 2 or 3 at a time after a company has proven that they can deliver a project of the same type (so one a board game campaign is completed and delivered, now that company can run multiple board game ones, but is still limited to 1 if they try something in a different format).
I kickstarted a GAME TABLE for less than they want to deliver the game. This is ransom. They pissed away 1.5 MILLION and NOW want money to actually make and ship it. They gotta go.
"Don't take your ire on the little people" Based. I don't get people who go after the employees of a company. They have NO role in how the company is lead. They're not responsible. They just get a paycheck.
Let talk about the 'storm sunder' where problematics lays......are 'ravage star' Ks campaign revenue do helps and solve the storm sunder matter on production and shipment?
What I find is hilarious is that people are losing it on the Mythic Battles Ragnarok comments thinking that it is being made by Mythic. Some of these kickstarter comments really make me question the general backer's intelligence.
hah! In fairness that one is hard. Not only does it share the same word, but Monolith bought it from Mythic after the first campaign. It was indeed theirs first and to top it off, mythic was formed out of monolith to make it even more confusing :D
I am done with their bullshit, I'll send them another mail to set a deadline to refund my pledge or otherwise I will file a chargeback. Under european law a pledge is a normal purchase so they have to comply to purchase laws and if they refuse to refund me I am entitled to the chargeback.
Hi King, thanks for addressing my earlier question! I've got a new one, though. You mentioned stormsunder in comparison to 6 siege. Do you believe it won't be delivered either without additional payments?
It's simply just another example (like Archon's Chronicle X, etc.) of a long overdue game that start being a cost instead of a source of profit for a company thanks to long delays and also means it ships in a different economic environment than when it was originally funded. Currently LSG is selling warhammer type minis in other campaigns to keep funding, like Archon was able to do with their D&D minis/terrain so as long as that keeps going they are good. Otherwise not so much. It's all a matter of how long the train keeps going. For Mythic Games, Anastyr stopped the train. Hopefully LSG doens't hit a similar roadblock. Diemension Games is another. Any company that has a long-standing undelivered game has that worry from me.
@@TheKingofAverage well.. Fudge. I've late pledged it only a few months ago. I do hope i won't get hit by both 6 siege and stormsunder... i was under the impression they're generally doing ok...
So I have the base game with a couple add ons so I haven’t got the contribution email but the people that have are getting 100+ dollars in shipping in some cases on top of the big contribution. I’m at a loss for words
I backed 6:Siege and went all in on Anastyr but I doubt I'll ever see them arriving. But that's the thing with Kickstarter, delivery isn't guaranteed for any project.
Could just wait for retailers to get there preorders and get it for 50% off. I did this with the add ons for DD at miniature market. Cheaper than the KS by far.
BREAKING - apparently a new decision has been made, backers can now reduce their pledge to offset the cost of contribution. What does that tell us now? Games we’re going to be produced anyways, and what happens to those extra produced content? Also what happens to backers who’ve already paid the full contribution to learn about this?
The nice person in me wants them to recover and be able to fulfill their obligations which I am tangled in somewhat. The business person in me says that a company which is out by a million bucks should consider selling off the rest of their licenses and fold. Kickstarter shares the lion share of responsibility. People should just stop crowdfunding things. Established companies should stop crowdbegging as a means to survive. Its an abuse of the system, but capitalism strikes again.
Since I work in non-profits. I can relate to what you are saying. The people that start non-profits are in it to help people but not run the company. They have to hire people like myself that have the skill sets to run a company and make it financially viable. I don’t have the vision to design games or run programs. But I have the vision of what the numbers need to be and how to keep the company healthy, prosperous, and growing.
Can i ask why, when it comes to Mythic, "not everything is malicious," but when it comes to CMON, they are manipulative liars? I'm having a hard time understanding. I used to think both companies were very similar, with the small difference of CMON has delivered every game I've backed and never asked me for more money, while Mythic has thousands of dollars of my money that I'll never get anything for...
If you hadn’t noticed, KoA received the feedback on the level of his CMoN criticism during the Marvel Zombies campaign and toned it down significantly since then. This is the result. You can go back and watch his commentary on the White Death CMoN campaign for evidence
@@buddywahlquist2467 the point is his negative commentary on cmon peaked around mz and had since cooled and he’s been critical but civil about it for the most part. I noticed because it was so biased for a while I unsubscribed. I have appreciated the change
I basically had the same thing happen for a vid game I got. However for that I paid only 20$. Basically company made 300,000$ for their vid game. After about months of silence they came back saying that due to Covid and the War they only had 8,400$ left, and that wasn't enough to make a game. Basically all the money was spent are art assets, basic mechanics, and apparently the teams monthly salary but not an actual product. The difference is this company was done, and they wanted to give that 8,400$ they still had to charity. In which case people were pissed cause they wanted their money back, however their response was they didn't have enough money to pay all the backers back. Mythic on the other hand, while probably doing the same thing spending most or all of the money on art assets, basic mechanics, and a salary, still want to continue, but to do that they just need you to pay for the game again lol. I am expecting for this to be a thing for all Mythic's projects.
I know everyone hyped up the Battletech Mercenaries kickstarters but Catalyst games has the same issues mythic had with fulfilling kickstarters. Maybe the huge infusion they got will help them finish there previous incomplete kickstarters but are they sliding down the same path as Mythic and other companies have or have they learned there lessons and are they turning the corner with the new kickstarter. They silenced and banned anyone who dared ask about there previous kickstarters and details on the merc kickstarter and how they intended to accomplish what thus far has been impossible for them, finishing a kickstarter and why each successive kickstarter has after the first battletech ks has gotten worse. It'd be nice to know just how solid they are given there terrible track record before the pledge manager hits and people dump another couple mil into it.
Is it that possible thay are keeping their head on top of the water so they don't get sued by the companies that sold them the licnces of DD and R6? I was also thinking that it was maybe more profitable to not take the money and run and to try to keep open a few years with limited service and workflow but maybe a big salary for the boss...
Yeah, me too. Funny how just after the campaign finished Sam Healy was saying something about "successful kickstarter", while I was quite certain it was a disaster for them. Now we see the result...
Is mythic games still shipping DD? Some paid our contributions late and no idea if they are being shipped or will be. It's been over 2 months trying to get an answer.
KOA, I have, in the past, been not so kind to you. For that, I apologize profusely. The needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few or the one. You have become the gaming equivalent of Mike Wallace on 60 Minutes to me, and I thank you and appreciate you for that. You have a set of brass balls unlike most gaming reviewers, you obviously care about and are passionate about your opinions, you provide supporting evidence, and you will call people (and companies) to the carpet, which I appreciate greatly. You are a hero, and the world needs more people like you! Cheers, and onward and upward!
(1) The contribution prices do not include additional shipping, so you'll need to pay for shipping AGAIN! So you paid shipping (and VAT) in the pledge manager after the campaign. Now you pay the contribution and an additional shipping cost, which is insane.
(2) This campaign launched DURING the COVID pandemic. Blaming COVID for increased costs and delays is ridiculous.
Not only is the additional shipping insane - the cost itself is ludicrous. It's like they added a 50% profit margin atop of everything. And to gloss over the fact, they want hilariously high shipping and not even deign to include that in the update. Well - if it weren't a shitshow already, it would be now.
Almost 100%, but there was no additional VAT during the campaign. They stated it was already priced in the product.
@@xtrava24x Personally I think VAT was the whole thing that destroyed DD. The payment was VAT, almost assuredly. Maybe plus a hefty fee from the government. This here is fallout.
I got an email about contribution - they are asking for money based off pledge and add ons, AND shipping. Based off what I got they are asking $170 for my Pledge & add ons + $78 for shipping so yes they are asking for additional shipping
@@IchbinsderBen That's what the rumors say. MG was using a loophole where they only declared the production cost of the games for VAT (which was industry standard at the time) but then the loophole was closed while they had all these open campaigns and all of a sudden they have to pay VAT on the delivery price of the game. It's unclear if they also paid a penalty for this, but that would have eaten a lot of their available money. Add increased shipping and production costs on top of that and it's easy to see how we got here.
I do not think this is about Mythic wanting to get the games to the backers. This is about the management at Mythic wanting to keep getting a paycheck and not have to find a new job. They want to keep their way of life and company despite running it into the ground. Theives.
top salary starts at 7 figures and step down to mid 5 figures
@@snowabegglen Are you serious? These indie CEO are getting more in salary than what the company makes in profit LOL. That is terrible.
Know how publishers can avoid rising costs?
Go into manufacturing right after the campaign ends and quoted prices are still relevant.
That means have your damn game ready for production before you start a damn crowd funding campaign.
Mythic and those like them deserve to go out of business.
In fairness, almost no company did this pre COVID. They operated in a seemingly static industry without major hiccups in price for years and years and years. Well before COVID it was already a joke that games took over a year to deliver and we all scoffed at their year estimate.
So this ate into the profit of most companies. Most though only had 1-2 games and weren't too terribly big but many indies struggled and companies that had overly large games and multiple campaigns out found it just too much. Mythic Games is one of those.
@@TheKingofAverage Yep, and we now see how unsustainable those business models really were. This is why I think it's best for MG to just go under. They are trying to keep a company on life support that isn't financially viable and I don't think it should be allowed to exist. Yes everyone loses then, but I'd be more content that the message got out to everyone this way to watch out for this kind of business than if they pull through and say "see, everything worked out just fine"
There's also comanies who actually buy the materials and stock them if they expect prices to go up. Some company mentioned this during Covid that they already bought paper etc because they expected the prices to go still go up
@@PRC533why don’t you go throw your money away by yourself instead? How many mythic games have you backed and how much money you got tied up in them? Don’t talk for the rest of us. I don’t mind paying more if I eventually get a game vs nothing.
@@ellyari Good for you.
Mythic games needs to be done. I can’t think of anybody who would back any new game that they try to crowdfund.
reputation is over for this company and also Leonidas & co. No more projects for them no more any compagny for them.
Another comment I can make, there were a lot of youtubers hyped up Anastyr during the campaign, but those same youtubers stay silent during this issue. You are of the few who is brave enough to discuss on this. Keep on making people aware man!
Happy to do so but not happy I have to :)
KOA is the Voice for the voiceless. Tremendous respect!
I backed “All In” and have decided they aren’t getting another dime from me. Totally cutting my losses.
I would not necessarily trust them that they will reimburse these further contributions just because they SAY they will. They have said a lot of things.
It may get lost in their Monthly cap refund system. They're still paying out July 21st, 2022 refunds and will be for the next few months to a year +
And if they go into liquidation they won’t have any choice who gets paid with whatever $$$ they have left. A trustee is appointed who decides which creditors get paid.
The trustee will have to pay the golden parachutes first the the creditors
Not gonna pay the $245 they want from me that is insane. Plus they'll probably insult me by selling it at 50 % off or something again and then I could have picked it up cheaper than the contribution from them directly. I'm thrice burned by them already.
Yeah, that sucks man. I was about to back it during the campaign but chicken out at the last moment. I will probably pick it up though from their shop at a discount like darkest dungeon.
Just wanted to give an update: I had already asked for a refund in July 2022 and I was refused back then. After sending that proof on their server, I got a substantial refund. I had not expected that. I guess they really are trying to make good on things? What a shitty situation. :( But I wanted to tell people that, be transparent in the good and bad.
The $40, $99, $129 numbers are lies, even if you didnt choose any extra add ons they are are also charging shipping AGAIN and won't be surprised to hear them asking for it a 3rd time should they weather this storm. $129 was a tough pill to swallow, but the fact they obfusicated how much they really want has turned me off completely.
Yeah I'm not sure when this video was filmed, but it's very much not up to date with info from yesterday
Mythic will keep coming back to the well if backers are weak. Least worst option now is for Mythic to declare bankruptcy and the names of all its executives to be made public so the boardgames community can ensure they never work in the industry again.
One practical thing people could do is if they've backed other campaigns from Mythic, request a refund from that and insist they allocate part of that refund directly to paying your extra fee on this one. You'll get this game without giving them extra money and probably won't be seeing that next game anyway. They could always say no but it's an absolutely reasonable request to be making. If they say the refund will take months to process as they're going through in order well then you can tell them it'll take months for them to get the extra payment on this from you.
What I wouldn't suggest is just paying the extra on a credit card and once it delivers, initiating a chargeback. That would be as morally bad as what they're doing though.
Stuff like this is why I hold off until retail for most cases now.
Yeah, I got burned by two Kickstarter scams and learned that KS offers no customer protection whatsoever. Better to just buy stuff on retail. It's also a lot cheaper since you don't have to pay the ever-increasing shipping costs.
Always they ask for more. It is what it is. I’m just done backing anything anymore. Not hate just tired and done with it all.
i'm pretty much there as well. I have Conan and Primal that I'll probably still support as long as they don't start looking shady.
Kickstarter should take some accountability. It's ridiculous they offer zero customer protection. I backed 2 scam projects and have become very wary of backing anything anymore. But I didn't see Mythic pulling this stunt. Can't trust anyone anymore lol.
16:05 There is no way they can legitimately promise that you will get back your contribution if they go belly-up. If they have any debts and enter into bankruptcy, those funds will be tied up in bankruptcy and then good luck getting your money back. This smacks of desperation, and I’m afraid sending any additional contribution is just chasing your losses at this point.
They can always refund it and then go belly up.
Even if they do manage to manufacture the game, if they become insolvent before they deliver those games, then the games become assets of the company that can be fought over in bankruptcy, so manufacture of the game won’t even guarantee that you receive it.
Mythic is like the Bernie Sanders "I am once again asking for your financial support" meme
That's funny, I was just about to type the same thing for Trump 🤣
@@rmclean101 It wasn't a political thing dude that's just a well known meme for when someone keeps crawling back and asking for more money.
@@ironwolf56 Totally, I understand. I'm not familiar with that meme. I was just literally thinking about Trump asking people for legal and campaign help while being wealthy and already been draining his supporters over the years. The same could probably be said for most politicians :)
How did Dragori manage to deliver Tanares without asking for more money!? The campaign only raised something like 1.5 M just before Covid and although it was delayed I still got 50 lbs of board game and they didn’t ask for another penny even with their pre Covid campaign pricing.
Thanks for the video but I wish you had waited a day. I was ready to pay at the $130 level but when I got my email and it was $250 I just can't do it. I am asking for a refund knowing that I won't see a cent but I know I won't see a cent if I don't pay the $250 and I am very skeptical that I will see a cent if I do see any money if I do pay, but I would be out $650 instead of $400.
So if they succeed to produce the game, this builds confidence to ask double payment for next game in the queue.
The line Kickstarter doesn't care kinda says it all...
Stormsunder being mentioned in your videos as a problematic project is always funny to me as you are the biggest reason I went all-in on that game.. LOL
Since I see kickstarter and crowdfunding as a inherrent risk that's also on me i'm happy too take the wait and see approach and if I get burned sometimes its part of the game I suppose. I have enough boardgames still on the shelves anyway.
I never comment this but thanks for making videos about these topics. Very informative and lets me make more informed kickstarter decisions.
I backed all in and they want around $250 dollars.
I went all in for the Monsterpocalypse KS. That has been my only Mythic KS, and honestly when I went in (something like $400) I thought the price was too good to be true even then. So far they aren’t even looking at working on that project AFAIK, so I’ll be surprised if they get to it.
Same. I'm all in and with shipping, that's a lot of money. I'm hoping that they're keeping the buckets separate and trying to manage things but given where they're at now, I'm very doubtful of that.
Yep, I'm also all-in on MonPoc. Really don't like our chances :(
Wishing us all the best, fellow All In Monpoc backers :( the toral cost I've paid for shipping, addons, and the all in currently are equalling my salary...
If it's any consolation, at least that isn't their own IP so they might have external pressure to produce something. Their own IP's are a bigger concern.
I still dont get why they havent made a proper ks for a solomon kane reprint instead of anastyr or monsterpocalyps... that would have save them I think... so sad.
We'll have to wait and see what Monolith does with it.
This is my first time dealing with anything Kickstarter or mythic games and it’s most certainly the last time. I’m unsure if I’ll pay what they’re asking, it’s insane to me that it’s even something I have to do.
Ah man sorry to hear that! Thankfully this is something that's not very normal so bad luck there :/
put mythic on your black list man ;-) trust me they have to bankurupt
A point on DD -- wave *1* was already produced and only needed the contribution for shipping. Apparently wave 2 hasn't been produced yet, so I'm wondering what will happen if enough wave 2 people don't pay the ransom.
They're almost certainly going to be asking everyone for more money, even those who paid the extra shipping in wave 1.
I was premium all-in and they are wanting an additional $245 from me...the $129, plus $8 for runner up box, plus $8 for deluxe storage box, plus $10 for 3D color token set, plus $12 for game mat...so $167 is my actual, "Contribution," plus $78 for an additional round of shipping costs....$245 total...
If I had backed, I would file a class action suit against Kickstarter for knowingly allowing a kickstarter that was against their rules of having outstanding campaigns.
Just wanna say thanks for being level headed and explaining your experience with companies. This is my first kickstarter and I don't want to do it again because of this, but it's nice to hear someone talk and understand why Mythic is doing what they're doing. Sucks to pay more but I know 6Siege will be fun to play with the Fiance.
What a ridiculous amount they're asking for. It makes no sense. They want more in contributions than the last like 4 games I've backed raised.
I’m also surprised that Kickstarter is so lassiez faire on all of this. I know failures are a lot more common in other categories than board games, but we’re starting to see some HUGE campaigns fail.
But you compare them to a site like EBay. They are extremely meticulous to protect their image and reputation.
It’s not an apples to apples comparison, and there’s surely a fine line with how much to hold fledgling creators accountable. But it feels like just a total hands off “if it dies it dies” approach is eventually going to hurt their business.
yeah it really sucks how Kickstarter is. Their main focus now is trying to avoid regulation which is why they are pursuing web3.0 tech IMO.
Honestly though Board games are really safe compared to other products on Kickstarter. Ive been more screwed with vid games on their, were they literally just steal your moeny and you never hear from them.
KS takes their cut right off the top once a project funds. There is no incentive for them to care about what happens after that point.
Completely disagree with you. I think they should decide and stay principled about it though. As it is now they occasionally butt in, mostly not. I feel like they should just deliver the site and service, a la any AWS service or cloud flare etc and just stay out of the rest. It’s a good thing to keep sacred unless you want a completely controlled Internet.
Dang. I thought we DD backers got screwed over. They're fleecing the 6 Siege backers super hard.
I wish someone would just sue them to prove a point to these game companies, you can’t enter into contracts with buyers, then change the terms after you’ve received your consideration. And I question if being on Kickstarter will protect them along with the click through terms and conditions. I’d love to see these challenged. It would change the landscape of gaming if a company is taken to task and held accountable.
Well what would a bancrupt company prove? The next Petersen Games is just around the corner.
I'd like to know what they plan to do regarding the 2nd SOLOMON KANE Kickstarter. OK, so they're trying to fulfill the 6th Siege KS, but what about the latest Solomon Kane? And also, how about people who pre-ordered Solomon Kane and its expansions direct from their website? Apparently, they handed Solomon Kane off to Monolith, but then what??
Under the contract, Mythic Games is responsible for providing any orders they made on their website, not Monolith.
As an Anastyr backer I... AH who am I kidding. I'll never ever get that game and will likely have to pay extra for it anyway.
I feel your pain my friend. All-in on Anastyr and $150 shipping up front. Nearly $600 on the hook, plus being a Hel backer as well, while watching the disaster that is Mythic Games unfold is a tough pill to swallow. Here's to hoping we see our games some year.
Mythic: adj. existing only in imagination: fictitious, imaginary
It sounds like this is a real "Mythic" Game alright...
Seems like buying off the second hand market might be a safer option for some of these companies with sketchy business models. You’re paying exorbitant $ anyway, might as well make sure you’re getting something for it.
I was ready to hold my nose and pay the $130 to get a game that is widely considered an excellent implementation of one of my favorite properties. Then I got the $245 invoice and realized that I hadn't accounted for the PM exclusive add-ons OR the additional shipping. Now I (like so many of us) am forced to decide which hurts less. Do I think this is a $700 boardgame? No. But would i rather spend that $700 and have the thing or just write off the initial $460 and walk away with nothing? Guess I've got two weeks to figure that out.
Wow that's bad.
I think the refunds are open so there could be another option for you.
@@TiagoSousa026 I don't believe that refund would ever pay out. There are refund claims in the comments from a year ago that haven't been responded to, and you know this whole deal just pushed a ton more of them to request one. This company goes belly up before all the refunds are honored, it's just a matter of whether or not I get my game before that happens, imo.
@@bluwzrdisgreedy234 Yeah for sure, I don't know where they will find the money to refund because it seems to be a lot of people unhappy based on what I see.
Good luck 😥
Based on how unreliable they have been I think it's too much of a risk
Does Kickstarter have a limit on campaigns you can have unfulfilled before they say no more until you clear these out?
Not really. If KS thinks you'll be successful and earn money they can take a percentage of they generally let you launch your campaign.
I believe it used to be 1 at a time, but they removed that a long time ago due to the huge money they were making off companies having a dozen outstanding.
Two weeks is kind of nuts considering we as a community knew we were gonna get hit for the contribution for like two weeks.
They have to produce at least IPs or they'll open themselves to lawsuits with Ubisoft, Privateer Press, Red Hook. All contracts, I'm sure. They don't want to default on those.
If they payed for the license i don't think the big name care.
@@sidnusmagnus3144 They're still probably under contract to produce it. If they don't they could be taken to court for breach of contract. Having a license doesn't preclude that.
@TheKingOfAverage I watched your video at work, so I might have missed your decision: are you paying the extra or let your money go?
I also "only" paid $99 with shipping so far, but I'm not planning to "contribute" as their approach repells me...
It's annoying how they won't provide the MOQ for production though... Reimbursement or not, if it were in the 40% range it would likely encourage further contribution.... Kinda makes you feel like it's in the 70% range if they are not being open and transparent about it.
This video is not up to date with the final rates that Mythic is asking, an Operator pledge contribution equals to a total of 245 $. I feel this makes a huge difference in the conversation.
You know you messed up when you make petersen games look good
Just a very bad look. I paid extra for Darkest Dungeon and I gave Mythic the benefit of the doubt. But after this and Wild Assent taking FOREVER I think backing board games on crowdfunding may be over for me. I don't have the disposable income to back games and then never get them or be extorted for more later. Guess I'll stick to retail for a while.
In the exact position you're in. ALSO backed Wild Assent and I'm ALL IN for Monsterpocalypse :(
Hanlon's razor is an adage or rule of thumb that states, "Never attribute to malice that which is adequately explained by stupidity."
Exactly!
i wish they'd cut costs like mini trays that take up 1/2 the space of the box in order to deliver more cheaply. They could also put all add-ons in one box instead of separately to save a ton of space/cardboard. cancel people that got only one or two add-ons
I do think the problem comes from bad management. They should have updates prices when shipping went up, they should have updated them for new campaigns as well, especially when the prices of raw materials went up, they should have made less stretch goals (they kinda snowball here). When making new games they should have added up to a 10% margin of error, which can help with shipping if possible. They are so many thing they should have done...
My biggest complaint is that we the backers are being asked for more but the retail backers most certainly are not. I can still pre-order the game on zatu for £54. If i could get my money back i would get it in retail and would be cheaper.
Zatu put their pre order prices up super early, way before they have confirmed stock. Expect that pre order to be cancelled or the price change.
Keep chasing that dragon Mythic. I see the Dave Chapelle meme "Y'all got more of that kickstarter money?". This is throwing good money after bad people.
@The King of Average -- I know you do not have the numbers, but I would love to know the math. For manufacturing, you get one price if you are ordering 100 copies and cheaper price if you are ording 10K copies. If the price they need to complete the compaign is based on N,NNN number of people to pay extra, what happens if only half of what they need to gets funded?
It seems like if not enough people pay the extra amount, they are still screwed.
Exactly. I imagine it's one of two things, based on a full print run or based on a similar giving percentage that Darkest Dungeon had. That plus cost of the company until the next contribution is the estimate.
Jamie from Stonemaier games has a good blog post on how much is manufacturing, and how much are the profit margins.
You did not mention VAT, as this will be on top of the extra amount for many countries/territories. It would make the 'all in' supplement just over $154.
I kinda disagree that Mystic actions are better than just go bankrupt. At least in that case they wouldn't rob customers any more.
What people are missing is crowdfunding is investing not buying - which comes with an inherent risk of the investment outcome not materialising - so Kickstarter doesn't need to care, it is inherent to their business that projects will fail (that is why they say "backing isn't buying"). I'm not saying this is fair but I think people have forgotten this element of risk on Kickstarter - we need to remember we are always at risk of losing are money. However on the other side of this chucking more money at a bad investment rarely turns it into a good investment - so totally agree with those who are cutting their losses at this point
Your tone of voice and choice of words are very diplomatic in videos critical of Mythic
Thankfully KOA is blessed with more vocabulary than most KS backers. 😂
Ideally that's just the case always now. I try to be calmer and more well worded than I used to when I shouted how crap everything/everyone was. I feel it ends up hurting the message.
@@TheKingofAverage Being one of the people that has been against paying more for a game i've already paid the asked price for, I have to be honest and say your video has me second guessing. What I want though is for Mythic games to keep us informed on where they are in hitting the threshold required, that way I'll know whether i'm throwing good money after bad at this point. If they can't do that, i'm probably just out and will no longer support them.
@@rgsniper2 The objectively right decision is not to throw more money at the game. Think about how many other games you could get for that. Don't think of the extra payment as "saving" your original pledge because that money is gone. But don't sacrifice other potential games for it.
I would LOVE for mythic to refund everyone and sell the IP and all of the plans to another company to pribt
Not looking forward to the funding request for HEL and Anastyr....i backed both thinking they could pull it together. Should have listened to the warnings but was too optimistic.
“As for Wave 2 (the rest of the English language expansions as well as the foreign language versions of the entire series), we can confirm that this will be the next major project we will be working on. As with Wave 1, we will be asking for your contributions in September of this year, and will begin production immediately thereafter. Delivery of this Wave 2 will therefore be possible in the first quarter of 2024.” This is from the Darkest Dungeon update page on KS. Seems people will need to cough up more money here as well later this year to get the expansions. Items are not even produced at this point in time.
They'll get their money for the outstanding kickstarters (sunk cost fallacy and all) but I doubt theyll ever be able to crowdfund another project.
If you are referring to Darkest Dungeon, they have clarified multiple times after that update: If you paid the first time they asked, you are not paying an additional time for wave 2, this is only for the folk who did not pay the extra fee initially and that now want to do so when wave 2 is ready to ship. I will probably have to let go of my Hel pledge if I want to pay for Middara...their wave 2 shipping price is not additional but it may as well be, it is just way above and beyond what I expected, 4x what I paid for wave 1 shipping.
@@aonline_abridged Yeah that shipping on middara wave 2 was rough but im currently enjoying my duo playthrough of the first wave so much I cant imagine letting it go.
Ive backed off on kickstarter a lot though its getting too crazy with the shipping and more stringent VAT rules.
@@aonline_abridged Marco and Amanda have clarified that, but they don't always get told the full truth by Leo and Benoit. Also, the first DD contribution was only for shipping. They are not at the point of asking for money for production as well, and since wave 2 has not been produced yet I would be very surprised if they didn't ask everyone for more money again.
UA-camrs (Content Creators) need to take some blame here too. They hype these games up and may need to start adding on disclaimer statements about the risk involved. I’m proud of BoardGameCo for being up front and apologizing to his audience if his videos led them to back games from Mythic Games.
This!
KoA and BoardGameCo are why I backed Monsterpocalypse!! I unfollowed BoardGameCo because of his overhyping and overselling of ks stuff, it's not sustainable behaviour
And we, the viewers, are supposed to have a brain. It's the classic, "If they told you to jump off a bridge, would you?"
Content Creators give us their thoughts. They're not God and don't know everything that's going to happen. They have a right to be excited about things. In fact, we encourage that behavior - those excited videos are the ones we watch most. Unless they corruptly take money to show fake excitement, I don't see how they should take the blame.
Update: Mythic Games is also asking an extra shipping cost!!! not ony the 39$, 99$ or 129$... there is again other 45-60$ of shipping!!!
I’m on the hook for Darkest Dungeon wave 2, Anastyr and All in Monsterpocalypse. 😬 I for one hope that they are able to get the money. I would rather overpay for a game I can sell for most of what I put in than losing everything and getting nothing.
Yeah same here on those 3 games.
Same I’d rather pay more than get nothing. People spent like 900 with shipping for middara so I’ll survive getting the game then selling it in a few years when it’s a collectors item
@@CheddahSlammer Let’s hope for the best!!
@@ellyari Just hope more people are driven by practicality than anger. Doubt I’d ever back a mythic games game again, but for these I’d like to get them at least. They usually make pretty good games too. 😑
What I want to know is what happened to all of the money from the sale of some of their IP's? Plus the sale of other games like Darkest Dungeon which my son bought outside of the Kickstarter. How big is that financial hole?
I am waiting for the second wave of Darkest Dungeon (which I expect to pay a ransom for again). I'm very close to giving up on Hel: The Last Saga (and even if it does turn up 'm sure they'll want me to pay again as well). After that I'll be glad I didn't back any of their other projects.
Hel will be last due to needing to get IP contracted games out. Do not expect that soon.
I'm not expecting it any time soon.
HEL is not going to happen.
The question is will 6S and DD wave 2 happen. I doubt it.
These people got fleeced into buying the world's most expensive "access to the pledge manager".
Really sucks overall
At this point I would have paid the huge contribution asked but....the question is are we guaranteed to get it or just funding another KS.
I was a sucker on this one and I think I got burned. I had a one dollar pledge but REALLY wanted the game. I reached out and asked if I could pick up an all in as everyone was bailing. They said yes. I did it, and…..i think they took my money and cancelled my order…so, I paid my stupid tax for the year.
I am SO GLAD I did not back any of these Campaigns. They ticked me off with Super Fantasy Brawl so they did not get any more of my money. I could tell with that campaign, and the follow up, that they had poor office management and support. Really apparent now. Sorry for all those that are loosing money.
Same. I went in on SFB but backed out of Round 2 when they didn't offer any solution to a box full of air. Avoided them ever since
Cheers!
You know what i think mythic game get our previous money from kickstarter go to invest something like stock market or gold market even nft, but eventually going side way, so they lost their money, and the price they asking right now it almost like the cost they actually need for production, 39 dollar for a game its quite decent production cost and after that they charge for another shipping cost is the real shipping cost. So right now what we pay is actually the real production cost and shipping cost, so ppl not paying will not get their game
Companies can't just keep making more and more Kickstarters to fund previous ones. They passed a new restriction not that long ago that limits companies to only having a certain amount of outstanding campaigns before they can no longer launch new ones. That is why you see a lot of companies starting to use other crowdsourcing programs like Backerkit and Gamefound. They have hit their limit for ourstanding campaigns and had to go elsewhere to launch another one.
It should only be 1 at a time, but that would artificially limit Kickstarter's income from companies like CMON who run multiple Million $+ campaigns at a time.
@@PRC533 I think it is limited to 1 at a time now for new companies, and it raises to 2 or 3 at a time after a company has proven that they can deliver a project of the same type (so one a board game campaign is completed and delivered, now that company can run multiple board game ones, but is still limited to 1 if they try something in a different format).
I kickstarted a GAME TABLE for less than they want to deliver the game. This is ransom. They pissed away 1.5 MILLION and NOW want money to actually make and ship it. They gotta go.
"Don't take your ire on the little people" Based. I don't get people who go after the employees of a company. They have NO role in how the company is lead. They're not responsible. They just get a paycheck.
You forgot the shipping charge, my trooper pledge contribution was just about 200. Not paying
Let talk about the 'storm sunder' where problematics lays......are 'ravage star' Ks campaign revenue do helps and solve the storm sunder matter on production and shipment?
I can’t afford the contribution. It’s too high for me. If it was like 50 bucks I would’ve done it
You’d think they would hire a management accountant to allocate management funds.
Nah they just hired extra devs they didn't need.
Can you confirm that people who chose not to provide extra funds for Darkest Dungeon never got their pledge?
What I find is hilarious is that people are losing it on the Mythic Battles Ragnarok comments thinking that it is being made by Mythic. Some of these kickstarter comments really make me question the general backer's intelligence.
hah! In fairness that one is hard. Not only does it share the same word, but Monolith bought it from Mythic after the first campaign. It was indeed theirs first and to top it off, mythic was formed out of monolith to make it even more confusing :D
Give the backers the files to create the games themselves by having them 3d printed, laser engraved, printed on cardstock, ect...
I am done with their bullshit, I'll send them another mail to set a deadline to refund my pledge or otherwise I will file a chargeback. Under european law a pledge is a normal purchase so they have to comply to purchase laws and if they refuse to refund me I am entitled to the chargeback.
Hi King, thanks for addressing my earlier question!
I've got a new one, though. You mentioned stormsunder in comparison to 6 siege. Do you believe it won't be delivered either without additional payments?
It's simply just another example (like Archon's Chronicle X, etc.) of a long overdue game that start being a cost instead of a source of profit for a company thanks to long delays and also means it ships in a different economic environment than when it was originally funded.
Currently LSG is selling warhammer type minis in other campaigns to keep funding, like Archon was able to do with their D&D minis/terrain so as long as that keeps going they are good. Otherwise not so much. It's all a matter of how long the train keeps going.
For Mythic Games, Anastyr stopped the train. Hopefully LSG doens't hit a similar roadblock.
Diemension Games is another. Any company that has a long-standing undelivered game has that worry from me.
@@TheKingofAverage well..
Fudge. I've late pledged it only a few months ago. I do hope i won't get hit by both 6 siege and stormsunder... i was under the impression they're generally doing ok...
Thank you!
Did you contact Ubisoft for comment? It's their brand land logo on the box.
Sam knew why he was running from them ;-)
So I have the base game with a couple add ons so I haven’t got the contribution email but the people that have are getting 100+ dollars in shipping in some cases on top of the big contribution. I’m at a loss for words
I backed 6:Siege and went all in on Anastyr but I doubt I'll ever see them arriving. But that's the thing with Kickstarter, delivery isn't guaranteed for any project.
Could just wait for retailers to get there preorders and get it for 50% off. I did this with the add ons for DD at miniature market. Cheaper than the KS by far.
Do they still do refunds? Has anyone got one? Or is it pointless to ask for it?
BREAKING - apparently a new decision has been made, backers can now reduce their pledge to offset the cost of contribution. What does that tell us now? Games we’re going to be produced anyways, and what happens to those extra produced content? Also what happens to backers who’ve already paid the full contribution to learn about this?
"I am once again asking for your financial support"
The nice person in me wants them to recover and be able to fulfill their obligations which I am tangled in somewhat.
The business person in me says that a company which is out by a million bucks should consider selling off the rest of their licenses and fold.
Kickstarter shares the lion share of responsibility. People should just stop crowdfunding things. Established companies should stop crowdbegging as a means to survive. Its an abuse of the system, but capitalism strikes again.
FYI... I watch videos on my laptop and comment on my phone when I have time at my desk
Since I work in non-profits. I can relate to what you are saying. The people that start non-profits are in it to help people but not run the company.
They have to hire people like myself that have the skill sets to run a company and make it financially viable.
I don’t have the vision to design games or run programs.
But I have the vision of what the numbers need to be and how to keep the company healthy, prosperous, and growing.
EXACTLY. It's a completely different skillset.
This should go without saying, how can you make something without it being financially viable.
Can i ask why, when it comes to Mythic, "not everything is malicious," but when it comes to CMON, they are manipulative liars? I'm having a hard time understanding. I used to think both companies were very similar, with the small difference of CMON has delivered every game I've backed and never asked me for more money, while Mythic has thousands of dollars of my money that I'll never get anything for...
excatly
I agree with your comment, but this channel isn’t meant to be an unbiased voice/opinion/analysis.
If you hadn’t noticed, KoA received the feedback on the level of his CMoN criticism during the Marvel Zombies campaign and toned it down significantly since then. This is the result. You can go back and watch his commentary on the White Death CMoN campaign for evidence
@@Twineandribbon nah. The "manipulative liars" comment is from the Dune game, which was months after Marvel Zombies.
@@buddywahlquist2467 the point is his negative commentary on cmon peaked around mz and had since cooled and he’s been critical but civil about it for the most part. I noticed because it was so biased for a while I unsubscribed. I have appreciated the change
I never received the email to sign up and pay the added fees. So, it looks like the choice of whether I'm getting 6 Siege or not has been made for me.
this will be my first and last Mythic game that I purchase.
I doubt they'll make any more so there's that I suppose.
I basically had the same thing happen for a vid game I got. However for that I paid only 20$. Basically company made 300,000$ for their vid game. After about months of silence they came back saying that due to Covid and the War they only had 8,400$ left, and that wasn't enough to make a game. Basically all the money was spent are art assets, basic mechanics, and apparently the teams monthly salary but not an actual product.
The difference is this company was done, and they wanted to give that 8,400$ they still had to charity. In which case people were pissed cause they wanted their money back, however their response was they didn't have enough money to pay all the backers back. Mythic on the other hand, while probably doing the same thing spending most or all of the money on art assets, basic mechanics, and a salary, still want to continue, but to do that they just need you to pay for the game again lol. I am expecting for this to be a thing for all Mythic's projects.
I know everyone hyped up the Battletech Mercenaries kickstarters but Catalyst games has the same issues mythic had with fulfilling kickstarters. Maybe the huge infusion they got will help them finish there previous incomplete kickstarters but are they sliding down the same path as Mythic and other companies have or have they learned there lessons and are they turning the corner with the new kickstarter.
They silenced and banned anyone who dared ask about there previous kickstarters and details on the merc kickstarter and how they intended to accomplish what thus far has been impossible for them, finishing a kickstarter and why each successive kickstarter has after the first battletech ks has gotten worse.
It'd be nice to know just how solid they are given there terrible track record before the pledge manager hits and people dump another couple mil into it.
Is it that possible thay are keeping their head on top of the water so they don't get sued by the companies that sold them the licnces of DD and R6?
I was also thinking that it was maybe more profitable to not take the money and run and to try to keep open a few years with limited service and workflow but maybe a big salary for the boss...
If I pay, it’s 245 extra on top of 454 already paid. 699 total. It’s not just 129 - shipping (again) jacks it up.
yeah the shipping charge I think really screwed them over.
I’m so glad I only pledged $1 for Anastyr. I’d love to play the game they showed but at this point I don’t know that we will ever see it.
Yeah, me too. Funny how just after the campaign finished Sam Healy was saying something about "successful kickstarter", while I was quite certain it was a disaster for them. Now we see the result...
Is mythic games still shipping DD? Some paid our contributions late and no idea if they are being shipped or will be. It's been over 2 months trying to get an answer.
KOA, I have, in the past, been not so kind to you. For that, I apologize profusely. The needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few or the one. You have become the gaming equivalent of Mike Wallace on 60 Minutes to me, and I thank you and appreciate you for that. You have a set of brass balls unlike most gaming reviewers, you obviously care about and are passionate about your opinions, you provide supporting evidence, and you will call people (and companies) to the carpet, which I appreciate greatly. You are a hero, and the world needs more people like you! Cheers, and onward and upward!
Why would anyone buy a crowd funding game today? They're NOT getting my money. I've been stolen from too often.