Thanks for the video. The poly-stain combo works well when applying over an existing stained wood piece. Otherwise, you would have to strip the entire piece. The product tends to apply more like a thin paint, which can give a good effect, depending upon what colour you are applying over an existing stain. 🙂
I just refinished a table top. After putting polyurethane on and letting it dry, I was not happy with how light my stain was. So I am going to make my own Poly Shade by mixing a Provincial stain with polyurethane to get the color I want. The Poly Shades do not have the ready made color I wanted , so am very happy to see that I can mix my own.
I recently did this with a table top, as well. The color looks good and close to the original (using water based stain/poly). I ran into one issue where the stain was a bit streaky. Going to redo and try spraying stain/poly versus hand applying. Also, before applying the poly/stain blend, I applied one coat of the stain by itself to deepen the color. Not sure if that changed anything.
Thank you for the video. I am planning to repair a door that has a hole from a door stop. There were no close matches in the filler and it doesn’t stain well. I am going to try the mix over the dime size wood filler and think it will help it blend. It’s great to know they can be mixed for alternative projects. Thanks again!!
I build furniture. As hard as I try, I don't always get all the glue off. Wood glue doesn't except stain. Mixing the poly and stain allows you to touch up the glue spots. I stain the piece normally then apply the touchup poly/stain. When dry I finish the whole project with poly.
I'm Subcontractor Painter the Best way to go is Prep, sand it apply, the secret of each painter, wish every each painter used a diferent material them apply the Stain Let it dry for 24 hours and apply 2 coats of poly. I always recommend poly oil 👌
I actually used the mixed technique with part of a project that I couldn't get to take up stain as well as the surrounding area. I don't know if the grain was particularly dense or that the pores were already saturated, but it wouldn't sand out. It worked like a charm to blend in the troubled spot since I was using the same exact stain and polyurethane to finish the rest of it. I can imagine it's possible to end up with a horror show when you're not using the exact same product everywhere else though.
Ill have to give this a try, ive been using the premix poly and stain because The flooring ive been using has rough side cuts which I use filler. Thw issue with filler is that basic stain is absorbed more in the filler than the wood. Using the premix in my reno saves me TONS of time. The poly/stain dries in one solid layer and If I take my time and make a thin layer the filler just appears to be a grain in the wood. Also areas that I used adhesive that wouldnt otherwise absorb stain, I just stain right over it. Theme of the house is rustic and so far so good. But needless to say, I ran out of my premix so I was looking into mixing my own to finish the floors
The stain and poly mix can serve two purposes... it can darken an existing piece you have stained, where the wood won't absorb enough to get the desired color... and if there is a little bit of blotchiness, instead of stripping the whole thing and starting over, it can help even that out with one simple topcoat.
The only reason I can think of is why I'm researching this...darken up an existing PU sealed surface. 2 years ago, I stained a redwood fence, and layered on 3 layers of poly after the stain. It's held up pretty good for in the California sun, but it's time for a clean and another coat of poly. BUT, while it looks good, it's a little too light in terms of color shade compared to other wood around the house. When I did the original job, I should have use 2 coats of stain. So now, I want to slightly darken AND reseal right on top of the existing poly. There are some spots where the the wood is showing from weathering, and gray. So, my plan is to light sand the fence without messing the finish. Then, thin out some stain with mineral spirits, and use a rag to touch up the gray spots and bring some color back. After, do a 75 poly / 25 stain mix and apply on the whole fence to darken it up. then one more 100% poly to finish. My only hesitation is apply pure stain on top of what is mostly poly right now, save for the gray spots. Let me know if you think I'm crazy here. Thanks!!
It’s a good way of applying a second coat of stain Incase your first coat doesn’t cover the way you’d like or Incase you can’t get a Corner on your room floors for whatever reason. It has its own use cases for sure
Good info. I'll be using this method on some storage shelves in a basement and garage, and it's a good fit. Just want the minimum effort to get a stained finish and seal against moisture.
Did you buff with 0000 pad between layers? Curious if that would improve it. One benefit i see to this method would be the elimination of oily waste rags. Also curious what the result would be with wipe on. Great video! Love experiments!
Well, my dilemma I built a stereo cabinet some years back and thewood was an aged pine . So when polyurethane it ,it dried with a golden finish to it. Well I wanted to add a couple of more shelves to the center of the existing cabinet and without even thinking about it ,I bought more of the same size wood without matching the colors and urethane them only to my surprise ,the wood was not aged but new cut and the tint was off. My thoughts ,always bring a sample to the lumber yard so you can match the color. New growth cut wood is much different than aged.
Here's my reason my piece of wood is not getting darker with several coats of stain and if you lay the stain on too thick it doesn't dry and you have issues putting the Polly on I'm going to try mixing them
, hey I am doing a table in black flat stain and need to know what I can seal it with to keep the flat black look. You know how kids are when they're eaten cereal and spill their milk on top of the table, I want to make sure I can clean it up without staining
Perhaps a satin sheen polyurethane? Either water based or oil. You can test in on a sample. I have had some unfavorable results using water based poly on dark colors, so I would probably go with a satin oil based poly -- perhaps just one light coat will be enough to protect the paint while keeping a flatter look.
Can I ask you a question. I have just accidently applied an indoor polyurethane varnish to some of my outdoor deck boards before I realised the mistake. Is it okay to just apply the outdoor polyurethane over the top of the indoor coat or do I need to sand it all off? Thank you.
I would just lightly sand, clean, then apply the outdoor stuff. The outdoor has UV protection. Should be fine....although even outdoor poly doesn't last that long if it is in direct sunlight. Good luck.
@@AlleyPicked I've had decent luck staining projects and, through lousy experiences, avoid some products. Matching stain can be a real pain and is my current predicament.
I searched the question about mixing polyurethane with stain. I did this because I was going to try to use it on a laminate to see if it would take to the laminate. So if it works that's the use for it rather than just being lazy
I think you’re actually wrong. If you were to change the tone or color existing wood that method of mixing the stain and polyis a great method and then you would clear over that i’m just disagreeing because you’re saying there’s no situation you think this would work I change color on wood all the time that way way more cost-effective
@AlleyPicked true, but my pop always told me not to mix poly and stain or it wont come out right and it can haze up white. I'm novice at woodwork so im not sure. Looks like it works well for this gentleman
I have not tried. I never use water based stains. Maybe I'll give them a try one day. I guess I am of the opinion "If it ain't broke, don't fix it". Thanks for the comment and I will try to pick up a can of water based stain. Maybe I'll do a comparison video.
@@AlleyPicked I've only ever used oil based but I have a unique situration/issue. My place has Bruce Engineered Wood Flooring. It was most likely installed around 15 years ago. Maybe more. Several of the baords are water damaged and have peeled their finish. And of course, Bruce no longer makes it in a 3" wide. It gets better (worse, actually). There appears to be 4 different looks/shades of the planks, so I'm thinking of doing at least 2, maybe 3 of those shades in order to keep the look. Contacted Bruce to find out what color stain I can get to match the floor and they said that they don't really have a stain "per say," because the finish is applied in a certain "process." Some of my floor planks have peeled and it looks like the colorant is in the poly finish. The available poly + stain finishes don't match up to they planks I have. So. I thought I might try to match the "stain" color and mix with the poly myself. The worst part is that this Bruce Eng Floor is water based. I was surprised to learn that many flooring finishes are water based. No wonder it got damaged. Well, thanks for reading my long explanation.
This addressed a question I had! I do see a good reason to mix them: Darkening a stain. I like MinWax Red Mahogany stain but it is not as dark as what some people like. Putting a second coat of it on is not the answer...it only darkens it a little, as the wood really does not soak much more in. But maybe stain it, then have the first coat be the poly+stain mix???
Nope...im doing a old 1922 man cave and doing the 70 percent with ebony color...on a ancient pine floor..yup..its what im gonna do and in fact i may do it with their water based
I agree with you, Patrick. Poly mixed with stain is not a good idea. Tom makes sure that little things are done behind the scenes at his church. Most of the church members probably don't even know that he is serving in this way. If you are a woodworker and a member of a church, you should consider following his example and look for ways to make the old church building look a little better.
Yeah - mixing the two is kind of like going to Home Depot and then putting out a bag of weed and feed on your lawn - as they should be done separately (and at different times!). Lots of these products are aimed at impulse buyers who haven't a clue but the product misleadingly appears to them to be a time-saver.
Thanks for this question and answer. I just started making my own walking sticks, and ever page I looked at never told this. Ha, I even tried to ask the question on a site and I got a whole lot of no you don't put stains on polyurethane and then smart ass answer why not Ugh. But this answer is what I needed to know 😊
Thanks for the video. The poly-stain combo works well when applying over an existing stained wood piece. Otherwise, you would have to strip the entire piece. The product tends to apply more like a thin paint, which can give a good effect, depending upon what colour you are applying over an existing stain. 🙂
Sir, I am SO-grateful for this clever, concise tutorial. GOSH! You answered EXACTLY the questions I had.
I just refinished a table top. After putting polyurethane on and letting it dry, I was not happy with how light my stain was. So I am going to make my own Poly Shade by mixing a Provincial stain with polyurethane to get the color I want. The Poly Shades do not have the ready made color I wanted , so am very happy to see that I can mix my own.
I recently did this with a table top, as well. The color looks good and close to the original (using water based stain/poly). I ran into one issue where the stain was a bit streaky. Going to redo and try spraying stain/poly versus hand applying. Also, before applying the poly/stain blend, I applied one coat of the stain by itself to deepen the color. Not sure if that changed anything.
How did your project turn out applying a stain/poly mix over poly? I am working on a project where I ran into the same situation. Cheers.
I use a grain filler if needed, than stain, than poly
Thank you for the video. I am planning to repair a door that has a hole from a door stop. There were no close matches in the filler and it doesn’t stain well. I am going to try the mix over the dime size wood filler and think it will help it blend. It’s great to know they can be mixed for alternative projects. Thanks again!!
I build furniture. As hard as I try, I don't always get all the glue off. Wood glue doesn't except stain. Mixing the poly and stain allows you to touch up the glue spots. I stain the piece normally then apply the touchup poly/stain. When dry I finish the whole project with poly.
Exactly, same applies to oak plywood
I'm Subcontractor Painter the Best way to go is Prep, sand it apply, the secret of each painter, wish every each painter used a diferent material them apply the Stain Let it dry for 24 hours and apply 2 coats of poly. I always recommend poly oil 👌
I actually used the mixed technique with part of a project that I couldn't get to take up stain as well as the surrounding area. I don't know if the grain was particularly dense or that the pores were already saturated, but it wouldn't sand out. It worked like a charm to blend in the troubled spot since I was using the same exact stain and polyurethane to finish the rest of it. I can imagine it's possible to end up with a horror show when you're not using the exact same product everywhere else though.
Ill have to give this a try, ive been using the premix poly and stain because The flooring ive been using has rough side cuts which I use filler. Thw issue with filler is that basic stain is absorbed more in the filler than the wood. Using the premix in my reno saves me TONS of time. The poly/stain dries in one solid layer and If I take my time and make a thin layer the filler just appears to be a grain in the wood. Also areas that I used adhesive that wouldnt otherwise absorb stain, I just stain right over it. Theme of the house is rustic and so far so good. But needless to say, I ran out of my premix so I was looking into mixing my own to finish the floors
The stain and poly mix can serve two purposes... it can darken an existing piece you have stained, where the wood won't absorb enough to get the desired color... and if there is a little bit of blotchiness, instead of stripping the whole thing and starting over, it can help even that out with one simple topcoat.
The only reason I can think of is why I'm researching this...darken up an existing PU sealed surface. 2 years ago, I stained a redwood fence, and layered on 3 layers of poly after the stain. It's held up pretty good for in the California sun, but it's time for a clean and another coat of poly. BUT, while it looks good, it's a little too light in terms of color shade compared to other wood around the house. When I did the original job, I should have use 2 coats of stain. So now, I want to slightly darken AND reseal right on top of the existing poly. There are some spots where the the wood is showing from weathering, and gray. So, my plan is to light sand the fence without messing the finish. Then, thin out some stain with mineral spirits, and use a rag to touch up the gray spots and bring some color back. After, do a 75 poly / 25 stain mix and apply on the whole fence to darken it up. then one more 100% poly to finish. My only hesitation is apply pure stain on top of what is mostly poly right now, save for the gray spots. Let me know if you think I'm crazy here. Thanks!!
I think if you mix it, it will work fine. Normally poly isnt used outdoors but perhaps in CA you can get away with it.
It’s a good way of applying a second coat of stain Incase your first coat doesn’t cover the way you’d like or Incase you can’t get a Corner on your room floors for whatever reason. It has its own use cases for sure
Good info. I'll be using this method on some storage shelves in a basement and garage, and it's a good fit. Just want the minimum effort to get a stained finish and seal against moisture.
Did you buff with 0000 pad between layers? Curious if that would improve it. One benefit i see to this method would be the elimination of oily waste rags. Also curious what the result would be with wipe on. Great video! Love experiments!
I wonder if you can mix a water bases stain polyurethane with a different stain to change the overall color.
Well, my dilemma I built a stereo cabinet some years back and thewood was an aged pine . So when polyurethane it ,it dried with a golden finish to it. Well I wanted to add a couple of more shelves to the center of the existing cabinet and without even thinking about it ,I bought more of the same size wood without matching the colors and urethane them only to my surprise ,the wood was not aged but new cut and the tint was off. My thoughts ,always bring a sample to the lumber yard so you can match the color. New growth cut wood is much different than aged.
Great video!
But was it blotchy because you didn’t use a wood conditioner?
Here's my reason my piece of wood is not getting darker with several coats of stain and if you lay the stain on too thick it doesn't dry and you have issues putting the Polly on I'm going to try mixing them
I was looking for a way to reduce blotchiness on my birch ply. I was hoping to achieve that by mixing the poly and stain.
You can save several days considering it takes 24 hours between coats of poly
, hey I am doing a table in black flat stain and need to know what I can seal it with to keep the flat black look. You know how kids are when they're eaten cereal and spill their milk on top of the table, I want to make sure I can clean it up without staining
Perhaps a satin sheen polyurethane? Either water based or oil. You can test in on a sample. I have had some unfavorable results using water based poly on dark colors, so I would probably go with a satin oil based poly -- perhaps just one light coat will be enough to protect the paint while keeping a flatter look.
Can I ask you a question. I have just accidently applied an indoor polyurethane varnish to some of my outdoor deck boards before I realised the mistake. Is it okay to just apply the outdoor polyurethane over the top of the indoor coat or do I need to sand it all off? Thank you.
P.S the indoor coat is water based.
I would just lightly sand, clean, then apply the outdoor stuff. The outdoor has UV protection. Should be fine....although even outdoor poly doesn't last that long if it is in direct sunlight. Good luck.
@@AlleyPicked Thank you for replying. I will do just what said. Hopefully all will be good.
My dog bited my kitchen I would combine them to make small touchups anyways already switched to water based
The mixtures try to do two things, and don't due either well. Stain is intended to soak into the wood. Poly is a topcoat.
You got it!
@@AlleyPicked I've had decent luck staining projects and, through lousy experiences, avoid some products. Matching stain can be a real pain and is my current predicament.
A HUGE Thumps Up for an interesting experiment. Every store will have Snake Oil on the shelf hoping someone will try it. Enjoyed!
I searched the question about mixing polyurethane with stain. I did this because I was going to try to use it on a laminate to see if it would take to the laminate. So if it works that's the use for it rather than just being lazy
Thanks this stopped me making a mistake
thanks!
Any experience with spraying oil poly over uncured gel stain?
Why is the stain uncured? Was it applied too thick?
I think you’re actually wrong. If you were to change the tone or color existing wood that method of mixing the stain and polyis a great method and then you would clear over that i’m just disagreeing because you’re saying there’s no situation you think this would work I change color on wood all the time that way way more cost-effective
Nice layering technique when trying to get a complex shade just right and can't use the shellac technique.
Only reason I grabbed a polyshades is because they had a color that the regular minwax stains didnt offer.
Good luck with it.
Dont the chemicals not mix well? Are you using oil based or water based?
The first sentence in the video says "oil based" :-)
@AlleyPicked true, but my pop always told me not to mix poly and stain or it wont come out right and it can haze up white. I'm novice at woodwork so im not sure. Looks like it works well for this gentleman
Ever try this with a mix of water based products?
I have not tried. I never use water based stains. Maybe I'll give them a try one day. I guess I am of the opinion "If it ain't broke, don't fix it". Thanks for the comment and I will try to pick up a can of water based stain. Maybe I'll do a comparison video.
@@AlleyPicked I've only ever used oil based but I have a unique situration/issue. My place has Bruce Engineered Wood Flooring. It was most likely installed around 15 years ago. Maybe more. Several of the baords are water damaged and have peeled their finish.
And of course, Bruce no longer makes it in a 3" wide.
It gets better (worse, actually).
There appears to be 4 different looks/shades of the planks, so I'm thinking of doing at least 2, maybe 3 of those shades in order to keep the look.
Contacted Bruce to find out what color stain I can get to match the floor and they said that they don't really have a stain "per say," because the finish is applied in a certain "process."
Some of my floor planks have peeled and it looks like the colorant is in the poly finish. The available poly + stain finishes don't match up to they planks I have.
So. I thought I might try to match the "stain" color and mix with the poly myself.
The worst part is that this Bruce Eng Floor is water based.
I was surprised to learn that many flooring finishes are water based.
No wonder it got damaged.
Well, thanks for reading my long explanation.
This addressed a question I had!
I do see a good reason to mix them: Darkening a stain. I like MinWax Red Mahogany stain but it is not as dark as what some people like. Putting a second coat of it on is not the answer...it only darkens it a little, as the wood really does not soak much more in. But maybe stain it, then have the first coat be the poly+stain mix???
That sounds like it would work. With a little experimentation I think you should be able to get the color you desire.
i mixed stain and some old paint together an painted my wheel barrow it came out rubbery work out good enough for a wheel barrow 😁😁😁
Interesting idea.
Nope...im doing a old 1922 man cave and doing the 70 percent with ebony color...on a ancient pine floor..yup..its what im gonna do and in fact i may do it with their water based
Interesting experiment. But you proved why these should be done separately. Thanks for sharing this. Also, what would your church do without you?!? 😃
I agree with you, Patrick. Poly mixed with stain is not a good idea. Tom makes sure that little things are done behind the scenes at his church. Most of the church members probably don't even know that he is serving in this way. If you are a woodworker and a member of a church, you should consider following his example and look for ways to make the old church building look a little better.
Amen Eddie! :-)
Yeah - mixing the two is kind of like going to Home Depot and then putting out a bag of weed and feed on your lawn - as they should be done separately (and at different times!). Lots of these products are aimed at impulse buyers who haven't a clue but the product misleadingly appears to them to be a time-saver.
weed & feed :-) yea...food and poison mixed together. Never thought about that. Good point!
LOL, kind of like eating some wives' cooking!
so what is 'the standard method"?
Stain first. Separate from polyurethane. Let it dry, then use a finish on top of the stain.
Thanks for this question and answer. I just started making my own walking sticks, and ever page I looked at never told this. Ha, I even tried to ask the question on a site and I got a whole lot of no you don't put stains on polyurethane and then smart ass answer why not Ugh.
But this answer is what I needed to know 😊
Use Saman, poly shades doesn’t compare.
Also with your 70-25% what happened to the other 5% 😂
Lol -- You're the only one who caught that!
@@AlleyPicked 😂
Dont wax the steps!