Honda for me: sidenote, wow - fuel over there sucks, here we get 98 ... Now, the comment about the Ducati wheels shocked me, i couldn't imagine having easy to damage wheels on a big expensive bike sold as an adv...i know why, unsprung mass but come on....
Owning a 2024 Honda Transalp but these two is what I would upgrade to and this video only made me more undecided. While I like the smoothness of the Honda's, I like the roughness of the Ducs. I guess I need a bigger garage.
“Not a crappy bike in the bunch”. Agreed. Own a DesertX and have rode Africa Twin. Appreciate very balanced discussion. For me it was the closer to sport bike fun of DesertX to get to the dirt that won the day. Thought I wouldn’t find riding modes so useful on DesertX but so easy to adjust while riding I end up using almost daily. Riding for almost 40 years and cannot stop grinning on every old and new bike I have privilege to ride. Thanks again and highly recommend your Bend course. Cheers.
I have owned a DesertX for two years and around 16k miles. It has been a reliable, versatile and enjoyable ride both on and off-road; no disappointments. Fair and balanced review and nothing I would disagree with. Well done.
I have a '24 ATAS (and love it).... but one of the main deciding factors was seat height and actual standover height. Despite being a big bike, I felt it was easier to get a leg over, touch the ground and feel more confident holding it up with one leg. Nearly ever other full sized adventure big was too big.
Agree on ride height. I got out on a 24 ATAS a few weeks ago and they have a much lower seat height than the previous AT’s. But you do lose an inch of travel. Eric and i felt the ATAS was more comparable to a 1250 GSA than the DesertX so we focused on the standard AT. I have a 1250GS and it was almost a coin toss between the ATAS and the GSA. Both are such good touring machines.
I paid 8000 for my Africa Twin DCT standard 13 months ago. Had a KLR before that. I chose AT for Honda reliability and 10:1 compression. DCT didn't scare me other than how is it off road. I have put 11k miles on the AT to date. After RaceTech suspension upgrade. Oiled prefilters on the air intake. Pirelli Rally Race front and either shinko 805 or Tusk 2 track rear. Bike has left me stranded no where and leaves be wanting back on it after every trip. The part I like about an older AT was ease of turning off ABS rear and traction control and the price I gave for it. Bike came with Outback motortech protection front, rear and bash plate, Camel kick stand, center stand and screen brace, Oxford heated grips, Pivot pegs and eastern beaver power hub. All for 8000. Love love love the bike. I did add a wind rider seat cover which is very nice in warmer months. All said when I look at pics of a Desert X it really makes me perk up. And to hear that it has little more power and lighter feel and flick ability. Well, sure like to ride one. But, for probably twice the money at best sound like I'll stick my my old AT. Great review guys I've wanted to see one like this.
Thats a lot of motorcycle for $8k. I love my DesertX and really didnt consider the AT when i bought it. But after ripping around on our rental AT i was really surprised and impressed. Id still prefer the DesertX, but this is what inspired me to do the video. Glad you enjoyed it.
In terms of the electronics and controls on the Africa Twin.... you get used to the controls quite quickly. No, they aren't perfect.... but I am not a serious offroader, so the issues with turning off abs/traction/wheelie control are not a factor. The Android Auto can be glitchy... but is still a nice feature to have for long rides.
I can finally operate the electronics controls on my '21 AT without looking at the buttons, even in the dark. It's definitely not intuitive to learn, but it's pretty simple once you get used to it.
Africa twin 1000 in my garage. 90% offroad and rough fire trails. Contemplating stiffer springs. Handles fine with my 100kgs onboard, but bottomed it out a few times this year.
I put 10k miles on my honda , it never missed a beat , and i rode in a lot of areas most adv riders wouldn't go , san Juan mtns of Colorado. I did put heavier fork springs in it.
For me the weight of africa twin the pain of air filter and backwards horn signal from every other bike I much prefer the tenere 700. Hoping for a tenere 900!
I switched teams from 2019 AT to 2023 DesertX. I agree the AT felt much heavier, more top-heavy. Moving it around the garage was nerve-racking. DesertX has been much comfier on-road, better wind protection. DX's dash was easier to read. I love the DX's cruise control and heated grips. DX's plastic is much simpler than the AT - the AT's plastic was super complicated with multiple layers of interlocking pieces and dozens of fasteners, plus the windscreen well nuts that fall into the fairing and get lost forever.
As a multiyear owner an have driving +-100k km on a 2016 africa twin DCT , yes dct , I can say for the passengers I had on the back it is a good bike to have except for the hard seat . Thats maybe a the one real negative comments I had from my passengers .The seating position is great but it is in how little foam or the type of foam is in the seats of the africa twin . This is still the same for the newer models of this bike . Also the rider seat has 'that' problem , but for the rider I think it really depends on the rider . I don't really have a problem with it and I have done a few roadtrips on them so far . Longest one was a whole month riding on the bike on and off road . Many points these guys gave are the best I have seen so far . They have really great points to both of them . They are both really potent bikes and can suit many riding styles and usage . I used the twin for offroad , onroad and in normal and heavy use , It is my go to bike for me . But I do not recommend them to everybody . Last week got a conversation about it with somebody and with the talk I had with him I even recommended him to look more in the bmw direction . Every bike has his rider and I do not doubt that the desertx has a larger rider group that still need to go take a look in that bike than the droup is has right now . Same goes for the africa twin . Adventure bikes are great allrounders and there is a really good reason they are so popular these day . The only problem I have with the motorbikes these days are all the uneeded technological doohickies that only can break at some point , this is also the reason why I am sticking to my 2016 model . But ... depends on what you want . But great video here guys , love to see more of this type of videos . Fair points , honest decent discussion .
My 2017 Africa Twin had a reduced weight almost 10kg with aftermarket rims, lithium battery, galfer brake rotors and aftermarket exhaust. It picks up and handles like a dirt bike with much reduced unsprung weight and rotational inertia. I can live with less HP. Here in Singapore, we don’t want a bike that heated up really bad. So AT is a perfect bike for me and many riders here.
I was looking for this video 3 months ago. I was in the marker for a new ADV bike. I went through this list exhaustively up and down and tried both. My honest opinion was that I just fell in love with the DDX's imperfections and looks and was unable to remove it from my brain. I think the AT looks amazing but there is just something with that white that calls my name. Fantastic overview and comparison. Even after this video I would still have chosen my bike. I think either bike, it's a win/win.
There is a dongle that makes it faster to set the Africa Twin in offroad mode. With that dongle you press the star 3 sec, and everything if off. ABS, TC, AW, it even turns off that confirmation menu.
Your honds there is old..Honda mechanic in every town US and abroad. LSK Dongle one button ABS, TC & wheelie control OFF/ON without even having to stop & its cheap easy to install😮.
Pillion comfort goes hands down to the Africa Twin in my Opinion. I own a 2023 AT DCT; and my friend owns a Desert X and it´s not a comfortable seat at all.
I live in Medellin, Colombia, and we are lucky enough to have Ducati, Honda, and Apriia dealerships a stone's throw away. What's really screwed up here is all of these bikes get hit with a 30% tariff. I have always been in love with Africa bcs, in my mind it will last forever. However took the Apriia Tuareg for a test ride and ran into a couple riders on Huskies 901 and 701 and this bike blew the doors (whoops bikes don't have doors) off of both of them. It was a true joy to ride too! I do have a neighbor in the wink wink biz and he has the Desert X he told me he had to spend $30k something for it. Crazy for most people here. But there are some that have that kind of money to spend on it for sure! Hard to walk away from Honda for the Aprilia, but man, what a ride! Not as apples to apples, but I am smaller than both of you at 5" 10". So average-sized man globally. But here kind of above average. In no hurry to pull the trigger, but I had to watch and really liked how you went through your checklist on these bikes! Italians really love their cars and motos for sure. To them it is a craft legacy!
I'm in Vancouver, Canada and I know a few guys on the Aprilia660, and I am telling you honestly, the bike is very reliable. Every owner has no regrets! And these are the type of guys who go off road. The bikes have plenty of nicks and scratches…not coffee shop queens. Personally, I ride an Africa Twin, but I would consider the April now….especially the new Rally version set to come 2025!
Well said! Thought we covered it pretty well. The comparison of these two bikes reminds a bit of the lion and the gazelle we talked about in T7 versus 790R review a few years ago around 9:37: ua-cam.com/video/fRIk7625JUI/v-deo.htmlsi=kV9iQZPNMSxi4HCD
Have 2020 AT Standard. Have Dongle, it's been available from a small European aftermarket manufacturer for about a year but actually I don't use it much as I thought I would as I haven't done allot of off road. 1 button push and a memory option.
Nice comparison video, I have the 2020 AT and I can say they way over hyped the electronics, the rider modes are pretty much a joke. I like the bike but one of my biggest complaints is the way the throttle is so jerky on and off, depending on your gear and RPM if your standing up pretty relaxed and shut the throttle off it can about put you over the bars (maybe slight exaggeration) tried getting ecu reflashed it didnt help also at 180lbs rear spring was way to soft. compared to a Triumph Tiger rally pro it feels kind of cheap & unrefined... which it is a lot cheaper so I guess that is forgivable. But at 6'1 with 36' inseam it fits me better than any bike I have been on especially for standing
Agree on the electronics and throttle response. Obviously im not a fan of the switches and menu system. But even the way the traction control intervenes off road is not as smooth as the Ducati. I find the DesertX traction control to be very smooth and unobtrusive. Not quite as good as the KTM 790/890 Adventure in Rally mode, but close. .
A little feedback regarding 2-up riding with the Africa Twin... I have a '24 ATAS... I purchased it with the intent of doing a significant amount of 2-up riding with my adult son and my wife (occasionally), mainly on-road. The ATAS replaces my old 2011 Honda CBF1000 sport tourer. I went ahead and ordered/fitted the OEM accessory composite panniers and top box right away. In terms of room, the AT has decent passenger room, but the foot room for the pillion is cramped and quite often my passengers foot hits my leg when they are getting on/off the bike. If the passenger has short legs, their legs could rest on the panniers (not an issue for people with longer legs). Both the rider/passenger seats are not great for long distances... after 2 hrs, both of us are getting squirmy - After 4hrs, the butt is down-right sore (I am looking into an aftermarket or modified seat now). Other than that, it is a fantastic 2-up rig. Zero issues with power (or lack of) when riding 2-up. Zero issues with handling or suspension when riding 2-up... the bike is super stable and loves to be pushed hard on the twisties. The Adventure Sports model has electronic suspension and it is fantastic. I have my user modes set up so I can easily switch back and forth between modes when riding 2-up or single.... I have the settings dialed in perfectly right now for both conditions. If anyone is interested, I have some more detailed videos on my UA-cam page.
i found it odd no comparison videos between them, i recently got back into bikes and always wanted the africa, sat on 1 in a dealer and it was so heavy to stand up, then the sea of buttons, to me it felt like a lifted goldwing. At that point i then saw your guys videos on the desert x, made the treck to a ducati dealer, soon as i sat on it i knew i was sold. For me at least how it feels just to stand up is a big thing, and going down the road, you can be chill or full on hooligan, i love it.
Glad we helped in your decision. Yes, this video came about because I was curious about the Africa Twin after I bought my DesertX. We had the 22 AT in our rental fleet, but I'd never really had any time on it. So I took it for 3 days of riding both on and off and also at our training range. After that 3 day ride I went looking for good comparison videos because the two bikes seemed pretty close in a lot of ways, and didn't find any. I told Eric, "hey I think we just found our next video topic". Appreciate you tuning into our channel and your comments. Enjoy your DDX.
@@superflycatchermtb Thanks for establishing, finally, that you were comparing the DesX to a '22 AT. It is impossible to tell from all the video footage you show, which includes pre-'20 and post-'20 AT models. When you cited a compression ratio of 10.5:1, I realized you were talking about a '24 model. So, I guess you just messed up when you said that, and it was actually a '22 AT being compared to.
They don't even want you to adjust your own chain. I remember seeing a video about that. Doesn't help the culture of motorcycling one bit. How about the rear axle nut. Isn't it an odd size? Kind of small?
@@lelouchabrilvelda1794 Mine was a Honda, made in Japan and I've had problems. But, I usually steer clear of European, Chines and American brands. As with cars, so is true with motorcycles.
Just tested them both. For me the Honda was the sensible choice, the desertx spoke to my heart. In contrary to my mothers advice I let my heart dictate my financial decision..
Desmo service and dealership is a deal breaker for me! Im from Brazil and Ducati dealerships in Brazil are close to non-existent, and you have to trust your Ducati to someone who claims to know what they are doing. I owned a Ducati Multistrada 1200s for a few years and it's one of the best bikes I've ever had in my life. But unfortunately during this period I had some problems with it that the dealers were unable to resolve, and I spent more than 4 months without the motorcycle, until I found someone who could solve the motorcycle problem.
I rode an Africa Twin for 6 years, and I replaced it (and a 1200 Multistrada) with a Desert-X. The Desert-X had porcelain wheels and had constant problems. I couldn't trust it do do much off-road and get me home. And then there was the mileage and annual maintenance warning resets that require time at the dealer to reset. Care to install the overpriced heated grips yourself? You have to pay the dealer to "activate them". I learned to hate it and sold it for a pretty big loss 1 year later. Buy the Africa Twin, invest a few grand in the suspension and you will have a more satisfying, and much more reliable ride.
I'd be very interested in hearing what problems the bike had aside from the admitadly fragile wheels. I know many other DDX riders that have had zero reliability issues.
Wondering how the DesX compares to the Norden 901. Heard that heat is a big issue with that bike. Euro5 regs sure are messing with engine performance, heat management, etc. I cringe to think of what Euro6 will do!
Both bikes run hot. I've owned a couple 890R's and also a Norden 901 for a short period. The DesertX and the KTM/Husky engines all put out a lot of heat, especially with the decat. I'm not really a fan of decating because of the extra noise, potential warranty issues, and fuel mapping. But decatting either bike will definitely help with heat. All of my riding pants have leather inserts on the calfs and without that I probably wouldn't tolerate it.
@@AndrewMurray-w9i I'd much prefer it if the EPA and other "protectors of the environment" would focus on longevity of engines and fuel economy over tailpipe emissions. All are important, but they have elevated tailpipe emission concerns to such a high level that they ignore other upstream causes of pollution, like burning more fuel.
2022 Africa Twin compression ration is 10.1:1, NOT 10.5:1 as stated in the video. You are talking about the 2024 and on, I believe. This begs the question, which model year AT were you comparing to the Desert X? It's ambiguous based on the video footage you showed of both pre-'20 and post-'20 AT models. I thought at the beginning of the video you were comparing the Ducati to a '22 AT, but then you showed many videos of an AT with only one headlight lit up, which indicates that you were filming a pre-'20 model, which is hardly a fair comparison.
Thanks for watching and for your comments. We use stock and B roll footage from a variety of events and sources. The riding time I spent on the AT was on our 2022 AT from our rental fleet and my "seat of the pants" riding impression was from that bike. I'd previously had a 2018 AT and found it no where close to comparable to the DDX, and only after a short ride on the 2022, did it occur that it was a good match for the DDX. Whereever possible we tried to include new 2024 specs in our conversation where relevant, like HP and torque figures. It would have been nice to have the 2024 to ride as much and as hard as I rode the 2022 that we had but just wasn't in the cards.
@@superflycatchermtb Thanks for clarifying that your observations were based on the use of a 2022 AT from your rental fleet. Wanted to make sure, because the 2022 model does not have a compression ration of 10.5:1, the 2024 does.
Agreed and like I said in the video, I don't ride with a passenger, but I don't think either bike is a great two person touring bike. I also have a 1250GSA and that's clearly a much better bike for hauling passengers than either the AT or the DDX. Not just for the amount of room, and the size of the seat, but for the amount of weight that the GSA can carry with out struggling. The torque of the boxer engine really shines when you load it up.
@ nope, mine is a 2021 and as long as it Bluetoothed in you can select CarPlay via function button. I prefer to ride with earplugs but like the map function. Works a treat. As for wheelie and TC, across to screen 4, hold the enter button to highlight TC or wheelie control. Hold the select to the left while push in the enter button and off it goes. Easy once you know how.
Thanks, it was an amazing trip last summer with my wife. I was there 50 years prior as an 11 year old. Amazing how theyve managed to keep the spirit and vibe of the town intact.
Honda reliability and ease of maintenance or fun sexy Ducati and even easier maintenance you'll never have to touch it because the manual tells you not to.
I think you got the HP figure wrong on the AT from 2020 to 2023 it has 100.6 hp not 93.8hp was the old 2019 and previous. I think you said 97 or something
It’s so exhausting to see the motorcycle publications dance around the world “reliability” Although I applaud Ride Adventures for at least touching on livability and oil changes and valve checks they still fear pissing off the European brands and by comparing reliability with Japanese bikes. You even went as far as to compare compression ratios for vibration and feel but didn’t speak on the obvious. A high compression engine will not last as long as a lower compression engine. Every major motorcycle publication does this to stay in good graces with BMW, KTM, Ducati, Triumph and Guzzi to keep getting press loner bikes and I wish you’d just be honest and tell people the Japanese bikes will last much longer and be much cheaper to operate 99/100 times.
Are you new to Ride Adventures? They are a motorcycle adventure touring business. They don’t get press or loner bikes. They have spoken numerous times about how Japanese bikes are far more reliable than European bikes. They don’t dance around that fact.
@ Definitely not new and just because they don’t get loner bikes doesn’t mean they want to step on any toes. They are still reviewing two wildly different adv bikes. Most riders would be looking at a KTM 890 vs a Dessert X. The Africa twin is not in the same class of bikes as the European middle weights. It’s just a different bike entirely. And no, they never talk about reliability. If they did they would have brought it up here. Reliability is an easy talking point that everyone wants to hear about and they skipped right over it, Instead they talk about the vibration of engine compression 🤣🤣 Eric has even said that having a “less reliable bike” like his KTM have led to more fun memories breaking down and having to figure out how to fix the bike. Which is the most tone deaf rich guy bullshit I’ve ever heard in my life like the average joe is going to enjoy breaking down and having to find help from the locals while he’s on vacation from work.
I don't know anyone that doesn't already know that Japanese bikes are the most reliable. I think it's a mistake to say that Euro brand bikes are UN reliable, though. I agree that reliability should get a mention, but that's clearly not a defining factor for a lot of riders. There are many great things about Euro bikes...performance, sound, refinement, etc. We all have different budgets, too. If you were to look at this through the lens of a RTW traveller on a shoestring budget, purchasing either of these bikes would probably be a bad idea. Everyone has their own way of having fun on these bikes, and everyone has their own opinion on the "right" bike and the "right" way to do something. I'm genuinely curious though...how are these two bikes so radically different in your opinion? They're both adventure bikes with similar power output.
@@2wheels.are.better.than4 reliability on rental bikes is only important for the time they keep them. Usually rental fleets get renewed often so riders can enjoy new bikes.
From what I've read, the Desert X is a reliable bike with a proven motor. It is a higher performance bike than the AT and in general higher performance bikes are going to be less durable, but I'm not sure what else there is to say about the Desert X with regard to reliability. Ducati has made a modern, high quality, fun motorcycle.
the idea of a conversation starter should be broken up into 2 different categories... non-motorcycle enthusiasts and motorcycle enthusiasts... my cb300r gets tons of non-motorcyclist interest but enthusiasts could care less.
@@danielkramer8586 technically, if you want to be pedantic, it could also be couldn't. I have heard it said both ways and I get it, "could care less" implies there is some manner of caring and there is, not many people have them so when people see a newer one, whether they are riders or not, they want to try it or at least learn about it.
@@adam346 Exactly. You care the least. People say all kind of things. Some of them reflect their opinions and others create false impressions. I think the CB300R is a great bike. It hits a sweet spot in balance of weight, power and economy. Glad you can be an ambassador to motorcycling. Ride safely!
Great discussion and comparison, however: Two major omissions . Reliability and Projected cost to own. Even though you touched on maintenance there is a lot more to it over the course of ownership. Honda of course is a resounding slam dunk in both categories. Given these major factors, The Honda with it's stella reliability, ability to run on shit gas, massive dealer network and much lower cost to own puts it in a class of its own.
Agreed on many of your points. I think bottom line, the Ducati is not the bike for someone looking for the best value, or most practical machine. If you don't feel really passionate about the Ducati you're not going to be able to justify the extra cost and difficult maintenance. For me, the bikes are similar in performance, but the Ducati is a very fun, well built, beautiful bike. But yea, if I was buying based on price and practicality, the Honda wins every day.
Ive thought about your comment some more and while i dont disagree, I would say this; I think the reliabilty reputations of both bikes are exaggerated. Most people bash Ducati DDX as unreliable with little or no evidence to back up.. they just think oh, italian high performance must break down a lot. In reality the 937 motor is super dependable and proven and even slightly detuned compared to other models that use it. And the DDX build quality and electronics are really good. The Africa Twin is reliable but not with out issues, especially electronic gremlins. But overall, Hondas gonna win on reliability and cost of ownership. Im just mot sure id call it a slam dunk.
@@AndrewMurray-w9i Let me put it this way. You have to cross the Simpson desert, solo, no tools and you have a choice.There are two bikes sitting there and you need out of there ?
Thats an interesting scenario. So if we are talking about bikes brand new off the showrrom floor, I think it’s a toss up. Electronic faults are the most common on new bikes and i dont think either has an advantage. If the bikes had thousands of miles then probably take the Honda. But on either bike the things that would probably go wrong are flats, fork seals, chain issues. I dont think either bike has an advantage. Where i think the real advantage on reliability on the Honda is really long term cost of ownership. If i have limited funds and want to put 50,000 miles on either bike thats where the Honda really shines.
Are you on Team Ducati or Team Honda?
Honda for me: sidenote, wow - fuel over there sucks, here we get 98 ... Now, the comment about the Ducati wheels shocked me, i couldn't imagine having easy to damage wheels on a big expensive bike sold as an adv...i know why, unsprung mass but come on....
Owning a 2024 Honda Transalp but these two is what I would upgrade to and this video only made me more undecided. While I like the smoothness of the Honda's, I like the roughness of the Ducs. I guess I need a bigger garage.
Between two bikes, Ducati for me is better one…I don't want Android or Apple carplay on my bike.
@@KoenPrins What is your review of the Transalp? I have a T7 and I love it but I also love looking at other bikes 😂
Ducati makes awesome bikes but I will keep my 2022 ATAS DCT.
“Not a crappy bike in the bunch”. Agreed. Own a DesertX and have rode Africa Twin. Appreciate very balanced discussion. For me it was the closer to sport bike fun of DesertX to get to the dirt that won the day. Thought I wouldn’t find riding modes so useful on DesertX but so easy to adjust while riding I end up using almost daily. Riding for almost 40 years and cannot stop grinning on every old and new bike I have privilege to ride. Thanks again and highly recommend your Bend course. Cheers.
Thanks for watching, and for having joined us in Bend! We are proud of our great and growing team of instructors.
Weve finished our third year training in Bend. Im really proud of the program and facility weve built here.
I have owned a DesertX for two years and around 16k miles. It has been a reliable, versatile and enjoyable ride both on and off-road; no disappointments. Fair and balanced review and nothing I would disagree with. Well done.
Glad you enjoyed it. The DesertX is a pretty amazing bike.
I have a '24 ATAS (and love it).... but one of the main deciding factors was seat height and actual standover height. Despite being a big bike, I felt it was easier to get a leg over, touch the ground and feel more confident holding it up with one leg. Nearly ever other full sized adventure big was too big.
Agree on ride height. I got out on a 24 ATAS a few weeks ago and they have a much lower seat height than the previous AT’s. But you do lose an inch of travel. Eric and i felt the ATAS was more comparable to a 1250 GSA than the DesertX so we focused on the standard AT. I have a 1250GS and it was almost a coin toss between the ATAS and the GSA. Both are such good touring machines.
I paid 8000 for my Africa Twin DCT standard 13 months ago. Had a KLR before that. I chose AT for Honda reliability and 10:1 compression. DCT didn't scare me other than how is it off road. I have put 11k miles on the AT to date. After RaceTech suspension upgrade. Oiled prefilters on the air intake. Pirelli Rally Race front and either shinko 805 or Tusk 2 track rear. Bike has left me stranded no where and leaves be wanting back on it after every trip. The part I like about an older AT was ease of turning off ABS rear and traction control and the price I gave for it. Bike came with Outback motortech protection front, rear and bash plate, Camel kick stand, center stand and screen brace, Oxford heated grips, Pivot pegs and eastern beaver power hub. All for 8000. Love love love the bike. I did add a wind rider seat cover which is very nice in warmer months. All said when I look at pics of a Desert X it really makes me perk up. And to hear that it has little more power and lighter feel and flick ability. Well, sure like to ride one. But, for probably twice the money at best sound like I'll stick my my old AT. Great review guys I've wanted to see one like this.
Thats a lot of motorcycle for $8k. I love my DesertX and really didnt consider the AT when i bought it. But after ripping around on our rental AT i was really surprised and impressed. Id still prefer the DesertX, but this is what inspired me to do the video. Glad you enjoyed it.
Great comment Michael. Do you feel like your AT lacks power at any time?
In terms of the electronics and controls on the Africa Twin.... you get used to the controls quite quickly. No, they aren't perfect.... but I am not a serious offroader, so the issues with turning off abs/traction/wheelie control are not a factor. The Android Auto can be glitchy... but is still a nice feature to have for long rides.
I can finally operate the electronics controls on my '21 AT without looking at the buttons, even in the dark. It's definitely not intuitive to learn, but it's pretty simple once you get used to it.
Africa twin 1000 in my garage. 90% offroad and rough fire trails.
Contemplating stiffer springs. Handles fine with my 100kgs onboard, but bottomed it out a few times this year.
I put 10k miles on my honda , it never missed a beat , and i rode in a lot of areas most adv riders wouldn't go , san Juan mtns of Colorado. I did put heavier fork springs in it.
LSK Electronics has a dongle that fixes the Africa Twin’s ABS/traction control issue you mentioned. It’s about $150.
Good to know…thanks.
Confirmed: this is really great!! (On 2022 ATAS DCT)
Man must be crazy to try any sort of “ adventure” in a ducati
For me the weight of africa twin the pain of air filter and backwards horn signal from every other bike I much prefer the tenere 700. Hoping for a tenere 900!
I switched teams from 2019 AT to 2023 DesertX. I agree the AT felt much heavier, more top-heavy. Moving it around the garage was nerve-racking. DesertX has been much comfier on-road, better wind protection. DX's dash was easier to read. I love the DX's cruise control and heated grips. DX's plastic is much simpler than the AT - the AT's plastic was super complicated with multiple layers of interlocking pieces and dozens of fasteners, plus the windscreen well nuts that fall into the fairing and get lost forever.
The most successful and honest comparison video I've watched in a long time.
Appreciate the feedback, thanks bud.
Thanks, great to know you enjoyed watching it.
Good and fair review and assessment of both bikes. Good to see honest, knowledgeable and well presented discussion with minimum bias.
I love my 21 base model Africa Twin
As a multiyear owner an have driving +-100k km on a 2016 africa twin DCT , yes dct , I can say for the passengers I had on the back it is a good bike to have except for the hard seat . Thats maybe a the one real negative comments I had from my passengers .The seating position is great but it is in how little foam or the type of foam is in the seats of the africa twin . This is still the same for the newer models of this bike . Also the rider seat has 'that' problem , but for the rider I think it really depends on the rider . I don't really have a problem with it and I have done a few roadtrips on them so far . Longest one was a whole month riding on the bike on and off road . Many points these guys gave are the best I have seen so far . They have really great points to both of them . They are both really potent bikes and can suit many riding styles and usage . I used the twin for offroad , onroad and in normal and heavy use , It is my go to bike for me . But I do not recommend them to everybody . Last week got a conversation about it with somebody and with the talk I had with him I even recommended him to look more in the bmw direction . Every bike has his rider and I do not doubt that the desertx has a larger rider group that still need to go take a look in that bike than the droup is has right now . Same goes for the africa twin . Adventure bikes are great allrounders and there is a really good reason they are so popular these day . The only problem I have with the motorbikes these days are all the uneeded technological doohickies that only can break at some point , this is also the reason why I am sticking to my 2016 model . But ... depends on what you want .
But great video here guys , love to see more of this type of videos . Fair points , honest decent discussion .
My 2017 Africa Twin had a reduced weight almost 10kg with aftermarket rims, lithium battery, galfer brake rotors and aftermarket exhaust. It picks up and handles like a dirt bike with much reduced unsprung weight and rotational inertia. I can live with less HP. Here in Singapore, we don’t want a bike that heated up really bad. So AT is a perfect bike for me and many riders here.
I was looking for this video 3 months ago. I was in the marker for a new ADV bike. I went through this list exhaustively up and down and tried both. My honest opinion was that I just fell in love with the DDX's imperfections and looks and was unable to remove it from my brain. I think the AT looks amazing but there is just something with that white that calls my name.
Fantastic overview and comparison. Even after this video I would still have chosen my bike. I think either bike, it's a win/win.
There is a dongle that makes it faster to set the Africa Twin in offroad mode. With that dongle you press the star 3 sec, and everything if off. ABS, TC, AW, it even turns off that confirmation menu.
Your honds there is old..Honda mechanic in every town US and abroad. LSK Dongle one button ABS, TC & wheelie control OFF/ON without even having to stop & its cheap easy to install😮.
Yes on the simple on/off option! Good to know, thanks for sharing.
Pillion comfort goes hands down to the Africa Twin in my Opinion. I own a 2023 AT DCT; and my friend owns a Desert X and it´s not a comfortable seat at all.
Along with that peppier feel goes a bit less cushiness. Thanks for watching.
Admittedly, the entire back end, including the rear seat on the DesertX seems a bit like an afterthought.
I live in Medellin, Colombia, and we are lucky enough to have Ducati, Honda, and Apriia dealerships a stone's throw away. What's really screwed up here is all of these bikes get hit with a 30% tariff. I have always been in love with Africa bcs, in my mind it will last forever. However took the Apriia Tuareg for a test ride and ran into a couple riders on Huskies 901 and 701 and this bike blew the doors (whoops bikes don't have doors) off of both of them. It was a true joy to ride too! I do have a neighbor in the wink wink biz and he has the Desert X he told me he had to spend $30k something for it. Crazy for most people here. But there are some that have that kind of money to spend on it for sure! Hard to walk away from Honda for the Aprilia, but man, what a ride! Not as apples to apples, but I am smaller than both of you at 5" 10". So average-sized man globally. But here kind of above average. In no hurry to pull the trigger, but I had to watch and really liked how you went through your checklist on these bikes! Italians really love their cars and motos for sure. To them it is a craft legacy!
It looks like the US is going to join you very soon with high tariffs. Can't wait. 👎
I'm in Vancouver, Canada and I know a few guys on the Aprilia660, and I am telling you honestly, the bike is very reliable. Every owner has no regrets! And these are the type of guys who go off road. The bikes have plenty of nicks and scratches…not coffee shop queens. Personally, I ride an Africa Twin, but I would consider the April now….especially the new Rally version set to come 2025!
Well said! Thought we covered it pretty well. The comparison of these two bikes reminds a bit of the lion and the gazelle we talked about in T7 versus 790R review a few years ago around 9:37: ua-cam.com/video/fRIk7625JUI/v-deo.htmlsi=kV9iQZPNMSxi4HCD
Im lucky to get to ride lots of different bikes, but still waiting for my time to ride the Aprillia.
Have 2020 AT Standard. Have Dongle, it's been available from a small European aftermarket manufacturer for about a year but actually I don't use it much as I thought I would as I haven't done allot of off road. 1 button push and a memory option.
Nice comparison video, I have the 2020 AT and I can say they way over hyped the electronics, the rider modes are pretty much a joke. I like the bike but one of my biggest complaints is the way the throttle is so jerky on and off, depending on your gear and RPM if your standing up pretty relaxed and shut the throttle off it can about put you over the bars (maybe slight exaggeration) tried getting ecu reflashed it didnt help also at 180lbs rear spring was way to soft. compared to a Triumph Tiger rally pro it feels kind of cheap & unrefined... which it is a lot cheaper so I guess that is forgivable. But at 6'1 with 36' inseam it fits me better than any bike I have been on especially for standing
Agree on the electronics and throttle response. Obviously im not a fan of the switches and menu system. But even the way the traction control intervenes off road is not as smooth as the Ducati. I find the DesertX traction control to be very smooth and unobtrusive. Not quite as good as the KTM 790/890 Adventure in Rally mode, but close. .
A little feedback regarding 2-up riding with the Africa Twin... I have a '24 ATAS... I purchased it with the intent of doing a significant amount of 2-up riding with my adult son and my wife (occasionally), mainly on-road. The ATAS replaces my old 2011 Honda CBF1000 sport tourer. I went ahead and ordered/fitted the OEM accessory composite panniers and top box right away. In terms of room, the AT has decent passenger room, but the foot room for the pillion is cramped and quite often my passengers foot hits my leg when they are getting on/off the bike. If the passenger has short legs, their legs could rest on the panniers (not an issue for people with longer legs). Both the rider/passenger seats are not great for long distances... after 2 hrs, both of us are getting squirmy - After 4hrs, the butt is down-right sore (I am looking into an aftermarket or modified seat now). Other than that, it is a fantastic 2-up rig. Zero issues with power (or lack of) when riding 2-up. Zero issues with handling or suspension when riding 2-up... the bike is super stable and loves to be pushed hard on the twisties. The Adventure Sports model has electronic suspension and it is fantastic. I have my user modes set up so I can easily switch back and forth between modes when riding 2-up or single.... I have the settings dialed in perfectly right now for both conditions. If anyone is interested, I have some more detailed videos on my UA-cam page.
Fortunately, by 4 hours of riding, you are due for a stop at a gas station and the butt-relief that includes.
i found it odd no comparison videos between them, i recently got back into bikes and always wanted the africa, sat on 1 in a dealer and it was so heavy to stand up, then the sea of buttons, to me it felt like a lifted goldwing. At that point i then saw your guys videos on the desert x, made the treck to a ducati dealer, soon as i sat on it i knew i was sold.
For me at least how it feels just to stand up is a big thing, and going down the road, you can be chill or full on hooligan, i love it.
Glad we helped in your decision. Yes, this video came about because I was curious about the Africa Twin after I bought my DesertX. We had the 22 AT in our rental fleet, but I'd never really had any time on it. So I took it for 3 days of riding both on and off and also at our training range. After that 3 day ride I went looking for good comparison videos because the two bikes seemed pretty close in a lot of ways, and didn't find any. I told Eric, "hey I think we just found our next video topic". Appreciate you tuning into our channel and your comments. Enjoy your DDX.
@@superflycatchermtb Thanks for establishing, finally, that you were comparing the DesX to a '22 AT. It is impossible to tell from all the video footage you show, which includes pre-'20 and post-'20 AT models. When you cited a compression ratio of 10.5:1, I realized you were talking about a '24 model. So, I guess you just messed up when you said that, and it was actually a '22 AT being compared to.
Africa twin- best!
I cant support Ducati because of the right to work on your own bike. If you plan on putting on 100k you need to be able to do your own maint.
That's fair
It's frustrating, especially since it's an ADV bike and likely to need more routine service than a bike that stays on the road.
They don't even want you to adjust your own chain. I remember seeing a video about that. Doesn't help the culture of motorcycling one bit. How about the rear axle nut. Isn't it an odd size? Kind of small?
@@danielkramer8586If you don't want a problems then don't buy any European brands or Chinese and american.
@@lelouchabrilvelda1794 Mine was a Honda, made in Japan and I've had problems. But, I usually steer clear of European, Chines and American brands. As with cars, so is true with motorcycles.
Please put in subtitles, the weight or any other units in metric. Thanks for the video.
Excellent info, thanks!
What is Carplay? All of my vehicles have Android Auto. Good fair review. It's a shame about Honda can't make easy switch gear, why so complicated.
It's the Apple equivalent to Android Auto.
Just tested them both. For me the Honda was the sensible choice, the desertx spoke to my heart. In contrary to my mothers advice I let my heart dictate my financial decision..
Ha Ha. Agree, you should listen to your heart regarding motorcycles.
Desmo service and dealership is a deal breaker for me! Im from Brazil and Ducati dealerships in Brazil are close to non-existent, and you have to trust your Ducati to someone who claims to know what they are doing. I owned a Ducati Multistrada 1200s for a few years and it's one of the best bikes I've ever had in my life. But unfortunately during this period I had some problems with it that the dealers were unable to resolve, and I spent more than 4 months without the motorcycle, until I found someone who could solve the motorcycle problem.
Yea, without access to a Ducati dealer it would be tough to justify.
I rode an Africa Twin for 6 years, and I replaced it (and a 1200 Multistrada) with a Desert-X. The Desert-X had porcelain wheels and had constant problems. I couldn't trust it do do much off-road and get me home. And then there was the mileage and annual maintenance warning resets that require time at the dealer to reset. Care to install the overpriced heated grips yourself? You have to pay the dealer to "activate them". I learned to hate it and sold it for a pretty big loss 1 year later.
Buy the Africa Twin, invest a few grand in the suspension and you will have a more satisfying, and much more reliable ride.
I'd be very interested in hearing what problems the bike had aside from the admitadly fragile wheels. I know many other DDX riders that have had zero reliability issues.
Wondering how the DesX compares to the Norden 901. Heard that heat is a big issue with that bike. Euro5 regs sure are messing with engine performance, heat management, etc. I cringe to think of what Euro6 will do!
Both bikes run hot. I've owned a couple 890R's and also a Norden 901 for a short period. The DesertX and the KTM/Husky engines all put out a lot of heat, especially with the decat. I'm not really a fan of decating because of the extra noise, potential warranty issues, and fuel mapping. But decatting either bike will definitely help with heat. All of my riding pants have leather inserts on the calfs and without that I probably wouldn't tolerate it.
@@AndrewMurray-w9i I'd much prefer it if the EPA and other "protectors of the environment" would focus on longevity of engines and fuel economy over tailpipe emissions. All are important, but they have elevated tailpipe emission concerns to such a high level that they ignore other upstream causes of pollution, like burning more fuel.
2022 Africa Twin compression ration is 10.1:1, NOT 10.5:1 as stated in the video. You are talking about the 2024 and on, I believe. This begs the question, which model year AT were you comparing to the Desert X? It's ambiguous based on the video footage you showed of both pre-'20 and post-'20 AT models. I thought at the beginning of the video you were comparing the Ducati to a '22 AT, but then you showed many videos of an AT with only one headlight lit up, which indicates that you were filming a pre-'20 model, which is hardly a fair comparison.
Thanks for watching and for your comments. We use stock and B roll footage from a variety of events and sources. The riding time I spent on the AT was on our 2022 AT from our rental fleet and my "seat of the pants" riding impression was from that bike. I'd previously had a 2018 AT and found it no where close to comparable to the DDX, and only after a short ride on the 2022, did it occur that it was a good match for the DDX. Whereever possible we tried to include new 2024 specs in our conversation where relevant, like HP and torque figures. It would have been nice to have the 2024 to ride as much and as hard as I rode the 2022 that we had but just wasn't in the cards.
@@superflycatchermtb Thanks for clarifying that your observations were based on the use of a 2022 AT from your rental fleet. Wanted to make sure, because the 2022 model does not have a compression ration of 10.5:1, the 2024 does.
Colorado Springs Ducati had brand new desert x’s for 13,400 with 299. Fees.
Thats a bargain.
My wife did not like the Africa Twin as a pillion - she loves the BMW GSA as a pillion.
Agreed and like I said in the video, I don't ride with a passenger, but I don't think either bike is a great two person touring bike. I also have a 1250GSA and that's clearly a much better bike for hauling passengers than either the AT or the DDX. Not just for the amount of room, and the size of the seat, but for the amount of weight that the GSA can carry with out struggling. The torque of the boxer engine really shines when you load it up.
Africa has tubeless wheels on 2022 and up models. Slight correction.
Oh with the AT, you don’t have to plug in for CarPlay. Also, there are cheats to the traction control and wheelie control easily.
Is that a new feature with 24 AT that you can run Carplay via Bluetooth? I thought the AT required a usb connection.
@@superflycatchermtb I know Android Auto requires a wired connection. You can get around it with a dongle, but the dongle has to be plugged in.
@ nope, mine is a 2021 and as long as it Bluetoothed in you can select CarPlay via function button. I prefer to ride with earplugs but like the map function. Works a treat. As for wheelie and TC, across to screen 4, hold the enter button to highlight TC or wheelie control. Hold the select to the left while push in the enter button and off it goes. Easy once you know how.
Desert X looks like 1982 Africa Twin.
Good call! Kinda does. Cagiva or something.
@@RIDEAdventures just look at the Cagiva Elefant, that's where the looks comes from
like your ZERMATT Sticker on the Bottle😂
Thanks, it was an amazing trip last summer with my wife. I was there 50 years prior as an 11 year old. Amazing how theyve managed to keep the spirit and vibe of the town intact.
@ 👍yes nice Place, for me as a Mountainguide that Place to live and work.
save ride.
Andreas
@@Andre-lc6vx If you live and ride in Switzerland, I'd like to connect with you....I'm planning another visit in 25 and looking to rent a bike.
Honda reliability and ease of maintenance or fun sexy Ducati and even easier maintenance you'll never have to touch it because the manual tells you not to.
I think you got the HP figure wrong on the AT from 2020 to 2023 it has 100.6 hp not 93.8hp was the old 2019 and previous.
I think you said 97 or something
WTH is with all the commercials ?? I’m out see ya
Ditch cable and get Premium. I haven't seen a UA-cam "commercial" for three years. That stress of "That God Damn Commercial Again" will be gone👌
@@MrRodwatsonOr a revanced
Yeah sucks. UA-cam has stepped it up a notch to push people to youtube premium.
It’s so exhausting to see the motorcycle publications dance around the world “reliability”
Although I applaud Ride Adventures for at least touching on livability and oil changes and valve checks they still fear pissing off the European brands and by comparing reliability with Japanese bikes.
You even went as far as to compare compression ratios for vibration and feel but didn’t speak on the obvious. A high compression engine will not last as long as a lower compression engine.
Every major motorcycle publication does this to stay in good graces with BMW, KTM, Ducati, Triumph and Guzzi to keep getting press loner bikes and I wish you’d just be honest and tell people the Japanese bikes will last much longer and be much cheaper to operate 99/100 times.
Are you new to Ride Adventures? They are a motorcycle adventure touring business. They don’t get press or loner bikes. They have spoken numerous times about how Japanese bikes are far more reliable than European bikes. They don’t dance around that fact.
@ Definitely not new and just because they don’t get loner bikes doesn’t mean they want to step on any toes. They are still reviewing two wildly different adv bikes. Most riders would be looking at a KTM 890 vs a Dessert X. The Africa twin is not in the same class of bikes as the European middle weights. It’s just a different bike entirely.
And no, they never talk about reliability. If they did they would have brought it up here. Reliability is an easy talking point that everyone wants to hear about and they skipped right over it, Instead they talk about the vibration of engine compression 🤣🤣
Eric has even said that having a “less reliable bike” like his KTM have led to more fun memories breaking down and having to figure out how to fix the bike. Which is the most tone deaf rich guy bullshit I’ve ever heard in my life like the average joe is going to enjoy breaking down and having to find help from the locals while he’s on vacation from work.
I don't know anyone that doesn't already know that Japanese bikes are the most reliable. I think it's a mistake to say that Euro brand bikes are UN reliable, though. I agree that reliability should get a mention, but that's clearly not a defining factor for a lot of riders. There are many great things about Euro bikes...performance, sound, refinement, etc. We all have different budgets, too. If you were to look at this through the lens of a RTW traveller on a shoestring budget, purchasing either of these bikes would probably be a bad idea. Everyone has their own way of having fun on these bikes, and everyone has their own opinion on the "right" bike and the "right" way to do something.
I'm genuinely curious though...how are these two bikes so radically different in your opinion? They're both adventure bikes with similar power output.
@@2wheels.are.better.than4 reliability on rental bikes is only important for the time they keep them. Usually rental fleets get renewed often so riders can enjoy new bikes.
From what I've read, the Desert X is a reliable bike with a proven motor. It is a higher performance bike than the AT and in general higher performance bikes are going to be less durable, but I'm not sure what else there is to say about the Desert X with regard to reliability. Ducati has made a modern, high quality, fun motorcycle.
the idea of a conversation starter should be broken up into 2 different categories... non-motorcycle enthusiasts and motorcycle enthusiasts... my cb300r gets tons of non-motorcyclist interest but enthusiasts could care less.
You mean "could NOT care less," I believe, but, yeah, I know what you mean.
@@danielkramer8586 technically, if you want to be pedantic, it could also be couldn't. I have heard it said both ways and I get it, "could care less" implies there is some manner of caring and there is, not many people have them so when people see a newer one, whether they are riders or not, they want to try it or at least learn about it.
@@adam346 Exactly. You care the least. People say all kind of things. Some of them reflect their opinions and others create false impressions. I think the CB300R is a great bike. It hits a sweet spot in balance of weight, power and economy. Glad you can be an ambassador to motorcycling. Ride safely!
Will get AT, don't wanna risk my trip with some failure of italian weak mechanic crap
Desert X engine has been around for more than 10 years on the multistrada, without showing any issue. Just saying
Great discussion and comparison, however: Two major omissions . Reliability and Projected cost to own. Even though you touched on maintenance there is a lot more to it over the course of ownership. Honda of course is a resounding slam dunk in both categories. Given these major factors, The Honda with it's stella reliability, ability to run on shit gas, massive dealer network and much lower cost to own puts it in a class of its own.
Agreed on many of your points. I think bottom line, the Ducati is not the bike for someone looking for the best value, or most practical machine. If you don't feel really passionate about the Ducati you're not going to be able to justify the extra cost and difficult maintenance. For me, the bikes are similar in performance, but the Ducati is a very fun, well built, beautiful bike. But yea, if I was buying based on price and practicality, the Honda wins every day.
Ive thought about your comment some more and while i dont disagree, I would say this; I think the reliabilty reputations of both bikes are exaggerated. Most people bash Ducati DDX as unreliable with little or no evidence to back up.. they just think oh, italian high performance must break down a lot. In reality the 937 motor is super dependable and proven and even slightly detuned compared to other models that use it. And the DDX build quality and electronics are really good. The Africa Twin is reliable but not with out issues, especially electronic gremlins. But overall, Hondas gonna win on reliability and cost of ownership. Im just mot sure id call it a slam dunk.
@@AndrewMurray-w9i Let me put it this way. You have to cross the Simpson desert, solo, no tools and you have a choice.There are two bikes sitting there and you need out of there ?
Thats an interesting scenario. So if we are talking about bikes brand new off the showrrom floor, I think it’s a toss up. Electronic faults are the most common on new bikes and i dont think either has an advantage. If the bikes had thousands of miles then probably take the Honda. But on either bike the things that would probably go wrong are flats, fork seals, chain issues. I dont think either bike has an advantage. Where i think the real advantage on reliability on the Honda is really long term cost of ownership. If i have limited funds and want to put 50,000 miles on either bike thats where the Honda really shines.