I know its a game balance thing to limit the total allowed augments and remove the ability to add those to mutoids but god damn was it badass in XCOM Enemy Within to have a fully gene modded solider that also had psionic powers.
Oh yeah, that's a great game and you could do a lot of cool stuff like that. I did a playthrough where I used all mechanized soldiers - it was like the game was on easy mode. They get to be so powerful in the end, especially when you get Jellied Elerium flamers. Meld was a problem, I couldn't get the whole squad up to level 3 mechanicals, but they still just glided through the last mission. As for the Mutoids, I think they're balanced fairly well. After finishing my full mutoid-only playthrough, the biggest thing I noticed that they really just can't deal with at all is mist. With no head-mounted gear available, they can't have mist repellers and they don't have any abilities, (other than maybe fireworms), that get rid of it. Most of the time it's not an issue but against certain enemies it can be a big pain. Otherwise I think they have an answer to pretty much everything, even with the limitations they have. It was a lot of fun doing mutoids-only!
I think people get upset because they don't have the level 7 soldier skills and that makes them "worthless." Also bringing them on missions takes away skill points from your human soldiers. But they're not worthless, they're extremely good. I've got a full playthrough series here on UA-cam that I'm about wrapping up that is mutoids only, no human soldiers, and they've performed incredibly well through the whole game. Skillpoints aren't a problem for them because they use mutagens to buy attributes and skills. Training time isn't a problem, either. With a proper training base with like 4 training facilities, you can get a brand new Mutoid soldier to max level in about two days, and 720 mutagens gets him max stats and all skills. You can't do that with humans because even if you put them in the training facility, they're only going to get 120 SP, and they need to get the rest either from the general pool or by grinding through missions. Lose a level 7 human soldier, that's a huge hit. If you lose a 5th level mutoid, you can replace him completely in a couple of days. I wasn't kidding in the video when I said I was skeptical at first, but I've run almost an entire game with only using them and they're really good.
Very interesting analysis, you focused on something I didn't even think about, fielding full teams instead of using them to fill gaps in existing ones (of regular soldiers). There's probably an optimal way to mix and match but until I play this DLC I can only speculate on it. With that in mind I was looking at the Pandoran skills and giving more weight to the ones not available to regular soldiers by any other means (items, mutations or bionics), I totally agree about your points on the launch worm abilities but I think you may be overlooking some like double perception for a reaction build (sniper, extreme focus, return fire or something). I was going to disagree about frenzy and psychic scream due to them being available to regular priests but then realised they're mutually exclusive so this is a major advantage to the mutoid over them, now I'm thinking combining a regular priest with the 3rd head to further synergise might be interesting. Also I think the passives of the base 3 classes are probably better than the berserker or the 3 other advanced because brawler gives melee proficiency and you gain access to more equipment per soldier with assault, sniper and heavy and the others probably benefit more from multiclassing. Finally the missing capstone abilities are of benefit to some classes (sniper) and detriment to others (assault), so it's probably worth replacing the former with mutoids who can benefit from cherry picking off other class and pandoran skills more than they'd lose out on with skills like adrenaline rush and rapid clearance.
I think the base class you need depends greatly on what you're doing with your Mutoid. For instance, in my playthrough, I've got a Mutoid soldier that focuses a lot on adding firepower to the field. One of the primary ways of doing that is turrets, so I made her a technician base so she could throw them and remotely activate them. She's also got worms with boom blast (which does lower the cost to launch worms to 1), and she's also got resurrect so she can do some "recruiting" in the middle of the fight. It was pointed out to me, and I agree, that there's virtually no reason to take berserker as your base class for Mutoids, because if you're going melee, you're definitely going to want Brawler anyway. It was just something I hadn't really thought about when I made this video. If you want the handgun proficiency, you should go with Sniper instead so you also get sniper rifles, then add brawler to that for melee proficiency. But otherwise, I think there's a place for all of the other base classes in your Mutoid builds, depending on what you want to do.
That seems fair, I'd still argue the priest and infiltrator base don't do too much for the mutoid compared with the others though. A multiclassed infiltrator gets the capstone and can put out silly amounts of damage and viral weapons as your only proficiency seems extremely sub-optimal. You've convinced me on the technician though, the capstone isn't great and they can get good additional support abilities as a mutioid. For an ideal team I think you can't lose the assault/infiltrator or assault/berserker, assault/heavies are great too as bombardiers so that leaves the sniper, technician and priest roles uncovered. As I said before I think going for a priest with the third head ability might be good so that would fill out another 2 spots. I'm thinking 2 sniper builds and a dedicated support technician might be what makes an amazing combo. So that would be 4 regular, 4 mutoid soldiers
Awesome video, a nice find. Would love to see a mutoid assault team build, which isnt about capture, but for mission clearing. This first team is really strong though got to say.
Not sure if I will do a video on it, but if I were putting together a mutoid mission team, I'd probably do something like this: 1. Handler - I'd keep the handler concept from this team, but would probably use sniper class for that instead of Priest. Long range weapons would help make up not being affected by its own frenzy. Dash would help here, as well. 2. Breaker - For dealing with armor. Heavy class with the Berserker's Armor Break ability and Boom Blast at level 5. Give him a machine gun and load him up with grenades, (or a grenade launcher), and you've got a great armor shredder. 3. A Screamer - Crowd Control type, probably an Assault with Dash, Psychic Scream and War Cry. Maybe mix in Induce Panic too, just for fun. Plus plenty of defensive abilities since he's going to be in the thick of things 4. Sniper - Dedicated sniper, probably follow most of the sniper abilities. Definitely Quick Aim. 5. Assault - You probably want another assault rifle or shotgun on the team. This would be a fairly straight assault build, but with Quick Aim at level 3 instead of Return Fire. Pandoran abilities to taste, but make sure you have some defensive abilities, (Syphon attack, Pain Chameleon, Regen, or Ignore Pain). 6. Defender - Pretty much the same as from this video. Important things here are Cure Spray for dealing with status effects on your soldiers and being able to put other targets out on the field for the enemy to shoot at. Cure Spray means you can't get Pain Chameleon too, so you probably want either syphon attack or regen
Really great informative content which I've found really useful as I just got and started playing Phoenix Point a few days ago. Small thing though- given the length of the video, would it be possible to add some timestamps with brief descriptions of what it is you are discussing at different points?
I really like the idea of making army of expendable clones. It actually makes the game closer to the original xcom that way. Only issue is that you can't heal them. You can't even cure them of poison, which is an issue. Still, cool soldiers and great if you need some soldiers in an isolated base quickly.
I ran a full playthrough on Legend difficulty using only Mutoids, and honestly, poison wasn't really an issue and neither was their inability to use medkits and stuff. They CAN heal, they just have to do it with the Regeneration and Siphon Attack abilities. If you build them properly, they're super-tanky and very fast. I don't remember how many Mutoids I lost in the playthrough, but it was only like four or five total. And the nice thing is, especially later in the game, if you DO lose one, you can have him replaced with another at max stats pretty much immediately.
@@JericsGamescape Yeah, I discovered that they can get regeneration after writing this when I got enough spare mutagens to start upgrading them. Which is great, because now I can use regeneration cheese.
14:09 "Erm, Double Perception.... uum mediocre... not the best..." Double perception on a sniper means your sniper can overwatch potentially up to 50 squares away which depending on where you place your sniper means it could theoretically hit any enemy on the map that wanders into the open. Your mileage may vary for other classes and the choice of preferred weapons but I've always found Double Perception to be a regular go to option when not building something like an assault where Stomp or Psychic Scream night be tactically more useful.
Yeah, it's a good point you make with the snipers. I also used it on my infiltrator so he could spot things farther away. It has uses, but it's usually not the first thing I look at when picking abilities. But as you say, there are times when it's good.
I'm not sure if you made a mistake or they patched it, but armor break works differently than other abilities, it's +30 per attack, not per projectile. You can turn on detailed weapons stats in the settings and it'll show you this. It's actually more than 30 for some weapons, like PDWs which are 4 round burst, get 8x4 (=32 armor shred). That also means it's not as useless as you mentioned (in the multi class video) for snipers, because it doesn't matter if it's a 12 round burst MG or a single round pistol / sniper, you'll be doing +30 armor shred regardless (within rounding errors, assuming all hit).
Yes, I made the mistake here. It is per attack, not per round. The exception to this is grenades, which do 30 shred on every section they hit (which was what led me to think it was per round). Also, one other thing, the description of Armor Break itself is wrong. It's not +30 shred, it's just 30 shred. So if you're using a weapon that does 10 by itself, it doesn't go to 40, it's just 30.
I really like Mutoids, too. I got a lot of work out of my mutoid team in my playthrough. And next time I do a PP playthrough series, it's probably going to be an all-mutoid run... no humans allowed! :D I'll have to modify the starting parameters a bit so I have the proper technologies and such, but I don't think that's too difficult.
@@JericsGamescapeI’ve made a mutoid capture just like you, but I had to make a few compromises with abilities since I’m playing with the Terror From The Void mod. For example you can’t pick both armor shred and induce panic, so I compromised and picked mind control.
Yes, you have to have that Mutagen economy going, but it's still MUCH easier to get more mutagens than it is to get more SP, especially on Legend difficulty where you're only getting +5 SP per mission. You wouldn't even necessarily have to have 6, and you don't HAVE to give them max stats, (though I would give them at least as much strength as you can afford so they have the best chance of survival). Glad you liked the video! :)
I got a idea for my first mutoid, they’ll use fire and acid worms, resurrection, that holo decoy ability, and their a heavy specialist so they’ll use a grenade launcher and was wondering what you would recommend I also use for my first mutoid?
OK, so if you're using Fire worms, acid worms, and resurrect, then you definitely want siphon attack - you really need some kind of defense on your mutoids because you can't heal them outside of a couple of abilities. To that point, I think you always want at least one of Siphon Attack, Pain Chameleon, and Regeneration. More than one isn't a bad idea. For skills, the only thing really standing out as a must-have with what you said is Boom Blast on the heavy track. That'll reduce the cost of both your grenades (from the GL) and all of your worms (down to 1AP per worm). For your level 2 skill, I'd go for either Armor Break for good shredding on your grenades, or Brawler to give yourself a melee option and to increase the effectiveness of your Siphon attack so you can heal more with it. Level 5 skill I'd take Ignore Pain unless you have a specific burning need for one of the other skills. That lets your mutoid ignore disabled body parts and also prevents him from panicking and being mind controlled. Hope this helps!
I think the problem with mind control is most of the Pandorans start out with SO much willpower. For Mind Control to work, you have to have more will points than the target, and it costs you a number of WP to activate equal to the target's WP plus upkeep each turn depending on the target's size. With a human Priest, you can get the Judgement head mutation which gives +8 WP and you might get lucky enough to pick up one or two traits that give you +2WP each, so you can effectively get to 32WP on a human priest if you happen to catch both traits that give the bonus WP. The Mutoids don't have any of those bonuses, so 20 is the most they can have in WP. That means you're probably only going to be able to really pull off mind controls if you either couple the mind controller with some Psychic Screamers, or if you wait until the targets have lost a lot of WP (virus damage, other targets dying, etc.) before you're going to be able to take control of one. So it's probably not going to do you any good until late in the battle, or you're going to have to dedicate several Mutoids to getting a single mind control off. Now, as always, I caveat this with "this is just my opinion" and you may have ideas that I don't, but that's kind of been my experience with Mind Control. I will say other human soldiers do tend to have a lot less WP, so you might do OK against them with it.
So why don't you like the resist pandoran abilities? Toss a blast resist on them on top of the passive viral resist you get from hecate with ignore pain and the pandas can barely do anything other than acid you.
Yeah, OK, you can go that route for sure. But here's my thoughts: Not many things use fire against you, so fire resistance isn't that useful. Poison resist is OK... It might save you from a Venomous Myrmidon, but you can get a vest that does the same thing if you're worried about it and I think Syphon Attack is a more useful ability. Virus resistance is definitely not worth giving up the other 5th level skills like Regen or Instill Frenzy, I don't think, especially if you do have Ignore Pain or if your soldiers are usually frenzied and won't panic even if they drop to zero WP. On top of that, both Virus and Poison are easily dealt with using Cure Spray, which you're going to want on your team regardless. That's why I'm not a fan of the resistances. If they work for you and your playstyle, that's great. I just personally think you get more mileage out of some of the other skills at those same levels.
They did, there's a line of skills from the Scylla. It's the line with Daze Immunity and Sonic Scream. What I was saying in my video is that you may not have access to it yet when you first get Mutoids unlocked because you have to do an autopsy on a scylla to get access to them, and you may not have run into scyllas yet when you get mutoids because they become available fairly early in the game.
Yeah, for the team I had in mind, those turned out to be really good choices for the Mutoids. The Handler/Team Leader could have been another class, but I thought viral damage might be a nice addition to help the team with the really tough bosses and such. But either way, being able to pick any soldier ability plus adding in the Pandoran abilities as well makes that a lot more feasible to take both Priest and Berserker as your starting mutoid class than it is to multiclass a regular soldier. I have to say when I first looked at Mutoids, I was really not that impressed. But since I've been able to play around with them, I REALLY like them a lot. Thanks for the comment!
“Mind control? Nah, you have to have more wp and a lot of Pandorans start with more wp than your soldiers. Take induce panic instead! You only need to have more wp than Pandorans.” …
Jump does work, but it's a bit limited. It's only good for moving up 1 level, and you can't jump up a level AND over a railing. If the railing isn't there, you can make the jump, or if there's a hole in the floor you can jump up through that, or 1-level cliff (like on the Ancients sites, which tend to have a lot of elevation change), etc.
You're right, you can. I tried it once on a dead Arthron and it didn't work for me, but I probably had something else wrong that I didn't notice. I went back and retested, and it worked. So yes, does actually work on dead Pandorans! Thanks for the comment! Good to get these things straightened out.
why bother if you can have 1 aspida and one technichian with remote control and instantly paralyse 2-3 units in one turn get out without any damage at all
The Technician + Aspida combo is definitely good as a capture team, but there are plenty of situations they're not equipped to handle, too. For example, narrow passages in nests and lairs can present big problems for the Aspida. Also, the Aspida is squishy and easy to hit even from long range, and while the technician can repair it, the incoming damage can become too much to keep up with. Also, you still have to be able to actually get the mission done, whatever it is, which may require more endurance than the Aspida is going to have with its twelve uses of its arms. The Mutoids team, on the other hand, can make use of cover to mitigate incoming damage, and they get access to a lot of special abilities that the human soldiers don't: Regen, Pain Chameleon, Fireworms for use against Spawneries, etc. The Mutoid team is going to get stronger and stronger the more they capture and turn into Mutagens, and like regular soldiers, they have the ability to handle missions well even if they are built as a dedicated capture team. I did a full playthrough using mutiods only on Legend difficulty and it went really well. These guys are really good, despite their drawbacks. The only thing I found that they really can't deal with well is mist. Their only option there is fire and that's a slow and messy way of getting rid of mist.
@@JericsGamescapeQuick question for you Jeric on Mutoids. If someone wanted to get access to level 5 Mutoid abilities like Instill Frenzy, would you need to also go through and choose the characters human skills 1 through 5 before being able to gain access to Instill Frenzy? I'd want that skill as soon as possible. I wouldn't care about the human skills until down the line if that's an option.
@@unstableanimations No, you can skip levels. You do still need to get the XP to get your soldier up to using those levels of skills, but you don't have to fill in all the level 1-4 skills first. But the two skill tracks aren't dependent on each other, and you don't have to have all the previous levels filled in. If you dumped a Mutoid soldier into a training base and got it the XP it needed to be max level, you could just give it instill frenzy immediately and nothing else, if that's what you wanted.
so u pick berserker on mutoid for what? to have acces to melee weapons and pistols? wouldnt just picking sniper be better since u have acces to melee through brawler anyway and u get acces to pistol and sniper rifles? also u dont need melee proficiency for neuralizer soooooooo u basically criple your sodiers by choice
I'm not quite sure what you're asking, I guess. If you're asking how I got all the Mutagens or how I got the guy to max level right away, I used console commands to add resources and add XP to him. That was just so I could showcase the different abilities and such. In a normal game, you'll have to get XP to level your Mutoid just like any other soldier.
You can't "retrain" Mutoids. Once you select their class, that's what they are. Same for purchasing abilities - once you purchase the ability, that's what the Mutoid has. Attributes you can move up and down until you leave that Mutoid's screen, (change to the next soldier, or go back to geoscape, etc.). If you change attributes, then leave the screen, those changes become permanent as well.
Well, it's not XCOM. There aren't mods for weapons, but there are different versions of weapons that have different capabilities - some have better range and accuracy, others have better damage. Some pierce armor, some shred armor. You can also improve (or reduce) accuracy with different suits of armor - The sniper suits increase accuracy but have lighter protection. The heavy suits reduce accuracy but provide a lot of protection, etc. Then there are also mutations and bionics that can alter things like speed and accuracy as well, and some skills do too (Master Marksman, for instance). There is plenty of variation you can get in the weaponry. It's just a different mechanic than what XCOM uses.
Super helpful, thanks! You've persuaded me to turn on the Corrupted DLC so I can try mutoids.
I know its a game balance thing to limit the total allowed augments and remove the ability to add those to mutoids but god damn was it badass in XCOM Enemy Within to have a fully gene modded solider that also had psionic powers.
Oh yeah, that's a great game and you could do a lot of cool stuff like that. I did a playthrough where I used all mechanized soldiers - it was like the game was on easy mode. They get to be so powerful in the end, especially when you get Jellied Elerium flamers. Meld was a problem, I couldn't get the whole squad up to level 3 mechanicals, but they still just glided through the last mission.
As for the Mutoids, I think they're balanced fairly well. After finishing my full mutoid-only playthrough, the biggest thing I noticed that they really just can't deal with at all is mist. With no head-mounted gear available, they can't have mist repellers and they don't have any abilities, (other than maybe fireworms), that get rid of it. Most of the time it's not an issue but against certain enemies it can be a big pain. Otherwise I think they have an answer to pretty much everything, even with the limitations they have. It was a lot of fun doing mutoids-only!
Best PP content on YT. Keep up the great work. Subbed.
Thank you, Manny! Very kind. Glad to have you on board!
You seem to be the only person I've encountered who praise these guys ;)
I think people get upset because they don't have the level 7 soldier skills and that makes them "worthless." Also bringing them on missions takes away skill points from your human soldiers. But they're not worthless, they're extremely good. I've got a full playthrough series here on UA-cam that I'm about wrapping up that is mutoids only, no human soldiers, and they've performed incredibly well through the whole game. Skillpoints aren't a problem for them because they use mutagens to buy attributes and skills. Training time isn't a problem, either. With a proper training base with like 4 training facilities, you can get a brand new Mutoid soldier to max level in about two days, and 720 mutagens gets him max stats and all skills. You can't do that with humans because even if you put them in the training facility, they're only going to get 120 SP, and they need to get the rest either from the general pool or by grinding through missions. Lose a level 7 human soldier, that's a huge hit. If you lose a 5th level mutoid, you can replace him completely in a couple of days. I wasn't kidding in the video when I said I was skeptical at first, but I've run almost an entire game with only using them and they're really good.
Very interesting analysis, you focused on something I didn't even think about, fielding full teams instead of using them to fill gaps in existing ones (of regular soldiers). There's probably an optimal way to mix and match but until I play this DLC I can only speculate on it. With that in mind I was looking at the Pandoran skills and giving more weight to the ones not available to regular soldiers by any other means (items, mutations or bionics), I totally agree about your points on the launch worm abilities but I think you may be overlooking some like double perception for a reaction build (sniper, extreme focus, return fire or something). I was going to disagree about frenzy and psychic scream due to them being available to regular priests but then realised they're mutually exclusive so this is a major advantage to the mutoid over them, now I'm thinking combining a regular priest with the 3rd head to further synergise might be interesting. Also I think the passives of the base 3 classes are probably better than the berserker or the 3 other advanced because brawler gives melee proficiency and you gain access to more equipment per soldier with assault, sniper and heavy and the others probably benefit more from multiclassing. Finally the missing capstone abilities are of benefit to some classes (sniper) and detriment to others (assault), so it's probably worth replacing the former with mutoids who can benefit from cherry picking off other class and pandoran skills more than they'd lose out on with skills like adrenaline rush and rapid clearance.
I think the base class you need depends greatly on what you're doing with your Mutoid. For instance, in my playthrough, I've got a Mutoid soldier that focuses a lot on adding firepower to the field. One of the primary ways of doing that is turrets, so I made her a technician base so she could throw them and remotely activate them. She's also got worms with boom blast (which does lower the cost to launch worms to 1), and she's also got resurrect so she can do some "recruiting" in the middle of the fight.
It was pointed out to me, and I agree, that there's virtually no reason to take berserker as your base class for Mutoids, because if you're going melee, you're definitely going to want Brawler anyway. It was just something I hadn't really thought about when I made this video. If you want the handgun proficiency, you should go with Sniper instead so you also get sniper rifles, then add brawler to that for melee proficiency. But otherwise, I think there's a place for all of the other base classes in your Mutoid builds, depending on what you want to do.
That seems fair, I'd still argue the priest and infiltrator base don't do too much for the mutoid compared with the others though. A multiclassed infiltrator gets the capstone and can put out silly amounts of damage and viral weapons as your only proficiency seems extremely sub-optimal. You've convinced me on the technician though, the capstone isn't great and they can get good additional support abilities as a mutioid.
For an ideal team I think you can't lose the assault/infiltrator or assault/berserker, assault/heavies are great too as bombardiers so that leaves the sniper, technician and priest roles uncovered. As I said before I think going for a priest with the third head ability might be good so that would fill out another 2 spots. I'm thinking 2 sniper builds and a dedicated support technician might be what makes an amazing combo. So that would be 4 regular, 4 mutoid soldiers
Awesome video, a nice find. Would love to see a mutoid assault team build, which isnt about capture, but for mission clearing. This first team is really strong though got to say.
Not sure if I will do a video on it, but if I were putting together a mutoid mission team, I'd probably do something like this:
1. Handler - I'd keep the handler concept from this team, but would probably use sniper class for that instead of Priest. Long range weapons would help make up not being affected by its own frenzy. Dash would help here, as well.
2. Breaker - For dealing with armor. Heavy class with the Berserker's Armor Break ability and Boom Blast at level 5. Give him a machine gun and load him up with grenades, (or a grenade launcher), and you've got a great armor shredder.
3. A Screamer - Crowd Control type, probably an Assault with Dash, Psychic Scream and War Cry. Maybe mix in Induce Panic too, just for fun. Plus plenty of defensive abilities since he's going to be in the thick of things
4. Sniper - Dedicated sniper, probably follow most of the sniper abilities. Definitely Quick Aim.
5. Assault - You probably want another assault rifle or shotgun on the team. This would be a fairly straight assault build, but with Quick Aim at level 3 instead of Return Fire. Pandoran abilities to taste, but make sure you have some defensive abilities, (Syphon attack, Pain Chameleon, Regen, or Ignore Pain).
6. Defender - Pretty much the same as from this video. Important things here are Cure Spray for dealing with status effects on your soldiers and being able to put other targets out on the field for the enemy to shoot at. Cure Spray means you can't get Pain Chameleon too, so you probably want either syphon attack or regen
Really great informative content which I've found really useful as I just got and started playing Phoenix Point a few days ago. Small thing though- given the length of the video, would it be possible to add some timestamps with brief descriptions of what it is you are discussing at different points?
Glad you enjoyed the video. I've added a few chapter markers, as suggested.
I really like the idea of making army of expendable clones. It actually makes the game closer to the original xcom that way.
Only issue is that you can't heal them. You can't even cure them of poison, which is an issue. Still, cool soldiers and great if you need some soldiers in an isolated base quickly.
I ran a full playthrough on Legend difficulty using only Mutoids, and honestly, poison wasn't really an issue and neither was their inability to use medkits and stuff. They CAN heal, they just have to do it with the Regeneration and Siphon Attack abilities. If you build them properly, they're super-tanky and very fast. I don't remember how many Mutoids I lost in the playthrough, but it was only like four or five total. And the nice thing is, especially later in the game, if you DO lose one, you can have him replaced with another at max stats pretty much immediately.
@@JericsGamescape Yeah, I discovered that they can get regeneration after writing this when I got enough spare mutagens to start upgrading them. Which is great, because now I can use regeneration cheese.
14:09 "Erm, Double Perception.... uum mediocre... not the best..."
Double perception on a sniper means your sniper can overwatch potentially up to 50 squares away which depending on where you place your sniper means it could theoretically hit any enemy on the map that wanders into the open. Your mileage may vary for other classes and the choice of preferred weapons but I've always found Double Perception to be a regular go to option when not building something like an assault where Stomp or Psychic Scream night be tactically more useful.
Yeah, it's a good point you make with the snipers. I also used it on my infiltrator so he could spot things farther away. It has uses, but it's usually not the first thing I look at when picking abilities. But as you say, there are times when it's good.
I'm not sure if you made a mistake or they patched it, but armor break works differently than other abilities, it's +30 per attack, not per projectile. You can turn on detailed weapons stats in the settings and it'll show you this. It's actually more than 30 for some weapons, like PDWs which are 4 round burst, get 8x4 (=32 armor shred). That also means it's not as useless as you mentioned (in the multi class video) for snipers, because it doesn't matter if it's a 12 round burst MG or a single round pistol / sniper, you'll be doing +30 armor shred regardless (within rounding errors, assuming all hit).
Yes, I made the mistake here. It is per attack, not per round. The exception to this is grenades, which do 30 shred on every section they hit (which was what led me to think it was per round). Also, one other thing, the description of Armor Break itself is wrong. It's not +30 shred, it's just 30 shred. So if you're using a weapon that does 10 by itself, it doesn't go to 40, it's just 30.
Thank you
You're welcome! Glad you enjoyed it!
I’ve fallen in love with Mutoid teams. I literally make a training center to level them without combat and field 8 person teams of them.
I really like Mutoids, too. I got a lot of work out of my mutoid team in my playthrough. And next time I do a PP playthrough series, it's probably going to be an all-mutoid run... no humans allowed! :D I'll have to modify the starting parameters a bit so I have the proper technologies and such, but I don't think that's too difficult.
@@JericsGamescapeI’ve never used mutoids before. Now I might reconsider.
@@JericsGamescapeI’ve made a mutoid capture just like you, but I had to make a few compromises with abilities since I’m playing with the Terror From The Void mod. For example you can’t pick both armor shred and induce panic, so I compromised and picked mind control.
@@JericsGamescape I have a Mutoid Handler, 2 ranged capture units, 2 melee capture units, and 2 defenders.
@@JericsGamescape I also picked the same classes and abilities as you minus the few compromises with some abilities that I had to make.
Nice bro keep it up 👍👍👍
Thank you! I'm having a good time making these. Glad you're enjoying them, too 👍
Still playing around with how to utilise and build them best. At the moment even fully specced ones are way too fragile for how I use melee fighters
These soldiers are beast but . You better be good at capturing Pandorians!!! Thanks for the video! 💪💪💪💪💪💪
Yes, you have to have that Mutagen economy going, but it's still MUCH easier to get more mutagens than it is to get more SP, especially on Legend difficulty where you're only getting +5 SP per mission. You wouldn't even necessarily have to have 6, and you don't HAVE to give them max stats, (though I would give them at least as much strength as you can afford so they have the best chance of survival). Glad you liked the video! :)
I got a idea for my first mutoid, they’ll use fire and acid worms, resurrection, that holo decoy ability, and their a heavy specialist so they’ll use a grenade launcher and was wondering what you would recommend I also use for my first mutoid?
OK, so if you're using Fire worms, acid worms, and resurrect, then you definitely want siphon attack - you really need some kind of defense on your mutoids because you can't heal them outside of a couple of abilities. To that point, I think you always want at least one of Siphon Attack, Pain Chameleon, and Regeneration. More than one isn't a bad idea. For skills, the only thing really standing out as a must-have with what you said is Boom Blast on the heavy track. That'll reduce the cost of both your grenades (from the GL) and all of your worms (down to 1AP per worm). For your level 2 skill, I'd go for either Armor Break for good shredding on your grenades, or Brawler to give yourself a melee option and to increase the effectiveness of your Siphon attack so you can heal more with it. Level 5 skill I'd take Ignore Pain unless you have a specific burning need for one of the other skills. That lets your mutoid ignore disabled body parts and also prevents him from panicking and being mind controlled. Hope this helps!
@@JericsGamescape would mind control be a good option?
I think the problem with mind control is most of the Pandorans start out with SO much willpower. For Mind Control to work, you have to have more will points than the target, and it costs you a number of WP to activate equal to the target's WP plus upkeep each turn depending on the target's size. With a human Priest, you can get the Judgement head mutation which gives +8 WP and you might get lucky enough to pick up one or two traits that give you +2WP each, so you can effectively get to 32WP on a human priest if you happen to catch both traits that give the bonus WP. The Mutoids don't have any of those bonuses, so 20 is the most they can have in WP. That means you're probably only going to be able to really pull off mind controls if you either couple the mind controller with some Psychic Screamers, or if you wait until the targets have lost a lot of WP (virus damage, other targets dying, etc.) before you're going to be able to take control of one. So it's probably not going to do you any good until late in the battle, or you're going to have to dedicate several Mutoids to getting a single mind control off. Now, as always, I caveat this with "this is just my opinion" and you may have ideas that I don't, but that's kind of been my experience with Mind Control. I will say other human soldiers do tend to have a lot less WP, so you might do OK against them with it.
Hi nice guide , is there a mod you use for colored icons on soldiers?
Exelent.
It is a really good and informative Video... But... Sometimes i wish you would come to rhe point...
But respect for your knowledge 😉😊
So why don't you like the resist pandoran abilities? Toss a blast resist on them on top of the passive viral resist you get from hecate with ignore pain and the pandas can barely do anything other than acid you.
Yeah, OK, you can go that route for sure. But here's my thoughts: Not many things use fire against you, so fire resistance isn't that useful. Poison resist is OK... It might save you from a Venomous Myrmidon, but you can get a vest that does the same thing if you're worried about it and I think Syphon Attack is a more useful ability. Virus resistance is definitely not worth giving up the other 5th level skills like Regen or Instill Frenzy, I don't think, especially if you do have Ignore Pain or if your soldiers are usually frenzied and won't panic even if they drop to zero WP. On top of that, both Virus and Poison are easily dealt with using Cure Spray, which you're going to want on your team regardless. That's why I'm not a fan of the resistances. If they work for you and your playstyle, that's great. I just personally think you get more mileage out of some of the other skills at those same levels.
“The Lost” are from Xcom bro, I think you mean “The Forsaken”.
Yes, you're right. Crossed wires a bit there.
Why they don't do set of pandoran skills for Scylla? I'd like to see this =/
They did, there's a line of skills from the Scylla. It's the line with Daze Immunity and Sonic Scream. What I was saying in my video is that you may not have access to it yet when you first get Mutoids unlocked because you have to do an autopsy on a scylla to get access to them, and you may not have run into scyllas yet when you get mutoids because they become available fairly early in the game.
Berserker and Priest, looks like what Anu could have been with aid of technology.
Yeah, for the team I had in mind, those turned out to be really good choices for the Mutoids. The Handler/Team Leader could have been another class, but I thought viral damage might be a nice addition to help the team with the really tough bosses and such. But either way, being able to pick any soldier ability plus adding in the Pandoran abilities as well makes that a lot more feasible to take both Priest and Berserker as your starting mutoid class than it is to multiclass a regular soldier. I have to say when I first looked at Mutoids, I was really not that impressed. But since I've been able to play around with them, I REALLY like them a lot. Thanks for the comment!
“Mind control? Nah, you have to have more wp and a lot of Pandorans start with more wp than your soldiers. Take induce panic instead! You only need to have more wp than Pandorans.”
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Is this Jump ability from level 1 buged ???? I do it on a sniper mutoid for high advantage but it doenst Work in battle?????
Jump does work, but it's a bit limited. It's only good for moving up 1 level, and you can't jump up a level AND over a railing. If the railing isn't there, you can make the jump, or if there's a hole in the floor you can jump up through that, or 1-level cliff (like on the Ancients sites, which tend to have a lot of elevation change), etc.
I'm pretty sure i used ressurect on triton and arthron corpses. Did they change it?
You're right, you can. I tried it once on a dead Arthron and it didn't work for me, but I probably had something else wrong that I didn't notice. I went back and retested, and it worked. So yes, does actually work on dead Pandorans! Thanks for the comment! Good to get these things straightened out.
can you recover these guys' health in med bays of the battlefield?
No, you have to pay mutagens to heal them on the Geoscape. It's the same as healing corruption, it's 25 - 100 depending on how hurt they are.
Handsome lads.
why bother if you can have 1 aspida and one technichian with remote control and instantly paralyse 2-3 units in one turn
get out without any damage at all
The Technician + Aspida combo is definitely good as a capture team, but there are plenty of situations they're not equipped to handle, too. For example, narrow passages in nests and lairs can present big problems for the Aspida. Also, the Aspida is squishy and easy to hit even from long range, and while the technician can repair it, the incoming damage can become too much to keep up with. Also, you still have to be able to actually get the mission done, whatever it is, which may require more endurance than the Aspida is going to have with its twelve uses of its arms. The Mutoids team, on the other hand, can make use of cover to mitigate incoming damage, and they get access to a lot of special abilities that the human soldiers don't: Regen, Pain Chameleon, Fireworms for use against Spawneries, etc. The Mutoid team is going to get stronger and stronger the more they capture and turn into Mutagens, and like regular soldiers, they have the ability to handle missions well even if they are built as a dedicated capture team. I did a full playthrough using mutiods only on Legend difficulty and it went really well. These guys are really good, despite their drawbacks. The only thing I found that they really can't deal with well is mist. Their only option there is fire and that's a slow and messy way of getting rid of mist.
@@JericsGamescapeQuick question for you Jeric on Mutoids. If someone wanted to get access to level 5 Mutoid abilities like Instill Frenzy, would you need to also go through and choose the characters human skills 1 through 5 before being able to gain access to Instill Frenzy? I'd want that skill as soon as possible. I wouldn't care about the human skills until down the line if that's an option.
@@unstableanimations No, you can skip levels. You do still need to get the XP to get your soldier up to using those levels of skills, but you don't have to fill in all the level 1-4 skills first. But the two skill tracks aren't dependent on each other, and you don't have to have all the previous levels filled in. If you dumped a Mutoid soldier into a training base and got it the XP it needed to be max level, you could just give it instill frenzy immediately and nothing else, if that's what you wanted.
so u pick berserker on mutoid for what? to have acces to melee weapons and pistols? wouldnt just picking sniper be better since u have acces to melee through brawler anyway and u get acces to pistol and sniper rifles? also u dont need melee proficiency for neuralizer soooooooo u basically criple your sodiers by choice
Yeah, probably wasn't the best choice, in retrospect.
How to rewind all that skill?
I'm not quite sure what you're asking, I guess. If you're asking how I got all the Mutagens or how I got the guy to max level right away, I used console commands to add resources and add XP to him. That was just so I could showcase the different abilities and such. In a normal game, you'll have to get XP to level your Mutoid just like any other soldier.
@@JericsGamescape what I mean is how do you restore mutoids whose max level is zero again, aka we can choose again
You can't "retrain" Mutoids. Once you select their class, that's what they are. Same for purchasing abilities - once you purchase the ability, that's what the Mutoid has. Attributes you can move up and down until you leave that Mutoid's screen, (change to the next soldier, or go back to geoscape, etc.). If you change attributes, then leave the screen, those changes become permanent as well.
Not being able add scopes and other mods to equipment and Armour is biggest drawback mind you not finished game
Well, it's not XCOM. There aren't mods for weapons, but there are different versions of weapons that have different capabilities - some have better range and accuracy, others have better damage. Some pierce armor, some shred armor. You can also improve (or reduce) accuracy with different suits of armor - The sniper suits increase accuracy but have lighter protection. The heavy suits reduce accuracy but provide a lot of protection, etc. Then there are also mutations and bionics that can alter things like speed and accuracy as well, and some skills do too (Master Marksman, for instance). There is plenty of variation you can get in the weaponry. It's just a different mechanic than what XCOM uses.
Exelent.