Companies are leaving the cloud?
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- Опубліковано 14 січ 2024
- Article we are discussing: world.hey.com/dhh/the-big-clo...
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#cloud #microsoft #azure #aws #gcp #tech #engineering - Наука та технологія
The big problem with the cloud is most of the decision to migrate is made by business people who just want to migrate because their golf buddy also moved.
😂😂😂😂
And thinking that they will be saving money!
Indeed. ☺☺☺☺
Nailed it.
Golf courses are Mecca for all the terrible business decisions. Channelling all that small ball energy 😂😂
I worked for a company a few years ago, i helped them move everything into the cloud and managed it for about 6 months. Then the owner turned around and let me go. He said since they are no longer hosting equipment then he didn't need me. About 2ish months later he called me begging for me to come back. I told him I would come back for 4x's the pay. Worked for about a year. paid off all debts. paid off my car and credit cards. Then quit.
The best way to use the cloud is NOT to lift and shift your entire datacentre because its not like moving house!!
The cloud has great value if you know how to take advantage of its services. In my opinion the best solution is a hybrid setup of your entire datacentre. Using the cloud for BACKUPS, dISASTER RECOVER, BUSINESS CONTINUITY, FILESERVERS SYNC SERVICE AND WEB APPS might be the best mix of on-premises and cloud structure.
Exactly!! Mostly Redundancy!
That's why I've focused on networking. Be it cloud or on-premises, youre going to have an in-demand skill.
great idea
I always recommend networking to people entering IT!
Forget the compute side of cloud, focus on networking the skills set remains the same, and your skill is still required on-premise.
Facts@@motolaoshin
not "on demand"? :D
As a former Verizon network engineer, and then having done cloud engineering for 2 other companies..
yeah I KNEW this shyt was coming, cuz the monthly bills would be OUTRAGEOUS, and always billed as 'oh,
well WE handle 'maintenance and upgrades'.
Ok great but often the end user is NOT SEEING any of that #1
#2 they would still need an in-house cloud engineer
#3 depending on the contract you have, often your wouldn't get expedient tech support service (as they all claim)
So yeah< THIS WAS COMING! lol no shock here at all.
Ok first of all cloud is growing, check the big 3 last quarterly earnings. 2/where do you get the people to support bringing in house - sorry but they are not out there, and you can’t afford the really good ones. 3/how are you going to manage the constant upgrades, cyber, etc… have you done the true ROI on moving back, no the real,ROI…
if they bill like chatgpt, 12cents per request, costs must be gigantous :D
This is why the traditional sysadmin role will really never truly die. It has evolved but on-prem will never truly vanish. I work in the defense industry as both a Sr. Tech / RHEL Admin as there are still a lot of stuff that will never move to the cloud esp legacy applications. There will always be a need to run some services on prem esp anything that's more data sensitive. Most business today are still Hybrid not fully cloud. AWS is very expensive to run large workloads.
I think this is bang on. A good sysadmin is adaptable and a lot of the skill set is transferrable across architectures.
Couldn’t agree more with this
The unfortunate thing is salary, sysadmin salaries don't seem to have caught up.
@@MadeByGPS yeah unless you specialize. Must Linux Admin that specializes in only Red Hat makes well into 6 figures. Starting average salary is around 78k. I think the Linux guys makes slightly more then the Windows Server Admins.
@@eman0828 Are you able to hire me as a Mid Linux Admin job for 78k? Because I've been looking for a DevOps job for 4 months now and got nothing.
I'm working as architect in APN. The benefit public cloud is related to maintenance.
1. Want to go global deployment quickly
2. Want to handle highly spiking traffic or computing
3. Do not want to manage services like DB and other middleware by ourselves
4. Do not want to rely on people living specific area to manage DC
5. Do not want to negotiate with local providers
If you are not on the list, You are easy to feel Public Cloud is expensive.
Provisioned resources are always cheaper than demanding resources. but can you really utilize them over 50% in 24 hours? and you are increasing cost the hardware and software to run it.
The business man want to scale quickly but DC requires lots of overhead to do it. That is why cloud was so good at start.
If your business is not so growing up quickly and you are already having DC, you might be better to stick to DC.
Most of AWS service are saying ELASTIC including naming service like EC2. It means no elastic no merit for you.
Dropbox is another company that moved off the cloud. They started with AWS but outgrown AWS thus had to build there own Data Centers.
There is absolutely no way that dropbox outgrew AWS, there's another reason they left.
cost
Fomo can be costly indeed.
Business chiefs and strategic architects need to actually do the planning and analysis on what works for their corps and customers...not chasing the shiny or doing what others are doing.
For job seekers, Linux will still be a great entry point into any market.
Linux doesn't care who owns what or where nor the scale or scope.
agreed
This is so true. A strong linux background will carry you through many changes in technology and keep you relevant
When MGM Resorts was rebuilding their post-breach Linux backend, they were seeking to hire short-term Linux admins for $100/hr. The math came out to something like $26,000 over six weeks for continuous long days of rebuilding their architecture.
I say it all the time. Everyone loves the cloud. Until they get that bill. The ultimate benefit of the cloud is flexibility, not cost savings. All the cool kids were doing it so everyone did 'Monkey see, Monkey do' and are now realizing they should never have pushed to the cloud, at least in the way they did.
Right? That reoccurring bill isn't fun...
the cloud is projected to grow by like 5x by 2030. Some companies will go away from cloud, as it does make sense sometimes. But generally, the cloud is coming, and it'll be here to stay. Buy in while you can.
Nonetheless, developing your tech/IT skill set will make you valuable regardless of wherever the infrastructure goes.
Simple as that.
"Buy in while you can?" Until it's too late? What?
@@moe47988 Invest with time by studying it so you can make profit from it.
Let's all just become software engineers and forget the cloud!
It's a joke? Sry Im truly confused 🤔
Then there is ai😂
or SRE's
ur scaring me GPS🤣🤣
Thank you for providing all of the great info you provide!!!
Coming from the security side of the house, the cloud concept of a "Shared Security Model" is under a lot of continual stress.
In the end you have to look at your tradeoffs on increase of capex vs opex and how you would balance your teams around the inevitable upgrades/failures of software, hardware, and facility. I have been on both sides where it made sense to be in the cloud or on premise/hybrid.
My company exec actually though Azure would manage our servers because we migrated them to Azure.
but I have found that the work load actually increased.
At least they would in the realm of possible like PaaS.
@@tcbobb1613 it was a lift and shift.
Even with PaSS the provider doesn't do everything, and what is offloaded comes at a cost.
I'll never be 100% cloud or on-prem. There are use cases for either and I'm always suspicious of anyone who strongly advocates for one or the other. For instance, I'm happy for a generic out of the box finance system with little to no customisation can run SaaS or cloud hosted. An OT control system for running industrial processes I would almost always run on-prem.
The world is complex, problems are complex and simplistic solutions often fall short. There are so many things to consider, like performance, business continuity, integration, data protection, security, scalability etc etc, so any one single methodology is not going to have all the answers. So what I do is look at the workload or business problem, think about how it fits into a customer's overall architecture and build a solution accordingly.
What this means is that the overwhelming majority of my customers run a hybrid architecture and it mostly works.
Cloud was way oversold to a lot of companies. Some sales folks for AWS and Azure getting their bags while some companies literally working backwards and messing up everything by trying to go full on cloud.
It's basically another example of how corporate is a clown show as usual.
People can't afford to pay a business every single month. More so when the price keeps going up and up for features the company is not even using but forced to pay.
Buying Dell servers doesn't lock you in to Dell.
You MUST know that, come on... I just moved a datacenter from Cisco UCS to Dell VxRails - didn't matter, they didn't even run the same type of hypervisor (which would have made the whole thing a breeze).
You can't migrate Azure AWS GCP very easily, you can absolutely move from Dell to HPE or Lenovo or whatever - no issues.
Suppose it’s a company that owns several car dealerships in a big metro area. They have hundreds of employees and the sales, warranty, repairs, parts, and maintenance work all generate data. But their business isn’t data. Data is a byproduct of their business. I could easily see a company like that providing for their own selves instead of dealing with the cloud.
The who selling point of cloud was simplicity and ease of deployment. "WAS".
People have learned to do calculate cost of actual server. AWS is using ARM CPU and renting out for 25x cost?
Hey GPS, I really enjoy your content and advice for breaking through to the cloud. I'm currently an Active Directory engineer and I would love to get your thoughts on AZ-800 & 801 and if these certs can be a good transition to a more cloud based role. Keep up the good work! I really appreciate all of your advice
i see this happening as well, a lot of companies just finding to expensive in the public cloud. where i am from its because they lift and shifted, they didn't re-architect for the cloud - so yeah its more expensive than it needs to be.
So is there any point learning the cloud at all? I’ve only just started getting into it.
Learn to create your own cloud (buy hardware and assemble your owm server) and learn system administration (Windows Server and Linux). Then learn virtualization (Qemu) and install as many systems as you want. These are some of the abilities the market is demanding and will keep demanding for a while
Interesting point on traffic. Without too many details I can tell you that in publishing if you're lift-and-shift and have gigantic data storage bare metal is cheaper, especially the main benefit of the cloud - delivery - can be sorted out, again cheaper, directly with edge providers.
2:00 vendor lockin with servers isn't really a thing if you are in a hypervisor environment. Now you can definitely argue that you can get locked in with VMware however. Another part is the majority of the talent you would find to support your infrastructure is likely familiar with DELL(or HP) hardware and VMware's enterprise offerings.
I didn't even think about the vmware vendor lock-in, great insight.
I can tell you that SysAdmins everywhere are worried about the fate of VMWare and where they are headed. There is a massive lock-in with VMWare. The industry should have been backing open Hypervisors and open Virtual Machine Environments like the ones used in The Cloud like Xen etc. @@MadeByGPS
@@MadeByGPS VMware vendor lockin is limited, if you are using VMware, you are most likely using a backup/DR solution like Veeam, Acronis or Zerto. Which are all Hypervisor agnostic. You can simply replicate to the target Hypervisor and move on.
I think the Dell comment is fair but also if designed correctly those compute nodes shouldn’t make a difference who they come from.
Compute, storage and network should be commodity if you have that design principle then it doesn’t matter if it’s HPE, Dell, Lenovo etc.
I think the important part is independence does mean you have control but it also means you are now in charge of a lot more, you have to keep the lights on, you have to update, you have to protect your data etc. (you have to protect data in the cloud as well)
I came across this same article and thought it was interesting. I do think upper management often does promote the cloud as savings in some area. If its labor, hardware\datacenter costs or whatever. They have the past precloud numbers and see the monthly cloud bills so they know. Believe a lot of it is just optics. If they are saying we are saving money and can sell that idea, that is all that they need. I dont care either way, I will just keep on building skills.
That "I'll keep building skills" part 👏
Super smart conversation.
Thank You !!! ,
24:17 The idea that using the Cloud for everything would be simpler was definitely the way it was marketed to my company. Instead, after three years, we have 5 full-time contractors still working on the switch and doing the maintenance.
My question is this. How will you adapt AI to your business practices without a cloud provider?
I read this article, and I love the movement! Repatriation, and lean cloud !
On the real, I don't think cloud services were supposed to provide some permanence in how we host application. Scale will always rule, and pricing issues are big part of the scaling question. Cloud CAN be a near permanent solution for companies that are not fiercely chasing growth (yes, those actually exist) and /or have their monthly cost outcomes in some predictable form.
The last line of this video…..
This is exactly what I do.
My question to you is, what do we call this role/job?
I’m constantly trying to define this very task to people and I struggle. Is it an infrastructure strategist? Maybe a FinOps thought leader? Your suggestions would be welcomed.
If you have read more of the article it covers it. Under Did you factor in what it costs to replace your servers later?
he spent $600,000 buying a ton of new servers and wants to get at least 5 years of service out of it and calculated the cost over 5 years. So they are using planning for the long term. For data center costs they probably have one in Chicago or in the state of Illinois
so, it probably not insanely expensive, and they do not need an expense one due to compliance reasons.
We read the entire article, still doesn't mention total cost in comparison to savings.
@@MadeByGPS - Yup! Plenty of people have asked the cost of both the CAPEX and OPEX and it has been met with silence. Sure, it might work out very well if you have an extremely competent team who can run lean but I feel it almost just breaks even with the cost of running in the cloud.
I feel like people misunderstand an obvious concept while calculating cost: Total cost of ownership. So like, what about all this effort to migeate and operate on-premise? Why is that never mentioned in the cost equation? I think people thinking datacenters are cheaper than the Cloud have never come close to managing and operating a datacenter.
Notice this is happening after the biggest on prem software ever created in vmware was sold. They are going to make so much money off of the migration back to on prem. Did Dell make the right decision to sale? It's a huge bet against leaving the cloud vs further adoption.
I guess were are going to be seeing more hybrid infrastructures moving forward
Time to switch careers!
Where?
Bhai yr kya chlra cloud ka scene
I've just started to learn cloud / devops. Should I continue or not :(
I see Azure be survivor if there was a Cloud Apocalypses. At least Learn Azure and MS365.
Same here! 😅
@@coachmw83no dont. Wait a year for me to get a job.
Learn Software Engineering and you can adapt into any tech field.
@@cyberlion7900 i think networking is also good to learn as well
As an investor, my question is which companies will benefit and which ones will be harmed.
If cloud becomes cheaper, guess who's coming back!
In vfx here. Theres a big pull back from the cloud
Cloud : Operations/Infra :: trendy framework : software dev
I'd want to see the originally TBA who sold them the package.
Like what did that cost benefit analysis (over time) REALLY lol In relation to hardware and all its CAPEX.
I dead azz, wanna see those original CBA.
lmfao..Then they were probably UPSELLING dafuq out of the contract,
having them buy useless services and packages. and NOT optimizing its monthly bill.
**Yes, the 'money people' very rarely well-informed in how cloud services are billed. **
Cloud makes sense for companies with constant/steady growth. stagnation will yield in cloud bill always eating away at profits.
Like you stated serverless isnt a mandatory thing to make an application run proficient..
Its a marketing ploy to have you thinking you NEED cloud, to service your clients.
Most software companies, arent in that range. lol
Hilarious
I guess im not getting my Cloud+
You Gen-Z'ers really don't know that a "Dell" Server just means there's a Dell logo on the case? They're not MacBook Airs where you're locked into the vendor or purchase time config.
Cloud is someone others' computer.
With k3s or nomad you can really setup your own cloud though data centers.
The wrong point here is to propagate the own dell servers.
Thats not the point IMHO.
The made their situation now they must deal with it. Shout out to 36 Signals!
The ignorance about on-premise and bare metal server is unbelievable. Do you know how powerful a $5,000 bare metal server vs a $1,000/mo. cloud VM server? At this config, the bare metal server will run circles on your cloud VM. Many don't know that tools available for cloud are available for bare metal because both uses Linux at most use cases. The difference I see is that people think on-premise is not sexy.
I work as developer/consultant for small rural Telcos in PH where internet is still not stable (fiber cut is an ordinary thing), I have to roll my own Linux server. But I use cloud ($24/mo.) to backup the database. As long as a good UPS is in place, most of my severs have uptimes of more than 300 days (before reset). This means modern servers are reliable with proper configuration.
yeah, but that's not the comparison most companies are making.
will be following this…. very curious about how the repatriation goes
Just starting to learn cloud and now this 😂. What is there to learn than? AI
Learn Python and you can fit in anywhere
Networking Or Secuitry seems to be the most safe no matter Cloud and On-prem.
@@tcbobb1613 we got to all remember that when you get into tech you are now on into a learning Career. The amount of reading and studying we all have to do for exceeds any other industry. So if you getting into tech, fall inlove with learning and changing and your boss never appreciating the sacrifice you make to learn what you know today. Therefore love what you do and you will see your career go far. If you playing it safe or doing it for the money you will stagnate and not excel. Learn to code, learn linux, learn networking and most of all learn how to change swiftly. This in my opinion is the foundations of tech that I haven't seen changed over the years.
@@tcbobb1613 lmao, and then I ask someone else and they say networking has taken a back seat to cloud. its a mess trying to figure out what to do nowadays.
Continuing learning the cloud. Don't let anyone discourage you.
Good luck finding enough people to run a data center and run security updates and patches or WAF or cloudflare or whatsoever. Also bringing in a dev journey that would make it possible for others to jump in. AWS also comes with AI services. So good luck leaving the cloud. You will regret it although of course it comes with downsides beeing cloud locked.
who are you talking to?
What and absurd... startups - cloud because they get a lot of credits. This should never be considered as option. Look at your business plan, how much customers you generate and how much cloud resources they likely to consume. Don't commit to cloud because you get something free. Later on cloud vendor will lock you and cost of leaving will be greater than you anticipate.
Cheaper until they go global.
Cloud isn't the problem. You can keep a budget, use basic service's, make your own tooling and be fine. The cost to properly run a data center is nuch higher.
After reading the article, they have moved to a "hybrid" cloud model rather than "leaving the cloud". So they have not exited the cloud. They have procured hardware upfront and will have full Ops costs based on the Hardware purchased rather than what is used.They also will not have access to certain tooling available from hyper scalers and also are limited to 384TB of NVMe storage, which they have to manage, backup and increase in a manner where they will have wasted storage (unused) whilst utilising storage over time. I also don't see anything regarding Ingress or Egress costs in terms of Deft's services?
Cloud Repatriation?
yall will never allow to own one computer,come on
what
LMAO 🤣 yeah right
I sure hope so, I hate the fucking cloud.
Stick the kubernetes up your Yaml files
I would leave this company immediately and find alternative employment - backwards thinking and management that don't learn and stuck in their ways. I wonder how much Dell gave them a discount on the first set of servers to keep the dying giant relevant
True. This is network companies planned propaganda. We know onprem orgs like Cisco are desperate ti stay relevant. Look at their poor excuse of a cloud exam. The new cisco ENCC exam. A few months in and theres no books or any kinds of courses or readings for this 'certification'. There are also lots of small orgs that cant handle onprem.
ask them to guy and buy 400 servers and 20 Palo FW.. and wait for 12 months to get it delivered if you are lucky
Nobody is leaving the cloud