5 AWFUL MOVES IN SMASH
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- Опубліковано 10 лип 2024
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If I do a part 2, what moves do you think I should feature?
Pac up tilt, ZSS f smash, Wario d smash, so-po up b, Mac aerial's 💀
Shulk jab is probably the worst jab in the game. It is still a jab though so still useful. Ken heavy side tilt is actually useless, if you see it the Ken probably did a misinput
Falcon punch, Ganon’s up tilt, Yoshi’s side B, Megaman’s D smash, Shulk’s jab and MORE
Yoshi's Side B. That is a detriment with little pay out.
Pit Ftilt.
Zelda's dair isn't bad. It is a kill confirm on grounded opponents and its pretty effective at gimping opponents as it's active for 10 frames. It's also one of zelda's safer landing aerials.
Zelda's really bad move is up smash. Think mewtwo without a body launcher and doesn't hit battlefield platforms. A lot of characters low profile the move. Mario can stand under it and link's shoulders are below the move as well. The only thing it's good at is catching jump from ledge and a poorly spaced roll in.
Not to mention it's pretty inconsistent OOS and is also incredibly unsafe on whiff/shield. You could even make a case for her nair being comparatively worse than her dair
i just started playing zelda for fun and mannn she has a lot of terrible moves 😂 but it’s been super fun to try to optimize her
Also there's no sourspot on the clean hit on frame 14, I don't know why he said you need to hit the "closest range hitbox", they are two but they have the exact same properties.
@@lloydaran which is pretty funny because it looks like he hits his "sour spot" at around 2:21 but it does sweet spot damage. Not sure why he thought testing at maximum staleness makes for a good demonstration either.
The moves in this video are all extremely useless, and then there's Zelda down air.
I would argue Inkling up tilt ain't that Bad either, it does combo actually into nair chains and it Can be comboed into from other moves decently.
Yoshi egg roll is the worst. I would actually prefer he had no side B...because sometimes I use egg roll by accident and it will get you punished.
It can be used to get a guaranteed shield break in certain situations
it’s not bad it’s just decent
it has crazy applications with egged opponents, and for breaking shields
Yoshi's egg roll is awful, even if it has some niche uses. It got some attention for being able to set up shield breaks at a ledge, but realistically you'd have to be pretty lucky to actually find a scenario where it works (enemy positioning, lots of startup).
Honestly, I believe the move isn't inherently bad in its concept. A fast, continuous, and redirectable hitbox is actually quite good. But unfortunately, all the little drawbacks of the move come together to make it bad, and if even a single one of them was removed, the move could be good. One example out of MANY: it does pretty much nothing when used in the air, and is a common way to SD when misinputted offstage. Most other mobile side B's (minecart, roller, clown kart, bike) give forward momentum and let you jump out of it without using a double jump (Spin dash does use a double jump, but that move is broken enough for every other reason). If nothing else was changed, and egg roll was given even just one of those two things (forward momentum or a jump cancel), it would suddenly go from being a death sentence to becoming a very good recovery/disadvantage tool.
It could also have just ONE of the following: less cancel lag, a forward launch angle, a faster rehit rate, less startup, armor, a hitbox when started in the air, more knockback, etc, etc. and the move would be some level of decent/good.
At this point though, I guess the dev team understands that Yoshi is seriously good enough and doesn't actually need a good side B, possibly that it would actually be kind of broken if he did, and seem intent on keeping it a For Fun Party Game move lol.
shield break setup tho
Pretty sure you completely messed up Zelda
She doesn't have a spike hitbox and a non-spike, it's a whole spike hitbox that continues to send downwards even during the sourspot, and it lasts a total of 11 frames
So I have no idea who this move could ever be considered bad, aside from the fact that it's a little slow
Where’s falcon punch, Yoshi rolling egg, Ganon’s up tilt, mega man’s down smash etc ?????
Mega Man dsmash hits below ledge and is his strongest shield break punish, as well as just being one of the strongest dsmashes in the game in general
mega mans down smash is powerful and hits below ledge, not a bad move at all, the only character with a bad downsmash is prob wario
Wario down smash better be in this video
what I love about this move is how gluto throws it like once every three months and it works lmao. Still trash
Worst move in the game
If you're looking to do another video like this, as a puff main I would say puff's down tilt is actually her worst move (other than up throw I guess). Most people think it's rollout, but rollout is surprisingly hard to punish and has some niche techchase applications on fd, town, and kalos. Her downtilt is frame 10, which is only four frames slower than her downsmash. It has low range, -10 on shield, and it doesn't hit below ledge. It's really unusable outside of the pacman matchup as it sends hydrant at a good angle. If you're in a spot where downtilt can hit at ledge, downsmash and grounded pound are always better for hitting ledge, and on stage puff nair + jumpsquat is frame 9 and puff dair + jumpsquat is frame 10.
Really good video, btw!
Kinda suprised it wasn’t here but ALL OF ROBINS tilts are so bad
Deadass forget their tilts exists , that's how bad they are 😭
I mean down tilt is kinda usable but yea not really in like a you ever want to use it kinda way
I hard disagree
Up tilt is great
Dtilt it a solid poke
I think Palutena has some pretty garbage tilts as well.
@@UltraThroatKickat least they kill
Fake list, doesn't include Volcano Kick
The reason you’re not getting combos from inkling up tilt is because you’re not using the right combo move. You’re trying to use up air, when nair combos super well out of it.
I don't know what this up tilt is doing on this list when Ganondorf's is like 100× worse. Hell even Inkling's down air is worse, should've replaced Zelda's
@@edward8380 Tbh, I think this list could’ve been solely ganondorf moves
@@furret4150Hot take: Ganondorf's moves are pretty good in a vacuum, with only 2 awful moves (neutral b and up tilt). He sucks because of his recovery, big hurtbox, bad OOS, and slow speed, not because of his overall moveset (although they could have better frame data overall)
@@edward8380 I think overall the frame data on his moves is just bad. Of course, some are a lot worse than others. But I just think way too many of them can be reacted to with ease. As an Isabelle main, I know how much it sucks for bad frame data like that, because her grab takes ten years to come out.
@@furret4150 Other characters have comparable frame data to Ganon, but I think it's easier to react to his moves than those characters mostly because of his inability to approach, which I think is the fault of his mobility and not his moveset. That's part of the reason why I said "in a vacuum", since other characters who have better range and mobility would be perfectly fine with his moveset.
And besides, there are more to moves than just pure frame data. Even his slower moves, like his smash attacks or f-air are still used more often than most moves on the list, even if their frame data isn't amazing
Pacman up tilt...
Tea has made some use out of it but it is bad
It’s not that bad, it has some combo extension potential
It’s pretty bad, but can be an occasional good combo extender/starter
This
Zelda’s down-air is really good wtf Dabuz
I've gotta disagree with Hero's up smash. The fact that it has the potential to crit, combined with the rest of his kit makes it lethal on platform stages when he hits a snooze while their on a platform. Combined with psychup and or oomph it can potentially kill at insanely low percents, and it absolutely has a use case. Although niche, when pulled off there is potentially massive upside whereas the rest of these moves when pulled off have essentially no upside
That's true, but it barely matters with a hitbox that bad
Samus up smash. Sure it's good when it hits. But it is so inconsistent connecting that it is isn't even worth using it most of the time. Some characters cannot even be hit with it. Sad considering how similar it is to Mii Gunner up smash. A move that is actually amazing and actually works.
yeah there's something wrong with the up-smashes in this game. I remember how they mostly tried to fix Falco and Falcon's up smash back then, it was kinda fine even if it's still jank sometimes. But Samus' is the worst, this shit misses so often it's tragic.
Yes it's inconsistent, but she kinda has to use it for anti airs anyway
@@edward8380 It sucks as an anti air. It loses to disjointed moves and trades badly with other ones. It's a read coverage type of move.
@@mir8651 I'm not arguing it's good at all, but many zoners have to anti air jumps whenever their opponent jumps over their projectile, and her other moves don't really do that. But yeah, it losing to other moves sucks, I agree
@@edward8380 she has fair/upair for that anti air. Up smash is for the purposes I mentioned. If it was one hit it would be nice. Or even something like Gunner up smash which is awesome.
You can combo off of inkling uptilt, it may not be realistic in a match, or at least certain characters, but it CAN work
I'm no Inkling player, but shouldn't he be using n-air instead of up air to follow up?
Marcina Dash Attack
You can combo sour fair into sweet spot DA with Marth at least. And at least it kills on Marth. But yeah on Lucina its actually garbage
Lucina's Dash attack is TRASH. At least Marth's can kill and is a combo finisher in his kit. It's also good for tech chases at high percents but that's it. Still bad but not nearly as trash as Lucina's
Amazed he didn't mention Ganon once. Like bro Warlock Punch and Up-tilt lmao. Everybody has seen some cheese online with these but I'm pretty sure they're considered the worst moves in their respective categories. Falcon Punch too to some extent.
Fun fact: If you don't reverse Warlock Punch, it kills later than a non-reversed Falcon Punch because the angle it sends at is easier to DI. I seriously don't know why Nintendo hasn't replaced the move since Melee
Just peach up tilt/ftilt like we consider these moves as taunts that's how useless they are
Tbh they're bad but they're not unusable. Mute's been using them as anti-airs for certain situations or mus
@@Eggss_B why would you use up tilt or ftilt as anti air when you have the litteraly best anti air move in the game wich is up air that is also a big combo starter
Ftilt and up tilt lead into nothing are laggy af slow af doesn't kill until like 170
Like when mute uses them like every peach it's usually a miss input
okay everyone, the point of the video is to point out 5 awful moves, IT IS NOT INTENDED TO BE A "THE 5 WORST MOVES" VIDEO, he isnt gonna point out something obviously bad, just point out 5 bad moves.
True, but Zelda's d-air isn't that bad
Worst move warlock no turn around. Why dose that exist it’s so bad
I tested non-revered Warlock Punch in training mode and it literally kills later than Falcon Punch if you DI lmao
falco dash attack
5 useless moves :
- mac's nair
- mac's fair
- mac's back air
- mac's upair
- mac's down air
It's crazy how wrong this is but I get the joke
N-air: Combo breaker
D-air: Recovery
U-air: Platform pressure
F-air: b-air but faster
All of them suck but the only useless one is b-air
@edward8380 I agree with all but I'd like to expanded on some these
Nair; is phenomenally fast and opens up for combos while breaking them and some well needed tech
Dair; recovery as well jab lock into kill set ups but yeah, that's bout it. Hype Spike esp on Yoshi 😅
Uair; combo extender, can string into each other for some juggle pressure from utilts
@@MasterHandSpazz yeah I also could've added that. It's funny how Mac's aerials have quite a few applications, and yet they all still suck lmao
@edward8380 😅 I love playing as Mac, think he's not at all as bad as ppl make him out to be and has a pretty decent recovery
Inkling main, the most use I get from UTilt is just poking from underneath platforms, but even then only on so many stages like Battlefields or Hollow Bastion. Otherwise dead useless. Whiffs at point blank range every damn time. UTilt does lend itself to some silly Z axis moments tho
I like to add that Shulk’s forward tilt sucks because it’s unsafe on shield even if spaced
It still has a lot of range, unlike *cough cough* jab
no way he got the liquid metal slime on the hero stage
I'm sorry but you lost me on zelda's down air. That thing is active for like 11 hours, and launches downward on the sourspot the entire time. I know there's not a lot of Zelda players out there but I promise every single one of them will disagree.
Little mac bair should be on here
Nah, I like that move lol. It's crazy what it sets up into
this list is suuuuper wrong, also I main Inkling and I use Up tilt all the time
Found you!
Marths dash attack lmaooo
At least his dash attack kills and is easy to tipper with thanks to the buff. Lucina's has no tipper and has 0 kill potential at all. Lucina's is leagues worse.
You missed Steve up tilt
why
Yo i usually like your perspective but this list is whack. I would put actually useless moves on part two lol. Where is up tilt from Ganondorf? Where is down B from Byleth?
???
Zelda dair is great
nah this list is trash.
I think zelda dair is broken wdym I dont get it
mii gunner dair is rly rly trash, worse than zeldas
bowser dash attack
It's not bad actually. I usually wouldn't go for it over ftilt but it still has a use as a move when you cannot ftilt and have to cover a landing quickly.
Like you should really consider scrolling through all the characters before you make a list like this again lol. Because you missed some characters and moves that are much much worse than the moves you listed in this video.
Wario
Down
Smash
Worst move in the game
0 utility, strong hitbox active for like 1 frame, punishable, weak knock back, very little situational usage if any
Egg roll is leagues better
It's kinda fast I guess? I agree it's absolutely terrible but Egg Roll has nothing going for it
@edward8380 I disagree, egg roll has some practical utility in being a platform tech chase sheild break. BSD highlights it in one their videos and in high level play as a non yoshi player, it's pretty easy to pull off esp since egg lay is a command grab
@@MasterHandSpazz I'm no Yoshi player, but I heard something about the Egg Lay cheese strat being avoidable by mashing (I could be mistaken, correct me if I'm wrong).
Outside of that, shield breaks don't happen that often in professional play, let alone with Egg Roll. It requires specific positioning from your opponent, it is a free platform punish if you whiff, and even if you break their shield, your opponent would learn to never shield next to a ledge again. Not saying it never happens, but I barely consider shield breaking a positive of the move.
As for tech chasing, I mean, you could do it, but the question is just why? I imagine Yoshi getting more off of one of his aerials in platform tech chases, but then again I'm not a Yoshi player
@edward8380 the reason why I mention egg lay in tandem with eggroll on Plat tech chase is option select. Similar to Bowser having side b command grab for tech chase read or Bowser bomb to potentially break sheild but with Yoshi, you have those great aerials which you can add in missed tech laddering (which is likely more optimal)
Egg roll having the option to disengage by jumping seems realitivly low risk-high reward if going for the sheild break tech and paired with Yoshi's neutral you lose out on nothing in theory
@@MasterHandSpazz wouldn't it only be high reward if your opponent decided to shield on the platform? In which case, I could maybe see it working, but guessing wrong means either you get punished or your opponent gets hit by the egg roll (which is certainly not high reward). Now that I think about it, that might be more than what Wario's down smash does, so congratulations for convincing me lol
Lost all credibility when you said Zelda Dair
Inkling, Plant, Rosa all have conceivably worse dairs than Zelda no?
wtf no
I dont remember the properties of inklings dair but plants and rosas are way way way better, those are good dairs, not bad ones
No way. Rosa dair can outrange most moves and can combo into upsmash, Plant dair is extremely deadly, and Inkling's is easier to spike than Zelda's
@@LeahLuciB Inkling down air lasts for 1 frame...
@@LeahLuciB Rosa has range but even that's not a huge strength. Her sourspot is extremely prevalent, and that makes it inconsistent to use as a combo tool (it has very low hitstun) it's unsafe, really slow, and really really weak.
You're straight up wrong about inkling's dair, it's bad
idk about plant i was just guessing
Hero up air is so bad. Don't know why they did that to him while his frame data is already abysmal
As a Hero main myself with a few good results, up air is actually very useful. It has considerably low endlag, does respectable damage and racks up damage quickly (especially with Oomph or Acceleratle). It also is a valid kill move when paired with PU and woosh setplay. Not exactly his best aerial, but it's not bad at all
Nah I thought the same but highkey upair is acc pretty useful. It’s ur best down throw confirm at 0% and deals 34% if u land the whole string (d-throw, upair x2, nair finisher). With accelerattle u can do up throw into up air as a mix up. U can also up fast fall up air into fully charged Kafrizz, but I don’t really go for that combo and mainly stick to down throw confirms
Upair is good, its his grab that is turbo garbage, even compared to other swordies
I don't think it's that bad plus Hero can literally kill you at 0, don't think he needs a G&W up air
@@survivorofthecurse717 still way worse in a vacuum when you have Corrin up air right there.
Zelda down air is way better than fair or bair, still on a garbage character though so it doesnt really matter
No shot is it better than her bair/fair LMAO
wario down smash