23:54 I'm not sure if I'm more jealous of the amazing amount of lasers and other tools you have in this video, or just the amount of shop space you have available, lol
Great and informative video... One option you didn't cover with regard to desktop machines is the CO2 machines sourced from China, typically available on eBay. I went this route about 4yrs ago. Purchased a 12" x 20", 50W sealed tube CO2 machine for about $1200. It has many of the features of the more expensive domestically sourced (US made) machines. It's not quite as refined, but it does the job just fine. Worked for 30yrs in the industrial laser field and this machine, even though it's a lot cheaper, is every bit a "real" machine as the more expensive ones. Though I don't use it for "production work", it could... That said, not sure how long it'll last for with that kind of use, but for hobby users like me, it's the perfect low cost, nearly full featured machine. The only thing mine doesn't have is a chiller and auto focus. I use a large bin full of DI water that can be cooled by tossing in a few frozen bottles of bottled water. Though it doesn't have auto focus, it does have a manual Z-axis table feature and I use a dial indicator to set the height based off the material thickness used. Again... Great and very informative video. Continue to be amazed at the scope and quantity of equipment available to hobbyists these days!
@@pulporock They come as many different brands, but "K40" will find you most of them, as that's sort of the unofficial model number of all of them. There's also larger versions that are essentially the same, just with a bigger bed
Sorry for the delayed response to your questions... The machine I have is neither a "K40" or a Vevor. It was pre-Vevor. Unfortunately, there's no brand name on the unit. Even the instruction manual is nameless. It's a much bigger machine than the K40, with actual linear guides for the X/Y axis and a manually movable table. There's also a ventilation/evacuation fan and port on the back of the unit. It's a good machine for what I paid for it (about $1200 after a small refund due to some cosmetic shipping damage). The 12" x 20" work envelope is significantly bigger than a K40. As I said above, you use it for "Production work" but it might not hold up. It's not an Epilog or Universal machine (both built in the US, and about $15K for an entry level machine).
Somehow just liking and leaving a comment doesn't feel like an equal measure for the lessons I have learned watching it. It's hard to talk about our feelings, but it is so important. Good for you Mark. Keep Making.
I watch most YT vids at 1.25 or 1.50, but you are so informative I stuck at normal speed, great video. I am struggling to decide what laser to get. Even after your vid, but it helped immensely, thanks
After years of rebuilding imported laser systems like the Ship of Theseus, I went all in on Epilog and haven't looked back. Pricey, but reliable workhorses with great output. Really the number one factor I can't stress enough in business is reliability - especially during busy seasons & short deadline projects.
@@MyLegacyLaserStudio Epilogs can run from about $10,000 and 30 watts to over $30,000 and 120 watts, (they are high end commercial machines) I have a pair of Mini 24's and the oldest is 17 years old now and about 25,000 hours of running time, it rarely needs parts and when it does, Epilog has great support and fast shipping of those parts.
I was speaking to one of our suppliers about adding a laser to our shop and his recommendation was when it comes to fiber laser, anything below 8kW are just toys.
I’m newer to laser engraving and I have a Snapmaker 2.0 with 1.6w diode, 40w diode, and soon a 1095 infrared. This is one of the best laser engraving orientation videos to show you what you can get and what it’s for I’ve seen. Subscribing.
What a comprehensive guide! his video is truly invaluable for beginners like me. Thank you for the detailed insights! I have decided to choose the S1or F1 Ultra as my first laser machines.
Based on reviews, the big concern for me is post sales support. It seems that all of them have issues with support to varying degrees; however, I would have went for an xtool but support reviews are horrible. I have some time since I'm holding out until black Friday.
For higher end industrial lasers, you should mention the big 3: Epilog, Universal and Trotec. Never mind, I just saw that you did mention them toward the end.
Awesome - thank you for this! I had an XTool setup, never got to use it. I had emergency open heart surgery (no idea I had issues), followed closely by hurricane Helene with destroyed most of my workshop. Insurance only covered a small portion of loss. Talk about a small business hit. 😳
it has been a few months, and we have a new player (One Laser)...."desktop CO2" for a school/library makerspace ... XTool P2, Thunder Bolt, OneLaser XRF (starting from scratch or replacing Glowforge)... the integrated (& simpler) software (XCS vs Lightburn) has me leaning P2.... but i also like the XRF not needing chilling
I would love to see a side by side speed comparison that isn’t fast forwarded or sped up. Or take a cutting job and compare completion times with CO2 lasers
The first step really is to decide what you want to cut/engrave and why - business or hobby/ side hustle? Bear in mind too that not all lasers are Mac compatible or Wifi enabled, which may be important. Size of what you may want to engrave is also very important for cost - do you need a rotary or riser?
Hey 👋 great video. I was wondering how come Sculpfun never gets mentioned in your videos? In my environment those seem pretty common, and I think it's kinda cool that you can get a infrared module for the open gantry type Laser. In any case, I'm really appreciating the info you put together here, since I'm in the market for a new diod laser this black Friday. Thanks and keep on going 😊
I wish Xtool sales reps on the phone actually knew what they are talking about. Instead, you ask them a question, they have to flip through their 3 ring binder of facts to give you an answer. Grrrrrr. This makes me hesitant to buy from them.
they literally will tell u to buy accessories from another source rather than trying to help u with ur problems.. and as soon as they put a new product, the one they sold u as a whole package will suddenly wont have any stock for small parts or different accessories.. my closest location to buy in europe from them is their site from Bulgaria and for my D1 pro 2.0 i can find just a honeycomb
I’m a small shop, ~1,500 sales annually. I use their (xtool)machines daily, I mean nearly 6-8 hours a day. They run real well. Maintenance is easy. When I had an issue with the fiber ultra, they replaced it. As a business I have the three year warranty’s, which is the best money spent. They also get back to me fast. No they didn’t pay me for this, lol. You can find my a Etsy shop easily, I’m a real user :). Glowforge is how I started and dear god they were awful, but they did get me started and that is it. Next up is a heavy duty Omnicron and a plasma table, heh heh
Awesome video and I appreciate the dicussion being more to the point and less 'fluff' than other video reviewers. I am looking to purchase my first laser as a hobby maker and one critical element I want is to be able to engrave the inside of a ring(stainless, wood, tungsten, ceramic, antler), but I see very few videos on this. Due to the working proximity of the laser module to the material and having to 'tilt' the ring on a rotary, I don't have enough knowledge to choose which ones are compatible with this function. The 2 I have seen have some less desirable reviews from a customer service standpoint.(I would also like it to cut thin wood and engrave various materials, of course) Thank you for any expert advice you may have!
@japaneseDomestic I make rings in all the materials I have listed there. The majority are ceramic, tungsten and stainless. Engraving is the bulk and the I would like to cut thin wood to make ring and pen boxes for my items.
I would like to purchase a budget friendly, user-friendly software laser that can cut metal, wood,acrylic, and leather but also can engrave. This was a great video, and I'm somewhat a bit overwhelmed because you provide great info, but I'm new to this and would like to purchase a good quality laser that won't break the bank. Any advice would be appreciated.
Omtech K40+ has filled that need for me, as both a professional use device and a budget laser to learn on. It’s really quite versatile, as long as your projects fit on the bed, and you’re willing to learn how to calibrate it.
The simple reason I would never ever consider a glow forge is because the software doesn’t run 100% locally I mean what kind of bullshit is that that you need an Internet connection depend on their servers to run it I mean that is so beyond messed up.
@ yeah that’s why I would certainly never even give a glowforge a second look. One they’re pretty expensive for the initial buy in and two they want a perpetual subscription. That’s just a money grab
Glowforge is junk. They won't sell you parts. They force you to buy another complete unit at a refurbished price of 2k for everything that goes wrong or breaks. It's a scam
I want to do detailed engraving on 8-9 ounce vegetable tanned leather. All pieces would be pre-cut and smaller than 7 x 10 inches. Not a production shop, just 50 or so items per year. Could you please recommend some lasers that would do the job?
As always, you answer so many questions I have. I still very interested into a fiber laser, powerful, but with limited budget. Love the F1 Ultra but will like the same power with lower budget ;)
Great video, but I'm still not sure what I need. I'd like to cut/engrave wood and acrylic. I'd also like to engrave on cylinders, mugs, tumblers, cups, etc. They are metal (painted, powder coated)
I want a laser for just to cut leather patterns like wallets so all I will need to do is sow the wallets together or any leather projects like making kits so people can sow there own wallet thank you
Great video and great list. The only thing it was missing is Z axis work space and the ability to add a Rotary for glasses and tumblers and such. I know the We creat Vision does but do any other enclosed desktop diode lasers have that?
Thanks for the great info...really looking at the Thunder Bolt, and REALLY like the RF type laser in that unit because of its engraving detail (smaller beam width). But, maybe you could do a video on the difference between regular RF Tube and the Coherent RF Tube - is it worth the extra $2000 in the Bolt line? Thanks, Charlie in Central Ohio, but soon to be Central Florida !!
Just found this channel. My biggest issue with my glowforge I have is if I want even what I consider basic functions I have to pay for them. When I joined the kickstarter as an early bird I do not recall that being stated. I know I had access to them for about a year before I lost those to their subscription model. Needless to say it sits there collecting dust now which is sad.
Thanks so much for your content. I am a high school science teacher. About two and a half years ago I inherited the school "design lab" classroom which contained a glowforge pro. Since then, I acquired another glowforge (free donation from a parent). I have spent a great deal of time learning how to operate the machines, run inkscape, adobe illustrator etc. My students are I are getting pretty good at making the kind of things people would actually buy. The machines run 2-3 hours a day just about everyday. As problems arise I do my best to troubleshoot and put out fires but this is getting harder and harder. I've convinced my admin that I am going to need to replace one of both of these machines soon. I am DEFINITELY NOT going with Glowforge again. Knowing what you know, what would you recommend for a school setting (high school)?
New subscriber... I only learned about laser machines after purchasing my first 3d printers from snapmaker (idex J1 ) then saw their 3-1 machine. I knew of glowforge and Wyzer.. but i do like the S1 from Xtool. I'm looking for a machine which will engrave.. print on shirts and tumblers. metal for dog tags.. and cut 2 to 3mm thick polycarbonate/plexiglass and then metals.. maybe I can go with S1 and F1 ? P2 pro.
Now to bad Bambu labs didn't come out with something like Snapmaker 3-1 but with 420mmx420x500mm wk area.. crossbreed Co2 3d printed 3-1.. with cricket babies..
What about adding co2, diode, and IR to a large cnc router base, like 5’x9’ or bigger? Like a 6 in 1 or whatever. Besides needing to improve accuracy. What challenges do you foresee? Or do you have hindsight in this area you’d like to share?
Goodness, that's a lot of fun toys! Just out of curiosity, how many amps do some of these machines pull, from the 20W or 40W desktop Diode, RF, or CO2 to the industrial heavyweights - speaking as just a homeowner with a small shop who would love to have 1 or 2 of these!
If you want a better machine you should start to focus how they build the gantry on high-end machines vs the cheaper ones. Aeon are on the right direction with their gantry but for the most part all low and mid-end range feels that they are only focus on wattage and not the gantry and the chassi of the machine. DC motors are also very nice to have. The more stable the machine is the better results you will get
Great video sets. Amazing the amount of information you provide. Thanks! I do have a specific question... I want to "engrave" aluminum, not as you mentioned 'etch'. The aluminum will be engraved with characters for displaying outside to identify plants in a community garden. What would be the best type of laser? Based on what I have learned from the videos, I would assume either CO2 or Fiber. My budget is between $1000 and $2500. Thanks in advance.
Hi, love your videos, so helpful. Still having a hard time deciding what laser to buy. I know based on this video I need CO2 vs Diode but which CO2. I am looking to cut mostly acrylic, small pieces and maybe wood (cutting boards). Trying to figure out the best value, really do not have the budget for 7-8k. Any insights would be helpful?
Same here. Hesitate about the budget vs quality to be expected. Looking at some 3K options like atomstack and GW ones, But not sure enoue to make a call.
From what I've gathered, the fully enclosed hobby level diode machines with a camera, air assist and at least 20W of power cost in the 1200-1500 range. This is comparable to lower end CO2 machines. So why not just get the CO2? Well, for one, the cut quality seems to be cleaner with a diode laser, as they usually have smaller kerf and are consistent across the entire work area. The versatility of light cutting up to 15mm and more detailed engraving in a single machine is probably a better option for hobbyists than a small CO2 laser. Or am I wrong and there are CO2 lasers that outperform the engraving quality of diodes?
On the market for my first laser… unfortunately I want to do metal. Considering a Laserpecker 5 or break down and buy a Roly and MOPA fiber. Not cheap!
I have a Tykma Minilase fiber laser. (Made in Ohio.) Have you ever heard of it?? I’ve had it since 2016. It’s been great. I’m thinking of getting a second laser though. Something that can engrave a few more alternate materials.
Great video. 6mo ago, I bought a 10w NEJE and it was affordable and so far it's been good for learning. I picked this one because it has a Z axis and I bought their Webcam. Once I become more proficient and can make some passive income from it, then I will upgrade to a CO2 laser.
fml...with it being black friday, it seems like it would be a good time to pickup a laser...but now I feel like im more confused. Maybe next year...dont want to make a rushed decision.
2:52 I disagree, my 20w laser does everything at a decent speed, 1 pass enough to build a business from and sell 100's of items. It's extremely rare that thick material needs to be cut.
I have a question, please. My wife makes handmade wedding invitations; many of her clients want wax seals with their initials on them. At the moment, we order from a third party, a few hundred a year. I think we need to bring the making of these wax seal stamps in house. What kind of machine are people using to make these stamps
Great video! Incredibly informative. I recently bought a 40K diode laser (Sculpfun SF-A9), but found that the laser spot size was .4mm - .5mm, which for my purposes is basically unusable. The advertised spot size was .1mm - .15mm. In your experience, is this a common problem for higher-watt diode lasers, or did I just get a lemon?
@@makeorbreakshop I agree, it felt very high to me as well!! I tested it at multiple focus depths from -3mm to +9mm from the recommended focus distance and saw little change (a tiny bit of improvement with longer distance before getting less focused again). I tested it on anodized aluminum as well to be sure I had crisp lines. If your experience is generally better than .4mm for 40W diodes, then I guess I won't give up on diodes just yet. I'll assume that the machine I got was a fluke.
Sounds like you're either terribly out of focus or got a lemon indeed As far as I know the 40W with smallest dot is S1 - the dot is the same size as typical for 20W.
I am wanting to set up a small business personal engraving cutting. Your video was great but could do with some advice. Power sounds great and size to but to start I am not sure. I have been considering the Xtool P2. Your explanation of software was good. I want to use wood, slate plastic but possibly metal to. I have a limited budget of around £7000. Is there a machine or machines you wouks suggest looking at. Engraving wise the smaller lasers woukd give better detail. So a little confused but in a good way.
Have you happened to hear anything from Roly about swapable heads for mrk2? I thought they said they were going to be releasing an IR module but can't seem to find any info any more. Also, can't wait to hear about the 1 laser info
For the x tool p2 series, you said that there is no water pump but you still need to put water in the machine. Is this reliable or are there problems that come with it? Also how often do you need to calibrate it?
i understand the diferences between that 3 tyoes of laser, but co2 its too expensive for me to start whit it, and fiber it like a on trick pony and is not cheap either so i will start whit a diode 20w becouse i have to see if i can make some money whit it befor decide to go up in my investment, nice video!
Perfect timing and a great video! I've read that a diode can cut iron on vinyl just fine (PE only, PVC omits noxious fumes) which is all I use a blade for. Would you agree with that? I'd like to obtain a better laser for cutting and engraving 3-6mm? wood than invest in an M1 especially with the ultra out of the budget.
There are two types of heat transfer "vinyl" - one is the actual vinyl which is not safe to laser cut, and the second is the "laser safe vinyl" which is not vinyl at all but PE. That second one is indeed safe to cut with a laser, so you can safely pick something cheaper than M1 Ultra from the desktop diode category.
Always super helpful; bought an XTool F1 and love it but already see the need for more power as I do a lot of marking on metal. If I were to buy a 2nd machine, would you recommend the F1 Ultra or a standalone Fiber Laser? Thx!
If you only mark metal,I recommend you choosing the fiber laser machine.And UV laser marking machine can mark all materials,include metal,non-metal and PVC.
Great info for someone new to this. I might be able to purchase a Thunder Nova 51. Any suggestions on what to consider for pricing? Run time and basic condition of the unit?
Great, in depth video!! Quick question: the fiber laser module that you can add to the xtool S1, what is that in watts? Is it the power of the F1 or 20 watts like the F1 Ultra? Just wondering which laser to get next. I have the F1; I'll be looking to upgrade sometime in the next few months. Also, do you think xtool is going to do an "Ultra" version of the S1 anytime soon?? 🤔☺ Thanks! -- New subscriber!
You did miss (or skip) an entire category.... UV laser's. From what I'm seeing, these are the "IT" laser of today, they can cut glass, engrave glass without masking, and not just the surface of glass, they also do not burn wood or plastic when engraving them, and they engrave thin metals without warping the metal. But definitely not cheap.
Hi! Great video! I have an Xtool S1 40w. It Works great. Now I was wondering to upgrade to an Xtool p2 but I’m afraid about the integrated water cooling sistem. Is it able to support 3-4 Hours of continuous Wood cutting? Thanks 😊
I haven’t tested it for that long but I would lean towards no. It does have a heat indicator so it would at least cut off if it got too hot. But if you are looking for something to work for extended amounts of time I would get a unit that has an external chiller hook up.
Wait before you decide because they're releasing P2S soon! The P2 can do 3-4 hours of continuous cutting but it depends on the temperature in your studio/workshop.
Great video, very informative. I've had 4 different lasers and wondered where you'd rank the FS Muse Titan laser compared to other CO2 lasers? Looking to upgrade or trade for another. Thanks!!!
I am really sorry. Nuerodivergent glitch of not being able to take in something even though I'm interested in. I want to be able to engrave wood, metal, leather and maybe glass/ acrylic. Is there something that isn't silly money, easy use, not to big (no bigger than a microwave at most) that is an all rounder? Thank you
Great information thank you! I have a couple of questions. Can any of the lasers (about $1000.00) do both the color laser marking on stainless and also cut balsa wood? The second question is; when the lasers color mark on the stainless is it really laser annealing where the surface of the metal is not etched or is it true etching. I need laser annealing because these stainless pieces will be used in hygienic applications where they need to be smooth and easy to clean. Thank you!
Kudos for excellent presentation of the variety of lasers for home use! Can you suggest a 'best' choice for a fairly large gantry to cut single layer cotton fabric?
A CO2 laser will get you there. If you on a budget I'd check out OMTech or Monport. I wouldn't worry about the wattage as much since you won't need a ton. Look more at the bed size to make sure it will fit the size you need.
Great video. I have an application that involves cutting plastic about .080” (2mm) thick. The plastic is not flat, but has a contour. What would you recommend?
I'd question which machines are class 4 and which class 1. I'd also question which are truely CE marked or just have a CE stamp on them. So many coming out of China are claiming standards they just do not achieve. I'd also question which ones have been tested electrically. (full stop). This year I've seen two that would never have passed electrical or laser safety standards. So beware.
I own a scaffolding rental company. All of it is Aluminum. I'd like to engrave my logo & a barcode if possible, probably about 2 x 3 inches. We have long planks with large flat areas & 3" C channel to engrave on. Can you steer me towards a portable machine or at least one where I can clamp the engraver to?
Hi, thank you for your informative video! I have a question, which laser would you recommend that will cut 18 gauge (1.02mm) copper metal sheets? The laser would be purchased for a small jewelry metalworking business.
Curious as to why you don't include ComMarker machines? I've noted there are only a handful of videos about the ComMarker Omni 1 UV laser engraver so far. Is the company difficult to deal with? Anyone else have any experiences with them?
23:54 I'm not sure if I'm more jealous of the amazing amount of lasers and other tools you have in this video, or just the amount of shop space you have available, lol
For real I realised an.omtech is best buck bit then the space
.. I don't have the space 🥹
Mate, your videos are so snappy and concise but still full of some so much knowledge and information. It's a mark of S-tier quality.
Appreciate it!
I love seeing someone who knows their stuff. Good job.
Great video especially for someone like me who is a beginner. Thanks for putting together the comparison grid -- very helpful!
Great and informative video... One option you didn't cover with regard to desktop machines is the CO2 machines sourced from China, typically available on eBay. I went this route about 4yrs ago. Purchased a 12" x 20", 50W sealed tube CO2 machine for about $1200. It has many of the features of the more expensive domestically sourced (US made) machines. It's not quite as refined, but it does the job just fine. Worked for 30yrs in the industrial laser field and this machine, even though it's a lot cheaper, is every bit a "real" machine as the more expensive ones. Though I don't use it for "production work", it could... That said, not sure how long it'll last for with that kind of use, but for hobby users like me, it's the perfect low cost, nearly full featured machine. The only thing mine doesn't have is a chiller and auto focus. I use a large bin full of DI water that can be cooled by tossing in a few frozen bottles of bottled water. Though it doesn't have auto focus, it does have a manual Z-axis table feature and I use a dial indicator to set the height based off the material thickness used.
Again... Great and very informative video. Continue to be amazed at the scope and quantity of equipment available to hobbyists these days!
Would you be happy to share the brand and model?
Cheers from Oz
I wanted to buy a 200w rf reci laser. Is it good for engraving with good quality? Or is it only for cutting because it doesn't have a good definition?
@@pulporock They come as many different brands, but "K40" will find you most of them, as that's sort of the unofficial model number of all of them. There's also larger versions that are essentially the same, just with a bigger bed
Vevor makes some but no real third party videos. They have a 60w co2 in rolling cabinet for like 1500
Sorry for the delayed response to your questions... The machine I have is neither a "K40" or a Vevor. It was pre-Vevor. Unfortunately, there's no brand name on the unit. Even the instruction manual is nameless.
It's a much bigger machine than the K40, with actual linear guides for the X/Y axis and a manually movable table. There's also a ventilation/evacuation fan and port on the back of the unit.
It's a good machine for what I paid for it (about $1200 after a small refund due to some cosmetic shipping damage). The 12" x 20" work envelope is significantly bigger than a K40.
As I said above, you use it for "Production work" but it might not hold up. It's not an Epilog or Universal machine (both built in the US, and about $15K for an entry level machine).
Somehow just liking and leaving a comment doesn't feel like an equal measure for the lessons I have learned watching it.
It's hard to talk about our feelings, but it is so important. Good for you Mark. Keep Making.
Thanks for that!
I watch most YT vids at 1.25 or 1.50, but you are so informative I stuck at normal speed, great video. I am struggling to decide what laser to get. Even after your vid, but it helped immensely, thanks
After years of rebuilding imported laser systems like the Ship of Theseus, I went all in on Epilog and haven't looked back. Pricey, but reliable workhorses with great output. Really the number one factor I can't stress enough in business is reliability - especially during busy seasons & short deadline projects.
What’s there pricing like?
@@MyLegacyLaserStudio Epilogs can run from about $10,000 and 30 watts to over $30,000 and 120 watts, (they are high end commercial machines) I have a pair of Mini 24's and the oldest is 17 years old now and about 25,000 hours of running time, it rarely needs parts and when it does, Epilog has great support and fast shipping of those parts.
I was speaking to one of our suppliers about adding a laser to our shop and his recommendation was when it comes to fiber laser, anything below 8kW are just toys.
love the video, as someone whos never even looked at these ive learned so much already!
I’m newer to laser engraving and I have a Snapmaker 2.0 with 1.6w diode, 40w diode, and soon a 1095 infrared. This is one of the best laser engraving orientation videos to show you what you can get and what it’s for I’ve seen. Subscribing.
Thanks !
How do you like the snap maker? does it leave char marks? Can it engrave gold, silver, plated, stainless steel etc really well?
What a comprehensive guide! his video is truly invaluable for beginners like me. Thank you for the detailed insights! I have decided to choose the S1or F1 Ultra as my first laser machines.
Which one did you end going with?
Love your channel. Such great info for us beginners. Thanks!
Based on reviews, the big concern for me is post sales support. It seems that all of them have issues with support to varying degrees; however, I would have went for an xtool but support reviews are horrible. I have some time since I'm holding out until black Friday.
Wondering what you end up getting , Black Friday sales is up but I’m concerned about post sales support too.
For higher end industrial lasers, you should mention the big 3: Epilog, Universal and Trotec. Never mind, I just saw that you did mention them toward the end.
Awesome - thank you for this!
I had an XTool setup, never got to use it. I had emergency open heart surgery (no idea I had issues), followed closely by hurricane Helene with destroyed most of my workshop. Insurance only covered a small portion of loss. Talk about a small business hit. 😳
it has been a few months, and we have a new player (One Laser)...."desktop CO2" for a school/library makerspace ... XTool P2, Thunder Bolt, OneLaser XRF (starting from scratch or replacing Glowforge)... the integrated (& simpler) software (XCS vs Lightburn) has me leaning P2.... but i also like the XRF not needing chilling
@29:05 The Atomstack M4 (original) is a 20W electrical input with a 5W laser diode output... The Atomstack M4 Pro is a dual 10W + 2W laser
Very nice video. Thanks for all the information. You definitely know your stuff.
I would love to see a side by side speed comparison that isn’t fast forwarded or sped up. Or take a cutting job and compare completion times with CO2 lasers
Make or Break Shop, nice content I loved it
The first step really is to decide what you want to cut/engrave and why - business or hobby/ side hustle? Bear in mind too that not all lasers are Mac compatible or Wifi enabled, which may be important. Size of what you may want to engrave is also very important for cost - do you need a rotary or riser?
Hey 👋 great video. I was wondering how come Sculpfun never gets mentioned in your videos? In my environment those seem pretty common, and I think it's kinda cool that you can get a infrared module for the open gantry type Laser.
In any case, I'm really appreciating the info you put together here, since I'm in the market for a new diod laser this black Friday. Thanks and keep on going 😊
I wish Xtool sales reps on the phone actually knew what they are talking about. Instead, you ask them a question, they have to flip through their 3 ring binder of facts to give you an answer. Grrrrrr. This makes me hesitant to buy from them.
they literally will tell u to buy accessories from another source rather than trying to help u with ur problems.. and as soon as they put a new product, the one they sold u as a whole package will suddenly wont have any stock for small parts or different accessories..
my closest location to buy in europe from them is their site from Bulgaria and for my D1 pro 2.0 i can find just a honeycomb
I’m a small shop, ~1,500 sales annually. I use their (xtool)machines daily, I mean nearly 6-8 hours a day. They run real well. Maintenance is easy. When I had an issue with the fiber ultra, they replaced it. As a business I have the three year warranty’s, which is the best money spent. They also get back to me fast. No they didn’t pay me for this, lol. You can find my a Etsy shop easily, I’m a real user :). Glowforge is how I started and dear god they were awful, but they did get me started and that is it. Next up is a heavy duty Omnicron and a plasma table, heh heh
Awesome video and I appreciate the dicussion being more to the point and less 'fluff' than other video reviewers. I am looking to purchase my first laser as a hobby maker and one critical element I want is to be able to engrave the inside of a ring(stainless, wood, tungsten, ceramic, antler), but I see very few videos on this. Due to the working proximity of the laser module to the material and having to 'tilt' the ring on a rotary, I don't have enough knowledge to choose which ones are compatible with this function. The 2 I have seen have some less desirable reviews from a customer service standpoint.(I would also like it to cut thin wood and engrave various materials, of course) Thank you for any expert advice you may have!
@japaneseDomestic I make rings in all the materials I have listed there. The majority are ceramic, tungsten and stainless. Engraving is the bulk and the I would like to cut thin wood to make ring and pen boxes for my items.
Good video, but it actually made it harder to choose what laser to get. Didn't realize there were so many different kinds
I would like to purchase a budget friendly, user-friendly software laser that can cut metal, wood,acrylic, and leather but also can engrave. This was a great video, and I'm somewhat a bit overwhelmed because you provide great info, but I'm new to this and would like to purchase a good quality laser that won't break the bank. Any advice would be appreciated.
That's the same question I had
I guess it depends what you consider "breaking the bank"
Omtech K40+ has filled that need for me, as both a professional use device and a budget laser to learn on. It’s really quite versatile, as long as your projects fit on the bed, and you’re willing to learn how to calibrate it.
I am in the same boat, I was going to look at Xtool but a number of complaints about after sale support. Not sure what to do.
Same here. The only thing this video lacked is info on cutting ability of these lasers.
The simple reason I would never ever consider a glow forge is because the software doesn’t run 100% locally I mean what kind of bullshit is that that you need an Internet connection depend on their servers to run it I mean that is so beyond messed up.
Is why I won’t upgrade past Mojave and give up my perpetual lic software to then go subscription cloud based💩
@ yeah that’s why I would certainly never even give a glowforge a second look. One they’re pretty expensive for the initial buy in and two they want a perpetual subscription. That’s just a money grab
Glowforge is junk. They won't sell you parts. They force you to buy another complete unit at a refurbished price of 2k for everything that goes wrong or breaks. It's a scam
I want to do detailed engraving on 8-9 ounce vegetable tanned leather. All pieces would be pre-cut and smaller than 7 x 10 inches. Not a production shop, just 50 or so items per year. Could you please recommend some lasers that would do the job?
As always, you answer so many questions I have. I still very interested into a fiber laser, powerful, but with limited budget. Love the F1 Ultra but will like the same power with lower budget ;)
Normally I have to speed up youtube videos, this is the first that I have played at .75 speed.
Great video, but I'm still not sure what I need. I'd like to cut/engrave wood and acrylic. I'd also like to engrave on cylinders, mugs, tumblers, cups, etc. They are metal (painted, powder coated)
perfectly timed video. will be getting a laser at some point
Do it!
I want a laser for just to cut leather patterns like wallets so all I will need to do is sow the wallets together or any leather projects like making kits so people can sow there own wallet thank you
I have the new Atomstack 70 watt and it's a beast.
great video, really well done. Appreciated!
Great video. Thanks!
Great video and great list. The only thing it was missing is Z axis work space and the ability to add a Rotary for glasses and tumblers and such. I know the We creat Vision does but do any other enclosed desktop diode lasers have that?
We have Xtool D1 Pro 20W with expansion kit and enclosure.
Thanks for the great info...really looking at the Thunder Bolt, and REALLY like the RF type laser in that unit because of its engraving detail (smaller beam width). But, maybe you could do a video on the difference between regular RF Tube and the Coherent RF Tube - is it worth the extra $2000 in the Bolt line? Thanks, Charlie in Central Ohio, but soon to be Central Florida !!
The Thunder Bolt Pro,series are 2000mm/s
We got the Thunder Bolt, and couldn't be happier. Our old non-working Glowforge is unplugged and out of commission.
You are the thumbnail
Just found this channel. My biggest issue with my glowforge I have is if I want even what I consider basic functions I have to pay for them. When I joined the kickstarter as an early bird I do not recall that being stated. I know I had access to them for about a year before I lost those to their subscription model. Needless to say it sits there collecting dust now which is sad.
Thanks so much for your content. I am a high school science teacher. About two and a half years ago I inherited the school "design lab" classroom which contained a glowforge pro. Since then, I acquired another glowforge (free donation from a parent). I have spent a great deal of time learning how to operate the machines, run inkscape, adobe illustrator etc. My students are I are getting pretty good at making the kind of things people would actually buy. The machines run 2-3 hours a day just about everyday. As problems arise I do my best to troubleshoot and put out fires but this is getting harder and harder. I've convinced my admin that I am going to need to replace one of both of these machines soon. I am DEFINITELY NOT going with Glowforge again. Knowing what you know, what would you recommend for a school setting (high school)?
What exactly don't you like about the Glowforge?
New subscriber... I only learned about laser machines after purchasing my first 3d printers from snapmaker (idex J1 ) then saw their 3-1 machine.
I knew of glowforge and Wyzer.. but i do like the S1 from Xtool. I'm looking for a machine which will engrave.. print on shirts and tumblers. metal for dog tags.. and cut 2 to 3mm thick polycarbonate/plexiglass and then metals.. maybe I can go with S1 and F1 ? P2 pro.
Now to bad Bambu labs didn't come out with something like Snapmaker 3-1 but with 420mmx420x500mm wk area.. crossbreed Co2 3d printed 3-1.. with cricket babies..
What about adding co2, diode, and IR to a large cnc router base, like 5’x9’ or bigger? Like a 6 in 1 or whatever. Besides needing to improve accuracy. What challenges do you foresee? Or do you have hindsight in this area you’d like to share?
Goodness, that's a lot of fun toys! Just out of curiosity, how many amps do some of these machines pull, from the 20W or 40W desktop Diode, RF, or CO2 to the industrial heavyweights - speaking as just a homeowner with a small shop who would love to have 1 or 2 of these!
I have a Glowforge Plus and its definitely the definition of a company overcharging old people who just want a hobby.
If you want a better machine you should start to focus how they build the gantry on high-end machines vs the cheaper ones.
Aeon are on the right direction with their gantry but for the most part all low and mid-end range feels that they are only focus on wattage and not the gantry and the chassi of the machine.
DC motors are also very nice to have.
The more stable the machine is the better results you will get
Great video sets. Amazing the amount of information you provide. Thanks! I do have a specific question... I want to "engrave" aluminum, not as you mentioned 'etch'. The aluminum will be engraved with characters for displaying outside to identify plants in a community garden. What would be the best type of laser? Based on what I have learned from the videos, I would assume either CO2 or Fiber. My budget is between $1000 and $2500. Thanks in advance.
Hi, love your videos, so helpful. Still having a hard time deciding what laser to buy. I know based on this video I need CO2 vs Diode but which CO2. I am looking to cut mostly acrylic, small pieces and maybe wood (cutting boards). Trying to figure out the best value, really do not have the budget for 7-8k. Any insights would be helpful?
Same here. Hesitate about the budget vs quality to be expected.
Looking at some 3K options like atomstack and GW ones, But not sure enoue to make a call.
From what I've gathered, the fully enclosed hobby level diode machines with a camera, air assist and at least 20W of power cost in the 1200-1500 range. This is comparable to lower end CO2 machines. So why not just get the CO2? Well, for one, the cut quality seems to be cleaner with a diode laser, as they usually have smaller kerf and are consistent across the entire work area. The versatility of light cutting up to 15mm and more detailed engraving in a single machine is probably a better option for hobbyists than a small CO2 laser. Or am I wrong and there are CO2 lasers that outperform the engraving quality of diodes?
On the market for my first laser… unfortunately I want to do metal. Considering a Laserpecker 5 or break down and buy a Roly and MOPA fiber. Not cheap!
Look at the Xtool F1 ultra as well
I highly recommend the F1 Ultra
@@abbyhe4245 why?
Get a MOPA.
I have a Tykma Minilase fiber laser. (Made in Ohio.) Have you ever heard of it??
I’ve had it since 2016. It’s been great. I’m thinking of getting a second laser though. Something that can engrave a few more alternate materials.
Great video. 6mo ago, I bought a 10w NEJE and it was affordable and so far it's been good for learning. I picked this one because it has a Z axis and I bought their Webcam. Once I become more proficient and can make some passive income from it, then I will upgrade to a CO2 laser.
Do you know which ones work well with cutting plexiglass?
fml...with it being black friday, it seems like it would be a good time to pickup a laser...but now I feel like im more confused. Maybe next year...dont want to make a rushed decision.
Thank you
2:52 I disagree, my 20w laser does everything at a decent speed, 1 pass enough to build a business from and sell 100's of items. It's extremely rare that thick material needs to be cut.
I have a question, please. My wife makes handmade wedding invitations; many of her clients want wax seals with their initials on them. At the moment, we order from a third party, a few hundred a year. I think we need to bring the making of these wax seal stamps in house. What kind of machine are people using to make these stamps
Great video! Incredibly informative.
I recently bought a 40K diode laser (Sculpfun SF-A9), but found that the laser spot size was .4mm - .5mm, which for my purposes is basically unusable. The advertised spot size was .1mm - .15mm. In your experience, is this a common problem for higher-watt diode lasers, or did I just get a lemon?
.4 seems really really high. There might be an issue with focusing, if you move it up and down can you dial it in at all?
@@makeorbreakshop I agree, it felt very high to me as well!! I tested it at multiple focus depths from -3mm to +9mm from the recommended focus distance and saw little change (a tiny bit of improvement with longer distance before getting less focused again). I tested it on anodized aluminum as well to be sure I had crisp lines.
If your experience is generally better than .4mm for 40W diodes, then I guess I won't give up on diodes just yet. I'll assume that the machine I got was a fluke.
Sounds like you're either terribly out of focus or got a lemon indeed
As far as I know the 40W with smallest dot is S1 - the dot is the same size as typical for 20W.
I am wanting to set up a small business personal engraving cutting. Your video was great but could do with some advice. Power sounds great and size to but to start I am not sure. I have been considering the Xtool P2. Your explanation of software was good. I want to use wood, slate plastic but possibly metal to. I have a limited budget of around £7000. Is there a machine or machines you wouks suggest looking at. Engraving wise the smaller lasers woukd give better detail. So a little confused but in a good way.
Have you happened to hear anything from Roly about swapable heads for mrk2? I thought they said they were going to be releasing an IR module but can't seem to find any info any more.
Also, can't wait to hear about the 1 laser info
Really enjoyed your video, but ya might want to cut back a little on the java.
Yeah this guy is so hyper energetic that it's tiresome. I have to drink three coffees one after another to be like him.
For the x tool p2 series, you said that there is no water pump but you still need to put water in the machine. Is this reliable or are there problems that come with it? Also how often do you need to calibrate it?
Have you reviewed the AP Lasers?
Thanks for the video! What would you suggest if I wanted to print my own metal playing cards at scale?
Love your video and charts. Is there a way I can export the comparison chart to excel so I can keep for future reference? Thanks!
i understand the diferences between that 3 tyoes of laser, but co2 its too expensive for me to start whit it, and fiber it like a on trick pony and is not cheap either so i will start whit a diode 20w becouse i have to see if i can make some money whit it befor decide to go up in my investment, nice video!
Perfect timing and a great video! I've read that a diode can cut iron on vinyl just fine (PE only, PVC omits noxious fumes) which is all I use a blade for. Would you agree with that? I'd like to obtain a better laser for cutting and engraving 3-6mm? wood than invest in an M1 especially with the ultra out of the budget.
There are two types of heat transfer "vinyl" - one is the actual vinyl which is not safe to laser cut, and the second is the "laser safe vinyl" which is not vinyl at all but PE. That second one is indeed safe to cut with a laser, so you can safely pick something cheaper than M1 Ultra from the desktop diode category.
Always super helpful; bought an XTool F1 and love it but already see the need for more power as I do a lot of marking on metal. If I were to buy a 2nd machine, would you recommend the F1 Ultra or a standalone Fiber Laser? Thx!
If you only mark metal,I recommend you choosing the fiber laser machine.And UV laser marking machine can mark all materials,include metal,non-metal and PVC.
I want to add lettering to a silicone rubber surface - which type do you think would be best?
very very very ... helpful!!
Great info for someone new to this. I might be able to purchase a Thunder Nova 51. Any suggestions on what to consider for pricing? Run time and basic condition of the unit?
Another hit out of the park Brandon! Great job
Thanks!
Great, in depth video!! Quick question: the fiber laser module that you can add to the xtool S1, what is that in watts? Is it the power of the F1 or 20 watts like the F1 Ultra? Just wondering which laser to get next. I have the F1; I'll be looking to upgrade sometime in the next few months. Also, do you think xtool is going to do an "Ultra" version of the S1 anytime soon?? 🤔☺ Thanks! -- New subscriber!
You did miss (or skip) an entire category.... UV laser's. From what I'm seeing, these are the "IT" laser of today, they can cut glass, engrave glass without masking, and not just the surface of glass, they also do not burn wood or plastic when engraving them, and they engrave thin metals without warping the metal. But definitely not cheap.
Is it possible to get an upgraded xtool diode module without buying the whole machine again
Do any of these cut through stainless steel
Hi! Great video! I have an Xtool S1 40w. It Works great. Now I was wondering to upgrade to an Xtool p2 but I’m afraid about the integrated water cooling sistem. Is it able to support 3-4 Hours of continuous Wood cutting? Thanks 😊
I haven’t tested it for that long but I would lean towards no. It does have a heat indicator so it would at least cut off if it got too hot. But if you are looking for something to work for extended amounts of time I would get a unit that has an external chiller hook up.
@@makeorbreakshop Thank you. A Machine with an external chiller may be the best choice for me
Don't worry, P2 is capable of supporting long-duration continuous wood cutting.
Wait before you decide because they're releasing P2S soon!
The P2 can do 3-4 hours of continuous cutting but it depends on the temperature in your studio/workshop.
Great video, very informative. I've had 4 different lasers and wondered where you'd rank the FS Muse Titan laser compared to other CO2 lasers? Looking to upgrade or trade for another. Thanks!!!
I am really sorry. Nuerodivergent glitch of not being able to take in something even though I'm interested in. I want to be able to engrave wood, metal, leather and maybe glass/ acrylic. Is there something that isn't silly money, easy use, not to big (no bigger than a microwave at most) that is an all rounder? Thank you
Great information thank you! I have a couple of questions. Can any of the lasers (about $1000.00) do both the color laser marking on stainless and also cut balsa wood? The second question is; when the lasers color mark on the stainless is it really laser annealing where the surface of the metal is not etched or is it true etching. I need laser annealing because these stainless pieces will be used in hygienic applications where they need to be smooth and easy to clean. Thank you!
Kudos for excellent presentation of the variety of lasers for home use! Can you suggest a 'best' choice for a fairly large gantry to cut single layer cotton fabric?
I would love to know as well. I’m cutting a lot of fabric for appliqué for embroidery
A CO2 laser will get you there. If you on a budget I'd check out OMTech or Monport. I wouldn't worry about the wattage as much since you won't need a ton. Look more at the bed size to make sure it will fit the size you need.
But if you want "Best", I'd go with something like the Thunder Nova series.
When cutting thick foam in multiple passes, is it possible to have the cutter focus to different depths for each pass?
Great video.
I have an application that involves cutting plastic about .080” (2mm) thick.
The plastic is not flat, but has a contour.
What would you recommend?
Aren't diode lasers typically rated in input power, where co2 is rated in optical output power, or is that a myth I've heard?
I'd question which machines are class 4 and which class 1. I'd also question which are truely CE marked or just have a CE stamp on them. So many coming out of China are claiming standards they just do not achieve. I'd also question which ones have been tested electrically. (full stop). This year I've seen two that would never have passed electrical or laser safety standards. So beware.
We want to engrave cutting boards. What desktop machine would you recommend?
Do you have any idea if there are removable areas that will allow the OMTech 80w pro 2440 to fit through a residential door??
Hello, what would you recommend for engraving pigeon bands? Thank you.
What's the best bang for your buck when it comes to the latest mopa lasers?
Whats the typical kerf of each type you've outlined?
What do you think of LaserStar?
I just need a 4MW pulse laser which is water proof and compatible with a Shark harness.
I own a scaffolding rental company. All of it is Aluminum. I'd like to engrave my logo & a barcode if possible, probably about 2 x 3 inches. We have long planks with large flat areas & 3" C channel to engrave on. Can you steer me towards a portable machine or at least one where I can clamp the engraver
to?
The Xtool F1 is ideal for you, it’s over a grand but will easily do what you want.
Hi, thank you for your informative video! I have a question, which laser would you recommend that will cut 18 gauge (1.02mm) copper metal sheets? The laser would be purchased for a small jewelry metalworking business.
What's the best laser to cut though rock and concrete?
Curious as to why you don't include ComMarker machines? I've noted there are only a handful of videos about the ComMarker Omni 1 UV laser engraver so far. Is the company difficult to deal with? Anyone else have any experiences with them?
So what open gantry diode machine and IR diode module would you recommend?