I think I purchased one of the first 10 units that these guys made, about a year ago (maybe 2?). I called them on a Sunday and I talked at length with 2 of the guys there. These guys are really committed to their customer base. Their stuff is built (like a tank) like the stuff I see at my job and I work at a helicopter manufacturer. Very happy with my DK2 system.
Thankyou Barry i am going to book a test drive at the UK supplier, 150 miles from me but worth it to experience before I purchase I think. thanks again for a great review
@52:40 some of the rumbles in iRacing are painted and/or do not have the actual raised surfaces 3D modeled. This is specially true on the Red Bull Circuit or COTA. Some games completely remove the 3D rumbles and instead rely on locational effects or basically a mapping of the location of the wheel to play an artificial "effects" that send vibrations to the wheel and/or controller rather than the vehicles actual suspension. This is done for efficiency reasons, such as time to model the track and/or to shorten the loading time (less polygons to load). In short, a good motion system can shine some light on the level of detail that the track has from the developer.
Great review as always Barry. Just decided to get the FREX H shifter after a long while with my TH8A based on your review a while back thanks for the help! I would personally skip these and just spend the extra 1400 or 20% on the DK6 with 3x the suspension travel. From what I've also heard the actuators should be mounted so your seat area is roughly in the center between the actuators so it acts more like a real car would with you sitting roughly in the center of the car although you would probably have to get longer bars for your rig. Also what car sound is used in your intro? After listening to a Porsche 991.2 RSR GTE from the 2018/2019 season it sounds exactly like correct me if I am wrong.
@@DnBVooDooDNA lol no. From their website, “Due to lack of respect and disregard of the project license, which prohibits any commercial use, the project was paused.”
@@rHopkinz11 what does this mean? Does this mean people were using the product commercially when they weren't permitted to? Had this not happened would this have been the best bang for buck motion?
Good to see somebody using a full motion rig with the goal to match real world experience. I see way too many rigs jumping like a jack in the box with the driver being thrown around. Totally unrealistic! This looks pretty convincing.
Hi I'm considering doing a motion system with the Traction Plus and 4 actuators. What do you think about trying it. I saw you and a couple other guys do it before.
@srg - any feedback on the road texture setting? In the video you discussed engine vibration, but I don’t think you discussed road texture. Like you, I turn down engine vibration on my d-box because I think feeling the road is more important and satisfying
This is something I don't understand just 50mm, a rally car goes up and down a bit more 100mm when you add it all up lol;, and the rest I'm not sure, but a normal car I do know, Can you also tell me what kind of music this is playing lol; db if you can thanks, Only the price is a bit high, especially if you have to order for Europe With years of experience building simulators and motion systems for 🚗 manufacturers, we believe that a motion system with 2.0” of actuator travel is the optimal amount to produce a precise, responsive, tight and realistic experience for sim-racing. We believe that a compact 2.0" system is more than enough to realize our complex, multi-layer VelocityTrap motion algorithm. A longer actuator system certainly has some additional benefits, but the primary motion should still be kept within 2.0" for optimal speed and response (for sim racing application).Thanks info Barry And as usual thanks for the research
I heard that 50mm vs 150m argument many times.... Real cars do this or that... But I'm not in a real car. I'm in a sim that doesn't give me g forces. So i enjoy those extra mms to make up for the lack of g forces... Also, 150mm is a nice feature to simulate up slopes, and banks at Daytona.
@@davidgalaw9326 They also make a 6" kit. Many people in the motion industry suggest that subtle movements are the most convincing, at the moment. This is for many reasons, which likely includes the fact that we can't really simulate G-forces properly and completely. So if we have crazy or extreme motions, it can feel fake, while many indicate subtle movements are more convincing and "real" feeling when driving these sims. Gamer Muscle did a video talking about motion platforms. He tested a ton of various platforms, and his general conclusion is subtle movements are most effective. I'm not suggesting this is "right" or some golden rule. Just sharing what I've read.
@@davidgalaw9326 Thanks for sharing. I have never tried a motion setup, but would love to. I hope to buy one within a year but would definitely like to feel one before dropping thousands of dollars.
I run the DK2, done so for 5 months now, close to every day. Not once have i though i want more travel. I do 70% road , 20% rally and 10% drift of driving, in a high end rig. Actually, i run with mid to low settings, without smoothing most of the time. I really dont want to be moved all over the place, without G-forces. Thats would just distract me and make me slower. The DK systems use quite special algorythms that use the available travel smarter than many of it’s competitors, that might play a role in this as well.
@@AdamB5000 you're right... But a 150mm actuator that moves at 250mm/s is also fully capable of smaller displacements. The difference is that it can simulate slopes whereas the small actuators can't
Nah, dbox is also releasing a integrated motion system without controllers and same stats as their top model currently for 1.5k cheaper. Gen 5 releases next month
@@adamlitchfield3371 hasn’t been announced yet but I just put a 50% preorder on one through my local sim dealer. They got contacted by dbox last week. I have a photo of the new system though. :) no more controller boxes
Heard you need another ethernet plug in your motherboard or add another?
Рік тому+1
Correct. If you do not have an available network port available on the computer, a simple $20 USB to Ethernet adapter is required to connect to the controller.
I always think about why do this kind of systems have the motors on the "moving" part and not flip the system so the motor is "on the floor" (obviously taking into acount necessary design changes like motor disipation...) this way it will "free" the system to have to "push" it may not be a lot but may be 1 or 2 kg by "feet" will become available to move the rig it is mounted on.
Please review the new SFU gearboxes from DOF Reality. They should be a massive upgrade for a very reasonable price. Would be great in comparison with the older reviews. Thanks for the great & detailed content!
I have DOF P3 and I'm so diappointed with it for flight sim, it's cogging and stuttering when you do small movements for pitch and roll, I'm looking now for an option with actuators.
Too bad we can see the latency between the in-game motions and the motion system. Maybe the best would be to have the monitors attached on the whole cockpit. Or playing in VR, with my g29 and my oculus Quest 2 pCars 2 and AC feel fantastic to play. I spent tons of hours since last weeks on them in VR, I can't imagine how awesome it must be with your setup and a high end VR headset with a good FOV
I was watching this because I thought maybe one day I’d want to add a motion system. Then I saw the price of this system...now I’m like...let me just close this video.
Why does the controller box have to be so excessively large. It seems like there’s a lot of empty space in there. I just appreciate it when companies make things efficient and economical when it comes to their footprint
In regards to motion platforms, would it not be more advantageous to use the lightest cockpit you can(not sacrificing rigidity) to get the fastest travel from the actuators. I.e using the GT Omega method of using lower grade aluminum in non essential areas as opposed to thicker aluminum profiles all around from say Sim Lab, ASR and the like?
2 роки тому+6
Not necessarily. Feeling wise having some suspended weight feels great, but the system is able to provide smooth and consistent motion regardless of mass. ;-) The motors do work harder with more weight but as long as you are within spec, it should be just fine. ;-)
I think I purchased one of the first 10 units that these guys made, about a year ago (maybe 2?).
I called them on a Sunday and I talked at length with 2 of the guys there. These guys are really committed to their customer base. Their stuff is built (like a tank) like the stuff I see at my job and I work at a helicopter manufacturer. Very happy with my DK2 system.
Just like FANATEC! I mean exact opposite of Fanatec😄
Love the motion system reviews, Barry! Thank you, good sir!
I really enjoy the tuning in of new equipment. So fun.
Thankyou Barry i am going to book a test drive at the UK supplier, 150 miles from me but worth it to experience before I purchase I think. thanks again for a great review
@52:40 some of the rumbles in iRacing are painted and/or do not have the actual raised surfaces 3D modeled. This is specially true on the Red Bull Circuit or COTA.
Some games completely remove the 3D rumbles and instead rely on locational effects or basically a mapping of the location of the wheel to play an artificial "effects" that send vibrations to the wheel and/or controller rather than the vehicles actual suspension. This is done for efficiency reasons, such as time to model the track and/or to shorten the loading time (less polygons to load).
In short, a good motion system can shine some light on the level of detail that the track has from the developer.
Keep up the great quality sir!
Great review as always Barry. Just decided to get the FREX H shifter after a long while with my TH8A based on your review a while back thanks for the help! I would personally skip these and just spend the extra 1400 or 20% on the DK6 with 3x the suspension travel. From what I've also heard the actuators should be mounted so your seat area is roughly in the center between the actuators so it acts more like a real car would with you sitting roughly in the center of the car although you would probably have to get longer bars for your rig. Also what car sound is used in your intro? After listening to a Porsche 991.2 RSR GTE from the 2018/2019 season it sounds exactly like correct me if I am wrong.
Are you going to be reviewing the DK6?
Out of the 30+ motion Sims reviewed, which do you feel brings the best bang for the buck?
@@DnBVooDooDNA lol no.
From their website, “Due to lack of respect and disregard of the project license, which prohibits any commercial use, the project was paused.”
@@rHopkinz11 what does this mean? Does this mean people were using the product commercially when they weren't permitted to? Had this not happened would this have been the best bang for buck motion?
Thank you as always for such a thorough review. How does this compare to the DOF H3? Worth the price difference?
What is your opinion in comparison to a 4 Actuator D Box 1,5" motion system?
You ever get to make this comparison?
Good to see somebody using a full motion rig with the goal to match real world experience. I see way too many rigs jumping like a jack in the box with the driver being thrown around. Totally unrealistic! This looks pretty convincing.
Hi I'm considering doing a motion system with the Traction Plus and 4 actuators. What do you think about trying it. I saw you and a couple other guys do it before.
@srg - any feedback on the road texture setting? In the video you discussed engine vibration, but I don’t think you discussed road texture. Like you, I turn down engine vibration on my d-box because I think feeling the road is more important and satisfying
I noticed that even though you didn’t talk about it as a segment, you did talk about it. Thanks!
Rickenbacker Barry? Nice 😊
It probably cost as much as this manufacturer's lower spec'd DK2 system! 😉🎸
Barry your the best!
Whats the best budget motion system to buy when using Fanatec DD Pro wheelbase and fanatec CSL loadcell pedal kit?
Sehr interessantes Video 💪
This is something I don't understand just 50mm, a rally car goes up and down a bit more 100mm when you add it all up lol;, and the rest I'm not sure, but a normal car I do know, Can you also tell me what kind of music this is playing lol; db if you can thanks, Only the price is a bit high, especially if you have to order for Europe
With years of experience building simulators and motion systems for 🚗 manufacturers, we believe that a motion system with 2.0” of actuator travel is the optimal amount to produce a precise, responsive, tight and realistic experience for sim-racing. We believe that a compact 2.0" system is more than enough to realize our complex, multi-layer VelocityTrap motion algorithm. A longer actuator system certainly has some additional benefits, but the primary motion should still be kept within 2.0" for optimal speed and response (for sim racing application).Thanks info Barry And as usual thanks for the research
I heard that 50mm vs 150m argument many times.... Real cars do this or that... But I'm not in a real car. I'm in a sim that doesn't give me g forces. So i enjoy those extra mms to make up for the lack of g forces... Also, 150mm is a nice feature to simulate up slopes, and banks at Daytona.
@@davidgalaw9326 They also make a 6" kit. Many people in the motion industry suggest that subtle movements are the most convincing, at the moment. This is for many reasons, which likely includes the fact that we can't really simulate G-forces properly and completely. So if we have crazy or extreme motions, it can feel fake, while many indicate subtle movements are more convincing and "real" feeling when driving these sims.
Gamer Muscle did a video talking about motion platforms. He tested a ton of various platforms, and his general conclusion is subtle movements are most effective.
I'm not suggesting this is "right" or some golden rule. Just sharing what I've read.
@@davidgalaw9326 Thanks for sharing. I have never tried a motion setup, but would love to. I hope to buy one within a year but would definitely like to feel one before dropping thousands of dollars.
I run the DK2, done so for 5 months now, close to every day. Not once have i though i want more travel.
I do 70% road , 20% rally and 10% drift of driving, in a high end rig.
Actually, i run with mid to low settings, without smoothing most of the time.
I really dont want to be moved all over the place, without G-forces. Thats would just distract me and make me slower.
The DK systems use quite special algorythms that use the available travel smarter than many of it’s competitors, that might play a role in this as well.
@@AdamB5000 you're right... But a 150mm actuator that moves at 250mm/s is also fully capable of smaller displacements. The difference is that it can simulate slopes whereas the small actuators can't
Is this a D-box beater? 🤔
That's not a very high bar.
@@pt-actuatorukltd1118 Why does Barry use D-box himself then?
Nah, dbox is also releasing a integrated motion system without controllers and same stats as their top model currently for 1.5k cheaper. Gen 5 releases next month
@@vividpsychosis8222 Where and when has that been announced? Can't see anything online (?)
@@adamlitchfield3371 hasn’t been announced yet but I just put a 50% preorder on one through my local sim dealer. They got contacted by dbox last week. I have a photo of the new system though. :) no more controller boxes
WHAT RIG IS THAT U STRAPPED THEM TO ?CHEERS
Looks like a P1-X by Sim Lab. It's arguably the best premium semi-affordable cockpit on the market. ($1k+)
👏👏🙌
Another great review! Are you planning to review the new Motion Platform Plus from Next Level Racing?
How easy would it be to mount these on a rig such as an rseat P1?
I have seen some people have installed them on the P1 not really sure how they have done it, but I am guess it's not too bad
Requires some drilling with a provided template. Pictures here: www.racedepartment.com/threads/dk2-motion-system-usa-made.219697/page-5
Why no MSFS support?
Which is your fav motion platform that you use on a regular basis?
PT Actuator is my current go to. But there are other good ones out there.
Thanks@@simracinggarage3026 What are your thoughts on DK2 as that's easily accessible in the US?
It's a good system.
What shifter and handbrake is being used here?
Heard you need another ethernet plug in your motherboard or add another?
Correct. If you do not have an available network port available on the computer, a simple $20 USB to Ethernet adapter is required to connect to the controller.
I always think about why do this kind of systems have the motors on the "moving" part and not flip the system so the motor is "on the floor" (obviously taking into acount necessary design changes like motor disipation...) this way it will "free" the system to have to "push" it may not be a lot but may be 1 or 2 kg by "feet" will become available to move the rig it is mounted on.
Please review the new SFU gearboxes from DOF Reality. They should be a massive upgrade for a very reasonable price. Would be great in comparison with the older reviews. Thanks for the great & detailed content!
I have DOF P3 and I'm so diappointed with it for flight sim, it's cogging and stuttering when you do small movements for pitch and roll, I'm looking now for an option with actuators.
Too bad we can see the latency between the in-game motions and the motion system. Maybe the best would be to have the monitors attached on the whole cockpit. Or playing in VR, with my g29 and my oculus Quest 2 pCars 2 and AC feel fantastic to play. I spent tons of hours since last weeks on them in VR, I can't imagine how awesome it must be with your setup and a high end VR headset with a good FOV
I was watching this because I thought maybe one day I’d want to add a motion system. Then I saw the price of this system...now I’m like...let me just close this video.
Post covid, it went up $1,000
30:14 - BeamNG.drive is missing from that list
FACTS
Specially at 4000Hz
Why does the controller box have to be so excessively large. It seems like there’s a lot of empty space in there. I just appreciate it when companies make things efficient and economical when it comes to their footprint
15mm equals 3/4 of an inch. 13Mmm equals about 13mm.
nearly $7000 for this is a joke .i get that its a decent bit of kit but thats just taking the piss
What would you say is a reasonable price for a USA made motion system?
@@howihowi i dont know depends on the markup
A crappy seat motion system costs ~$5000, so $7000 is rather "reasonable"
@@Sithhy they all cost too much imo
@@scoobysnacks209 I was just going to say that Sigma's DK2 starts at $3,900. The system in this review is a premium version so it costs more.
In regards to motion platforms, would it not be more advantageous to use the lightest cockpit you can(not sacrificing rigidity) to get the fastest travel from the actuators. I.e using the GT Omega method of using lower grade aluminum in non essential areas as opposed to thicker aluminum profiles all around from say Sim Lab, ASR and the like?
Not necessarily. Feeling wise having some suspended weight feels great, but the system is able to provide smooth and consistent motion regardless of mass. ;-) The motors do work harder with more weight but as long as you are within spec, it should be just fine. ;-)