You're spot on man. I am the worst sales person. In all honesty, they didn't even tell me it was coming out when it did. I will get a video out and an actual spec out on the reticle.
Thanks, I appreciate it. I genuinely am growing to love this thing and the roll out was less than Ideal. But know you're not all to blame on it there. I'll make sure to get your last name right on the review when I finish it up 😁. Thanks for dropping in and letting us know.
@@navyman8903 absolutely man. I also posted the reticles data sheet on the blog of my website so it's accessible since I have no control over the Steiner website.
@@KineticConsulting I appreciate that and it's fair. They need to do their part which is admittedly much larger than yours. It's definitely their product that you had input on. I appreciate you picking up the slack, there's a lot of dudes with questions in forums across the internet.
How....on God's green earth did I not get any copyright claims? Also......Massive shoutout to GunDae for knocking out that reticle in 30mins for me on a Sunday, not a couple of hours like I said in the video. He's a wizard.. His channel is in the description.
About damn time, it only took me mispronouncing his last name to get his ass in gear. It's trash you have to sign up, but I'll take what I can get. I have to finish this review.
So, I just went outside to shoot a coyote. I now understand the massive circle on the Steiner. While this is user error, I think it's also reasonable... -My NX8 was last used during deer hunting/day time. I had it set to 7-8 (the off in between the two). -My NX8 was set to 1x as I leave it when indoors. I heard my dog barking his angry bark (He will bark curiously at possum, etc but when he gets angry you can tell, and it's always a coyote. He guards my chickens and has seen coyote kill them. He HATES coyote. That dog is literally friends with my flock, they nap togather, he knows their egg song vs. alarm calls, etc. it's wild). Anyway, I ran outside and threw the rifle to my shoulder after flicking the illumination knob. I was using a Cloud REIN 1.0 High Output. The dot was nuclear bright and at the distance the coyote was at washed him out. Long story short, I missed as he was running and I was unable to 100% get a clear shot. The backdrop was a mountain, so I am not worried about what was beyond my target (dirt and trees), but long story short, that large circle on the Steiner makes sense at this point and I'm considering one again. How have you enjoyed yours so far?
@@navyman8903 Well... I did find some blood this morning...how has the scope been, mechanically? Tracking, zero retention, etc? I guess I have a really hard time divorcing from Nightforce as that NX8 and ATACR were proofed to 10K rounds of simulated SCAR17 recoil and passed. The Steiner had some guys go shoot with it for an afternoon on a few SCAR17s.
Based on this, I think I will end up with another NX8 in FC-DMx. With fine tuning the diopter, it is very good on 1x for me, and the compromises in glass quality for my uses are very minimal. The gain in proven durability and the excellent reticle and illumination are unparalleled so far, IMO, in this class.
I like the reticle proposition, but the wind holds do not start until 3 mils down. In a 5.56 gun, that's 350-450 yards, depending on projectile/barrel length. The issue with Steiner's circle, here, is that it's "closed" and "thiccc" and it gets in the way of the 1 and 2 mil drop windage holds. This is why Nightforce's FC-DMx is segmented on the bottom half. Honestly, you're asking for a completely different reticle vs. just throwing some dots at this one, IMO.
Well the reticle does work as is, but the wind holds fix what people are asking for. The glass clarity would also allow for seeing perfectly what you're shooting at around 500-600 yards. Which is what 6x should be able to do for you.
Just got mine, love the scope, but the manual is terrible. Im kind of just a 1 or 6 guy personally.. It's sitting on an 8.3" galil ace in 7.62x39 so the 6x is more for seeing what's out there. The 1x is perfect for me and my bad eyes.
I was surprised to find this scope with so little information about it. I decided to upgrade my scope and mount on my 14.5 FN AR and thought this would be an excellent addition to replace my current P4Xi. Wind holds would have been awesome but at the price I found it (1,399.00 shipped) I pulled the trigger. Looking forward to your final review, subbed!
Thanks, I appreciate it. And I'm hoping to make a few more range trips with it then be able to do an informed review on it. So far I am loving it though.
Thanks for making this video. Currently torn between this and vortex razor 1-6 for general purpose carbine. Would you recommend the Steiner over the vortex?
That will depend on focal plane preference honestly. Both are clean and precise at 6x, glass is great on both. Eye relief is probably slightly better on the Vortex. The Steiner is tested more and has a deeper submersion depth. They're close for sure. I'd say focal plane and the 1x is what will be the determining factor.
@@navyman8903 in your personal opinion, which one has the better 1x? The vortex is really bright Illumination and good eye relief so I see why it's still the "go-to" optic for 3 gun. Is the Steiner better at 1x than the razor?
The more I see how crazy some reticles were designed, the more I appreciate my Bushnell's. The bad part is, now that they're discontinued, if I ever have enough money to fork, I wouldn't know what scope to get. Back to the ACOG, maybe?
Acogs are great for what they are designed for. I just think you get a lot more flexibility with lpvo. Especially if you get one featuring mils. MOA needs to die and once you transition to mils you’ll never go back.
@@Runningmancs I'm actually used to MOA, and find myself hard to make a transition. But you're right, the fixed power ACOG, even given a top-mounted red dot, is a legacy system. But still, I find it hard to shell out my shekels for something made by chi-coms, and as well, not having enough to fork something premium.
Mr. Navyman..... If you ever feel like selling any of your optics, gear, honestly whatever... I'd be happy to purchase directly from you. I wanted the steiner 1-4x but they jacked the price WAY up...
I just don't understand how a company can go through all the trouble to design a reticle like this, and not put out in the manual the actual details for it. How is that possible?
Preference to reticles in LPVOs can be very subjective based on the user. Coming from about a year of saving and researching optics, it is difficult to decide on a purchase. C_Does finally sold me on the PLX C 1-8 and I have not regretted the purchase. Clear glass, excellent reticle, lightweight and within price range. Durability I have not tested, nor will I LOL! but Sage Dynamics dropped the original PLX 1-8 and it lived, so you may take that "data" for what it's worth.
@NAVYMAN8903 Understandable. I've never looked through the NX8, but the commonality between the two I find is the shortening of the optic. Keeping it shorter lightens the load, but may detract in performance elsewhere. Phrasing 😂
As for lack of info with/about the product, I believe Steiner is owned by Beretta right? I just bought a Beretta APX A1 that came with no manual, there was postcard thing you can mail them requesting a paper manual
@farklestaxbaum4945 There was no *manual* with your APX A1? Good grief that is cheap! Beretta puts out some good stuff still, but they are a very, very weird company sometimes.
A-fuckin-men on the whole point of not having to dial on an LPVO. All I've been looking for is a decent tree reticle on a FFP scope that has a top end of 6x or 8x.
You should contact Steiner via a phone call and have a discussion with them. They **MAY** have the proper info - or maybe not. DuFresne (pronounced DuFraine here in South Louisiana) May have better info, too.
Thanks for the unpaid explanatory Steiner should have done. I get your point about ring distracting from dot at certain mag settings. About the mini tree: how have folks managed shots for over 100 yrs w/o trees and Horus varieties? Sincere Q, is it that hard to visualize right angle geometry w/in a std hashed cross?
You're welcome. It's something they should have done themselves. I hope my Cross reference to the reticle at 6x sticks so they learn....but we'll see. And I do get that. I've made due without, but wind hold trees in the reticle make it much easier to get things done.
@@navyman8903 Thanks. I ask because sometimes I find the tree distracting vs helping, but that's probably a time/training bias with much less time on trees. "Get those dots out of my picture!" is how it seems sometimes.
The glass is incredibly flat and clear. I'm just trying to learn the reticle at this point. I don't think they're open to changes or anything like that.
@@navyman8903 I wonder who they are designing for.? The 2.5-15 looks great but locking windage and reticle choice kill it. You should have John Duf on to discuss.
@@navyman8903 honestly makes no sense not to include them. I still want more mag so maybe they’ll make a lighter and shorter 1-8 with your new and improved reticle, otherwise it’s the PA or hold for leupold to put a decent reticle in that 2-10 sometime by 2025
@@navyman8903 also, will you try some type of side by side comparison of the glass in the Steiner compared to the credo ffp? Cause honestly, if they implemented your reticle design I think they’d sell well, and I’d have to seriously consider it
Steiner makes some great stuff but there Red dots were so bad. Each and every time I wasted my money I would be so pissed. My fault for buying them online but finding them in store is always so difficult. I don’t know why it’s so hard to make a bright enough red dot that you can see it when THE SUNS OUT.
Them not explaining their product is like how some companies make new high-tech light weight receiver or part but then don't actually list the actual weight anywhere. Drives me nuts.
You're spot on man. I am the worst sales person. In all honesty, they didn't even tell me it was coming out when it did. I will get a video out and an actual spec out on the reticle.
Thanks, I appreciate it. I genuinely am growing to love this thing and the roll out was less than Ideal. But know you're not all to blame on it there. I'll make sure to get your last name right on the review when I finish it up 😁. Thanks for dropping in and letting us know.
@@navyman8903 absolutely man. I also posted the reticles data sheet on the blog of my website so it's accessible since I have no control over the Steiner website.
@@KineticConsulting I appreciate that and it's fair. They need to do their part which is admittedly much larger than yours. It's definitely their product that you had input on. I appreciate you picking up the slack, there's a lot of dudes with questions in forums across the internet.
How....on God's green earth did I not get any copyright claims? Also......Massive shoutout to GunDae for knocking out that reticle in 30mins for me on a Sunday, not a couple of hours like I said in the video. He's a wizard.. His channel is in the description.
This seems to have very similar issues to the Vudu FFP reticles.
Yup. A little cleaner, but the same downsides.
Duffy just added a blog entry explaining the reticle on his site. You have to sign up to see it.
About damn time, it only took me mispronouncing his last name to get his ass in gear. It's trash you have to sign up, but I'll take what I can get. I have to finish this review.
And I thought I wasn’t looking at the correct websites looking for the recital information. Excellent video.
So, I just went outside to shoot a coyote. I now understand the massive circle on the Steiner. While this is user error, I think it's also reasonable...
-My NX8 was last used during deer hunting/day time. I had it set to 7-8 (the off in between the two).
-My NX8 was set to 1x as I leave it when indoors.
I heard my dog barking his angry bark (He will bark curiously at possum, etc but when he gets angry you can tell, and it's always a coyote. He guards my chickens and has seen coyote kill them. He HATES coyote. That dog is literally friends with my flock, they nap togather, he knows their egg song vs. alarm calls, etc. it's wild).
Anyway, I ran outside and threw the rifle to my shoulder after flicking the illumination knob. I was using a Cloud REIN 1.0 High Output. The dot was nuclear bright and at the distance the coyote was at washed him out. Long story short, I missed as he was running and I was unable to 100% get a clear shot. The backdrop was a mountain, so I am not worried about what was beyond my target (dirt and trees), but long story short, that large circle on the Steiner makes sense at this point and I'm considering one again. How have you enjoyed yours so far?
I really have enjoyed it so far and grown to love it now that I've taken it out to 616 yards repeatedly.
@@navyman8903 Well... I did find some blood this morning...how has the scope been, mechanically? Tracking, zero retention, etc? I guess I have a really hard time divorcing from Nightforce as that NX8 and ATACR were proofed to 10K rounds of simulated SCAR17 recoil and passed. The Steiner had some guys go shoot with it for an afternoon on a few SCAR17s.
@@UnobtaniumsQuickReviews I did a review on it, but it tracks well, and th3 glass is very clear.
Based on this, I think I will end up with another NX8 in FC-DMx. With fine tuning the diopter, it is very good on 1x for me, and the compromises in glass quality for my uses are very minimal. The gain in proven durability and the excellent reticle and illumination are unparalleled so far, IMO, in this class.
Eagerly awaited video. Appreciate the content.
Thanks for watching, I appreciate it.
Based and Christpilled reticle design
Precisely my brother in Christ.
I like the reticle proposition, but the wind holds do not start until 3 mils down. In a 5.56 gun, that's 350-450 yards, depending on projectile/barrel length. The issue with Steiner's circle, here, is that it's "closed" and "thiccc" and it gets in the way of the 1 and 2 mil drop windage holds. This is why Nightforce's FC-DMx is segmented on the bottom half. Honestly, you're asking for a completely different reticle vs. just throwing some dots at this one, IMO.
Well the reticle does work as is, but the wind holds fix what people are asking for. The glass clarity would also allow for seeing perfectly what you're shooting at around 500-600 yards. Which is what 6x should be able to do for you.
ah yes i was wondering what was going on with that reticle
It starts looking stupid, but when you start using it, things start to make sense. But I will say at 3x and 4x that ring doesn't get out of the way.
Steiner is proving itself to be a High Too Dog over some other heavy hitters
WTF is a high too dog?!
Just got mine, love the scope, but the manual is terrible. Im kind of just a 1 or 6 guy personally.. It's sitting on an 8.3" galil ace in 7.62x39 so the 6x is more for seeing what's out there. The 1x is perfect for me and my bad eyes.
I was surprised to find this scope with so little information about it. I decided to upgrade my scope and mount on my 14.5 FN AR and thought this would be an excellent addition to replace my current P4Xi. Wind holds would have been awesome but at the price I found it (1,399.00 shipped) I pulled the trigger. Looking forward to your final review, subbed!
Thanks, I appreciate it. And I'm hoping to make a few more range trips with it then be able to do an informed review on it. So far I am loving it though.
@@navyman8903 looking forward to it!
Thanks for making this video. Currently torn between this and vortex razor 1-6 for general purpose carbine. Would you recommend the Steiner over the vortex?
That will depend on focal plane preference honestly. Both are clean and precise at 6x, glass is great on both. Eye relief is probably slightly better on the Vortex. The Steiner is tested more and has a deeper submersion depth. They're close for sure. I'd say focal plane and the 1x is what will be the determining factor.
@@navyman8903 in your personal opinion, which one has the better 1x? The vortex is really bright Illumination and good eye relief so I see why it's still the "go-to" optic for 3 gun. Is the Steiner better at 1x than the razor?
The more I see how crazy some reticles were designed, the more I appreciate my Bushnell's.
The bad part is, now that they're discontinued, if I ever have enough money to fork, I wouldn't know what scope to get.
Back to the ACOG, maybe?
I want to love the ACOGs but they're good at what they are, but not what we may need. If that makes sense.
@@navyman8903 Kind of get what you're talking about, but not entirely, on the ACOG. Then again, yeah...
@@navyman8903 I mean, after all, the ACOG is two decades old, if not older.
Acogs are great for what they are designed for. I just think you get a lot more flexibility with lpvo. Especially if you get one featuring mils. MOA needs to die and once you transition to mils you’ll never go back.
@@Runningmancs I'm actually used to MOA, and find myself hard to make a transition. But you're right, the fixed power ACOG, even given a top-mounted red dot, is a legacy system. But still, I find it hard to shell out my shekels for something made by chi-coms, and as well, not having enough to fork something premium.
holy shit, a girls_frontline UMP 45 in a NAVYMAN video, this is really something
Can you see the center dot unilluminated well enough on 1x or even 2x for a close, but precise shot on a small target?
Yes, but it's dimmer.
Jeez you sure know how to make a guy blush lol.
You did a phenomenal job.
Mr. Navyman..... If you ever feel like selling any of your optics, gear, honestly whatever... I'd be happy to purchase directly from you. I wanted the steiner 1-4x but they jacked the price WAY up...
I just don't understand how a company can go through all the trouble to design a reticle like this, and not put out in the manual the actual details for it. How is that possible?
I'm trying to understand that myself.
Probably because they contracted it out and didn't really design anything themselves.
My homeboy at 0:52 is pissed too.. see how he got turnt up at the reviewers BS....
Yes indeed. He couldn't contain himself. He has all sorts of perfect timing lately.
What is the battery life? I can’t seem to find any specifications anywhere?
Preference to reticles in LPVOs can be very subjective based on the user. Coming from about a year of saving and researching optics, it is difficult to decide on a purchase. C_Does finally sold me on the PLX C 1-8 and I have not regretted the purchase. Clear glass, excellent reticle, lightweight and within price range. Durability I have not tested, nor will I LOL! but Sage Dynamics dropped the original PLX 1-8 and it lived, so you may take that "data" for what it's worth.
I have heard that, but I think the glass is a bit stretched. I am eyeing it from time to time, but something keeps stopping me. It gives me NX8 vibes.
@NAVYMAN8903 Understandable. I've never looked through the NX8, but the commonality between the two I find is the shortening of the optic. Keeping it shorter lightens the load, but may detract in performance elsewhere. Phrasing 😂
As for lack of info with/about the product, I believe Steiner is owned by Beretta right? I just bought a Beretta APX A1 that came with no manual, there was postcard thing you can mail them requesting a paper manual
Good point. They might be cutting costs.
@farklestaxbaum4945 There was no *manual* with your APX A1? Good grief that is cheap! Beretta puts out some good stuff still, but they are a very, very weird company sometimes.
I know you had a razor gen 3, i have the g2 on my urgi and its money, have you tried it?
I have, I think it's their best offering followed by the PST Gen II.
I can pick a new one up for $975, is it worth it or should I look at something else in that price range?
It's awesome at that price.
Sweet, thx for the video review and reply. Cheers
A-fuckin-men on the whole point of not having to dial on an LPVO. All I've been looking for is a decent tree reticle on a FFP scope that has a top end of 6x or 8x.
And doesn’t cost NF ATACR money 😊
Eotech Vudu 1-10 LE reticle looks similar.
You should contact Steiner via a phone call and have a discussion with them. They **MAY** have the proper info - or maybe not.
DuFresne (pronounced DuFraine here in South Louisiana) May have better info, too.
I'm actually going to try that here soon.
And thanks for the pronunciation. I suck with last names.
@@navyman8903 for some reason, anything that ends up with "-esne" is pronounced as "-een" or "-aine".
French is weird Lol.
@@seijiroukikuoka5975Like that school in PGH, Duquesne ("doo-cane").
Every video I see of this makes the outer circle look so much brighter than the center dot at 1x, is this true or is it a camera thing?
I have to say for ghetto rigged recording setup it actually came out pretty well.
Thanks. I might have to try to rig something more stable here soon.
@@navyman8903 also I live 45 mins from jtac, would be cool to see you out there sometime.
Thanks for the unpaid explanatory Steiner should have done. I get your point about ring distracting from dot at certain mag settings.
About the mini tree: how have folks managed shots for over 100 yrs w/o trees and Horus varieties? Sincere Q, is it that hard to visualize right angle geometry w/in a std hashed cross?
You're welcome. It's something they should have done themselves. I hope my Cross reference to the reticle at 6x sticks so they learn....but we'll see.
And I do get that. I've made due without, but wind hold trees in the reticle make it much easier to get things done.
@@navyman8903 Thanks. I ask because sometimes I find the tree distracting vs helping, but that's probably a time/training bias with much less time on trees. "Get those dots out of my picture!" is how it seems sometimes.
@@seanoneil277 I do appreciate a clean picture at times, and I do appreciate the tree at times. All situationally dependent for me.
Would totally buy a T6Xi with the NM89 reticle.
The glass is incredibly flat and clear. I'm just trying to learn the reticle at this point. I don't think they're open to changes or anything like that.
@@navyman8903 I wonder who they are designing for.? The 2.5-15 looks great but locking windage and reticle choice kill it. You should have John Duf on to discuss.
What distance did you end up zeroing at?
I did a dirty 50/200 zero. I'm going to check it again today.
Wind holds would make me want to buy this
It would drastically improve the 6X for 500-600 yards.
@@navyman8903 honestly makes no sense not to include them. I still want more mag so maybe they’ll make a lighter and shorter 1-8 with your new and improved reticle, otherwise it’s the PA or hold for leupold to put a decent reticle in that 2-10 sometime by 2025
@@navyman8903 also, will you try some type of side by side comparison of the glass in the Steiner compared to the credo ffp? Cause honestly, if they implemented your reticle design I think they’d sell well, and I’d have to seriously consider it
Roman Catholicism isn’t Christian so I’ll think it’s not 😇 but definitely a true cross ❤!
Extremely good video as always brother
Whats the eye relief on this thing?
Shorter than advertised as you dial up the magnification. 1x is about 3.5 to 4" based on diopter setting. But this does get shorter at 6x.
It looking like a Roman Catholic cross sold me on it, it’s going on my patrol rifle #StateTrooper
Center them and then send them to Jesus lmfao I’m weak
Glad someone appreciated it.
HELLLOOOOOOOO!
Hi there!
Yeah….. I’m gonna just stick to my 1-6x vortex razor gen2 e and my slew of chinesium primary Arms 1-6 & 1-8 scopes ACSS 😊😁😇
Steiner makes some great stuff but there Red dots were so bad. Each and every time I wasted my money I would be so pissed. My fault for buying them online but finding them in store is always so difficult. I don’t know why it’s so hard to make a bright enough red dot that you can see it when THE SUNS OUT.
True. The dots needed work. Cool ideas honestly, but poor brightness and run time. Their MPS is much better though. They are improving.
happy Sunday Semper Fortnite or whatever it is we're supposed to say
I'm definitely stealing that.
Hah 👍🏻✝️lol
I thought LPVOs sucked. 🤔
I know right?
Hey, his last name is pronounced "Dufrane" is common speak. It's French and "S" is silent. Come on dude!!!😀
Dude, “dew-frane” my god, did all of you simps go to Appalachian State?
Lol.
Cops and mil dudes can buy this for 977 fyi guys if u got an expert voice account
STEINER
Them not explaining their product is like how some companies make new high-tech light weight receiver or part but then don't actually list the actual weight anywhere. Drives me nuts.
Yeah, it's pure laziness in a saturated market.
THE NUMBERS, MASON. WHAT DO THEY MEAN?
Well played. Baller comment.
@@navyman8903 Makes me happy when you post new stuff my friend
@@donrickles845 I appreciate you watching.
Love the sabaton so what lpvos do you recommend then?
Well I haven't done the review on this yet. I will have a video on LPVOs I recommend and why here soon.