Just a theory, but since we know, that Ancestor can replicate himself and that replicants are not always exact copiest, wouldn't it be possible that there are two Ancestors? What if Ancestor really became the herald of the Heart and mastered self perservation through multipliing and replication. But one replicant was...different. He saw, what was happening and guilt stroke him. This replicant is the one who escaped the Dungeon and saw the mob storming the manor. As he knew, the mob or the Ancestor himself would kill him, he wrote the letter and killed himself. And the original Ancestor remained by the Heart. The Replicant Ancestor, or his spirit or ghost, then guides us through the horrors of the dungeon, trying to kill his own creator, whereas original Ancestor vaits patiently, as he became one with Heart.
i think if this was even somewhat possible we would have had a single journal about it or somethin no? i like the headcannon but i think thats all it is sadly
I liked the whole world and feel of sunless sea, but the weird lore history, and lack of explanations made me stop enjoying the lore, and the weak way missions are set made me stop playing.
@@mistersippi2945 The lore is intentionally obtuse and mostly left to players to decipher, but I find it engaging. There’s a feeling that you’re chasing down leads and learning forbidden secrets.
Now we are left with the question how does this lead into Darkest Dungeon 2. With the context from this video I watched the ending of DD1 and the "A Glimmer of Hope" trailer for DD2. With this I think it's clear, the ancestor's schemes were a success. The monster in the Earth has all but awaken, and the corruption that consumed the manor is now consuming the world. But his victory is not absolute as the player and the heroes are still alive (mostly) and are trying redeem themselves for their unwitting role in the ancestors plot by saving the world and permanently ending the threat.
having played the EA it seems to have a kind of 'the world has ended, you must restore it' kind of vibe as where you start seems to be outside of space and time
Great to see you put together a good explanation for the chronology! Glad I could lend you my... expertise. Personally I'd love to further explore the location of the Hamlet as we've previously discussed.
Quite interesting video, alot of points have been made that more or less seem to tie up the lore. I've been watching your videos recently, to say I have been theorising myself lore of Darkest Dungeon but I never came to write it down, you on the other hand made a excellent execution of the ideas. I also tend to call this family the "Ironcrown" as I found its name on one of the merchandise with Darkest Dungon even if doesn't fit it seems like a good placeholder.
I welcome you to the channel. Ironcrown is a good one since it's all over the place in-game. (It's the stress symbol) I've heard of House Corvid from the Family sigil. My personal one is House Darklyn, but that's a Game of Thrones reference too.
Maybe you could do a lore of all the bosses? I know you talked about them a little bit here and the ancestor video but maybe you could do something like you did with the fanatic lore video? Look at the moveset, designs and what the ancestor says about them to come up with ideas on where they come from or how they got to where to the state they where when we meet them. Or maybe a heir lore video but then again we have really little information given about us so that could maybe be a interesting topic to discuss your theorys about the heir.
* In my best countess voice * A fascinating exposay on the ansestors my darling~ Ti's a shame he bested me, for the court could have used his powers for much more... Gluttoerness exploited ~ (but srsly though, great video Matt. Its interesting to hear the ansestor's writings and how everything went down. Keep doing what your doing ^^)
one thing to remember about the ancestor is that the letter was the last thing the ancestor did as a human, all the narration we hear in game is after he merged with the heart, so how much of the cruelty in the narrations comments was genuinely the ancestors own or the hearts influence is unknown, one also has to wonder if when he spoke about telling the prophet "the full extent of my plans" if that was the ancestor or the heart speaking, perhaps his suicide was both, his regrets and suicide were genuine in a brief moment of sanity away from the hearts madness, but even still the heart twisted his thoughts enough to ensure he would not flee the hamlet or give himself to the mob or anything else that might let him escape it in death and that the letter that the ancestor thought was the last hope to stop what he had done would serve its plan as well
These videos (both this and the movie one) where REALLY well done, happy I stumbled across them. The one issue I have is the time frame, its implied dozens, if not hundreds of years from the start of things until you turn up, and yet that doesn't make sense assuming you the player are just a normal human. The only thing I can think of is its been several generations and for some reason only now you are getting the letter, maybe its been in the family but not opened? I could see how maybe your parent or grandparent wanted nothing to do with the ancestor and left his letter unopened and it wasn't until you found it that the call was answered. I am just making guesses at this point but it will be interesting to see if they expand more on that in 2
I love this game’s lore and you and your friends are doing it great on exploring it. I love the ideas of future videos (specially the XCOM one :3). Keep on going because, remember that there can be no bravery without madness
11:48 Given all the other stuff the Ancestor did, I feel like a third reason the Ancestor decided to murder his guests/teachers was "Because I could." This would have been after the Ancestor had proven himself to be extraordinary skilled in magic from said tutoring, so he felt more confident that he could get away with it.
Love your videos! Ngl learning about the bosses and the factions/areas would be super cool. Or expanding into new games like the Cultist Simulator you showed at the end
I feel sorry for the Waif maybe most of all, she got sacrificed to an ancient unknowable evil because she didn’t have the courage to ask out her crush.
Would you, maybe, put Iratus on the program and explore the other side of the villainous fence, so to speak? I had already come to most of these conclusions while I was playing the game but the narrative prowess of these videos would make the ancestor and Morgan Freeman proud. More videogame lore is in need of this. Keep on creating.
My theory is that the Prophet isn't exactly a descendant of creatures which built the ruins but another person with contacts to eldritch force oposed to what Ancestor wanted to do. Mind that what Church in the place where Darkest Dungeon takes place has it's own god- The Holy Light, which might be another eldritch being (for all Cosmic horror sake)
In my opinion, the ancestor is driven mad by the drop of the blood he drank, which causes him to begin the excavations and his pursuits of the arcane. Then he suffers another mental break when he finally sees the terror he has awoken, and it shakes him from his desire to bring about the end of the world. He kills himself out of the guilt of his deeds, with the letter being a genuine attempt at restoring the family name and destroying the heart; but the heart takes his likeness and his voice to be both an avatar and an encouragement for the player to continue sacrificing heroes so that the heart may grow.
I was always a little confused about the end of the game. The darkest dungeon world is stuck in an eternal loop as shown at the end of the game, so my question would be. Does time really go back and everything is repeated or just new heroes appear when you send the letters again?
It's complicated. The main issue I find with the whole, we become the next Ancestor, is that would imply that we repeat all the same mistakes as the one we meet. Meaning we would have our own Hag, Mariners, Siren etc. It's a loop in the sense of time repeating. When we first travel along the old road the cycle begins. But our ghost from the previous times we've stopped the Heart still lingers in the Estate. Pointing away to tell us to leave. We are bounded to the Estate though. The cycle of an Heir trying to redeem and reclaim his Ancestral home and the Ancestor who brought it all to pass. All we can do is hold the line. But as a elf assassin I know once said. "In the war against Darkness, stalemate is victory"
@@MiskatonicMemorialist a little late but i think what happend and what is going to happend is that the heart of darkness and the ancestor understimated the heroes (they just saw them as sacrifices) because we know that at least two cicles had to happen one is where the crusader sacrifices to stop the heart and one maybe is one when no one dies because the heroes kill the heart with one hit (the leper ), maybe us as the heir we remeber what is happening so no mather if we kill the heart everything will go back in a cicle, that why in DD II now we are runing from the state and we are killing the lungs the brain and the eyes not to kill the heart but maybe to stop him for make it weaker or sent it to sleep again
@@MiskatonicMemorialist The events of the ancestors life are so specific I think it's much more possible that it's a literal time loop, not the player repeating the same story as the ancestor.
Terá teorias sobre o zelador ou o "Protagonista/player"? Adoraria saber sua opinião :D Continue com o trabalho maravilhoso! Will you have theories about the caretaker or the "Protagonist / player"? I would love to hear your opinion :D Keep up the wonderful work!
i love how the moment the Ancestor find the Heart of the world is the point were ´´things get weird´´, like, what was all that happen before? a snack of crazy bullshit?
Yeah check the description, and check out the movie if you haven't already. Although I should say the art already existed in the community I just asked and they said sure.
Is it wierd that i assume based on some dialogue of the academician that the amcestor has his own momemt of guilt.Basically i think that the heroes won against the final boss, but the ancestors mistakes have now extended to the whole world and now the academician is the only one who knows how to combat them.
The reason i say this is because i believe that the ancestor we see in the end is a manifestation of the hearth if darkness, not the one who wants us to know and destroy the extenr of his failures.
That's an interesting topic that I've thought on a bit. A distant branch of the family tree is my theory, making him the heir's uncle or great-uncle. If the Ancestor inherited the lands then he was probably either the oldest or the only child, with a cousin far away from the estate. It's all speculation since the Ancestor doesn't specifically mention anything.
When you're looking at other games for the channel don't skip out on Fear & Hunger, it has more of a mature rating and has sensitive subject matter.. But if you can tolerate that the theme is very close to Darkest Dungeon in how it handles dungeon delving and the feeling of hopelessness in the face of unknown horrors.
Hey, what about the ending? What on Earth does it mean? I was waiting for the whole video some wild speculations about the ending, and I didn't hear a word. Consider making a whole video about it.
thx for the video honestly the ancestor is one of the biggets pros of the game. unfortunately i feel darkest dungeon 2, from what i have seen so far is inferior.
Fun fact the ancestor was supposed to have a smaller role but they loved the voice so much they gave him a bigger role in the story
And now I can't imagine the game without him.
@@MiskatonicMemorialist did you know he reads hp lovecraft on auidable ( thats actually how they found the voice actor
@@geoshark12 I need this in my life right now
Darkest dungeon without Wayne June and Stuart’s work wouldn’t be the same
Just a theory, but since we know, that Ancestor can replicate himself and that replicants are not always exact copiest, wouldn't it be possible that there are two Ancestors?
What if Ancestor really became the herald of the Heart and mastered self perservation through multipliing and replication. But one replicant was...different. He saw, what was happening and guilt stroke him. This replicant is the one who escaped the Dungeon and saw the mob storming the manor. As he knew, the mob or the Ancestor himself would kill him, he wrote the letter and killed himself. And the original Ancestor remained by the Heart.
The Replicant Ancestor, or his spirit or ghost, then guides us through the horrors of the dungeon, trying to kill his own creator, whereas original Ancestor vaits patiently, as he became one with Heart.
It’s out there, but it’s cool as hell to consider.
i think if this was even somewhat possible we would have had a single journal about it or somethin no? i like the headcannon but i think thats all it is sadly
I would deffinelty watch a sunless sea lore video. But exploring the lore of enemies would be nice too...
*or sunless skies
I liked the whole world and feel of sunless sea, but the weird lore history, and lack of explanations made me stop enjoying the lore, and the weak way missions are set made me stop playing.
@@anthony_pr1033 is huh ccc h go oh I
@@mistersippi2945 The lore is intentionally obtuse and mostly left to players to decipher, but I find it engaging. There’s a feeling that you’re chasing down leads and learning forbidden secrets.
Now we are left with the question how does this lead into Darkest Dungeon 2. With the context from this video I watched the ending of DD1 and the "A Glimmer of Hope" trailer for DD2. With this I think it's clear, the ancestor's schemes were a success. The monster in the Earth has all but awaken, and the corruption that consumed the manor is now consuming the world. But his victory is not absolute as the player and the heroes are still alive (mostly) and are trying redeem themselves for their unwitting role in the ancestors plot by saving the world and permanently ending the threat.
having played the EA it seems to have a kind of 'the world has ended, you must restore it' kind of vibe as where you start seems to be outside of space and time
Great to see you put together a good explanation for the chronology!
Glad I could lend you my... expertise.
Personally I'd love to further explore the location of the Hamlet as we've previously discussed.
Quite interesting video, alot of points have been made that more or less seem to tie up the lore.
I've been watching your videos recently, to say I have been theorising myself lore of Darkest Dungeon but I never came to write it down, you on the other hand made a excellent execution of the ideas. I also tend to call this family the "Ironcrown" as I found its name on one of the merchandise with Darkest Dungon even if doesn't fit it seems like a good placeholder.
I welcome you to the channel. Ironcrown is a good one since it's all over the place in-game. (It's the stress symbol)
I've heard of House Corvid from the Family sigil. My personal one is House Darklyn, but that's a Game of Thrones reference too.
@@MiskatonicMemorialist I imagined something like Ravenhold or Ravencrest due to the, well Raven as the motif...
Glimpse the light of Wolfstack Docks,
And heed the Drownie's zong.
The beasts are foul, and darkness raw,
You best not lodge for long.
Maybe you could do a lore of all the bosses? I know you talked about them a little bit here and the ancestor video but maybe you could do something like you did with the fanatic lore video? Look at the moveset, designs and what the ancestor says about them to come up with ideas on where they come from or how they got to where to the state they where when we meet them.
Or maybe a heir lore video but then again we have really little information given about us so that could maybe be a interesting topic to discuss your theorys about the heir.
Yeah the boss lore would be tied in with the areas and factions since most bosses are the leaders of their factions.
Exploring the lore of the enemies and locations would be good.
* In my best countess voice *
A fascinating exposay on the ansestors my darling~
Ti's a shame he bested me, for the court could have used his powers for much more... Gluttoerness exploited ~
(but srsly though, great video Matt. Its interesting to hear the ansestor's writings and how everything went down. Keep doing what your doing ^^)
Always a pleasure Renara you're always welcomed on the channel.
one thing to remember about the ancestor is that the letter was the last thing the ancestor did as a human, all the narration we hear in game is after he merged with the heart, so how much of the cruelty in the narrations comments was genuinely the ancestors own or the hearts influence is unknown, one also has to wonder if when he spoke about telling the prophet "the full extent of my plans" if that was the ancestor or the heart speaking, perhaps his suicide was both, his regrets and suicide were genuine in a brief moment of sanity away from the hearts madness, but even still the heart twisted his thoughts enough to ensure he would not flee the hamlet or give himself to the mob or anything else that might let him escape it in death and that the letter that the ancestor thought was the last hope to stop what he had done would serve its plan as well
These videos (both this and the movie one) where REALLY well done, happy I stumbled across them. The one issue I have is the time frame, its implied dozens, if not hundreds of years from the start of things until you turn up, and yet that doesn't make sense assuming you the player are just a normal human.
The only thing I can think of is its been several generations and for some reason only now you are getting the letter, maybe its been in the family but not opened? I could see how maybe your parent or grandparent wanted nothing to do with the ancestor and left his letter unopened and it wasn't until you found it that the call was answered. I am just making guesses at this point but it will be interesting to see if they expand more on that in 2
I love this game’s lore and you and your friends are doing it great on exploring it. I love the ideas of future videos (specially the XCOM one :3). Keep on going because, remember that there can be no bravery without madness
11:48 Given all the other stuff the Ancestor did, I feel like a third reason the Ancestor decided to murder his guests/teachers was "Because I could." This would have been after the Ancestor had proven himself to be extraordinary skilled in magic from said tutoring, so he felt more confident that he could get away with it.
I’m late to the party, but Sunless sea lore would be so dope!! Love the content!
much better than the long version with all the stops and starts
Love your videos! Ngl learning about the bosses and the factions/areas would be super cool. Or expanding into new games like the Cultist Simulator you showed at the end
Like it already hasn't been weird up until this point lol 19:25
Completely normal. Nothing unnatural happening over here. Nope. Nothing at all. Lol
@@MiskatonicMemorialist Lmao
I feel sorry for the Waif maybe most of all, she got sacrificed to an ancient unknowable evil because she didn’t have the courage to ask out her crush.
bro finally someone tries to explain the lore of this masterpiece
Would you, maybe, put Iratus on the program and explore the other side of the villainous fence, so to speak? I had already come to most of these conclusions while I was playing the game but the narrative prowess of these videos would make the ancestor and Morgan Freeman proud. More videogame lore is in need of this. Keep on creating.
My theory is that the Prophet isn't exactly a descendant of creatures which built the ruins but another person with contacts to eldritch force oposed to what Ancestor wanted to do.
Mind that what Church in the place where Darkest Dungeon takes place has it's own god- The Holy Light, which might be another eldritch being (for all Cosmic horror sake)
In my opinion, the ancestor is driven mad by the drop of the blood he drank, which causes him to begin the excavations and his pursuits of the arcane. Then he suffers another mental break when he finally sees the terror he has awoken, and it shakes him from his desire to bring about the end of the world. He kills himself out of the guilt of his deeds, with the letter being a genuine attempt at restoring the family name and destroying the heart; but the heart takes his likeness and his voice to be both an avatar and an encouragement for the player to continue sacrificing heroes so that the heart may grow.
Love the content, keep it up!
I was always a little confused about the end of the game. The darkest dungeon world is stuck in an eternal loop as shown at the end of the game, so my question would be.
Does time really go back and everything is repeated or just new heroes appear when you send the letters again?
It's complicated. The main issue I find with the whole, we become the next Ancestor, is that would imply that we repeat all the same mistakes as the one we meet. Meaning we would have our own Hag, Mariners, Siren etc.
It's a loop in the sense of time repeating. When we first travel along the old road the cycle begins. But our ghost from the previous times we've stopped the Heart still lingers in the Estate. Pointing away to tell us to leave. We are bounded to the Estate though. The cycle of an Heir trying to redeem and reclaim his Ancestral home and the Ancestor who brought it all to pass. All we can do is hold the line. But as a elf assassin I know once said. "In the war against Darkness, stalemate is victory"
@@MiskatonicMemorialist a little late but i think what happend and what is going to happend is that the heart of darkness and the ancestor understimated the heroes (they just saw them as sacrifices) because we know that at least two cicles had to happen one is where the crusader sacrifices to stop the heart and one maybe is one when no one dies because the heroes kill the heart with one hit (the leper ), maybe us as the heir we remeber what is happening so no mather if we kill the heart everything will go back in a cicle, that why in DD II now we are runing from the state and we are killing the lungs the brain and the eyes not to kill the heart but maybe to stop him for make it weaker or sent it to sleep again
@@MiskatonicMemorialist The events of the ancestors life are so specific I think it's much more possible that it's a literal time loop, not the player repeating the same story as the ancestor.
Terá teorias sobre o zelador ou o "Protagonista/player"? Adoraria saber sua opinião :D Continue com o trabalho maravilhoso!
Will you have theories about the caretaker or the "Protagonist / player"? I would love to hear your opinion :D Keep up the wonderful work!
Choose:
A) Mod Hero Lore
B) Location & Enemy Lore
C) Meta Lore
D) Other Lovecraftian Games Lore
My Answer: ALL OF THEM. *SHUT UP AND TAKE MY MONEY*
i love how the moment the Ancestor find the Heart of the world is the point were ´´things get weird´´, like, what was all that happen before? a snack of crazy bullshit?
My thought is when he was attacked by the heart is when he became one with it and the written letter was made by one of his copies
Hey guys I think the ancester might be a bad guy
Would love to see more mod lore but fallen london sounds amzing as well.
Plus that soundtrack, same with Cultist Simulator
Maybes you could do some videos of Muscarine’s moded characters. He put a lot of thought into them.
Hey you mentioned a movie a couple of times but I cant find anything about it, I would really appreciate if you could tell me where I could find it
I’d love to see more of the modded heroes lore
👍
XCOM!!!! I can't wait!
I'm glad I'm not the only one who did a little dance at that.
Yo is this art custom? If so credits to the amazing artists!
Yeah check the description, and check out the movie if you haven't already. Although I should say the art already existed in the community I just asked and they said sure.
I started playing DD. It is unrelentingly unforgiving. Things should improve as I learn more about game play.
Well the current Xcom kind of goes into Cosmic Horror because the concept of Aliens is that Human-life isn't unique in the universe.
So you're saying that for every time I rage quitted in the game, that was the good ending??
Is it wierd that i assume based on some dialogue of the academician that the amcestor has his own momemt of guilt.Basically i think that the heroes won against the final boss, but the ancestors mistakes have now extended to the whole world and now the academician is the only one who knows how to combat them.
The reason i say this is because i believe that the ancestor we see in the end is a manifestation of the hearth if darkness, not the one who wants us to know and destroy the extenr of his failures.
I'm still curious as to the Ancestor's relationship to the heir. We're never told about any siblings or wives of his, so where/who did they come from?
That's an interesting topic that I've thought on a bit. A distant branch of the family tree is my theory, making him the heir's uncle or great-uncle. If the Ancestor inherited the lands then he was probably either the oldest or the only child, with a cousin far away from the estate. It's all speculation since the Ancestor doesn't specifically mention anything.
How is this not a movie
When you're looking at other games for the channel don't skip out on Fear & Hunger, it has more of a mature rating and has sensitive subject matter.. But if you can tolerate that the theme is very close to Darkest Dungeon in how it handles dungeon delving and the feeling of hopelessness in the face of unknown horrors.
Wait there’s a movie for this??? Link plsss
I literally late about darkest dungeon but better late then never i'm really into this game since the darkest dungeon 2 came out
It's never too late to get into the game.
Hey, what about the ending? What on Earth does it mean? I was waiting for the whole video some wild speculations about the ending, and I didn't hear a word. Consider making a whole video about it.
ua-cam.com/video/vCIHqABG6MU/v-deo.html
Around the 9 minute mark.
It’ll be cool to talk about the sunward isles. Hardest dungeon in the mod community.
Harder than the Darkest Dungeon!?
Yes, actually...
I love this
do more content outside DD please and thank you
as more content is still content
as you'll eventually run out of DD stuff to do
Oh yea Sunless sea and X com lore count me interested.
What movie??? Couldn't find any darkest dungeon movie
it's the 42 minute long video on his channel
A new game would be cool 🤩
I love the video. But I want to comment and reply to some of the other comments, but I don't want to necropost on year old comments.
Xcom videos hints WOOO
thx for the video
honestly the ancestor is one of the biggets pros of the game. unfortunately i feel darkest dungeon 2, from what i have seen so far is inferior.
I'm still curious as to the Ancestor's relationship to the heir. We're never told about any siblings or wives of his, so where/who did they come from?