Why do people hate mathematics?
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- Опубліковано 18 січ 2014
- Featuring Professor Edward Frenkel, from the University of California, Berkeley. Author of Love & Math. amzn.to/1g6XP6j
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People hate math because it's often taught in boring and uninspiring ways.
true
and its rare to have a math teacher to teach in a cool and inspiring way
+CNVideos I went back and studied maths as a middle aged man. My tutor was utterly imaginative, creative, inspiring and motivating. It made a world of difference. Greatest teacher I've ever encountered. It made the world of difference. I aced the class with distinctions in all units because of his drive and commitment. Difference between a great teacher and a mediocre, go-through-the routine tutor is worlds apart.
+CNVideos "Here's 50 sligtly different questions, solved the exact same way. For 10 pages"
+CNVideos It's really easy to lay blame on others. I had terrible teachers, too, growing up. I got frustrated one day, picked up my old geometry book, read the book, did the problems, now I'm doing research in the field. It was hard work, but worth it.
There are three types of people: those who are good with numbers, and those who are not.
who are the third kind?
+William Gardner LOL
+Edward Wood
There are 10 types of people in this world. Those who understand binary numbers, and those who do not.
+Paul Gross there are 10 type of people in this world, those who understand binary, those who don't, and those who weren't expecting a ternary joke.
lol
Math is only Satisfying when U understand how it works
You are absolutely Right ! I think math is easy !
PR4J4 I struggle at maths but I love it and find maths easy with physics
PR4J4 not even then..
the question is are u willing to understand them ?
If math is easy, you should be able to solve all unsolved things, right? Math is not easy. The things you understand are easy. That´s a difference.
Because most math teachers don't teach math in context. When you're told to "just remember the formula", without being given an application that fits the equation...you may as well be learning English by memorizing the order of the letters, without being taught what the words actually mean.
Thats so true, in my first year of engineering my teacher when he taught maths always spent 10 mins in the beginning motivating the topic and 10 mins in the end explaining its application, it was always very interesting. He has a yt channel 'Chris Tisdell'
+Sergeant Soap That's why applied mathematics is fascinating!
It is truly amazing
Mike Stavenes Now that is a brilliant comment! 😁
Mr. Nisse omg you are so right today I received my exam results and it's say that mathematics was the worst because we needed to learn 3 formulas without understanding it and a lot of people in my class didn't do well for mathematics only a few did
It's not that I hate it. It just makes my brain hurt. Making me hate it
The only reason I abhor math is the annoying formulas and theorems you MUST REMEMBER and PROVE your answer in preCalc -__-
I understand logical patterns like memorizing and proofing is what made recent technology, but in a 9-5 job I have no use for them nor do people who I talk to care about math since computers and hobbies took over almost everything in their daily lives. Ignorant as it sounds that's life as of today in which geniuses can't understand why that is, and that's coming from a simple minded guy like me.
Philip Ottey you should understand it and no trying to remember it
This guy is spitting facts!!!
Ikr you have to do so much work in math especially WHO TF DECIDED TO PUT THE ALPHABET IN MATH.?
Philip Ottey what if you’re bored
People hate math because modern education is a joke, and they fail to motivate students to discover the fun and fascination of learning things.
I agree. I remember being very young and in love with learning. I would spend an afternoon reading encyclopedias or observing nature. Once I went to school, it all changed. The same thing happened with my brother. He put a bag of glitter in the freezer once, just to see what would happen. And gradually that curiosity faded away.
Amelia Allen Did anything happen to the glitter?
Ste Rose
It froze, what else would it do?
Well that's what I expected, but the fact that you mentioned it made me wonder if anything else happened.
This is true. I was awful at Maths at one school and I had bad teachers that didn't care, I changed school and I was getting 90/100 most of the time by the end.
People don't hate mathematics. They hate practicing mathematics.
People don't hate reading. They hate practicing to read.
People don't hate playing music. They hate practicing to play music.
Math(s), reading, and playing music all require repeated practice so that the process can be "felt," or internalized. Once the student gets past learning, these things become a joy to do. It's getting over the hump that is painful for most people.
I agree with Edward Frenkel that people should be shown some interesting outcomes derived from what is to be learned. Most (though not all) "Dummies" books do that. The first chapter is almost always devoted to a small example which serves as a hook.
I don't think that I've ever met a person who's mastered a subject and still dislikes it. Reaching proficiency is a painful process. Once proficient, any subject becomes gratifying.
***** Yes, and consider yourself lucky that you "still hate practising writing," because proficient writers tend to get themselves into heaps of trouble for expressing their beliefs in written form.
+Peter Wexler Sometimes, people hate things because they are compulsive. Let's say, you have to read a story as an assignment. You have to read it many times a day to get details, text evidence, etc. Thus, it becomes boring.
No I math because I just don't get it. I'm not going to use all the math in RL
And some people can study hard and still can't get.
+Peter Wexler - Spot on!
Personally, the reason that made math irritating for me to learn were the ways in which all my of my teachers presented/explained it. For example, all of the teachers I've ever had only showed me how to do a problem, but they have never showed me why its done that way. For me, I need to know WHY questions are done in specific ways. I've only been taught how to use formulas, not taught why these formulas are used. Hopefully this made sense.
@grand dio the education system and the correspondent of the school are the reason to our depression
That dude's accent is straight out amazing.
That's actually real russian accent. The stereotypical russian accent people are used to is fake, was made up by hollywood and pretty offenisve to be honest. And what's sad is that it's still being used in movies and videogames.
Konstantine Rymaruk I knew that already. But thanks anyway.
Konstantine Rymaruk Bullshit, I've come across many russians with the typical "hollywood" accent. So your point is invalid. However, I do agree that not every russian has the same accent when talking in english. My accent differs from my classmate's accent. Doesn't mean we are from a different country or one of us is "faking" the accent.
Konstantine Rymaruk Oh hi Konstantine love your work ;)
kitanovskisasa Oh, haha thanks! :))
I'm currently in high school. I can tell you why kids hate math.
Let's start with why kids hate school. Seven hours a day, five days a week, forty weeks a year, kids are forced to endure hell. Waking up at 6:30 to be somewhere they don't even want to be at 8:05, wandering around hallways that are often worse than rush hour traffic, all to sit down, and be silent for an hour to be lectured about something they usually don't care about. Then, they have a very short intermission before they have to sit down in another place for another hour. In short, they're bored. They just don't care, and I won't claim innocence from this. I don't care about what happened thousands of years ago, I don't care about old books. Now, I am interested in math and science, but I seem to be the outlier. To most kids, memorizing all of these theorems and postulates and formulas is nothing more than a chore. As I know you're aware, "When am I ever going to use this?" is one of the most commonly asked questions in a math class, and they're right. Most people aren't going to need to find the length of the hypotenuse of a triangle based on its sides, or find the volume of a sphere, and that's some of the most "basic" stuff that's taught. Also, the work assigned by teachers is extremely tedious, and extremely boring. I think most people will get the concept that the teacher is trying to teach after about 5 examples. Assigning 30 or more, which I see often, is just way too much. Now, I understand the thinking behind it. "Repetition, repetition, repetition," but again, kids get extremely bored of this extremely quickly.
The problem isn't the math, the problem is the way it's taught. Teachers need to give examples of how the math they're teaching will be used in real life, and the homework should be less of a chore. Unfortunately, I don't know how this would be achieved, but if nothing is done, the upcoming generation will be one that thinks math to be boring, tedious, and useless, and that is unacceptable.
Thats more why people hate school in general, which is totally comprehensible. They make the learning process completely unatractive and uninteractive.p, rendering stundents like mindless servant and objects there to listen and copy. The reason people might math in specific is more underlying to itself.
This is where the dreaded "word/story problems" come in.
You nailed it!
i started liking math in 8th grade when i started getting close to ending 9th grade and I got scared about my future so i wanted to learn maths to become an engineer, also being smart is awesome
Mathematics is awesome
Numberphile makes me like math.
same
meth
@@kakyoindonut3213 yeah I like meth also
@@namehere2986
M - Math
E - English
T - Tech
H - Hentai
True that. One of biggest (if not THE biggest) reasons I recently became passionate with math and started to learn it online during the pandemic.
I can see mathematics as beautiful and nuanced, but unfortunately it isn't taught that way. It's taught as a regimental and rote exercises that are incredibly boring. That's no way to spark passion in a person
Not In college. Early "math" is boring that i agree with
Rothkana I am not speaking for myself. I'm speaking for students first being introduced to math. Rote learning does not invoke passion and is most likely the reason many don't pursue mathematics. However this is the easiest course of action for the teacher.
couldn't agree more, when I was at school in Australia, maths was dull boring, and I avoided it
You have to learn how to stand before you can learn how to play football.
What I would do is stress from the start that maths is about acquiring *skills* , not just knowledge.
Indeed.
Why do I have to solve 9000 equations of the same type? If I know how to solve 8x=16 I can obviously solve 8x+1=17 or 7y+3=24. It's logic
I dislike math because our teachers never taught us to question it. Formulas, for example. Why do I put the numbers here? Why do I have to subtract a random number from that value? Why can't I just use a protractor to find the angle measure, or a ruler to find the side measure, or logic instead of theorems?
dharma6662013
You've got any proof of that? That school children don't have the skills to prove formulae?
(P.S. not trying to be bashful, I'm just curious.)
Having been a Maths teacher for seven years I can tell you that 99% done. Like any learning process: it has to be incremental. You have to learn to walk before you can run. Most 16 or 17 year old students do not have the algebra skills to prove the quadratic formula. Believe me: I've tried!
dharma6662013 Where I live, we learned how to prove the quadratic formula from completing the square, which was taught BEFORE that actually. I did that in Mathematics 2c the tenth year, and I was 16 years old by then.
Now of course, people don't remember that now because they don't have to, but we still did it, you know. I can't say I percieved it to be very hard either. Algebra makes sense for the most part, but thus far it was just a matter of see through the complexity instead of fearing it, which is something I think many do, unfortunately.
P.S. enjoying our discussion thus far.
I think the point is that algebra makes sense *to you*. You obviously enjoy Mathematics (you're watching Maths videos online). I would imagine that most of the class didn't follow it very well. Performing algebra with four unknowns involving adding, subtracting, cross-multiplying and square-rooting algebraic fractions is hard-core for school. Most 16 year old would struggle with that.
***** Theorems *are* logic in the purest form... Also measuring something directly with a ruler is cute but what do you do when there's an obstruction? What if you're measuring across a lake or a ravine, or to a GPS satellite in space, or even between themselves? What if you can't measure the angle of a thing because you haven't even built it yet because you need to know what angle it should be in the first place to satisfy several other parameters?
I can relate to this... growing up through high school I always thought I was terrible at math and I had no interest in it; it wasn't until I had an awesome professor in college and got into higher levels of math that I became very interested and actually pretty good at it. It became a lot easier than I thought
many people hate math b/c it's taught mostly w/ memorization instead of conceptualization .
+wcdeich4 Exactly! I'm a pure mathematician; many people write it off as useless because they don't realize the ways in which you can use it to reason about systems in real life. To them, all they see is numbers. But in reality, pure mathematics is so much more than just numbers!
Yeah
And teachers who try to teach conceptualization usually fail at doing it properly, making the students even more frustrated.
@@Tursiopstruncatus interesting point. I always felt conceptual explanations were easier to understand - but - I am not the average student. I have heard some teachers say it is best to use a variety of methods & explain things multiple ways.
@@wcdeich4 All I know is that PE classes made me hate sport, art classes made me hate drawing, and math classes made me hate math.
I am feeling useless while doing math
If I were a math teacher, I'd start the first class of every year/semester with this challenge to my students: "Math is everywhere. It's in everything we see, everything we do, and everything we feel. I know, you don't believe me, I'm just a mathematician shilling for my art. So I'll tell you what: I'll prove it. Everyone, write down on a piece of paper something you think has nothing to do with math. Something that can't possibly relate to math. Fold the papers up and pass them to the front of the classroom." I'd then proceed to read off all the papers and explain, one by one, how each relates very much to math. If there are duplicates, I'd list a different mathematical aspect each time. Every student would then be hit with the realization that they couldn't possibly live without math. And then, hopefully, that would motivate them to want to learn it a little more.
it's insane seeing the amount of students had come to any of my classes (when I taught) that would say they hated math, and trying to discuss with them the 'why' of that, and turns out that they had early math teachers who never really undestood the concepts themselves... so the 'unease' of math was transferred from that terrible teacher to an entire generation of students.
Very true.
I had parents that taught me math at home until highschool and compared to most people I know it's paid off significantly
I just did math homework with Eric and taught him the way I taught myself.
In pre school they wanted us to know all the multiplication table by heart. I just couldn't!
So I calculate from what I do remember.
So 6*7 is 7*7-7 for example.
And for *9 I do *10 minus the number.
Flash cards were what did it for me. My mom would a bunch and we would see how many I could get right in a minute, or 2 minutes.
I dont hate math I hate taking math tests and trying not to fail math courses
this
Lol that's to test it ability to do maths problems and U clearly are bad at it no offence
John Le *offense
@@johnle1723 no. its a test to see who can learn fastest. evertone can do the math tests given time.
@@perhapsso1909 Even people with mental disabilities, leaving them incapable of understanding the concepts of numbers and shapes?
I missed half the words because I was distracted by his wonderful accent.
+Benjamin Salt right?
That's Russian accent
"The truth is not the monopoly of anyone; it is the common heritage of all the intelligences." (Leonel Franca)
Goody quote.
I hated art at school, I couldn't even paint the fence.
It is oddly satisfying for me to listen to russian accent in english while i'm russian myself
this accent is so cute, I wish I was born in Russia so that I would speak with a Russian accent
For me either, bro)
Kasza Jaglana that would practically destroy its allure :D
Да акцент у нас не плохой
Привет
Why hate Maths? Because if you skip a little, tiny bit of your equation, or any other notion you've been taught, that small error becomes a HUGE snowball that, in the end, makes all your previous work useless; and going back to find where that "snowball" started is incredibly frustrating.
Great observation
+Andrea Nutri Your own inaptitude isn't an argument.
+Tristan Odysseus Roodt
*Your
By the way, hating something is a very subjective feeling so I am totally entitled to hate it because I am bad at it as long as I don't push my opinion to someone else who doesn't agree.
Andrea Nutri practice gets rid of that weakness though, I've noticed
Tristan Odysseus Roodt Yeah and i totally agree on that
I hated maths classes back at school and I was actually good at it too... it was just so boring the way it had to be taught, my teacher was a good teacher, when he goes off topic (but still mathematics related of course, it was always interesting and fun), but sadly, he still had to stick to the syllabus most of the time, as teachers are trained to teach exams, not knowledge...
1. Teachers are bad at teaching math
2. Endless meaningless basic math homework when you are a kid. Kids can learn a lot of stuff, but teachers burn them out with 12 digit divisions solving or endless sums. I have smart nephews but every single time I see them, they are busy doing extensive bullshit homework including endless sessions of math exercises, One of them, the smartest, really hates that crap.
3. Lack of real life examples when learning more advanced math.
4. Focusing on teaching by repetition of exercises rather than teaching by actually letting you the concept.
(I'm not a teacher) I think the thing about teaching mathematics is that it's much harder when teaching a larger group. I usually answer questions or explain stuff to others when they don't fully grasp it and the reasons they don't understand are generally quite different. So to teach someone math you really have to get into their head to see what it is that they don't understand. I also hate the way the homework for kids usually is (just a table of basic arithmetic or calculating simple areas with no context) I would compare it to teaching someone to read by giving them a table of words and making them read and memorize them instead of giving them a book to read with increasing difficulty. I also think learning in groups of 4 and making them do problems together and that way they can also learn from each other, and it's also a lot more enjoyable.
the problem is that maths is so poorly taught in schools that from day 1 people are put off from math. nothing has a meaning, its just arbitrary formulas for the sake of it. not to mention that very few teachers are actually passionate about it and care about it.
Hennal I would like to just blame the schools, but I do not think that is enough. It is math itself that puts people off.
When you read a poem or listen to certain types of music, it is a visceral experience. Math requires you to think in abstractions and equations, which really is not natural for us.
There is also the very obvious idea that we do not see how these things are applied to our lives. Anyone using logarithms or algebra recently in their daily lives?
Case closed.
That's not the case at all.
In school, you have a historical / functional approach, so it's always clear why you are learning something, what the advantages are, etc.
K August yep, use algebra quite frequently to calculate forces.
This man's passion for math is so inspiring. I legit almost cried when he said "What if I told you there is this beautiful world out there and you don't even have to travel anywhere to find it? It's right at your fingertips." Something so beautiful about seeing math in that way.
I would ask if it is really beautiful to most people for whom it is nothing but pain, humiliation and constant stress. Maybe if it had a whole year dedicated to it you could reach everyone, but perhaps its not so beautiful if so few can see it.
@@okankyoto so is an amazing art piece no longer beautiful if it is only seen by one person?
What is "truth" then?
Something that is believed by everyone? That's just impossible, people will always have different opinions
A constant in the whole universe? well how do you define it?
Suppose the colour red. Is red the colour that we see? Or is it the wavelength of the light?
Suppose there is only one species in the whole universe and they just cannot sense a wavelength through any technology at all
Is the wavelength "true"?
a year ago in high school i had a math teacher who sat down and taught me trig and i was doing great in his class. but when ever any type of break(including weekends)came along i completely forgot every thing i was taught. for me math just goes in one ear and out the other, i honestly don't know how i got this far in school.
I think thats how it works for the most of us students
Mostly it is because teachers can not explain it. I learned more during several hours with a good teacher than during 13 years of school math before.
My maths teachers were lunatics. If you could reduce the number of people teaching maths that are borderline psychotic it might help. Only ones worse are PE teachers: either manics or perverts in the main...
+JonnyInfinite my teacher memorized maths, so he is also made me memorize maths without even teaching me any principals.
Sometimes mildly off-kilter and quirky individuals can make the best math teachers. Some of those weirdos taught me in HS and community college and they taught me pretty damn well.
Trust me when I say this: being a weirdo is so much dam fun
@@itsreeah2663 but being taught by one isn't
@@JonnyInfinite ...
there are 10 types of people: those who understand binary and those who dont
I see what you did there
Underrated comment. Though the format 0010 would have given it away.
Well if you were to communicate binary in the most common way, like most computers today. It would look something like this: 1100100001010101011011100011010110000110000100101011010000010010
Thats not to mention if you use the 128 bit MMX buffer of the newest Intel CPUs
There are 10 types of people: those who understand binary, those who don't and those who didn't expect this joke to be in base 3.
I really appreciate Numberphile for doing a great job in "exposing these ideas to the public in an accessible way!" You are really filling this gap! A kiloThanks!
thank you - that's very kind
I don't know where this man is from, but I enjoy his accent.
From Russia
It's crazy . . . high schools and colleges all have appreciation classes for all sorts of things: art/music appreciation (art/music history), language appreciation (literature studies), science appreciation (physical science), philosophy 101 (logic appreciation?), etc. And yet, there's no such thing as a math appreciation class. Creating such a class is probably the simplest step we could take in the direction of helping people love math.
+Intrafacial86
so what should it be called?
+Intrafacial86 Logic is math
+Intrafacial86 we had one at my school, you could opt-in for more maths. problem that I had with maths was that I just got everything thrown at me (formula's, functions, algebra) and they told me, to graduate you need to know this, without explaining at all why you should know that and in which situation you should use it. in stead they presented you an abstract thing which you "just need to know" without giving a proper reason. Nowadays as a software engineer I kind of start to understand and appreciate maths more, I even discover new techniques that accomplish complex computing stuff which I have never learned in high school. The problem is not maths.. it's the schools.
+Intrafacial86 At my college, we have a class called "Nature of Mathematics," that is essentially a math appreciation class. It is a 100 (freshman) level class, but rather than dealing with computation, it deals more in proofs and patterns, like a more advanced class for math majors would. It was a way for non-math majors to learn about things like the Fibonacci sequence, the Golden Mean, the sum of the first n numbers, and so forth.
I used to love math, solving interesting problems that requires intuition gave me a satisfaction. But because of tests I started to hate math.
Competiton?
how is it even competition? this person was referring to tests and not to some math contest.
Silver Mirai me too. I used to love math like arithmetic, fractions, integers, and problem solving but now when the letters and complex procedures came in I just became bad at it. Now, it's making my school life super stressful and depressing.
lol but the contests really do just drive you up the wall dont they?
Same
I've thought on things like this before.
The reason that people dislike maths is because they find it difficult and unrewarding. It is unrewarding because it seems difficult. It seems difficult to many because by the time they are studying it where it matters they are already supposed to know the basics but don't. I can't speak for other areas but in my classes I watched so many students doing assignments where their difficulty was not always in understanding the way to find the simplest form of a polynomial but in taking a long time to do it because the smaller steps in the process were such work for them to complete.
Solving the problem is difficult because really what is needed is for maths to become more prominent in our everyday language so that kids start learning it before they ever see the inside of a school. Kids who talk at home learn to talk quicker. Kids who read at home learn to read at a higher level and faster. If kids did math at home they'd be more ready to learn math when they got to school. The problem with something like that, though, is that their parents don't get it either. How can they teach what they don't understand?
I hate mathematics because it went behind my back and started dating the alphabet.
i cant' stop llooollling
no it was dating "X" of yours
I don't get it.
Taxtro, people feel like math gets much more difficult when variables (the alphabet) are involved.
KillahShogun and hen when you got used to it and decided to give it another go with the three of you, Greek somehow joined the mix 🙄
There are no people who hate mathematics. There are people who love mathematics, and people who don't understand mathematics.
I understand it mostly but I'm super bad at it
no I hate it
I've never had a problem with understanding mathematics, for as long as I was forced to "learn" it. I however hate it to it's core. It's essentially the most boring of all fantasies. When I was a kid I once asked my math teacher: "how can there be minus four apples?" "negative numbers don't express quantities and cannot be found in real world" he said. He also used to say "math is all around us, everything in math has it's application". Oh, and "mathematics teach how to think logically". He wasn't the smartest guy
+DrMakak Unfortunately, your teacher was right though. Math is all around us. Whether it's in the measument of recipes for delicious meals or the geometrical and symmetrical designs for fashionable clothing. Math is everywhere. But you can have fun with it by using it to make stuff you may like. Ex. delicious food, fashionable clothing, a slingshot rifle, etc. You decide whether to make math fun.
So what you're saying is that I can't dislike something that you enjoy. Okay
This guy is awesome. Please interview him more!
If someone wants to transcribe the video for me, I will happily add a caption file!
***** if make got the translation, I will happily not understand it!
yeah but its not impossible to convince a teenager to become disciplined enough to learn the material, has happened many many times before ofc, plenty of teachers are just too bad at doing this though. i think teachers from university would probably do a better job as not only would they be qualified but they'd have a true passion for their subject and be able to get the students more interested.
Please phrase "university teachers" should teach at middle and high schools to "teachers who have been taught to an amazing extent at their field". You may be giving people the wrong idea about "all" professors.
University professors are not all qualified either to teach lower level classes, even ones from prestigious big colleges, like UCLA.
A lot of big public university professors focus on research, not teaching, and how research focused professors "teach" in big universities is by lecturing, which is just blurting knowledge for people to take up and decipher by THEMSELVES. I'm not saying this applies to all professors, and professors in REALLY prestigious colleges can teach and research well. Also, professors who focus on research are absolutely necessary for our societies. So I'm not hating on professors, this is just to show those who don't know about the situation with professors.
Middle school and high school level math teaches the basics of math, the ABCD's of the math world. If you put a high level professor into a average American high school, it's like giving babies a great novel: the babies won't understand.
So instead of confusing the babies with a text they can't understand, you give them picture books. Picture books have simple stories that put complex ideas of the morals and ideas of society into little pretty plots that help children understand. That's what math needs from those who understand this almost "elite" world. Picture books to help babies.
i agree, i just mean if you have a collection of university professors they're probably, on average, gunna be better than regular high school teachers, who don't know or perhaps don't care much about the material, at inspiring the students.
as for primary school teachers, i think it wouldn't be very enjoyable for most university professors who are great at teaching advanced stuff they find interesting to suddenly teach very young children what a number is and things, so for that i suppose there isn't much of an alternative other than just trying to find better teachers :/
I absolutely love mathematics and learning new maths, but the busy work that is given to us in public schools(at least in America). It's absolutely ridiculous! I'm in the eighth grade and I'm in an Algebra 1 class(I already know most of what they "teach" us). All it is is busy work, though. I want to learn. That's why I'm subscribed to this channel and look things up for myself. Public school really is a joke where I am, though.
I was a young artist. It was part and parcel of my daily life. This was true up through my 9th grade of education. Then I hit sophomore year in High School and a certain art teacher. Who beat the joy out of art. He squashed it. I stopped doing any form of art for years. Close to two decades. In a similar manner I had teachers that never conveyed the beauty of math to me. They killed my curiosity in the subject in utero. When you are taught that a subject id drudgery you come to dread it.
Many people hate maths because our schools keep teaching us the boring part of maths. Same goes for science. If I am more interested in learning from Vsauce than a teacher at school then there is something wrong with the education system
***** Yeah, Vsauce, Numberphile and others like those are way more interesting and exciting for me than any class I had in highschool
Adrian Sanchez can you suggest me more channels like vsauce and numberphile?
+TheKappa Because all the videos from Numberphile and Vsauce are useless, they cannot be used for you getting a job in the future. They are interesting and that's why they exist, but interesting content has nothing to do with the error in the education system. Your education (not university) is an introduction, so in the future you know actually what you don't want and what you want.
+TheKappa Numberphile/Vsauce type stuff is not rigorous mathematical study. There is no problem with the education system just because you prefer 'popsci' to proper study, you have the wrong attitude. This is not how the great mathematicians think. Casual interest does not equal true passion.
+TheKappa Yeah but it's difficult to learn someone the basics of something while simultaneously showing them the beautiful high level math. I had teachers that did have these 20 min long rants after lessons when I asked them things after the lessons in high school. The problem seems to be more that most students would not be interested in all this essentially flare information (until you get to a high enough level of understanding to actually grasp it properly). I was definitely not interested in math in pre-high-school and would not have gotten or properly listened to talks like this and probably not a majority of my classmates either. Same thing in high school where I found an interest for it, I was the only one actually willing to stay and listen.
Math to me is like this
_If bob had 6564654 apples and he gave 463631781 of them too his friend.Then how many cars were crashed last year_?
Foxy The Pirate Fox That's really not what maths is about. That's the kind of mind-numbingly boring task a computer would do so much better than a human.
Trying to figure out if a certain class of problems adheres to certain rules, which lets us devise a general but very elegant solution to all of them would be a better example of some of the things maths is about.
One very basic example of that would be deducing the quadratic formula by completing the square, but this sort of thing can get more complex and interesting and varied to infinity. In general, if it can be a computer's job, then it's not a mathematicians. When you can handle fractions with one and two digit numbers, that's the end of the mental arithmetic you need.
So true! XD
Vault Boy that's not math. the last question has no correlation with the beginning.
red herring alert.
+Vault Boy 54390 cars.
Proven
I would add (to the video, rather than my previous comments) that another reason why learning math is so important, is that's it's part of having a balanced understanding of reality. It's part of the function of the human brain. One cannot fully exercise his/her brain without also exercising that part of it. In other words, it's not important that you become a math "whiz". But, it's essential that you exercise your entire brain, because that analytical part of your brain may be the part that solves another problem in your life, that really has very little to do with math, but DOES require a detailed analysis.
Problem solving is part of survival in daily life. We face problems about our careers, marriages, households, relationships, etc. that actually require us to be cool and collected, to analyze all the basic information available. To do that, we're using the same brain function, as what's being employed in the learning of mathematics. People who never exercise their powers to analyze things (especially in the abstract), are missing very important survival mechanisms.
Also, how many people in poorly educated countries (I'm thinking of my own here - the U.S.) don't believe in evolution, or global warming, simply because they can't wrap their minds around some very basic mathematical concepts that aren't readily intuitive to them? This has serious political implications. We can't afford to continue undereducating future generations when so much is at stake.
The lack of mathematical education is just a symptom of a broader problem.
Honestly I think its all because of the sheer amount we need to learn in high school. We are told about lets say complex numbers yet we are never told what would it be used for. The education system is a bit off in my opinion.
"What would it be used for" = engineering.
i'm 16 and have loved mathematics since as long as i can remember, i continue to love mathematics every day. Sure wish there were others my age who feel the same. They're might be but they're so difficult to find.
I'm the same! I love math and I'm also 16 :)
Im 17 and i hated math as long as i can remember
did you become a rocket scientist yet
I'm 15 and I am in that situation
Wish we lived close to each other or something
Watching Numberphile continues to spark my excitement for Math! So many interesting stuff to learn from experts. I saw that square root of 2 video and then told my friends about why the ratio of the dimensions of paper is about the square root of 2! Love Numberphile! Keep it up!
Hooray! A new Numberphobe video!
Biggest flaw with the education system at primary level (which should be the seed of knowledge) is that children/teenagers (as was I) are taught subjects, but are never taught to understand them. It's like learning of a poem word by word, in a different language that you don't understand, and then paraphrasing it during an exam, and come out with 100% on your test score. Result? Nice shiny school certificate, and a huge disappointment in 2nd semester university test.
Schools completely destroyed the reputation of math
Exactly
It's sad, actually: I remember being SO excited to go to class and learn in elementary school but then when I got to junior high the fun seemed to just...leak away.
As a person with a maths disability, it's especially trying for me. I only know gradeschool maths and will forget everything I've learned in a week no matter how much study/effort/tutoring, I've accepted this. I can't even add/subtract/divide/multiply doubles in my head without repeated error. I still count with my fingers, yet mix up numbers often. That doesn't mean I hate maths though, I along with countless other people- know very well just how important this stuff is, it's what drives technology forward and solves problems.
I too wish I can unlock this cool and mind-blowing world that is mathematics, however I have a solid iron wall blocking my way. (Laden with traps, pitfalls, instant-deaths, confusion rays, and Obliviates)
try Khan Academy, it worked for me and I was pretty average at school
I love math, I just suck at it :D
SuperGloop same
When You're Right, You're Right!
facts
No you’re just bad at painting the fence
😂😂😂😒😒very funny
I'm a chemistry student. Everyone can benefit learning chemistry. What chemicals to avoid, what to clean with, or even what gasoline to use. But when I was taking math classes, the equations I learned were just for tests. After that if it did not cross into chemistry, I never bothered remembering them.
Because a lot of math professors care more about feeling superior to a student than actually teaching them.
That is 100% correct. Indeed you can see that feeling in this video as well. Also, math teachers love to correct others, and no one corrects them. Students hate this and project on math!
I would also add some of them are narcissistic and insecure
Is this more common in mathematics than other disciplines?
@@MuffinsAPlenty It happens more in fields of authority where verdicts are not often questioned by other bodies due to specific areas of expertise.
Basically credibility acts as a shield to intimidate others from calling them out on injustice or just plain arrogance.
A few things: (1) Abstraction is very difficult, and to go at all far in mathematics you have to be able to cope with it. (2) A lot of mathematics is taught very badly, especially at the lower levels where most people's initial opinions are formed.
Math was always my favorite school subject :)
That's Moronic! (I mean, of course - that's you!) This channel must be right up your alley! ;)
M Hanson i do indeed enjoy it
Such an astute opinion on Maths could only be from a member from the Glorious PC Master Race!
Grade schools don't teach math, they teach how to do calculations without context. This would be the same as trying to teach English (or whatever language you are trying to teach) by reading a dictionary. The number one objection students universally voice is "when am I ever going to use this?" And rightfully so. Asking "why?" is universal among humans and people will not do or learn something without a reason. Students are not given any useful context or taught how all these functions or calculations can do anything for them in life. This is fundamental failure in the educations systems we have today and it is not the teacher's fault, so stop blaming them.
+Matthew Hagerty Most teachers love teaching, but have serious issues with the educational system. To illustrate your first point, we've probably all heard comedians or seen jokes about "when will I ever use algebra?", yet people use it all the time, they just don't realize it.
Word problems... do they count as using them in more understandable situations?
I have always loved math from what I have learned at school, but this channel and other channels on youtube have given me an entirely new outlook on math and numbers. Now math is not just an interesting subject at school, but a beautiful aspect of nature, like the depiction of an endless scenic landscape.
I don't really hate maths, it simply never captivated me. It's incredibly useful and I'm glad there are people out there who dedicate their lives to it because it's these sort of people who push the threshold of human learning. But I have always been about the wordier subjects in school, I loved and still love history, both ancient and modern. Legal and Business also have always interested me
In high school I loved math. Today I'm a game programmer, and math becomes extremely handy in that particular field for a multitude of tasks (all the way from geometry to algorithmical puzzle solving.)
I can't say, however, if I became a programmer because I loved math, or if I loved math because I had the kind of mentality that made me love computer programming as well.
Either way, game programming is a beautiful example of using math in practice.
There is just one reason people hated mathematics. They hate what they didn't understand
The problem for me is that is not practical for most occupations. Why some math is important knowing how to factor 3xsquared+35x+12 doesn't help me balance me checkbook or understand interest rates things that are applied
yes linear algebra is mainly for computer students and data scientists...not for layman. Topology used by biology people who make medicine and stuff..so yeah it depends(all of it ain't for everyone, but some of it definitely will be)
I so agree about connecting math to our daily lives. This is a very good interview.
I don't need math. When I grow up, I will make computer games.
It’s been 10 years, I hope your computer games are going well
Numberphile is the biggest leap towards making maths more accessible and fun in modern day. I blame my "hatred" for maths on schools; the way things are taught, the topics deemed important, and of course that schools are run by people who dont really know much about the subjects taught there. I've become a math geek because of numberphile, and now having just entered college, I'm able to TRULY learn more about subjects that I never knew existed. I found a love for abstract algebra, and now I am taking a course on it, and loving it.
His passionate speech brings tears to my eyes.
There's something to be said for allowing people to learn what they are interested in, rather than trying to cajole, threaten or otherwise 'motivate' them to learn what _we_ think is important. I think this is true even for kids to some extent and it is certainly true for teenagers.
Maybe people would learn less math in school but they would also hate and fear it less. So if at any point in their life they decided that they needed (or just wanted) to learn more math they wouldn't have a mental block.
People pick up new hobbies or learn new things as adults all the time. Math could be one of them if they weren't immunized against it in school.
I feel one of the biggest problems is math class these days is all about learning how to do the calculation. in a world with computers we should be learning the concepts of what math does and how to use it instead of focusing on how it actually works.
Not to say that learning how it works is not Important because it definitely is, and learning how to do some of the hard calculation is important but I don't think it should be the central focus. as a computer programmer, when I deal with math I don't have to think about doing the calculation because that is what the computer is for. instead I deal with writing the equations in a form that will get me the result that I need.
i once wrote a program that used an iterative loop that would draw a hemispherical spiral point by point. Because I had an intuition of trigonometry and algebra I was able to derive the correct equation off the top of my head to get the coordinates of each point. technically I did not need to know how to multiply numbers(or any other arithmetic) by hand to be able to write those equations, I just needed to understand what the arithmetic was doing for me.
today most math class focuses solely on hard calculation and it's the least fun and interesting aspect of mathematics. I failed many math classes because of this and never even made it to trigonometry before dropping out of school. but today, I spend a great deal of time programming and doing things that have to do with math because it is an incredibly useful and amazingly enjoyable discipline.
anyway, that's my 2 cents.
I agree. Learning logical thinking and how to tackle problems is the most useful lesson you get from math, in my opinion. Students should learn more about problem solving rather than just being forced to memorize a formula and use it 20 times.
I somewhat agree with you, but I also think those are fundamentals that are necessary to progress in math. In higher level math (higher than Calc), it's mostly all proofs, concepts, and analysis. You will most likely be coding up a simulation to answer your queries.
While it is "boring" in a sense, it all reinforces fundamentals that are needed to progress. Everything has a purpose.
Aomine To a certain degree, yes, you're right. But that should come second and at the higher levels. For most people who do not find a passion in math,almost all of those "fundamentals" go forgotten for the remainder of their life.
That being said, tools like Wolfram Alpha and Mathematica can easily be utilized for proofs, concepts, analysis, and simulation; all without having to do any degree of hand written arithmetic, algebra, trig, calculus, or statistics. But, like i've said, that's not to say learning manual calculation is not important as you still need to have people capable of producing such tools; But that should be for the people who find the greatest passion with math. For those people, learning the methods of manual calculation would come rather easy and with a certain degree of enjoyment.
An example would be long division, something everyone learns in grade school (to soon forget). Most people in day to day life do not need or want to take pen to paper to solve those problems. All they care about is the answer and what it represents. And that's what a calculator and intuition provide, respectively.
marcuslola then ppl would hate math even more
***** if you dont get the basic concepts how are you supposed to keep up with the more sophisticated stuff ? "learning" about simulations withour the base is not learning at all, it would be just staring at moving pictures which would tell you nothing at all
for math you only need paper and pencil
So nice to hear someone talking passionately about something. As a non-math person I find it awesome to hear him.
Math is life and we all should appreciate it more, like he said. Like art. At least recognize it.
I don't hate math, so it's hard to relate, but I think the basic problem is that too much emphasis in mathematics is put on memorization. If a child knows what a problem conveys, but has trouble solving it without aids, such as tables or calculators, then making them solve it without aids will compound the problem.
So for example, a child may understand every operation in the following: 17^2×13-765, but that may still be hard for them to do without a calculator.
The same goes for something like the English language. No one expects a child to have mastered spelling in order to start writing a paragraph. Not to mention, the key is wanting them to be able to read to expand their knowledge. The basics take time to master, but the importance is being able to further one's ability to express themself with words, and to use words with which one is familiar. Math is similar, being able to use pi is far more important than being able to calculate pi.
Maybe that made no sense, but I still think memorization is a big problem.
+Litigious Society ye, i love aids
Why is math uninteresting?
Because 'a given person' hasn't seen all of vihart's videos yet, particularly doodling in math class.
I don't hate maths... Maths hates me! :p
cc
When I know how to do one thing in maths I feel like a genius and u be like maths is easy
2 secs later I HATE MATHS
HAHAHAHA
Lol ur probably the same as me 🤣🤣😂😂
People don't just hate maths. Some people hate learning. Because the system we live in encourages us to not explore our universe and creativity.
+Lugn Et So how many people in your life have told you creativity is bad? How many have told you the opposite? =P
+Lugn Et I think this nails it on the head. It's not about maths, its about modern societies aversion to wanting to learn.
+Nate Zimmer Our entire education system is based on not being creative.
I second this. The way we are taught math is everything but interesting imo.
I think feminism would actually help remedy this as it helps explores people’s feelings
You have to be a hobbyist type of person to love maths, equally with physics and ever more so with computing. It requires dedication, genuine interest and the ability perceive and accept that your contributions are different from that of a brick layer, doctor, teacher or a lawyer. I'm a fervent follower of science yet I have one struggle that keeps me at bay from wanting to become part or at least some sort of affiliation with the scientific community or obtaining the title as scientist. What my job represents to others, how hard it is to become a scientist and lastly emolument, i've practically made 3 of the biggest mistakes in choosing what you want to do in life. Imagine that for everything and struggling to find dedication.
Something in maths that all teachers need to learn is that Wikipedia is a good resource! I have heard "It's not good because anyone can write anything." so many times but they are totally unaware of the algorithms and coding used to hunt down vandalism or false information
As a high school student who adores this channel, I can say the problem is not a lack of interest, but a lack of interesting subjects being discussed. Teach us about interesting complex Math, not about how to graph a line.
You need to understand the basics first before moving on to complex mathematics. For example, you won't understand the concept of derivatives and integrals in calculus without learning how to graph a line. It's like learning how to run when you don't even know how to walk.
Devistnathan You need to learn the basics before you can fully understand the more complex skills. Not only in mathematics but in life in general. You have to learn how to graph a line before you can prove or disprove the Riemann hypothesis.
How do you plan on learning about complex math without knowing how to draw a simple graph line? You do realize that math is infinitely more complicated than simple Numberphile (or your favourite popsci channel) videos right?
Unfortunately, learning how to graph a line is a necessary prerequisite to the "interesting complex math."
Devistnathan. Yea I never got that. Like why are we graphing this line.
This is probably the best video I've ever seen. it literally made me cry.
I cannot tell you how thankful I am for this video. I totally agree. We need to connect Mathematics and Science in general with History, Society and all science at all. With people and their stories (which can be super exciting and dramatic even in Mathematics).
As a student teacher, I've thought a lot about this and research seems to agree with professor Frenkel in that students find maths hard because they can't relate it to anything. Often (if not always), I've found that students learn and remember more if I can tie the subject to something that is relevant to them. Authors of maths text books are really good at relating exercises and examples to the real world up until they start throwing X: s and Y: s into the mix, then the examples stop and defaults to "This is how it works... because maths." and it is around that point where many students' grip starts slipping. I like to think of it more as a generic model for problem solving. Then again, my subjects are engineering and crafts, and that's what we do there.
Of course I purchased Professor Frankel's book. I've commented elsewhere in a Numberphile post on the extraordinarily moving and inspiring presentations of the Scholars contributing and this commentary of the Professor serves to confirm that note. I am not a mathematical adept, alas! but hearing and watching Numberphiles' encourages me to drink up and enjoy number intoxication! Blessings to all that care to share and to all that listen to learn🙏🏽Peace
You know, as an adult, I'm starting to appreciate the beauty of mathematics. When I was a schoolboy I just really didn't like it--it was tedious and boring and didn't pique my interest as much as biology or history or literature. Like the mathematician said, the way math was taught, it wasn't tied to anything in real life. So it wasn't until I was in college that math became something else, slowly--that math was the language of logic. I get logic. If my math teachers had said that math is just logic with symbols attached, and not some scary, test-filled, perfectionistic, stressful thing, I would've been like, ah, I get it. I use logic all the time, every day. And now that I am learning more and more about the basics of astrophysics, general relativity, quantum mechanics, math becomes attached to the truths of the universe. This is how I've become much more interested, and how math became more beautiful in my eyes. Too bad I'm still really bad at it.
the thing people don't understand is that there is a real fear of math, some people have legit fears. i don't like math because it takes me a little longer to understand and i forget it if i don't practice it. i also get frozen with fear over it.
yes i understand the beauty of math, how its the same in every language and also how the golden ratio represents nature in mathematical form.
not everyone is going to care about how beautiful it is and neither am i.
the problems with schools is that people are expected to learn things at a certain rate so when someone is struggling with it most of the time its not addressed, they are given bad grads and bam that's how hatred for math is born
The truth about mathematical anxiety has been spoken.
Probably the largest reason, that so many people dislike math, is due to it being challenging. People in general, like the simple things; alternatively, people like things to be simple. Basic math is simple, whereas Algebra and beyond are more complex. I find that, to be the most common reason/answer to that question.
In my schooling, math was taught as a memorization exercise. "If you see this, follow these steps to solve, if you see that, follow these steps to solve." I could not learn this way, I need to understand why. I need to know why I'm doing something to absorb it, that's why I appreciate this channel. You learn so much more from people who genuinely understand what they are speaking about rather than just aping what works.
I get his point but as a masters level musician, I see art as a bit more than "we could live without it"
Hating maths is like hating a screwdriver. It is illogical to hate a tool.
As someone who has successfully taught themselves computer programming using the Internet, I can say the most important thing for me was that it was always fairly intuitive as to what to learn next and how to improve.
When it comes to teaching oneself mathematics, there's often no indicator as to where to begin. Even if you know what you want to learn, you often find that there is a massive tree of prerequisite knowledge one needs to even begin.
Also, mathematics is fraught with notation. Notation doesn't lend itself to Google searching. Just understanding some notation actually represents a huge undertaking (for example, if you've never come across, say, integration or limits).
I honestly think one of the better ways to approach mathematics is through scientific or engineering fields. If you have a practical goal in mind, it's easier to stay focused and relate mathematical concepts in a meaningful way.
I think the problem of math is that is too abstract. It is extremly difficult for understanding because most of time we speak about things we cannot image. This is why people dont have problems with simple arithmetic (because we all know if bread cost x and butter y then we have to pay x plus y). But starting with for example statistic and infinitezimal calculus it is something we cannot imagine in real life.
For example I think I understand a basic principle of vectors but tenzors is totally out of my imagination.
In spite I have a degree in chemistry (for which you have to know quite a lot of math and physics) I have to admit that I understand only middleschool (I think the expession is college in US terminology) level of math. And I am quite sorry for that because it is fun to knowhow to mathematically solve problems. But I have a limit :-/
Thats why it is very important to understand basic concept first before moving on to more abstract concepts, for example, if you want to take calculus class, you must first be strong in your Algebra cause it is the essential topic to master in order to understand calculus, take it step by step work your way through, dont be afraid of making mistakes, and when you do make one, try to learn from them as much as you could, this is the way to do mathematics, knowing the concept and how to apply is much better than just knowing an answer to a problem, hope this guide helps~Ediwin
I would say that the abstraction is one of math's greatest strengths and one of the things that attracts me to it the most.
There are always people, such as yourself perhaps, that prefer math that has an application or physical interpretation. But I think mathematicians and math teachers can attract more people to do math for its own sake by presenting what it really is. Math has no care for the physical world, that's what science is for. And I think there's a lot of beauty in the fact that we can prove theorems about things that may not exist.
Also calculus intuition comes quite naturally thinking about the real world, thinking about things like kinematics.
For you it is beautiful but for most of people they absolutely hate it. The education of math should change otherwise mathematicians are gonna be sick because of loneliness
I agree that math education needs to change. That's the point of this video. I don't think anyone would hate math if the way it were taught represented math itself.
I keep coming back to this video. Love it.
Math was one of my best subjects throughout school and I always loved dealing with numbers and understanding equations, where my friends were coming to me saying it's so annoying not understanding math I was out taking extra math courses that brought me into middle school math in elementary and high school math going into middle school.
It's almost discouraging seeing people hate math when I find it so interesting. :\
I hate math
Same I’m in 9th grade and I’m planning to skip another year of math and do AP calculus for the 10th grade year
You guys are doing a good job because I hate mathematics but I love your channel. I watched almost every video. I know this will sound really corny but you guys really *do* make maths fun!
I am a physics student whose passion is math. As I learn more I want to know even more, and I really love talking about it. Not only with people who work with math, I talk about it with my family, with my little cousins etc. Teaching mathematics to med students is one of the things I enjoy the most.
Love what you have to say Edward. Great stuff! Thank you!
I see math as kind of like running. It challenges people to a point where failure is pretty much guaranteed UNLESS one really practices and gets up and at em to do it. Think about it, running is tedious, demanding, and downright exhausting work. So is math. And when that tedious, demanding, and exhausting work results in unsatisfactory results or even failure, we end up hating it.
When Mr. Frenkel talked about the "exposing maths to the public in an accessible way" I simply had to think about Numberphile. This Channel is basically the interface he is talking about. (Atleast to me. ;] I always couldn't really get myself to love maths, but atleast those videos here show me the fun sides about it.)
when you get punished for doing them wrong... who would want to get taught that way...
normal teachers have no patience and enough intelligence to teach students.
when the teachers themselves don't even know how maths work, how do they create the right metaphors to make students understand...
Brilliant, what an insightful analogy and explanation. Never would have thought of it in such a way.