Why The Apple Vision Pro Doesn't Make Sense..... Yet
Вставка
- Опубліковано 30 січ 2024
- The apple vision pro AR / VR / XR headset is soon to be available in biscuit land but everything I have seen about it so far makes me feel like apple have totally missed the mark. I really hope I'm wrong though.
☕ SOCIAL LINKS ☕
➤INSTAG : tinyurl.com/y5yawzbs
➤TWITTER : goo.gl/6hgBT6
➤DISCORD : / discord
➤TWITTER : / gamermusclevid
#GamerMuscle #Simulation
--
Production Music courtesy of Epidemic Sound: www.epidemicsound.com - Наука та технологія
For a gadget to make sense I think historically it has to at a minimum do two things
1 - Reduce effort to do something pre existing thing ( Ideally something people dislike or lets people get to enjoyable bit faster with less effort )
2 - Does a pre existing thing substantially better , substantially higher quality or for cheaper than pre existing gadget
A gadget or platform can also do a totally new thing that over decades people then get attached to but fundamentally the first two conditions have to be met for people to bother
getting used to or using a new gadget in the first place / buying into it. I mac ( Very simple to use computer , relatively affordable ect ) I Pod ( put all your music in your pocket and buy tracks you want instantly sent to your pocket) I phone ( Very versatile pocket computer that makes accessing information on the go very simple and easy + games + phone + camera at launch )
I can't see in what way the Apple Vision Pro meets those first conditions
I also think as it is with current VR devices sure they offer better immersion and VR is fantastic for industry simulation and a whole host of things but its stuck in a small slowly growing niche until those first two conditions are met which I think only a compact AR device really can ( even if that AR device is quite limited in terms of computation and what it actually does)
But at least with quest 3 , valve index you can say they are tools for more immersion in games or the best possible way to simulate or train or visualize things in industry and these HMDs in general have met condition 1 and 2 but only in the context of industry ( military , space , simulation).
Vision Pro Feels like its not an AR device outside of visual quality functionally no more of a better AR device than Quest 3 and its not a very good VR device as its FOV is really constrictive , you really notice this when you use stuff with lower FOV than Valve index and Quest 3.
The decisions that add a ton of Wight to the device glass , metal ect also make no sense at all in the context of HMD's especially AR devices.
So then people default to , Its a development device and it will take 1-3 gen to get to proper AR device , well ok lets use that excuse for every single consumer device ever made to justify why the product actually doesn't really do anything of specific utility better than an existing thing yet lol.
The true power of AR is when its a device you can conceivably ware as much as you would glasses , until that is met then AR is basically pushed into more of a VR type category of device and thus until you can meet the form factor of glasses a company might as well be focused on making a VR device up until tech is such you can do AR.
They have already announced the future consumer version, but it's not ready yet.
The AVP was never designed to stand as a consumer product. It's not soup yet.
Its quite aggressively marketed and anyone can buy it , also 200,000 sold in first 10 days of new device I think that makes something a consumer product
But its a handy way to re-frame any criticism of a device being able to claim its a "developer device" or something.
Imagine if that claim was made for iphone,Ipod,Ipad,Macintosh.
Or imagine making that claim for other VR headsets like valve index , pi max, Quest 3 which are to be honest in exactly the same spot of development.
Obviously all VR/AR/XR devices will develop and move forwards as do all devices as technology progresses its super strange how all of a sudden any criticism of avp is met with random answers that don't actual confront specific points.
@@markkovalcson7243
@@GamerMuscleVideos I'm not trying to reframe anything. Personally I think the Apple board of directors went for a money grab because they knew their rabid base would buy these now.
I think that's a pretty strong criticism. I'm also saying that I have absolutely no use for an AVP and won't remotely consider buying one. It is an unfinished worthless device unless you want to write software for when the consumer version drops.
This introduces a lot of new concepts and pushes the HW envelop in terms of sporting the largest brightest uOLED panel in production, and a lot of new ways of doing things, but it is not feature complete. The issues have not been worked out yet and it is not ready for prime time.
Frankly I think this money grab was just because they could. Also Tim Cook wanted this released before he retired. There were many reasons things happened the way they did. Personal ego and greed are at the top of the list.
So as a work in progress, I'm glad they did this. In terms of the people buying this now who are not developers, "buyer beware".
From my understanding it wasn't a money grab more a case that they had been working on AR/VR internally for a while and the department had to justify itself by actually having a product to launch , you can see how much meta has burned through developing VR , it will be the same for apple. If there is nothing tangible to show for it then investors / management might worry .
Ironically them selling it for a high price ( though maybe its not that high relative to R&D and tech in the specifc headset) will only make it more appealing as it makes it a more "exclusive" device , you already have idoits calling people "poor" as a retort for any criticism of the device or the fact that a quest 3 looks like it matches vast majority of the functionality of the AVP for both VR and AR in a practical sense.
@@markkovalcson7243
It definitely does let you do one thing that you can't do easily on any current device. Which is put a portable movie theatre wherever you are.
And the tech in terms of dispkay to make that an actual compelling experience. Only maybe big screen beyond has similar spec in terms of the micro oleds, but that isn't stand alone and that doesn't have a spacial audio solution. The device is 'better than the best TV in my house' according to one reviewer. So maybe that is where it finds favour. But it is still a hard sell if it turns out not to be all that comfortable.
I'm not including quest 3 in this, because honestly that is still not a device that I would recommend for consuming content.
And Sony has apparently forgotten that they also make movies and hasn't put a player suitable for psvr2! Shakes head in despair!
I, for one, am glad Apple finally invented VR! Thank you Apple!
Yep me too , we wouldn't have smartphones without apple .....🤓
pretty sure vr came before apple, so not sure how they 'invented' it....but welcome to the club :)
i think he was being sarcastic ...😂like i was when i said they invented the smartphone.@@suncoastbart
Apple be like, "It's not VR, it's SpAtIaL cOmPuTiNg"
I'm still in disbelief, every time I eat an apple, it's seems so organic.
Facial computing 😆 Looking forward to sadlyitsbradley review on it. While he isnt much of a gamer he is one of the most critical reviewers of VR devices out there.
I am also currently LMAOing at Facial Computing 💀
Apple make me sick to my scorn, I was using mp3's on multiple devices inc small portable units many years before Apple came along acting like they invented this, and the kids of course go along with it and think this is so.
To be fair the iPod touch did look really nice 😅
Meta have been really smart with the Quest 3. It's a fantastic leap forward from the Quest 2 and is affordable for a wide range of folks. Give it another two or three years and there'll be a Quest 4, likely for similar money to the 3, that will take things forward even further. To be honest, though, I already couldn't be happier with how good the 3 is for sim racing. Apple is, of course, charging stupid money for their headset. It will appeal to a certain elite, but is not going to take VR forward in general, as it is too exclusive, irrespective of how good or bad this first headset will be.
A VR headset with a terrible FOV For $3500 from a company that barely supports gaming......a definite fail.
VR is still gimmicky, only a handful of games make it worth it. Until every game can be played in VR im not interested.
Whats going to happen is Apple Fanboys who've never used VR before will buy it be amazed by spectacle that is VR, declare Apple invented VR. Then put it aside where it will collect dust to never be touched again. A lot of people who buy Oculus Quest did this, but that device was $300, its a lot different when its $3500 for the entry model.
Luv the rant … and agreed with everything you say … there’s a whole bloody herd of elephants in the room and dozens of rudie nudie emperors. For me a fully enclosed headset purporting to be an AR device that has zero PCVR capability is a dead 🦆
But thank you Apple for giving us something to get fired up about 😂
A pointless natter you say, GM - but isn't that EVERY? video you do, hahahaha. Genuinely just Aussie stirring --- as I am really loving the last few dedicated Quest 3 video's you've done, as well as nearly every one of your standard racing video's. So you can "natter along" any time as far as I'm concerned, Mr GamerMuscle. [;]-)
They can use this Slogan: Vision Pro, Welcome to the most expensive Quest 1 experience 😂😂😂
This may be completely useless info, but I had problems with my wrist when my steering wheel was very low in my lap, putting more strain on the wrist. Having the wheel at "real car" (any real car) height resolved it for me and I have never had a wrist issue since. Thanks for the vid. Stay healthy, mate.
my wrist is fine , have golfers elbow issue , wrist gard stops me over using the tendons / reduces movment :)
Should have been a cool wrap around sleeker version of Geordi's visor, with bone conducting earpieces, keep the electro switchable lcd glass with adjustable opacity, using the smartphone for the primary processing.
Sold as a matching phone & visor set for $3600, snagging new users for the Apple ecosystem = PROFIT
🍎🐀
I think you hit the nail on the head with how apple has traditionally found success. Looking at a market segment, analysing its weaknesses and then implementing something that is not necessarily brand new, but shifts the way people had previously thought about the products that had already existed in that space.
I think they know this will be a low volume device, so wanted to charge a lot for it. And they have painted themselves into a corner with their history of premium materials, so the idea of making it out of lighter weight materials probably came up and was vetoed for fear of it cheapening the brand.
We're on the cusp of having processing power, optics, and cameras and other infrastructure do do things we've all read about in cyberpunk novels or seen in movies. But whats lagging behind is the miniaturisation. All the stuff they thought they could do in the 80s with VR.... we can now actually do. The stuff we are all wanting to do with AR is currently where VR was in the 80s. The ideas, the desires are 40 years ahead of the equipment needed to deploy them. As you said: glasses, or contact lenses. Preferably with no external power or compute source.
That being said: apple should have dropped some of the features like the front facing display and associated glass/electronics to save weight. Although then, I guess it would have been a huge lump of metal on your head. Maybe the display saves weight.
When the Vision Pro fails, I don't think it will have much of an impact on other manufacturers though. They've already made the mistakes of headsets with too much weight, not enough FOV and so on. It is unusual for apple to repeat mistakes others have made, but I think the other players in the market will be able to look at the eye and gesture based interaction that apple did get right, and implement versions of that into their next iteration of products.
No one reads that
The problem they, and others, have with miniaturisation, is that there is a limit to how small and how far away they can place screens, in these devices.
You can get away with a lot with AR, but for an immersive VR experience you need, relatively large screens and isolation, so I can't see VR devices getting any smaller than oversized swimming goggles, which will only tackle the weight issue, not really any of the others mentioned in the video.
I think this is really intended for devs to buy, and not aimed at the basic consumer yet. They had to know this isn’t a consumer friendly price. They put it out there so devs can figure out and build the must have apps. And after developers figure out what features work, Apple trims the fat for the next consumer model. But they should have called this one a dev kit.
Apple dev hmd has been out for a while already.
@@GamerMuscleVideos the dev software has, but not the hmd. They’ve allowed you as a dev to schedule time to test apps developed on the hardware only on specific days at specific locations. Also Unity, the biggest 3D engine for Xr just released their integration to devs recently. Either way, not nearly enough time to really figure it out yet. I was on the early betas, but developing using a simulator is not the same thing.
To the gulag with you. It's called a spatial computer. How dare you call it VR.
It's a baffling product. Time will tell if it might actually take off but my prediction is that it won't.
I think the VR tech is still changing pretty fast. There is no final display or optical stack yet. Its still the wild west.
For example: How many cameras do we need for tracking/ computervision? 1(dk2) ,2 (Rift), 3(Rift) 4(quest), 5(rift s), 12(vision pro?!!)
Im an apple fanboy :) And i dont want to buy this, not just the price, but like you said they’ve repeated the flaws. Hardware tech almost isn’t available. Need the LG transparent TVs to shrink to Rayban level lenses. Probably about 20 years away.
Good rant good points. Ive always said comfort is #1
Jim of course you are wrong. How dare you question an Apple product. No matter what you perceive is wrong with it, including it going on fire and burning you to death, is clearly user error. They were wearing it wrong.
I 100% agree with you, Apple really dropped the ball by not doing something novel and lacks the typical Apple ingenuity. Sure it's got a lot of tech but that's a low hanging fruit. The lack of ergonomics is the biggest oversight.
Spot on..... It looks like a real fumbled opportunity. Hopefully it doesn't unwittingly kill VR development.
Good assessment
You are 100% right. I am reluctant to VR devices and apple's design does nothing about it.
I think there are some glasses-like VR devices have you try them?
I'm " vr-curious" I don't dislike your recent videos but I would like something more abstract and less specific about settings and all that.
10 years ago, the new apple VR headset would have been amazing. But today, this thing is full of compromises. Extended battary? Low FOV? Heavy? Lacking compatibility? Huge device? It’s the complete opposite of what apple should have build. 😂
Totally agree
You forgot that this time with new Apple Device we dont have Steve Jobs anymore… thats why apple wont do well with VR
I think this is the iPhone 1 of VR. It's expensive, it doesn't do much, it is heavy, etc. but the next iteration is deep in development and is less than a year away. Remember that the base model iPhone was $500 and 11 months later we had a better, lighter iPhone 3G that was $200 with twice the storage. I think this Apple VR thing is mostly a dev platform.
I hope you are right but
I phone 1 , iPod 1 , iMac and other equivalent products were really good and nothing like this.
Apple watch is maybe a bit like this just ended up being another smart watch but then again don't really see any hype for apple watch over other smart watches.
@@GamerMuscleVideos yeah, maybe it's wishful thinking. I am thinking that Apple's walled garden approach will probably not push VR/AR in a direction I'm interested in anyway.
you are 100% crazy, but you are right about this.
Never ever anything from Apple.
Unusual for apple to get it so wrong in the first iteration. It's more like their developer model. thankfully I think its still a positive move for VR/AR/MR. More versions will definitely follow
These are all the exact same thoughts I had. I hope we are wrong.
I thought they would’ve used the phone as a computer. That made some sense to me. Not heard anyone state if you can use it as a device through steam. I’m assuming not.
I'm gonna buy it ......i need new skiing goggles.
Great idea, then you can do your taxes while your on your snowboard.
Agreed , it will be a disaster for Apple , with their smart phone sales constantly reducing one would think they’d really go for the VR market & make it special & for mass consumption , they’ve really got this wrong
I was excited about this thing because if anyone could solve the problems of vr it was Apple. But this has all of the same problems. I think once people get over how neat it is, theyll discover it’s mostly inconvenient with few use cases and zero killer app
IMO, the people who will shell out $3500 for the first iteration won't spend a lot of time complaining. They will either be devs or Apple fanboys who line up around the block anytime the Apple vomits out a new iPhone.
@@lavachemist Bingo this is a dev platform without all the kinks worked out to allow developers to build the apps that people will want when their consumer headset drops later on.
Completely agree with you. I lost interest in this Apple VR a long time ago for many of the reasons you listed
I see this being like the first generation iPad and Apple Watch where nobody talks about them because they were really developer tools. It seems like they are marketing for unrealistic uses, like a lifestyle device. It seems like your iPhone as a VR headset. Apple pissing off devs isn’t going to help them either, combine that with this powerful device that’s really not even going be able to be used in gaming….. it’s a hard pass. The big screen beyond is the device moving things forward if you’re not adding in AR. Make it a bit higher resolution, get rid of the shimmer and give it fovated eye tracking and you’ve nailed what’s much closer to being my optimal device. The Vision Pro is the Lexus LFA of the VR world
I think the problem is with recent apple stuff , going back The first Ipad was a bench mark , the First Iphone was a bench mark , The first I pod was a benchmark , the Macintosh was exactly like those devices as well .... Samsung out apple'd apple on the smart watch side of things but yah apple basically bumbled around trying to make there watch good or make sense for its price and what it did.
The only excuse we can give is its a dev tool / its to get something to market, but then surely thats what Ipad,Ipod,Mac,Iphone did whalst also being amazing devices in the first place.
@@GamerMuscleVideos they really weren’t amazing devices when they first dropped, at least not the iPad and Apple Watch. Everyone thinks of their successors that came out shortly after. The first Apple Watch is so bad it’s referred to the Apple Watch zero and the 1X is the first gen. The first iPad got a whole two updates before it was abandoned, I see this going the same way. The difference here is, I really just don’t see the market.
yah you just picked the two worst devices , not the main products that you would consider the core of apple which were all prity damn good at launch or at least the base hardware was solid. Yah I see this going same way as the iwatch or other failed apple products specifically because it makes no real sense in its current form.
what might keep apple going though is compeition and the fact that AR will quite likely be the norm for average consumer within 25 years , as it offers far to much utility for it not to be.
@@ShawnHinck
2 years late for that type of use....and over priced by $2000 for use case/competition. NEXT!
It seems to be marketed as a multi monitor replacement and a 3D / big screen entertainment viewing device. But if it's uncomfortable and heavy... people aren't really going to use it for 10 hours a day. They would just get a second or third monitor for cheaper, or even a single giant screen, to be honest. :-\
Agreed, any Company would have a riot on their hands if they expected their Staff to plop these things on their heads and isolate themselves all day, from what makes a lot jobs bearable, social interaction.
Exactly , it's like everything is moot unless it's comfortable
I like your idea about having the computer part in your pocket with the battery to reduce weight. But I wonder how thick the cable would have to be as it needs to transmit high resolution screen, all the data from cameras and sensors, power etc. what else? Too thick cable would not be comfortable I believe.
I mean quest 3 USB C cable with 900Mbps looks great , you can get prity thin display port cables
Video calling is great on apples. Limited use, but for me with my dad living a fair way away, brilliant.
Seems like video calls would be available for Q3
You are 100% correct.
Maybe Microsoft will buy Varjo or better yet Bigscreen Beyond and give Apple some comp. That would be great for PC users.
Microsoft ditched vr they don't care about it at the moment
@@GamerMuscleVideos True
👍 for anyone shitting on the apple.
It is 7 times cheaper than the Vison Pro , not 1/4 James... Apple pre-sold 200k of them though and are already working on the second version. At the very least they will help with supply chain costs to other manufactures for some of the high-end components. I'd suggest watching the latest video from Immersed, where they do a lighthearted comparison with their upcoming glasses form factor even higher res mini-OLED headset, which has a boosted version of the chipset in the Quest 3.
At the moment Immersed exists only on Immersed videos as non functional sunglasses advertised as 4k per eye VR headset. I am afraid it might be a next DecaGear 1. But of course I hope I am wrong.
@@davidzx692 It certainly pays to be skeptical in this space. Even though they haven't showed it off yet, they are supposed to be doing that next quarter when their big hardware tech partners allow them to. And the fact they have been able to work with Qualcomm directly gives some hope, and even though it is their first piece of hardware, they have established, well-regarded, VR software. And Bigscreen managed that transition. So, I am cautiously optimistic about it at the moment - I certainly wouldn't pre-order one though, but I also wouldn't do that for anything these days.
What does the other person see when you're video calling them from this headset?
Someone wearing an oversize ski mask, with a cartoon face.
That they saved 3500 and their friend is a moron
the gen 1 / apple experiment theory or its a prosumer dev kit theory doesn't hold up. Apple has never released a product that they didn't want to be marketed as a consumer product. There team just didn't choose the right path this round but hey competition is good and it keeps the vr progression rolling!
Design is cool
Long term i think it's going to be Elon's neural link. It'll hack into your sense's. You'll close your eyes, smell the petrol in the race car, your skin will feel the foam and cushioning of your race seat, you'll feel the heat of the sun on your face. It'll be just like being in a simulation.....or are we in one NOOOOOOWWW! Du-du-derrrrr 😂😂😂
We don't have any tech for that , that's non invasive. So it's 50-80 years away for pure brain VR unless some random elcto magnetic device or new neuroscience is developed.
Untill then all be about screens on faces
4000 bux to sit on the couch and shop amazon in vr...fakkkking apple lol
There are certainly good points - the confort is a big one but can be helped with third party aftermarket head straps. Bobovr to the rescue again 😉 Not much can be done about the unnecessary weighty materials in this version (glass and metal etc) but hopefully someone does a teardown and 3D prints a housing as a proof of concept and the response is good. Apple might adapt in the next version. But I think the biggest point is the vision pro becomes a platform getting more people into VR that have the best possible 'first VR experience'. Nothing would put more people off VR than what so many of us have seen or experienced in the past on bad performing or configured headsets ... motion sickness.
My real hope is that folks are blown away in their first experience and as more apps, that make sense and provide better and fun ways of doing day to day things ... people will want to experience VR more and more. Eventually driving down the price etc etc.
I'm cautiously optimistic. 😊
That's true , but I don't see how apple hmd would blow people away any more than a quest 3
It’s almost like Apple hasn’t done any due diligence. Just given it to a designer (not a product designer) and then made it without anyone testing it. Hopefully I’m wrong, and the once that buy it, love it. But it doesn’t look good…
audio was a bit low for this video
It was fine for me 😊
I guess putting a laptop on you face is cooler (thermally) than trying to keep one in you pocket.
I agree and common sense has left the building these days..Btw that song you sang the other day I believe it’s a hit (I’m a DD Girl) I love it just needs some tweaking here and there and definitely More Cow Bell!!! I honestly believe it’s Gold just add the word Cincinnati in it somewhere..Hell look what it did for Jimmy Buffet 👍 your big fan Ole Skool✌️
Just like most things from Apple... other companies can do it better and sell for less $. The apple vision pro should be around $1000.
End of the day the Apple saps will buy it then it'll be left collecting dust or end up on eBay. Apple still laughing all the way to the bank end of the day.
It'd doomed to fail at that price.
I think the price actually helps it ironically
The AVP is called "Pro" like in "Mac Pro", so I assume there will be lighter devices coming, both in weight and price. I also would guess that motion-controllers might be coming or compatibility with existing ones. The gaming-revenues are too big to ignore with Apples 30% cut. Problem with the comfort is, that flexible headstraps doesn't work and I guess Apple or another company will sell a solution for that. The battery as a counterweight would also make sense.
Main problem from this concept is, that proper AR-displays doesn't exist, so you need too many cameras getting this otherwise disposable passthrough alright, and Apple succeeded in this regard. They were also more clever by making a VR-device for non-gaming consumers while the Quest Pro was a miserable attempt in comparison. The Quest 3 isn't good enough in this regard because of too low resolution displays without eye-tracking. Meta must be dumb if they don't work on a proper Quest Pro successor and better software for those purposes.
Yah there pass through from what I have read looks great but then it's still pass through with lots of the issue's.
And as I said in video a more open glasses style hmd is way more impressive for AR / pass through even with quest 3.
Ultimately the vision pro is a VR device but it's like apple think it's an AR device or are confused.
As a result it's a bad VR and bad AR device.
They should have just picked one and went with that.
Only logic I can come up with is this is there baseline for what they think all VR hmds should do interns of sensors and tools Devs should then have access to , IE it's a foundation platform and then that needs 5-10 years of development.
It's just that's not what apple have traditionally done and not where apple has traditionally been successful.
AVP will be outdated very soon for the most part. By this time next year, it will be on the shelf or for sale on ebay for $900.
@@GamerMuscleVideos Again, the pass-through is necessary because there are no decent displays that can turn transparent. So far the AVP is getting quite overwhelming reviews just with a few flaws and certainly practicable for people who need to work in hotels and want a bigger screen than their Macbook. The others can buy for example an Asus with dual-display and 6 hours battery-life for less. The home ego-cinema purpose can be done with a Quest 3 as well and certainly gaming, but have you tried to cut a video in Virtual Desktop? You will probably miss the resolution of the AVP for this purpose, which renders about 4x more pixels and give you 4k plus iPad-apps instead of 1080p. The thing just needs a better headstrap and for comfort-reasons.
@@BoltRM Nope, just the displays alone are said to be 1k, and from the specs the AVP is actually cheap. Just look the price of a Varjo XR-4, which provides an awful passthrough (worse than Quest 3). Two CPUs, lots of cameras and the hole software integration won't be matched that soon and only the big players can even compete, so Meta, Samsung, maybe Sony or a Pico 5 Pro. Look how bad the HTC XR Elite is despite so long experience in this market. Look how much Somnium is asking for their VR1 just for a barebone headset with lower specs. The prices will come down a bit, but not so soon if ever. The displays will get cheaper, but camera-optics, lenses, CPUs and the hole engineering process with hard- and software rather not so much.
Not sure what the drama is 🤔 its for devs and enthusiasts. More apps get created will leas to a consumer friendly version etc
They had a Dev hmd already
I have to admit, I hate the direction VR is taking, these stand alone headsets with no real PCVR (connection to a display port), they have amazing screens and optics just to not be able to take full advantage of their goodness due to compression, can you imagine how good the Quest 3 would be with a true Display Port connection and no compression?
As for AR, I personally don't have a use for it, yes, it's a neat experience but for me, more of a novelty with very little use, if I want to see the real world, I'll take the uncomfortable headset off and see the world in super high res, super high definition with HDR and be comfortable doing it, it's called using my own eyes! LOL.
to be fair with link cable , you can't see compression. its more just a case of it giving overhead and not being as seamless as a HDMI port into HMD , i think also everyone has moved to wireless regardless due to how much more fun it is for room scale + stand alone VR is so much more simple and easy to use as a device for most people.
I agree though in some ways I really miss just having hdmi / DP into hmd :( and would like it as a option with new hmds
The price is not made for the average consumer so therefore they don’t need to follow the rules for what average consumers want. I do think that once they make the average consumer version it will comply a bit more and I also believe these type of headsets will bridge the gap to vr and eventually help vr grow further in a handful of years. That’s my theory and I hope it all comes true.
Who is this device for then ? Its like they are following the rules of making something no consumer wants.
Why would a wealthy apple fan use this over a screen or tablet or other apple device why would they want to stick a chunky heavy VR headset on there face , it really does not make sense for anyone other than people susceptible to marketing.
@@GamerMuscleVideos you answered the question in your reply and your video buddy. I love vr and I can honestly say this headset was not made for me as I love gaming, but you can see from their pre orders and the demand that people want to try this. It will probably outsell psvr 2 in a handful of months too and it will bridge the gap to vr.
One of the biggest complaints about vr and also one of the things people love about vr is that you escape the real world and are completely cut off from it. Apple headset bridges that gap as you combine the virtual world but are still in touch with the real world. I’m no Apple fan boy and I don’t ever see me buying an Apple headset, but I do see it guiding people into vr over the next handful of years.
Apple headset massively cuts you off it honestly looks worse than when you use quest 3 with no interface , I think it will pan out they have totally failed in there goal and the eye screen on the front does not work at all due to how its designed look at other videos about it it really looks super janky.
Looks like a bad AR and bad VR headset to be honest @@jamesleegte5753
@@GamerMuscleVideos this has the quest pro and quest 3 story written all over it! My money is on we will see an exact same story and timeline as quest pro and quest 3. This headset is the prototype and expensive and then the improved cheaper mass market one comes.
There is going to be a lot of Vision Pro returns. I e been using quest 3 last few days. Considering to return it. Fun with games. But to clink it on my head is more of a struggle. Imaging me getting phone calls when not wearing it. The. Run to it and put it on for FaceTime. Vision pro does t even have games.
If meta can make a headset for 1k usd /eur with similar Oled screens and clarity for AR. Then they will outperform apples device. Meta gotta do more integration for productivity. Today it’s just streaming a computer.
are you using a custom headstrap with quest 3 ? its super crap without.
Default strap. I have ordered the mk3 strap with battery. We’ll see. Also quest 3 UI is strange. Buying games with Norwegian credit card doesn’t work inside quest 3. Have to use phone. Also why is there no sync function with phones for messages and email and images right ?
It’s just a MacBook in a headset. Can you even game on Mac’s?
I for one don’t give a stuff who makes the tech all i want is a product which does a good job at what’s it’s supposed to do.
Apple vision Pro so far I have not seen anything which I can see is on any use to me. The stupid screen on the front I can’t see any benefit it brings to the headset other than maybe helping in marketing.
Watching movies on it meh! why would i want to even start as it will run out of power before the end of the movie probably!
I have seen little or nothing on its AR potential the stupid idea you will use it instead of monitor screen is not practical for most people.
No mention of little mention of VR or AR gaming.
Yes you can where the stupid thing on your face to play XBox games on a massive screen dumb, very few people will do that.
So all in all to me a wasted product lunch, I wait to see if it brings anything remotely if use.
Does anyone understand what this device is even for?
AR porn.
Justifying apples VR department that has not produced a consumer product in over a decade.
@@GamerMuscleVideos So they made a 3500$ ski mask with a battery pack. Excellent😂
The main question is - How did GM hurt his wrist....
Lol not my wrist it's for golfers elbow , wrist restraint reduces movement and then reduces repetitive strain on elbow tendons
Yeah I suffer with that - Found out is was because I had a shoulder issue and elbow was compensating @@GamerMuscleVideos
Hi, can't see this lasting,it will be a passing fad ,
I think they have fucked up too ,,i love vr gaming got cv1, g2, now crystal ,i think this device isn't for me its for techies who work on pcs , i cant believe its tethered imo it will fail HARD then il get one cheap lol
Throw money in yes, but asking for 3 and a half grand back ? Ouch.
Agreed, the cost will kill this, as, for most Consumers this will be just an entertainment device, like a TV, DVD, game console, etc. , all of which are priced in a range that can be justified.
But $3500 is way too much for Dad to buy for himself and the family to amuse themselves with, especially when competing devices that are so much less.
When it comes to use as working device, I don't see anyone wanting to strap this this thing on their heads all day at work.
I love all the poor people cope videos!
How does that make sense ?
@@GamerMuscleVideos ponder that for a bit and get back to me.
No explain how this video is a poor people cope ? @@michaelvarney.
@@GamerMuscleVideos wait… did you think I said your video was poor people cope? Was your video nothing but a rant on how expensive this is, and from that premise fitting a narrative on how bad the APV is as a form of sour grapes regarding that price? If not then I would not call such a video a “poor people cope”.
flopper... cheap 2nd hand perhaps ?
I think the biggest culprit here is that - as you mention - they haven't really shown what it's for. There's no killer app or killer use case to revolutionise anything. Judging by their promo videos it seems to be for normal media consumption or as an extension of what we already do. VR/AR has so much potential to do something completely new, and already does in the gaming space (to some extent), but for som reason Apple doesn't want to tap into that market. I'm waiting for someone to make a Spinal Tap inspired meme with guy1 trying to explain why this is amazing, and guy2 saying: "This does nothing that I can't already do with my other devices. Why would I want yet another device to do the same?" Guy1: "This one goes on ya face!"
If they released goggles attached to a computer it wouldn't be as marketable and profitable.
When it comes to phones, Apple has never been ahead of Androids. They're just better at marketing and ease of use. We as gamers should be looking at this as an opportunity for VR and MR to gain momentum. We should not consider buying these products as they will be behind in terms of features and overall technology - just like with phones
I phone was before android smart phones , I had a Sony p900 and used windows CE devices also palm 3e years before smart phones really took off , but apple genuinely innovated the user experience and base line exspectation of , mobile music players and mobile phones so they really did push things forwards in many ways. Then they just slumped and since I phone have not really done anything like that.
ironically iphone is less easy to use than android now , unless you happen to also have apple pc apple watch and everything else apple. but if you are a normal person with a mix of devices ie best device from different companies apple is a total pain in the ass.
@GamerMuscleVideos obviously I meant in the last 10 or so years. Android has been ahead with most features and then Apple eventually implements them into their products and markets them like they just invented them.
I am not an Apple fan at all. I have no Apple products and never will be for 2 reasons. All their products are so damn expensive. and I find Apple products only work well with other Apple devices.
So being only a PC user for a long time, you won't see me spending 3500 dollars for an Apple VR headset.
End of story!!!!!
You read developers tech specs it doesn't do properly vr immersive games
I think the hand gestures and eye traking is good
Everyone has said the pro is to heavy
It is like 17,000 dollar apple watch they released on first gen
When you see reviews of this headset that the headset is useless for games and fitness which is the exact use case for vr
It has no killer apps
Why couldnt they have made the headset out of some composite material to be lighter
It also seems you need to have a mac keyboard as the keyboard is useless
It is apple way making innovative devices but overpricing them or being late to market as with the homepod
The lie that apple come late to market but make everything better is a lie
Apple have shot themsleves in the foot with developers with the recent eu regulations as netflix , youtube and spotify are not on the vision pro
I think your right , apple watch is very analogous to this.
My worry is apple watch didn't even cost 1/10th as much to develop and is a waywayway more simple device that is also way easier for consumers to upgrade through or be more relaxed about.
@@GamerMuscleVideos what I was interested in as were apple developers lazy just to use the iPad os as with spacial computing wouldn't you expect 3d icons and everything to be 3d rather than 2d
The lack of immersion shocks me as with hololens you had 3d Minecraft which is for kids a killer app
Considering the watch was just an iPod nano on a watch originally 😊
More than 10 years since the foundation of OCULUS (Now META), with more than 6 devices released already to the public, and Apple think that from one day to another will release a VR/AR device that it's better? sorry, to do that, they need something called EXPERIENCE, and that takes years. I really hope that no one buy this thing and Apple get a lot of cancellations and returning devices, so they get a big lesson for good. Average go from 4000 to 5000 dollars to have Apple Vision Pro (because Apple care it's a must always with this kind of product)? really? ... Give me 10 QUEST 3 to give it to every member of my family and friends lol and let's play and do whatever we want together, a much better investment I think.
Even as an Apple fanboy I’ve never been really interested in this product. Since it was first announced through to release I’ve thought long and hard about what it will actually be used for. At least with other mainstream VR headsets you can use them for gaming, which is probably the most successful niche where VR has been implemented….but Apple’s commitment to gaming has and continues to be half-arsed so that is a non-starter within the current Apple ecosystem (considering it won’t work with any games outside of that ecosystem).
So the questions remains, what specific action would you rather do as a user of this thing, beyond the novelty phase, with the headset on as opposed to just doing it on either your Mac, iPad or iPhone. And I can’t think of a single one. The closest thing would be watching a movie or TV in 3D, but that’s hardly worth $3500. Plus I don’t like movies so for me personally that is of zero value 😂
Right now it feels like a first-gen tech demo. Too heavy, wayyy too expensive with little to no actual real-world use. Maybe it will find a niche in the future that we’re just not thinking about right now. I think Steve Jobs would have laughed at this product and said “you must be fkin jokin, mate” (if he was British) while Tim Cook is trying a bit too hard in creating his own legacy with a slightly pretentious product like this.
THIS WAS NEVER DESIGNED FOR CONSUMERS. This was supposed to be a development headset so that software developers had something to work with to create the killer apps for when the less expensive consumer device that they have already said is coming later.
Make no mistake that the Apple Vision Pro is a breakthrough device, but it IS a development headset. The Board seems to have pushed them into releasing this as a consumer product when it was never supposed to be that. What they are doing is working out all the things we need for AR to work. Like the combination eye tracking and gesture support and all the cameras inward and outward facing. There is a lot of tech and new ideas that they are working with. Sure the outward facing eyes don't work well in bright light, but is is another completely new concept.
And no they didn't mess up the FOV. They have been pushing foundries' to ramp up production of a 1.4" uOLED display which is the largest uOLED display currently in production. Pancake lenses are small and allow the displays to be very close to the lenses, but they don't allow for much magnification. They have as much FOV as they could possibly get out of that 1.4" Display. The Quest 3 is using miniLED displays that are much larger which allows for more FOV. So it's not that they don't know what they are doing. They have adopted uOLED as being the future and are starting with that, rather than miniLED's which are peaking now, but will be falling out of favor.
So Apple is priming the pump for future larger uOLED displays that will benefit us all in VR land.
The final AR device that will be embraced by the masses will be more like a Magic Leap where you can see out of the displays with your eyes and without cameras or reprojection, BUT that tech has other deal breakers which is why it hasn't taken off either. Ironically that won't be uOLED based, but it's further away right now.
So Apple is dead on the money for moving AR forward, but this is just a building block to try out a lot of new ways of doing things and it is that integration that will make what they finally release for consumers important.
I use an Android phone and run windows computers and only have one ancient iPod to my name, so I'm not an Apple fanboy.
If they were dead on the money and this was purely a developer device ( they already had a dev device they didn't market / was secret )
they would have made it lighter , used lighter materials not put the outward face screen on it , not used glass or metal , they would have had a better head strap design
and they would not have marketed this in a way that's meant to appeal to wider consumers / Any apple consumer that has lots of money to spend on expensive apple stuff as a luxury consumer device.
Sure they want to set the foundation for developers to know what a general target platform is but this device does not seem to know if its a VR headset or a AR headset and does nether very well..
Great they are using OLED displays but why would a niche developer only limited run hmd be the way to ramp up production ? The oled screens also have the core issues from pancake lenses that actually make this device bad for watching films as a screen replacement ( ghosting / fog effect) rendering a large part of having that contrast and colour quality redundant.
So sure it looks like they were forced to push something out before they were at all ready to actually release a proper product that makes sense for apple , that's not a good thing...
Quest 3 with no facial interface is really really good as an AR device I think even meta missed a trick with that.
Obvously all companies are aiming for proper magic leap type solution , do you not think meta have got more of a platform that people are developing for ?
not going to be to hard to go from hand / controller input to eye track based input the nice thing with eye track input is its really intuitive and also not to hard to implement when a developer started out with other forms of input.
Its not cybertruck bad though lol , just its going to take some miracle for this not to be a device that most people ditch after a few months like many other VR / AR devices that are not fundamentally comfortable or don't have a specific use that nothing else can do more comfortably or easily.
They need to announce some form of eye tracking / AI integration that some how makes this one of the most productive and easy to use computing platforms , then they would be onto a winner ( if they also fixed the comfort)
@@GamerMuscleVideos Unless someone actually had a compelling use case (which would be very rare since there is no killer app for it yet ) they shouldn't buy this unless they are developing software for it.
You are correct that the Apple fanboys who just had to have one of these, will likely lose interest, but what can you do. They will line up around the block for anything Apple puts out.
The whole point is that they need to get this out there so that killer aps can be developed and that means a LOT more units than a few "secret devices". Writing good software takes time and requires having a platform created in the thousands.
Yah but again , killer apps came for Iphone and apple mac due to the iphone and apple mac being really good devices in the first place , also fundamentally I'm not sure how much people that do buy the AVP will actually use the HMD unless there is some big changes to its comfort.
Also device that doesn't really do anything over similar device that's 1/7th the price for the sake of you being a alpha tester does not really sound like " a good product" by standard definitions of what people typically define as a good product.
But hay lots of people don't know about VR , apple marketing is strong and if they can sell enough to get a user base maybe something will come from it but its essentially down to factors separate to the actual intrinsic qualities of the product.
ironically I want it to sell well as it makes more companies get into VR and for face book and apple to play off each other which only markets and pushes VR faster so that I get nice AR glasses even sooner.
Downside is we already have people lapping up apples "Spatial Computing" rebrand of AR despite the headset clearly being more VR than AR due to how chunky it is.
@@markkovalcson7243
1. I have a few VR headsets that I use for gaming
2. I tried to do what I want with them for my job, and they just don’t work
3. I don’t want Meta in my home or life, so I’m not going near a Quest, Cambridge Analytica was a big lesson to never forget
4. I’m buying a Vision Pro tomorrow for work, it’s half the price of buying a MacBook Pro and iPad Pro that I’d need for what I do and I’ll earn the cost back in half a day
For me, Apple is for mission critical work, other Operating Systems are just not reliable enough, I can’t have failure like my Windows PC and current VR headsets often do. If I can’t play Assetto for a few days, it makes no real difference to my life, if I can’t earn because the software just decides not to work I can lose tens of thousands.
Apple fan boys 😅
Its not VR nor AR
Is it ...... A made up word by apple for them to pretend they invented something totally by themselves so it can't be compared to anything else despite literally being a AR/VR HMD ?
@@GamerMuscleVideos big difference
@@GamerMuscleVideosi hope u try it frist before u say that
Please explain to me how the device is a totally different category of device to say a quest 3 or say other AR/VR headsets ? @@wawaxkalee88
@@GamerMuscleVideos Complete immersion: VR headsets typically block out the real world entirely, creating a confined and sometimes isolating experience.
Limited interaction: Traditional VR interactions often rely on hand controllers, which can feel less intuitive than natural hand gestures.
Focus on gaming: Most VR headsets are primarily designed for gaming and entertainment, with limited productivity applications.
Vision Pro's Unique Capabilities:
Advanced interaction: Eye-tracking and LiDAR enable precise interaction with digital objects, similar to VR's direct manipulation.
Dynamic transparency: Adjustable transparency levels allow for both AR-like overlays and VR-like immersion in specific areas.
Wider field of view: The wider field of view expands the perceived space, making the experience feel less confined than traditional VR.
Productivity focus: While still offering entertainment options, the Vision Pro emphasizes productivity and communication applications.
Why "AR" and "VR" Don't Fit:
Vision Pro transcends the limitations: It offers more than just information overlay (AR) and goes beyond complete immersion (VR).
Limiting labels hinder understanding: Using "AR" or "VR" might give users a misleading impression of the device's capabilities.
Apple's "Spatial Computing" Approach:
Focuses on the device's core functionality: Interacting with the real and digital world in a 3D space.
More inclusive and accurate: Encompasses both AR and VR aspects, offering a broader understanding of the device's potential.
Remember:
Technology is constantly evolving, and the lines between these terms are becoming increasingly blurred.
Apple's approach reflects this evolution and avoids limiting users' understanding of the Vision Pro's capabilities.
I hope this explanation clarifies why "AR" and "VR" fall short and how "spatial computing" offers a more accurate picture of the Vision Pro's unique features.
I agree, let's see what software innovation comes from the App store, there's no point putting this on to look at Apps that exist on your Ipad. Just use your Ipad. It's never going to be for gaming so I wonder whether they can pull in a non gamer audience and sell enough to encourage developers to create apps for it. You are not crazy, I think they have got it wrong.
Moan moan moan moan why isn’t this thing tailor made for me Moan moan moan moan why don’t company’s just do what I know to be right moan moan moan moan
If you don't want critical thinking you really should be watching other youtubers.
Well I really enjoyed this video rant … nearly as much as the one with the Apple FB watching like 6 basketball games at once and trying to convince himself (and his audience) that this is the bees knees lol 😂
Only a butt hurt Apple Fanboy would moan about people moaning about an Apple device.
I think you missed every critical point in the video and that it's not about what "I want" it's about what is likely to move VR forward.