(request vid)NBA Defenses - Changing the Game
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- Опубліковано 17 січ 2015
- =================================
----Illegal Defense Official NBA Guidelines----
A. Technical Foul
Section I-Illegal Defenses
a. Illegal defenses which violate the rules and accepted guidelines set forth are not permitted in the NBA.
b. When the offensive team is in its backcourt with the ball, no illegal defense violation may occur.
(1) Penalties for Illegal Defenses.
On the first violation, the 24-second clock is reset to 24. On the second and succeeding violations, the clock is reset to 24 and one free throw (technical) is attempted. When a violation occurs during the last 24 seconds of any period (including overtime), regardless of the number of prior offenses, one free throw is awarded for the violation. (On all violations, the ball is awarded to the offended team out-of-bounds at the free throw line extended on either side of the court.)
EXCEPTION: If a field goal attempt is simultaneous with a whistle for an illegal violation, and that attempt is successful, the basket shall count and the violation is nullified.
(2) Guidelines for Defensive Coverage
a. Weakside defenders may be in a defensive position within the "outside lane" with no time limit, and within the "Inside lane" for 2.9 seconds. The defensive player must re-establish a position with both feet out of the "Insidelane" to be considered as having legally cleared the restricted area.
b. When a defensive player is guarding an offensive player who is adjacent (posted-up) to the 3-second lane, the defensive player may be within the "inside lane" area with no time limitations. An offensive player shall be ruled as "postedup" when he is within 3' of the free throw lane line. A hash mark on the baseline denotes the 3' area.
c. An offensive player without the ball may not be double-teamed from the weakside. Only the player with the ball may be double-teamed by a weakside defensive player. Weakside and strongside restrictions shall extend from the baseline to the midcourt line.
d. When an offensive player, with or without the ball, takes a position above the foul line, the defensive player may be no farther (toward the baseline) than the "middle defensive area." Defensive player(s) may enter and re-enter the "lower defensive area" as many times as desired, so long as he does not exceed 2.9 seconds.
e. When a weakside offensive player is above the free throw line extended, his defensive man may be no lower than the "middle defensive area" extended for more than 2.9 seconds. When a weakside offensive player is below the free throw line extended, his defensive man must vacate the "inside lane" unless his man is positioned adjacent (posted up) to the threesecond lane extended. When a weakside offensive player is above the tip of the circle, his defensive man must be no lower than the "upper defensive area" for more than 2.9 seconds. When a strongside offensive player is above the tip of the circle extended, his defensive man may be no lower than the free-throw line extended (upper defensive area) for more than 2.9 seconds. When a strongside offensive player is above the free throw line extended "upper defensive area, his defensive man may be no lower than the "middle defensive area" for more than 2.9 seconds. When an offensive player on the strongside is below the free throw line extended "middle defensive area," his defender must take a position below the free throw line extended immediately or double-team the ball as soon as the ball crosses midcourt. There is no 2.9 time limit. If the offensive player relocates to a position above the free throw line extended, his defender may take a similar position no farther than one defensive area away within 2.9 seconds. In all of the situations above, a defensive player may always aggressively double-team the ball regardless of his previous position on the floor.
f. When an offensive player takes a position above the tip of the circle, with or without the ball, the defensive player may be no farther (toward the baseline) from him than the "upper defensive area."
g. A defensive player must follow his weakside offensive man, switch to another man at an area of intersection, or double-team the ball. There is no 2.9-second time limit on this play. A defensive player must execute one of these three options or he is guilty of an illegal defense immediately.
h. A defensive player must follow his strongside offensive man, switch to another man at an area of intersection, or double-team the ball. There is a 2.9-second time limit on this play which commences when the defensive player reaches the weakside and "opens up."
i. A double team is when two or more defenders aggressively pursue a player with the ball to a position close enough for a held ball to occur. Failure to comply with paragraphs (a) through (i) above will result in an Illegal Defense violation. - Спорт
The huge change that this also caused is that, in order to have an elite offense, you need 4 guys that can actually shoot the ball, and the 5th needs to be able to provide vertical spacing.
Yep. That's why the video is partly titled "Changing the Game". The introduction of zone changed the game so fundamentally that it reshaped how rosters had to be constructed, transformed the roles of the different player positions and made certain player types go extinct.
The zone to me, creates less scoring opportunities for star players but opens up more opportunities for assists because they draw so much attention, my perspective of it anyway.
This is a very good take. Many more opportunities for spot up threes and dump offs/lobs for big men that didn't exist in the 80s and 90s.
Casual take
Dear Jordanites,
If you want to comment on the video, please stop spamming the page with big blocks of cut and paste from insane Jordan cult member channels and websites. You guys keep cutting and pasting meaningless data dumps of the same deliberately misleading, out-of-context stats and silly arguments *verbatim*. UA-cam automatically(and correctly) marks comments like that as spam and hides them because it detects that the same glut of text has been posted elsewhere over and over. No one, including me, can see your comments when you do that and I'm not going to constantly check and sort through my spam box looking for them just because you insist on trolling every basketball video with the same dumb shit literally word-for-word.
Type a real message like you have some sense so that people will actually get to see it and be able to respond.
craig michael
I think Kobe and Jordan are basically the same player so I'd say Kobe is more or less equal to Jordan. LeBron is better.than Jordan.
craig michael Yeah, Jordan is really insecure when it comes to LeBron. I'm just surprised that he makes it so obvious. You would think Jordan would at least hide it better so it wouldn't look so bad. It's like he just can't contain himself when LeBron comes up.
craig michael Dominique seems to hate modern players period. Every time I see him speak it's "in my day" this and "in our era" that. Apparently Dominique believes that you're automatically disqualified from being a great player if you were drafted after 1989. Which is unfortunate because I always assumed Wilkins was the type who could appreciate other people's games.
Hh
*****
What? Dominique really said that about Vince? Hate is a helluva drug...
People don't talk enough about how brutal it was for the TMac, Kobe, Pierce generation of guys to transition into playing against zone defenses when they came up in the league with a completely different set of rules. It was so much easier for an Iso scorer before 2001.
Brutal for Shaq that's why they brought back the zone and it didn't even affected him.
@@cheymilion3168 they were already defending him illegally it just wasn't getting called consistently. He complained about the rule change go look it up
@@waynetables6414 yup
@@waynetables6414 So why didn’t they average MJ numbers before 2001? Lol
A lot of people don't understand how rough the transition was to zone. Star players were literally contemplating retirement over it the first year or two.
Just imagine if guys like Westbrook, lebron or giannis played in a league where zone defense was illegal. They would all average 35+ and shockingly that might actually be an under exaggeration.
@WorldFlex yes they would tf lmao, they are WAY more athletic then other players back then they could easily put up those numbers
Agreed
@@dayshonjennings6284 Doesn't work like that because presumably their defenders would be bigger stronger faster and more skilled than guys from the 80's and 90's were. The rules effect everyone equally, the advancements these guys have benefited from effect everyone equally too. Everyone else in the 80's and 90's had the same opportunity to do dominate like MJ but none of them were able to, and MJ had no additional opportunity than they did.
LeBron might, but Giannis probably would not and Westbrook absolutely would not. There were a lot of big men enforcer types who just stayed in the paint and that was their only job and they could do that because there was no defensive three second rule. The paint was much more clogged and there was always a big man in the paint which would make it waaay harder for a small guard like Westbrook who needs a big launchpad.
@@dayshonjennings6284 *than
Most people on here doesn't understand the concept of a 'free zone'. When they hear zone, they automatically think "Oh 2-3 Zone defense, or 3-2 Zone defense. Teams will stop playing zone if you beat them."
That's not what a 'free' zone is. A 'free zone' allows all defensive players to play off-man. During the 90's, the minute you leave your man, you're called for an illegal defense. It used to be a BS rule because that rule didn't exist on the playgrounds.
Superstars hated zone defenses because they're now forced to share the ball and that effectively eliminated ISO scorers.
Great breakdown of the zone and how it deterred star players from spamming ISO’s.
That’s a big reason why I think james harden is such an underrated scorer because he’s still able to isolate vs zone defenses due to his ability to hit highly contested step back 3’s
That’s definitely not how the illegal defensive rule worked at all lol.
@@younggggggg No. Harden is able to isolate against zone defenses for two reasons. He’s a great scorer first and foremost. Reason number two, he was playing in a 5 out lineup where PJ Tucker and everyone on the Rockets can space the floor . All those Harden was leading the league in ISO’s, Russell Westbrook a terrible outside shooter was right behind him against those same zone defenses lol
@@Thanosdidtherighthing It was. you couldn't hedge on defense
I need more vids man. This is easily my favorite channel. Not only do you make claims, you have facts to back it. I'm a relatively young guy(24), but i've always tried to explain to my friends about how abolishing the illegal defense rule made it difficult for today's stars, and that stars today would've had a field day in the 90's & 80's
Poor Giannis Antetokounmpo. It never ceases to amaze me how little zone is talked about despite how important it is and how enormous a difference it makes. It's so odd watching these professional analysts try to break the games down without mentioning zone. It leaves these weird, gaping holes in their analysis when they do this since zone is the cause behind half the things that are happening. I understand the reasons why it's not talked about and the taboo of speaking the word "zone" in the NBA, but it's 2019. Zone has pretty much reshaped the game at this point. I think it's OK to acknowledge it's existence now.
Giannis Antetokounmpo in this Raptors series was pretty much a case study on how zone has re-written how the game has to be played. Just from what I've seen of him, I think if Giannis played in the pre-zone 90s he would distantly lead the league in scoring on 60+% shooting. His stats would look like typos. He'd be easily the best player in the league. He's a giant freak of nature with muscles and speed everywhere who can get to the rim and finish seemingly at will against a single defender. But against a zone, it doesn't matter. You can just form walls in and around the paint and that's the end of that. There was no way Giannis could get to the hoop against Toronto's zone defense. He can get some good numbers because he can get dunks in transition and when the opportunity presents itself, but he can't actually control when he scores. He couldn't take over the game since you can't run a play for him to score on command because the zone reduces everyone to long jumpers, which he doesn't have. I felt bad watching Giannis heave up 3-pointers that he was visibly uncomfortable shooting. But he had no real choice.
But I was glad to see the TNT guys at least acknowledge that this was zone being applied to Giannis. Analysts usually avoid ever admitting to zone and why the stars are struggling. They will usually criticize the players for taking too many 3s instead of penetrating or posting up, as though the players are just doing this for no reason.
Bro. Came here to say the exact same thing. It's insane they analyze as if they are brainwashed... they NEVER bring up zone
Yeah. People really try to wall the guy the fuck off. If there was no zone he’d have his way with defenses a lot easier than Jordan ever did since he is just so Large, strong, mobile and coordinated. You can’t really coach size. Having the size AND that talent makes it hard to deal with players without lame gimmick defenses.
Beyond that, I never hear 3 seconds of enforced in games. Watching hundreds of games a year I seldom hear it called. It would ruin the game if they called 3 seconds every time I suppose. Even so people don’t attempt to play defense frequently. They just focus on looking like they are guarding someone near the paint to not get a violation. It’s crap as it gets called somewhat more regularly on the offensive end. They really have a hard on for trying not to allow people to post up or ISO ik the NBA and NBA media.
I am not against 3 point shooting but it’s gotten pretty bad lately. Instead of standing around while someone Isos, offense had turned into standing around the three point line trading off jacking up bricks between teams. At it’s worse 1 team or both will go really cold for a few minutes, no one will try any other type of shot and it’s like they are running suicide drills at half speed while shooting the ball. That’s so much more entertaining than Watching a good player isolate somehow? People bitch about harden Jacking up so many threes bur he sorta has to or else people will just have their entire team stand in the lane deliberately. Having russ on the team makes it so much worse. He doesn’t make the best decisions and drives into traffic a lot but it is still crap that in the half court you can basically completely block the basket with whatever players including useless scrubs. It’s just so bad for gameplay. It feels like Allowing defensive encroachment in Football to not be a penalty somehow. Just a horrible way to play.
@@TheGrindcorps The thing about James Harden is that he may be the prototype for star NBA players going forward. He is the type of player you would expect zone to ultimately produce: one whose field goal attempts are a majority 3-pointers. It goes against tradition, but Harden's style is the best way to score, strategically/analytically speaking.
Very well said, I think modern talent or even above average modern talent would be a great player in a pre-zone era.
@@TheRiggedBA I"m outraged LEBRON was robbed. Kobe did not deserve an Oscar.
LEBRON- In the greatest dramatic actor in Nba history ua-cam.com/video/4fSlLdXNzPw/v-deo.html
And here is his fresh acting work ua-cam.com/video/68RZZ9PrC-k/v-deo.html
These are interesting insights. I never quiet understood how the 'clear out' was used during the pre-zone days of the NBA. The focus of the pre-zone rule was to foster one-on-one play. It made sense that a great one-on-one player like Jordan would suddenly explode in the NBA, after not being as huge a scorer in college - having to deal with those zones. He probably felt like a 'kid in a candy store' having all those one-on-one opportunities.
+mikem987 don't go to far with it...
Bruce Lee
No. Mike was right, actually.
mikem987 ‘Rules were changed for players to emulate Jordan who weren’t Jordan” “What Rules Were Changed and Why They Were Changed? So the NBA started implementing rule changes to make it easier for players who weren't Jordan to emulate the same things he did. Even the zone defenses, often cited as something that works against perimeter players, had the impact of making it easier.
There is a misconception that there was a single rule or single year where the rules were changed. Actually, it was a series of rule changes which spanned seven years from the 1997-1998 season to the 2004-2005 season.
In 1998, the hand check rule was changed to say, "A defender will not be permitted to use his forearm to impede the progress of an offensive player who is facing the basket in the frontcourt.”
In 2000 two more changes were implemented. First, there was a clarification on the hand-check rule,
In the backcourt, there is no contact with hands and forearms by defenders. In the frontcourt, there is no contact with hands and forearms by defenders except below the free throw line extended in which case the defender may only use his forearm. In the post, neither the offensive player nor the defender is allowed to dislodge or displace a player who has legally obtained a position. Defender may not use his forearm, shoulder, hip or hand to reroute or hold-up an offensive player going from point A to point B or one who is attempting to come around a legal screen set by another offensive player. Slowing or impeding the progress of the screener by grabbing, clutching, holding “chucking” or “wrapping up” is prohibited.
And,
Any defense is legal on the strong side. Defenders must remain on the weak side outside the paint unless they are double-teaming the ball, picking up a free cutter or closely guarding an offensive player.
In 2001, there was more clarification:
No contact with either hands or forearms by defenders except in the frontcourt below the free throw line extended in which case the defender may use his forearm only.
In 2002,
Illegal defense guidelines will be eliminated in their entirety.
A new defensive three-second rule will prohibit a defensive player from remaining in the lane for more than three consecutive seconds without closely guarding an offensive player.
There is a misconception that zone defenses balance out the removal of the hand-checking rules. That's not true because of the institution of defensive three seconds. Because of that, big men could no longer hang out in the paint. That opens up the paint for driving wings.
The intended effect happened, and the game moved away from the big man.
Finally, in 2004-05, the rules were, "introduced to curtail hand-checking, clarify blocking fouls and call defensive three seconds to open up the game.
The last five words of that last clarification is crucial, "to open up the game." There is no question that the intention of the rule changes was to open up the game because the people that made the rule changes said why they were doing it, and they said that it was to open up the game.
The Proof it Worked
Prior to Jordan, the game had been dominated by big men for virtually its entire history. The league's first MVP was awarded in 1956. From that time until Larry Bird won in 1983, the award had gone to a center all but two times. The only exceptions were Bob Cousy and Oscar Robertson.
Larry Bird won the next three, then the Michael Jordan era began. Over the course of the Jordan era, there were six winners that weren't Jordan. Karl Malone won twice, Magic Johnson, Charles Barkley, David Robinson and Hakeem Olajuown each won once.
Since Jordan retired (if you don't count the Wizards years), only one center, Shaquille O'Neal, has won, and he won during the early part of the rule changes which opened up the game.
Since 2005, no centers have won. It's the longest span of time in NBA history where a center didn't win the award. Six of the seven winners were players who generated their teams offense through ball handling.
The traditional center is gone.
Even the "forward-center" doesn't really qualify. For example, Tim Duncan is often called a center, even if the Spurs don't call him one. Setting aside the question of what you then call the player filling the center spot on San Antonio, the argument is moot.
Even if Duncan is a center, he's not the traditional center; he's a modern center. The modern center has changed to adapt to the rules the way they are now. Centers no longer score their points at the rim. They score from further out.
When Duncan won the MVP in 2002, 56.2 percent of his points came more than three feet away from the rim.
When he won in 2003, over 61.0 percent of his field goals came away from the rim.
Yao Ming, at the peak of his career, was a center whose scoring came more than three feet away from the basket. According to basketball-reference, he shot 61.0 percent of his shots from at least three feet out in 2006-07.
Shaquille O'Neal, by contrast, had only 40 percent of his field goals come outside of three feet in 2001.
The point here is that for centers, the game is moving away from the basket. It's not just a few isolated cases, either, and it has an impact of the overall scoring. Since 2005, only two centers, Shaquille O'Neal and Dwight Howard, have scored more than 20 points per game for a season with more than half his points coming within three feet of the rim.
No center has averaged more than 23 points and had more than half their shots within three feet. Four centers have only accounted for 20 point per game seasons on just 10 occasions regardless of where the scoring has come from.
In the seven years prior to when the rule changes started taking place, there were 36 centers who scored 20 points, and virtually all of them were players who scored the bulk of their points at the rim, although the shot details aren't available.
Yao Ming's 25.0 points, which is the highest average since the rule changes, would only be tied for 14th in the seven years from 1991-1998.
Yes, there is a slower game now, with an average of five possessions fewer per game in 2012 than there were in 1992. Even if you account for pace, though, it only accounts for 0.8 points, not the dramatic difference here.
Nor does it explain why scoring for wings has gone up. Using the same parameters, there were 127 20-point scorers who were pure forwards or guards from 1991-98 compared to 165 over the last seven years. Granted, there are a few players on both of those lists who are power forwards, but not enough to skew the difference.
Some will say "numbers don't mean everything." Of course, I'm not arguing they do here. I'm arguing that the numbers show that the rules had the intended effect, not that they "mean" anything. The numbers don't lend meaning to the argument; they defend it.
It is a point of fact. Scoring has shifted from the center to the wings since the implementation of rules that were intended to have that impact.
The numbers do make that indisputable.
Post Hoc Ergo Procter Hoc Or Occman's Razor?
One of two things is true here. Either it's just a coincidence that the changes that the rules were designed to affect happened after the rule changes or it's caused by it.
Some could argue that it's "post hoc ergo propter hoc" or "after this, therefore because of this." If I drop my pencil and at that exact moment my light bulb burns out, that doesn't mean that dropping my pencil caused the light bulb to burn out.
Just because there was a dearth of big men after the rule changes doesn't mean that the rule changes caused the drop off in productive big men.
That's where it's important to understand where the center shots are coming from and why it matters that Tim Duncan is attempting his shots from away from the rim. He's shooting from there for a reason.
It used to be that behind every great center, there was a great guard to spread the court for him with his shooting and/or passing. There was Kareem Abdul-Jabbar and Magic Johnson, John Stockton and Karl Malone, Willis Reed and Walt Frazier. The center to score at the rim and the guard to feed him the ball and score from outside.
Now, the roles are a bit reversed. Centers and bigs are stepping away from the rim to draw their defensive counterparts with them away from the rim. Duncan is opening up the lane for Tony Parker, Carlos Boozer is opening up things for Derrick Rose and Chris Bosh is opening the way for LeBron James and Dwyane Wade.
Occman’s Razor argues that when there are competing hypotheses, the explanation that requires the fewest assumptions is the best. That the rules changed the game in the way it intended to change it (i.e. opening up the game) by causing the very thing they wanted to (move the centers away from the rim), which would result in their objective (create more Jordans) leaves no room for assumption.
Perhaps the single best argument for Jordan as the greatest player of all-time is this: No other player had such an impact on the game that the NBA changed the rules to duplicate him. When Wilt Chamberlain dominated, they changed the rules to curtail his dominance. When Jordan dominated, they changed the rules to replicate his dominance. The side effect, though, was that there will never be another Chamberlain.”
bleacherreport.com/articles/1383036-how-michael-jordan-changed-the-nbas-center-position-forever
Yes you are right: you don't understand.
@@kristion9774 Very informative, i would like to add that after all those years Giannis Antetokounmpo MVP who made most of his shots at rim, but unfortunately he is forward at 6'11 :)
This is the best NBA Video I have seen. I have been saying all these things to NBA fans for a while and they never seem to get it. Great Job!
Very thorough video explaining the differences in the zone rules and how it has affected the NBA. I am saving this video as a 'favorite' as a reference. Good stuff.
We must protect TheRiggedBA at all costs
Possibly the best video I've ever seen analyzing and explaining the NBA. Damn.
+Alexei Nowak
Wow. Thanks! Appreciated.
Alexei Nowak except it's not. It's funny that you copy paste the rule from NBA.com into the discription but you clearly don't understand the rule or how it impacted the game
+Alan Lee well speak up then-what's the problem in his analysis?
TheRiggedBA “Last season, LeBron made the most shots in the restricted section of any NBA player. Two seasons ago, LeBron made the most shots in the restricted section of any NBA player. And three seasons ago-you guessed it-LeBron made the most shots in the restricted section of any NBA player. For more than a decade now, LeBron has been the sport’s premier force, period, but also its best player right at the basket: In his 15 seasons before this one, he led the league in made shots in the restricted area seven times and never ranked below sixth.”
By Zach Kram Nov 27, 2018, 5:40am EST
www.theringer.com/nba/2018/11/27/18113438/giannis-antetokounmpo-king-at-the-rim
Well that shows u literally r an imbecile
Keep in mind Jordan faced zone defenses when he played in the 1992 Olympics. While the Dream Team shot .578 from the field overall, Jordan individually shot the absolute worst percentage on the team at .451 unless you count in the college kid Christian Laettner who went .450. In any case it is obvious Jordan struggled with the zone. It was the biggest reason why he failed to lead North Carolina to the Final Four two years in a row despite having the best team and most loaded roster in the country. Anyone who believes he "would have found a way to beat it" are just being intellectually dishonest.
Didn’t he average 26-6-6 in 2001 on 47% with zone???
Soo, ppl can’t believe that jordan would have found a way to bypass it but they must believe he couldn’t do well against it🤦🏾♂️ you do know that there were numerous times he faced zones in the league right? & successfully handled it, It may have been a slightly different version but zone nonetheless. You also failed to mention that he shot 50% within the arc hitting 5.9 out of 11.8. His real misses came from outside the arc where he hit 0.5 out of 2.4 attempts. Which is how he ended up with 45% overall. he also was the team’s second leading scorer. And avg 4.1 steals a game
@@SmooveShotta Jordan could definitely play against the Zone, but he wouldn’t put up those numbers like he did in the 90s. The Zone defense is what really change the game, it’s why you have guys like Stephen Curry and Kyrie Irving. In the 2000s they played 90s style basketball at least up until the mid 2000s where you had guys shooting on poor percentages because of the Zone in the early 2000s. You want find another Shaq, I mean sure Shaq would do good but he wouldn’t dominate like he did in the Early 2000s and he may be a liability in the pick and roll defense. Orlando Shaq would definitely do better.
@@SmooveShotta
He was forced to take more outside shots, and he could not buy a basket from beyond the arc. Which goes back to to the point of the original comment, that he struggled against zone defenses.
@@heroinvrxther5826 how did he struggle if he shot 50% from within the arc? Making 6/12 shots per game. And you saying jordan couldn’t hit a shot outside the arc due to zone is false, he struggled from the beyond the arc regardless of the type of defense.
Man I love your videos the best there is about the NBA and it opens up your mind to a lot of things that we might not even think of, keep these videos up and thank you
After watching all these Jordan vs Lebron debates I had to come back and watch this. It's a crying shame how all these so called basketball purist never mention this in regards to rule changes and the effect on the game. I swear the older generation is lessening the greatest that we see on a daily basis from today's stars by not painting the full picture of how the game has changed!
Pretty much. Which is funny since zone is a total game-changer. Zone alters the game so much and increases difficulty in scoring by such a degree that it literally changed the way rosters have to be constructed. It's that significant.
TheRiggedBA and the funny this is the sports media today will tell you 90's basketball was more of a team game in comparison to today's game when zone defenses and zone principles has shaped the game to be more team oriented than ever. My personal belief is that 90s basketball next to the 70's was the worst era in the history. When you factor in perimeter talent, style of play and the rules. The zone defenses made top level players in today's era have to get better in areas of the game like shooting and basketball IQ.
Business First I understand your point but people like Jordan and Kobe would be great in any era. 80s ball was more physical..back then for sure you had a slower paced game hand checking less “flagrant fouls” today the game caters to spot up shooters “team ball” perfect era for Lebron to thrive in. Pre zone one on one defense perfect era for Jordan. Not taking anything away from neither of them both all time greats.
@@rowellmason2477 Micheal Jordan would be less dominant in today's NBA because he's garbage 3 point shooter.
Then how does Westbrook and Giannis dominate despite being garbage 3 point shooters?
This is absolutely brilliant. Great stuff.
Thank you, finally, I got this rule cleared lol I never thought something like this can be so difficult to understand
it's pretty sad when as soon as the video said "someone David Stern had been known to take aim at" i immediately yelled out "ALLEN IVERSON"
same here lol
Shaq
It's an interesting debate, though I'm generally in favor of allowing zone. Although superstars are less dominant - especially driving ones - I like how it forces more teamwork and ball movement. One aspect I don't see discussed in the video is it also transforms the sport from being more drive oriented to a greater focus on perimeter play (especially three pointers).
Also, I don't think superstars have been seriously diminished, I just think they've had to develop more complete games: less post ups and drives, and more of an emphasis on passing and shooting. Your final slide says "...sucks for the stars". Last I checked GM's main focus is still trying to get a franchise player or two to build around, and there's still individual players putting up insane numbers, like KD's MVP season in 2014.
The way i see it and i assume a lot of others do, basketball is a TEAM game and yeah seeing MJ and the like iso was nice, but what's the point (from my perspective at least) of having 4 teammates on the floor to not be able to help defensively without being called for a stupid illegal defense. Iso ball is so boring too
@@yayoLUIS James Harden has entered the chat
he sucks in the playoffs,how are MIAMI ZONE Defense troubling teams today which has much better shooting than the 90s did , which had to shorten their 3pt line from 95-97, the illegal defense was changed because of Shaq destroying it, but if MIAMI wins then it be first team since the 2011 Mavericks to use Zones exclusively which swept the LAKERS AND BEAT MIAMI IN 6. YOU could make the case that 2004 pistons slick use zone, but pistons say they played man to man but I don’t think they use the 90s illegal defense rules. But Miami pulls it off then that’s very impressive considering how much guys shoot better but the Miami has athletic quick rotation ZONE DEFENSE. But it’s weird tho because spurs are clearly guarding Lebron with help defense, so that’s definitely not like the illegal defense rule that Shaq absolutely destroyed.
@@davelouie131 Shaq in college against unrestricted zone defenses without a defensive 3: 21.6 ppg, 61.0% FG
Shaq during the 2001-02 season when the old illegal defense was removed and the defensive 3 was emphasized : 27.2 ppg, 57.9% FG,
2011 Mavericks: 8th in defensive rating( not top 5 ).
2022-23 Heat: 9th ranked defense
We don’t have to speculate. We don’t have to guess. Everything that you’re saying can be disproven with stats lol.
@Galileo Galilei 3 sec was to keep Shaq for sitting and the paint 🎨 and stop isolation basketball 🏀 and post ups, Don't care for the numbers because he got wore down , I read the 2001 articles of why Illegal defense was harming the NBA and its viewers ship, I read old 1999 articles of why the NBA hated Illegal defense and 2 man basketball 🏀 and unnatural isolation basketball 🏀. Good move by the NBA to improve their product by getting rid of the old Illegal defense rules.
The sequence at 12:08 is even worse than the weak-ass soccer offsides rule, where defenders move away from their goal to keep attackers away from it. I had thought that that was the most sissified rule in sports, but having grown-ass men deliberately presenting a weak offense so they can point to the defender and beg for a foul was even worse. Not to mention the interminable delays from those illegal defense calls. I'm glad those days are over.
Me too. Its really disgusting. Removing zone defense was a good move in my opinion
Removing illegal defense, I meant
+antoyal shut up about soccer! offside prevents a striker from standing the entire game near the goal waiting for long balls. It's a good rule:D
yeah, games with a lot of players should always have an offside rule.
Marco Carere thank you, this guy wants the Goalie to just lob long kicks to CR7, Messi and Neymar haha🤣🤣🤣
The zone makes it more difficult to score in the paint but at the same time, the removal of hand checking and travel calls makes it easier to score in the paint as well, so it kinda cancels out.
Hand checking still occurs watch the game
Jordan use to travel his ass off. it's a video for that too. o yeah also flopping.
Another great video by you, I enjoyed it very much. Hope you post more informative videos like this.
Finally there is people who agrees with me on today's defense. It's fun more difficult to drive to the basket than it was before. However jump shots r easier now because hand checking rules made it physical for shooters to get off a shot
How can it be harder to drive if you have seen James harden doing just that on the top of the key iso all there years with his fat and un -athletic body.it is actually easier. You can just see it in game. Even the all star game has become just a dunk and layup line with three point contacts at the same time.
Harden got exceptional long range shot skills that 90s players didnt have
@@user-ss4jc9xy7v Westbrook ?
@@cudackedees3327 people respect hardens jumpshot so much from 30+ feet out they have to play up close and you expect players to keep up with all these dribbles moves/ how fast these players are ?? i bet you cant even lock up a kid from 30ft out from your local ball park. It’s common sense never have we had to respect these shooters so much and play so high and so close to them it kind of makes it easy for the offense because how elite these players have become.
@@Thankyou4x yes all that carry, travel that are allowed make it much easier to shoot uncontested too. Exactly. It is easier to iso and make it to the basket without hurting in the modern era. The make up every new rule to ensure that. Exactly.
6ft6 Jordan ordering a clear out going 1 on 1 against 5'3 Muggsy is...
The funny part is that it looks like Muggsy actually won that match-up. He strips Jordan on the way up and, near as I can tell from the video quality, it looked pretty clean. Of course, it's Jordan, so they would have just called a foul anyway. But still...
I recently just got out of the cult of Jordan, and this video helps with the "he could score 50 in today's league" argument that was put into my mind and others, I'm helping others recover with this. Also it's crazy how people trash today's defense just because he played in that era when defense today is the most efficient it has ever been.
+bonnie buckhalter Welcome bro lol
+chitownkidd33 lol thanks, glad to be here.
+bonnie buckhalter it can get lonely in the club but it's better to know the truth than being a brainwashed fool lol.
+chitownkidd33 yea it can, very few want to accept the truth but I refuse to accept being told what to believe.
+bonnie buckhalter I'm here to yo. :)
This video shows Lebron went up against harsher defence than Jordan
This says a lot about the skills of big scorers after like Kobe, LeBron, Giannis, etc.
Exactly
Kobe, Lebron, Giannis ,KD would have had a field day in the prezone era
Curry and kyrie would have defenders running in circles.
@@144Souldier Troll
@@rafikz77 LeBron got outplayed by a bench player in the Finals, troll
@@AIH483 Bulls couldn't even stop Isaiah Thomas and Allen iverson always bust bulls ass offensively so yeah like I said. Curry and kyrie would have that weak ass defense running in circles. Goofball
Watching old 80's and 90's games on youtube, i have always wondered what was the illegal defense rules.
Thany very much for this video
+Trey Jones illegal defense means you can't have two off the ball defenders guarding one guy
Well u know, after seeing this illegal defense video.. It really kinda seems like a silly rule. It seems like a flaw in the game kinda.
+TELEthruVOXx I don't know. I don't mind most of the zone defense we have today (and the reasoning that it disturbs star players, forcing them to pass the ball), but I think double teaming someone without the ball is a bit coward, especially in the paint area.
I dont have a problem with zone. You beat what the defense gives you. To beat the zone you have to play like a team and swing the ball and set screens. Instead of just isolating player every time down the court. Kobe has put up 81 in the zone era. Its not about the style, its about the player. I despise hero ball, which to me is just isolation plays. I prefer team offense. That's just me but great video. I hope you are enjoying the playoffs!
Sorry if you want heros. Its a team game :p
Brandon Larranaga I agree with you about the team play and about Kobe top score, however I saw many times before 2004 zone defenses, of course this video is very clever and shows only actions out of contest, but if you watch a full game on the 90s (I'm Italian and I was a kid in the 80s so I don't remember full games!) you see they changed from one on one defense to zone defense all the time. Plus they could do anything they want, now with the new rules as soon as they touch eachother is a foul and believe me, be manhandled all the time was pretty hard and hand check also wasn't make life easy!
Anyway in the 90s when I was a kid we use to say that Wilt was able to score 100 only 'cause his era was weak and that he was the most overrated player ever only that we didn't have facebook and youtube so I can't prove it to you, but that's how it was, so remember what you think now about basketball and don't be surprised when some stupid kid 20 years from now will say that Kobe was an overrated player and was able to score 81 only 'cause he played in a weak era!
However even if I don't get excited when I look at the NBA right now compared to the 90s, I think we need to appreciate the NBA as it is and stop making this silly arguments, the rules changed so much from the 50s to now that the only good way to enjoy the game is to stop making comparison!
@@alexlanza79
Really? I was born in the 1970s and many times, illegal defenses were called.
It was painful to see players pointing at each other and being awarded FTs.
Of course, they were bending the rules. But they weren't doing it freely like today or before 1982!
@@alexlanza79 I'm the president of the United States as well
Make a response video cleverly made to this then? Otherwise accept the facts presented
Kobe put up 81 against defenders watching him shoot.
The only credit he gets for that is hitting the shots
I've always held that defenses today are much more effective, it as not physical as the defenses of past eras. And I've never gotten the argument that more physicality automatically equals better defense, especially when used to say players like LeBron wouldn't dominate. I feel like LeBron would be even greater than he is now if he had played in the 1980's and early 90's, but that's a topic for a different day. Anyways, great video as always man. I can really appreciate the amount of visible work and effort that you put into each video you make. +TheRiggedBA
Jonathan Foy Thank you
When scoring is at an all time high? And you have multiple guys averaging 30+ a night?
Today's defense is full of holes b/c NBA brings tons of hacks against the very zone defense they put in such as defensive 3-sec, protected zone, vertical jump, no hand-check, loosened up dribbling rules and so on.
@@stopmarcus3605scoring was at all time high before in 80s so wats ya point
Zone defense is the best. When I used to play basketball in middle school, we would always run a 2-3 zone or a 1-2-2.
Great and very detailed review, thank you!
Welcome
This for me reduced all the glory and removed the invincibility of the Jordan-led bulls
The media is paid to make Jordan seem invincible (Nike is a sponsor to EPSN which the Jordan Brand is under) so of course he needs to be made to be mythical. Was Jordan great? Absolutely, was he invincible? Nope, no player was. Does he still have the best combination of individual and team success to lay claim to being the Greatest? Absolutely. Is it a fact that he is the greatest? No, because at the end of the day it is still debatable.
I'm a Kobe fan, but I still think Jordan has the best argument for being the greatest. Even mentioning in this video that he faced Zones as a Wizard remember he was 38-40 years old. The fact he played as well as he did coming out of retirement after not playing for several years, in a game that had changed and against a new generation of younger players shows he would still have thrived even in this era. Great players adjust, as Tim, Kobe, and Shaq all had to adjust when illegal defense, 3 in the key, and Zone became prominent rule changes.
ralx225b don't forget they don't talk about how he lost to the magic in 94
His fg% and points would have been down.
Maurice Rollon ‘Rules were changed for players to emulate Jordan who weren’t Jordan” “What Rules Were Changed and Why They Were Changed? So the NBA started implementing rule changes to make it easier for players who weren't Jordan to emulate the same things he did. Even the zone defenses, often cited as something that works against perimeter players, had the impact of making it easier.
There is a misconception that there was a single rule or single year where the rules were changed. Actually, it was a series of rule changes which spanned seven years from the 1997-1998 season to the 2004-2005 season.
In 1998, the hand check rule was changed to say, "A defender will not be permitted to use his forearm to impede the progress of an offensive player who is facing the basket in the frontcourt.”
In 2000 two more changes were implemented. First, there was a clarification on the hand-check rule,
In the backcourt, there is no contact with hands and forearms by defenders. In the frontcourt, there is no contact with hands and forearms by defenders except below the free throw line extended in which case the defender may only use his forearm. In the post, neither the offensive player nor the defender is allowed to dislodge or displace a player who has legally obtained a position. Defender may not use his forearm, shoulder, hip or hand to reroute or hold-up an offensive player going from point A to point B or one who is attempting to come around a legal screen set by another offensive player. Slowing or impeding the progress of the screener by grabbing, clutching, holding “chucking” or “wrapping up” is prohibited.
And,
Any defense is legal on the strong side. Defenders must remain on the weak side outside the paint unless they are double-teaming the ball, picking up a free cutter or closely guarding an offensive player.
In 2001, there was more clarification:
No contact with either hands or forearms by defenders except in the frontcourt below the free throw line extended in which case the defender may use his forearm only.
In 2002,
Illegal defense guidelines will be eliminated in their entirety.
A new defensive three-second rule will prohibit a defensive player from remaining in the lane for more than three consecutive seconds without closely guarding an offensive player.
There is a misconception that zone defenses balance out the removal of the hand-checking rules. That's not true because of the institution of defensive three seconds. Because of that, big men could no longer hang out in the paint. That opens up the paint for driving wings.
The intended effect happened, and the game moved away from the big man.
Finally, in 2004-05, the rules were, "introduced to curtail hand-checking, clarify blocking fouls and call defensive three seconds to open up the game.
The last five words of that last clarification is crucial, "to open up the game." There is no question that the intention of the rule changes was to open up the game because the people that made the rule changes said why they were doing it, and they said that it was to open up the game.
The Proof it Worked
Prior to Jordan, the game had been dominated by big men for virtually its entire history. The league's first MVP was awarded in 1956. From that time until Larry Bird won in 1983, the award had gone to a center all but two times. The only exceptions were Bob Cousy and Oscar Robertson.
Larry Bird won the next three, then the Michael Jordan era began. Over the course of the Jordan era, there were six winners that weren't Jordan. Karl Malone won twice, Magic Johnson, Charles Barkley, David Robinson and Hakeem Olajuown each won once.
Since Jordan retired (if you don't count the Wizards years), only one center, Shaquille O'Neal, has won, and he won during the early part of the rule changes which opened up the game.
Since 2005, no centers have won. It's the longest span of time in NBA history where a center didn't win the award. Six of the seven winners were players who generated their teams offense through ball handling.
The traditional center is gone.
Even the "forward-center" doesn't really qualify. For example, Tim Duncan is often called a center, even if the Spurs don't call him one. Setting aside the question of what you then call the player filling the center spot on San Antonio, the argument is moot.
Even if Duncan is a center, he's not the traditional center; he's a modern center. The modern center has changed to adapt to the rules the way they are now. Centers no longer score their points at the rim. They score from further out.
When Duncan won the MVP in 2002, 56.2 percent of his points came more than three feet away from the rim.
When he won in 2003, over 61.0 percent of his field goals came away from the rim.
Yao Ming, at the peak of his career, was a center whose scoring came more than three feet away from the basket. According to basketball-reference, he shot 61.0 percent of his shots from at least three feet out in 2006-07.
Shaquille O'Neal, by contrast, had only 40 percent of his field goals come outside of three feet in 2001.
The point here is that for centers, the game is moving away from the basket. It's not just a few isolated cases, either, and it has an impact of the overall scoring. Since 2005, only two centers, Shaquille O'Neal and Dwight Howard, have scored more than 20 points per game for a season with more than half his points coming within three feet of the rim.
No center has averaged more than 23 points and had more than half their shots within three feet. Four centers have only accounted for 20 point per game seasons on just 10 occasions regardless of where the scoring has come from.
In the seven years prior to when the rule changes started taking place, there were 36 centers who scored 20 points, and virtually all of them were players who scored the bulk of their points at the rim, although the shot details aren't available.
Yao Ming's 25.0 points, which is the highest average since the rule changes, would only be tied for 14th in the seven years from 1991-1998.
Yes, there is a slower game now, with an average of five possessions fewer per game in 2012 than there were in 1992. Even if you account for pace, though, it only accounts for 0.8 points, not the dramatic difference here.
Nor does it explain why scoring for wings has gone up. Using the same parameters, there were 127 20-point scorers who were pure forwards or guards from 1991-98 compared to 165 over the last seven years. Granted, there are a few players on both of those lists who are power forwards, but not enough to skew the difference.
Some will say "numbers don't mean everything." Of course, I'm not arguing they do here. I'm arguing that the numbers show that the rules had the intended effect, not that they "mean" anything. The numbers don't lend meaning to the argument; they defend it.
It is a point of fact. Scoring has shifted from the center to the wings since the implementation of rules that were intended to have that impact.
The numbers do make that indisputable.
Post Hoc Ergo Procter Hoc Or Occman's Razor?
One of two things is true here. Either it's just a coincidence that the changes that the rules were designed to affect happened after the rule changes or it's caused by it.
Some could argue that it's "post hoc ergo propter hoc" or "after this, therefore because of this." If I drop my pencil and at that exact moment my light bulb burns out, that doesn't mean that dropping my pencil caused the light bulb to burn out.
Just because there was a dearth of big men after the rule changes doesn't mean that the rule changes caused the drop off in productive big men.
That's where it's important to understand where the center shots are coming from and why it matters that Tim Duncan is attempting his shots from away from the rim. He's shooting from there for a reason.
It used to be that behind every great center, there was a great guard to spread the court for him with his shooting and/or passing. There was Kareem Abdul-Jabbar and Magic Johnson, John Stockton and Karl Malone, Willis Reed and Walt Frazier. The center to score at the rim and the guard to feed him the ball and score from outside.
Now, the roles are a bit reversed. Centers and bigs are stepping away from the rim to draw their defensive counterparts with them away from the rim. Duncan is opening up the lane for Tony Parker, Carlos Boozer is opening up things for Derrick Rose and Chris Bosh is opening the way for LeBron James and Dwyane Wade.
Occman’s Razor argues that when there are competing hypotheses, the explanation that requires the fewest assumptions is the best. That the rules changed the game in the way it intended to change it (i.e. opening up the game) by causing the very thing they wanted to (move the centers away from the rim), which would result in their objective (create more Jordans) leaves no room for assumption.
Perhaps the single best argument for Jordan as the greatest player of all-time is this: No other player had such an impact on the game that the NBA changed the rules to duplicate him. When Wilt Chamberlain dominated, they changed the rules to curtail his dominance. When Jordan dominated, they changed the rules to replicate his dominance. The side effect, though, was that there will never be another Chamberlain.”
bleacherreport.com/articles/1383036-how-michael-jordan-changed-the-nbas-center-position-forever
@Drink Me that's all you got you simple minded infant? Keep licking your Jordans
Imagine if LeBron , Kobe , KD , Westbrook could go one on one in the 80s? ( Melo too )
Bruce Lee LeBron Kobe melo and Westbrook would but don't know bout kd cause of his size and build. Kobe would drop 50 easy, melo 40 Westbrook and LeBron 30. Kd would play like curry and shoot from deep but still average quite a bit just not so much.
Bruce Lee So you're basing kobe's stats with mj's. ok. But that's not how you do it. Kobe THRIVES on iso in today's era. With zone, help d etc. So what do you expect a 35ppg kobe in zone d era to drop without that zone d? My guess 40 close to 50. I'm not really sure bout the rules so I'm not gonna talk in depth abt that haha.
HAhahahah yea maybe. I think melo would do better than kd by a few cause he also plays lots of great iso ball. Kd might be a role player hahaha. Westbrook would be like another Dr j or sth. Bron is subjective I do agree ahah.
Well all I can say is that anyone who thinks kobe's iso offence is trash should watch his highlights from 01 to 13. That's all I'm gonna add
Bruce Lee Oh yea, mj would actually most definitely averaged lesser in today's era. His main offense is through dunks and around the rim plays. It's a little harder if they play zone.
George Gervin, who's built like a set of toothpicks, lit up 80s defenses. Reggie Miller, a bag of bones, was one of the best players in the 90s. The grossly overstated physicality didn't bother either of their skeletal body frames. Basketball back then was just that: basketball. It wasn't a kumite match. If you made excessive contact, it was a foul. And the further back you go, the weaker the defenses are. Today's defenses are better than the 90s. 90s defense was better than the 80s. Just watch 5 minutes of an 80s game and see.
You put Kobe in the 80s and he puts up Wilt Chamberlain numbers. You put Kevin Durant in the 80s with his height, shooting range and dribble moves and he drops 40 points before you can say "hand checking". There would be no way to defend these guys with no zone behind you.
+Bruce Lee
The Bad Boys were only one team and the NBA changed it's rules to get rid of their physicality shortly after it started. And they only appeared to be a great defense relative to other teams that played NO defense. The 80s Bad Boy Pistons defense doesn't compare to the 2004 Pistons' defense.
And if you think defenses as a matter of practice were allowed to kick Jordan in the face, punch him and clothesline him without being called for a foul then you're just living in a strange combat fantasy. That's ridiculous. This imaginary NBA you're describing wouldn't even be legal. The NBA and it's players would need fighting licenses just to have a game. Because what you're describing isn't basketball, it's a full-contact death match.
It would be good to show a little more footage of MJ dealing with the zone when he played for the Wizards. Age was a big factor, but he was never able to get the Wizards over the hump.. Maybe the zone had something to do with it. I think the target of the zone would more likely be someone like Allen Iverson. I saw a number of Wizards - pre-zone - games in person, and Iverson was the most electrifying player I saw. It was amazing to see a 6'0 guy dominate an NBA game. I never saw MJ in person. The zone didn't help didn't help Shaq, but the league made provision for him, by allowing him to get away with murder down in the paint when the Lakers had those 3 straight championships.
So basically todays defense is way more complex and harder. Only thing that has changed is contact and how physical a player can get.
well let's just say the coaches has more options in defensive plays than just mere man-to-man all the time
It's more complex, but also more effective. That's why good 1v1 players hated it.
If Lebron was in this era, he could literally be the best play forever and ever. The only way to stop James is double team or shade him consistently and force him to commit an offensive foul or a jump shot (still doesn't stop him)
+Win Lose lbj has no post play... how could he able to survived handchecks... fyi, jordan was most of the time tripled or doubled team... video clips not lied, bball announcer said it...jordan is unstoppable because of his fundementala, lebron? yes his good passer, but he do nothing if rodman or pippen guard him, he would look pussy
ArASsEO_ WaKaRiMaShiTa!!!
"Survive" hand checks? LOL What do you think hand checks are, grenade explosions? If there's nobody behind them, defenders could have 4 hands and still not stop LeBron from either blowing by them or powering through them.
TheRiggedBA You must be Leunskilled fan.
That's pathetic.
Good shit dude thanks for showing me this vid
Great video man ! I know the hard work it must've took to compile all this. Appreciate you brother !
Thanks! It was definitely a task.
This was great. I love it.
Thank you for this... I was just in a debate about this and they were looking at me like I was crazy lol
Most people don't understand zone or the difference it makes since zone is almost never spoken of, for various reasons. I was watching a sports show just recently and, in 2018, they were literally still talking about NBA defenders must stay close to their man or it's an illegal defense violation.
You make great videos lol pure genius
Excellent video to show to those people that claim 80s/90s superstars would dominate this era even more.
Fantastic stuff. Love your research.
alotan2acs
Thanks!
this video was excellent though, very eye opening
This is one of the best videos ive ever seen
Thanks!
Cherry
@@allanhouston6759 same casual who tried saying that 2011 finals was rigged for lebron
@@tj5180 He's no casual, I understand you jordan fanboys are mad because he exposed truths about jordan and the 90's defenses lmao
@@dynamic6645 he didn't expose any truth🤣😂.
Another great video! The great players find a way it seems
Great job with this video. Learned a lot!
GREAT VIDEO! It’s funny how there’s still just as many isos and the pace of play isn’t much faster.
Any comments players or coaches say about zone or toughness is propaganda to keep the 90s relevant. If Gary Payton can hold mike to 40% alone, imagine the 04 Pistons or 08 celtics 13 Spurs zone that shut down every superstar those years. I don't see any perimeter player in NBA history dominating those 3 teams.
Exactly because those are Jordan's friends and they always want the world to still think that MJ is the GOAT, when reality there are players that meant more to their team and are just better players than him. Jordan is all propaganda and hype. Hes a great player but he ain't the greatest.
Playerrs. coaches , media, are all suppose to say hes the greatest and say how tough the 90s was. it's part of the description. The casual fan will never get this.
chitownkidd33
Not only that but since the fact that he invested 10 billion dollars in revenue is also the main reason why the media blinds these basketball fans that he is the greatest. No doubt get was the best player of his time. But not in history.
04 pistons would not win a championship in todays league though. They did it in hand checking + zone defense era, remember the playoffs when muthafuckas were scoring 70something points per game? The game is meant to be more about the teamwork now with todays role players cookin, while the 90s bench players would not survive the shit out of the league now.
LMAO spurs dared Lebron to shoot in the 2013 NBA finals. You think MJ would stuggle with Fat diaw guarding him?
MJ ave 22 ages 38-40 on Almost kobe Career FG percentage
Jordan dropped 51 on the hornets age 38
Jordan dropped 43 on RJ Martin and Kidd age 40
Jordan dropped 32 on Paul P age 38
Jordan dropped 39 on Shawn Marion age 38 and a game winner
LMAO Jordan would rape zone defense in his prime. No Hand checking free lanes. LMAO you forgot to shot the physical play in the 80s and 90s.
Yes I love man to man...lol the good old days glad I was able to watch and enjoy those guys
The last minute of this vid. I did not see that coming. just WOW. It makes so much sense now.
Zone Cripples slashers but hand checking does have an effect on ball and off from getting to your spots.Nonetheless zone helps shooters not slashers. zone also help slow footed defenders
What about Switching defense.
That's why KD, Kobe, LeBron, and Steph Curry are so good. Kobe's old now, but if he had one-on-one matchups, he'd still score in the mid-twenties in points per game average, and have a much better field goal percentage. He use to have his legs, now that he's old, his explosion is lost and now he has become a role player. Without Westbrook, KD wouldn't be so good. James Harden is now going through his struggles because he has to use so much energy just to get a shot off. Damian Lillard led the league in miles ran on the court for a reason - if you're going to score in this league and be a superstar, not only do you have to be in top-notch shape, but you will have to use a ton of energy on both offense and defense. Playing zone allows you to be "lazy" when guarding your man, since most teams run tons of pick n rolls to get you off of their scoring threatening and mismatched big on small on the perimeter or small on big in the post. People look at sports with a simplistic eye, they just see averages, PER ratings and how much someone scored by shooting less. Team basketball really does make some people stand out, where in a different situation, they may not be as good (ahem Draymond Green).
KD had the best season of his career without Westbrook. Tf are you talking about.
+Slightly Biased Kevin Durant Fan I like KD to.. But I think the league has cought on to that lil half crossover juke move he does all the time.
I understand an individual player's frustration with it at the time, but it really forced teams and players to value shooting more. Allowing to zone parts of the floor has without a doubt benefited the game more because now in order to create space and driving lanes, you got to have shooters to give them that space. It's made a more beautiful and complex game in my opinion.
It forces guys to work on their shooting and has added a dynamic to the game that wasn't there before. If you don't like the zone, work at your game to be a good shooter and force guys to come out and guard you, which will allow other players to drive and kick.
Great video . Really helped me understand this
Great video, explain why Jordan had it easier. And he realizes with his advice to the league
Nope , he played in the handcheck era so it balances out
@@YounginBallin Handchecking was illegal since '79
@@dynamic6645 no, they ATTEMPTED to make it illegal but couldn't actually implement it. It took several years for the league to find a way to LESSEN handcheck. Not eliminated until 2000s
@@luridsilence You should watch RiggedBa's videos debunking the handchecking myths 😆😆😆
@@luridsilence I mean even here at 5:54 handchecking is shown to be easier to score on, zones are harder than handchecking, Jordan in this era will not be as dominant like he was in the 80's and 90's, he would score less, and his defense will not be this great vs LeBron and so many other modern stars.
Allen Iverson made the zone defense happen. Nobody could just stop the dude.
And Shaq.
If lebron had that...
It was actually Shaq
It was because of shaq not iverson! I loved Allen n hated shaq but truth is truth
@@andreic8786 lebron's game is built for zone defense. his game is kick out threes and making the defense collapse.
Damn, thanks for this video
Thanks for posting. I think this makes a strong case for getting rid of the illegal defense rules.
I agree, seems like a silly rule
Kobe dominated the zone era. Just imagine if he didn't have to worry about a zone and there was illegal defense giving his team free points.
Kobe played in the late 90s and all he did was 4 AIR BALLS in the Playoffs
Kobe > Jordan...
Jordan>Kobe
Allan Houston he was an 18 year old coming into the league and most players don’t hit their prime until their mid-to-late 20s lmao stop it
Kobe didn’t dominate the zone defense. The 2004 finals against the pistons proved it. The back to back champ Lakers also got swept by the 2011 mavs who relied on heavy zone usage. Kobe played like shit in that series as well. Most of kobe’s high scoring performances came in the regular season where teams hardly play zones. Game 7 of the 2010 finals against Celtics kobe went 6-24. Lakers won despite of his poor performance. You will notice that kobe scoring tended to go down in the playoffs compared to regular season. Teams play more zones consistently in the playoffs because of its importance.
Excellent video.
Great video, thanks!
Your welcome!
Yo great explanation video I learned a lot from this vid
what is KD’s career ppg if teams were forced to guard him man to man? dude averages over 40 a game i think cause which teams have players not only big enough to guard him but quick enough?
if kd had hardens usage rate in the 80s and 90s, maybe
This is a well put together video. Thanks!
I must say though, as someone who watched both pre-Zone and Zone NBA games, that I think allowing the Zone was the right move. Unless you're a superstar-type player like MJ or Kobe, isolation basketball is boring and ineffective. There was no ball movement.
Additionally, the idea that a defending team should be restricted in the way that they guard the basketball.... just because.... is stupid, IMO. Why make it "illegal" to guard a player a certain way in the first place?
I feel that superstars of any era could be just as successful in today's game. Jordan would still be the GOAT, even with a zone. Maybe it even makes him work on his outside jumper a little more.
JVIPER88 Actually the zone defense was used in the 90s but there are not a lot of videos of that time, you should find some VHS of that time and you see the zone even back then!
It was not the zone defense illegal, but only specific defensive alignments (and it was 1981 so 3 years before Jordan came to the NBA!).
So as you said MJ would be the GOAT anyway and as they eliminated the defensive alignments rules in 2001, Michael played without that from 2001 to 2003 and yet at 38/39/40 years of age was able to average 20 ppg, so it's pretty obvious in his prime he'd be a monster. Plus in 2004 they also curtailed the handcheck so for his kind of game he'd have no problem to score 10 ppg more in his prime!
JVIPER88 ‘Rules were changed for players to emulate Jordan who weren’t Jordan” “What Rules Were Changed and Why They Were Changed? So the NBA started implementing rule changes to make it easier for players who weren't Jordan to emulate the same things he did. Even the zone defenses, often cited as something that works against perimeter players, had the impact of making it easier.
There is a misconception that there was a single rule or single year where the rules were changed. Actually, it was a series of rule changes which spanned seven years from the 1997-1998 season to the 2004-2005 season.
In 1998, the hand check rule was changed to say, "A defender will not be permitted to use his forearm to impede the progress of an offensive player who is facing the basket in the frontcourt.”
In 2000 two more changes were implemented. First, there was a clarification on the hand-check rule,
In the backcourt, there is no contact with hands and forearms by defenders. In the frontcourt, there is no contact with hands and forearms by defenders except below the free throw line extended in which case the defender may only use his forearm. In the post, neither the offensive player nor the defender is allowed to dislodge or displace a player who has legally obtained a position. Defender may not use his forearm, shoulder, hip or hand to reroute or hold-up an offensive player going from point A to point B or one who is attempting to come around a legal screen set by another offensive player. Slowing or impeding the progress of the screener by grabbing, clutching, holding “chucking” or “wrapping up” is prohibited.
And,
Any defense is legal on the strong side. Defenders must remain on the weak side outside the paint unless they are double-teaming the ball, picking up a free cutter or closely guarding an offensive player.
In 2001, there was more clarification:
No contact with either hands or forearms by defenders except in the frontcourt below the free throw line extended in which case the defender may use his forearm only.
In 2002,
Illegal defense guidelines will be eliminated in their entirety.
A new defensive three-second rule will prohibit a defensive player from remaining in the lane for more than three consecutive seconds without closely guarding an offensive player.
There is a misconception that zone defenses balance out the removal of the hand-checking rules. That's not true because of the institution of defensive three seconds. Because of that, big men could no longer hang out in the paint. That opens up the paint for driving wings.
The intended effect happened, and the game moved away from the big man.
Finally, in 2004-05, the rules were, "introduced to curtail hand-checking, clarify blocking fouls and call defensive three seconds to open up the game.
The last five words of that last clarification is crucial, "to open up the game." There is no question that the intention of the rule changes was to open up the game because the people that made the rule changes said why they were doing it, and they said that it was to open up the game.
The Proof it Worked
Prior to Jordan, the game had been dominated by big men for virtually its entire history. The league's first MVP was awarded in 1956. From that time until Larry Bird won in 1983, the award had gone to a center all but two times. The only exceptions were Bob Cousy and Oscar Robertson.
Larry Bird won the next three, then the Michael Jordan era began. Over the course of the Jordan era, there were six winners that weren't Jordan. Karl Malone won twice, Magic Johnson, Charles Barkley, David Robinson and Hakeem Olajuown each won once.
Since Jordan retired (if you don't count the Wizards years), only one center, Shaquille O'Neal, has won, and he won during the early part of the rule changes which opened up the game.
Since 2005, no centers have won. It's the longest span of time in NBA history where a center didn't win the award. Six of the seven winners were players who generated their teams offense through ball handling.
The traditional center is gone.
Even the "forward-center" doesn't really qualify. For example, Tim Duncan is often called a center, even if the Spurs don't call him one. Setting aside the question of what you then call the player filling the center spot on San Antonio, the argument is moot.
Even if Duncan is a center, he's not the traditional center; he's a modern center. The modern center has changed to adapt to the rules the way they are now. Centers no longer score their points at the rim. They score from further out.
When Duncan won the MVP in 2002, 56.2 percent of his points came more than three feet away from the rim.
When he won in 2003, over 61.0 percent of his field goals came away from the rim.
Yao Ming, at the peak of his career, was a center whose scoring came more than three feet away from the basket. According to basketball-reference, he shot 61.0 percent of his shots from at least three feet out in 2006-07.
Shaquille O'Neal, by contrast, had only 40 percent of his field goals come outside of three feet in 2001.
The point here is that for centers, the game is moving away from the basket. It's not just a few isolated cases, either, and it has an impact of the overall scoring. Since 2005, only two centers, Shaquille O'Neal and Dwight Howard, have scored more than 20 points per game for a season with more than half his points coming within three feet of the rim.
No center has averaged more than 23 points and had more than half their shots within three feet. Four centers have only accounted for 20 point per game seasons on just 10 occasions regardless of where the scoring has come from.
In the seven years prior to when the rule changes started taking place, there were 36 centers who scored 20 points, and virtually all of them were players who scored the bulk of their points at the rim, although the shot details aren't available.
Yao Ming's 25.0 points, which is the highest average since the rule changes, would only be tied for 14th in the seven years from 1991-1998.
Yes, there is a slower game now, with an average of five possessions fewer per game in 2012 than there were in 1992. Even if you account for pace, though, it only accounts for 0.8 points, not the dramatic difference here.
Nor does it explain why scoring for wings has gone up. Using the same parameters, there were 127 20-point scorers who were pure forwards or guards from 1991-98 compared to 165 over the last seven years. Granted, there are a few players on both of those lists who are power forwards, but not enough to skew the difference.
Some will say "numbers don't mean everything." Of course, I'm not arguing they do here. I'm arguing that the numbers show that the rules had the intended effect, not that they "mean" anything. The numbers don't lend meaning to the argument; they defend it.
It is a point of fact. Scoring has shifted from the center to the wings since the implementation of rules that were intended to have that impact.
The numbers do make that indisputable.
Post Hoc Ergo Procter Hoc Or Occman's Razor?
One of two things is true here. Either it's just a coincidence that the changes that the rules were designed to affect happened after the rule changes or it's caused by it.
Some could argue that it's "post hoc ergo propter hoc" or "after this, therefore because of this." If I drop my pencil and at that exact moment my light bulb burns out, that doesn't mean that dropping my pencil caused the light bulb to burn out.
Just because there was a dearth of big men after the rule changes doesn't mean that the rule changes caused the drop off in productive big men.
That's where it's important to understand where the center shots are coming from and why it matters that Tim Duncan is attempting his shots from away from the rim. He's shooting from there for a reason.
It used to be that behind every great center, there was a great guard to spread the court for him with his shooting and/or passing. There was Kareem Abdul-Jabbar and Magic Johnson, John Stockton and Karl Malone, Willis Reed and Walt Frazier. The center to score at the rim and the guard to feed him the ball and score from outside.
Now, the roles are a bit reversed. Centers and bigs are stepping away from the rim to draw their defensive counterparts with them away from the rim. Duncan is opening up the lane for Tony Parker, Carlos Boozer is opening up things for Derrick Rose and Chris Bosh is opening the way for LeBron James and Dwyane Wade.
Occman’s Razor argues that when there are competing hypotheses, the explanation that requires the fewest assumptions is the best. That the rules changed the game in the way it intended to change it (i.e. opening up the game) by causing the very thing they wanted to (move the centers away from the rim), which would result in their objective (create more Jordans) leaves no room for assumption.
Perhaps the single best argument for Jordan as the greatest player of all-time is this: No other player had such an impact on the game that the NBA changed the rules to duplicate him. When Wilt Chamberlain dominated, they changed the rules to curtail his dominance. When Jordan dominated, they changed the rules to replicate his dominance. The side effect, though, was that there will never be another Chamberlain.”
bleacherreport.com/articles/1383036-how-michael-jordan-changed-the-nbas-center-position-forever
Jordan would've had a worse career if there was no illegal defense. Same with every player who scores near the basket. No illegal defense means more jumpshots and less drives. Would you let Jordan iso your SG into the paint? Now the catch and shoot three is valuable
Stephen Kardasz dude Lebron has lead the nba In points in the paint 7 times in 15 seasons never finished lower than top 6. Giannis is on pace to make more field goals in the paint than Shaq ever made by over 100 FG this season if he plays a full season. And guess what illegal defense doesn’t exists. The mid range jump shot no longer exists. Only layups and 3 pointers. Uncontested layups Defensive 3 seconds has the paint unprotected and no hand checking has guards getting into the paint with no resistance. You clearly don’t know what you are talking about and don’t have the data to support you.
Cris Junior that’s because the game has moved away from big men and Gianna’s is a freak he unless there is a 7 footer Gianna’s is the best player and tallest on the court not name Lebron or Durant
THIS VIDEO NEEDS TO BE SHARED MORE BY EVERYONE. EVERYONE SHOW THIS TO YOUR FRIENDS AND FAMILY
this also explains why we donot see 50 point plus per game explosions by individual players very often
Is it really bad to stop one man from scoring 50 pts a game? It is team basketball, so what if they play zone? If you're that good then beat it. You can't get mad because a team put a wall up to stop you from scoring. How do you think they feel when they can't defend a certain way and you end up scoring 50? You dont see Lebron James complaining. He came in when the rules changed and dominated. Mj was used to a lot of 1on1, but today if the whole team isn't involved then you're probably gonna lose. In other words, today's nba is more team-oriented and back in the day it was more hero ball. If they wouldn't have changed the rules, only certain teams with the best players had a shot at the title. You see why mj had a 3peat twice and when he got to Washington, they played team defense on him. There was very little iso
Word!
jordan went to weak team..so expected, eh cannot carry his team, plus injuries halt him to play more games...if he joined decent team or stronger team, he could had 8 or 9 rings...zone defense does not really issue about jordan's outcast on journey for rings against other team, he can actually beat this defense...zone D is not really conern since" traps" was already exist in 90's, an alternative for zone ( actually a zone trap in today's league), you can actually see it if you watched playoff games of bulls vs knicks ( they called it "jordan" rules)
***** yes agree...he actually outplayed young players with his age..only 40 year old guy need to double team...this young nigga never realized that how jordan unstoppable despite of aging status
***** but he didn't dominate in Washington did he? Now, LeBron James took a starless cavs team to the championship. Man to man, zone, or trap he still put his team on his back
+Bruce Lee cool
You legend 🙌
M/oron
This is one if the reason the Bucks defense has been so good at causing Harden Trouble Recently. If course he always lives off ref help probably more than Anyone since Jordan but it’s pretty hard to score when yku can be double or triple teamed with
A. CEnter hanging around the pait and a guy like Giannis allowed to olay free safety like that. Can you imagine how many titles the rockets might have Jordan would not if Dream could just hover in the paint like Giannis is able to.
Thank you for this
I'm glad to see that they took the illegal defense rules out of the game as soon as Michael Jordan left I was tired of seeing players being called for an illegal defense when they are playing Michael Jordan halfway it was obviously a tough players card so it's only right that they would have put him halfway this is why I prefer LeBron or Michael Jordan because oh the things you can do. don't get me wrong Michael Jordan still a phenomenal player I just prefer LeBron over him I feel LeBron is a better player than Michael Jordan.
I'm glad they changed this rule. It's a team sport
for me, i like zone defense. it gives teams more options to stop a scorer of the opposing team. it also force coaches to sort out some offensive strategy to sort out zone. it forces teams to play team oriented basketball. i like nba with zone defense. you will see in recent years that the players are constantly moving with or without the ball and that's of allowing zone defenses. imagine if the illegal defense is still enforced in nba-the game will become stagnant because you only allow player to iso with 4 other teammates standing around. it also fosters selfish-brand of basketball. that's why i don't like the remarks of shaq and ai because if you are really that good, whatever kind of defenses will show on your face you overcome. they can't.
A big difference that's not beginning talked about is while the defenders had to stay with their mans usually bigs and power forward and still in or around the paint not standing out on the 3 point line like today so the paint was still difficult to get into because defenders were still at the rim or around it in a league were three point shooting was not as popular.
It wasn’t that 3s wasn’t popular. Those players just couldn’t shoot. They sucked.
During 2001 wizard season… Jordan averaged 22 points…..
But he also averaged 23 shots per game. The zone clearly had an effect.
Any fan on this comment section should not say anything about hand checking. It was made illegal in the 1979-1980 season and it has been illegal since then, the league clarified the rules in 2012 but hand chedking has been illegal for a long time. It's very clear that players and coaches today are better than those of the 90s. Jordan is not the GOAT and probably isn't a top 5.
WOW finally a great video about the taboo ZONE DEFENSE
Thanks. It was necessary.
Great video thks a lot man.
Can’t believe I used to blindly agree with the oldheads that say the same BS narratives like “Defense was like a war zone back in the 80s/90s”, “MJ would average 50 PPG in today’s soft NBA”, “Today’s players are not skilled they just jack up 3s”, etc. I feel like an idiot but thankfully videos like yours debunks the myths of the old NBA and why players today would literally have a FIELD DAY back in the 80s/90s. Just the thought of a prime LeBron, prime Wade, prime CP3, prime Melo, prime Kobe, prime T-Mac, Giannis, Curry, Durant, Westbrook, Harden and many other great modern day players playing one on one basketball is just downright scary. The oldheads would have heart attacks watching these players make MJ, Bird, Magic, etc. look like scrubs.
but they have to now play defense you idiot ha ha ha Melo can't play D so he would not be a great player
Yeah judge an era because one player can’t play defense.... Real smart... Melo would torch those plumbers all day
you can only play old-school style defense on street ball period.
Bertlove Morleo indeed!
8:38 it’s amazing listening to the announcers talking about how that, something we probably see all the time today, is clearly illegal in this era
M/oron
This is an excellent video.
No its not
Finally someone exposed the NBA
"Zone defense, widely used in high school & college basketball, was introduced with a [significant] caveat. The committee instituted a 3-sec rule for defenders in order to [prevent] teams from [parking taller players in the post]. The goal was to [free the lanes] & [encourage] cuts & drives through the paint. With those changes, among other factors, offenses have [opened up] & scoring has [climbed]."
-- Feb. 9, 2009 NY Times
Enough said...and by the way they were playing zone defense in Jordan's era too, even if it was illegal. What the nba is doing right now is not really a zone defense.
*****
Yes, I know. The man was 39. He was trying a comeback after 3 years of retirement and he still torched the league, even if he was playing on the worst team in the league. Nobody is on his level.
+Air Magic not to mention the next game versus the hornets he scored like thirty points or more
The Zone Defense was introduced to STOP SHAQ.
in the early 2000s, the defense was way better than the 90s, because you had zone defense and hand checking coexisting and the players in the early 2000s couldn’t shoot as well as players today. The reason why they couldn’t shoot the 3 well is because they weren’t prepared for the zone defense. But in the mid 2000s they made rule change to get rid of hand checking. Now the defense slip a little for perimeter players but the defense was still good, well better than the 90s. The reason why teams still struggle against the zone even though it didn’t coexist with hand checking anymore is because players couldn’t SHOOT THREES. When the 2015 and 2016 Warriors came along they exploited Zone Defense. So the zone got beat because players became more skilled. and the players that do play iso ball in today’s NBA are surrounded by shooters but if those shooters shots are not falling then Zone Defense can still be applied but in today’s NBA the primary defense is switching but every now and then you could see zone depending on what type of player is playing. But in the 90s the defense wasn’t good because of the rules, in the 90s especially the late 90s you seen more iso ball because teams figured the defense out, because of the rules, you could literally have a non shooting big go to the 3pt line like Luc Longley and the defender would have to go out there even tho he was a non shooting big because the rules allowed no Zone Defense , manny coaches in the late 90s complain because the the illegal defense rules became even stricter in the late 90s. Some coaches even thought the NBA did this to help a older Jordan out. But when I say the early 2000s defense was better than the 90s defense, I’m not talking about when the Kobe Shaq Lakers was winning titles because they had the same exact defense that the 90s had, but in 2002 and above is really when the Zone came along and even though Shaq still had good numbers, you can tell he was getting fatigue more so before the rules change, by 2007 when he was on Phoenix he became a defensive liability even though this was an older Shaq. But I remember Shaq saying he had a hard time with big country because he shot 3s, and Charles Barkley bragging about Sabonis when he played in the Olympics, when he describes Sabonis shooting, it sounds mythical because back then they never really seen bigs that could shoot the 3 ball. For people wondering who Sabonis is then check out the 2001 blazers vs Lakers. If you watch the series you can make the case that some bigs today shoot just as good or better than Sabonis even though he was not in his prime on the Blazers. If Shaq played in today’s NBA, he could struggle in the pick and roll. You can make the case that Kobe faced tougher defense than Jordan, hence is why Kobe had to become more skilled than Jordan. You can see the proof when Kobe played against Utah in 2009, he was hitting tough contested jump shots right in brewer grill and watch how he lit up the 2010 suns. I’m not saying Kobe was better by any means, I’m just demonstrating the different in era. Now in today’s NBA it’s actually considered a bad idea to hit those tough contested shots that Kobe hit, because, most players can’t hit those shots and the league has better 3 point shooting now and the lane is open more. I watched a video of Kobe and Jordan explaining their game, and difference was how they explain the defenders. Jordan said you might have long defenders like Scottie, Charles Oakley, and Charles Barkley to shoot over. Kobe on the other hand said you need a good fade-away because there are a lot of long athletic defenders in the NBA. If you watch the highlights you can tell their are more athletic players in Kobe era then Jordan. Today’s NBA has slightly more athletic players then Kobe era. In matter of fact you find most teams with at least one player that has similar athleticism to Jordan. Jordan is still the Goat and would of been great in today’s NBA because of 3pt spacing, and Jordan is the king of iso ball, one defender can’t stop Jordan but a defensive team certainly can. I don’t really see him struggling until the playoffs when face more elite defenses. Jordan probably wouldn’t been as dominant in 2002-2009 era because of the zone defense and slack of consistent shooters or 3pt specialists. When I say not as dominant, I mean he wouldn’t put those numbers he had in the 90s, into 2000s basketball era because of tough D. But in today’s NBA he can as long that he has shooters around. Lol I love Jordan but he wasn’t a polished 3pt shooter, don’t believe then watch Jordan 3pt contest, it’s on UA-cam by the way. I will give the 90s defense credit on they guarded small guards better because of the rules, but if were big, strong, athletic and skilled you could dominate in the 90s. But if we’re small and un athletic then you could have major problems facing 90s defense. Hence why you seen small guards turn their back coming up court instead in today’s NBA they come up shooting from the Logo, that’s because we don’t have hand checking in today’s NBA but if we did the defense would be remarkably better than the 90s. But defense today is the same defense we had when Kobe torched the Utah Jazz in 2009, the only difference is players today just Shoot better and you can make the case that Zone Defense made players shoot better because 3s beat the Zone. Allen Iverson said back in 2001, that players in the future are gonna shoot better because they implanted Zone. If we had hand checking coexisting with zone and our knowledge of using switching, you would definitely play more team ball and becomes a more skilled player but that would take years for players to develop, in the mean it would be a problem because you would like the EARLY 2000s see non superstar teams like defensive guru teams like the 2004 pistons, 2004 Indiana pacers and see a low rating finals like the 2005 spurs vs pistons. But eventually I think teams would figure it out by becoming more skilled and playing more team basketball, but wait a minute that sounds like European basketball which is what the NBA don’t won’t to look like. So I don’t they will bring hand checking back and besides the game is way more fun to watch then it was when I was a little kid back in the early 2000s because players still tried to play iso ball like it was the 90s even tho they facing tougher defense than 90s, so in the early 200s you seen a lot bricks and inefficient shooting but the defense was good and boring too because the players back then just then have a developed consistent jump shot because they wasn’t prepared for Zone defense but players later like Curry was. If I was kid watching Curry 2016 run that would been amazing and exciting and Kyrie 2016 finals performance instead of watching the 2004 Basketball season slugfest and bricks basketball as a 9 year old 4th grader.
This video is so gold. Looking back at it, I just realized that some of the 90's players like Grant Hill are crybabies about the zone defense. The 90's players think that basketball is fun when things are man-to-man and if you can't guard, then you can't play. So, Mr. Hill, is basketball is about selfish play with the mindset of "I want to burn you and score over you", right? I personally think zone defenses are great for basketball. It brings a layer of strategies of slowing down superstars and lesser players to have an impact in the game. Looking back at Kobe's highlights, for example, I find it more fun to watch Kobe's game past the pre-zone era and even though he despises the zone defenses, it shows how remarkably skilled Kobe was during his young days, his prime days, and his twilight years. The defenses were limited back in the pre-zone era with the man-to-man stuff, so Kobe took advantage of it. I personally think Kobe's play was better than his pre-zone days, while his skills were superb when he joined the NBA as a teen. At least, Kobe overcame the zone and adapted. So, among the 90's players, Kobe is one of the exceptions. I could think of T-Mac, Iverson, KG, and Nash as players who adapted to combat the zone defenses. Jordan is a crybaby when it comes to the zones as well. The star players will need to share the ball so that the pace was quicker instead of selfish man-to-man, mano a mano style of basketball, which I personally find it as slow-paced "I am me" basketball. I am glad that there is more freedom of playing defense. Well, the 3-pt shot is the killer against zone defenses, but being an elite shooter from downtown requires a lot of skill to make those shots. Zones make the offense move the ball around and outplay the defense. Man, I can't watch the 90's basketball the same way even the early 2000's pre-zone days. Unfortunately, the NBA is ruined by gambling sites since the NBA is partner with those gambling sites, players cheesing the system like what James Harden did with a candy full of threes and fishing for fouls, and analytics done by math nerds to optimize scoring. Even though the 3-pt shots and shooting a bunch of them is mathematically valid for maximizing points, it makes it less fun to watch at times. Even my uncle thought that the Lakers beating the Celtics in Boston this year without LeBron and AD was a foolish game since Austin Reaves was left behind to hit long threes all game. I personally think the Jordan brainwashing media also ruined basketball. The propaganda has done so much damage to the paying customers, and because of these repeated propaganda, Jordanites are created. TheRiggedBA, your videos allowed me to piece things together that confirmed my observations that made the NBA seemed fishy when I start digging on things. Well done, sir! Also, the tremendous LeBron hate make me dig for info and finding reasons how the ESPN and other media propaganda in the 90's shaped the irrational hatred of the current superstars and the 2000's and 2010's players that surpassed Jordan in terms of talent, achievements, skill set as part of the sport's evolution, and intangibles. The sport evolves, and there will players that will surpass the all-time greats of the past.
Great video. People forget that Jordan regularly struggled against zones. In the NCAA where it is allowed the defenses were able to hold down Jordan, which helped upset the top seeded Tar Heels from making the Final Four two years in a row. They also allow zone in the Olympic Games. In 84 Jordan shot the fourth worst percentage on that squad. In 92 Jordan shot the absolute WORST percentage of all the Dream Team players. In addition, Jordan led both the 84 and 92 teams in turnovers. Is it no surprise how much Jordan dominated in a zone-free NBA?
jaranarm Which isn't surprising. Jordan was primarily a slasher in his prime. His shot was suspect beyond about 15 feet and even when his jumper improved later in his career his range was still short of the 3-point line. Apply a zone on that kind of player and his effectiveness sinks right off the bat. It's no wonder Jordan personally pleaded with the NBA not to allow zones when he knew he was coming back out of retirement. He didn't want to see all those bodies in front of him.
TheRiggedBA just like how Wade struggles in this league right without a 3 point shot. Man your clueless
jonnoi beckford
Wade does struggle against zones. Struggling doesn't mean you go scoreless, dumbass. It just means you won't score as easily or as much or on as high a percentage.
TheRiggedBA bro Wade was destroying the league and injures is the only thing that stopped him. He was averaging 30 ppg on 49% in 09 and is currently still averaging 49% from the field. Mj avg 20 on 44% at 40 years old and had more 40 pt games then most.
jonnoi beckford 2009 was Wade's best year by a good margin. He has never had a year like that before or after. Not coincidentally, 2009 was also the year he took and hit the most 3-pointers of his career and at the highest percentage. His jumper was abnormally good all that year. 2009 is also the only year in his career where Wade has ever had a 50-point game. You don't see Wade exploding for 50 and 60 points like guys such as Tracy McGrady and Kobe Bryant who have zone-beating range and can just pull up for 3-pointers with defenders in their face. Wade can't do that, so even though he's an elite player it's too difficult for him to score against zones to have outbursts like that.
One time he (Wilt Chamberlain) called me and said, 'Michael Jordan, from 15 feet back, is a terrible shooter." At his urging, one year I dissected all 82 Chicago games, and Wilt was right. Jordan shot in the 30s (percent) from 15 feet and back. -Harvey Pollack, Sixers statistician
jaranarm that’s funny... because since they started shot tracking in 96... MJ is on the “most mid range field goal made in a season” for Guards lists 4 times out of 10 slots. Did you know Mj made more mid range shots as a Wizard than Kobe did when he averaged 35ppg im 2006?
Mistah Unknown no his shooting percentages were not terrible.
MJ shot 30ppg on 50% shooting FIVE TIMES.
The only other players (non centers) to do that is KD ONCE and Steph TWICE. That’s it.
MJ consistently shot 45% in the mid range area. His career fg% went down as a Wizard. MJ is the best high volume mid range scorer EVER. Facts not opinions.
Samuel Díez it’s actually sad that this video exists because it’s poisoning the minds of casuals who don’t actually know basketball.
Wilt played against plumbers
@@ClassickWORLD It helps that what the video says happens to actually be true.
Durant would have had a field day in the 90's. The most unaffected by any defense shooter would kill that league. 80% shooting percentage Im calling it😂😂
Zone defense's has made the game overall better, making rules to allow better defensive play was a must it added parity to the league. Even with zones you see players still dominating. At least now there's some competitive balance instead of guys just running isos all game.
6:28 that shot by Kobe, damn 😂 😯
Against the zone D AND Tony Allen
Kobe played in the 90’s lol.
But why do they say defense was TOUGHER back then when zone was illegal?
Why do they say defense now is WEAKER and SOFT when zone is legal now and made scoring harder?(according to the players)
you need to realise that players love to exagerate about their era
Players of the past like to push one side of the story. They constantly resort to “handchecking” but ignore the illegal Defense out of it. Now teams did occasionally use it and get away with just like today some teams handcheck and get more physical at times and get away with it
It was become of the lesser spacing in the 90s and more handcheck freedom.. I'd say the today's game is still much easier for perimeter players to score cuz you can't touch players now on perimeter, Pick n' rolls are unguardable, fouls are called more often and spacing shooters make it impossible to play good defense today.. atleast back in the 90s with illegal defense you actually have to honestly guard your man even without the ball.. don't get it twisted isolations plays wasn't even used that often. post up plays were more efficient rather than isolations.. hence why everybody was forced to be a good tough defender back then.
Another great video.
I don’t see how this is a bad thing. It mostly shifts it from a game around the paint to one more outside. It also makes it less isolations and more team ball. Probably explains why Russ had 47 triple dubs last season, most ever.
Zone? Try it against Warriors, they will eat you out.
Wonder if Stern hitting Iverson had anything to do with Nike calling the shots in the NBA and Iverson endorsing Reebok...
Interesting suggestion. Never thought about that.
Great video. So, zone defense rules and hand check rules now give shooting team likes GS a competitive edge of no doubt.
i see the reason why a USA team in 2004 olympics with allen iverson got beaten so bad.