The Bible's definition of a Christian is someone who knows the Lord. That is something that never happened with you. Is it fair to say then that, based on your experience, the Bible is not true? How about a person who has a terrible time at Disneyland, then claims that it is not fun for anyone? Is that not insane? In the same way, through the hardness of your heart, you never allowed Christ into your life. Why is that not even on your radar, that through the hardness of your own heart, you did not encounter Christ? Moreover, is it a 'strawman' to use the Bible to define what a Christian is? Jesus said, "This is eternal life, that you know God and Jesus Christ Whom He has sent." If you did not know Christ, then you were never a Christian. Yet, what do you do with people like me? I met Christ in 1977 and He is my best friend. I have those 'rivers of living water bubbling up', I have the unspeakable joy, every day, of knowing Christ. What do you do with that? Do you dismiss me as 'delusional'? Many have! Sucks to be them when, as morally imperfect, they stand before a just God! Brandon, I do not want you to go to hell! It is morally wrong to lie, to steal, and to murder. Yet, if there is no God, then there is no right and wrong. We are simply animals doing what animals do. You have no rules for life except those of your own. Christ died on a Cross so that you may know Him. You begged and begged, but it was not to Christ. He always keeps a promise. He does not kowtow to your manipulations. Your heart, everyone's heart, is full of so much deceit! By begging God, you pushed Him away. Yet, it is not too late! You can know Christ! Jesus Christ is the light of the world.
Hey, great video! Thank you for your service to The People! I LOVE the list of questions at the end. Also, most of them can be generalized to any religion or group that demands self-sacrifice, especially of our markers of individuality. For your consideration: as to "When does the buck stop with god?" I'd like to us take this one step further to look see the Hebrew Bible as ONE of MANY texts that convey culture, alongside Hebrew art, history, architecture, music, food, clothing, transportation, ritual, family structures, educational models, etc. To stop short of seeing the text as an artifact of Hebrew culture is to make exception and give the impression that it IS exceptional, when every cultural group has texts, myths, legends, and lots of other cultural artifacts. A mind shift can occur when we see The People, place, and time where the text originated and NOT as an American text that can mean "whatever we say because Jesus." I am a retired teacher; one class I loved teaching was Mythology, another was Theory of Knowledge. Your channel explores many of the topics I included in my course plans. I enjoy learning from you. Be well!
McDonald's doesn't steal my self-worth. The church DID. McDonald's doesn't shame me for being born. The church DID. McDonald's doesn't tell me I'm evil and not of God. The church DID. McDonald's doesn't threaten me with eternal damnation. The church DID. McDonald's doesn't threaten me if I hought for myself and questioned things that aren't healthy. The church DID. McDonald's didn't reject me. The church DID..... multiple times. Great video, Brandon!
@@karenmiller6088question? Sure, questioning can almost always be valuable. Question *and* actually responsibly listen to the answer - now there’s a jackpot of an idea! 😅😂
@@BluStarGalaxy Y’all talk about straw man arguments this one of the best. It’s not that you don’t have the right to ask questions it’s that you don’t like the answers.
The first time a fast food restaurant gives me rocks or acid instead of food and drink, I'm never going again. That's a big difference. Church gave me little except guilt, anxiety, misinformation, and bad advice. When the product is consistently worthless, why would I ever go back?
Not to advocate going back (and not in a sense of going back into the faith), but I frequently go back, specifically to the church where my Pentecostal fundamentalist wife still goes to - to engage the pastor (a friendly and knowledgeable fellow), to sharpen my own understanding off the Bible and theist tactics and to sharpen my own sword of atheism.
@@BorisTheRed That's awesome. It's not like I've never been back to church as an atheist. If I'm visiting someone, and they go to church, I go to. It's like going to McDonald's, but not eating any of the food. I'm not angry and bitter at the church, Christianity, or anyone that indoctrinated me as a child. I just recognize that there is nothing useful to me being offered by those institutions.
The other one that gets me is, "You're only denying the existence of god because you want to sin." That is as stupid as saying, "You're denying the existence of police because you want to commit crimes."
My response to this is always that if I wanted to continue to sin( which I believe is a man made concept) I would have stayed a christen because I can do whatever pleases me and just go to sky daddy and ask for forgiveness.
@@sonyalangeveld5731 Absolutely. My response is I obey the law and most sins are not actually unlawful so by my understanding only Christians can sin. If I'm not a Christian I can't sin, it doesn't apply to me, only the laws of where I live do.
A few days ago I went to a third funeral in four years. No drama, all three lived to be over 85 years old. None of the three farewells had any religious affiliation whatsoever. Here in Northern Europe, religion simply fades away. Now, a clear separation between church and state helps a lot.
@@MindShift-Brandon Following what is happening now in the USA, is mind blowing, the least we could say. And then to know that America has far too much influence in the world. Very frightening.
Last funeral i attend ,it's been a while back, i was expecting to hear a lot about the deceased's life and what a good man he was with his family and community. Instead, the vast majority of the service was about Jesus and being saved from hell. Now, I only go to viewings and sign in to pay my final respects to that individual. When i exit this life soon as an old boomer, i will be cremated. There will only be my request to leave something in my name to my favorite charity.
German here. Out of a weird history situation, the big Christian churches have a close relation to the state up to the level that the state collects church taxes for them (you can easily opt out by a simple declaration). Last year for the first time more than half of the grown up population is no longer affiliated to one of the churches! Among the young (
Imagine going to a McDonald's and after correcting an order that they got wrong, instead of listening, they give you religious apologetics and try to gaslight you about what your order was. There, I fixed the analogy
Ray Kroc has a perfect plan for fast food, and his spirit told us that this was the meal you needed, even if it is not what you ordered. Now eat it and praise his name!
I'm actually had on multiple occasions, the manager of a McDonald's tell me that I ordered something I didn't order. I think gaslighting is in their manager's handbook
So, all of you haters, what have you substituted for God and religion? Bet you are just loving this illogical, out of control world full of crime, hate, drugs, and inequality. It's not looking like a good trade.
@b.kimhumphreys6662 lol really as compared to what the good ol days? When were those? When god killed people for picking up sticks or condoned slavery. Like it or not moral progression has happened despite this supposed god not because of him
I left the Catholic Church because of the wild claims and empty promises they offered in exchange for money and submission. After I left the mental confusion went away.
Let us not forget the repulsive coverups of child rape and molestation the Catholic Church covered/covers up. I was raised Catholic and, before I left, I refused to give tithes. I was asked why I didn't give and I said "I am not paying for the legal defense of pedophile priests." Then, shortly after, I noticed the complete hypocrisy and lack of teachings of Christ and walked away, never looking back. I have been a happier Atheist than I ever was a Catholic. I am just sorry I wasted some of my adult years attending.
@@pamparker4047 Well, that's the thing. There is no such thing as a "right" church. Every single one is just build off baseless faith, and translations of what essentially amounts to several chapters and letters of bronze age text mashed together into a single "book".
@@pamparker4047 no he went to *A* church, absolutely fucking hilarious of you to assume yours is better. Because literally everyone thinks there's is. and more than half of them are wrong.
My deconstruction started against my will because my mental health was in crisis and all my Bible reading in prayer made it worse. I had no choice but to seek professional help outside of the church.
I definitely understand! My grandma (I love her so much and she thinks she’s helping but she’s not) told me that my bipolar, anxiety and depression would be healed if I pray to god. I told her that I need medical attention and she told me that I need to have more faith. At the same time my aunt (her daughter) was diagnosed with breast cancer and her church told her to believe in total healing and to pray. Once she became stage 4 she went to the doctor to get treatment and within that month she passed away. I hoped that my aunt’s situation would cause my grandma to see that prayer alone doesn’t help nor cure anything. My deconstruction started when I lost my aunt. Once I tried to delete myself, I knew I needed help. So much of my trauma did come from god, the church and the Bible. I completely understand you! Here’s to healing ❤️🩹
@@bignoob1790 Funny? No, that's an obnoxious statement. You're saying to go back to the very thing she said gave her pain and? What? Try again? Insulting. That's like telling an abused woman to go back to her husband because he'll make it better this time. What's going to change? Nothing. Try thinking before making arrogant, presumptive, insulting statements.
I love how "hurt" is never defined. It's just that you've been "hurt". There are different kinds of hurt, and some kinds do need to result in leaving a church.
Yeah there’s so much ambiguity in the language they use that lets them hide and shift goalposts so often. Hurt could totally be a valid reason to leave, depending on what the details and context were. Or the cause of someone leaving could be related to/connected to a situation in which they were hurt, but not *caused by* that hurt, and they could very well still be accused of leaving *because of* the hurt.
It took me years into my adulthood to work through the feelings of shame, bitterness, resentment, and trauma that a lifetime being brought up under Christian doctrine did to me. I was in therapy for years. And one holiday, when it was known to my family that I had stepped away from the faith, my aunt said to me "well you were never a Christian. This is the culmination of Satan's plan for your life and you let him win." I will never forget that. In that moment it hit me that these people don't actually care about me. They care about me staying in line. If I stepped out of line, I'm immediately dog shit on the bottom of their shoe to them. A demonic entity. It's a cult mentality through and through. If you're not part of the in-group, you're evil.
Similarly, some years after I left the church, I asked my mum why she'd never asked me why I left. Her response: "I assumed you wanted to sin." I was literally speechless. That was well over a decade ago, and it still hurts.
I might argue that religious people are like a car full of church goers who order from the same drive through every week, and every week they only have empty bags handed to them from the drive through window. And every week, all of the car's occupants rave about how delicious and filling their meals are, even though at least some of them would like to discuss the fact that the bags are empty and they're still hungry. But they're afraid of being berated and having to walk home.
"People just get hurt one time and then leave." So he's saying that you should be ready to get hurt over and over and not leave? Sounds fine, normal, healthy, and not at all abusive.
@swissarmyknight4306 Trials and tribulations are a thing, but if your dealing with physical abuse inside your church it's time to find a new one and possibly seek legal assistance
It's kind of what they say about marriage...a wife should just stick around and keep getting hit in the hopes that one day her patience and submission will bring him around. I've actually heard this preached.
@ianchisholm5756 As a Christian that makes a lot of sense for 2 reasons Sanctification is a marathon not a sprint, there's improvement with time and patience Some people become Christian for non spiritual reasons, and are just going through the motions It's not my place to say who those people are, but it is a biblical reality
@@bignoob1790 Hmmm...I don't buy that one. 1) Sanctification may be a marathon, but even in a marathon one gets closer to the end, and finishes. The bible insists that these people are being transformed "daily," and yet even after years or decades they're basically the same. A transformation that is indistinguishable from nothing is not a marathon, it's paralysis. 2) Maybe some are faking it...but that doesn't escape the problem. Either we have to accept that nearly everyone in the pews is a fake, and therefore are going to hell by surprise (how would they even know?), or this "holy spirit" doctrine is bunk.
@@MindShift-Brandonso much of my most immediate reasons for not being in the faith could be summed up as “the god they claim exists fails spectacularly to meet the standards I’d set for a human.”
@@coruscantaIt seems to me that if God really existed and wants a relationship with me I would be hearing from him directly. Either it is simply awful at communicating or it doesn't really give hoot or it doesn't exist. The thing that burns my britches is that supposedly it is so powerful that it could create the whole universe from nothing and yet it sends out a signal so weak I am unable to detect it.
People don't usually leave the Church and religion because of a single bad experience, it's that the bad experience made them remove their religion glasses that makes you excuse away everything bad, and made them look at their beliefs critically. The bad experience is what triggers a more profound examination of the religion without starting with the presupposition that everything it teaches is good and right, and religious people just seem to have a really hard time understanding that. Probably because of the religion glasses.
Religion is a deep emotional commitment. For me, being a persistent (read: stubborn) soul, even more so. It took me years and years to finally be willing to step outside the christian bubble and examine my own religion the same way I would examine any other...and THAT is what put an end to my belief. Atheist for five years now, and thankful.
@@njhoepner interesting point. I wonder if the fact that I have autism and can step back and separate myself from overly emotional content and think rationally is what helped me start to distance myself from religion.
@@arkbien9303 That could be an advantage of being a certain distance along the spectrum. For most of us putting the emotional pull aside - especially when reinforced by the social acceptance pull - is very difficult.
When I went from beliver to non believer it seemed like a fairly short timeframe. It was actually tears in the making, clinging to my faith with an iron grip hoping I'd not be lead astray. Leaving a faith is a long and very painful process
Yes! I don’t think believers get it because they haven’t been open to questioning their faith in such a way before. Once I realized the whole religion didn’t make sense and how much evidence there was that it was manmade and contradictory, there was no way to go back to believing it anymore. I was so terrified of losing my faith for a while-it was extremely hard to unwind the mental gymnastics and emotional attachment I had, but once I did, the world felt so much more clear and REAL. The peace of letting it go was incredible and a feeling I never felt while I was a believer.
Yes, I completely agree that educational videos like this are soooooo important. Fighting ignorance and misinformation is one of the biggest fights this world has.
I've done a lot of soul searching on the subject of deconstruction (deconverting) ...what I know is, after reading the Bible all the way through like someone reads a long novel, it hit me that every page was man constructed, misogynistic, endorsed slavery, full of contradictions and historical inaccuracies. And, I asked myself if I thought the majority of Scripture was divinely written..the answer was NO. Once I saw it, I couldn't unsee it.
I was raised in Catholic school, church every week, pray before dinner and bed, I got communion but before confirmation my parents asked us if we wanted to keep going to church and I was kind of apathetic toward it so I said “not really” and that was that. I never asked why they didn’t care because it wasn’t that big a deal. This was in the 80s so way before atheist UA-cam or abuse scandal. Nothing bad happened. We just weren’t that into it. In my early teens a few years later I deconstructed and thought about it a lot and decided I was an atheist. And then I really didn’t think much about it for 20 years until Christian nationalism became blatant a few years ago and I learned more about religion now than I did as a kid and it’s so much less believable than I thought it was
I wonder how many people who self-identify as Catholics in surveys are actually “cultural” Catholics. You know, people who keep up with the basic traditions and go to church on Christmas but otherwise live completely secular lives and don’t actively believe in the god of the Bible.
I agree It is concerning that the thinking of Christians goes from: "you are a true believer God has great plans for you." When you believe. To: "you never believed and never a Christian." When you stop believing.
Comparing my personal beliefs and experiences in christianity with those of other religions is the main reason I stopped believing. But when I found out about all the coverups for CSA in churches, the growing christian fascism in the US, and all of the illogical fallacies and manipulations christians do to nonchristians- that all made me want to further distance myself from christianity.
When a religion tells you you’re born inherently evil, it’s extremely damaging and brings down self esteem. It makes you feel lower than dirt. I enjoy this world and life I’ve been given and I love being alive. I do what I can to be kind to others. I follow Jesus teachings more spiritually than dogmatically.
If you don't already have a liberal-minded church which welcomes you, you may want to check out Rev. Ed. Trevors who is active on UA-cam. I'm not trying to convert you, I'm an atheist. However, Rev. Trevor's is the kind of Christian that I respect. Since you indicated you still believe but have felt unwelcome, this may be a friendly community for you. Just a suggestion. So many of the Christians online are deplorable, so I think it's fair to note the good ones.
@@pcoleman1971I am the same. Jesus was a spiritual teacher. He even talked against yahweh. And preachers think yahweh is the true and rightful god. He's not. So no. We aren't interested in any christian dogma
I was a practicing Christian till my late 30s, most of my friends were Christians and none of them, none of the folks from the church, ever asked my why. Why did I leave the faith. They never came at me with curiosity as to why. I’m still friends with a small number of them and they’ve NEVER ASKED. It blows my mind.
Y'all complain when they question you and y'all complain when they don't. This UA-camr just pinned another person's post who said that Christians shouldn't question them for leaving. Maybe, just maybe, your Christian friends have heard a similar sentiment. So, now they are just respecting your decision which they presume may be a personal one.
I'm fighting with leaving my church. I have been a lifelong member but was lied to, lied about, shunned, and after speaking to the pastor and deacons, I realized I was the only one using the Bible to support my position. The person who lied began shunning my daughter in the youth group and then excluding her outright; my parents are now being shunned. Not over Biblical teaching but the narcism of one person and the desire to protect him from his bad behavior of being a liar. I will never leave my faith, but I have no use for a building filled with people who don't love their brothers and sisters in Christ; it is no longer a church. It's a social club.
Excellent video! My main reason for leaving Christianity altogether was reading the Bible cover to cover without bias and I realized how ridiculous it all was. Yes I was hurt by my home church, hurt by many Christians, and abused while using the Bible against me however, the reason why I no longer believe was because I actually did my own research and none of it made sense to me anymore. When they ask me, I tell them yes, the church did hurt be but ultimately I left because the Bible doesn’t make enough sense for me to believe in it anymore. They realize they can’t shame me with the “church hurt narrative” and just walk away… It’s so dismissive and disrespectful for Christians to poke fun or shame you for leaving the church because of church hurt. I don’t think they truly understand that it pushes people further away when they have this attitude. It has nothing to do with saving souls, it has everything to do with being in an exclusive club while harassing those who don’t want membership in 🤷🏽♀️
Re: The McDonald's analogy. Driving around town late at night, we stopped in a high crime area. The car died and could not be restarted. We had the car towed to the dealership service department and left the car in the "early morning" drop off spot, and took a cab home. In the morning, the service department called us, "We have examined your car. It is in perfect working condition. Please come and pick it up" and told us the cost of the service fee. Later that day, another mechanic took several hours to find a hairline crack in the distributor cap that had caused the car to act unpredictably. That is exactly the same feeling of "being offended" that made me leave the church. With the car, it was once. With the religion, however, it was time after time.
It took decades. Lots of various churches. And, finally, reading the bible from front to back by myself with no study guide or explanation. Just my 40 year old adult brain to think about what I was reading. To finally decide that I was no longer Christian. I just can not follow the god the bible describes.
I thankfully haven't had a bad experience with the church. However, after having read the Bible multiple times over my life, I just don't believe that Christianity represents capital "T" Truth.
I wish that my family was interested in why I left Christianity. They think that it's just because I am queer, and I tried to explain to them that it was only a small part of it. They don't listen to me.
Ive been of 4 different denominations, The last one, Friends Church, was very good and they know I am transgender and even told me Im welcome back (I cant because of distance) the Baptists were ...they were good at first but turned bad when I pointed at something I didnt like in the church. i still have a few friends form that church. The Methodists, some were nice some werent but I have several friends from the Methodist church. The first church, Disciples, well i was about 5.
I get that, I’m LGBT+ too and my family thinks the same thing about why I don’t talk about Christianity anymore. They don’t get that the rejection I felt for just being myself was the first step that pushed me to begin my journey. I wanted to understand how and why Christians believed being queer was so bad … once I started really looking into the logic of the entire religion, the whole thing collapsed like a house of cards. Going to different churches wouldn’t bring my faith back-trust me, I tried.
Spent 16 years in the church. 5 years old until 21. Read the entirety of the Bible at age 18 and spent 3 years trying to justify the stories of the Bible and searching for biblical history/accuracy. After taking elective courses in early mesopotamian history I learned of the Akkadians and other pre-Isrealite religions and saw way too many stories that predated the Bible that it drew inspiration from. Took me years to finally admit to myself the the global flood was a myth as well as the exodus of Moses.
One of the first steps of forming your sense of empathy is accepting the fact that you may not be as good of person as you think you are. Unfortunately, that’s where the cognitive dissonance comes from. Christian extremists don’t believe they’re actions can be bad because they believe they’re on the side of “good.”
My mother does this. To this day she believes the church or her hurt me and I'm taking it out on God. When I disagree and say it's for logical reasons, she says she knows my mind better than I do.
She does know you better than you. Your insatiable appetite for sin and desperate unwillingness to say "no" to even the most depraved of desires clouds your ability to think, judge, and accurately see yourself. Your god, being your stomach (Phil 3:19), shapes how you perceive reality. Every thought is guided by these appetites, so it's impossible for you to see reality if reality contradicts these appetites. Until you accept Jesus and repent of all your depravity (and sincere repentence means in your heart but also publicly - to all the Christians whom you've been gaslighting), your thinking will continue to be clouded.
Let go of the fears and dogmas. If that's the response than their love is conditional. Ultimately is between choosing to be correct or live a loving life.
@@somexp12wtf?? How condescending and invalidating that response was. You ought to feel ashamed, but I’m sure you don’t, so instead of asking you to try and understand the perspective of people who don’t believe like you, I’ll say this: people like you are great confirmation for us atheists of why we left religion in the first place. Your smug, holier-than-thou attitude stinks, and honestly you’re wasting your time and energy in these spaces trying to “exhort” non believers. Those tactics don’t fly outside the church, friend … they just make you look like a jerk.
I’m sad to hear that youve had to experience that from your own mother. Christians always seem to think we leave for emotional or relational reasons because they have trouble wrapping their minds around the fact that people can logically question why they believe in a religion and come to the conclusion that Christianity is manmade and doesn’t make much sense.
My deconstruction story is, i just stopped going to church, no Christians telling me I was never a true Christian, no strawmanning, no nothing, i just stopped going and, nobody seems to care
Some of them try very hard to break you down on your way out. They want to be the ones bringing to fruition, in the absence of an actual God to do the job, the threats that God is going to get you and bring you to your knees if you leave.
fear is really all they got. They dominated because to be ostracized from your community could well destroy your life. Im sure many just went along to get along, there was no other (plausible) choice
My mother has years telling me to come to the lord with love and not with the lord punishing me to come to him. I already told her I can suffer everything in the world and would never worship that god.
@@MindShift-BrandonI agree! Not one ounce of bitterness whatsoever! If anything you seem confident, calm and willing to teach! I appreciate this channel so much ✊🏽
This is what scares me about Christian Nationalism and mandating the Bible/Ten Commandments in public school. The reason why all the different denominations get along more or less peacefully in this country is that they are all equal under the law. No one church has power over the others. But let a "Christian Nation" be established and look out, the most dominant group will turn on all the others. Mandated Protestant Bible readings and prayer in public schools was what drove the Catholics to start their own parochial schools, because their rights were being violated. That's right. Up until around 1965 Catholics were forbidden on pain of mortal sin (which means you are going straight to hell, do not pass Go, do collect $200) to take part in ANY kind of Protestant service INCLUDING readings from a Protestant Bible and Protestant prayers). Now I know a lot of you will say big deal because hell doesn't exist. But it is very much a big deal to those who feel that they are being forced to take part in something they don't agree with. And that's just Protestant versus Catholic. Forget about those who aren't even Christian at all! I had a conversation yesterday with someone who brought up this subject and I said to them, "First of all, do you believe Catholics are Christian?" He hemmed and hawed and said, "I really don't want to say." This person is a Baptist. I said "ok, then, have you ever had your Christianity questioned? Have you ever had someone tell you that you are not a Christian because of the church you attend?" He said, "No." I said, "Well, I have, MANY, MANY, MANY times. Because I was a Catholic. Because I went to the 'wrong' church. I was not considered a Christian even though I had been brought up to believe that I was a Christian, that my church told me I was a Christian, but no, I was not really a Christian. Not really one of you. So you will forgive me when I say this kind of talk scares me." He said that he didn't really blame me but the fact that he dodged the question on whether Catholics are Christian is quite revealing. I said I have never met a group of people who were more intent on determining who is and who isn't a Christian than Christians themselves and these are precisely the kind of people I do not want to be in power over me or anyone else.
100! The church is very abusive, both emotionally and physically. I know firsthand as my married pastor tried to sleep with me. When it was found out, he got to keep his job (by this time he was in a different church) and the church kept it very hush hush. Most people that went there at that time have no idea it even happened. And to top it off I was told by someone in the church that it was none of my business how it was being handled. After all of that, I still stayed for years!! I didn’t leave until around 23 and it happened when I was in high school!! But now, when people find out about it, it never fails that I get hit with the whole “you have to follow Jesus, not men” remark. Ugh. It’s all just so emotionally abusive looking back.
McDonald's will usually try to correct your order if something was done wrong. The Church only changes when it gets dragged _kicking and screaming_ into something closer to modern morality.
You know who's supposed to understand me leaving the church? God. He didn't stop me, so I'm to assume that it's okay. And if the God of the Bible were real, then I would expect Romans 8:38 to hold up. It didn't. And I'm here, free from the confusion and hypocrisy of religion. 😊
This guy just did a video on celestial beings being God's slaves. And yet he pins your comment about God *not* stopping you from leaving the faith.😏 As for Romans 8:38-39, it doesn't include, nor myself. So nothing in the world can separate you from God, but you.
@@NP70se And I don't understand your reasoning for Romans 8:38-39 not including "you or me". That's ridiculous. If there's "nothing" that can separate me from the love of God, then I would expect any thoughts of me leaving would be a clue for him to step up his game. My point was that he's not real and if he were that I'd expect more from the Almighty than he should expect from lowly me.
@@NP70seif you can’t see how liking(notably *not pinning*) a comment expressing what this comment does is not in the slightest in contradiction with the video about celestial slavery, then I’m concerned about how you’re interacting in these spaces, how much attention you’re paying to the things you talk about and respond to.
@@NP70se and I think you're in the wrong video anyway. This is on leaving the church and coping with people blaming us when it's god not following through, leading to the conclusion that it might not be true.
McDonald`s doesn`t claim that Ronald McDonald died to get my order right. I don`t have to wait in line for one to three hours to get my food while listening to the store owner tell me I ordered wrong. I don`t have to listen to McDonald`s fans tell me I`m evil for going to Burger King... oh, wait, that part is true!
Ronald McDonald died for your hunger… He is fighting the Hamburgler for your soul! Grimace said “Ronald died so that you may have delicious, crispy fries 🍟, and that your Super Size Coke 🥤 shall never go empty…” Grimace 4:20
I was hurt by people in my local church. Actually, it happened in two churches, but I didn't leave, at least not right away. In a couple cases 'church' left me. Nevertheless, I was still a believer. This went on for years. Then I came out as gay. Church (people) really left me then. Yet I was still a believer. I joined the gay Christian Network. This inspired more bible study to reconcile me faith with my sexuality. Then my view of the bible changed. I saw the impossibility of Genesis, The Flood, Moses and the Exodus. The foundation of my Faith turned to smoke, and my Faith went with it. That's when I became an atheist. being hurt didn't cause me to leave, rational thinking did.
So spot on and well done, Brandon. And as far as your assessment of yourself, which is a difficult thing to do accurately I agree 100% with the way you perceive yourself all you do is educate without pushing and indoctrinated narrative.
The number one reason for why people have been leaving the faith is, drum roll....the internet, youtube, the logical people explaining how idiotic religion really is. That's why they would love to control the content.
... but, historically (and even today), the number one reason people leave is because they look beyond the surface level, usually in their adulthood, and discover the ridiculousness of the religion. More people talking about the ridiculousness is certainly a catalyst for some folks.
That's one reason that so many Christians home school or send their children to private schools. The goal is to control what information a person has access to.
I have no animosity against the majority of people in my faith tradition. Most are good, loving, genuine, some even “holy” , people. I continued to learn, came to new conclusions, “Seek the truth and it will set you free.” Ironically… My cognitive dissonance caught up with me. I moved along. Peace be with you
Thanks Brandon. Personally I stopped going to my last church because it wasn’t particularly friendly or engaging. I hadn’t made any friends there. I then spent 6 years out of church but still in the faith, until finally deconverting. I’m really fortunate in that at that point I didn’t have any church community to lose.
I recently commented on videos posted on different channels about scriptures that were used directly in the content creators videos. The excuses were a bit comical. I was told I wasn't seeing what I read or I need to repent because of the questions I asked. My favorite was the long time classic, "You're not supposed to question God." Whether it was the content creator or commenters, it's been attempted personal attacks or opinions. But no answers. Too many of these folks are posting religious based content that they themselves don't even understand and turn out to be unhelpful themselves.
McDonald's doesn't demand 100% fealty for life. Policing every thought, every act, the twisting back and forth between forgiveness and guilt, etc. etc. etc.
Thank you so much for making these videos that help me think through this transition. Leaving a high control fundamentalist church was in no way easy. I gave up my community and can't talk to half my family and friends now. I had to leave my job that I got through the church. I didn't make that decision lightly. I made it when I knew that I no longer believed and couldn't pretend to be a believer.
There was a study done of people that left the church versus people that joined the church. They found that the process of leaving The church usually took place over years and involved a conflict between what they were told and what their intellect told them. On the other hand people who joined the church often did it based on one emotional incident that triggered something. It was based on a feeling.
Belief happens in an instant, and it's NOT based on a feeling. We believe God gave us the provision for eternal life. That has nothing to do with my feelings. It has everything to do with "I want life, I believe the Gospel." It has nothing to do with "church" either. I don't attend a church. I believe in Christ and His Gospel, His offer of only relying on Him for eternal life, as I cannot earn it myself. Focusing on "church" is a distraction and a null point.
You're 100% right. Believers don't understand that a good number of deconverts left because they studied, they asked hard questions and got no answers or shallow ones, and they came to logical conclusions that the religion was based on false presuppositions and mythology. This happened to me - I learned more and realized the whole thing was false. I do not believe that religion is evil - I think belief can be helpful IF it makes you a better person, then that's great. I'm all for it. But most of the time, religion stops critical thinking, encourages bigotry and tribalist mentalities, and gives you a false sense of spirituality and superiority. That's why I don't believe. They just like telling people that they stopped because of hurt, or because their church wasn't welcoming.
I’m so glad you’re covering this topic! How hypocritical for a group of people that are always accusing us of misrepresenting them or taking things out of context have no shame whatsoever in misrepresenting us. Obviously as an ex-believer, I understand that they’re under this echo chamber groupthink. It just goes to show the potency of conditioning within this particular cult
I didn't want to leave the church 😢I lost all my friends, my support group. 😪 I just actually read the Bible (especially old testament) and couldn't do it anymore.
Sometimes bitterness is the natural result of interacting with self righteous and deceptive religious groups. Nothing for anyone to be ashamed of, as shame is merely another stock weapon from a churches large and loaded "arsenal of love""
People need to stop pretending that being hurt in church is not a legitimate reason to leave - not just the church, but to leave the faith entirely. They always say “it’s a relationship.” Yeah, and being hurt in a relationship can be a very good reason to end that relationship. “But it wasn’t God who hurt you, it was people!” Yeah, then he let them do it. Why would I want to continue a relationship with someone who allows their children to do such terrible things to people and does nothing about it?
They are basically just telling you "Be with us or you're doomed forever". If we go by your argument, then it would still be a relationship. A toxic one. Like, look at the parallels. They make you believe you are worthless without god and that you're evil if you leave him in order to make you scared of them so you'll stay and let them torture you for their own benefits. And to be honest: That's just not a relationship I would want to be in!
I took a break from the church I used to go to, because they didn't follow the things they taught. I was still a devout Christian, I was hurt by that particular church, but I had every intention of going elsewhere. During that process, I realized my belief was so intertwined with their dogma, I needed to deconstruct to figure out why I believed Christianity was true; I needed my own epistemic foundation. Now I'm an atheist, because it turns out, there's not much objective evidence upon which to build a foundation in the first place.
Your videos have helped me realize that my deconstruction has been far more complicated than I thought. I went no contact with my mother two years ago and it still bothers me that she claims to love me, but fully believes that I am going to hell and honestly doesn't give a crap about who I am as a person.
1 John 2:19 "They went out from us, but they were not of us" etc , etc. I think those verses are a source of the "O you were never really saved, you were never a real Christian" attitude and mindset. Great video, keep it rolling there Brandon.
“I might try a different McDonald’s or maybe even go to Burger King instead” is actually a really cool addition to that metaphoric comparison, cuz if you think about it, if I don’t like a church (McDonald’s franchise), my first step is to try another church of the same religion. If/when that one doesn’t vibe with what I believe is right, I might try a different religion altogether (Burger King).
My deconversion had zero to do with anything any person said or did. It was an entirely intellectual pursuit on my part and was intended to strengthen my faith. However, the reaction of some believers after I came out as an atheist certainly doesn't help their case.
As always thanks for the content Brandon and thanks for coming to the defense of nonbelievers. I left the faith 20 years ago after meeting my now husband who grew up in a non religious household and had much better arguments than mine for the truth of the all powerful Flying Spaghetti Monster. My faith dictated that my soulmate was damned to an eternity of punishment and suffering which was a concept I could never really wrap my head around anyway. I came to realize that I wouldn’t wish eternal punishment on my greatest enemy let alone someone I claimed to love, no matter how badly they might wrong me and if I as a flawed, selfish, and “sinful” creature had a higher moral compass than that of my all benevolent creator God than that god was a contradiction in terms and I just could no longer believe in it.
"Why do we scare them??" the leaders? The money you do NOT donate scares them. the sheeple? You don't scare them. Their past0r does by lying about you.
Its very close to how abusers act when the focus of their abuse escapes their control. The Church is a scam, and must hate those who refuse to be scammed anymore.
Well, this ex Christian simply got fed up with coping with the cognitive dissonance between the rhetoric in church and what we now know to be the case via scientific investigation. I also didn't like the way that all weddings and funerals were effectively just standard church services with a grudgingly little bit about the person/people involved shoe-horned in. Secular services (including my own son's wedding) are far more about the individuals involved; and consequently far more meaningful. In the 2021 UK census the number of people identifying as Christian fell below 50% for the first time in history, with 'no religion' following a close second. With a 'closing speed' of 25% between Christian and secular since the previous census in 2011, the positions will inevitably have reversed by 2031. Even those identifying as Christian seemed to have very weird ideas and probably only meant it culturally. For instance, very few actually believed in original sin (from follow-up surveys) and others were just vaguely deist and did not believe in a personal god.
I really like the questions you bring up here. "What DOES it take before you think it's ok to leave?" or questioning why the church isn't the model of kindness and loving and selflessness. It also doesn't help when you have people who say things like, "If your 10 year old is SA'ed and impregnated, God wanted that so that's why you're NOT ALLOWED to get an abortion." If I was ever religious, that would DEFINITELY get me to look at those people sideways because that's so messed up. And all you really have to do is remember that Yahweh flooded the entire earth and what that actually means in terms of not just body count but the types of bodies.
Hey all! I am so tired of those that leave the faith being strawmanned over snd over and over. Doing my part to add nuance. Enjoy!
I would accept if they stated that i left the church because god wants it that way.
EVen mindless sheep are allowed power of Jesus starting now enjoy ❤
The Bible's definition of a Christian is someone who knows the Lord. That is something that never happened with you. Is it fair to say then that, based on your experience, the Bible is not true? How about a person who has a terrible time at Disneyland, then claims that it is not fun for anyone? Is that not insane? In the same way, through the hardness of your heart, you never allowed Christ into your life. Why is that not even on your radar, that through the hardness of your own heart, you did not encounter Christ?
Moreover, is it a 'strawman' to use the Bible to define what a Christian is? Jesus said, "This is eternal life, that you know God and Jesus Christ Whom He has sent." If you did not know Christ, then you were never a Christian. Yet, what do you do with people like me? I met Christ in 1977 and He is my best friend. I have those 'rivers of living water bubbling up', I have the unspeakable joy, every day, of knowing Christ. What do you do with that? Do you dismiss me as 'delusional'? Many have! Sucks to be them when, as morally imperfect, they stand before a just God! Brandon, I do not want you to go to hell!
It is morally wrong to lie, to steal, and to murder. Yet, if there is no God, then there is no right and wrong. We are simply animals doing what animals do. You have no rules for life except those of your own. Christ died on a Cross so that you may know Him. You begged and begged, but it was not to Christ. He always keeps a promise. He does not kowtow to your manipulations. Your heart, everyone's heart, is full of so much deceit! By begging God, you pushed Him away. Yet, it is not too late! You can know Christ!
Jesus Christ is the light of the world.
@@kenshiloh what you call 'hardness of heart' is what I call 'using critical thinking'.
Hey, great video! Thank you for your service to The People!
I LOVE the list of questions at the end. Also, most of them can be generalized to any religion or group that demands self-sacrifice, especially of our markers of individuality.
For your consideration: as to "When does the buck stop with god?"
I'd like to us take this one step further to look see the Hebrew Bible as ONE of MANY texts that convey culture, alongside Hebrew art, history, architecture, music, food, clothing, transportation, ritual, family structures, educational models, etc. To stop short of seeing the text as an artifact of Hebrew culture is to make exception and give the impression that it IS exceptional, when every cultural group has texts, myths, legends, and lots of other cultural artifacts.
A mind shift can occur when we see The People, place, and time where the text originated and NOT as an American text that can mean "whatever we say because Jesus."
I am a retired teacher; one class I loved teaching was Mythology, another was Theory of Knowledge. Your channel explores many of the topics I included in my course plans. I enjoy learning from you. Be well!
McDonald's doesn't steal my self-worth. The church DID.
McDonald's doesn't shame me for being born. The church DID.
McDonald's doesn't tell me I'm evil and not of God. The church DID.
McDonald's doesn't threaten me with eternal damnation. The church DID.
McDonald's doesn't threaten me if I hought for myself and questioned things that aren't healthy. The church DID.
McDonald's didn't reject me. The church DID..... multiple times.
Great video, Brandon!
Go, Barbara! this is great.
McDonald's threatened me. Although it was fair...I was running a blackjack game in the ball pit.
Allow me to add this: McDonalds doesn't have Nothingburgers with a side order of lies on the menu.
@@crassbusinessman3122 That was you? My grandkid left that ball pit with a small fortune. 🤑
Well said !!😲🙂👍.
People don't leave the church because something goes wrong, but because they understand it *_is_* wrong.
Technically something went wrong. The indoctrination stopped working.
Well put!
Well said!
Yes exactly
Beautifully said.
If Christians don’t doubt a person’s intentions when they join the faith, they don’t have the right to question our intentions when we leave it.
They should question why they left and learn but they're taught it's personal wickedness that caused them to walk away.
I love this so much! stealing it for life. thanks
@@karenmiller6088question? Sure, questioning can almost always be valuable. Question *and* actually responsibly listen to the answer - now there’s a jackpot of an idea! 😅😂
Some churches do have a watch period before membership
@@BluStarGalaxy
Y’all talk about straw man arguments this one of the best. It’s not that you don’t have the right to ask questions it’s that you don’t like the answers.
"You saw one international conspiracy to cover up widespread CSA, and that's all it took for you to leave the church?!"
isn't it just so insane
The Christian defense of CSA, “It happens in all denominations and even the Boy Scouts.” How does that make it acceptable???
It's a good thing I was never a True Believer. Otherwise, I would still be sitting in the pews looking for a way to reconcile my faith.
OMG spot ON.
Exactly this
The first time a fast food restaurant gives me rocks or acid instead of food and drink, I'm never going again. That's a big difference. Church gave me little except guilt, anxiety, misinformation, and bad advice. When the product is consistently worthless, why would I ever go back?
Not to advocate going back (and not in a sense of going back into the faith), but I frequently go back, specifically to the church where my Pentecostal fundamentalist wife still goes to - to engage the pastor (a friendly and knowledgeable fellow), to sharpen my own understanding off the Bible and theist tactics and to sharpen my own sword of atheism.
@@BorisTheRed That's awesome. It's not like I've never been back to church as an atheist. If I'm visiting someone, and they go to church, I go to. It's like going to McDonald's, but not eating any of the food. I'm not angry and bitter at the church, Christianity, or anyone that indoctrinated me as a child. I just recognize that there is nothing useful to me being offered by those institutions.
love this!
@@BorisTheRed Very courageous in my book. I couldn't STAND being in any church service ever again.
The other one that gets me is, "You're only denying the existence of god because you want to sin."
That is as stupid as saying, "You're denying the existence of police because you want to commit crimes."
True
100%!
Agreed
My response to this is always that if I wanted to continue to sin( which I believe is a man made concept) I would have stayed a christen because I can do whatever pleases me and just go to sky daddy and ask for forgiveness.
@@sonyalangeveld5731 Absolutely. My response is I obey the law and most sins are not actually unlawful so by my understanding only Christians can sin. If I'm not a Christian I can't sin, it doesn't apply to me, only the laws of where I live do.
Victim blaming is necessary to keep up the stock of potential victims. Religion is a grooming pool.
1 John 2:19...victim blaming has been the standard answer from the start.
As someone with a fear abandonment and abandonment issues, becoming an atheist is probably the most courageous thing I've ever done.
I hope you’re proud of that courage! It really can be such a difficult task/thing/journey, and in ways that can be so difficult to see coming. 🎉😊
Same here my friend! Glad to see you on the other side of things ✊🏽🫶🏽✊🏽
A few days ago I went to a third funeral in four years. No drama, all three lived to be over 85 years old. None of the three farewells had any religious affiliation whatsoever.
Here in Northern Europe, religion simply fades away.
Now, a clear separation between church and state helps a lot.
I really cannot imagine
@@MindShift-Brandon Following what is happening now in the USA, is mind blowing, the least we could say.
And then to know that America has far too much influence in the world.
Very frightening.
@@MrCanis4as an American myself, America can never mind its own business but decides to meddle in every other countries affairs.
Last funeral i attend ,it's been a while back, i was expecting to hear a lot about the deceased's life and what a good man he was with his family and community. Instead, the vast majority of the service was about Jesus
and being saved from hell. Now, I only go to viewings and sign in to pay my final respects to that individual. When i exit this life soon as an old boomer, i will be cremated. There will only be my request to leave something in my name to my favorite charity.
German here. Out of a weird history situation, the big Christian churches have a close relation to the state up to the level that the state collects church taxes for them (you can easily opt out by a simple declaration).
Last year for the first time more than half of the grown up population is no longer affiliated to one of the churches! Among the young (
Imagine going to a McDonald's and after correcting an order that they got wrong, instead of listening, they give you religious apologetics and try to gaslight you about what your order was. There, I fixed the analogy
Ray Kroc has a perfect plan for fast food, and his spirit told us that this was the meal you needed, even if it is not what you ordered. Now eat it and praise his name!
I'm actually had on multiple occasions, the manager of a McDonald's tell me that I ordered something I didn't order. I think gaslighting is in their manager's handbook
@@jonnyblaze2692 At least he didn't tell you that if you left and went to Wendy's, he would punish you for all eternity 😜
lol, perfect!
@@joeyangtree1862 Wendy's is purgatory. Burger King is hell. Carl's Junior is the next level of heaven up. Jack in the Box is where Loki lives.
I got hurt every time I was in church but I used to say " I am here for God not the people lol" but my eyes got wide open in 2022
Imagine going to McDonald's and being told you will get your fries in the afterlife
Do I get apple pies with my virgins.
But you paid 10% of your income IN ADVANCE!
What kind of crap is that?
So, all of you haters, what have you substituted for God and religion? Bet you are just loving this illogical, out of control world full of crime, hate, drugs, and inequality. It's not looking like a good trade.
@b.kimhumphreys6662 lol really as compared to what the good ol days? When were those? When god killed people for picking up sticks or condoned slavery. Like it or not moral progression has happened despite this supposed god not because of him
I left the Catholic Church because of the wild claims and empty promises they offered in exchange for money and submission.
After I left the mental confusion went away.
Let us not forget the repulsive coverups of child rape and molestation the Catholic Church covered/covers up.
I was raised Catholic and, before I left, I refused to give tithes. I was asked why I didn't give and I said "I am not paying for the legal defense of pedophile priests."
Then, shortly after, I noticed the complete hypocrisy and lack of teachings of Christ and walked away, never looking back.
I have been a happier Atheist than I ever was a Catholic. I am just sorry I wasted some of my adult years attending.
You went to the wrong church
@@pamparker4047 Therein lies the problem, what is the right church? Is there a litmus test all believers could agree on?
@@pamparker4047 Well, that's the thing. There is no such thing as a "right" church. Every single one is just build off baseless faith, and translations of what essentially amounts to several chapters and letters of bronze age text mashed together into a single "book".
@@pamparker4047 no he went to *A* church, absolutely fucking hilarious of you to assume yours is better. Because literally everyone thinks there's is. and more than half of them are wrong.
I don't go to McDonalds, I don't like their food.
Same for church.
Also both have a clown as their mascot.
You beat me to it!
Well said.
This is why I don’t go to Arby’s, they don’t have the meats
@@BluStarGalaxy
*DAMN*
My deconstruction started against my will because my mental health was in crisis and all my Bible reading in prayer made it worse. I had no choice but to seek professional help outside of the church.
I definitely understand! My grandma (I love her so much and she thinks she’s helping but she’s not) told me that my bipolar, anxiety and depression would be healed if I pray to god. I told her that I need medical attention and she told me that I need to have more faith. At the same time my aunt (her daughter) was diagnosed with breast cancer and her church told her to believe in total healing and to pray. Once she became stage 4 she went to the doctor to get treatment and within that month she passed away. I hoped that my aunt’s situation would cause my grandma to see that prayer alone doesn’t help nor cure anything. My deconstruction started when I lost my aunt.
Once I tried to delete myself, I knew I needed help. So much of my trauma did come from god, the church and the Bible. I completely understand you! Here’s to healing ❤️🩹
@@doodleschmoodle
Funny, I developed anxiety when I left the church, and it went away when I started going back
@@bignoob1790 probably because of the indoctrination. It can be hard at first, but rewarding in the long run.
same thing happened to me
@@bignoob1790 Funny? No, that's an obnoxious statement. You're saying to go back to the very thing she said gave her pain and? What? Try again? Insulting. That's like telling an abused woman to go back to her husband because he'll make it better this time. What's going to change? Nothing. Try thinking before making arrogant, presumptive, insulting statements.
I love how "hurt" is never defined. It's just that you've been "hurt".
There are different kinds of hurt, and some kinds do need to result in leaving a church.
Yeah there’s so much ambiguity in the language they use that lets them hide and shift goalposts so often. Hurt could totally be a valid reason to leave, depending on what the details and context were.
Or the cause of someone leaving could be related to/connected to a situation in which they were hurt, but not *caused by* that hurt, and they could very well still be accused of leaving *because of* the hurt.
McDonald’s doesn’t run candidates and promote laws that rob people of their rights when they get my order wrong.
Not yet
I mean, they're a megacorp, so they probably do exactly that. Although they're at least less judgey about it.
It took me years into my adulthood to work through the feelings of shame, bitterness, resentment, and trauma that a lifetime being brought up under Christian doctrine did to me. I was in therapy for years.
And one holiday, when it was known to my family that I had stepped away from the faith, my aunt said to me "well you were never a Christian. This is the culmination of Satan's plan for your life and you let him win." I will never forget that. In that moment it hit me that these people don't actually care about me. They care about me staying in line. If I stepped out of line, I'm immediately dog shit on the bottom of their shoe to them. A demonic entity. It's a cult mentality through and through. If you're not part of the in-group, you're evil.
I "gave up." They say.
Exactly. But so sorry still to hear the struggle of it all for you
Maaterfully said
Anything other than face the fact that their holy book might be falible and not work for everyone.
Similarly, some years after I left the church, I asked my mum why she'd never asked me why I left. Her response: "I assumed you wanted to sin." I was literally speechless.
That was well over a decade ago, and it still hurts.
I might argue that religious people are like a car full of church goers who order from the same drive through every week, and every week they only have empty bags handed to them from the drive through window. And every week, all of the car's occupants rave about how delicious and filling their meals are, even though at least some of them would like to discuss the fact that the bags are empty and they're still hungry. But they're afraid of being berated and having to walk home.
The Emperor’s New Fast Food
Great analogy!
Omg, I love this!👍✅💯😊
"People just get hurt one time and then leave." So he's saying that you should be ready to get hurt over and over and not leave? Sounds fine, normal, healthy, and not at all abusive.
@swissarmyknight4306
Trials and tribulations are a thing, but if your dealing with physical abuse inside your church it's time to find a new one and possibly seek legal assistance
It's kind of what they say about marriage...a wife should just stick around and keep getting hit in the hopes that one day her patience and submission will bring him around. I've actually heard this preached.
Yeah, it's odd that all these new creations washed clean by Christ seem to behave just as, or more, appallingly than the 'sinners'.
@ianchisholm5756
As a Christian that makes a lot of sense for 2 reasons
Sanctification is a marathon not a sprint, there's improvement with time and patience
Some people become Christian for non spiritual reasons, and are just going through the motions
It's not my place to say who those people are, but it is a biblical reality
@@bignoob1790 Hmmm...I don't buy that one.
1) Sanctification may be a marathon, but even in a marathon one gets closer to the end, and finishes. The bible insists that these people are being transformed "daily," and yet even after years or decades they're basically the same. A transformation that is indistinguishable from nothing is not a marathon, it's paralysis.
2) Maybe some are faking it...but that doesn't escape the problem. Either we have to accept that nearly everyone in the pews is a fake, and therefore are going to hell by surprise (how would they even know?), or this "holy spirit" doctrine is bunk.
Some of us left because of those who didn't. And then they proved us to have been correct.
ohh well said, Jenna!
If God does exist and loves us why would it care if you lost your faith or not! if my kids lost faith in me, maybe I'd look at why and not blame them!
To be fair, something going wrong can be the catalyst for questioning faith, but never the reason for leaving.
if god could act in the same way as even a barely decent human parent, i might still be a christian.
Unfortunately many human parents act like God: assume fault in their child and lash out in retribution at any criticism
@@MindShift-Brandonso much of my most immediate reasons for not being in the faith could be summed up as “the god they claim exists fails spectacularly to meet the standards I’d set for a human.”
@@coruscantaIt seems to me that if God really existed and wants a relationship with me I would be hearing from him directly. Either it is simply awful at communicating or it doesn't really give hoot or it doesn't exist. The thing that burns my britches is that supposedly it is so powerful that it could create the whole universe from nothing and yet it sends out a signal so weak I am unable to detect it.
Rude or racist employees would make me never want to come back to an establishment again. I don't think I'm bitter because of that.
People don't usually leave the Church and religion because of a single bad experience, it's that the bad experience made them remove their religion glasses that makes you excuse away everything bad, and made them look at their beliefs critically.
The bad experience is what triggers a more profound examination of the religion without starting with the presupposition that everything it teaches is good and right, and religious people just seem to have a really hard time understanding that. Probably because of the religion glasses.
ah, well put! yes it works together.
Exactly!! This was the combination that snapped me out of the indoctrination!
Religion is a deep emotional commitment. For me, being a persistent (read: stubborn) soul, even more so. It took me years and years to finally be willing to step outside the christian bubble and examine my own religion the same way I would examine any other...and THAT is what put an end to my belief. Atheist for five years now, and thankful.
@@njhoepner interesting point. I wonder if the fact that I have autism and can step back and separate myself from overly emotional content and think rationally is what helped me start to distance myself from religion.
@@arkbien9303 That could be an advantage of being a certain distance along the spectrum. For most of us putting the emotional pull aside - especially when reinforced by the social acceptance pull - is very difficult.
When I finally came to the conclusion that I no longer believed, I was scared and felt heartbroken. I cried and it hurt.
When I went from beliver to non believer it seemed like a fairly short timeframe. It was actually tears in the making, clinging to my faith with an iron grip hoping I'd not be lead astray. Leaving a faith is a long and very painful process
indeed it is for so many of us.
Yes! I had to get therapy for it 😢
❤️
Yes! I don’t think believers get it because they haven’t been open to questioning their faith in such a way before. Once I realized the whole religion didn’t make sense and how much evidence there was that it was manmade and contradictory, there was no way to go back to believing it anymore. I was so terrified of losing my faith for a while-it was extremely hard to unwind the mental gymnastics and emotional attachment I had, but once I did, the world felt so much more clear and REAL. The peace of letting it go was incredible and a feeling I never felt while I was a believer.
I kept asking myself, how could I EVER have gotten so SNOWED.
Excellent video! I grew up in a church that is notorious for demeaning people who leave, so this really spoke to me.
Thank you very much and so sorry to hear that!
I know exactly what you mean!
Yes, I completely agree that educational videos like this are soooooo important.
Fighting ignorance and misinformation is one of the biggest fights this world has.
I've done a lot of soul searching on the subject of deconstruction (deconverting) ...what I know is, after reading the Bible all the way through like someone reads a long novel, it hit me that every page was man constructed, misogynistic, endorsed slavery, full of contradictions and historical inaccuracies. And, I asked myself if I thought the majority of Scripture was divinely written..the answer was NO. Once I saw it, I couldn't unsee it.
I was raised in Catholic school, church every week, pray before dinner and bed, I got communion but before confirmation my parents asked us if we wanted to keep going to church and I was kind of apathetic toward it so I said “not really” and that was that. I never asked why they didn’t care because it wasn’t that big a deal. This was in the 80s so way before atheist UA-cam or abuse scandal. Nothing bad happened. We just weren’t that into it.
In my early teens a few years later I deconstructed and thought about it a lot and decided I was an atheist. And then I really didn’t think much about it for 20 years until Christian nationalism became blatant a few years ago and I learned more about religion now than I did as a kid and it’s so much less believable than I thought it was
I wonder how many people who self-identify as Catholics in surveys are actually “cultural” Catholics. You know, people who keep up with the basic traditions and go to church on Christmas but otherwise live completely secular lives and don’t actively believe in the god of the Bible.
I agree It is concerning that the thinking of Christians goes from: "you are a true believer God has great plans for you." When you believe. To: "you never believed and never a Christian." When you stop believing.
Thanks!
Thanks so much for the support!
Comparing my personal beliefs and experiences in christianity with those of other religions is the main reason I stopped believing. But when I found out about all the coverups for CSA in churches, the growing christian fascism in the US, and all of the illogical fallacies and manipulations christians do to nonchristians- that all made me want to further distance myself from christianity.
When a religion tells you you’re born inherently evil, it’s extremely damaging and brings down self esteem. It makes you feel lower than dirt. I enjoy this world and life I’ve been given and I love being alive. I do what I can to be kind to others. I follow Jesus teachings more spiritually than dogmatically.
If you don't already have a liberal-minded church which welcomes you, you may want to check out Rev. Ed. Trevors who is active on UA-cam. I'm not trying to convert you, I'm an atheist. However, Rev. Trevor's is the kind of Christian that I respect. Since you indicated you still believe but have felt unwelcome, this may be a friendly community for you. Just a suggestion. So many of the Christians online are deplorable, so I think it's fair to note the good ones.
@@pcoleman1971I am the same. Jesus was a spiritual teacher. He even talked against yahweh. And preachers think yahweh is the true and rightful god. He's not. So no. We aren't interested in any christian dogma
I was a practicing Christian till my late 30s, most of my friends were Christians and none of them, none of the folks from the church, ever asked my why. Why did I leave the faith. They never came at me with curiosity as to why. I’m still friends with a small number of them and they’ve NEVER ASKED. It blows my mind.
yes same! its like they dont want to have to deal with the fact it may be valid to leave
Y'all complain when they question you and y'all complain when they don't. This UA-camr just pinned another person's post who said that Christians shouldn't question them for leaving. Maybe, just maybe, your Christian friends have heard a similar sentiment. So, now they are just respecting your decision which they presume may be a personal one.
@@NP70se Why would you think we don't like when people ask us our reasons? That's literally this whole channel.
Because deep down they KNOW why!
@@Volleyball_Chess_and_Geoguessr Because someone else posted that people should not be questioned for leaving.
I'm fighting with leaving my church. I have been a lifelong member but was lied to, lied about, shunned, and after speaking to the pastor and deacons, I realized I was the only one using the Bible to support my position. The person who lied began shunning my daughter in the youth group and then excluding her outright; my parents are now being shunned. Not over Biblical teaching but the narcism of one person and the desire to protect him from his bad behavior of being a liar. I will never leave my faith, but I have no use for a building filled with people who don't love their brothers and sisters in Christ; it is no longer a church. It's a social club.
Excellent video! My main reason for leaving Christianity altogether was reading the Bible cover to cover without bias and I realized how ridiculous it all was. Yes I was hurt by my home church, hurt by many Christians, and abused while using the Bible against me however, the reason why I no longer believe was because I actually did my own research and none of it made sense to me anymore. When they ask me, I tell them yes, the church did hurt be but ultimately I left because the Bible doesn’t make enough sense for me to believe in it anymore. They realize they can’t shame me with the “church hurt narrative” and just walk away…
It’s so dismissive and disrespectful for Christians to poke fun or shame you for leaving the church because of church hurt. I don’t think they truly understand that it pushes people further away when they have this attitude. It has nothing to do with saving souls, it has everything to do with being in an exclusive club while harassing those who don’t want membership in 🤷🏽♀️
Re: The McDonald's analogy. Driving around town late at night, we stopped in a high crime area. The car died and could not be restarted. We had the car towed to the dealership service department and left the car in the "early morning" drop off spot, and took a cab home. In the morning, the service department called us, "We have examined your car. It is in perfect working condition. Please come and pick it up" and told us the cost of the service fee. Later that day, another mechanic took several hours to find a hairline crack in the distributor cap that had caused the car to act unpredictably.
That is exactly the same feeling of "being offended" that made me leave the church. With the car, it was once. With the religion, however, it was time after time.
Comparing bad service to telling me I'm a worthless sinner...hmmm, that's a tough one.
It took decades. Lots of various churches. And, finally, reading the bible from front to back by myself with no study guide or explanation. Just my 40 year old adult brain to think about what I was reading. To finally decide that I was no longer Christian. I just can not follow the god the bible describes.
Same here.
yup!!
I thankfully haven't had a bad experience with the church. However, after having read the Bible multiple times over my life, I just don't believe that Christianity represents capital "T" Truth.
Same!!!!
This is nonsense.
I wish that my family was interested in why I left Christianity. They think that it's just because I am queer, and I tried to explain to them that it was only a small part of it. They don't listen to me.
Ive been of 4 different denominations, The last one, Friends Church, was very good and they know I am transgender and even told me Im welcome back (I cant because of distance) the Baptists were ...they were good at first but turned bad when I pointed at something I didnt like in the church. i still have a few friends form that church. The Methodists, some were nice some werent but I have several friends from the Methodist church. The first church, Disciples, well i was about 5.
I get that, I’m LGBT+ too and my family thinks the same thing about why I don’t talk about Christianity anymore. They don’t get that the rejection I felt for just being myself was the first step that pushed me to begin my journey. I wanted to understand how and why Christians believed being queer was so bad … once I started really looking into the logic of the entire religion, the whole thing collapsed like a house of cards.
Going to different churches wouldn’t bring my faith back-trust me, I tried.
@@artisticflower because in their feeble minds, queers can't breed cannon-fodder for the armies of the 'Lord'.
@@artisticflower I tried that too!
@@artisticflower *hugs*
Spent 16 years in the church. 5 years old until 21. Read the entirety of the Bible at age 18 and spent 3 years trying to justify the stories of the Bible and searching for biblical history/accuracy. After taking elective courses in early mesopotamian history I learned of the Akkadians and other pre-Isrealite religions and saw way too many stories that predated the Bible that it drew inspiration from. Took me years to finally admit to myself the the global flood was a myth as well as the exodus of Moses.
The accuracy of a fastfood order doesn't determine the ETERNAL FATE of my soul.
It's a coping mechanism. It's easier to believe that something is wrong with you than you then that they might be wrong.
Exactly
One of the first steps of forming your sense of empathy is accepting the fact that you may not be as good of person as you think you are. Unfortunately, that’s where the cognitive dissonance comes from. Christian extremists don’t believe they’re actions can be bad because they believe they’re on the side of “good.”
My mother does this. To this day she believes the church or her hurt me and I'm taking it out on God. When I disagree and say it's for logical reasons, she says she knows my mind better than I do.
She does know you better than you. Your insatiable appetite for sin and desperate unwillingness to say "no" to even the most depraved of desires clouds your ability to think, judge, and accurately see yourself. Your god, being your stomach (Phil 3:19), shapes how you perceive reality. Every thought is guided by these appetites, so it's impossible for you to see reality if reality contradicts these appetites. Until you accept Jesus and repent of all your depravity (and sincere repentence means in your heart but also publicly - to all the Christians whom you've been gaslighting), your thinking will continue to be clouded.
Let go of the fears and dogmas. If that's the response than their love is conditional. Ultimately is between choosing to be correct or live a loving life.
@@somexp12wtf?? How condescending and invalidating that response was. You ought to feel ashamed, but I’m sure you don’t, so instead of asking you to try and understand the perspective of people who don’t believe like you, I’ll say this: people like you are great confirmation for us atheists of why we left religion in the first place. Your smug, holier-than-thou attitude stinks, and honestly you’re wasting your time and energy in these spaces trying to “exhort” non believers. Those tactics don’t fly outside the church, friend … they just make you look like a jerk.
I’m sad to hear that youve had to experience that from your own mother. Christians always seem to think we leave for emotional or relational reasons because they have trouble wrapping their minds around the fact that people can logically question why they believe in a religion and come to the conclusion that Christianity is manmade and doesn’t make much sense.
My deconstruction story is, i just stopped going to church, no Christians telling me I was never a true Christian, no strawmanning, no nothing, i just stopped going and, nobody seems to care
I hear you. Church is so boring, I just can't understand why more people don't make this comment.
"Why are they really leaving?"
... To make the most of life?
Some of them try very hard to break you down on your way out. They want to be the ones bringing to fruition, in the absence of an actual God to do the job, the threats that God is going to get you and bring you to your knees if you leave.
fear is really all they got. They dominated because to be ostracized from your community could well destroy your life. Im sure many just went along to get along, there was no other (plausible) choice
how very telling. always pain and fear for control purposes. what a good god.
My mother has years telling me to come to the lord with love and not with the lord punishing me to come to him. I already told her I can
suffer everything in the world and would never worship that god.
Some just pray that you return. Out of genuine love.
@@raymondcampusano2991 Never say never!
It has been said, “Any reason for leaving Christianity is a good one!”
Your content is ALWAYS so rich with logic, wisdom and LOVE. I cherish being a subscriber to your channel.
The comments on this video are freaking gold!! ❤
"Um, have you tried talking to Jesus about this?" LOL that was my favorite. 😂😂
I did. I saw him in a mall. I shouted this English "djeeeezus", but Yeshua just kept walking. It was weird :- )
Churches kicked Jesus out decades ago.
He was too poor, hungry, naked, least....
he got a job landscaping
True that.
Thank you, sir, for your content. It serves as one of the great podiums for what churches are not telling their congregations.
Brandon, I've never seen you come across as bitter. Ever. Occasionally annoyed, frustrated, sure, but with good reason :)
I think he’s just frustrated, that’s all. I don’t see it as bitter, just annoyed maybe. Justifiably so.
@@BorisTheRed even the frustration is because of his compassion.
Thats kind of you to say. Thank you!
@@MindShift-BrandonI agree! Not one ounce of bitterness whatsoever! If anything you seem confident, calm and willing to teach! I appreciate this channel so much ✊🏽
Bitterness is a thought-stopping buzzword
Oh boy, the thing that hurts my tummy so bad is how judgemental Christians are!!!
Same
This is what scares me about Christian Nationalism and mandating the Bible/Ten Commandments in public school. The reason why all the different denominations get along more or less peacefully in this country is that they are all equal under the law. No one church has power over the others. But let a "Christian Nation" be established and look out, the most dominant group will turn on all the others. Mandated Protestant Bible readings and prayer in public schools was what drove the Catholics to start their own parochial schools, because their rights were being violated. That's right. Up until around 1965 Catholics were forbidden on pain of mortal sin (which means you are going straight to hell, do not pass Go, do collect $200) to take part in ANY kind of Protestant service INCLUDING readings from a Protestant Bible and Protestant prayers). Now I know a lot of you will say big deal because hell doesn't exist. But it is very much a big deal to those who feel that they are being forced to take part in something they don't agree with. And that's just Protestant versus Catholic. Forget about those who aren't even Christian at all!
I had a conversation yesterday with someone who brought up this subject and I said to them, "First of all, do you believe Catholics are Christian?" He hemmed and hawed and said, "I really don't want to say." This person is a Baptist. I said "ok, then, have you ever had your Christianity questioned? Have you ever had someone tell you that you are not a Christian because of the church you attend?" He said, "No." I said, "Well, I have, MANY, MANY, MANY times. Because I was a Catholic. Because I went to the 'wrong' church. I was not considered a Christian even though I had been brought up to believe that I was a Christian, that my church told me I was a Christian, but no, I was not really a Christian. Not really one of you. So you will forgive me when I say this kind of talk scares me." He said that he didn't really blame me but the fact that he dodged the question on whether Catholics are Christian is quite revealing. I said I have never met a group of people who were more intent on determining who is and who isn't a Christian than Christians themselves and these are precisely the kind of people I do not want to be in power over me or anyone else.
100! The church is very abusive, both emotionally and physically. I know firsthand as my married pastor tried to sleep with me. When it was found out, he got to keep his job (by this time he was in a different church) and the church kept it very hush hush. Most people that went there at that time have no idea it even happened. And to top it off I was told by someone in the church that it was none of my business how it was being handled. After all of that, I still stayed for years!! I didn’t leave until around 23 and it happened when I was in high school!! But now, when people find out about it, it never fails that I get hit with the whole “you have to follow Jesus, not men” remark. Ugh. It’s all just so emotionally abusive looking back.
McDonald's will usually try to correct your order if something was done wrong.
The Church only changes when it gets dragged _kicking and screaming_ into something closer to modern morality.
You know who's supposed to understand me leaving the church? God.
He didn't stop me, so I'm to assume that it's okay. And if the God of the Bible were real, then I would expect Romans 8:38 to hold up. It didn't. And I'm here, free from the confusion and hypocrisy of religion.
😊
This guy just did a video on celestial beings being God's slaves. And yet he pins your comment about God *not* stopping you from leaving the faith.😏
As for Romans 8:38-39, it doesn't include, nor myself. So nothing in the world can separate you from God, but you.
@@NP70se and your point?
@@NP70se And I don't understand your reasoning for Romans 8:38-39 not including "you or me". That's ridiculous. If there's "nothing" that can separate me from the love of God, then I would expect any thoughts of me leaving would be a clue for him to step up his game. My point was that he's not real and if he were that I'd expect more from the Almighty than he should expect from lowly me.
@@NP70seif you can’t see how liking(notably *not pinning*) a comment expressing what this comment does is not in the slightest in contradiction with the video about celestial slavery, then I’m concerned about how you’re interacting in these spaces, how much attention you’re paying to the things you talk about and respond to.
@@NP70se and I think you're in the wrong video anyway. This is on leaving the church and coping with people blaming us when it's god not following through, leading to the conclusion that it might not be true.
McDonald`s doesn`t claim that Ronald McDonald died to get my order right. I don`t have to wait in line for one to three hours to get my food while listening to the store owner tell me I ordered wrong. I don`t have to listen to McDonald`s fans tell me I`m evil for going to Burger King... oh, wait, that part is true!
Ronald McDonald died for your hunger… He is fighting the Hamburgler for your soul! Grimace said “Ronald died so that you may have delicious, crispy fries 🍟, and that your Super Size Coke 🥤 shall never go empty…” Grimace 4:20
Nah, BK is delicious!
Saint Ronald's Church. Your order will be ready in the afterlife.
What an absolutely asinine and inaccurate comparison.
Comparing a McDonalds order to the offer of eternal life is so empty headed. 🙄🙄
@@X-Cactus stfu it literally NOT REAL 😂😂
Hey Brandon
Lovely to see you, watching now 😅
Thank you much for always being here!
I was hurt by people in my local church. Actually, it happened in two churches, but I didn't leave, at least not right away. In a couple cases 'church' left me. Nevertheless, I was still a believer. This went on for years. Then I came out as gay. Church (people) really left me then. Yet I was still a believer. I joined the gay Christian Network. This inspired more bible study to reconcile me faith with my sexuality. Then my view of the bible changed. I saw the impossibility of Genesis, The Flood, Moses and the Exodus. The foundation of my Faith turned to smoke, and my Faith went with it. That's when I became an atheist. being hurt didn't cause me to leave, rational thinking did.
thanks for sharing. That darn thinking will do it everytime.
As a friend of mine once said, children need myths, adolescents need heroes-adults need facts.
So spot on and well done, Brandon. And as far as your assessment of yourself, which is a difficult thing to do accurately I agree 100% with the way you perceive yourself all you do is educate without pushing and indoctrinated narrative.
Thank you so much, Jeff!
The number one reason for why people have been leaving the faith is, drum roll....the internet, youtube, the logical people explaining how idiotic religion really is. That's why they would love to control the content.
Awareness and finally being challenged to critically think. Yes, indeed.
... but, historically (and even today), the number one reason people leave is because they look beyond the surface level, usually in their adulthood, and discover the ridiculousness of the religion. More people talking about the ridiculousness is certainly a catalyst for some folks.
That's one reason that so many Christians home school or send their children to private schools. The goal is to control what information a person has access to.
I have no animosity against the majority of people in my faith tradition. Most are good, loving, genuine, some even “holy” , people.
I continued to learn, came to new conclusions, “Seek the truth and it will set you free.” Ironically…
My cognitive dissonance caught up with me. I moved along.
Peace be with you
@armandolarade7861
No I'm pretty Libertarian, and I believe the Christian side has the better arguments
Thanks Brandon. Personally I stopped going to my last church because it wasn’t particularly friendly or engaging. I hadn’t made any friends there. I then spent 6 years out of church but still in the faith, until finally deconverting. I’m really fortunate in that at that point I didn’t have any church community to lose.
I recently commented on videos posted on different channels about scriptures that were used directly in the content creators videos. The excuses were a bit comical. I was told I wasn't seeing what I read or I need to repent because of the questions I asked. My favorite was the long time classic, "You're not supposed to question God." Whether it was the content creator or commenters, it's been attempted personal attacks or opinions. But no answers. Too many of these folks are posting religious based content that they themselves don't even understand and turn out to be unhelpful themselves.
McDonald's doesn't demand you blindly accept that your burger will resurrect after you crap it out.
It's the reason I close the lid before I flush, holy crap.
McDonald's doesn't demand 100% fealty for life. Policing every thought, every act, the twisting back and forth between forgiveness and guilt, etc. etc. etc.
and they are willing to give you a burger in THIS life.
Thank you so much for making these videos that help me think through this transition. Leaving a high control fundamentalist church was in no way easy. I gave up my community and can't talk to half my family and friends now. I had to leave my job that I got through the church. I didn't make that decision lightly. I made it when I knew that I no longer believed and couldn't pretend to be a believer.
My pleasure! thanks for watching!
There was a study done of people that left the church versus people that joined the church. They found that the process of leaving
The church usually took place over years and involved a conflict between what they were told and what their intellect told them.
On the other hand people who joined the church often did it based on one emotional incident that triggered something. It was based on a feeling.
Belief happens in an instant, and it's NOT based on a feeling. We believe God gave us the provision for eternal life. That has nothing to do with my feelings. It has everything to do with "I want life, I believe the Gospel."
It has nothing to do with "church" either. I don't attend a church. I believe in Christ and His Gospel, His offer of only relying on Him for eternal life, as I cannot earn it myself.
Focusing on "church" is a distraction and a null point.
You're 100% right. Believers don't understand that a good number of deconverts left because they studied, they asked hard questions and got no answers or shallow ones, and they came to logical conclusions that the religion was based on false presuppositions and mythology.
This happened to me - I learned more and realized the whole thing was false.
I do not believe that religion is evil - I think belief can be helpful IF it makes you a better person, then that's great. I'm all for it.
But most of the time, religion stops critical thinking, encourages bigotry and tribalist mentalities, and gives you a false sense of spirituality and superiority.
That's why I don't believe. They just like telling people that they stopped because of hurt, or because their church wasn't welcoming.
I’m so glad you’re covering this topic! How hypocritical for a group of people that are always accusing us of misrepresenting them or taking things out of context have no shame whatsoever in misrepresenting us.
Obviously as an ex-believer, I understand that they’re under this echo chamber groupthink. It just goes to show the potency of conditioning within this particular cult
yes exactly. Thanks!
Outstanding! You are speaking whats been in my heart for many years. Well done. Thanks🇨🇦🙏✝️
My pleasure. Thanks so much for being here!
Every time I go to McDonald's they abuse my children. But I LOVE Big Macs!
lol!!
😂😂😂
I didn't want to leave the church 😢I lost all my friends, my support group. 😪 I just actually read the Bible (especially old testament) and couldn't do it anymore.
yup! this is the case for so many of us, thats why it irritates me so much when they diminish our experiences for their own sense of security.
@@soulinameatsack29
There are answers to the tough questions
McDonald's doesn't demand 10% of my wealth and a large chunk of my life with the threat of eternal torment for the promise of a burger after I die.
Your list of questions at the end is spot on. I'd love to hear those answered
Sometimes bitterness is the natural result of interacting with self righteous and deceptive religious groups.
Nothing for anyone to be ashamed of, as shame is merely another stock weapon from a churches large and loaded "arsenal of love""
People need to stop pretending that being hurt in church is not a legitimate reason to leave - not just the church, but to leave the faith entirely.
They always say “it’s a relationship.” Yeah, and being hurt in a relationship can be a very good reason to end that relationship.
“But it wasn’t God who hurt you, it was people!” Yeah, then he let them do it. Why would I want to continue a relationship with someone who allows their children to do such terrible things to people and does nothing about it?
They are basically just telling you "Be with us or you're doomed forever". If we go by your argument, then it would still be a relationship.
A toxic one.
Like, look at the parallels. They make you believe you are worthless without god and that you're evil if you leave him in order to make you scared of them so you'll stay and let them torture you for their own benefits.
And to be honest:
That's just not a relationship I would want to be in!
I took a break from the church I used to go to, because they didn't follow the things they taught. I was still a devout Christian, I was hurt by that particular church, but I had every intention of going elsewhere. During that process, I realized my belief was so intertwined with their dogma, I needed to deconstruct to figure out why I believed Christianity was true; I needed my own epistemic foundation.
Now I'm an atheist, because it turns out, there's not much objective evidence upon which to build a foundation in the first place.
Your videos have helped me realize that my deconstruction has been far more complicated than I thought. I went no contact with my mother two years ago and it still bothers me that she claims to love me, but fully believes that I am going to hell and honestly doesn't give a crap about who I am as a person.
1 John 2:19 "They went out from us, but they were not of us" etc , etc. I think those verses are a source of the "O you were never really saved, you were never a real Christian" attitude and mindset. Great video, keep it rolling there Brandon.
Hi Brandon. You don't have a single bitter cell in your body. You are just a decent , moral man. Keep up the good thinking.
A Christian comparing God to McDonald's getting your order wrong is crazy, right? Like, they throw fits when we do that kind of blasphemy, right?
“I might try a different McDonald’s or maybe even go to Burger King instead” is actually a really cool addition to that metaphoric comparison, cuz if you think about it, if I don’t like a church (McDonald’s franchise), my first step is to try another church of the same religion. If/when that one doesn’t vibe with what I believe is right, I might try a different religion altogether (Burger King).
Or you could go to Taco Bell.
McDonalds won't torture me for eating Wendy's
But they will say "we'll make you welcome". Great video.
My deconversion had zero to do with anything any person said or did. It was an entirely intellectual pursuit on my part and was intended to strengthen my faith. However, the reaction of some believers after I came out as an atheist certainly doesn't help their case.
I can relate, in some ways it ended up being “you aren’t why I left, but you’re certainly making that more right than it might’ve been.”
yep. I had to study my way out of that darkness
@@coruscanta
lol so true
As always thanks for the content Brandon and thanks for coming to the defense of nonbelievers. I left the faith 20 years ago after meeting my now husband who grew up in a non religious household and had much better arguments than mine for the truth of the all powerful Flying Spaghetti Monster. My faith dictated that my soulmate was damned to an eternity of punishment and suffering which was a concept I could never really wrap my head around anyway. I came to realize that I wouldn’t wish eternal punishment on my greatest enemy let alone someone I claimed to love, no matter how badly they might wrong me and if I as a flawed, selfish, and “sinful” creature had a higher moral compass than that of my all benevolent creator God than that god was a contradiction in terms and I just could no longer believe in it.
If Jesus makes people like this I don’t want anything to do with him or his religion. Where is their Christian love?? Where?? Why do we scare them??
"Why do we scare them??"
the leaders? The money you do NOT donate scares them.
the sheeple? You don't scare them. Their past0r does by lying about you.
I seem to sense more relief than bitterness from the deconstructed.
Its very close to how abusers act when the focus of their abuse escapes their control. The Church is a scam, and must hate those who refuse to be scammed anymore.
At least the people at McDonald's will apologize and fix the issue.
We spend too much time worrying about what “they” think. Once we give up the need to defend and explain the shackles fall off.
Well, this ex Christian simply got fed up with coping with the cognitive dissonance between the rhetoric in church and what we now know to be the case via scientific investigation. I also didn't like the way that all weddings and funerals were effectively just standard church services with a grudgingly little bit about the person/people involved shoe-horned in.
Secular services (including my own son's wedding) are far more about the individuals involved; and consequently far more meaningful.
In the 2021 UK census the number of people identifying as Christian fell below 50% for the first time in history, with 'no religion' following a close second. With a 'closing speed' of 25% between Christian and secular since the previous census in 2011, the positions will inevitably have reversed by 2031.
Even those identifying as Christian seemed to have very weird ideas and probably only meant it culturally. For instance, very few actually believed in original sin (from follow-up surveys) and others were just vaguely deist and did not believe in a personal god.
It took me 40 years to leave the lies. Crawling on my hands and knees!
I really like the questions you bring up here. "What DOES it take before you think it's ok to leave?" or questioning why the church isn't the model of kindness and loving and selflessness. It also doesn't help when you have people who say things like, "If your 10 year old is SA'ed and impregnated, God wanted that so that's why you're NOT ALLOWED to get an abortion." If I was ever religious, that would DEFINITELY get me to look at those people sideways because that's so messed up. And all you really have to do is remember that Yahweh flooded the entire earth and what that actually means in terms of not just body count but the types of bodies.
Hey bro. Longest McDonald's visit for me was about 30 minutes. Church I grew up in lasted 3 hours, not counting Sunday School and the time in between.