CFmoto 450 MT Water in Subframe.
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- Опубліковано 13 вер 2024
- Warning Flashing light, the camera unfortunately picked up the led flash. There is no use in people saying to get rid of it, you can't without redoing video. After hearing reports of Water in the Subframe I decided to investigate my own bike. I show taking off Subframe bars and treating them . This is to prevent rusting in the future.
Thanks a lot dear Bazz.. interesting and useful to know.. my proposal would be to fill the tubes with poliurethane glue, the one used with timber, since it reacts with moisture and it expands, filling the inner tube volume and preventing water to come in and find available space to stay
Very, very interesting contribution. He shared the problem with us well. I was also thinking about buying this particular motorcycle. Thanks again!
@slobodanstojanovic5521 Thanks , I love the bike but just wanted to show preventative maintenance.
@@bazz6670 👍
I´ll keep my Crf300L
Japanese Quality ❤
I'm thinking of drilling a measured (drain) hole at the lowest point of the sub-frame, draining out any exiting water, spraying the inside of the subframe with a rust inhibiter, sealing the holes that are allowing the water to enter, then screwing in a stainless-steel screw (self-tapper) into the measured hole I drilled. This will allow me to periodically remove the SS screw to drain out any water that may have got in (hopefully none since I sealed the other holes) and prevent any mud and crap getting into the drain holes while out on the trail. On another matter, perhaps you could spray WD40 onto those header pipes and scrub with a green scotchbrite scourer to get that crud off.
Ha le heggeszted a jukat kész is szerintem!! Se víz se korrózió!!!!
@@KZ0783 Welding closed the holes would work but not everyone has a welder.
That could work, or you could use a rubber grommet.
If the squashed end around the mount hole has a gap (both at the end of the arm and around the circumference of the hole) then some moisture may still get in through capillary action, even if you weld the cable/hose mount holes. A drain hole (with screw) and some decent corrosion inhibitor seems a better and easier remedy than welding.
why not fill with expanding foam
Yikes! Who would have thought? Good fix mate, I'm sure it will protect it just fine 🙂 Stay upright mate!
@@in2ADV Thanks Petros, its no big deal as people make out.
Good bit of info there. I like the bike, it has plenty of good things written about it but will hold off buying one for a bit longer to see how they go long term.
Nice one Bazz, the cut down Allan key is genius. I think I am going to drill a whole at the lowest point of each subframe member so it can self drain, I will blow compressed air in, then rust inhibitor, I will do my best to seal the existing holes to help reduce water ingress.
Thanks David, that should work.
surely that would be a warranty claim...its it supposed to have a flooding Hull like an Avon Sea rider RIB
Make sure you remove the burr caused by the drill….you can get a special file for this that fits your drill.
I'm sure a refined replacement part will come and won't be expensive 👍
Good to share those issues Bazz. Alot of interesting comments. I'd be wondering if drilling a drain hole becomes problematic with warranty.
This 450MT is getting so much attention, it's amazing.
👍😊
@bobdrakeford5731 Thanks Bob, not sure about a warranty issue. People are thinking it, it's happened on other bikes I've had. The bike really is quite popular.
Gracias por mostrar ese problema de la MT. Incluso los japoneses, tendrían que tomar ejemplo en cuanto a diseño y equipamiento de serie. Habrá que esperar a ver su fiabilidad a largo plazo. Para motos nuevas con "problemas de juventud" importantes los que he tenido con las BMWs. (De pesadilla). Estas nuevas motos chinas, tienen actualmente una relación calidad precio muchísimo mejor que las fiables pero caras japonesas. Esta MT, si hubiera salido como 490 Adventure y con la marca austriaca KTM, probablemente, hubiese salido con algún caballo más, algún kilo de menos, pero algo más costosa. Y de las marcas alemanas no quiero oír ni hablar.
La CFMoto MT 450, posee potencia, buen equipamiento de serie, larga autonomía, actualizaciones vía app de móvil, tubeless, buena ergonomía, pantalla ajustable, tomas de energía, escape alto, capacidad de carga, subchasis desmontable, estriberas, cambio, y espejos retráctiles, suspensiones Kayaba largas solventes y adecuadas para uso mixto, electrónica comedida, altura de asiento polivalente desde solo 80 a 87 centímetros, filtros fácilmente accesibles, me parece bonita y sobre el papel buenos materiales y acabados honestos. Es casi perfecta. Solo le falta ofrecer Quickshifter y color verde que me encanta para moto trail. 😀Incluso los japoneses, tendrían que tomar ejemplo en cuanto a diseño y equipamiento de serie. Los fabricantes occidentales y japoneses, ya no quieren fabricar motos así de buenas y sencillas. (KLEs, XTs, DRMs-Zs, DRs, Pegasos, Gesitas monocilíndricas, etcétera).
Creo que solo la KTM 390 Adventure, la Honda CB500X y la RE Himalayan II, están a la altura de la MT, aunque con distintos enfoques. Voge 500 DSX y Benelli TRK creo son más pesadas y asfálticas. Esta CFMoto 450 MT no es moto endurera, como mucha gente afirma, sino trailera asfáltica, con algunas buenas posibilidades camperas. Con algo de dinero se pueden camperizar mucho más. Como las KTM 390 Adv, pero en mi opinión, siguen siendo motos muy pesadas para los estándares del off road duro. Me encanta esa 450 MT y cuando dentro de un año venda mi KTM 390 Adv, que ya tendrá cuatro años y 30.000 km, creo que será la primera de la lista con posibilidades de ir a mi casa.
Un saludo desde España para todos los moteros de bien.
This small detail "speaks volumes"! Everything is there just to copy (as they did) and didn't paid attention to a small thing like this.
@candro5510 probably not something many would think about. A lot of thought has gone into the bike with features people wanted.
@@bazz6670 I would not go that far with the praising. There are plenty of bike models to relate to / to copy from. To be picky, they "invented" that subframe and did it poorly. "105" years ago, Japanese bikes were copying European and USA brands but, overall, all were at the beginning of the road "technology wise". Nowadays, there is plenty of experience and available technology for "copy-paste". Choosing from steel work area/domain we will see how it will cope with aging = steel, aluminum, rubber (gaskets) and plastics. I bought "tons" of products from that particular part of the world and, too many of them end-up literally crumbling (plastic become brittle) steel not up to advertised specs, and so on.
Several years ago an Suzuki V-Strom 650, 10 years old, had the same market price as a brand new Chinese copy.
So regarding the overall investment, time will tell/confirm the quality of it.
My harley davidson m8 softail had rusty water leaking out of rear swingarm frame all the time. I was told this was normal and just spray a bit of crc and wipe it off!!
Thanks Baz. I have my new bash plate and other pieces to put on next week so I'll have a look at mine too.
@FlatBrokeAdventures good idea, finally getting my crash bars and seat this weekend.
Good job Bazz..another fella drilled holes in his, will be interesting too see how both techniques go over time 👍
@sausagesandwichSA yes I think both ways will work but I know in the past holes have filled with mud. Cheers mate.
Fish oil probably the best to inhibit rust. Used it in my car doors. Those down tubes are a similar design like the Yamaha T7. Probably a sacrificial part. so if you have a hit on the front it doesn't damage the engine and the subframe mounting points.
Ohh Bazza, c'mon mate get yourself a nozzle from Bunnings five finger job.
Personally, i wouldn't completely seal it up because youd want some condensation escaping/venting when they get hot from the engine then getting cold from river crossings/rain.
I think a drain hole at the bottom will drain any moisture & maintain using fish oil spray (with a nozzle) say every major big days out & wash.
Dont forget anti-sieze those chain adjuster bolts in the aluminium swingarm. They will rust faster than tubing.
Thanks Steve, I think I done well spraying into that little hole, I know from other bikes with holes in subframe they tend to fill up with mud and don't drain anyway. I'll just keep it simple.
I'm going to wait for 2nd gen. Hopefully the factory will fix all the problems.
@user-vd1uz3dj8l they might be the same just with drainage holes in subframe. Be interesting to see if there are any changes.
Chain lube is pretty much made for this application if you can’t find fish oil.
Great video Bazz ride safe
I think I will be tapping a hole in the lower part of the bar and using cavity wax just to prevent any deep rust accumulation
Great idea.
Good ole fish oil should do the job mate.
I'm sure it's from a bit of surface rust but the water on the right side tube is the same colour as the water at Creswick we rode through. 😅
Lol, your rite, that was a wet muddy day.
surface rust grows into rust holes and being in a moisture rich environment like tubing it will grow pretty quick unless it is treated.
This is my biggest concern with the 450MT - brand new bike and there’s rust on the subframe already.
Unless CFMoto come out with a recall for these tubes, this is a massive no go for me…
It's a very fix. Plenty of bikes have had similar problems.
@@pabloricardodetarragon2649 plenty of bikes go rusty within a couple of thousand km? I think not
Same with my 2023 BMW 1250GS!!! The MT issues is easily fixable.
It's really not a big deal, it's a removable part. If you were to spray a coating in there before it gets wet, it should never have a problem , seal the holes or drill a hole in the bottom.
Good to share Vid Thx 🙏
That Garage strobe light is very annoying.
The fish oil prevent nothing for getting water inside. You have to drill a hole at the bottom.
I know the light was annoying, first time I filmed with them. I sealed the holes so water can't get in.
@@bazz6670 Now water and condensation is trapped inside Baz; If it were my bike, I'd make the hole at the very rear of the down tube bigger and drill a smallish hole at the very top of the tube; Gravity will do the job of draining any water and circulating air will dry out any trapped moisture; I'd weld all the other holes closed or use a metal epoxy; Being Chinese, the welds probably have pin holes like they have done in both their cars and bikes of recent past; wipe a smear of metal epoxy over the welds too; Unfortunately, this will require the need for painting as well but at least you know it will last for many years.
seria echarleun producto que se usaba hace años para los coches no se oxidaran se llama dinitrol se aplica con una pistola para el interior de esos tubos del bastidor seria buena cosa,y luego le inyectaria espuma de poriuletano asi quedaria muy aislado,es una faena eso de que el agua te eentre ahi menos mal que te diste cuenta que si lo dejas mucho tiempo te come los tubos.
That oil won't help. You should dry the frame and pour in rust converter instead. Seal the hole by welding and paint the welded area.
I’d be tempted to drill a drain hole and silicone on a short hose so crap doesn’t go into the drain hole.
Used to have a Rover the boot filled with water when it rained. They gave you a little yellow rubber Duck for the boot. 😄👎🇬🇧
Ended up drilling holes through the boot.
@g4joe lol , I've had cars like that too but I didn't get a rubber ducky.
Teething problems. I remember the Africa Twin having subframe issues in the beginning. This will be sorted out.
@fantasticfox411 Yes, nothing major
i might send those frames to a stainless steel shop and have them replicate a set, that should fix the problem forever.
4:45 Be good to get a review on these bikes after a few years to see how there holding up after a few kilometres in the bush, they actually look to be pretty good quality for the price. 4:45
@Tjames579 yes it would, I've done over 3000 ks now with no issues and I seen a post a guy has done 10,000 ks in central Australia, he said the bike done great. Can't go wrong for the price. Cheers.
Thanks for the vid...you made it easy to just decide to drill the rails rather than dick around with various fasteners and cable ties. No water in mine but drain holes for if and when it happens. How wonky is that bash plate lol...I had to loosely start three bolts and pry the plate off the headers to get the fourth started
@davw495 yea if that suits you easy to just drill holes, the bars do spring a bit but if you loosen top bolts in sub frame bars it makes it easier. I have a bash plate coming for mine.
Wow. This isn’t even a mechanical part. Just a stick of metal that’s failing. Can’t wait to know what the coming years will be like
fill the sub-frame of insulation foam spray :)
"it's only surface rust so it shouldn't matter"....um, you do know that rust never sleeps don't you Baz? every rust hole you have ever seen starts as surface rust; Fish Oil does not treat rust it is only a moisture barrier; It will not stop rust from growing under it; Further, nothing adheres to rust that has not been treated or de-oxidised; all you have done is put a band aid on an infected wound; and for the record, any silicon actually accelerates rust on bare metal; if wanting to plug the holes with something from a tube, use a non-acidic body sealer or windscreen sealant; Sikaflex make good quality urethane based sealants.
I found worse on the rere swing arm on a Kawasaki ER6 😢
Why not fill the holes with sealant like sikaflex or similar.never drill holes in frames.that part of tge frame takes a lot of impact from the bashplate.
Thanks for commenting, I used similar to sikaflex. I don't really want to drill holes.
If you were to fill the holes with sikaflex sealant, do you intend to weld up the openings afterwards? If yes do you have to weld it at the very minute when it's filled with sikaflex or do you have to wait for a few hours for the sealant to dry before doing this? Thanks a lot!
It could be bad if you get freezing water in.
Yep .. that’s definitely a sign of being made by KTM , hope those cams are different
@queenslander954 lol yes I think they will be ok , the motors have been around for some time now
Always use a blower after wash
Good tip..or take it for a quick ride making sure to get the brakes at least warm; Hot is better.
Cfmoto have fixed the problem and have redirected the water to the engine oil. 😂
I would get them galvanised. Or zinc plated.. wont EVER have an issue then
That's not really a sign of a cheaply made bike, my Versys x300 also has holes in some parts of the sub frame, and i'm pretty sure that there is rust inside, i don't know why they leave those holes there but i think it's better to keep the pats sealed and somewhat treated against corrosion.
My Versys is 6 years old already and that doesn't seem to have become a problem yet.
Thank you, I knew if I made this video there would be people saying Chinese rubbish. I have had Suzuki's and Honda's rust bad in subframe. Cheers.
@@bazz6670 when drain holes get clogged, rust starts; There's a good reason why frames have holes in them; Trapped moisture in metal tubing and no air circulation equals rust; It doesn't matter where the bike was made; I will say however that the Chinese aren't known for good welding practises; They are often full of tiny pin holes...
70's and early 80's Steel Framed Kawasaki's had a bad reputation for rusting inside out; they didn't use inert gas inside the tubes as they welded and the metal itself had a very high carbon content; Rust formed at critical points inside the weld areas; Headstem tubes and footpeg mounts failed all too often;
I've owned Honda's all my life and have never seen a frame rust from the inside out; I still have several old Honda MX'ers and Trail Bikes from 1974 to 1985 and none of them have any rust issues at all;
I would of thought the Kawasaki Versy's would be aluminium framed...
Well done Mate, pleased you pick it up early. Lots of silicone is the way to go. 😎
@MRTPR cheers mate, holes are now filled.
Silicone accelerates rust on any bare metal surface.
@@twowheelin7361 I bet they are bare metal where you can't see it...on the inside. Besides that, silicon is not the right compound for the job; It is very acidic; a body sealant or metal epoxy is the go if you must fill all the holes but I believe filling all the holes is a mistake; Metal tubing needs to breathe or moisture will build up; There's a good reason why holes are made in metal frames; not my bike I know but I wouldn't be blocking the hole at the rear of the tubing...I'd actually make it bigger so there's no lip on it.
@@twowheelin7361 "It’s a replaceable part so no big deal anyway "...until you have to buy one only to find out there are none in Australia....It's your bike so you can do whatever you want with it; no skin off my nose whatsoever; I've been riding and racing bikes for over 40 years and building/restoring bikes for the last 20...I'm just trying to help
@markhills3922 yeah i drilled 2 holes for drainage and air flow at the bottom of the frame. The top hole definitely needs filling as it's a massive entry point for mud and water
Good quality Chinese engineering
That lighting. Toss that led in the garbage.
@@s13kuminachu nothing is wrong with the light it's the shutter speed of the camera picking it up.
@bazz6670 yea I know. Totally unwatchable my friend. Change it.
Remember..they are Kato’s … same old stuff 😂
Yes mate,,,, FISH OIL IS WHAT YOU NEED !
@chrispulham4779 thank you, there has been so many mixed comments about what to use and do. Bars are not rusty as yet. People seem to overreacted.
Omg !!!!
Chinese bike ?????
Absolutely crazy to see that !!
CFMOTO , Here, it begins. The quality problems..
why not spray primer and paint inside then after it gets dry some type of thick lube /grease?
No need to go that far, fish oil was used for years to prevent rusting.
@@bazz6670 fish only prevents rust before it starts Baz...it wont stop it once it has started.
Can you touch that hole with your fingers? If you can, then it should be sealed with liquid metal without removing it
I think you should be able to get to it.
Think I’d fill it with waxoyl
Saludo desde España 🇪🇦🇪🇦, mi like quiero comprar una y he visto video de este motor reprogramación de mas de 20cv
Wow that would be a huge power gain, I have not seen that video.
Es en Colombia en una 450 de carretera@@bazz6670
is it possible to seal these holes completely by welding them?
I was thinking the same thing,or maybe put some rubber plugs in the holes itself?
You could, but easier to just seal them .
what about covering those holes in order not to happen again?
I did use sealant on them.
Bad idea...tubing needs to breathe or moisture will build up.
@@markhills3922 so, a drain hole is better?
@@don_alex_97 Absolutely; the hole at the very back of the tubing should be left open; If I had one, I would make this hole the same size as the inner diameter of the tube so that any water, mud and moisture drains out easier; I would also drill a small hole (3mm) at the very top of the tubing so that air can enter the tube; Metal tubing needs to breathe or moisture will build up in it; Any other holes that are not mounting points I would weld closed or use a metal epoxy...this will require a bit of painting when done but at least you know the job is done properly and will last for many years; Just make sure that the rear hole isn't blocked whenever you wash the bike; Simple!
Taki sam stary bajker jak ja , wie co dobre , pewnie wcześcniej jeżdził GS -em który jest najdroższym Café racer-em na świecie
How are you able to live with that flickering light, I would go crazy!
It is a new led, I hadn't filmed under it before. It is just the shutter speed of camera . Led lights flick on and off but you don't see it with your eyes.
Wow, the bike whom sold out in Greece from pre orders without to be ridden….
I bought mine with a test ride, I'm really happy with it for what I want to do. The motors have been in other models for some time now.
Miért nem jut eszébe senkinek hogy be heggesze és nincs gond többet!!! 😮
That light flickering tho...
Yes, unfortunately, I was unaware of the flickering from the new led light. To late to do video again. I have since worked out a solution with camera settings. Cheers.
I used to work at cf moto dealership.... run away people, its not good.
What are the bad things out of of interest.
Chinise power 😂😂😂😂😂😂
Mt450 super lemon 🍋
Beginning to wonder ... 😮🤔
It does not make it a lemon,
CF moto offering a 4 year warranty on these is amazing. I bet most of these wont last that long if ridden hard.
Thought it was 3???
I believe it is 3 years if serviced by cfmoto.
2 years I was told.
In some markets. I believe USA is 4 years? Australia is 3 if serviced by CFMOTO
UK state 4 years. I guess it might struggle to get through 4 of our shitty arsed winters. Mind you, the summers aren't much better!
these tubes are not structural, are they? They don't seem so, so in 10 years, when this water starts to create holes, just replace the tubes, if this bike is still alive that is.