Good video. I’m running VEP on a Mac Studio with 2 old Mac minis and a 2015 MBP. I was amazed that using VEP on the main computer even without using the other computers totally saved enormous mounts of cpu. VEPro runs on a separate thread so where Logic and Cubase start to throttle cpu on complex pieces, using VEP on the same machine for all the VST instruments cut cpu to a quarter. My writing partner does the same on his custom PC.
Thanks 🙏 for posting this video! I’m in the same situation with M1 Mac Mini 16GB RAM that’s struggling. I have a gaming PC I use for 3D Rendering and will look into VEP Pro 7 to handle the heavy lifting for larger, intensive templates!
I've been following your journey since your Mac Mini purchase. I actually decided to buy my Mac Mini 16GB RAM after watching your first video about it. After a while, I also found 16GB RAM too little for the libraries and vstis I use (BBCSO PRO, HOOPUS, other Spitfire stuff, Komplete 13 Ultimate, and others). And I also thought it was a waste to leave my old POWERFUL PC unattended in the dust (i7 3700 / 64GB RAM / 4 SSDs / Ultra Silent System). But, like you, I didn't want to go back to Windows at all. So I went for VEPRO. It's a fantastic system. I setup a gigantic template. But I started to have some problems (clipped notes, connection issues between the two machines) and not to mention that is not as easy as working in only one machine. End of story: I made a more efficient and streamlined template (but still huge, about 1000+ tracks) on the Mac Mini, using Cubase's magnificent "Enable/Disable Track" tool. Certainly with a little patience, help from tech support and a few tweaks I would resolve the issues with VEPRO. But at the end of the day, the truth is that in most of the serious projects I work on (small animations, soundtracks for the theater, etc) the Mac Mini (and Cubase) in this format work with ease. And it's infinitely more practical. But if you really need gigantic orchestrations you will love working with VEPRO. Who knows, maybe later I'll try this way of working again. Congratulations on your new setup! P.S: The new OPUS purge function is fantastic! I can setup really huge orchestration projects (using only the Mac Mini) with HOOPUS with all samples purged.
Thanks for the comment! Yeah it’s been a big change and it is definitely easier working on one machine. I still do that, in fact I’d say I split about 50% of the time between using the server and not. Quick mock ups with ensemble libraries and what not I just do on the mini. When I sit down to do a whole track I use the server. Like you say, it’s not without its quirks, I’ve found BBC SO introduces weird artifacts when doing offline bounces occasionally. No idea why. Bouncing to audio at the end of a project is more of a chore with VEPRO. But I really like being able to have everything ready to go and if I need more drive storage I can just add another drive to the machine. I’ve also thought about setting up VEPRO templates for each library since I don’t mix them that often. One for BBC SO, one for HWOOPUS, etc. That way I could have the entire library loaded (still don’t have enough memory to load all libraries at once and that’s a bit overkill anyway) and just add instruments I find I need on the mini. I’ve got the cubase trial currently and I’m going to give mocking something up using that a go. If I could find another piece of software I like as much as Logic Pro I’d probably ditch Mac completely. The server would then just become my music machine. Hasn’t happened yet though.
I thought Audiogridder would help me but then I realized you can't automate on another computer, well that doesn't help me with Ableton live. I hope this helps with that.
Hi, I am setting up my system with MacBook Pro M1 and Windows Pc, sometime working great and other the instant of VEP network not show on Nuendo 12 I don't know why? but I believe that is the great system when I get it stable to work. Thank you totally agree with you. I had subscribe to your channel.
Is per-track delay compensation on the DAW side or the VEP side? e.g. when shorts in library A hit 50ms ahead of legatos in library B... I'd love to only have to think about that once.
VEP should behave like any other instrument plug-in so delay compensation should be done on the DAW side imo. It also reports latency back to the DAW so that should be automatically handled.
Hey there, just watched what you said and I’m confused. Not technically accomplishmented as you are but looking into getting a new Mac (I have iMac 2015) and can’t afford a MacBook Pro, but want more libraries, I do have how’d Opus Edition and a few free libraries, but I need help and if I purchase a new Mac mini Pro, would you suggest for me, the Vienna Pro or what? I wonder what screen monitor you have using your mini?
Hi and thanks for the comment! It sort of depends on what you find lacking with your current machine. If you are low on space an external ssd or two would allow you more space to expand your library selection. You can also free up processing resources by freezing/bouncing tracks to audio if you are having issues with playback. The new Mac Minis are great machines, and I still use mine by itself a lot, I only use VE Pro when I need all of my libraries available. For quick mock ups I often don’t use it. VE Pro is nice but it adds some complexity, so I wouldn’t recommend it for every person. A single machine is way easier to use in my opinion. They do have a trial of it available if you want to give it a try. As far as monitor I don’t have anything fancy, it’s an old dell ultrasharp 16x10 monitor. I have a tv mounted behind the desk I use sometimes as a secondary display over airplay for the Mac or as the main monitor for the VE pro server.
I’m in a similar situation with a Mac Mini M1 and an untapped Gaming PC. I use V collection, and other virtual synths. CPU and latency gets worse and worse as my projects develop. Very much an inspiration killer. How would your setup work for virtual synths like Artuia V Collection, Silynth, Phase Plant, etc., where the bottleneck would be more CPU over RAM? Also, these plugins have their own individual UI individually mappable parameters of knobs and sliders. Is any of that accessible in the client?
It would work similarly. VE pro is excellent at spreading load across multiple cores. Depending on your DAW that could contribute to it. Some just plain are not good at doing that. I’ve never really run into the limit on my minis cpu but I also don’t actually use that many synth plugins. When I do use them I run them locally on the Mac. You could try setting up a few instances in VE pro for your most used plugins, then any you want to pull in later you can run locally. That being said id probably look into if there are specific plugins that bog the system down more than others and trying to troubleshoot that before going the other route.
Don't you have to mess with disgusting Windows if you use a PC as a slave? I'm guessing that it's easier (tho' more expensive) if you use a Mac, right?
Why do you need SO many mics at the same time? It's frankly overkill. Actually all those mic positions probably make the sound more muddy. Why not stick with one or max two positions. It won't make any discernable difference to the quality of your COMPOSITIONS or ARRANGEMENTS. That's what is really important.
A fair question and the answer is I don't. Not often at least. For BBC SO as an example I often just use the second of the two mic mixes, both of which are a combination of all mic positions curated by Spitfire themselves. I only have a handful of instruments that I need to load up different mics for and even then I only use 3 or maybe 4. But there were many other reasons besides mic positions that prompted me to switch. Mic positions were just an easy way to highlight the issue I was having.
Having multiple options saves quite a bit of time particularly for quiet or subtle passages of underscore when you want to make the music sound further away and reverb options bring in too much fiddling. But, one or two mic positions at a time, absolutely. Before I stared using VEPro I’d save presets of things like SO with fewer mic positions to save ram.
Good video. I’m running VEP on a Mac Studio with 2 old Mac minis and a 2015 MBP. I was amazed that using VEP on the main computer even without using the other computers totally saved enormous mounts of cpu. VEPro runs on a separate thread so where Logic and Cubase start to throttle cpu on complex pieces, using VEP on the same machine for all the VST instruments cut cpu to a quarter. My writing partner does the same on his custom PC.
Thanks 🙏 for posting this video! I’m in the same situation with M1 Mac Mini 16GB RAM that’s struggling. I have a gaming PC I use for 3D Rendering and will look into VEP Pro 7 to handle the heavy lifting for larger, intensive templates!
I've been following your journey since your Mac Mini purchase. I actually decided to buy my Mac Mini 16GB RAM after watching your first video about it. After a while, I also found 16GB RAM too little for the libraries and vstis I use (BBCSO PRO, HOOPUS, other Spitfire stuff, Komplete 13 Ultimate, and others). And I also thought it was a waste to leave my old POWERFUL PC unattended in the dust (i7 3700 / 64GB RAM / 4 SSDs / Ultra Silent System). But, like you, I didn't want to go back to Windows at all. So I went for VEPRO. It's a fantastic system. I setup a gigantic template. But I started to have some problems (clipped notes, connection issues between the two machines) and not to mention that is not as easy as working in only one machine. End of story: I made a more efficient and streamlined template (but still huge, about 1000+ tracks) on the Mac Mini, using Cubase's magnificent "Enable/Disable Track" tool. Certainly with a little patience, help from tech support and a few tweaks I would resolve the issues with VEPRO. But at the end of the day, the truth is that in most of the serious projects I work on (small animations, soundtracks for the theater, etc) the Mac Mini (and Cubase) in this format work with ease. And it's infinitely more practical. But if you really need gigantic orchestrations you will love working with VEPRO. Who knows, maybe later I'll try this way of working again. Congratulations on your new setup! P.S: The new OPUS purge function is fantastic! I can setup really huge orchestration projects (using only the Mac Mini) with HOOPUS with all samples purged.
Thanks for the comment! Yeah it’s been a big change and it is definitely easier working on one machine. I still do that, in fact I’d say I split about 50% of the time between using the server and not. Quick mock ups with ensemble libraries and what not I just do on the mini. When I sit down to do a whole track I use the server. Like you say, it’s not without its quirks, I’ve found BBC SO introduces weird artifacts when doing offline bounces occasionally. No idea why. Bouncing to audio at the end of a project is more of a chore with VEPRO. But I really like being able to have everything ready to go and if I need more drive storage I can just add another drive to the machine. I’ve also thought about setting up VEPRO templates for each library since I don’t mix them that often. One for BBC SO, one for HWOOPUS, etc. That way I could have the entire library loaded (still don’t have enough memory to load all libraries at once and that’s a bit overkill anyway) and just add instruments I find I need on the mini. I’ve got the cubase trial currently and I’m going to give mocking something up using that a go. If I could find another piece of software I like as much as Logic Pro I’d probably ditch Mac completely. The server would then just become my music machine. Hasn’t happened yet though.
I thought Audiogridder would help me but then I realized you can't automate on another computer, well that doesn't help me with Ableton live.
I hope this helps with that.
Hi, I am setting up my system with MacBook Pro M1 and Windows Pc, sometime working great and other the instant of VEP network not show on Nuendo 12 I don't know why? but I believe that is the great system when I get it stable to work. Thank you totally agree with you. I had subscribe to your channel.
Does your secondary PC running the server have to have an audio interface?
No, it doesn’t. Mine has no audio hardware hooked up to it at all
@@thegrizzledmusician Sweet Thanks
Is per-track delay compensation on the DAW side or the VEP side? e.g. when shorts in library A hit 50ms ahead of legatos in library B... I'd love to only have to think about that once.
VEP should behave like any other instrument plug-in so delay compensation should be done on the DAW side imo. It also reports latency back to the DAW so that should be automatically handled.
Hey there, just watched what you said and I’m confused. Not technically accomplishmented as you are but looking into getting a new Mac (I have iMac 2015) and can’t afford a MacBook Pro, but want more libraries, I do have how’d Opus Edition and a few free libraries, but I need help and if I purchase a new Mac mini Pro, would you suggest for me, the Vienna Pro or what? I wonder what screen monitor you have using your mini?
Hi and thanks for the comment! It sort of depends on what you find lacking with your current machine. If you are low on space an external ssd or two would allow you more space to expand your library selection. You can also free up processing resources by freezing/bouncing tracks to audio if you are having issues with playback. The new Mac Minis are great machines, and I still use mine by itself a lot, I only use VE Pro when I need all of my libraries available. For quick mock ups I often don’t use it. VE Pro is nice but it adds some complexity, so I wouldn’t recommend it for every person. A single machine is way easier to use in my opinion. They do have a trial of it available if you want to give it a try. As far as monitor I don’t have anything fancy, it’s an old dell ultrasharp 16x10 monitor. I have a tv mounted behind the desk I use sometimes as a secondary display over airplay for the Mac or as the main monitor for the VE pro server.
I’m in a similar situation with a Mac Mini M1 and an untapped Gaming PC. I use V collection, and other virtual synths. CPU and latency gets worse and worse as my projects develop. Very much an inspiration killer.
How would your setup work for virtual synths like Artuia V Collection, Silynth, Phase Plant, etc., where the bottleneck would be more CPU over RAM?
Also, these plugins have their own individual UI individually mappable parameters of knobs and sliders. Is any of that accessible in the client?
It would work similarly. VE pro is excellent at spreading load across multiple cores. Depending on your DAW that could contribute to it. Some just plain are not good at doing that. I’ve never really run into the limit on my minis cpu but I also don’t actually use that many synth plugins. When I do use them I run them locally on the Mac. You could try setting up a few instances in VE pro for your most used plugins, then any you want to pull in later you can run locally. That being said id probably look into if there are specific plugins that bog the system down more than others and trying to troubleshoot that before going the other route.
What’s your latency? Do you notice a lag?
I don’t really notice it if it’s there. Most libraries have more latency baked into the samples than the network connection is adding.
Don't you have to mess with disgusting Windows if you use a PC as a slave? I'm guessing that it's easier (tho' more expensive) if you use a Mac, right?
Why do you need SO many mics at the same time? It's frankly overkill. Actually all those mic positions probably make the sound more muddy. Why not stick with one or max two positions. It won't make any discernable difference to the quality of your COMPOSITIONS or ARRANGEMENTS. That's what is really important.
A fair question and the answer is I don't. Not often at least. For BBC SO as an example I often just use the second of the two mic mixes, both of which are a combination of all mic positions curated by Spitfire themselves. I only have a handful of instruments that I need to load up different mics for and even then I only use 3 or maybe 4. But there were many other reasons besides mic positions that prompted me to switch. Mic positions were just an easy way to highlight the issue I was having.
Having multiple options saves quite a bit of time particularly for quiet or subtle passages of underscore when you want to make the music sound further away and reverb options bring in too much fiddling. But, one or two mic positions at a time, absolutely. Before I stared using VEPro I’d save presets of things like SO with fewer mic positions to save ram.
Build a PC.
I’ve built more than I can count. This server is one of them.
@@thegrizzledmusician Current flagships for Intel and AMD blow M1/M2 out of the water.
@@adownbeatexegete1549 His favorite DAW is Logic, so he can't use a PC.