I'd like to share some thoughts from a developer perspective. I do agree that overall the flight model feels a bit better. Asobo hasn't introduced any new parameters, it's the same parameters we had in 2020 and they are interpreted differently by the simulation. Regarding backwards compatibility this can introduce a bunch of issues. Instability at previously unproblematic speeds for example, basically the whole performance of a 2020 Addon will be different if you look closely enough. I personally had to completely rework the flight models of my projects to get back to the same performance. After that was done I would agree that everything feels a bit better. However I want to point out one thing. Asobo has promised several things in the past that they have never realized. There are still quite a few severe bugs in the simulation that should be taken care of. At the moment I am not under the impression that Asobo is giving helicopters the attention they deserve and sometimes I also feel like there is some expertise missing. Developers are still waiting for the sdk documentation of several new aspects, describing the fuselage shape for the flight model for example. While we are waiting for a foundation to start working, Asobo creates the impression for end consumers that everything can be done rather quickly which is absurd.
Thanks for confirming! I wasn't sure. I haven't tried to fly from that position in the sim yet. The only time I've been around one IRL was when I was working line support in SE Michigan and there was a company placing HVAC units with one on some auto plants in the area. The more I progress with my real world ratings, the more interesting these bigger ships are becoming!
I tried to control the CH54 from the rear seat in the sim, but my brain could not handle the perspective. Maybe it would work with an inverted longitudinal cyclic axis?
That was cool ..enjoyed everything from your calm narration ,your flying skills to the information regarding real life heli flying and the in sim heli's . Great editing skills too i may add ..thanks for the video.
Picture this: You're hovering 6 feet above the ground in a Robinson. You lower the collective ever so slightly, and the helicopter begins to descend. In a real helicopter, the descent will stop by itself, 1-2 feet from the ground, as the ground effect increases. In the sim, the skids will hit the ground rather sharply, and the helicopter will bounce up a good ways, and then continue to porpoise. Currently, we have to jockey the collective constantly, (in the R66 at least) to maintain a steady hover, which we don't do in the real thing when we're that close to the ground. With that said, this sim is so much closer to the bullseye, than we ever got in 2020. There's a few other quirks I won't bore you with, and I really hope Asobo will give rotorcraft the love they deserve! They're so close! At any rate, I'm finding myself flying the R66 almost exclusively, and once you get into forward flight, it's a really enjoyable experience!
I haven’t tried MSFS2024, but I am a real pilot and get exactly what you mean. Even the training simulators I have used can never get rotary wing flight quite right. I recall DCS being fairly close as long as you remain within realistic limits. Of course once you start getting wild, the physics fall apart, but that’s to be expected and you can’t blame that on the sim. That might be my favorite part of flying helicopters. You can only do it in real life, it can’t be replicated at home to the extent that fixed wing flight can. Very unique experience.
I did exactly this type of testing with the new sim and found it to behave how it should, and very realistically. I haven’t tested every helicopter, but the R66 is matching my real world experience with it. I am using a Pro-Flight Trainer Puma set of controls, though. No curves, 1:1. I don’t have to jockey the collective at all with my setup. What are you using to control the collective axis? I am planning a future video about this topic. It also stops climbing when it gets to the top of the ground effect bubble.
I agree. The edges of the flight model are very hard to do. With good controls and VR, though, the modern sims are getting closer. I regularly fly XP12 and DCS as well.
@@Belatu42 A Thrustmaster Warthog throttle, which isn't ideal for a collective, but in titles such as DCS, it works like a charm, and seems to be working satisfactorily in MSFS, mostly. I'm going to have to try some more hover testing over flat asphalt and flat terrain. I wonder if there's some ground effect shenanigans going on with the added terrain detail.
@ that makes a difference in the real thing. Ground effect is most pronounced over a smooth flat surface. Rough ground and tall grass reduce the effect a bit. You’d also be surprised by the fine control you gain having a good collective. I recommend PFT or Virpil. I recorded some video of the Cowansim B206B3 showing ground effect working really close to what I experience in Robinsons.
Great video. Thanks for mentioning that ground effect issue, as thats my main gripe with it right now, so many nice pads and many have this issue right now unfortunately. Not seen if there's any improvement with the latest patch, but pretty sure I couldn't spot it in the vast abundance of fixes listed.
Great video! Took the Erickson out for the first time today from Cold & Dark. Makes me want more of those larger, heavier birds. While I personally think Carenado is a middling developer at best when it comes to anything outside of "being pretty", the R66 isn't too bad flight wise, especially now that Force Trim is fixed. Some of the sound design is questionable. The Asobo H125......I feel it could be much better. Not bad, but not great. The 407 is from Nemeth Designs. The "Aeroplane Heaven" of helicopters. Waiting for some more Sim fixes before buying the Premium Deluxe, but I'm looking forward to giving the 225 and CH-47 a shot.
@@KAPAFlyer Thanks! What do you find questionable about the R66 sound set? I find it to be very good. It has subtle things going on like ground reflection. The blade slap and main rotor whistle are spot on to the real thing
Hey thanks for that review. I'm not the early adopter type (even though a content creator should be I suppose) -- but all the chaos I'm seeing makes me squeamish to get involved at the moment. I just like things to be what they're supposed to be. I'm hosting a group flight on Saturday from Vegas to the Grand Canyon and back; inviting you to join us if you like, would be great to have an actual pilot with us. It'll be on FS2020 though.
I've been flight simming for so long...I'm an early adopter, but also patient for change. I've been in this game for a while. I will try to make it. I join RedHeron Sim Pilots and Flights with Joel occasionally. It all depends on what's on my plate and what I have time for! Thanks for the invite!
Most of the flight physics is fantastic. However, the focus on the H125 with no trim (yet has a trim button) was a crazy choice and kinda a middle finger to rotorheads. Also it’s very clear that no one at Asobo playtested the missions, many of them require you to “turn on parking brakes” to complete the mission, so they can’t be completed.
I'm persevering with the career mode but the ground effect bug when hovering over pads or trees is making the cargo missions a nightmare. You have to hold to hold a hover for 7 seconds without being catapulted back up. Other than that though the handling of the helicopters is much nicer.
The improvement from 2020 for helicopters is massive, cant believe some people think its the same, yes, people has said that to me many times... The issues you bring up are clearly there altho I had not flown from a refueling truck or a elevated pad so I had not encountered that issue my self but I did see others have it happen so I knew about it. But just flying the thing its so clear that they are 9000% better than what we had in 2020, smooth, responsive controls, no weird reactions, you can push the helicopter and for the most part you get what you'd expect, I can jump in to DCS in a similar helicopter and get the same responses and it looks and behaves as I see a helicopter do on the internets... We'll probably have to give it a few months but I think MSFS will be the best simulator ever for helicopters. Do I like that we are the alpha testers, no, it sucks... but this sim is finally heading in a direction I can believe in. The sim as you said run way better, it uses ALL the hardwre, all t he cores, all the memory in good way and its just gonna get better. Something the old 2020 version never managed to do. And that Autogyro, I love that thing, I have been waiting years to get one of those in a sim, ever since I saw renderings of BlueMesh's first attempt that they never was able to make because the company shut them down.
Fair review and excellent video. However the Bell 407 can not be manually started. It is disappointing knowing that it is included in the MSFS. Otherwise, it has a very good model and sound.
Thanks! The B407 needs some attention. There was an excellent mod from SimFocus for it in 2020 that fixed all of the startup and FM issues, but so far, it’s not available in 2024
You mention the center point in the water effect. Seems to me that's why the platform ground effect problem exists. There is no helicopter body considered. The rotor force goes straight down through one point.
That may be the issue with the inflow around objects, they fixed it for MSFS2020 in SU15 so we'll see what happens. With the water effect it's more visual and animation. It doesn't produce odd sudden launches like pads, buildings and trees.
The bizar behaviours also take place in in-ground helipads. If you try to land on the helipads marked with a white cirle in SEDONA airport you will experiment sudden and violent yaw movements that make no sense. If you try to fly over them in ground effect heigh the sim will consider you crashed and respawn you. There´s a big problem with helipads in MSFS2024.
Asobo gave me a present yesterday when they updated the missions and inserted the R66 inside career mode. And there I was trying to finish up a sightseeing and crop dusting mission but I couldn't because it says I have to enable the parking brake in a god damn skid helicopter lol
Yea, seems like we should have had a fix for issues like this, there’s prolly a thousand bugs like this but they’re like one line of code fixes, not deep issues.
@@superthrustjon The game industry is changing and it appears that they are getting used to release games before they are finished. Users are the ultimate testers and they already expect major bugs and issues. Its cheaper that way...Either way they've been able to solve many major bugs and I feel like they are moving fast in this issues.
I fly the Bell 407 and in 2020 it is fine once the trim is adjusted correctly. Only by using the mouse pointer on the stick, since you can't program the hat button on your joystick. In 2024, I set the trim to -21 nose down pitch and it is stable there. However, after flying around for 15 minutes and set up an approach, it all goes haywire within 100 to 200 feet AGL. That doesn't happen in 2020, so why?
That is interesting...have you reported your experience on the official support forums? I haven't flown the 407 in MSFS2024 much yet. I really liked the free mod from SimFocus for it, but it hasn't come to '24 yet.
I live in a small rural city in Michigan and MSFS 2024 has a huge skyscraper stick up in town which we don’t have ! So I can’t say the graphics are all that great in this sim. Also I was on the heli pad on the South lawn of the White House and they had palm trees all over the place ?! LOL
What about the Bell 407? I'm finding it behaving more like the original release of the Bell 407 for MSFS2020 where it was impossible to fly for months. Anything but the most gentle (I mean feather like) "elevator" inputs cause my tail to become unmanageable even with tail rotor assist on. So unlike the OG release of the 407 for 2020 I can actually fly it but I have to fly it like glass and it doesnt feel like any of the other birds. Is this right? Or does it need work?
I agree with your points, im really enjoying it. The Cabri still has too little torque effect, especially if you rush an approch and come out of ETL quick. IRL it can need a lot if pedal at that point. Where do you officially report issues?
Thanks! It will take some time, but I can't remember a launch of any simulator that was not the same experience. Flight sims are very demanding. I feel like the casual gamer crowd doesn't know this and is expecting COD functionality and support...
I have found some other little things that bother me, such as ascending at 5-10knots as if you were in ETL, translational lift not being powerful enough to make you climb and not lose speed in normal takeoffs without moving the collective, the absolute lack of settling with power/Vortex ring state, the rpms and speed behaviour when trying to make an autorotation... Lots of things to adjust or introduce to make MSFS2024 a decent helicopter simulator.
@@jmamcj I haven’t seen any issues with the points you mention. ETL is working how I expect and VRS is there, but it’s much more difficult to encounter than you would think. Any horizontal movement flys you out of it. I haven’t. Been able to trigger it at altitude like you practice IRL, but it’s hard to stay stationary at altitude in the sim. It’s easier to encounter close to the ground, but you know, there isn’t much time toe recover. The rotor rpm during autos needs more work but it’s a solid start.
@@Belatu42 I am not a real pilot, so I may be wrong. I have just read flying handbooks, listened to instructors in youtube videos, and played in sims. It shocked me to see the Cabri get out of ground effect in a no wind situation at 5-10 knots of speed (I´ve just checked right now to be sure of what I say, and it does that). I also expected to need to apply the general rule of "don´t descent at more than 300ft/min under 30knots" to avoid VRS. If I sink the helicopter at 1000ft/min in a no-wind situation at
They are both high quality, but different. The Miltech model flies like AFCS is on and is super stable. The Blackbird model flies like AFCS is off, with native tandem rotor flight modeling. they are different, but both good. I also have the X-Trident CH-47D for XP12 and the DCS CH-47F. They are all great in their own regards.
I think the Westland Wasp in 2020 was the best helicopter in the sim, flight model wise. Better than the best third party choppers even. It feels so natural to fly, as natural as a helicopter can be to fly that is. So it's clear they have been putting effort in on improving helicopters for a while. I still haven't bought 2024. I like to land on moving ships a lot. Do ships in 2024 bob in the waves at all or does the deck still track perfectly level?
I've seen smaller ships bobbing a bit but I haven't had time to mess with them too much. That's something I need to explore, but I did do some hovering in the H225 around a static fishing boat off Key West in a previous video.
The 2020 versions of Cownsim's birds work great in 2024! No cost if you already own them. I think it's fair to pay an upgrade fee for the dev to do the work to make them native for MSFS2024.
@@Blueesteel_ I purchased them direct from Cowansim’s website on PC. I don’t know about marketplace versions or XBox, but all of the other aircraft I bought in the marketplace are available and have been since day 1
I’m an HPG and Cowan user, but haven’t tried 2024 yet, primarily due to lack of disk space. Contemplating just deleting 2020, but wonder if I’ll regret it.
If you are happy with 2020 for now, let 2024 bake a bit. It's really good and shows a lot of promise, but just like when 2020 launched, it needs some bug fixing and time to mature a little...but I also haven't booted up 2020 since 2024 released.
Ground effect = Broken Airbus H125 trim adjust = Broken Airbus H225 collective = Broken Search and rescue missions = Broken At least the Boeing CH-47 Chinook flies nice and sounds cool. Oh, wait that helicopter is broken too, if you land and shut it down, and then start it back up the APU keeps stalling. this all will be fixed soon, I hope.
I'm sure it will get fixed. 2020 didn't even have VR support when it launched and performance was terrible. I feel like this launch is actually going better...
@@Belatu42 The default one that comes with MSFS, the one with the sprayer attachment on it. Mine hits an alarm and goes into a death spin the second I take off. No idea why.
@@PianomanKYreversed collective axis or controller profile have switched to Xbox default ( if you are on Xbox) that’s happen to me. Start your flight and check controller profiles.
@@MagnusThornberg I'm on PC but using an Xbox controller, since I don't have room for a joystick setup. Kinda stuck with that. It's weird, the Guimbal flies just fine but the R22 is so squirrelly it's impossible to fly.
@@TheSd1cko that’s interesting to hear. I haven’t flown the Magni or a real gyrocopter. The autorotation characteristics for helicopters needs additional work, so that makes sense. I’ll have to check it out.
@Belatu42 I haven't flown a magni but have flown a gyro. In a gyro, as long as air is passing through the main rotor, you'll remain airborne. Even if you are decending with no engine power, you'll do it safe enough for a "heavy landing". If you kill the throttle or the engine in msfs, it almost mimics a wing tip stall along with a nose down attitude. In real life, it will just stay perfectly neutral and descend straight down (wind permitting) like you have a parachute strapped to it, which for all intents and purposes, that's what the main rotor acts like. The model I flew in was an MTO-Sport.
The water effect is actually really ugly especially in VR and although it was a good intention the overall effect is bad. No water spray. No variation with power and height... awful. The center point ties its ugliness together :D .
@@Belatu42 yeah, I´m using them all for choppers. Still almost impossible to fly halfway straight for longer than 2 seconds... at least in some of the 2020 choppers you had the modded tablet with altitude, speed holding and directional modes which made them quite enoyable even if not realistic at all :)
I'd like to share some thoughts from a developer perspective. I do agree that overall the flight model feels a bit better. Asobo hasn't introduced any new parameters, it's the same parameters we had in 2020 and they are interpreted differently by the simulation. Regarding backwards compatibility this can introduce a bunch of issues. Instability at previously unproblematic speeds for example, basically the whole performance of a 2020 Addon will be different if you look closely enough. I personally had to completely rework the flight models of my projects to get back to the same performance. After that was done I would agree that everything feels a bit better. However I want to point out one thing. Asobo has promised several things in the past that they have never realized. There are still quite a few severe bugs in the simulation that should be taken care of. At the moment I am not under the impression that Asobo is giving helicopters the attention they deserve and sometimes I also feel like there is some expertise missing. Developers are still waiting for the sdk documentation of several new aspects, describing the fuselage shape for the flight model for example. While we are waiting for a foundation to start working, Asobo creates the impression for end consumers that everything can be done rather quickly which is absurd.
IRL you can pilot the CH54 from the back looking down position. I was in US Army aviation.
Thanks for confirming! I wasn't sure. I haven't tried to fly from that position in the sim yet. The only time I've been around one IRL was when I was working line support in SE Michigan and there was a company placing HVAC units with one on some auto plants in the area. The more I progress with my real world ratings, the more interesting these bigger ships are becoming!
I tried to control the CH54 from the rear seat in the sim, but my brain could not handle the perspective. Maybe it would work with an inverted longitudinal cyclic axis?
I wonder if you can make a different profile for that seat? @i.r.wayright1457 are the controls reversed in the real thing?
That was cool ..enjoyed everything from your calm narration ,your flying skills to the information regarding real life heli flying and the in sim heli's .
Great editing skills too i may add ..thanks for the video.
Thanks! I've learned a ton recently. I love helicopters and bringing the sim and real life aviation worlds together!
Picture this: You're hovering 6 feet above the ground in a Robinson. You lower the collective ever so slightly, and the helicopter begins to descend. In a real helicopter, the descent will stop by itself, 1-2 feet from the ground, as the ground effect increases. In the sim, the skids will hit the ground rather sharply, and the helicopter will bounce up a good ways, and then continue to porpoise. Currently, we have to jockey the collective constantly, (in the R66 at least) to maintain a steady hover, which we don't do in the real thing when we're that close to the ground. With that said, this sim is so much closer to the bullseye, than we ever got in 2020. There's a few other quirks I won't bore you with, and I really hope Asobo will give rotorcraft the love they deserve! They're so close!
At any rate, I'm finding myself flying the R66 almost exclusively, and once you get into forward flight, it's a really enjoyable experience!
I haven’t tried MSFS2024, but I am a real pilot and get exactly what you mean. Even the training simulators I have used can never get rotary wing flight quite right. I recall DCS being fairly close as long as you remain within realistic limits. Of course once you start getting wild, the physics fall apart, but that’s to be expected and you can’t blame that on the sim.
That might be my favorite part of flying helicopters. You can only do it in real life, it can’t be replicated at home to the extent that fixed wing flight can. Very unique experience.
I did exactly this type of testing with the new sim and found it to behave how it should, and very realistically. I haven’t tested every helicopter, but the R66 is matching my real world experience with it. I am using a Pro-Flight Trainer Puma set of controls, though. No curves, 1:1. I don’t have to jockey the collective at all with my setup. What are you using to control the collective axis? I am planning a future video about this topic. It also stops climbing when it gets to the top of the ground effect bubble.
I agree. The edges of the flight model are very hard to do. With good controls and VR, though, the modern sims are getting closer. I regularly fly XP12 and DCS as well.
@@Belatu42 A Thrustmaster Warthog throttle, which isn't ideal for a collective, but in titles such as DCS, it works like a charm, and seems to be working satisfactorily in MSFS, mostly. I'm going to have to try some more hover testing over flat asphalt and flat terrain. I wonder if there's some ground effect shenanigans going on with the added terrain detail.
@ that makes a difference in the real thing. Ground effect is most pronounced over a smooth flat surface. Rough ground and tall grass reduce the effect a bit. You’d also be surprised by the fine control you gain having a good collective. I recommend PFT or Virpil. I recorded some video of the Cowansim B206B3 showing ground effect working really close to what I experience in Robinsons.
Great video. Thanks for mentioning that ground effect issue, as thats my main gripe with it right now, so many nice pads and many have this issue right now unfortunately. Not seen if there's any improvement with the latest patch, but pretty sure I couldn't spot it in the vast abundance of fixes listed.
Thanks! I didn't see it listed either. I updated the sim, but haven't flown anything yet
Great video!
Took the Erickson out for the first time today from Cold & Dark. Makes me want more of those larger, heavier birds.
While I personally think Carenado is a middling developer at best when it comes to anything outside of "being pretty", the R66 isn't too bad flight wise, especially now that Force Trim is fixed. Some of the sound design is questionable.
The Asobo H125......I feel it could be much better. Not bad, but not great.
The 407 is from Nemeth Designs. The "Aeroplane Heaven" of helicopters.
Waiting for some more Sim fixes before buying the Premium Deluxe, but I'm looking forward to giving the 225 and CH-47 a shot.
@@KAPAFlyer Thanks! What do you find questionable about the R66 sound set? I find it to be very good. It has subtle things going on like ground reflection. The blade slap and main rotor whistle are spot on to the real thing
Hey thanks for that review. I'm not the early adopter type (even though a content creator should be I suppose) -- but all the chaos I'm seeing makes me squeamish to get involved at the moment. I just like things to be what they're supposed to be.
I'm hosting a group flight on Saturday from Vegas to the Grand Canyon and back; inviting you to join us if you like, would be great to have an actual pilot with us. It'll be on FS2020 though.
I've been flight simming for so long...I'm an early adopter, but also patient for change. I've been in this game for a while. I will try to make it. I join RedHeron Sim Pilots and Flights with Joel occasionally. It all depends on what's on my plate and what I have time for! Thanks for the invite!
Most of the flight physics is fantastic. However, the focus on the H125 with no trim (yet has a trim button) was a crazy choice and kinda a middle finger to rotorheads. Also it’s very clear that no one at Asobo playtested the missions, many of them require you to “turn on parking brakes” to complete the mission, so they can’t be completed.
Ha! Parking brakes is one I haven't seen yet! Yeah, the career for helicopters needs more work...
I'm persevering with the career mode but the ground effect bug when hovering over pads or trees is making the cargo missions a nightmare. You have to hold to hold a hover for 7 seconds without being catapulted back up. Other than that though the handling of the helicopters is much nicer.
@@flightsoficarus it’s the biggest issue with helicopters at the moment…and firefighting in the career mode. Hopefully they fix it sooner than later.
Another wonderful video, agree with all you say. I'm having a wonderful time with helicopters in MSFS2024.
Thanks! The potential is there! The issues aren't actually that bad compared to the launch of previous simulators I have flown.
The improvement from 2020 for helicopters is massive, cant believe some people think its the same, yes, people has said that to me many times...
The issues you bring up are clearly there altho I had not flown from a refueling truck or a elevated pad so I had not encountered that issue my self but I did see others have it happen so I knew about it. But just flying the thing its so clear that they are 9000% better than what we had in 2020, smooth, responsive controls, no weird reactions, you can push the helicopter and for the most part you get what you'd expect, I can jump in to DCS in a similar helicopter and get the same responses and it looks and behaves as I see a helicopter do on the internets...
We'll probably have to give it a few months but I think MSFS will be the best simulator ever for helicopters. Do I like that we are the alpha testers, no, it sucks... but this sim is finally heading in a direction I can believe in. The sim as you said run way better, it uses ALL the hardwre, all t he cores, all the memory in good way and its just gonna get better. Something the old 2020 version never managed to do. And that Autogyro, I love that thing, I have been waiting years to get one of those in a sim, ever since I saw renderings of BlueMesh's first attempt that they never was able to make because the company shut them down.
I completely agree. It only gets better from here. I will keep flying XP12 and DCS though. I love them all!
Fair review and excellent video. However the Bell 407 can not be manually started. It is disappointing knowing that it is included in the MSFS. Otherwise, it has a very good model and sound.
Thanks! The B407 needs some attention. There was an excellent mod from SimFocus for it in 2020 that fixed all of the startup and FM issues, but so far, it’s not available in 2024
Excellent showcase - very enjoyable watch 👏👏
Thanks! I appreciate the feedback! I love your channel btw :)
You mention the center point in the water effect. Seems to me that's why the platform ground effect problem exists. There is no helicopter body considered. The rotor force goes straight down through one point.
That may be the issue with the inflow around objects, they fixed it for MSFS2020 in SU15 so we'll see what happens. With the water effect it's more visual and animation. It doesn't produce odd sudden launches like pads, buildings and trees.
The bizar behaviours also take place in in-ground helipads. If you try to land on the helipads marked with a white cirle in SEDONA airport you will experiment sudden and violent yaw movements that make no sense. If you try to fly over them in ground effect heigh the sim will consider you crashed and respawn you. There´s a big problem with helipads in MSFS2024.
hopefully it gets fixed soon. It's a bummer because it was a known and fixed issue with 2020, but it seems worse in 2024...
Asobo gave me a present yesterday when they updated the missions and inserted the R66 inside career mode. And there I was trying to finish up a sightseeing and crop dusting mission but I couldn't because it says I have to enable the parking brake in a god damn skid helicopter lol
Yea, seems like we should have had a fix for issues like this, there’s prolly a thousand bugs like this but they’re like one line of code fixes, not deep issues.
@@superthrustjon The game industry is changing and it appears that they are getting used to release games before they are finished. Users are the ultimate testers and they already expect major bugs and issues. Its cheaper that way...Either way they've been able to solve many major bugs and I feel like they are moving fast in this issues.
This is a new one to me, but I haven't flown the update yet. Career is the most buggy part of the sim for me.
I fly the Bell 407 and in 2020 it is fine once the trim is adjusted correctly. Only by using the mouse pointer on the stick, since you can't program the hat button on your joystick. In 2024, I set the trim to -21 nose down pitch and it is stable there. However, after flying around for 15 minutes and set up an approach, it all goes haywire within 100 to 200 feet AGL. That doesn't happen in 2020, so why?
That is interesting...have you reported your experience on the official support forums? I haven't flown the 407 in MSFS2024 much yet. I really liked the free mod from SimFocus for it, but it hasn't come to '24 yet.
@@Belatu42 No report yet. But AI noticed the same effect in the CH54.
I live in a small rural city in Michigan and MSFS 2024 has a huge skyscraper stick up in town which we don’t have ! So I can’t say the graphics are all that great in this sim. Also I was on the heli pad on the South lawn of the White House and they had palm trees all over the place ?! LOL
@@MrHaaspaul yeah, there are some things…Bijan has a global tree mod out already that corrects some of those flora issues.
like in Vancouver Canada where they have trees taller than sky scrapers downtown, it really breaks emersion even in VR.
@walley2637 MSFS was constantly improving things like this with world updates in 2020. I suspect they will do the same for 2024
@@Belatu42 its just too bad that they were not able to start FS2024 where 2020 left off
@@walley2637how long does you game play in vr? I can’t get more than 30 minutes and I ctd…
What about the Bell 407?
I'm finding it behaving more like the original release of the Bell 407 for MSFS2020 where it was impossible to fly for months.
Anything but the most gentle (I mean feather like) "elevator" inputs cause my tail to become unmanageable even with tail rotor assist on. So unlike the OG release of the 407 for 2020 I can actually fly it but I have to fly it like glass and it doesnt feel like any of the other birds.
Is this right? Or does it need work?
The 407 FM needs work. There is a free mod from SimFocus that made it shine in MSFS2020 but it isn't available for MSFS2024
I agree with your points, im really enjoying it. The Cabri still has too little torque effect, especially if you rush an approch and come out of ETL quick. IRL it can need a lot if pedal at that point. Where do you officially report issues?
I'm glad you're enjoying it!
forums.flightsimulator.com/c/bugs/200
Thank you for another great video. MSFS2024 is indeed very promising and keeps getting better.
Thanks! It will take some time, but I can't remember a launch of any simulator that was not the same experience. Flight sims are very demanding. I feel like the casual gamer crowd doesn't know this and is expecting COD functionality and support...
I have found some other little things that bother me, such as ascending at 5-10knots as if you were in ETL, translational lift not being powerful enough to make you climb and not lose speed in normal takeoffs without moving the collective, the absolute lack of settling with power/Vortex ring state, the rpms and speed behaviour when trying to make an autorotation... Lots of things to adjust or introduce to make MSFS2024 a decent helicopter simulator.
@@jmamcj I haven’t seen any issues with the points you mention. ETL is working how I expect and VRS is there, but it’s much more difficult to encounter than you would think. Any horizontal movement flys you out of it. I haven’t. Been able to trigger it at altitude like you practice IRL, but it’s hard to stay stationary at altitude in the sim. It’s easier to encounter close to the ground, but you know, there isn’t much time toe recover. The rotor rpm during autos needs more work but it’s a solid start.
@@Belatu42 I am not a real pilot, so I may be wrong. I have just read flying handbooks, listened to instructors in youtube videos, and played in sims. It shocked me to see the Cabri get out of ground effect in a no wind situation at 5-10 knots of speed (I´ve just checked right now to be sure of what I say, and it does that). I also expected to need to apply the general rule of "don´t descent at more than 300ft/min under 30knots" to avoid VRS. If I sink the helicopter at 1000ft/min in a no-wind situation at
I'll do some more testing with the Cabri, but there are addon helicopters that definitely had it in 2020. Some may have custom code though.
Right now… they need a lot of help. But it’s very promising.
It's too bad they couldn't just port over the scenery from 2024 to 2020.
Hi, just wondering if the blackbird ch47 is on a par or better/worse than the offering from miltech? Any thoughts?
They are both high quality, but different. The Miltech model flies like AFCS is on and is super stable. The Blackbird model flies like AFCS is off, with native tandem rotor flight modeling. they are different, but both good. I also have the X-Trident CH-47D for XP12 and the DCS CH-47F. They are all great in their own regards.
I think the Westland Wasp in 2020 was the best helicopter in the sim, flight model wise. Better than the best third party choppers even. It feels so natural to fly, as natural as a helicopter can be to fly that is. So it's clear they have been putting effort in on improving helicopters for a while. I still haven't bought 2024. I like to land on moving ships a lot. Do ships in 2024 bob in the waves at all or does the deck still track perfectly level?
I've seen smaller ships bobbing a bit but I haven't had time to mess with them too much. That's something I need to explore, but I did do some hovering in the H225 around a static fishing boat off Key West in a previous video.
Cowan isn’t ready with their products yet… and they are making you pay an upgrade cost to use the helis you had in 2020 for 2024 which is ridiculous…
The 2020 versions of Cownsim's birds work great in 2024! No cost if you already own them. I think it's fair to pay an upgrade fee for the dev to do the work to make them native for MSFS2024.
@ they are ball available in 2024 now? I have a few of them from 2020 I haven’t checked in like a week..
@@Blueesteel_ I purchased them direct from Cowansim’s website on PC. I don’t know about marketplace versions or XBox, but all of the other aircraft I bought in the marketplace are available and have been since day 1
I’m an HPG and Cowan user, but haven’t tried 2024 yet, primarily due to lack of disk space. Contemplating just deleting 2020, but wonder if I’ll regret it.
If you are happy with 2020 for now, let 2024 bake a bit. It's really good and shows a lot of promise, but just like when 2020 launched, it needs some bug fixing and time to mature a little...but I also haven't booted up 2020 since 2024 released.
@ Better ground detail is the key thing for me. I can live with the bugs. I should probably just get another SSD.
Thanks for the video and feedback.
@ of course! The ground detail and cliffs are soooo much better in MSFS2024!
Flight Simulator 2024 is much smaller in size though, coming in at around 25 gigabytes (Rolling Cache included).
@@Fentomized Thanks, good to know. My current install is about 400Gb but should be able to fit that in.
Ground effect = Broken
Airbus H125 trim adjust = Broken
Airbus H225 collective = Broken
Search and rescue missions = Broken
At least the Boeing CH-47 Chinook flies nice and sounds cool.
Oh, wait that helicopter is broken too, if you land and shut it down, and then start it back up the APU keeps stalling.
this all will be fixed soon, I hope.
I'm sure it will get fixed. 2020 didn't even have VR support when it launched and performance was terrible. I feel like this launch is actually going better...
The R22 is completely unflyable, even with assists on. As soon as you throttle up it immediately goes into an uncontrollable torque spin.
Do you mean the R22 from Cowansim? Or the default R66? I haven't seen this with either of those models.
@@Belatu42 The default one that comes with MSFS, the one with the sprayer attachment on it. Mine hits an alarm and goes into a death spin the second I take off. No idea why.
@ some helicopters don’t have the governor on by default. Do you have ‘governor on’ and governor off’ bound?
@@PianomanKYreversed collective axis or controller profile have switched to Xbox default ( if you are on Xbox) that’s happen to me. Start your flight and check controller profiles.
@@MagnusThornberg I'm on PC but using an Xbox controller, since I don't have room for a joystick setup. Kinda stuck with that. It's weird, the Guimbal flies just fine but the R22 is so squirrelly it's impossible to fly.
Agreed
@@Serpico360 MSFS2024’s new features really add a lot for helicopters!
I can speak from experience and say that the gyro copter in msfs2024 flies NOTHING like a real gyro copter. Not even close.
@@TheSd1cko that’s interesting to hear. I haven’t flown the Magni or a real gyrocopter. The autorotation characteristics for helicopters needs additional work, so that makes sense. I’ll have to check it out.
@Belatu42 I haven't flown a magni but have flown a gyro. In a gyro, as long as air is passing through the main rotor, you'll remain airborne. Even if you are decending with no engine power, you'll do it safe enough for a "heavy landing". If you kill the throttle or the engine in msfs, it almost mimics a wing tip stall along with a nose down attitude.
In real life, it will just stay perfectly neutral and descend straight down (wind permitting) like you have a parachute strapped to it, which for all intents and purposes, that's what the main rotor acts like.
The model I flew in was an MTO-Sport.
The water effect is actually really ugly especially in VR and although it was a good intention the overall effect is bad. No water spray. No variation with power and height... awful. The center point ties its ugliness together :D .
I get variation with height, and I swear I saw some spray when I was just above the, but it needs improvement.
@@Belatu42 Hm... maybe the dynamic setting in graphics options is messing with its quality.Thanks!
@ yep. That could do it.
Horrible with controller. basically haven´t changed a bit from when helicopters officially got added in FS2020.
@@RSProduxx are you taking advantage of the assistance options? They smooth out the inputs for short throw controllers.
@@Belatu42 yeah, I´m using them all for choppers. Still almost impossible to fly halfway straight for longer than 2 seconds... at least in some of the 2020 choppers you had the modded tablet with altitude, speed holding and directional modes which made them quite enoyable even if not realistic at all :)
I have no car or boat traffics, even with update yesterday. No sight of them at all. Can you help?
This can be so many variables...what are your specs? Are they turned on in your graphics settings? The best place for help is the official MSFS forums