The FUTURE of Primaris Space Marines? Implications of Tenth Edition's 'Middle Ground' Terminators
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- Опубліковано 27 лип 2024
- Let's talk about the blurring of the lines that the new Terminator have done for Warhammer 40K...
Terminators in-depth review here - • New Space Marine Termi...
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0:00 Intro
0:48 The Primaris Releases
3:16 Firstborn Exceptions
5:04 New Terminators
6:55 Rules Implications
8:46 Model Implications
13:02 Outro - Ігри
![Lp. Последняя Реальность #107 РОДНОЙ ДОМ [Финал] • Майнкрафт](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/IK3QKzKUlHM/mqdefault.jpg)
I wonder if we will see transports derestricted for what they can contain, so we can put Primaris in rhinos and firstborn in repulsors, etc.
according to rumor, they are looking at bringing both sides of space marines together like that.
I hope so only reasons I never bought those transports was those restriction same with drop pod ...... just want to drop in heavies from orbit lol for the fun of it
@@SirJamesIGamerfuzion Terminators and Gravis still won't be turning up in a drop pod.
@@rankcolour8780 RIP
I really want to see Land raiders again
If they keep up this momentum and middle ground everything they can easily unfuck the problem they created for themselves.
Yeah, I'm actually pretty excited for the future of 40k for once.
Yeah. I'd love a scout update ...
Can't wait for even more space marine releases. They might as well remove the other factions and just make a game focused around solely Marines.
@@TheMagicalWizardPyro Entire new race of Votann, new Khorne, new Imperial Guard - it's about time GW update some of their old Space Marine figures. Of course Space Marines will get a release when a new gen of rules are announced, they're the poster boys of the franchise.
@@TheMagicalWizardPyro They did. 30k
I still feel the primaris shift would've been less abrasive on the community had they remade some iconic units like tacs and devastators early on in the new scale. Hell, some of the newer 2nd edition HH minis are close to primaris scale and look fantastic. The idea of new and improved marines has always been fine, but segregating old and new marines was the core of the issue. It's great to see they're finally moving away from the split, hopefully they carry on upscaling iconic units
Yeah, I miss devastator (and I hate the new desolation squat, seems silly) and my tactical squads mixing weapons....
Intercessors are superior to Tacticals in every way.
I think the Terminators did need an update, and now we have it. The Primaris range is now better and more dynamic, with a better variety of units designed to do specific things.
The trailer also shows veterans with combi weapons.
@@AuramiteEX they don't have the flavour or variety of tactical marines, can't take special weapons or missile launchers or combi weapons. Also look far more generic. They suit chapters like fists and ultramarines far more than blood angels and space wolves
@@calastyphon3414 they don't need it. They just do the job better
@@AuramiteEX Which job? A 5 man tac squad with a multi and a combi melta in it can do some pretty good damage while the intercessors can only shoot their bolters. As far as bolter shooting and melee goes, the intercessors have a slight edge.
If they sold primaris set’s with the option of giving them older generations of helmets and armor, it would be great.
This is why 3D printing of great.
Exactly, the intercessors have a few MK6 beakie bits, but no MK3 or MK7 tacticus helms. I wanna use the MK7 helms but I'm too particular about having a lore-consistent army that it'd make my brain itch.
@@dist0rted320 Here is how you hack your brain: the galaxy is enormous and for all the lore we hear about there are 1000x more stories that are untold and break all the "rules". This is the whole point of 40K, so don't let the lore stop you from having fun.
@@dist0rted320 plus adding to what above said, attrition is an asshole and that's the reason why firstborn had mix-and-match power suits in the first place
@@clanpsi yeah cause there aren't 1000's of firstborn helmets for cheap on ebay 🙄 god you people seem to think 3d printing is the second coming of jesus
"The Big 10th Merge" where a space marine is a Space Marine would be very welcome. I'd probably build the Land Raider I never finished.... in 1999.
I feel this in my bones. *looks at landraider crusaider*
Heck, they could just refresh the firstborn range and say it's "firstborn in mark 9 armour which is modular with all the mark 10 primaris tech" or something and everyone will be happy
This is how I saw marines headed for a while. The primaris keyword split made no sense either for gameplay or lore, and removing it just makes players more likely to buy both marine types. This is also an indirect buff to things like rhinos and land raiders, because they actually have useful things to transport again
The primaris keyword was necessary to get people to buy them for their existing armies.
But now that the range is wider, they can afford to back off and let availability dictate sales.
joint transport options will make all of us very happy
But it makes zero sense. It's the damage to the lore that it represents that causes the issue
@@stevepickford3004 so a primaris marine can't fit in a land raider... but a terminator can?
@@wigrammartialarts both could fit. But who would it be designed for? Think of astartes in baseline human vehicles. Always struggle to fit. Same for primaris in comparison to first born. And if it fit primaris the firstborn will be too small to fit in seats etc properly. Game wise makes sense but lore wise it's silly
@stevepickford3004 doesn't have to be for all vehicles. But it makes sense for all marines to fit into landraiders and the new primaris vehicles. I think they should phase out or re-release the entire rhino chassis.
Also worth pointing out that rhinos are already ridiculously small for first born.
Also, as a soldier... once you actually get into combat, you'll fit in whatever vehicle is available if it's what's needed to do the mission. I remember shoving 10 people in a 7 person LAV once.
@@wigrammartialarts I'm sure you could fit some marines in a smart car too but I don't think any military would design them that way. Nothing you said addresses the issues.
I like this reveal and here's hoping it's a sign that while the focus may be on Primaris, the Firstborn won't be benched. I don't mind updating FB kits, and adding in new wargear as it comes, but I do want to keep the customizability of the older kits. I should get my hands on a box of scouts soonish though, so I can remake a fun model of mine with the correct bits, but I'm in no rush to add to my backlog.
This is all I want. I prefer the First Born aesthetic and the lore. So why not just say they're the same, everyone is happy
I see this happening at some point
@@cottermcg123 its probably going to happen, i can see new units just coming with both a primaris head and first born head because that's the only real diffrence between the two
Black Templars did it first with their portly Castellan model, who had a combi-weapon (as a 'Primaris'), and who didn't have to be ran as Primaris. Blurring lines, inventing combi-weapons for the people, and looking cool while doing both.
It makes sense that Terminator armour can fit both types of Astartes. In the lore it's stated that it can be scaled. It also explains as to why Tyberos' suit of Terminator armour is so huge.
Hopefully we get some new combat patrol for the missing first founding chapter. I could see terminators going in the iron hands and the new flamer with eradicators in salamanders.
They could put
* Azrael
* 5 new Terminators
* random minis
in a combat patrol and it would sell among DA players. Throw in an extra sprue with Deathwing bits and... instant money
@@KrullMaestaren I hear you however, Dark Angel have a combat patrol.
Iron hands getting a box with a tech marine, 5 mono pose assault ints, 5 terminators and a storm speeder would be really. It would give players access to discounts on 2 kits that aren't usually discounted, as well as the terminator kit.
It also would absorb some of the lost revenue for GW by reusing the monopose kit that will likely not be reused in the next starter editions/launch box. AND would mix perfectly with the existing dark angels box to get you a damn powerful casual strike force.
At least it's preserving one of the iconic Marine units. also they really need to get rid of the divide and just make them general Marine synergy
The strategy has been pretty obvious from day one of Primaris when they launched in 8th edition - GW wanted 'true-scale' Space Marines but couldn't redo the entire range in one go so they introduced the idea of 'Primaris' as something that could exist alongside the old SMs, hoping that players would gradually crossover to the new models as they added them. GW also took the opportunity to change things up, including changing squad composition, weapons and vehicle types - in particular, they needed to differentiate SM vehicles from other factions like Imperial Agents and Chaos. The plan from day one was always to phase out the old SM so that everything is just Primaris, at which point they could drop the name 'Primaris' and voila, job done. The only thing that was never 100% clear was their plan for the very few units that this strategy didn't really work for, especially Terminators and Drop Pods. But at the start of 9th edition they signalled very clearly that Terminators were the one part of the old design that was going to stay (look at the photography in the 9th edition core book and SM codex), it's just that they had to wait until right at the end of the process to introduce up-scaled Terminators, i.e. now. We are in the final stages of this plan, so I wouldn't be surprised if the word 'Primaris' isn't dropped in 10th edition and all those old kits removed from sale. Another 3 years of having the old scale SMs sticking around would now be frankly embarrassing.
As a player who grew up through the editions, I liked the Primaris models but hated the squad design and game space.
I remember playing against an army with full squads of plasma infantry, full squads of rocket launchers, full squads of snipers, and hover tanks... they were called Eldar. It had a distinct feel vs. Marine armies which had tac squads with 1 special weapon. Primaris blurs the lines between play styles and removes the specialization only found in Eldar, which could prevent a new player from being interested in that army.
This feels like the right direction. I like the marines all just being marines. And I say this as someone who is 98% primaris because of when I joined the game.
My guess is the other releases will all be primaris specifically, and then later on they’ll merge the data sheets
merging datasheets wouldn’t work very well considering firstborn and primaris are organized very differently
@@qwer9676 yeah, that is a headache for GW... something got to go 😕
I came in late to the hobby (7th to 8th transition) but heavy on the lore moreso than the game and I haven't gotten over the Astartes going into obscurity, i love the tac squad and the HH lore and characters.
Yes. Primaris are just horrible.
@@JC-jo9bf love the new scale marines, hate the primaris lore. Love me tac squads, hate highly specialised units (sounds alot like Eldar xenos noncery to me).
@@FlyingcupNsourcer
luv me first born.
luv me tac squads.
'ate primaris.
'ate xenos.
simple as.
This was a relativley peaceful result so I'm gonna hsve to change that to keep it in-line with 40k. Here I go:
Nuh uh, you're both wrong. Doyle rules!
@@FlyingcupNsourcer Floating tanks? Very suspicious.
It'd be kinda nice if some new scouts had a old schol space marine flare. Keep the old ways going so to speak.
Yah, like a cheaper sniper squad with forward deploy locked to a different weapon suit than eliminators. Same could be done with "scout" outriders and a "primaris" scout tactical squad being the cheapest troops unit in the codex for holding objectives (kinda like incursors are used now, which means incursors and reavers need new rules).
Aggressors were kind of centurion lite in my eyes
technically speaking there's already options for bigger and updated tactical squads with the mk 6 heresy marines, theres nothing stopping you from using those guys in 40k.
The entire lore behind the primaris just aggravated me so much, that I still refuse to buy any of them. I have a few thousand points worth of Space Wolves that are all first-born, and I'll continue to keep purchasing the older style kits as long as I can.
Same dude! Firstborn only army, the transition from 8th to 9th was very uplifting, I hope that the situation will improve for 10th
agreed. It was such shitty writing. I also think the Primarch (loyalist) return(s) have been pretty poor writing. The Primaris squads with their monoweapon styles are not what I like out of my marines in 40k either. They aren't aspect warriors.
The only thing they have going for them is the upscaling
I’m really hoping that in 10th Ed GW erases the rules distinctions. Then my land raider that I got for Christmas will be somewhat relevant! Also it will open the doors for firstborn revamps.
I hope they lean into the Gravis armor's ability to mount jump equipment and orbital drop. Terminator armor can teleport deep strike, which is similar, but Gravis suppressors with the autocannons had jump packs so Gravis can be a sort of heavier jump infantry, hypothetically.
In lore, the differences between primaris and firstborn seem to not matter - they’re all just space marines. I hope that the game will start to reflect this as well. Having mixed units would also add to the feel of the army, as that’s essentially what space marines have always done. There’s always been a mix of old armor marks, relic vehicles, weapons, etc. I would welcome some conversion kits like this for primaris as well. It would be cool to see firstborn armor pieces in primaris scale and vice versa to really emphasize that space marines sometimes just have to make do with custom replacements and/or they develop a connection to a certain style of wargear.
What transports will Terminators use?
Well don’t forget in the preview they made a big deal about the teleporter homer. Most likely this was for dramatic effect, but maybe they will only rely on this tech to get about in future, stranger things have happened.
All I want is to have Bladeguards in Drop pods. And Intercessors to be embarked in Rhinos
I think GW was trying to have their cake and eat it with Primaris. Update the Space Marine line but do it in a way that makes firstborns kind of obsolete but do it slowly enough people don't notice. Everybody just wants them to do a normal range refresh without making old stuff obsolete.
Man this line of thinking is literally... 6 years out of date? Lol if anything this new stuff is doing what people actually wanted in the first place. Which was just proper scale firstborn.
Not exactly. People just love the firstborns. Just upscale the firstborns and call it a day at this point. Primaris should still be kept around, but you can't replace firstborns.
Primaris destroyed the SM lore. It would be nice to have an update that did not undo everything before it.
@@JC-jo9bf exactly. GW tried to get greedy and now the pushback is making them back off a little. No more Firstborns or Primaris Marines are just Marines. Dante didn't get Primaris-ed he got a new model.
I think corporate's mentality was 'we need to upscale space marines, but we also need a reason to force long time buyers to abandon their old figures, therefore it can't be as simple as a model refresh.'
I suspect they will consolidate all the characters in 10th, i.e. merge the standard "primaris captain" and "captain" data sheets and only have different ones for Phobos, Terminator and Gravis variants. That way they can scrap half a dozen datasheets without annoying to many people. Although I suppose there's always a chance they scrap wargear options at the same time ☹️
If they're going back to a keyword system it could look like the menu system from 3rd-7th. You buy a naked commander and choose wargear a al carte, and it doesn't take up too much space because profiles and keywords are in an appendix at the back of the book.
@@tempusavatar I think they will stick to having the profiles on the datasheets seeing as they moved the attacks characteristic to the weapon. I'm afraid the units with access to lots of weapons will be limited to what fits on their datasheet. Not sure what that means for sergeants though.
@@monkeyhammer it could be done with both in mind, depending on how much they simplify the rules. The dataslate could have a profile for 'CCW,' and the player is instructed to purchase their CCW from this menu, each option modifies the profile by adding keywords. It would also help balance errata as they could tweak gear costs as the meta evolves.
5:37 So I'm rebasing all of my Deathwing on corked up bases LOL
I want to mention that while marines were bumped up to 2 wounds, the Primaris versions of HQs still have that extra wound over their first born brothers. So you're trading options for survivability.
I really do hope the transport restrictions go away for P/FB I want by Primaris Crusader squad to be able to ride in my Land Raider Crusader
I know nothing about Warhammer but I was always thinking they'd probably release primaris versions of all the unique chapter marines that they wanted to keep and then phase out any other firstborn left over.
The only problem I see is this new heavy weapon Desolation squad. Apart from looking ugly as hell they would also conflict with Devastators if GW wanted to bring the two lines of Space Marines together. To my knowledge Devastators are pretty important in the lore as they serve as the training squads for the rookie marines before they can take their place in a frontline role (Tactical, Assault). Intercessors can serve as a Tactical squad alternative for Primaris marines, and I'm pretty sure we'll see some kinda new jump-pack melee troop for them as well in the near future. And Scouts can stay firstborn who can get later augmented to Primaris. However the Desolation squad has no place if the Devastators stick around and the two marine lines get merged.
I hope they can dissolve the primaris/firstborn barrier. My first exposure to Kill Team was Space Marine Steve from Play on Tabletop picking random marines out of a box of pre-owned models and having a soup list of primaris and firstborn. I really enjoyed the idea of both primaris and FB fighting together, and I wish that was better reflected on the tabletop.
I don’t even collect SM, but I’m gonna buy these new Terminators. They are THAT awesome.
it would make sense to me if GW made each model take up a certain amount of slots. (As is currently the case with some transports) e.g. Marines take up one slot. Primaris, jump pack and terminators are two. Gracie are three, etc. And just give each vehicle a number of slots it can transport.
I rezikon old marines r coming back eventually but full size however they tried same thing with phobos armour
glad there are some things that Cawl cannot improve. terminator armor is a relic. each having a shard of the emperor's armor, which is a limited resource.
hopefully this means we'll be seeing new sculpts for other terminator units, such as Deathwing knights or Grey Knight terminators/paladins.
in 10th, they might just have transhuman physiology as a permanent rule for terminators like Inner Circle for dark angels.
Would be cool to see new modern tactical squad ls and devastator squads
Wow Rycon, this is not where I thought Logan's Tale would go.
I'd be okay with Terminators getting an additional attack and if armor of contempt is exclusive to them. Additional weaponry would be nice too, but just making them more survivable would be nice.
My biggest issue is I still think the land raider and rhino vehicles and the derivatives are one of the finest designs in sci fi. I love them. The repulsor stuff... not so much.
I’d be very happy if they kept these and allowed us to use them with primaris and slowly phased out first born.
All I want is my Bladeguard to be able to drive around in my Land Raider Crusader for my Black Templars. Please, GW! Make it happen!
Primaris marines not being able to take drop pods was extra maddening to me because I just got back recently, and that goff rocker animation shows them riding drop pods. I was livid to find out the game disallowed that
It's literally been the method of insurgency since the beginning; drop pods of marines raining down on beleaguered humans to save the day... except for the Emperor's Finest 2.0
My issue with First Born vs Primaris is that the FB ones are more generalist while the Primaris are specialists. Devestators are prime example, as you can gear them out for a number of roles, while the Primaris equivalents are specific to one type of weapon; e.g.: Eradicators for melta, Helblasters for plasma, and Desolation for missiles. Means you can't just pick up one kit and outfit them how you want. You have to pick up a number of kits if you want to have the options. Seems like just a blatant money grab by GW.
Figured that out did ya?
@@JimH. Hey, I'm relatively new to the hobby, only picked up at the start of 9th. Ya, figured it out, just thought they would not become so blatant about it.
How about Assault Termies? will they get an update?!? 😮
Almost assuredly
It'll probably be the same box, GW has a whole thing about all options being in 1 box now
@@aidanquiett668I doubt that they’d need to have 10 lightning claws, 5 thunder hammers and 5 storm shields. Seems like they’d be more inclined to do different poses and swap out the weapon sprue
@@dittmar104 there was some talk it might be like the battle brothers kit and the chaos termie kit, all one kit only whats in the box one option for each special weapon etc
I don't think that just because Terminators can be fielded either as Firstborn or Primaris will lead to more diverse options (for other models). I expect it to be at the start of the battle you choose one and that's it. Only for Terminators.
even tho its for HH rather then 40K, the new plastic MK VI marines are a larger scale same as crow) then the older III and IV kits which are the old marine scale. there is also teh case that newer chaos marine kits have had their marines on near scale to primaris so they kinda started bluring the lines very early on as chaos got their newer models in 8th
I remember hearing that in 10th, each unit was going to have a stratagem or ability unique to it, so something they might do as they unify the range they might offer primaris as like a 15 point upgrade that gives a better ability than standard first born. This would also make it easier for people to collect higher point armies with an upgrade system like that similar to weapons options.
I really hope they just merge Primaris and Firstborn, maybe "Primaris" could be an upgrade you take on a unit that gives them some minor buff. But otherwise no functional difference, you could have first-born intercessors, primaris attack bikers, etc. Ideally they'll re-release all the classic first-born units in primaris scale.
My feeling is that Primaris is the thing that will be removed, not Firstborns. Primaris Marines will just become normal marines with different organization, but their kits will be the ones retained while the firstborn kits are slowly phased out as being "old" (or shifted to Horus Heresy).
And then in 3-4 years GW will pretend that there was never this Primaris thing to begin with, and that it was always their intention for these models to be a range refresh that just took 9 years.
The general rumor currently is that Firstborn and Primaris are going away and they will be just Space Marines. No restrictions on vehicle use.
The Primaris need to be retconned.
That’s the dream
I'm not an actual player and only follow 40k because of lore and got some votann (after years of following mind you this wasnt a discory or out of the blue deal) because they look nkce for my tastes. But damn i'm considering getting a few new proportions termis just to build paint and put on the desk they look truly dope.
I had the same thought for the lion but...uh...no, i know for a fact that will not be in the budget...
Let me put bladeguard in a land raider !! The biggest problem for me personally is the transport restrictions, just splits the space marines which makes no sense
It never made sense to create the primaris split except in short term sales. Obviously, in the long run people would have bought new sculpts and kits anyways.
I think most firstborn marines squads are going away by being replaced with Primaris Marine squads. That could mean a Primaris version of tactical squads etc.
It is not surprising that termis are upscaled. Its the iconic suit of amour. There are lots of characters that need a refresh without so called jumping the rubicon. The fluff went too far with that. In part gw upscaled to make better minis and include greater detail. This helps their ip amongst giving the opportunity for a new minis to be sold.
Tactical Dreadnought Armor can now be worn by either a Primaris Marine, or two firstborn marines in a trenchcoat.
I’m hoping that this means we’ll just have Space Marines and they don’t have to be Primaris/FB. It seems easy to make the change and they can just chalk it up to simplifying rules.
Oh man a new sculpt and update for the landraider without being a bonkers re-imagining would rule.
They should have just made them the next Mk of bigger armour. Would have been much easier
I think we should have a compromise on the range.
First, all Primaris are removed entirely, and REAL Space Marines are made to replace them. However, the rules can be equivalent so as not to invalidate the inferior models - you can field your Aggressors as an equivalent Space Marine unit, for example.
For the stuff that really doesn't fit, like the Repulsor, I guess it can count as a Land Raider.
In lore perhaps they can justify, it by saying the Rubicon primaris has become much safer with medical advancements. After pretty much every major character has gone though it without dying despite how supposedly dangerous it is.
I do kind of like the idea that new bigger armor could just have more padding in it for the little guys, just because it's funny.
For veteran marines, they just get a update on
A) lost tech on their wargear
B) the old stuff works better than the new stuff in the end and cawl was talking bs.
C) holy bolter barrel upgrade.
I think it's about time they got rid of the distinction altogether and simply say you can use either model to represent X or Y.
I was expecting that the new primaris "terminator" armour would be related to the votann hearthguard armour (clearly gravis Cawl was inspired by dark tech era technology). But for me this is better, I love terminator armours. I'm not sure if in lore terminator armours was even more advance than hearthguard armour, wasn't?
I don't want old kits to melt into primaris, I want old kits to be rescaled I think the terminators are a perfect example of being in-between keeping the families together. The old kits having much more character than primaris is a big selling point to me, but the scale is dated, that black templar castellan was a great example of new but capturing the detail and classic style of old
What is going to happen to the Horus Heresy marks of the Terminator Armor that came out in plastic recently - Cataphractii and Tartaros? Is GW going to up-scale them too?
I hope so one day. But I doubt it though
Unlikely.
I don't see that happening. People aren't in understanding any of this well. These are new Terminators that are Primaris scale Terminators in Indomitus armor; armor and weargear not enhanced by Cawl.
That stated, on the tabletop, there will now only be Terminators. As the new model, while scaled for Primaris; and your old models, all represent the most veteran members of the chapter that all have roughly the same combat ability.
The scale of the Terminators you mention are correct for firstborn, as are the chaos Terminators models, and Space Marine Heroes releases, and other other recent Firstborn Terminator sculpts. (They are around half a head shorter than Primaris)
Auspex out here rapid firing us with content damn
I could also see maybe firstborn vs PRIMARIS being a army contruction decision. So like the two ways to build world eaters there might be an option for a PRIMARIS army where everyone is essentially PRIMARIS and therefor gets access to transhuman or whatever, and gets slightly different army wide rules. And then one option that’s firstborn that gets their own stratagems and maybe even slightly different unit choices. Probably not but that’s one potential thing that could mean
Probably won't be for a good long while yet but I hope Tyberos gets this treatment
Primaris got me to start playing again.
I think they are all going to be space marines and drop having two different space marines
This is huge, i so hope this is the case. The distinction between primaris and firstborn is super super stupid. They are Space Marines, one might be slightly upgraded, while the other might have more battle experience, end of the day they are both space marines in form and function.
I think we might indeed be seeing a reunification of the range, I would expect the things primaris don't have an equivalent for that are very old and popular being redone, such as a new scouts range and veteran intercessors (possibly as killteam boxes) with an updated scout vehicle released separately at the same time as the scouts. Then seeing things that do have replacements go to legends with either a ministry of truth style there has always only been primaris marines or cataclysm buy new models to continue the story. This would allow for the continued refresh while reducing the number of models that need to be redone entirely as the existing vehicles etc would still exist.
I do hope that transhuman gets baked into the datasheets for primaris! Most primaris do not have an invuln built in so they just pop when most opponents shoot or attack them, Bladeguard have an invuln but are limited to only 6 bodies max vs 10 for deathwing terminators. Everything else requires psychic fortress for a 5+, which I think needs to be buffed to a 4++ against ranged and 5++ against combat.
Ive been saying for years that Primaris is just a way for them to sloooooooowly implement a new design direction and True Scaling for Space Marines, without pissing everyone off by overnight saying "Marines as a faction have been completely redesigned and all the old models are the wrong size and have the wrong gear now, buy a new army".
This is just phase 2 of it, where the line between Primaris and Firstborn blurs. Phase 3 is Firstborns get slowly Legends'd out.
Give Primaris access to Rhinos and Land Raiders would be a good move.
I really hope Primaris will be able to use old school transports. Being honest, the Impulsor is not as cool as the Rhino or Land Raider. I can't say I've been too impressed with Primaris armor in terms of model designs. They just seem to remove tracks to put on grav-plates and put a frustrating amount of guns on them. When I was playing with a friend and I fielded my Repulsor Executioner for the first of only 3 times by turn three it was still around I ended up skipping a bunch of shots on it because it felt like it was slowing the game down. (I play Space Wolves for those of who are wondering why shooting felt unappealing after a point.)
I just desperately want them to trim the absurd amount of niche-units in the SM range away.
Honestly - blurring the line between Primaris and firstborn makes sense, even narrative-wise.
Firstborn are simply more experienced, and there is zero logical reason why they could not use certain equipment. This influx of Primaris also makes little sense when we consider that Imperium has notorious issues with logistics for Space Marines - there are entire chapters that could not scramble full Terminator company, or had to use equipment cobbled together from different, heresy-era armours or different bolter batterns. Suddenly have all brand new and shiny and uniform marines neatly delivered everywhere makes little sense - ESPECIALLY when we consider that Imperium got basically cut in half.
Rule-wise - I really hope we finally get some variety. Beyond Primaris vehicles, that are generally complete, ludicrous overkill and tend to be hilariously overdesigned and over-armed to the point I wonder if Orks were employed in their development...
Primaris infantry is generally starved for options.
Pretty much every infantry squad is a single role-specialist with very little variety in terms of both visuals and equipment - they are more like Great Crusade squads or Eldar Aspect Warriors.
This is kind of confusing, when we consider Primaris coincide with return of Guilliman, who created Codex Astartes that got rid of Great Crusade organisation in favour of scaled down units and flexibility.
That said - at this stage I would say we have enough Primaris units that there is nothing stopping GW of giving players the options of creating either hyper specialised squads or more firstborn-esque versatile ones - that would be a good move in my opinion.
If only we could get some upgrade sprues or more variation for the armour in style of older kits, that would be actually nice.
Possibly GW might just say that Narritive wise "all" marines have now gone through the Primaris Transformation, so all Marine armies are just "marines (ie primaris)" and not one or the other... if thats the case the question really becomes do they rerelease and support units like Tactical Marines and Devastators and just have them differentiated with their weapons/rules/options... same with old/primaris vehicles or do they just let them go away and say that after 2 editions people have had enough time to update to the new models and some stuff will just not be in the game when 10th comes out
How on earth does this lad manage to pump out three videos a day?
I think it’s about time that the Space Marine army list just starts listing units like “Space Marine Intercessor Tactical Squad” won’t matter if your using old tactical squad or primaries intercessor same rules.
Drop pods would be great upscaled.
Rycon Roleplay playlist sent me here 😂😂 good stuff
Maybe in 10th they'll merge Tactical Marines with Intercessors so we'll get Primaris Scale marines that have access to all the Wargear First Born had. Then they will discontinue the Tactical Marine kits and release Weapon Kits for upgrading the Intercessor Kits.
After years of implying that your old space marine army was obsolete, and reinventing the wheel to mixed results, they've decided to just resculpt terminators... I can't help but feel conflicted.
I would guess terminators would be the exception and no other major 'non-primaris' style units would be made. But really with GW you could expect anything
I think Gw will go the same way they went with WorldEaters: 2 detachment with their 6 specific stratagems, one for firstborn and the other one for primaris marines. It seems the only logical solution if GW does't want throw anything into legends.
I would love if they could let primaris marines use landraiders etc. I don't personally want hovercrafts in my army unless I have no other option but I think we might have to wait since we are not even sure about the new terminators fitting into all vehicles
You *always* have a choice. Everyone has a part of their army they hate. For example Kasrkin sergeants not being able to use the hotshot lasgun instead of immersion breaking a tacticool spec ops squad with noisy lowbrow melee weapons. Tau not being given the generic XV22 commander (suit Shadowsun uses) and the stupid brainfart repulsor/ impulsors. You simply trade a houserule for your army for a houserule of your opponent's choice for theirs. Everyone is happier, and the game is more fun.
I hope they drop the primaris distinction for abilities and things. I'd love to just upscale the basic marines, but I know I'll keep using a bunch of classics as well as any upscale firstborn. I love running classic firstborn. I have a lot of fondness for them and don't want to have them be unusable models.
I also haven't liked the armor and lore fir the primaries, but upscale is good.
ngl, i would really lopve for GW to revisit old warzones, i know the current narrative its... well the current narrative
but idk i would kill to get some tasty rules for badab vraks taros and all the other very flavourful campaigns we had in the past, not saying giving them the direct 30k treatment, but a single rule with some rules for chapter tactics a couple of missions and relics, essentially like they did with nachmund or nephilim, a small campaign book
Scouts just look old school in terms of proportions and face sculpts, so I suspect we will get these quite soon.
I’m personally worried about what will happen to the primaris in the future. GW milks space marines every year at least once with a big release. Let’s say they update the firstborn to the new scale, which covers the company strategy for another 3-5 years, if they substitute this release with Horus Heresy fromtime to time (GW did this last summer). The primaris line seems somehow potentially even more bloated than the firstborn were at the end of 7th edition, whivh begs the question: where do you go from here? We already saw with Strike Force Agastus, that GW don’t necessarily anything ”too” revolutionary at the bottom of the primaris barrel. They can only bloat the range for so long with derivative units until the player base will notice. What’s comes after primaris? GW have in part already saturated the market with primaris space marines, and they’ve reached this point far faster than they originally did with firstborn. What’s the strategy in the future?
What if the squad with Combi weapons in the trailer is just Sternguard vets in mark 10 armor? I could easily see tac Marines and Intercessors becoming the same unit as well. Just with different weapon options.
I expect that, by 12th edition, Chaos will obtain the Primaris gene seed. It will mean the end of first born.
I both liked then disliked this comment 😄
I don't think first born completely are going away at this point. I suspect it'll just be a bunch of the older kits and vehicles. As for chaos primaris, as of AoO Angron they now exist. He channeled Khornes power and corrupted a bunch of them.
Nah, primaris destroyed all SM lore. It is cute that you think it will be fixed by 12th. Personally, I am holding out hope for the 22nd addition. By then, GW might fix the primaris mistake.
@J C dude primaris aren't that bad. Why do people like you have to be all doom and gloom about them? They don't ruin the lore and honestly are an interesting addition to the setting
@@mirotrevino9662 We are doom and gloom because primaris suck. They absolutely destroyed 10,000 years of in game lore. GW has paid good writers to try to fit the square peg in the round hole, but they fail. You might like the disneyfied stormtroopers that SMs have become. I personally hate the GW money grab that primaris represents. Primaris are a joke and they truly are guilliman's ogryn.
A grey knights range refresh would be great! Unlikely, but great!
It would also be great if they released a Terminator Chaplain model. From what I can tell there hasn’t been one that isn’t a limited release in a while.