What to do when a car dealer WON'T negotiate with you (from a former car dealer)
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- Опубліковано 7 сер 2024
- joinyaa.com
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Ray: / rasisjaz
Zach: / shefska
Today Ray and Zach review Jose's car deal for a new Subaru Forester. Ray explains what tactics you can use when a car dealer will not negotiate with you. Zach shares the Market Price Report and goes in depth on how you can gain leverage in negotiations with the dealer.
0:00 Introduction
1:20 Deal Analysis
6:06 Market Price Report
7:47 How to get leverage - Авто та транспорт
I went to a dealer a couple days ago without calling first for the OTD price, the guy sat me down to go over numbers and tacked on a $2k "vehicle reconditioning fee". I politely asked for that fee to be removed, he refused. So I said thank you for your time. He replied, "do you really want to leave here without a car after spending 2 hours with me?" I said, yes, and walked out. Called around for OTD prices and details of taxes and fees, spoke with the sales manager at a dealer who didn't try to convince me to come in for the price. They took $1000 off of the sales price, and only charged doc, T&L, and tax. I saved $3000 on that deal for an even better car, got exactly what I wanted.
Congratulations L M! You did great by walking out of the first dealership and then finding a dealership that was willing to work with you on your terms. Good job, you! Stay safe, Ray
@@CarEdge thank you!
LOL, did he give you these eyes as he said that 🥺?
@@Lightwaverable yes lol
I had the second in command pushing his numbers to try to sell me a car. Told me he was selling it at invoice price (which is what I wanted). I requested to see the invoice statement. He said "We don't do that. Told him "Then how do I know what you're telling me IS the invoice price" (I already knew invoice beforehand). "You just have to take my word for it". I replied "Well, I don't know you well enough to take your word for it". He responded "Then we shouldn't be doing business".
I looked at him and said "Exactly".
Then proceeded to walk away.
Not a good way to start customer satisfaction.
Last car purchase I had a price $1500 less (exact same car) from a dealer that was one hour further of a drive from my house. I went to the closest dealership and upfront told them the price I needed and how I got that number. I also told them if that wouldn't work that I understood and I would just leave. Didn't want to waste everyone's time. Over an hour later of playing the game I simply walked out and drove to the other dealership and bought the car. 2 extra hours of drive time was worth $1,500 to me. Frustrating that even if you are completely up front they still insist on wasting everyone's time with the game. The dealer I bought the car off of actually drove it to my house for free by the way and met me at the registry (bought in different state from where I live) which was 90 minutes away!!!
I can’t stop watching these videos. It is the father - son interaction that hooked me
First rule: Don't fall in love with the shiny object. It's CAR and there are many like it. If you don't buy at one dealership, go to another. You will find a dealer who will work with you and you can make a deal. It has to be a good deal for both. You don't want to get ripped off and the salesman is entitled to make a living. There is a compromise possible. Have realistic expectations when you begin shopping. Great vids and very informative.
As a salesman I can respect this.
@@mhauserman as a buyer I can respect this
Very well stated. Don’t fall in love with anything that can’t love you back.
Yep and leave your wife and kids at home
Either way leave a review. If they won't negotiate put it in the review. Others will read it. Maybe it'll cost them in the long run.
When a dealer wont negotiate with you the answer is pretty simple. Go somewhere else.
And quickly.
it's a Subaru dealership, they aren't abundant like a Nissan or toyota or ford
Lol, do we need a 14m video for that?
HomesliceDrummer was just saying since there aren’t many Subaru dealers, they have no obligation to discount their vehicles.
@@gmariogrand it's super easy to buy something in another state as well. Having less dealers doesn't make Subaru's more valuable.
"I really want this car" is the death of getting a great deal.
Good point....
I just realized the intro is inspired by Scotty lol
Rev up your references!
Me too 😅
Wonder if they’re gonna ring a bell at the end.
An “emulation”, yes. LOL
@@justicegusting2476it's not imitation. it's emulation... there's a difference. check with your lawyer.
Thanks for your videos. I bought a car yesterday. Found a vehicle sitting on a lot for 109 days and saw it was reduced in price several times during the last two months that I’ve been looking. I got a value significantly higher for my trade higher than several other local dealers offered. The vehicle was at a rural location and didn’t fit in the market it was in. After talking to the Sales rep he said some times they sit and sometimes they sell. I basically asked what my trade was worth and what his best price was. The vehicle was 6 hr from where I live and we met half way to do paper work. Based on the local market I got 1500 more for my trade and the vehicle was $2000-4000 lower than in local market .
I used to teach salespeople that you never know when the customer stops negotiating
Hey guys, my dad was in the car business (Hudson Valley, New York) for years and he and I used to have very similar talks/education sessions just like you two, all the time. You guys really remind me of that. Great service you are providing. I used to take what my dad taught me and help sailors buy cars (I was career Navy).
I have walked out of a dealer after letting them know I had another truck at a competitor that would work out fine for me. They wanted me to pay asking price, PLUS the installed high dollar security system they put in that was NOT in the ad they put out. I said no twice. The second no was as I was leaving. The sales manager called me 48 hours later and asked if I was interested in the truck. The answer was nope as I purchased a truck the same day, 2 hours after I left their dealership.
If they won't give you the out the door price, them YOU go out the door
The Scotty reference cracked me up. I can tell Ray thought it was pretty funny too. Thanks for more great info, guys. It was surreal hearing about someone that is in the market for the same car I am right now.
Control should be the Prime Directive for anyone buying or leasing a vehicle. The simple reality is every car buyer actually has control. The only way the sales staff can assume control is if the buyer relinguishes that control to the dealer.
A new car is a commodity, available at many places. On the flip side the dealer does not know when another buyer will appear to buy the particular vehicle the buyer wants to buy. That gives control to the buyer.
The buyer who loses control loses.
And the buyer must always recognize those dealer fees are FAKE, period.
I prefer this type of intro over the "this is a clip that you're going to see and hear again in a minute" style.
Very much enjoying you videos - friendly, engaging, humorous, and highly informative. Thanks!
Thanks for all the great info. We purchased a new car this year and used your advice to negotiate it. All went well. However, I really could use a shirt!!
Once again you two have taught me something. With your help, I am putting together a strategy on how I am going to negotiate with a luxury auto dealership. The advice on how to deal with push back about giving up the OTDP when asked is very helpful. Ray talked about ball caps to go along with the other swag. I think it's a great idea especially if they are embroidered. A tee-shirt I might wear once every 10-14 days a hat I might wear for a week or more.
I wasn't able to follow through visiting the dealership thanks to having to fix a problem with the cell phone - a stroke of good fortune, since I then had the opportunity to actually make use of the FREE Market Price Report. It amazed me! Talk about providing confidence. Moreover, it actually showed me the same model vehicle for a much lower price at a dealer much closer to home. I'm starting to feel more like a badass than a laydown. Will find out next week. What a difference a day makes, because now I'm looking forward to negotiating! (er . . . almost.)
Very helpful -thanks! I like how you keep adding to the info avail on your site.
I’ve been a buyer many times. I’ve been in sales for 40 years. There’s one thing you need to remember. Never in human history has there ever been a voluntary transaction where both parties didn’t feel they were benefiting. Not once. Neither the buyer nor the seller holds all the cards. If you’re the buyer and you want to buy something, don’t think for a moment that you have all the power. You don’t. The seller already knows that they don’t have all the power either. There’s no more shame in a dealer trying to sell a car for as much as they can, than there is in you trying to buy it for as little as you can. The seller is not your enemy. You as the buyer are not their enemy. Treat each other with respect, and you’ll both have a better outcome and a much more comfortable interaction.
Great advise for purchasing a new car as well. And a pleasure to watch these fellas.
This should have been a short answer: “Walk Out.”
That's what I did.
Even better, do not walk in......
"I spit at your moth-eaten flying carpet!" 😄
Yeah I completely feel the same way.
@@costakaskavaltzis1854 "Now go away or I shall taunt you a second time!"
I did this, thank you! I called the 5 hyundai dealers nearest to me to see who had the best price(I was looking to pay msrp or less not a cent more). I found one that was 2000 over due to dealer add ons(that I didn't care one bit for), I told them to remove the add ons because I didn't want to pay for them and they said they couldn't remove it but, the could lower the price by 500 so I told them I would keep looking. Then, I found another that was like 4000 over and didn't want to work with me so I told them thank you and have a great day. I called the 3rd dealer that finally offered me a few dollars below msrp(obviously I went with this one). With the taxes and all the fees it came to 40k and some(can't remember the exact amount). While in the process the dealer that didn't want to work with me called me and told me they would match the price but, without taxes and fees so I told them I already had a better price from the dealer right down the road from them. Long story short, do research and use it as leverage!
The two of you make it much easier to walk away from an unsatisfactory deal without subconsciously feeling guilty. Thank you.
Right! I just agreed to a good deal on a Nissan truck but the finance manager refused to send me the documentation for the deal before delivery, so I am moving on. Feel somewhat bad for the salesperson as he was transparent about everything.
I wish you could buy a car without all the hassle and BS
You can. You choose to hassle and BS. Pay the asking price. Trust me. They don’t choose to hassle and BS. You do.
@@freddy4130 I choose not to get taken. If they would offer a fair price to begin with, all would be good. I also choose not to buy their waste-of-money extended warranty, rust proofing, etc. I don't ask them to try to sell me these things. They do.
@@billphister so just buy used cars from people on craigs list. Super easy.
you can its called Car Max
@@billphister also, the car is a fair price. You just think you’re entitled to a better price. If you don’t want the products they try to sell you in finance, just politely decline them. Hundreds of thousands of people do it every day without being bitter and melting down. You come into my place and point at a car, say, “I’ll take that one but please, I don’t want a warranty and I’ll pay for my service as I go....” Guess what happens next? You’re signing paperwork within 15 minutes and you’re out the door within an hour after I teach you how to use the car. Super easy to buy a car, bud. How long it takes is entirely up to you. Come in spitting lies and being difficult and it’s gonna be a hassle. That’s literally all on you.
This is exactly why dealerships are a dead business model. Zach and his dad are fun, however.
They are far from dead. Keep in mind they are the only place to buy a brand new car.
extremely far from dead, and it's been record sales month to month this entire year.
@@drink15 Exactly! Why would anyone want to buy a new car? Businesses are different, depreciation is a business expense. However, the "new car dealer" selling only to other business customers is a broken business model.
Broken business model??!!! Hahaha after all the records are broken during the "pandemic" for units and gross keeping the economy going... yeah broken business model... 🤔
@@LL120 dead, just like XOM
Excellent information! Control and leverage... so important. Thank you!
This was excellent, please continue down this path.
Hi, you are providing a wonderful job to help people to make the best decision before they get to the dealership to purchase a new or use car .I need a car but I decided to wait until the market gets back to normal prices. Thank
love the content. shared with friends that were looking for a new vehicle and hate doing hoping this will help them.
I love the idea of having the dealer pull up that information on their computer.
Can't wait to try out the auto advocate guide, a great confidence builder. Thanks
Thanks for all the help you give everyone!!
The whole process is to " Wear you down" once people realize this, it's easy. The minute you
feel like you're getting jerked around and intentionally "wasting your time" it's better to just
walk. Many people are naive, and follow the path, that has been created for them to walk the
trail. The first thing that people want to do is trust the sale rep for being honest and sincere.
You have to remember, the sales rep makes a commission, it's the sales manager who gives
the sales rep the nod to let it go at a certain price. The sales rep is surmising you, and the sales manager is working the puppet strings. He is having the sales rep do, what he does. The
"out the door" price is the absolute only way to make a purchase.
Using this channels tactics is a sure fire way to speed up the deal. In my case they started moving very quickly. The more I scrutinized and pointed out errors. They quickly fixed it and we finally agreed on the deal after back and forth. But using these guys tactics is a sure fire way to get in and out. I didn’t spend all day in the dealer surprisingly lol. Was done and signed in less than 4hrs
Great stuff guy’s keep up the great video S
Good video! Thanks for your time!
Nice work walking thru this real story and how your app can help. 👍
Thanks guys for fantastic advice really appreciate it 👍
"We don't do that" are words from a business that wants the customer to work around their wants and needs. Feel free to tell the sales person, I've been here 2 minutes and already it's miserable.
I once drove on a lot, a sales guy approached smoking a cigarette and he had a gold chain around his neck .. I looked at him and started screaming "get the fuck away from me your fucking loser" .. and left
Love the nod to Scott Kilmer opener...
Thanks you guys. First time buying a new car since the 90's and that was a Saturn. No haggle
The customer ALWAYS has the leverage when you don’t need a vehicle but rather want a new vehicle. I’ve stated that fact and I’ve also walked out and ultimately got a callback the next day or was offered a deal that I was willing to accept. Just be reasonable and hold your ground. Even ask for more but be willing to support it with some actual information and be willing to give a little as they counter. It works all of the time.
Great channel. Thanksgiving livestream would be great. Especially in the Detroit area where the other option is the Lions game.
I’m very new to the channel and an even newer member to the site. I’m not sure if you were around in 2017 but I wish I knew then what I know now when I bought my 2017 Ford Escape. My father had taught me some stuff but nothing like what I’ve learned since finding the channel. I definitely could have saved my self more money especially since it was a cash deal
Zach I smell a new feature for the app “crowd sourced metric of how likely a particular vendor will negotiate pleasantly “
When the dealer will not negotiate, walk out the showroom door. The dealer needs you more than you need him.
@Steven GENNERO Bootz I would never leave a deposit because that would give the dealer leverage; I would only show up to make the deal and do all the negotiating before I ever show up (new cars only). Also, $75 per month is a large sum of money; I would have walked out too.
Some North Texas dealers will let you walk. More people than you think go for the low hanging fruit. They're not willing to climb the tree.
That didn’t age well. Lol.
Except for 2021...the dealer does not need us that much anymore. They are making bank.
@@AmmaLove24 it isn’t that we don’t need you. It’s just that we can’t stay in business selling the few cars we have at the same discounts we’d usually sell them for. There are more buyers than there are cars right now.
"Tell me, Mr. Salesman, what I as the customer gain by not having the information I have requested."
Can’t wait for the app Ray! Spot on!
Love the insight...take control! Im going use this mind set next time I buy!
Just keep in mind there is such thing as being too aggressive. If you come out right away and sound too demanding or rude then they'll likely not care to help you buy a car but help you out the door. You can be "in control" while still being reasonable and polite. Its not personal, they can do the deal or they can't. The real truth is that you never know if you got "the best deal" unless you are the manager and you sold yourself the car. Even the salesman doesn't know what "the best deal" would've been. They just know how much the deal made or lost once you drive the car off the lot. You know your budget so shop within that budget and find what works best for you. Good luck on your next purchase
Been watching several of your videos. Thanks very informative. Trying to use your information for a Ram 1500. Not making much headway just yet but they are still communicating with me.
Because this information has you believing in unicorn deals.
Always good information.
Hey , you guys are great! Ive been watching your videos for a long time now. You guys are so helpful. I’ve got a different situation, what if I ordered the car just like I want it and it’s got a price based on “ how I want the car”?? For example if I ordered it to my specs and it amounts to $40k, will I have any room to negotiate or that’s what I gotta work with?
😂 The start was so awesome 😂
Thanks for the advice! I'm currently looking for a used car but work long hours and am trying to get as much information as I can remotely, which seems very difficult.
Very nice intro, love love the smile. No skip ads. Here taking a chance to win.
Great video like always
I’m in the market for a brand new car and so want to wear a shirt from you guys when I purchase one! Come on Zach!
Great advice. Keep it up
I had a “fun” time at the dealership buying my first car. They showed me something I didn’t want to see because it was too expensive. I decided to test drive it anyway, then they tried to convince me to buy it. I told them my dad will sell me his car for very cheap and I don’t see why I should get their overpriced car. They told me they can’t beat my dad’s deal. So I told them I’m leaving, they called in some top manager that managed the other managers. He asked me what I can afford. I told him a price. He tried to get me a price as close to mine as possible, he ended up reducing the car by about 1500$ when it was already cheap to begin with. He seemed really nice and caring, I didn’t feel taken advantage of by him like I felt by the other managers. I ended up with a 2019 Nissan Sentra S, 7k miles for 16,500$. I’m not sure if that’s a good deal but it does seem to be about 2k cheaper than the other listings online of the same type of car.
Don't buy a Subaru . We have had nothing but major problems with ours including 2 engine rebuilds by the dealership , transmission problems and now AC condenser needs replacing at 90,000 miles .
Go find another car . The Subaru dealer is doing you a favor ☺️
Omg- me too. Never again.
Ive had 2 crosstrek and outback never ĥad a problem just had the 2013 crosstrek long enough wated a outback i had no problem with it will buy subaru again
Loving the intro.
Enjoyed the last livestream.
Sometimes it takes you guys a bit to get to the point.......but I have to say I like the way present yourselves. Good job.
This actually happened to me this summer. They made an offer with my trade in, I counter offered as usual. What was surprising was not closing the deal but they were not interested in negotiating. In all my years of buying this has never happened to me. I walked thinking they will call or text me with a followup. None. The funny part is the car I was looking at is still at the lot 4 months later!
Thats because demand has barely changed meanwhile offer almost went 0 because of covid, plants shut down so there were 0 cars beign produced. Dealees are taking advantage of this and not negotiating.
I have been watching you two, thank you for the infomation. I am looking to buy a truck, I am learning a lot. I am taking my time with a dealer, got to get more info; before I make a deal.
I'm trying to help my daughter get the Rav4 limited she wants , so I went to your site. Wow , what great information ! Your suggested offer was $37,989. With $2664 in manufacturer rebate and dealer discount , her OTD is $37,300 (b4 TTL which is 3438} ! I guess I'll recommend she close the deal. Any comments guys (YAA)?
She is too young for that type of car .Get her a Toyota corolla!
Thanks guys for another informative session. Would love the Thanksgiving chat!
Great video 👍🏻👍🏻
Great vid guys
You just hit the nail on the head with this video. Newer to your channel and love your efforts. I sent this to Kevin Hunter and also another fav guy Mike the Chevy Dude. Here is my question for you: Hitting the "road" and calling to make deals, in todays climate I need to know if they are willing to deal BEFORE even getting there. Previously I'd go in person but in this case I wont commit to the drive if they after 20 minutes of answering questions about the car wont come even close in the pricing you outlined with KBB calculations etc. I've gotten the "right now with the internet I put the best price out bc it would be easy to tell if they are inflated" response. They offered $100 off on a $39k new car....what a joke. Im in Madison Wisconsin here "metropolitan", and rural Wisconsin Dealer is the dealer. I mentioned Cox Automotive and Manheim auctions, being aware of dealer commission and PAC, and considering an offer that would still make them profit plus finance with them. Offered $33k and even coming up to $34 max and kept getting the run around about they dont make that much money on a car bla bla bla. Low trade (excellent condition) was $30,500, likely purchase was $30-30,600. I'm about ready to walk in an make a deal at CarMax since I've known exact spec I want for over a year now. Whats your take on the "traditional dealers" and not wanting to budge. I dont have time to mess around and wait until end of month etc. For that reason I may end up with the straight shooting Carmax to just get a deal done numbers out the door reasonably.
"For that reason I may end up with the straight shooting Carmax to just get a deal done numbers out the door reasonably."
(I know this comment was a year ago but for anyone else thinking the same way...). So what are you waiting for? You have your great deal all set up with Carmax but you want to continue to dick around with trying to force other dealers to negotiate with you? Then complain you don't have time? Makes no sense. They don't want your business! Move on.
@@j.frankparnell3087 I agree with what you mentioned and putting it out there for someone who may relate and find value. At the end of the day I learned a lot over time with their and others videos. No complaints here either, just giving feedback from the real world so others can see the signs as they are looking around and hone in their options. Then to recognize what would be a good "buy it now" scenario, and act with confidence. Nothing about no time was mentioned. Simple qualifying phone calls can be short and professional. Though no need to drive 2 hours, when a simple phone call was sufficient. Just like the phone call and car we bought 1 hour away, ready to sign upon looking it over. We got exactly all the specs we were looking for at reasonable price, and we love it. Why was I considering that other rural option? The short answer to why I would have my mind set on anther car: it was a newer lower mileage vehicle that would have made sense for the extra money spent. Also because cars with certain options are quick selling. BTW I patiently looked around for about 1-2 years, we didn't "need" a new car, so having patience to get exactly what we were looking for was important for the long haul. Had a few on the radar but slipped away and that was fine. It's a very specific model and then the extra options that we figured to buy up now, as we'll have it for 10+ years. My advice if your not in a hurry to buy something, consider how often the desired vehicle with specs is on the market, and make decision based on that, paying a little extra if needed to get what you really enjoy. Cars are just an item to be sold, to someone wanting to buy it at that moment. It doesn't matter that it would be the right fit for your family, its just a product and will be sold as fast as desired.
Great advice!
Ray, how about this intro " c'mon Zach, get in and lets go cruise" .
Yes! - on the live stream (even if I am working and can't watch) Also, with the amount of time it takes to complete a vehicle sale; how many sales per day is it really possible to complete?
This is genius!! Thanks so much!
Excellent content. App is a real help. Idea for future app expansion . Use vin number to generate what equipment is actually on a auto. Some times a salesmen’s knowledge is way different than reality.
I think the most important is to know the invoice price so you have a basis to walk out
I went to Nissan of Richmond VA, they are the same, I asked for out the door price and he said the same thing as taxes and other taxes so he did not give the price.
I just bought a 2020 Mazda CX-5. I ended up driving to 4 Mazda dealers in the Phoenix area. I told each exactly what I wanted (didn’t care about color, didn’t want to work to a payment, wanted the best out the door price) and gave all three dealers one shot to best my best offer. It took forever and left three salespeople annoyed. Can you offer better strategy to others to avoid this?
You guys are 👏🏼 awesome.
Thanks for the information
Do you recommend buying new or used without involving a trade?
Worked for 3 dealers, accurate information and yes this guy's prices are highly inflated.
Thx for the info!
I need a tee shirt! Thanks for your great info! Have Happy Turkey Day!
There is a NO DOC FEE dealership in Waterville Maine and you can get a good deal there.
So I have been trying to get a RAV4 from a dealership, and when sitting down with them, I asked for the invoice numbers from the start, as well as taking off the doc fees. The first Toyota dealership I went to acted like he didn’t know what an invoice price was(granted he was a young kid but that’s his job) and then the second dealership I went to, said they aren’t doing negotiating anymore because most of the cars coming to the lot are being sold(with the covid situation and the chip shortage problem). Neither of them would take the doc fee off either. Definitely will continue searching but is it just a bad time to buy a car right now because of the current situation or are they just trying to screw someone?
Lovin' you guys from London, Ontario, Canada!
In the State of NH doc fees are capped at 27 dollars BUT the dealer can charge whatever they want for "administrative fees" which can be anywhere from 175 to 500 dollars.
thanksgiving live is a great idea
I need to buy 2023 Honda hrv sport, is this a good time to buy to negotiate? Or I need to wait ? If wait how long? And if I need to buy mown at what price is a good deal for final price ?
Anything taxed is negotiable but a T-day livestream is a must see. Large T
Love the Scotty kilmer reference!
How would you negotiate a year of end model with limited inventory? Looking for a 2020 Sienna AWD that is not base trim and open to any color also. Any way to increase the distance for market watch reports? I live in PA and willing to travel!
I love how your guys interact!
Hope to learn how to get a deal! Thanks.
How do you find out how long a vehicle has been on the lot?
Years ago I went to buy an advertised Chevy the week after the sale price was in the newspaper. I told them that I'd buy it at the advertised price even though the sale was over and nobody had bought the car. They told me they wouldn't sell it for that price. I told them I drive truck and I've seen this car on their lot moving from space to space for the last 6 months and that they could give me a call when they were ready to sell it. They called the next Thursday. Walking away is huge leverage. Then I held out for $500 more on my trade in since they wasted my time the prior Saturday.
I had a sales manager tell me he was not interested in my offer for a truck if it was not at MSRP or above and that they would sell it to someone eventually. It has been there for six months lol.
Needing a t-shirt to buy my new car in! 🚗👍👚