And what happens when you or your "inspector" accidently blows the panel off the wall and burns down the entire building? who gets to pay for it? If this fool were wanting to take apart the gas lines to inspect inside of them would you still think it was smart? If you feel the electrical system needs to be inspected you call an electrician PERIOD and in this case "a new building" the only electrician allowed to open it is the one on the permit because he has to warrantee the components for a full year following final...always two sides to a story pal and as an electrician I can tell you nothing pisses us off more than finding out some one has tampered with anything we have under warrantee and doing so just may give me the right to void that entire aspect of the contract in court should it come down to it.
@@kevint1910 Uh, ever hear of property insurance for homeowners and commercial business insurance for the trades? If the house was that janky, I would want to know BEFORE I close, not after.
@@kevint1910. I don’t think that’s what he was saying. It sounded like the builder was refusing to allow ANYONE to open the panel until after closing. If that’s the case, then anyone willing to buy this property is potentially putting thousands of dollars at risk. But maybe I’m missing something in the message.
@@kevint1910 As a homeowner, you're solving your problem by making a much larger problem for the customer. How would I gain any confidence in your work if I'm not allowed to see it? Even if you work is perfect, you're mimicking behaviors of shady contractors. Would you tell the city inspector they can't open it? Take pictures of your finished work, use tamper evidence, etc. but never tell me the homeowner than I can't open my property.
Several years ago, I did a service upgrade on a 4 unit apartment building. When the city inspector showed up, she never opened the meter boxes. We were required to replace all basement wiring with conduit. She never stepped off the bottom step in the basement. She couldn't even see our panels from there, let alone any grounding. I called the head inspector and told hime that the only thing she inspected was that the box was gray. She wasn't even a licensed electrician and even failed the test.
I’ve met very few home inspectors who are capable of really understanding a panel. I’d hire an independent electrician if I was concerned and if the builder continues to deny access then we can not buy or go to court.
"Certified Home Inspector" is one of the biggest scams going. Very few of them have any experience in the trades, and many of them completed an online course and passed a bogus test. I actually know one guy who, for 30 years, was a full-time paper shuffler in the VT Army National Guard, and then he "trained himself to be a home inspector". He couldn't build a doghouse...
I'm not one to defend the average inspector, but it's not like a typical home panel is difficult. Maybe a panel with solar equipment, but the average panel is very straight forward.
You know why the builder can get away with that kind of potential concealment? Because of the housing shortage. If one buyer says no, there are too many lined up behind that one buyer, and they'll very likely say yes, despite that suspicious restriction. The housing market, particularly on a corporate level, is too unregulated, and thus we have all of this caveat emptor, with potential for life-ruination, going on.
Exactly. It's not too hard to understand about half the requirements. And if you find something dangerous, report the full story to the city (in writing). Of course, if you're over 65, buy it and sue the bejesus out of the seller, leaning on your senior status.
Soooo - you think a "home inspector" knows more about NEC than a licensed electrician. Most of those who wear the badge of "certified home inspector" have no experience in the trades, and couldn't build a doghouse.
It is not about knowing more. It is about having independent eyes looking at the product you are purchasing. There are some companies that cut corners to increase their profit (here is looking at you Boeing). Being able to inspect the product on such a large purchase needs to be allowed. And if a company says you must purchase sight unseen, you should likely walk off away from the purchase. With the demand for housing outracing supply it is important to not empower builders with the ability to make poor products.
@@nichodemus10 - there is no benefit to those "independent eyes" if they belong to some jackass who thinks his online course confers some qualification. The vast majority of "certified home inspectors" I have encountered are not qualified to inspect anything.
@erniea4424 while I 100% agree with your statement, I should still be able to look into the electrical box of a purchase I am making. And if you're going to sell me a car without letting drive it or see it running, we have a problem.
Your right a licensed electrician would know more than a home inspector but who's to say the work was done by a licensed electrician. Some of these companies send inexperienced helpers to do all the work and many local electrical inspectors don't seem to actually know the electrical code .
Just open it they’re not going to know. I’ve been an industrial and commercial electrician for some time now. Never heard of this. I’ve done residential in my free time also…crazy
Can the person buying the house not take out the six screws, put the panel down, and let you walk by it? There is no way a builder would tell me I could not open that panel if I were buying the house.
Holy $h!t, how is that even remotely legal? I"m assuming that it did have the Electrical "Final" inspection sticker viewable on the inside of the electrical panel door? Still that's BS and definitely shouldn't be legal. Thanks for sharing as I"ve never encountered that but it'd be a deal breaker if I were the potential buyer...
Why would anybody locate their main breaker outside where a burglar can force it open and shut off the main breaker, leaving the whole house unpowered (including the security system that reports breakins via a now-dead router)?
It is actually a part of the electrical code now to be done this way. This is required for firefighters to be able to kill power in an emergency. If a person is worried about losing power to a router all they have to do is install a battery backup.
I agree. It seems to be a southern thing or something. To me it is dumb. Why would I want to walk outside to reset a breaker? And garage is another terrible spot. And if the electric can not be inspected. That would violate many loan and purchase agreements. Electric is to be inspected. What that builder said and did would violate any VA home loan. The home would have to be inspected and that includes the electric. I would not purchase a home without the pre inspection. Why? By not allowing me into a panel, it tells me something is not correct or illegal.
@jimmyhargrove8672 bullcrap. I know someone who wrote much of the NEC. And yes you are right abt it. He is the other thing. Meters are near point of service and they have a main breaker. Pull the meter or trip that breaker. They done this long time. This is why the panel outside is terrible. My electrical instructor hates certain sections of code. This is one of them.
Lies. You don’t know anyone that “wrote much of the nec”. The nec is written by many different cmp’s (code making panels) that literally only focus on one small section each. And each cmp member can only sit on one panel. So you know no one that wrote much of it….a small section maybe, but not a lot.
Wow, they are not hiding the fact that their work is suspect of failure. Where I live, electrical has to be inspected by an electrical inspector, or the power company won't connect you to the grid.
In some states they adopt NFPA 70E verbatim into law and it is illegal for anyone other than a licensed electrician to open a panel. It requires proper PPE and qualified personnel. Where i worked our company wanted to train chemical process operators to reset motor overloads without opening the door and the electricians fought it so they called in MIOSHA (Michigan) for a meeting. When the company told them their plan MIOSHA said they would site them if the allowed anyone but electricians to do it, training or not.
Everything should be available for inspection or no sale unless the builder will let me put 50% in a closing non destruction unless, non code idems turn up, inspection account. Maybe A LAW THAT SAYS THIS WOULD MAKE BETTER HOMES AND FULSH OUT ALL THE BAD BUILDERS THAT DON'T WANT A LAW LIKE THIS, as cops say if you did nothing wrong why do you need a lawyer? If you build good homes to code or better, Why ARE YOU SO UP IN ARMS OVER THIS TYPE OF LAW. You 🤔 restate agents 🙄 BUILDER🤢.
the reason a builder would do this isnt to cheat the buyer in any way . If there are discrepancies with the electrical it will hold the electrician who did the work responsible , not the builder . However if this is a new home the inspection should already have been done by the local wire inspector and would supercede what any home inspector says any way
Shady builder don't buy ! Really that simple .i worked in the trade for almost 50 yrs seen it all from some very good builders to some absolutely horrific completely incompetent builders, and a whole of " inspectors " who didn't seem to inspect anything or didn't seem to actually know the codes . Have a competent independent inspector inspect everything before you buy or you might seriously regret your purchase.
This would be a big red flag for me and would result in no closing at all.
That is probably exactly what the builder wants.
@@geoffh1 why? Please elaborate.
@@dallaswarren6554He probably can get more for it than the contracted price.
Electrical should have been inspected by the electrical inspector, who should know a lot more about electrical code than a home inspector.
@@odavis1364 “Should” be the operative word and remember inspectors miss a lot.
It should be a nationwide law that inspection restrictions are not allowed.
Do not buy it.
"You can see my money AFTER I fully inspect the electrical panel, roof, foundation, plumbing, crawlspace and attic."
And what happens when you or your "inspector" accidently blows the panel off the wall and burns down the entire building? who gets to pay for it? If this fool were wanting to take apart the gas lines to inspect inside of them would you still think it was smart? If you feel the electrical system needs to be inspected you call an electrician PERIOD and in this case "a new building" the only electrician allowed to open it is the one on the permit because he has to warrantee the components for a full year following final...always two sides to a story pal and as an electrician I can tell you nothing pisses us off more than finding out some one has tampered with anything we have under warrantee and doing so just may give me the right to void that entire aspect of the contract in court should it come down to it.
@@kevint1910 Uh, ever hear of property insurance for homeowners and commercial business insurance for the trades?
If the house was that janky, I would want to know BEFORE I close, not after.
@@kevint1910. I don’t think that’s what he was saying. It sounded like the builder was refusing to allow ANYONE to open the panel until after closing. If that’s the case, then anyone willing to buy this property is potentially putting thousands of dollars at risk. But maybe I’m missing something in the message.
@@kevint1910 As a homeowner, you're solving your problem by making a much larger problem for the customer. How would I gain any confidence in your work if I'm not allowed to see it? Even if you work is perfect, you're mimicking behaviors of shady contractors. Would you tell the city inspector they can't open it? Take pictures of your finished work, use tamper evidence, etc. but never tell me the homeowner than I can't open my property.
@@kevint1910Yeah well I’m electrician of 40 plus years. And guess what someone is pulling that cover off for inspection.
It's like buying a used car and the seller refuses you to start the engine until the contract is signed.
No closing then. You win.
The builder is saying no to the potential home buyer? Then don't buy.
Several years ago, I did a service upgrade on a 4 unit apartment building. When the city inspector showed up, she never opened the meter boxes. We were required to replace all basement wiring with conduit. She never stepped off the bottom step in the basement. She couldn't even see our panels from there, let alone any grounding. I called the head inspector and told hime that the only thing she inspected was that the box was gray.
She wasn't even a licensed electrician and even failed the test.
some weak inspection are gods gift of grace....a hyper-active inspector is a curse from the devil!!
I’ve met very few home inspectors who are capable of really understanding a panel. I’d hire an independent electrician if I was concerned and if the builder continues to deny access then we can not buy or go to court.
"Certified Home Inspector" is one of the biggest scams going. Very few of them have any experience in the trades, and many of them completed an online course and passed a bogus test.
I actually know one guy who, for 30 years, was a full-time paper shuffler in the VT Army National Guard, and then he "trained himself to be a home inspector". He couldn't build a doghouse...
I'm not one to defend the average inspector, but it's not like a typical home panel is difficult. Maybe a panel with solar equipment, but the average panel is very straight forward.
Like gold star says "that ain't right"😅😅
I almost forgot him because he dropped off my feed, after the last YT changes. He's excellent and entertaining.
You know why the builder can get away with that kind of potential concealment? Because of the housing shortage. If one buyer says no, there are too many lined up behind that one buyer, and they'll very likely say yes, despite that suspicious restriction. The housing market, particularly on a corporate level, is too unregulated, and thus we have all of this caveat emptor, with potential for life-ruination, going on.
Shady….
That would be a deal killer for me…
Well, you are the inspector!!!! If you’re not allowed to do your inspection, simply deny the occupancy!!!!
Exactly. It's not too hard to understand about half the requirements. And if you find something dangerous, report the full story to the city (in writing).
Of course, if you're over 65, buy it and sue the bejesus out of the seller, leaning on your senior status.
Open it anyway your customer comes first not the builder
It would make valuable sense to take contract to lawyer to review before signing
I’m not a lawyer but makes good sense to me
Runaway don't buy it the guy's going to rip you off
Oh, its Florida. What could go wrong😮
Builder is wrong walk away
Or get lawyer involved it's gonna be ugly
That would never fly in Wisconsin.
No way! There is something wrong, or that clause wouldn't be in the contract.
Wow what a shotty rule I prefer panel be inspected before buying the house
No whole house surge protection.
Not a code requirement for most jurisdictions at this time.
@@geoffh1Depends on the NEC Code cycle they are on, but most DO require it. So you're statement should be SOME, not most.
makes no sense not to be allowed to inspect what should absolutely be inspected.
Soooo - you think a "home inspector" knows more about NEC than a licensed electrician.
Most of those who wear the badge of "certified home inspector" have no experience in the trades, and couldn't build a doghouse.
It is not about knowing more. It is about having independent eyes looking at the product you are purchasing.
There are some companies that cut corners to increase their profit (here is looking at you Boeing). Being able to inspect the product on such a large purchase needs to be allowed. And if a company says you must purchase sight unseen, you should likely walk off away from the purchase. With the demand for housing outracing supply it is important to not empower builders with the ability to make poor products.
@@nichodemus10 - there is no benefit to those "independent eyes" if they belong to some jackass who thinks his online course confers some qualification.
The vast majority of "certified home inspectors" I have encountered are not qualified to inspect anything.
@erniea4424 while I 100% agree with your statement, I should still be able to look into the electrical box of a purchase I am making. And if you're going to sell me a car without letting drive it or see it running, we have a problem.
@@nichodemus10 - the resistance we see from builders is a result of these moronic "inspectors". I hope you got your situation resolved.
Your right a licensed electrician would know more than a home inspector but who's to say the work was done by a licensed electrician. Some of these companies send inexperienced helpers to do all the work and many local electrical inspectors don't seem to actually know the electrical code .
Just open it they’re not going to know. I’ve been an industrial and commercial electrician for some time now. Never heard of this. I’ve done residential in my free time also…crazy
Can the person buying the house not take out the six screws, put the panel down, and let you walk by it? There is no way a builder would tell me I could not open that panel if I were buying the house.
Holy $h!t, how is that even remotely legal? I"m assuming that it did have the Electrical "Final" inspection sticker viewable on the inside of the electrical panel door? Still that's BS and definitely shouldn't be legal. Thanks for sharing as I"ve never encountered that but it'd be a deal breaker if I were the potential buyer...
Isnt this legislated in many states? Cant open up j-boxes
If it starts a fire he'll claim you should have inspected it before closing.
Why would anybody locate their main breaker outside where a burglar can force it open and shut off the main breaker, leaving the whole house unpowered (including the security system that reports breakins via a now-dead router)?
It is actually a part of the electrical code now to be done this way. This is required for firefighters to be able to kill power in an emergency. If a person is worried about losing power to a router all they have to do is install a battery backup.
I agree. It seems to be a southern thing or something.
To me it is dumb. Why would I want to walk outside to reset a breaker? And garage is another terrible spot.
And if the electric can not be inspected. That would violate many loan and purchase agreements. Electric is to be inspected.
What that builder said and did would violate any VA home loan. The home would have to be inspected and that includes the electric.
I would not purchase a home without the pre inspection. Why? By not allowing me into a panel, it tells me something is not correct or illegal.
@jimmyhargrove8672 bullcrap. I know someone who wrote much of the NEC. And yes you are right abt it. He is the other thing. Meters are near point of service and they have a main breaker. Pull the meter or trip that breaker. They done this long time. This is why the panel outside is terrible. My electrical instructor hates certain sections of code. This is one of them.
Lies. You don’t know anyone that “wrote much of the nec”. The nec is written by many different cmp’s (code making panels) that literally only focus on one small section each. And each cmp member can only sit on one panel. So you know no one that wrote much of it….a small section maybe, but not a lot.
Because electric code states you must have means of disconnect outside,not up to builder or homeowners
Only reason is they hide things and it ain’t gold bars.
Wow, they are not hiding the fact that their work is suspect of failure. Where I live, electrical has to be inspected by an electrical inspector, or the power company won't connect you to the grid.
In some states they adopt NFPA 70E verbatim into law and it is illegal for anyone other than a licensed electrician to open a panel. It requires proper PPE and qualified personnel. Where i worked our company wanted to train chemical process operators to reset motor overloads without opening the door and the electricians fought it so they called in MIOSHA (Michigan) for a meeting. When the company told them their plan MIOSHA said they would site them if the allowed anyone but electricians to do it, training or not.
cite
It’s cuz they don’t want you to buy it. They would prefer you walk away from the deal so they can sell the house for more to the next guy
Seems really shady thanks for the insight
Then instead of not paying the builder, you would have to take them to civil court. BS!
I'd say something isn't quite right about this. Naaw - I'd walk away from that situation.
are you kidding me? run as fast as you can........call a lawyer.....
OPEN THE PANEL
That should be illegal.
Everything should be available for inspection or no sale unless the builder will let me put 50% in a closing non destruction unless, non code idems turn up, inspection account.
Maybe A LAW THAT SAYS THIS WOULD MAKE BETTER HOMES AND FULSH OUT ALL THE BAD BUILDERS THAT DON'T WANT A LAW LIKE THIS, as cops say if you did nothing wrong why do you need a lawyer? If you build good homes to code or better, Why ARE YOU SO UP IN ARMS OVER THIS TYPE OF LAW. You 🤔 restate agents 🙄 BUILDER🤢.
the reason a builder would do this isnt to cheat the buyer in any way . If there are discrepancies with the electrical it will hold the electrician who did the work responsible , not the builder . However if this is a new home the inspection should already have been done by the local wire inspector and would supercede what any home inspector says any way
Scammers are everywhere
Builder name?
Do it anyways they dont make the rules
so what was this post for?
Walk away. Cancel contract
I wouldn't buy it.
Walk away.
Horsesht.
B S
Shady builder don't buy ! Really that simple .i worked in the trade for almost 50 yrs seen it all from some very good builders to some absolutely horrific completely incompetent builders, and a whole of " inspectors " who didn't seem to inspect anything or didn't seem to actually know the codes . Have a competent independent inspector inspect everything before you buy or you might seriously regret your purchase.