VIDEO STARTS AT 1:30 - Ah dammit we were rushing to get a few extra videos recorded/edited and out to go before I went on holiday and the start of this video got clipped from the wrong point, my bad fam
Pig's intro about skill-based matchmaking was pretty interesting to me because I remember diving in to PvP, expecting to lose my first games but at least have some fun with other noobs, but instead getting utterly rofflestomped by some insane cheezy strats and just giving up because it seemed like no-one was playing at my skill level and it would be impossible for me to have any fun.
Pig, I have not played SC2 and only played SC1 and BW in 2000 but a month or 2 ago I decided to try SC2 and when I played I lost my 1st 5 games and I decided that I was just too old now (35) to learn a new RTS. And now I find out it was because I was playing people WAY out of my league
Ok, what the actual firetruck was that last game? I didn't know it was possible for pro players to throw one match back and forth like that so many times.
I think a newcommer who did not play the AI a lot would have to be really lucky or a genius to win any ladder games within the first few days. I played most of the campaigns, some double, and watch a lot of SC2 videos, and within a few weeks of trying to ladder 1-2 games a day I got somewhere into high gold.
Thanks for the Napoleon Dynamite references every now and then. Too many people have not seen its glory, and it’s good to hear that even Australians, the upside down people of the Earth, have access to its wonders
Talking about the MMR, when I started SC2 tourney like 2 years ago I was playing unranked in like masters league where people killed me with 2 adepts, harassed with blink dts and cannon rushed me. Later I got PF rushed, bunker rushed, and there was one guy that flew his command center into my main and surrendered. Yeah. Rough start. That got me all the way down from masters to the silver league where I started to get more balanced games When I started playing ranked I won 8 out of 10 games and then ranked all the way up to diamond 3 throughout the years. I got like 70% winrate but I kept playing in diamond which resulted in me getting like 55% in the end. I'm done playing
I have never played a SC2 pvp match, played sc1 at a web cafe with friends back in the days and they smoked me bad, very bad. But I loved the game and didn’t own a computer so that was some good tournaments good tough love from my friend that was good at the game. Long story short, I’ve watched your casting now for fudging years and love the thins I’ve never thought about and wanna rematch my old mates that bullied me every game I game played. Cheers and love PIG 🐖 ❤
My brother and I played a 3v3 with her on our team. Right before she went PRO. I swear it was a game vs toddlers. She beat 2 of them and came back to finish off the one we were destroying. Was funny, she went just blink stalkers lol
17:41 but toss IS imba. Respect to Scarlett though for deciding "if you can't beat 'em, join 'em", and single-handedly getting us Oracle nerfs. 18:26 Why am i being so called out? Zerg pretty much needs to be reactive to get any good cost-effective engagements. Especially since the race has no real counters to immortals, thors, or archons. Granted, that's by design, since the whole design ethos of Zerg from the beginning is "if you're ahead, get more ahead", but it's hard to do that if you're not allowed to react to incoming threats.
Regarding skill based matchmaking and starting MMR: I think the reason for this is actually to protect noobs. If new player would start at the bottom, smurfing would be a LOT more problematic. Basically, those with a mindset willing to smurf - i.e. no real interest in the game and a fair tough game - are those most likely to be found in the lower leagues because those willing to play tough games and react to stuff will rise higher even when having slow reactions (i am myself 39 and slow as hell, but still easily in diamond). If one would reduce initial MMR, the amount of ppl that could use new accs for a low MMR would be a LOT larger. And crucially, it would include an excessive percentage of those that actually want to smurf. Smurfing rates would go absolutely insane if one would reduce initial MMR.
yeah I agree, I think the only possible change would be make the intial flexibility on the algorithm even more extreme, so if you lose 3 games in a row, actually throw you against a bronze/silver already. Whereas in the current system it might take 10+ losses to get down to that level
I agree that initial match placing is a bit broken. Also if you don't own a game you need to win 10 times on different days to actually be able to reach placements
Great cast. Not to sure about the random shade you throw at Idra. What advice would you give someone trying to get back into SC2 that hasn't played seriously since 2010?
I was just reading and responding to a comment in twitch chat, I stand by the view. Idra's a nice guy but just didn't have the same passion for SC2 that he had for SC1. Despite that he was good enough to be one of the best and his divisive attitude and BM made him especially entertaining to watch! Advice for getting back into the game is check out B2GM if you like to learn from others, whereas if you're more intuitive as a player and enjoy figuring things out for yourself just get on the ladder and expect to be bronze level since it's an entirely different game in 2024. So brace to lose your first 5-10 games, just try to get used to the basics again and stick to some relatively simple plans so you can start building good basic habits and muscle memory until the game starts feeling a bit more natural again
with your rank placement idea, would that not disproportionately affect the lowest ranked players by making them play against a lot of "smurf" level people though?
Exactly. The lower you start a "new" player, the more "reward" there is for smurfing. I suspect that newer AI machine learning models will be better able to assess a players "true" rank based off of things like how well they control their units and other subtle tells. Kinda like reCAPTCHA using behavior to distinguish between bot/human.
Yes, but I doubt it'd be significant. To a player on the ladder, they might lose a few abnormally tough games, but then win a few as their lowered MMR matches them against players slightly worse than them. Business as usual. But to the new player, those few games are their entire experience and greatly influence whether they enjoy the content at all. Of course, even that relatively minor issue would be mostly solved if they just had new players do the placement matches against bots.
If you start the new accounts at a lower MMR the noobies you're wanting to protect will have to suffer through matches against the pros who are placed lower... Either way it doesn't matter, the ELO system is solid at finding the right spot for you over the course of less than 20 games. If you're just starting out and can't handle some relatively quick losses, maybe the game just isn't for you...
Ooh, mate, bit of an editing goof in the first minute and a half. You intro, say some things, get distracted and then intro again and repeat the things. I don't know much about UA-cam, I uploaded 1 video once to see if I could and then never touched it again so bear with me if this is stupid but, if it's possible to do so post upload you might want to crop a bit there. Regarding the skill based matchmaking that distracted you: I don't think it would be outrageous to ask new players "How much RTS experience do you have?" and give them 3 options for 3 different MMR starts. Yes, smurfs would abuse that, but they already go on 13 game auto leave streaks, so it wouldn't increase the amount of smurfing.
VIDEO STARTS AT 1:30 - Ah dammit we were rushing to get a few extra videos recorded/edited and out to go before I went on holiday and the start of this video got clipped from the wrong point, my bad fam
Pig's intro about skill-based matchmaking was pretty interesting to me because I remember diving in to PvP, expecting to lose my first games but at least have some fun with other noobs, but instead getting utterly rofflestomped by some insane cheezy strats and just giving up because it seemed like no-one was playing at my skill level and it would be impossible for me to have any fun.
Love Scarlett games. Win or lose they are entertaining
Pig, I have not played SC2 and only played SC1 and BW in 2000 but a month or 2 ago I decided to try SC2 and when I played I lost my 1st 5 games and I decided that I was just too old now (35) to learn a new RTS. And now I find out it was because I was playing people WAY out of my league
You're not old at all ;)
You're not old, and it helps to learn from bronze to gm build order series like from vibe
In sc2 that’s like the average age!
I just came back a few months ago too
Shut up and ladder old man
I’m 40 and love playing
30:40 Pig's real-time reactions here are awesome. "So THIS is where this build came from!" 😂❤
Ok, what the actual firetruck was that last game? I didn't know it was possible for pro players to throw one match back and forth like that so many times.
I think a newcommer who did not play the AI a lot would have to be really lucky or a genius to win any ladder games within the first few days.
I played most of the campaigns, some double, and watch a lot of SC2 videos, and within a few weeks of trying to ladder 1-2 games a day I got somewhere into high gold.
Thanks for the Napoleon Dynamite references every now and then. Too many people have not seen its glory, and it’s good to hear that even Australians, the upside down people of the Earth, have access to its wonders
we out here
14:20
25:40: That is a brutal way to lose a game 😔
37:12: Rarely has an army disappeared as fast as that
What a wild ride 😄
Talking about the MMR, when I started SC2 tourney like 2 years ago I was playing unranked in like masters league where people killed me with 2 adepts, harassed with blink dts and cannon rushed me. Later I got PF rushed, bunker rushed, and there was one guy that flew his command center into my main and surrendered.
Yeah. Rough start. That got me all the way down from masters to the silver league where I started to get more balanced games
When I started playing ranked I won 8 out of 10 games and then ranked all the way up to diamond 3 throughout the years. I got like 70% winrate but I kept playing in diamond which resulted in me getting like 55% in the end. I'm done playing
How she held the first hellion pressure was insane!
I have never played a SC2 pvp match, played sc1 at a web cafe with friends back in the days and they smoked me bad, very bad. But I loved the game and didn’t own a computer so that was some good tournaments good tough love from my friend that was good at the game.
Long story short, I’ve watched your casting now for fudging years and love the thins I’ve never thought about and wanna rematch my old mates that bullied me every game I game played. Cheers and love PIG 🐖 ❤
37:30 to 37:42 is my favorite part of the commentary
Scarlett is my favourite!!
My brother and I played a 3v3 with her on our team. Right before she went PRO.
I swear it was a game vs toddlers. She beat 2 of them and came back to finish off the one we were destroying. Was funny, she went just blink stalkers lol
17:41 but toss IS imba. Respect to Scarlett though for deciding "if you can't beat 'em, join 'em", and single-handedly getting us Oracle nerfs.
18:26 Why am i being so called out? Zerg pretty much needs to be reactive to get any good cost-effective engagements. Especially since the race has no real counters to immortals, thors, or archons. Granted, that's by design, since the whole design ethos of Zerg from the beginning is "if you're ahead, get more ahead", but it's hard to do that if you're not allowed to react to incoming threats.
When bread and butter isn't enough, bring in the Cheese!
Two Scarlett videos in two weeks? Love it.
Thank you for your amazing content PiG❤
Regarding skill based matchmaking and starting MMR:
I think the reason for this is actually to protect noobs. If new player would start at the bottom, smurfing would be a LOT more problematic. Basically, those with a mindset willing to smurf - i.e. no real interest in the game and a fair tough game - are those most likely to be found in the lower leagues because those willing to play tough games and react to stuff will rise higher even when having slow reactions (i am myself 39 and slow as hell, but still easily in diamond).
If one would reduce initial MMR, the amount of ppl that could use new accs for a low MMR would be a LOT larger. And crucially, it would include an excessive percentage of those that actually want to smurf. Smurfing rates would go absolutely insane if one would reduce initial MMR.
yeah I agree, I think the only possible change would be make the intial flexibility on the algorithm even more extreme, so if you lose 3 games in a row, actually throw you against a bronze/silver already. Whereas in the current system it might take 10+ losses to get down to that level
I’ll have to try that double star port rush except with a bunker on the natural 😂
I agree that initial match placing is a bit broken. Also if you don't own a game you need to win 10 times on different days to actually be able to reach placements
1:45
"Its hard when you have outcomes like... pudding" 😢
When I came back after 8 years or so, I did lose about 10 games, so it seems accurate
Great cast. Not to sure about the random shade you throw at Idra. What advice would you give someone trying to get back into SC2 that hasn't played seriously since 2010?
I was just reading and responding to a comment in twitch chat, I stand by the view. Idra's a nice guy but just didn't have the same passion for SC2 that he had for SC1. Despite that he was good enough to be one of the best and his divisive attitude and BM made him especially entertaining to watch!
Advice for getting back into the game is check out B2GM if you like to learn from others, whereas if you're more intuitive as a player and enjoy figuring things out for yourself just get on the ladder and expect to be bronze level since it's an entirely different game in 2024. So brace to lose your first 5-10 games, just try to get used to the basics again and stick to some relatively simple plans so you can start building good basic habits and muscle memory until the game starts feeling a bit more natural again
with your rank placement idea, would that not disproportionately affect the lowest ranked players by making them play against a lot of "smurf" level people though?
Exactly. The lower you start a "new" player, the more "reward" there is for smurfing. I suspect that newer AI machine learning models will be better able to assess a players "true" rank based off of things like how well they control their units and other subtle tells. Kinda like reCAPTCHA using behavior to distinguish between bot/human.
Yes, but I doubt it'd be significant. To a player on the ladder, they might lose a few abnormally tough games, but then win a few as their lowered MMR matches them against players slightly worse than them. Business as usual. But to the new player, those few games are their entire experience and greatly influence whether they enjoy the content at all.
Of course, even that relatively minor issue would be mostly solved if they just had new players do the placement matches against bots.
I wonder how many truly new players sc2 gets on the ladder each month.
If you start the new accounts at a lower MMR the noobies you're wanting to protect will have to suffer through matches against the pros who are placed lower...
Either way it doesn't matter, the ELO system is solid at finding the right spot for you over the course of less than 20 games. If you're just starting out and can't handle some relatively quick losses, maybe the game just isn't for you...
I've seen fighting games that ask how experienced you are at fighting games and set starting rank based on that.
I haven't seen a scarlet tourney win in yrs
Scarlett est très gourmande ❤😊
Why we watching an ancient match??
Except Game 2 was totally worth it
PiG, amazing video
PLEASE go back and fully critique Idra
I'd watch the hell out of that
I like you, PiG
she is good in sc2 ?
uggu
Ooh, mate, bit of an editing goof in the first minute and a half. You intro, say some things, get distracted and then intro again and repeat the things. I don't know much about UA-cam, I uploaded 1 video once to see if I could and then never touched it again so bear with me if this is stupid but, if it's possible to do so post upload you might want to crop a bit there.
Regarding the skill based matchmaking that distracted you: I don't think it would be outrageous to ask new players "How much RTS experience do you have?" and give them 3 options for 3 different MMR starts. Yes, smurfs would abuse that, but they already go on 13 game auto leave streaks, so it wouldn't increase the amount of smurfing.
Yeah, tried playing again after 15 years and got dumped on 20 games straight. Gave up and just went back to watching 🤷♂️
Dude just lose another 10 on purpose and begin in bronze. Or watch some bronze to gm videos.
Just cheese. You will be surprised how good it works.
Screen is too dark PiG. Great casting but with that dark screen I'm not watching. Turn on that gamma :D
Maybe turn up your brightness? Seems fine to me