My dad worked with a man who was a marine on Saipan. He was there for the troop build up for the main invasion of the main islands. He said after japan surrendered “you never saw a happier group of guys”. The man went on to say that all of the marines felt they would all die if they invaded, and happy they didn’t have to since the bombs were dropped.
@Renzo Alarcón Invasion: 3 million women, children, and pets dead. Not even counting the regular amount of men in the military gone left to never raise said women and children. Nuke: Much lower number
I think there would be a lot less Americans around to read about it. Also British and other allied troops if they took part in the invasion (I know the British had a fleet in the Pacific).
When I was a kid, I had a neighbor who fought in the Philippines during WWII. He was a tank driver and saw a lot of combat. He said that it was a miracle he survived and that he and his buddies were happy the bombs were dropped. He said that if Truman had gone to the Philippines and dropped his drawers, everyone would have lined up and kissed his ass that's how much they felt their lives were saved.
@@carymnuhgibrilsamadalnasud1222yeah the spanish empire and usa when they occupied the phillipines were much more friendly than the japanese ever will they raped and rob the country for like 4 years and considered the worst occupiers for the hostory of the phillipines
@@carymnuhgibrilsamadalnasud1222heres the thing the filipinos (including me) has said the japanese are worse occupiers than the spanish and americans combined
I read that they were training school girls. To strap explosives onto themselves. In under to blow up allied tanks. The atomic bombings of both cities was horrific. But the casualties from Operation Downfall. Would have made Hiroshima and Nagasaki look like a drop in the ocean.
The irony is high commands plan, if downfall happened would likely have had the opposite effect. The vast casualties on the japanese side, including many children could have sparked a revolt. Meanwhile the higher the us death toll they less likely they would be to let the emperor off the hook
The book “The Smile of a Ragpicker” goes into what it was like for Japanese civilians preparing to defend their homeland. A lot of historical context! EDIT: book name.
@@donaldfrapwell4116 Yes actually, it follows the Life and conversion of a Japanese aristocratic girl. It is a catholic based book but there’s a TON of historical stuff all through out the book!
I read Japanese history book called “Shouwashi”. In this book, it is mentioned that, though it was in Japanese , local Japanese didn’t understand anything about Hirohito’s speech about the unconditional surrender of Japan. Even there were people who think “ So we won?”
Hirohito's speech was the typical corporation speech of "We surrender but we don't actually say it out loud", while delivering such speech with some complex kind of Japanese grammar and vocabulary so the civilian Japanese with limited education couldn't understand and won't think the emperor declaring lost the war so not to lose his face.
@@huytungnguyen119 Regardless we're lucky he avoided the coup and lived to actually surrender at all. Letting him keep face is a small price to pay compared to what could have happened.
In some ways he didn’t keep face because his family lost all political power and he was made to admit to his people he was merely a man and not a god. His country now doesn’t have a standing military and is effectively a colony/commonwealth
I think the most interesting part about this is that the Japanese knew exactly where the Allied forces were going to land, and at what time of the year they were going to do it. There was no deception plan like the Normandy operations where they convinced the Germans they were going to land at pas de calais. There was only one viable landing site, and there was only a couple of months in the year when a landing could occur. This meant that every single weapon the Japanese raised was going to be in the right spot for the fight.
Geography dictated were landings could occur and weather dictated when they could land. Any competent officer, even fresh lieutenant, could figure location pretty quickly. Timing was a little trickier as it depended on the logistic capabilities of the Allies and availability of troops. Something that could guessed at approximately.
Although the allies could carry out a massive air bombing campaign prior to invasion unlike at Normandy where air superiority was still contested, but regardless, it would have been to costly and i am glad the atomic bombs prevented an invasion of Japan
It was not the atomic bombs that made Japan Surrender. It was the threat of Russia piling on and joining the fight against them that made the difference. The A-bombs were devastating but so weren’t the conventional and incendiary bombs that were being rained down on Japan’s cities. Japan did not believe the US had many more bombs and it really did not. I’m sure the bombs played a role in Japan’s decision but the bombs main advantage was to get Stalin to pause his plans for domination of Europe. Everyone was fearful of Stalin, even Hitler risked the loss of the war for a shot at taking Stalin down. Though I will say one thing for the A-Bomb it has prevented a Third World War... so far.
One irony of the situation of course is that most of the Japanese war crimnals served vastly diminished sentences compared to their German counterparts, 6-8 years was typical. Of 16 men tried as Class A war criminals at the Tokyo Trials between 1946 and '48, 3 had died in prison but the remaining 13 had all been released by 1956 and at least two went on to serve in post war cabinet roles.
Makes you wonder what His majesty the great MacArthur got in return for going easy on the Japanese Even to this day it's the germans did this and the germans did that It's almost as though the entire world agreed to keep dumping on the germans whilst giving the japanese a free pass
@@daveanderson3805 As outlined in _Factories of Death: Japanese Biological Warfare, 1932-45 and the American Cover-Up_ the US got most of the 'research' into biochemical warfare the Japanese had performed up to 1945 (which was more or less worthless as it was mainly record of torture with no medical value) and more pertinently they got a very pliable regime in Tokyo in the 1950s, most pointedly they were able to continue to use military bases to prosecute the Korean war (though this was prior to the majority of the releases) specifically and to threaten the Soviet Union's pacific flank more generally after the end of the Korean war. The release of those tried at Tokyo also concided with a significant rise in support for the Japan Socialist party who had a general anti-militarist policy and opposed US bases in Japan and had a broadly pro-Soviet platform, the tacit approval by the US for the release of former cabinet ministers was part of the end of real multi party politics - Japan has been something of a one party democratic government since 1955 with only 6 years since 1955 of any party other than the LDP having apointed a PM - and consolidation of the right and centre right in Japanses politics into the modern Liberal Democratic Party (including the former prisoner Mamoru Shigemitsu) and the left into the JSP (what became the SDP and more recently the CDP). It is important to regonise that they were paroled by the Japanese state not the US (often ostensibly on health grond) but that US approval was present. It's also important to acknowelge that these men did not as a rule retire form public life and that their reintegration to public life has played a large part in shaping modern Japanse attitudes to their conduct in the war (i.e. that it was somewhere between legitimate or justifiable), several recieved not only paroles but clemency. We in the west rightfully take serious issue with North Korean propaganda and yet seem to have no issue at all with Japanese historiography, and I think particularly with the rise of Chian as a world economic and political power there's going to have to be some (hopefully) diplomatic reckoning over that at some point.
@@daveanderson3805 He got a compliant civilian population and a base for operations against Communism. This may score low marks for justice, but it scores high marks for prudence. Sometimes you have to choose between the two.
My Japanese friend’s father told me that he was thankful for the atomic bombs being dropped, because he and his friends were being taught guerrilla tactics to use against American GIs. He was 11 at the time.
I mean It was better optional than letting bloodshed to increase more. But atomic bomb was cruel to use to wipe out innocent civilians, but at the same time, it is understandable why they had no choice since Japan never wanted to surrender but rather continue fighting until the end.
@@robertcottam8824 Fun fact, that is the real reason why Japan surrendered Japan was still planning to fight after the bombs were dropped, We know this because we literally have documentation of Japan planning the defence after the bombs What got Japan to surrender was that the Soviet union entered Manchuria The thinking being - Surrendering to the Western allies was better than the fate they would of had against the Soviets Debatable tho since the US soldiers did exactly what the Russians did to the German civilians R"pe, entering homes and taking trophies ( Most Japanese artefacts in the US are from US soldiers taking them from civilian homes during the occupation)
@@Brimst0ne6800 Quite. They chose 'Murcan fast food and Disney. That's as close to hell-on-earth. Have you ever been to the USA? The Hamptons is nice but the rest.... 🤮
The Imperial Japanese gave us 2 previews of how they would oppose an invasion: Iwo Jima and Okinawa. Both were brutal, costly battles practically fought to the last man and many civilians. The terrain in Kyushu is much like Okinawa, a defenders dream. The US lost 12,000 killed talking Okinawa (1/3 navy due to kamikaze attacks), the Japanese lost almost all 110,000 defenders. By November 1945 estimates for Kyushu alone totaled 1,000,000 military defenders. The Japanese planned to continue to redeploy troops from China to the home islands. By mid summer, 1945, the joint chiefs sent an advisory to Nimitz and Macarthur to begin planning for other options to operation Downfall. The USN was a strong advocate for blockade and starvation, the Army Air Force for continued strategic bombing. These options would have resulted in a longer war, less US casualties than invasion, and unthinkable devastation of the Japanese population. The nuclear bombings were by far the best option for everyone involved.
The top military planners for the US military could not predict how long a blockade would take for such a determined, fanatical, warrior society with extreme sacrifice as part of their culture. Mass starvation would be very probable. The undetermined timeline led the Army to advocate for invasion. The extreme allied casualties projected led Truman to use the atomic option. It is noteworthy that the Japanese top military leadership wanted to keep fighting even after the second atomic bomb. They even tried to shut down the radio station that was to be used to broadcast the emperors’s surrender message.
The blockade option had its own problems; The public's support to the war would waned over times. Americans could handled short bloody wars, but not protracted wars. The blockage itself wasn't cheap. The US needed to constantly maintain a large number of troops, ships, planes etc. for starving out Japan. Furthermore, there were definitely casualties while maintaining the block as Japan wouldn't just sit idly by and died from hunger. The US would faced the war with no end in sight like Vietnam and Afghanistan. This left US three options: One, gave Japan more lenient terms. Two, Atomic Bomb. Three, an all-out invasion with a massive army whom would use everything they had, including bioweapon and chemical weapon, to beat Japan into submission or until all those who resisted was killed off.
One thing that the debaters against the bombs' use overlook was Japan's Terms of Surrender. The Emperor's council called The Big 6 were split down the middle on the terms. Three members advocated that Japan accept the Potsdam Declaration with the proviso that the imperial institution be retained. Three members held out for three additional terms. They would agree to surrendering but they wanted new terms to it, primarily to keep the Emperor as a figure of Japan's leadership. These additional terms included: 1) Japan would disarm her own forces; 2) Japan would conduct any “so-called” war crimes trials of her own nationals; and 3) there would be no occupation of Japan. This last term would assure the continuance of the Imperial system and Hirohito’s seat on the throne. Thing is there was a lot more that Hirohito had contemplated about the invasion happening and he made the tie breaking decision to surrender and act as a subordinate to MacArthur as he would be chosen as the occupation commander of Japan. So it was either face off against the rest of the world alone and die for the sake of Honor and Duty and commit National Suicide or bear the unbearable and agree to unconditional surrender and still have your country left intact.
I don't think they had any hope of winning the war. Their goal was not to force American surrender, but to force the Americans to seek peace. Remember at the time, the Allies wanted Unconditional Surrender. Their goal was to ironically push the Allied forces away from the idea of Unconditional Surrender, and possibly in the best of terms, a negotiated end to war, similar to the Russo-Japanese War, despite Russia's defeat in on the sea, the Tsar was intent to continue the war, but foreign intervention wanted it to end, and brought Russia to the negotiation table. The Japanese government, well those in charge of it really only hoped they could get some kind of negotiated end to war with possibly keeping some of her colonial assets like Korea. A flat out, unconditional surrender was well, a hard pill to swallow.
The story of the Japanese Empire is a lesson in swallowing your pride and shame to live and thrive another day. Remember, pride is not the opposite of shame; it is a symptom of it.
There's a Japanese island called Ozushima and it's where the submarine kamikaze trained. The museum on the island explains their story well. While visiting the museum, what struck me is how the Japanese weren't concerned about rebuilding their country after the war. You need a work force to rebuild, but the Japanese were willing to sacrifice their future workers as kamikaze.
Same with Germany. Near the German surrender Hitler issued Nero Decree to destroy any infrastructure left. He said "The Allies will not inherit a nation. They will inherit a ruin"
Not to mention that after you've thrown all your young women into a solid wall of firepower - there's no one left to produce the next generation of Japanese. A death cult of staggering inhumanity.
My father, a Marine Corp veteran of the Battle of Okinawa, was training for the invasion of Japan when the bombs were dropped. He told me he and his fellow Marines knew they would die in the invasion. They were to be in the first wave and knew there was no way they would survive. Thank you Mr. Truman.
The actual 1st group in was army they were to invade a couple of small off shore islands that were heavily fortified. My dad was in this army division. His division had come up all the way up through the south pacific the invasion of the Philippines and was scheduled for this landing. They were told once this was done they would then go in on the Japanese mainland. He always said thank God for that damned bomb
My father was Army and among those who were scheduled to be in the first wave to land on the home islands. Of course the invasion was not necessary, but he was among the occupational forces, and later on he saw his orders. His entire division was listed as expendable and expected to suffer casualties near 100%. . He said that literally every man woman and child was prepared to fight. He always had respect for the men he fought, in the stories he told. They were starving and still refused to surrender which , coming from a warrior tradition he respected. He said that oddly, there was no enmity from the people and like many of the occupying forces, came to love the country and people.
@@Hawkeye2001 My dad was also a medic His best friend was shot of the back end of the stretcher they were caring in the Philippines. He was 1st wave. He said that they would not ware their medical designations because that made them primary targets for the Japanese
I've spoken to a couple of Japanese WWII veterans and civilians in the 90s. In their minds, they were defending their Empire & the Emperor they had a lot of national pride and patriotism, of course they don't want to go on suicide missions, but they were willing to if ordered. That was the mentality back then.
People forget that at the point of the looming invasion, the Japanese had seen centuries of Western empires and how they ruled the world. As far as the Japanese knew, if they lost, they were going to be at best enslaved for centuries, and at worst, wiped out. If I thought my country was facing that I'd be prepared to make the ultimate sacrifice too.
Also, Japan was ready to execute every single POW at the moment the first shell was fired at the home islands, so there would be thousands of casualties that way.
US never stopped bombing Japan until the day of surrender. Many more died of firebombing than atomic bombs. But yeah, the home islands were bombed to hell non stop.
I’ve said it before, and I’ll say it again. Operation Downfall likely would have surpassed Operation Barbarossa to become the deadliest military operation in history. Just thinking about it makes me shudder. Tens of millions of people dead, soldiers being unable to distinguish civilians from combatants, Banzai charges around every corner, MG and artillery choke points in every alley, executed POWs lining the streets, house-to-house fighting in every single town and city.
And this is why they got the nuke... My dad was on Okinawa getting ready with 1st MARDIV. He said it was like someone had lifted a death sentence off their heads when they heard the news.
I can only imagine. My grandfather was wounded from Okinawa and his return kept getting delayed. I never knew why until I did my own digging. He was with the 6th marine division. I can only imagine the relief knowing the war was over.
I wouldn’t blame everything on Hirohito, given the military was practically in control of everything. If I remember correctly, there was a coup attempt to stop Hirohito from authorising the surrender as well.
Your memory is correct ... Japan's Generals and Admirals were all about saving face and, after sacrificing the entire Japanese population, would have committed hara-kiri. The atomic bombs saved millions of allied and Japanese lives as well as a continued hatred of the Japanese culture.
I see Hirohito similar to King Victor Emmanuel III of Italy, mostly a figurehead but also cowardly. Victor Emmanuel only got the courage to do his coup and oust Mussolini when it was obvious Italy faced total destruction. IF Hirohito knew what Tojo was doing in terms of war crimes and never at least protested or confronted him about it, then he was a spineless coward without question.
@@thunderbird1921you do realize that Hirohito was in favor of Japanese expansion right? the same goes for the king of italy, it didn’t make sense for either to move against those actually running their nations while things were going well in the war.
It is absolutely insane to me that this info is readily available but people still insist that the US never should have dropped the atomic bombs. It was a terrible, terrible thing that they did but it was also a necessary action to avoid many many more deaths civilian and military alike
Just like it is absolutely insane that the info about the Japanese plans and the real reason for the Japanese surrender is readily available yet people think that bombing the Japanese rubble even more finer somehow made Japan surrender.
My point, EXACTLY, bro!! The casualty estimates, JUST FOR "Operation: Downfall," ALONE would've, EASILY been in the MULTIPLE TENS OF MILLIONS!!!! Folks!! You gotta get this fact through your THICK heads!! By NO MEANS, would the Japanese acquiesce and, surrender!!! The mentality of THE ENTIRE POPULATION WAS NECK-DEEP in the Ancient Japanese warrior code of Bushido. Simply put: their lives for THEIR "god- Emperor"!!! Factor in the casualties from "Operation: Olympic"!!! Those figures LEAP to just about the HUNDREDS OF MILLIONS............... F****** DEAD, BONEHEADS!!!!! Add to that, the enormous public outcry ONCE WORD GOT OUT THAT THERE WAS A LESS-COSTLY WAY TO END THE WAR; i.e., the 2 atomic bombs!! Truman would've not only been vilified. But, his @$$ would've been REMOVED from office. Either by the 25th. Amendment's protocol OR, OUTRIGHT IMPEACHMENT!!!!! If any of you think otherwise! You're fooling yourselves!!!!!
This is a foolish and short-term view on the situation. In the war, the bombs make sense, but the implications of what dropping them meant will come to fruition in the future and maybe not even in our lifetime. When you drop something like that on a nation, you've opened the door to having that same bomb if not a worse version dropped on you. It's probably something that was inevitable due to human innovation and warmongering, but it's something America will specifically have to pay for in the future unfortunately
So my dad used to tell me this story about how he was told that he would have only 5 minutes to live in WW2. See, if the Hiroshima and Nagasaki Nuclear bombs weren't used. He and about 500,000 Americans and allies would have had to invade in the first wave. He was supposed to be the on the first wave on the beach at the Kanto Plain near Tokyo. So, you can say that I and all of my siblings and their kids are directly alive due to the nuclear bomb. It's amazing what one presidential decision can do to a family. He said, that when he arrived in Japan about a month after the bomb. His detail inspected the beach he was supposed to land on and they found machine guns, 30ft bamboo sticks with mines and sticks of dynamite at the ends all hidden in little caves along the beachhead. The US also had 500,000 drums of Mustard gas and another 500,000 drums of napalm being stored at Guam. Which was going to be used on Japan during the invasion... It would not be pretty.
In preparation for the Invasion of Japan the US made over half a million Purple Hearts. Only in the last ten years did they award half of those Purple Hearts.
My dad was going in on wave two. He was en route from Italy when the bombs were dropped. If I understand correctly, the chemical agents would be retaliatory use, not first use.
My grandfather who served in the pacific told me when I as a a teenager when I asked him what he thought about the atomic bombings “more would have died had we invaded”.
Not sure it was 'the best thing', but its definetly not the worst if we look to what might have happened if the Soviets would have gotten involved proper in the war with Japan.
@@MajorCoolD It's the best thing. Japan have changed completely compared to 80 years ago. No more fanatics willing to sacrifice their entire nation's population.
The entire history of Japan up until that point was defined by the brutal subjugation of the common people to despotic elites. It was a horrible place. They were completely backwards until the Meji restoration shortly before the war. Then they continued to be used like animals to serve the ruling class, but on a more industrial scale. During the war they were all treated as cannon fodder. Not just the kamikaze (suicide) soldiers, but the rest of the population. Including 90 year old women (and very young children) taught to make homemade knives to scuicidally attack American soldiers. It's unlikely Japan would exist today in any recognizable form if those two bombs weren't dropped. Their population would have been decimated by the millions, their entire country destroyed, and the allies would have been out for blood after losing close nearly two million soldiers (for context the US lost 300,000 in the European and Pacific theater in the war).
Whenever someone says that we didn't need to drop the atomic bombs, there is a number I like to point out. 500,000! That is the number of purple hearts the military had minted up just for the battle of Kyushu. So many were struck that we are still using up the stock today.
@@dindrmindr626 Dude, think for a moment. The Constant Bombings would eventually rack up a body count that would have exceeded the two Atom bombs. Non of the options you presented were better than the bomb. It's just choosing how you would put them down.
So you are saying that its ok to kill civilians to prevent your soldiers from dying? Or what? That pretty much justifies alot of massacres, which isnt really good you know.
@@bundabunda7774 Did you even see the video? The Japanese were going to use EVERY LEGAL AGE CIVILIAN to defend against the American invasion. 500,000 civilians is a small number if compared to the 40,000,00 civilians the Japanese were planning to use to stall the invasion
@@dindrmindr626 Dude, the video outright stated that so many Civilians were put for the final defense that barely any were left to operate the factories. They were arming them with either sticks or crudely made smoothbore rifles. They already had nothing of worth to produce.
@@PROVOCATEURSK …Would you rather we just let the Nazis live? We were dealt a bad hand overall in the WW2 time period. At least with the communists they weren’t specifically targeting whole cultures for systemic obliteration. (No, Joseph Stalin killing a lot of Ukrainians is not genocide, because he killed a lot of Russians and others too. Not saying that excuses him, though.)
@@theinquisitor8112 imo I would consider it a genocide because the holodomor was targeted specifically at Ukrainian land owners. Btw I also hate the nazis.
My great-uncle was on a troop ship preparing for the invasion when Japan surrendered. His parents were very relieved when they found out he wouldn't see combat.
The invasion of Japan would not have been as bloody as predicted The Japanese Army had lost most of its automatic weapons and heavy artillery in the defense of Okinawa
@@makeitpay8241 oh no no, apparently the more justified way to win was to blockade them with ensuing mass starvation because the Japanese government at that time clearly valued the lives of their citizens more than anything else. Or even better, give the Japanese really good terms to surrender on including the retainment of their colonial holdings. Cuz by bombing them the first time, they had to drop many of their previous conditions, and that’s not fair
The underwater suicide bombers sound ridiculous and horrific at the same time. The Emperor was a figurehead who didn't was not allowed to make military decisions. The Japanese regarded him as the direct descendant of their sun god, Ameratsu, and therefore EVERY Japanese was willing and expected to die for the emperor. It wasn't until after the 2 atom bombs were dropped that the people even had a chance to hear the emperor's voice in his surrender speech. That's how sacred he was! Finally, the generals had to surrender because the emperor surrendered. Hirohito was also spared the war crimes tribunals at MacArthur's urging.
The emperor was spared from war crimes and even allowed to maintain rule because the Americans feared rebellion. They wanted to maintain some form of control and change the country to become democratic so they could maintain ideas and influence rather than it becoming a soviet state like what happened to Germany.
Was it a lack of resources, or some other reason they didn't consider a limpet type mine with a short timer? The diver would probably still be killed either by the explosion, or trying to get away, but at least there's a chance of survival.
@@christopherconard2831 I doubt the chance of survival was very relevant to them at that point. They prepared to use schoolgirls with fucking bamboo sticks, what makes you think they'd care about a couple dozen survivors out of 1000 divers? As long as it got the job done that was fine.
Even after the A-bombs dropped US military planners weren't sure Japan would surrender. Once planners knew the bombs existed they worked them into the invasion plan. Which would be challenging since the bombs were so hard to make, after those first two there wouldn't be anymore for months. They hoped to have 4 of them ready for in the initial bombardment of Kyushu.
The planned defense was called "Ketsu Go". the planned Armageddon battle on Kyushu to turn the military situation to Japan’s favor. And after a while Hirohito had doubts about Ketsu Go being effective as high command had predicted it would be, on account of the long record of “discrepancy between plans and performance.” So he basically contemplating that going to the absolute wouldn't even matter in the end.
Good documentary. Follows closely with what my dad told me. He was drafted in 1944, and got to the Philippines in time for the Battle of Zamboanga (early 1945) and a few smaller mopping-up operations with the 41st ID. He was in training for Olympic when news of surrender came. If the planned order of battle had been used, he would have gone ashore at the coastal city of Miyazaki in he first attack (Cadillac Beach).His participation in the Occupation Forces showed him how bad things could have been. He told me stories about the tunnel complexes in the hills that he had to go through as part of the disarmament inspections. If he’d had to fight his way in, it would have been hell. Several years ago, he and I watched a documentary in which they said that the US govt. commissioned ONE MILLION Purple Heart medals to be ready for Operation Downfall. When that battle didn’t happen, the medals went to a warehouse. Every Purple Heart issued by the US Govt. since then (WW2, Korea, Vietnam, Desert Shield/Storm, Iraq, Afghanistan, etc.) has been pulled from that WWII stockpile. My dad said, “Don’t doubt that for an instant. It was gonna be that bad.”
@@TruePT I also hoped that was the case. Untill my Sister in law started learning Japanese and went there to study for half a year. Basically no one knew anything about their country in the years 32-45. And it was no accident. It's just how Japan handled the ww2 topic.
My grandmother was Japanese and served in the war with the Japanese Red Cross as a nurse. She left Japan in 1943 and spent the rest of the war in Singapore. She told that everyone was expected to fight. Even her. The nurses were trained on how to use rifles and grenades. They had hospital guard to maintain order. The nurses and staff weren't expected to take up their rifles unless the enemy was kicking in the front door of the hospital. If they did, there was Grandma with a rifle and a grenade.
I am grateful for this video because it confirms everything which my Dad told me about his time in Japan immediately after the war. My father was a lieutenant in the Third Marine Division, which was to be the tip of the spear in Operation Olympic. The task of his division and the two army divisions who were to follow them in was to establish a beachhead. The same task was the objective of the NEXT three divisions, because my Dad's force was expected to be annihilated. After the surrender, the Third was sent in as occupation forces. What shook him the most was finding warehouses crammed with bundles of bamboo spears, which were to have been used by Japanese civilians to attack him and his men should they somehow manage to make it past the beach. He also described how Japanese civilians would avoid any contact with marines, because they had been told by the Japanese media that the Globe and Anchor emblem was only given to Americans who had slaughtered their own mothers. His best memory was going to Midnight Mass in a partially destroyed Catholic Church just outside Nagasaki on Christmas Eve 1945, with American marines, soldiers and sailors worshipping alongside their former Japanese foes. His battalion CO told the assembled marines that if the collection plates for the offertory were filled to overflowing, to allow the church to begin repairs, all disciplinary reports on his desk would mysteriously disappear the next morning. His marines complied.
Nothing against your father But his CO and this made me sick "all disciplinary reports on his desk would mysteriously disappear the next morning. His marines complied." Knowing how much R"pe US soldiers committed during the occupation and how often it was ignored by CO`s only further galvanised the people against the US It proved to the Japanese people that the US were western brutes ( Comical since the Japanese did the exact same thing) Even to this day in places like Okinawa the Base is HATED by the locals they want it gone since often US personnel will commit crimes go to the base and be protected , like how that young girl was r*ped and the soldiers nearly got away with it , They only received justice after international news caught the story Not saying your father was like this, but the US army was known to be DEEPLY RACIST and not caring about any crimes against Japanese civs during the occupation seeing it as justice and revenge I've talked to a British veteran who was part of the British occupation and he remembers talking to some Japanese civilians who fled there prefecture due to it being under the US and were scared of US reprisal on them.
Read read all shit the japanesse military did 6 members of my familly where murdered in occupied Indonesia. Teachers and there kids not military . Have you ever heard of comfort women read !
@@mk_gamíng0609 Quite a lot of rubbish here. The americans aren't innocent heroes true, but it is also true that america are the reason Okinawans avoided being extinct. WHen they go into the island, they go in prepared, to shelter the local populace, to provide them with shelter and food. After all the battles they fought against Japan until then, they knew how Japan would treat the local populace, especially after Saipan. Japan encouraged okinawans to resist and fight until the end, if they can't then just commit mass suicide, this is the exact same thing japan did in saipan, they wanted the entire local populace to die alongside the soldiers. Did you know that 1/3 of Okinawa's population died during the battle? America helped to save the remaining 2/3 of the populace by coming in prepared to shelter them. Most of the older Okinawans that survived the battle were once part of this shelter built by america on the island. Compared to the Japanese that encouraged the entire islander to die along with the soldiers. You know, during the last days of the battle, when Japanese organized resistance have ended, all surviving soldiers were given order to fight guerilla warfare until death. This has unexpected tragic consequences for Okinawa populace. The surviving Japanese troops know they can't go back to Japan alive as they have been given the order to die. But since their commander in Okinawa have committed seppuku, instead of fighting guerilla warfare they simply do whatever they want, like a deserter's army. They would rape, kill, rob, and throw out the Okinawan population, to do whatever they want to prolong their life. They just don't care anymore since they all thought they were gonna die anyway. This created future tension between Okinawans and Japanese mainland later after the war, because of the contempt the Japanese soldiers treated the Okinawan populace with. Did you know that Okinawans after the war even started burning Japanese flag? This was decades ago though, but the tension was real back then. This is something that even Masahide Ota, the former Okinawa governor, and also a survivor of the battle, when he was part of the student soldier (he was a teenager), admitted in 2013, 4 years before his death. He admitted that although today there are tensions between the Okinawan population and the US base in the island, it is undeniable that America was an important part of the rebuilding of Okinawa after the war, and also to have saved Okinawans from a complete humanitarian disaster, because they came into the island prepared to shelter the local populace, a polar opposite of the contempt shown by many japanese soldiers towards the okinawan populace. Masahide Ota would know what he's talking about. He was one of the many Okinawan youths indoctrinated by the japanese army to die for the emperor. His unit was ordered to fight guerilla warfare to the death against America. His salvation was that he was captured by the americans before he could do any of that. It opened his eyes gradually to the reality.
The less bloody option? Then why did the US drop the bombs twice? Japan was already willing to surrender when Hiroshima got nuked, but the US dropped Nagasaki 3 days after. Did the people lived in Nagasaki had no choice but to die?
@@asdfghjjhgf That's simply not true, they definitively weren't. We have the cabinet protocols of them assessing it was a very limited capability of little strategic importance, and deciding to refuse to surrender. Even after the second one, the cabinet was still evenly split, with the emperor having to intervene, against all precedent. And even then - there was still a coup attempt, that barely succeded, to try to stop him. Any attempt to claim that they were willing to surrender following the first one, not to mention claiming the US knew that - is completely untrue and unhistorical.
@@tomhuynh3867 How would they have conquered Japan? They didn't have the Naval power to launch a invasion of that scale. Only the US could have invaded Japan. So unless the US offered them the use of their ships I don't see that happening. The Soviets were a major land military power not a major naval power.
@@asdfghjjhgf After Hiroshima, the Japanese military concluded it was a one-off stunt to cower them into surrender. They did not believe the US could make more than 1 or 2 a year at most. Nagasaki was complete shock as it meant the US could produce maybe a 1 or 2 a month and more were definitely coming. They were not the only reason Japan surrendered. BTW Japan had an active nuclear weapons program so they knew what happened at Hiroshima and Nagasaki.
My grandma said the Japanese army men came and taught them to use sharpened sticks against the Americans. She said when the army men left, they all threw down the sticks and said "what good are sticks against guns" They were done with the war, starving, and exploited by this military regime.
Just read this now. Good comment from Gran. The Japanese. Were starving to death by the time Hiroshima was bombed. McArthur as Supreme Commander had power and latitude never granted to a general or anyone else since. He knew how to handle the terrible situation. He had to feed the Japanese people or things would deteriorate out of control. So he took all the forward supplied food provisions stashed on islands for the intended main island invasion and used them to feed the Japanese. Additionally his meeting with Hirohito where Hirohito came and met with Him completly diffused any or most animosity towards the American occupiers. I have changed my mind about Japan and ww2 several times. That means understanding maily as I learned more. One other point, Japan lost the war the day they bombed Pearl. JIA did not listen to Admiral Yamamoto Isoruku who orchestrated the Pearl attack. He figured about 1 year for Japan to be somewhat successful. Didn't even really get that though.
I remember hearing that on the month of the planned invasion of Japan a hurricane hit the Japanese coast. The type not seen since the Mongol Invasion and might've scattered the American Invasion just like it did the Mongol one. Talk about a bullet dodged.
It hit the American staging areas and would have delayed The Invasion for a couple months Giving the Japanese 2 months more to dig in unfortunately the Japanese had only a 6 week supply of food stored for the invasion
I had an uncle who was stationed at Pearl Harbor at the beginning of the war. He was thankfully out on a supply mission when the attack happened. He drove landing craft during some of the early amphibious assaults and ended the war on a UDT. If the invasion of Japan had happened, he would have seen a lot of action. He began and ended the war with luck on his side.
The more I learn about this, the more cemented I am that we did the right thing in dropping the bombs. For a while now, nothing nobody says will convince me otherwise. I've even heard that some Japanese who lived through that period were glad the bombs dropped, because if they hadn't, they would be dead today.
One of the men who worked on the Manhattan Project as well as the B-17, Roscoe Charles Wilson, surveyed Japan after their surrender. He found every rice Pattie, home, and city entrenched and armed to the teeth. As terrible as the bombs were, they saved more lives than they took.
Sad how the military leaders of Japan thirsted for their own peoples blood more than the Americans did. Probably the only time in history where Nukes where the more humane option.
i mean the people also believed it it's amazing what propaganda can do. It's the same today all most of the thing you believe is from an unconscious national propaganda effort that's started when you were born.
I do love how some people stubbornly insist that Japan was on the verge of surrender and the US cruelly deployed the atomic bombs just 'because' edit: well.. I certainly didn't expect this comment to blow up
The people who complain about the atomic bombs clearly have no idea how brutally vicious the Japanese could be on a good day; let alone in a desperate attempt to defend their own island.
Fun fact. Japs got off considerably well than their previously occupied areas. So those a bombs were nothing conpared to what the japs did to their occupied areas. Especially korea and china.
As much as I disliked McArthur, I have to give him props for the way he handled post-war Japan. He understood that there was a vast cultural difference between Japan and the West. While Japan the country had modernized with amazing speed, much of their culture was still essentially feudal. All the worst war crimes against civilians and POWs were a part of that feudal mentality from the top to the bottom. The Allies were wise to go gentle on Japan despite what were to anyone's definition vicious war crimes. My Uncle was a Marine who fought in the South and Central Pacific, and he said of the Japanese: "They were tough, smart and had no give up in them. If we have to go to war again, I'd rather they be beside me than in front of me."
Why do so many people dislike McArthur? From what I've seen so far he was a capable general and a great diplomat; and he did a really good job making peace with Japan after the war.
@user-yc7vc3fq7b. No he didn't. This is a common misconception, he never actually advocated for using nukes in Korea. ua-cam.com/video/Msr2w02m8VE/v-deo.html
When it comes to the debate between the atomic bombings or invasion. I have two things to say. 1. The atomic bombings of Hiroshima and Nagasaki were terrible and awful, but so were all the other options. 2. It’s easy to pass judgment when you have decades of hindsight on your side and not making a critical decision in the actual moment. It’s almost like war is an awful destructive experience that should be avoided but requires decisive choice making when placed into the situation.
@@ericsuarez834 completely different, one is a legitimate attack against military targets to save the country we're Attacking. And the one you're talking about is killing children because they are innocent.
Imagine if we didn't drop the Atomic Bombs on Japan and instead invaded the island nation. We in the West wouldn't be talking about D-Day the invasion of Normandy as much as we do but the amphibious invasion of Japan. We would've lost 500,000 to a million US Soldiers and Marines and hundreds of thousands of other Allied soldiers. Not to mention the 10 million more or so Japanese soldiers and civilians. That is insane. And some people say the Atomic Bombings on Japan was horrifying and shouldn't have happened. But if you look at what would have happen if we invaded Japan instead, you can clearly see what was the best option.
It didn't help there really weren't many good options. Others saying that just conventional Bombing and Blockades would have worked better. Forgetting that mass starvation and possibly a higher body count as well as wider area of damage don't make them necessarily better than the bomb.
@@silverhawkscape2677 Exactly!! It was the best outcome with the least amount of deaths. Saying that blockading Japan and continuing conventional and fire bombings would have been a better decision is ridiculous. Not many seem to understand that the fire bombings for example killed more Japanese than the Atomic Bombs. And a invasion of Japan would be even worse for everyone involved.
There was no guarantee that Japan would surrender after being nuked and initially they didn't. Which is why we bombed them again. Even that didn't get an immediate response.
My grandpa serve in Kyoudo Boei Gyugun, he once said that theres a rumor among the auxiliary volunteers that they will be send to Japan's mainland to defend the country.
I've lived in Japan over 30 years and grit my teeth every summer while the national media gets all weepy about the nuke strikes. They would never be convinced that less people died because of them. Other than the well deserved retribution, it was absolutely essential use the coup de grace or else half of the country, at least, would be speaking Russian now. IMO
It wasn't just the lesser evil, but Japan choose this path. People are responsible for the actions of their government, that includes the suffering they caused their own people.
@@notest396 the Japanese conservatives government has perpetrated outrageous inhumane level of coupe de grace and Stockholm syndrome brainwashing on the average Japanese person.
That must have been frustrating. I’m around Chinese people, ( in Vancouver). Even with asking, I’ve never heard a Chinese person. Give thanks, for the allies, (mostly USA), for the defeat of The Japanese.
@@billpetersen298 I wouldn't expect them to be too thankful to the US. China was invaded in 1937 and the US did nothing at the time. The US didn't join the war until they were attacked themselves meanwhile China was going all out trying to fight the Japanese while the US slowly mobilized. The UK was also not the most helpful and refused to let the Chinese station some of their best troops in Burma which eventually lead to the fall of Burma and China being cut off from their biggest supply route. Yes the allies were instrumental in defeating Japan but they got involved for self interest reasons and not out of support for China who was illegally invaded.
@@notest396 Lol the war started by four of their megacorporation, not their people. People often forget that Imperial japan is what happen if megacorporation take control of government.
My Grandfather was 6 when the war ended. He remembered that the High School students were pulled from school and given knives. Then the middle schoolers were mobilized for labor. Luckily nothing ever came of it.
I have several times mentioned in comments the fact that our soldiers would have had to kill every man, woman and child if it came to an invasion. I tell them that the people killed by the bombs were “sacrificed” for the rest of Japan to survive.
In brazilian school system (mainly dominated by leftists) they teach people that "Japan was ready to surrender/already surrender" and that the US only bombed Japan to "scare the soviets". Yeah it is dumb and doesnt make any sense.
There were still wharehouses full of weapons being held and not issued. Old guns like Russisn no.3 Revolvers and ancient Samuria Swords. My Grandfather brought a bunch of the "obsolete" weapons home after liberating them during the occupation in 1946. For some reason the Japanese government was holding on to the odd weapons instead of issuing them, maybe part of the infighting of their military forces
Actually, at the later stage of the war, a conventional bomb attack by a Japanese plane against the U.S naval task forces was a suicide mission just attempting to get thru the tremendous amount of anti aircraft fire the U.S ships could put up for defense made a successful mission and coming back alive next to impossible,
That is kinda the point of a kamikaze attack. It wasn't worth the cost trying to get experienced pilots and quality aircraft if it was just going to get shredded in a matter of minutes trying to penetrate their air defense. Kamikaze pilots in contrast required little to no training and no specialised aircraft so if just one makes it through then it was worth it in their eyes.
My family is Japanese-American. My grandfather served as a translator in the Military Intelligence Service (MIS) in the Pacific and in MacArthur's camp during the occupation. The state of Japan post-war was horrific. He and a friend would sneak duffle bags of food and supplies to family they had never even met and only knew by name. Had the invasion happened, there might not have been anyone left.
I knew somebody who was a translator for General MacArthur's office after the war and she used to handle the incoming mail. She said that the vast majority of mail from civilians was basically, "send more rice, PLEASE".
"140 Days to Hiroshima" is a great book to read for an in-depth analysis of this question. Whatever your conclusion, I know that my father spent 4 years fighting from island to island in the Pacific and my father-in-law, who landed in France on D2, was on a troop carrier halfway across the Pacific with orders to be part of the landing and attacking force when the surrender occurred and their ship was ordered to turn around and head back to San Diego. So, there was an excellent chance that neither my wife, myself, our kids, or our entire family would be here if the atomic bombs had not been used (as horrific as those events were).
I think this is truly evidence for the bombs being the best choice in the end. This not only saved millions but showed how horrible nuclear weapons are. Very informative video.
There's a reason why the US chose to drop two nuclear bombs rather than invading Japan. Yes its tragic what happened due to that discission but far more people both soldiers and civilians would have been killed if the allies invaded japan.
Or they could have just accepted the conditional surrender japanese were offering.....which they ended up accepting at the end anyway japan is still a monarchy
@@leaveme3559 Stop being stupid. The conditions Japan wanted were to hold on to some of their conquests. A conditional surrender was not an option. Hirohito was only kept around after the fact as a stabilizing force against communism.
@@leaveme3559 Don't be an illiterate, Japan's offer was not of unconditional surrender. The monarchy stayed because MacArthur and many other US officials (Not all, as others wanted the Emperor tried) deemed it necessary to keep the Japanese nation together in the threat of Stalin - who pressured the JCP to initiate a violent Communist uprising in early 1950 - and Communism.
@@eodyn7 no they didn't it's demands are clearly stated in the video they wanted the emperor to still exist and usa could have agreed and not kill 100s of thousands of innocent people
"Thank God for the atom bomb." -- Paul Fussell, future cultural and literary historian, in August 1945 a second lieutenant and ETO veteran slated to take part in the invasion of Japan.
Regarding the suicide frogmen, their greatest strength would be if no one knew they were there in the first place. Otherwise the Americans might have just chucked grenades over the sides of the landing craft which would have killed the frogmen by concussion. Considering how America's UDT (forerunners of the Navy SEALs) operated during this time and how they were not treated as a suicide force the Japanese weren't likely to be successful. In fact I think the Viet Cong also had underwater sappers and they used less. As for the Emperor, it seemed that the militarists of the Imperial military had more authority using the Emperor as a rubber stamp. Hirohito's greatest crime might not have been that he ordered the deaths of millions, but he didn't stop them when he had the authority to do so. Keep in mind when he made the decision to surrender there was a military coupe that tried to overthrow him, but it failed.
While in high school in the 60's a Japanese foreign exchange student questioned, "Why TWO A-bombs"? I upset him when I answered, "We didn't have 3 ready to go at the time". I had no idea if that was true or not, but it seemed an appropriate reply.
We can debate all day as to whether the Soviet Invasion of Manchuria or the Atomic Bombings of Hiroshima and Nagasaki (Or both) is what truly drove Japan to unconditional surrender, but we cannot deny the fact that regardless of what was the true cause, Japan's unconditional surrender saved everyone, even themselves, from a lot of death and destruction.
I think it was a bunch of contributing factors the soviets joining instead of mediating, nuclear bombings/ firebombing campaign, Successes in the submarine blockade of Japan, and Emperor using his influence for peace. Finally overcame the war hawks in the Japanese government.
@@tylerkapteyn5830 the soviets would have had the advantage of landing in the boonies of Japan, up in Hokkaido and northern Honshu, and they had just taken Sakhalin, so they wouldn't have needed nearly as much naval capacity especially with the Japanese being focused on the Americans and British in the South. But even if the Soviets had no realistic ability to land on Japan, was that something the Japanese planners were aware of with the fog of war and the desperation of late 1945?
@@sankarchaya if that happened, the post war history would drastically changed. there might be no south korea, and a new conflict between soviet controlled japan and allied controlled japan will spark.
The debate is over because the Japanese insiders have told everyone that the Soviet invasion of Korea was simply not a factor back in Tokyo. For the key decision makers, the Emperor's new status was EVERYTHING. Truman indicated through channels that he'd let the Emperor live on in his palace. THAT'S what did it. This reality has been twisted and omitted in every US official telling of the decision... because Truman was reversing FDR's pledge. But, ever since the Cold War, Moscow has tried to build-up its self-importance to the Pacific War. It's a MYTH, a myth tied into the Soviet's attempt at creating Western Guilt WRT the atomic bomb... and their detonation. It was plain on its face that the US would be using atomic bombs on Mother Russia if the Bolsheviks crossed the line. The KGB was arguing that you don't need atomic weapons to win wars // win the peace. Think of it (the proposition) as military-theology: just say your prayers.
Great video. This a very seldom talked about aspect of the end of the war. I don't think many people will argue that the dropping of the 2 atomic bombs was a good thing, but it was a necessary thing. It gave the Japanese leadership a way out instead of having to sacrificing millions of lives. As for the predicted cost here's a bit of trivia. To this day the US Military is using Purple Hearts minted for Operation Olympic.
Honestly what japan was doing at that point can it even be called war cause at that point they were just knowingly sending people to their deaths for a war they knew was lost
I have lived in Japan for many years and love it. That said, I hike a lot here, and just about every time I venture into the mountains I am grateful we dropped the bomb. This terrain is so rugged, so easy to hide in and defend. I often think that if it weren't for the bombs we'd still be fighting in the hills.
@@1pcfred That's different the natives were divided and easy to be turned against each other, The Japanese on the other hand were religiously fanatic and loyal, to their emperor whom they believed was a living god. There's a story of that one Japanese soldier in the Philippines that didn't surrender till 1970. I think a more fair comparison would be Afghanistan, and the Imperial Japanese army like ISIS or Al-Qaeda. Kamikaze (suicide attacks) the reports of Japanese soldiers fake surrendering only to blow them selves and the American soldiers trying to detain them.
@@GameSteph Teruo Nakamura didn't surrender until 1974. Hiroo Onoda was the more famous hold out though. He also surrendered in 74, but before Nakamura did. One screwball named Shoichi Yokoi was hiding a mile from the US air base in Guam. They found him in 1972. The history of Japanese holdouts is pretty entertaining. Some people.
@@j.w.matney8390 the Indians did not start out on the plains. As Europeans showed up in the east they kind of had to go west themselves. Least the ones that weren't wiped out by European diseases. We brought them horses. They were not a plains horse culture before we arrived. There were no horses here. The Spanish brought horses to the New World in the 1500s. So horses are immigrants too!
"You see, the American soldier is trained with a preset kill limit. Our goal is to send wave after wave until we surpass that limit." -General Zap Branimota
Fun Fact- in anticipation of Operation Downfall The United States minted millions of Purple Hearts in 1945. They have not struck a single purple heart since then. It was anticipated that there would be 5-10 million Americans killed and wounded in the invasion of Japan, and at least double that in Japanese casualties, some commanders thought that we would literally have to exterminate all of Japan because they would not surrender. When you look at it objectively the 2 nuclear attacks were the humane thing to do, compared to the alternative. Oh, and also The United States seizing Japan saved them from the Soviet Union, who were also planning their own invasion of Japan. Japan was literally months, or even weeks away from being cannibalized by the Soviets and turning it into a satellite state, truly a fate worse than death.
@@marcoroberts9462 no, the emperor planned to surrender to Soviet but Imperial government (the majority people on the government are from IJA) want to continue the war. The emperor decided to surrender when he heard the news about Nagasaki and Hiroshima.
@@marcoroberts9462 Enough of that lie. The damn Japanese military tried to stage a coup against their own Emperor when they found out that he was planning on surrendering.
My father was reactivated into the US army when the Americans landed to liberate the Philippines from Imperial Japan. After the Japanese were defeated in the Philippines, my father's unit practiced with the landing forces for the invasion of Japan.
Damn. The Japanese were REALLY going all out with anything and anyone they could spare for the invasion😳. I remember seeing a vid on simple history about these low quality weapons too and I was kinda caught off guard when I saw it
The first days would have been a bloodbath, but after a day or two of intense combat, Japan would have collapsed into itself. Imagine Japan divided; with Kyushu and Shikoku becoming American satellite states, Hokkaido being turned into a Soviet satellite and Honshu ruled by a Japanese council directly overlooked by the UN security council.
My father was at Iwo Jima and Okinawa and was on his way back to the western pacific for the invasion. His ship would be involved with pre invasion bombardment, so he would have been in the crosshairs of kamikazes before the troops hit the beach. He was very happy they dropped those two bombs.
The US approach to the emperor was the most pragmatic and smartest solution, and although Hirohito gave the thumbs up for overall campaigns, it's not like he was being briefed, "cool if we gas x amount of Chinese this week or kill x amount of western POWs this week".
My mother was in the thick of it; although a high school student, she was put to work making parts at an aircraft factory and spent her time running from Allied bombs.
If the invasion of Japanese home island happened, my theory is that the invasion is similar to the invasion of the Italian Peninsula but more slower and bloodier
Japan might have been much more of a problem if the hadnt focused so heavily on kamikaze tactics. They could have kept going for far longer if they werent sending their personnel on suicide missions constantly, let alone at all.
Kamikazes actually made a fair bit of sense from a military stand point. Ironically they cost less troops to use than regular fighting missions. I would advise looking at this very good video ua-cam.com/video/F-GVSXy37Gc/v-deo.html&ab_channel=PotentialHistory
@@CaledonianGaisgeach at the end of the war Britain sent some forces to the Pacific theater and when the kamikazes attacked the British were horrified. The Americans were all like, first time? Because by then for them it was old hat. Wearing a necklace of kamikaze bones around your neck was considered great juju. That was the depth of savagery we'd sunk to.
I'm pretty sure it was due to the problem that most of the air crafts had very little ammunition left and all of the experienced pilots were ready dead.
kamikaze tactics are just a symptom of the terrible strategy of Japan. They were extremely racists, so they consider the enemy a non entity. They would abuse and torment their own man in training, brainwashing them to the point of insanity. They never considered any chance of defeat. It was all or nothing from the start. And not only that. They hit their targets during the first wave of expansion, but as the germans, they failed to make the occupied lands useful. They were too busy on the genocidal part, so they were under supplied. Yamamoto knew that Pearl Harbour attack would give them around 6 months to assert dominance, or they would be condemned to fail.
My father was in the Royal Naval Volunteer reserve as Lt Commander in charge of Landing Craft Tank Gun Boats, after the defat of germany he was told that his flotilla of craft were going to have there 4.7 inch guns replaced with a heaver calibre and more accurate weapons, that the craft would be modified with ballast tanks, the plan being that they should sail up to the invasion beaches and then flood the ballast tanks to sit on the bottom and make a stable gun platform so they could shoot directly into the japanese bunkers to disable theire guns as it was found unless a large calibre shell made a direct hit the palm tree, sand bunkers didnt seem affected. he knew that the likelyhood of surviving was next to nil but the chance of capture was everpressent so bought himself a 9mm self loading pistol to have as well as his service revolver to ensure he had one round left for his own head. he never forgave the japanese and said the dropping of the atom bombs was the best thing since sliced bread. Thanks for a very informative video. Nigel
The emperor was a war criminal and the Japanese got off easy compared to Germany. Germany still is apologetic for what they did and the Japanese don't even acknowledge their crimes. I never understood this and it makes my blood boil whenever I see someone "moaning" about the US using A-Bombs on Japan.
Good post, TF! I remember how men were aboard ship on their way to mainland Japan when they heard that Japan surrendered. We can only imagine their joy when they heard that no more American, Canadian, British or Australian blood would be spilled.
Some of media about this is worth to check out: - An Emperor In August covered some details about this and even an attempted coup to prevent Hirohito. - Barefoot Gen - The Eternal Zero, about kamikaze pilot’s life and despised to see some of inexperienced young pilot to participate in the suicidal mission.
I remember reading that contemporary Japanese said that dropping the atomic bombs was the right decision. Besides the millions killed, an invasion would have completely wrecked the country and taken far longer to recover.
It’s insane how this mission would’ve made the two atom bombs look less terrifying. Imagine how much different the world would be if dozens of millions more died, maybe Japan would’ve been divided within the Allies since there would be very few civilians. Maybe Japan would’ve been a 3rd world country, the possibilities of this going through are staggering
I’ve read somewhere that the allies knew the casualties would be so high so they created alot of Purple Hearts and that the purple hearts they give now are from that era
It wasn't the Emperor that was pushing the fight on civilians, but the Japanese military, primarily the the Imperial Army. Japan was 100 percent controlled by the military. When the Emperor accepted the surrender terms, Japanese troops attempted to overthrow the Emperor's decision. Fortunately, the Commander of the Imperial Guard Division refused to join the coup and ordered his troops to defend the Emperor. He and many of his troops died defending the Emperor from these forces. The Emperor made very few of the decisions during the war actually; most were made by the Imperial War Council made up of mostly Army officers.
For me, it sounds like, that hirohito (and staff) hoped to destroy the first wave of invasion and to show the allies (without USSR) that they are still able to fight them. Afterwards, they wouldve tried to negoticate through the soviets, because they weren´t in the war (yet). But after the Russians attacked in Manchuria, this option was not given anymore. Since Japan was an anticommunist state it needed a reason to surrender, which wasnt the russian attack. So the Atomic bombs, which were (for me) not the main reason of surrendering came coincedently in the right time. So hirohito gave his speech and surrendered to the allies, to let the world believe, that it was the allies alone, who defeated japan. This also helped him, to stay in power, because the USA were interesseted in an allied-favored Japan, because the Soviet-American-friendship held high during the war, was already iced out.
This is definitely what happened. The Soviets were the bigger threat, but the devastation of the bomb enabled a surrender without allowing Soviet influence in Japan
@@somedudeonline1936 True. Also how would the Soviets even invade Japan? They didn't have a navy powerful enough to transport a huge army to invade Japan. The Russians are more of a land military power not a naval power.
@@XD152awesomeness How would the Soviets have invaded Japan? They didn't have a Navy to launch such a invasion. The US had the Naval and Air power to successfully invade Japan not the Soviets.
The Japanese also had at least one submarine at sea equipped with biological weapons (cholera) they planned to unleash on San Diego. The end of the war came before it reached its target.
To those who think Japan was worried of a Soviet invasion in 1945 which made them surrender, think again. D-Day in 1944 had almost 7,000 vessels involved, and that was just invading a small part of France. Not just combat ships but ships specialized for transport, landing and logistics. By mid 1945 the Soviet Navy had less than 600 vessels, a third were subs, the rest were gunboats, old and captured ships and lend lease transports, and with the soviet-western relationship getting cold, the Western Allies ain't lending them any more.
Considering there are few admirals who can plan a Naval Invasion and even if they did Russian Fighters aren't made for long range escorts due to the nature of air battles in the Western Front and their Shock Armies, Guards Rifle Division and Assault Engineers are Land Based troops not made for Naval Invasions like dedicated Marines are and majority of the Russian Navy is in Europe it will take forever to relocate them that if it happens without trouble so only two country can actually invade Japan which is UK (this is already a stretch) and US
I've known a few guys whose fathers came home from the Pacific theatre with samurai swords. McArthur demanded that the entire population was to be disarmed, including family's ceremonial swords. Each family took their swords to an allied temporary admin point and handed theirs in. These were passed out to troops as tokens of the victory. Some of these GIs came home with priceless centuries old swords. One of my friend's dad had two of them displayed in his rec room.
One of japans national swords was lost after the owner of it had to hand it in. The masamune sword. Nobody knows where it is to this day other than it being handed to a u.s gi
The Emperor was more of a figurehead than an active head of government. The structure of the Japanese government under their constitution meant the IJA and IJN were not under civilian control and could operate as they saw fit. Also, when it became apparent Hirohito ordered acceptance of the Potsdam Declaration he was the target of a failed coup attempt.
The idea of the Emperor being only a figurehead is not true. The army was responsible directly to the emperor. They took their power from the support of the Emperor. They would never have dared oppose him directly. Hiro Hito agreed to everything until he realized he would lose power. The failed coup attempt wasn't targeting the Emperor, it was targeting the record of him surrendering. The army knew once people would be aware the emperor had decided to stop the war, the would have no other choice than to comply. Had Hiro hito refused to declare war to the USA, the war would never have happened, such was his weight in japanese policies. The Japanese Emperor was perfectly informed of the policies of all government including Tojo's. I agree Emperors at that time would perhaps not meddle daily in public affairs for fears of losing their authority but going to war was far too serious a subject to even think Hiro Hito did not give full support to the military including to the atrocities they commited.
The Emperor was educated and had his people. He knew what was going on. They do say the royal family made a fortune from the looting of the territories they conquered.
"We must embrace pain and burn it as fuel for our journey. She who loves roses must be patient and not cry out when she is pierced by thorns" - Kenji Miyazawa
From what I've read, Hirohito was kind of a push-over, he never really wanted to be Emperor and actually just wanted to be a scientist. Does this make him a good man? No, probably not as he was well aware of the "medical experiments" and even personally watching a live dissection, I do however think he had a lot less power on a practical scale than we sometimes assume.
I feel that Hirohito was intimidated by the prospect of assassination at the hands of fanatical Army or Naval personnel. Still, he might have been able to control them.
I can't even blame hirohito for ww2. The 2nd sino-japanese war (which started the world war 2 in the pacific) was started by rogue army officer. In order to save face ( as not to say they lost control of the army) the civilian governemt endorsed the the attack after the fact. Add to that the kyujo incident where rogue army officers (again) tried to capture the emperor, destroy the recording of the surrender speach in order to continue the war. It was a good call for douglas not to drag the emperor to the tribunal. Not only did it help the transition after war, it secure japan as ally in cold war.
So in other terms, it was either lose millions through the invasion or lose hundreds of thousands from the atomic bombs, and the second was the lesser evil
My dad worked with a man who was a marine on Saipan. He was there for the troop build up for the main invasion of the main islands. He said after japan surrendered “you never saw a happier group of guys”. The man went on to say that all of the marines felt they would all die if they invaded, and happy they didn’t have to since the bombs were dropped.
It's more than understandable that they were happy. Anyone would've been if they had cheated death.
@Renzo Alarcón I doubt the invasion would have been any better.
@Renzo Alarcón Invasion: 3 million women, children, and pets dead. Not even counting the regular amount of men in the military gone left to never raise said women and children.
Nuke: Much lower number
@Renzo Alarcón a invasion of the home islands will cause more casualties than the bombs combined because of fanatical defence and booby traps
@@FLTNUR---Couldn't agree with you more it would've been a blood bath.
Imagine how insane it would’ve been to read about the invasion of Japan in history books..
D Day of Asia
What two airplanes?
I think there would be a lot less Americans around to read about it. Also British and other allied troops if they took part in the invasion (I know the British had a fleet in the Pacific).
...and there'd be millions fewer Japanese to read about it too! It would have been a willing genocide.
Everyone died. The end.
When I was a kid, I had a neighbor who fought in the Philippines during WWII. He was a tank driver and saw a lot of combat. He said that it was a miracle he survived and that he and his buddies were happy the bombs were dropped. He said that if Truman had gone to the Philippines and dropped his drawers, everyone would have lined up and kissed his ass that's how much they felt their lives were saved.
For the American army?!?
@@carymnuhgibrilsamadalnasud1222yeah the spanish empire and usa when they occupied the phillipines were much more friendly than the japanese ever will they raped and rob the country for like 4 years and considered the worst occupiers for the hostory of the phillipines
@@carymnuhgibrilsamadalnasud1222heres the thing the filipinos (including me) has said the japanese are worse occupiers than the spanish and americans
combined
I read that they were training school girls. To strap explosives onto themselves. In under to blow up allied tanks. The atomic bombings of both cities was horrific. But the casualties from Operation Downfall. Would have made Hiroshima and Nagasaki look like a drop in the ocean.
Exactly!
The fire bombing of Tokyo caused more casualties than both bombs together but it's hardly ever talked about.
The nation of Japan has the belief of never giving up and strive for the goal at all costs.
The irony is high commands plan, if downfall happened would likely have had the opposite effect. The vast casualties on the japanese side, including many children could have sparked a revolt. Meanwhile the higher the us death toll they less likely they would be to let the emperor off the hook
@@wombatwilly1002 it's because it happend in a span of a year or two
The book “The Smile of a Ragpicker” goes into what it was like for Japanese civilians preparing to defend their homeland. A lot of historical context! EDIT: book name.
Sounds interesting but I don't see anything with that title. Is it "The Smile of the Ragpicker" by the author of "A Song for Nagasaki"?
@@donaldfrapwell4116 Yes actually, it follows the Life and conversion of a Japanese aristocratic girl. It is a catholic based book but there’s a TON of historical stuff all through out the book!
@@TruePT wait but what’s the title tho
@@gwebb8486 The Song of a Ragpicker.
@@TruePT that’s not a book tho, are u sure it’s not smile of a ragpicker?
I read Japanese history book called “Shouwashi”. In this book, it is mentioned that, though it was in Japanese , local Japanese didn’t understand anything about Hirohito’s speech about the unconditional surrender of Japan. Even there were people who think “ So we won?”
Hirohito's speech was the typical corporation speech of "We surrender but we don't actually say it out loud", while delivering such speech with some complex kind of Japanese grammar and vocabulary so the civilian Japanese with limited education couldn't understand and won't think the emperor declaring lost the war so not to lose his face.
@@huytungnguyen119 Regardless we're lucky he avoided the coup and lived to actually surrender at all. Letting him keep face is a small price to pay compared to what could have happened.
@@huytungnguyen119He came close to losing head and ass as well as face.
Fascism is a hell of a drug
In some ways he didn’t keep face because his family lost all political power and he was made to admit to his people he was merely a man and not a god. His country now doesn’t have a standing military and is effectively a colony/commonwealth
I think the most interesting part about this is that the Japanese knew exactly where the Allied forces were going to land, and at what time of the year they were going to do it. There was no deception plan like the Normandy operations where they convinced the Germans they were going to land at pas de calais. There was only one viable landing site, and there was only a couple of months in the year when a landing could occur. This meant that every single weapon the Japanese raised was going to be in the right spot for the fight.
Geography dictated were landings could occur and weather dictated when they could land. Any competent officer, even fresh lieutenant, could figure location pretty quickly. Timing was a little trickier as it depended on the logistic capabilities of the Allies and availability of troops. Something that could guessed at approximately.
Yep, it would have been a massive blood bath. For both sides
Although the allies could carry out a massive air bombing campaign prior to invasion unlike at Normandy where air superiority was still contested, but regardless, it would have been to costly and i am glad the atomic bombs prevented an invasion of Japan
Almost exactly
One Landing Beach was undefended
It was not the atomic bombs that made Japan Surrender. It was the threat of Russia piling on and joining the fight against them that made the difference. The A-bombs were devastating but so weren’t the conventional and incendiary bombs that were being rained down on Japan’s cities. Japan did not believe the US had many more bombs and it really did not. I’m sure the bombs played a role in Japan’s decision but the bombs main advantage was to get Stalin to pause his plans for domination of Europe. Everyone was fearful of Stalin, even Hitler risked the loss of the war for a shot at taking Stalin down.
Though I will say one thing for the A-Bomb it has prevented a Third World War... so far.
One irony of the situation of course is that most of the Japanese war crimnals served vastly diminished sentences compared to their German counterparts, 6-8 years was typical. Of 16 men tried as Class A war criminals at the Tokyo Trials between 1946 and '48, 3 had died in prison but the remaining 13 had all been released by 1956 and at least two went on to serve in post war cabinet roles.
Makes you wonder what His majesty the great MacArthur got in return for going easy on the Japanese Even to this day it's the germans did this and the germans did that It's almost as though the entire world agreed to keep dumping on the germans whilst giving the japanese a free pass
@@daveanderson3805 As outlined in _Factories of Death: Japanese Biological Warfare, 1932-45 and the American Cover-Up_ the US got most of the 'research' into biochemical warfare the Japanese had performed up to 1945 (which was more or less worthless as it was mainly record of torture with no medical value) and more pertinently they got a very pliable regime in Tokyo in the 1950s, most pointedly they were able to continue to use military bases to prosecute the Korean war (though this was prior to the majority of the releases) specifically and to threaten the Soviet Union's pacific flank more generally after the end of the Korean war.
The release of those tried at Tokyo also concided with a significant rise in support for the Japan Socialist party who had a general anti-militarist policy and opposed US bases in Japan and had a broadly pro-Soviet platform, the tacit approval by the US for the release of former cabinet ministers was part of the end of real multi party politics - Japan has been something of a one party democratic government since 1955 with only 6 years since 1955 of any party other than the LDP having apointed a PM - and consolidation of the right and centre right in Japanses politics into the modern Liberal Democratic Party (including the former prisoner Mamoru Shigemitsu) and the left into the JSP (what became the SDP and more recently the CDP). It is important to regonise that they were paroled by the Japanese state not the US (often ostensibly on health grond) but that US approval was present.
It's also important to acknowelge that these men did not as a rule retire form public life and that their reintegration to public life has played a large part in shaping modern Japanse attitudes to their conduct in the war (i.e. that it was somewhere between legitimate or justifiable), several recieved not only paroles but clemency. We in the west rightfully take serious issue with North Korean propaganda and yet seem to have no issue at all with Japanese historiography, and I think particularly with the rise of Chian as a world economic and political power there's going to have to be some (hopefully) diplomatic reckoning over that at some point.
To be accurate, many nazis war criminals indeed got free passes, due to the impending cold war coming right next.
Sad for their victims.
@@daveanderson3805 He got a compliant civilian population and a base for operations against Communism. This may score low marks for justice, but it scores high marks for prudence. Sometimes you have to choose between the two.
@@christosvoskresye yep war even a Cold War is a very dirty business
My Japanese friend’s father told me that he was thankful for the atomic bombs being dropped, because he and his friends were being taught guerrilla tactics to use against American GIs. He was 11 at the time.
I mean It was better optional than letting bloodshed to increase more. But atomic bomb was cruel to use to wipe out innocent civilians, but at the same time, it is understandable why they had no choice since Japan never wanted to surrender but rather continue fighting until the end.
Crumbs. Imagine if the Russians had invaded. GIs least of their worries.
@@scamhunter2346the options were either “hell on earth” or hell on earth.
@@robertcottam8824 Fun fact, that is the real reason why Japan surrendered
Japan was still planning to fight after the bombs were dropped, We know this because we literally have documentation of Japan planning the defence after the bombs
What got Japan to surrender was that the Soviet union entered Manchuria
The thinking being - Surrendering to the Western allies was better than the fate they would of had against the Soviets
Debatable tho since the US soldiers did exactly what the Russians did to the German civilians
R"pe, entering homes and taking trophies ( Most Japanese artefacts in the US are from US soldiers taking them from civilian homes during the occupation)
@@Brimst0ne6800
Quite. They chose 'Murcan fast food and Disney. That's as close to hell-on-earth. Have you ever been to the USA? The Hamptons is nice but the rest....
🤮
The Imperial Japanese gave us 2 previews of how they would oppose an invasion: Iwo Jima and Okinawa. Both were brutal, costly battles practically fought to the last man and many civilians. The terrain in Kyushu is much like Okinawa, a defenders dream. The US lost 12,000 killed talking Okinawa (1/3 navy due to kamikaze attacks), the Japanese lost almost all 110,000 defenders. By November 1945 estimates for Kyushu alone totaled 1,000,000 military defenders. The Japanese planned to continue to redeploy troops from China to the home islands.
By mid summer, 1945, the joint chiefs sent an advisory to Nimitz and Macarthur to begin planning for other options to operation Downfall. The USN was a strong advocate for blockade and starvation, the Army Air Force for continued strategic bombing. These options would have resulted in a longer war, less US casualties than invasion, and unthinkable devastation of the Japanese population. The nuclear bombings were by far the best option for everyone involved.
I'd have to wonder how effective blockade and continuous bombing would have been.
@@2ddw would have been effective for sure. Problem was, the allied powers wanted to end the war as soon as possible.
The top military planners for the US military could not predict how long a blockade would take for such a determined, fanatical, warrior society with extreme sacrifice as part of their culture. Mass starvation would be very probable. The undetermined timeline led the Army to advocate for invasion. The extreme allied casualties projected led Truman to use the atomic option.
It is noteworthy that the Japanese top military leadership wanted to keep fighting even after the second atomic bomb. They even tried to shut down the radio station that was to be used to broadcast the emperors’s surrender message.
@@smonyboy Yeah but the public want to the war end now
The blockade option had its own problems; The public's support to the war would waned over times. Americans could handled short bloody wars, but not protracted wars. The blockage itself wasn't cheap. The US needed to constantly maintain a large number of troops, ships, planes etc. for starving out Japan. Furthermore, there were definitely casualties while maintaining the block as Japan wouldn't just sit idly by and died from hunger. The US would faced the war with no end in sight like Vietnam and Afghanistan.
This left US three options:
One, gave Japan more lenient terms.
Two, Atomic Bomb.
Three, an all-out invasion with a massive army whom would use everything they had, including bioweapon and chemical weapon, to beat Japan into submission or until all those who resisted was killed off.
One thing that the debaters against the bombs' use overlook was Japan's Terms of Surrender. The Emperor's council called The Big 6 were split down the middle on the terms. Three members advocated that Japan accept the Potsdam Declaration with the proviso that the imperial institution be retained. Three members held out for three additional terms.
They would agree to surrendering but they wanted new terms to it, primarily to keep the Emperor as a figure of Japan's leadership.
These additional terms included: 1) Japan would disarm her own forces; 2) Japan would conduct any “so-called” war crimes trials of her own nationals; and 3) there would be no occupation of Japan. This last term would assure the continuance of the Imperial system and Hirohito’s seat on the throne.
Thing is there was a lot more that Hirohito had contemplated about the invasion happening and he made the tie breaking decision to surrender and act as a subordinate to MacArthur as he would be chosen as the occupation commander of Japan.
So it was either face off against the rest of the world alone and die for the sake of Honor and Duty and commit National Suicide or bear the unbearable and agree to unconditional surrender and still have your country left intact.
I don't think they had any hope of winning the war. Their goal was not to force American surrender, but to force the Americans to seek peace. Remember at the time, the Allies wanted Unconditional Surrender. Their goal was to ironically push the Allied forces away from the idea of Unconditional Surrender, and possibly in the best of terms, a negotiated end to war, similar to the Russo-Japanese War, despite Russia's defeat in on the sea, the Tsar was intent to continue the war, but foreign intervention wanted it to end, and brought Russia to the negotiation table.
The Japanese government, well those in charge of it really only hoped they could get some kind of negotiated end to war with possibly keeping some of her colonial assets like Korea. A flat out, unconditional surrender was well, a hard pill to swallow.
yes you saw the BBC special , me too
I had a Socratic seminar, those against the bomb used Japans olive branch attempt but did not know of its terms.
The story of the Japanese Empire is a lesson in swallowing your pride and shame to live and thrive another day.
Remember, pride is not the opposite of shame; it is a symptom of it.
They had no honour after This war.
There's a Japanese island called Ozushima and it's where the submarine kamikaze trained. The museum on the island explains their story well. While visiting the museum, what struck me is how the Japanese weren't concerned about rebuilding their country after the war. You need a work force to rebuild, but the Japanese were willing to sacrifice their future workers as kamikaze.
Same with Germany. Near the German surrender Hitler issued Nero Decree to destroy any infrastructure left. He said "The Allies will not inherit a nation. They will inherit a ruin"
It probably like you couldn't live longer than 3 minute in the battle field without gun powder (ok, 19 th reference)
酷い話だ。
戦地の日本兵が原爆投下のお陰で命拾いしたと喜んだ？
祖国の何万人もの老人や女子供が焼き殺されたのに？
いくら原爆投下を正当化しても民間人の生活する市街地に投下する必要があったのか？
呉の海軍基地の沖合に投下しても、日本軍部の戦意を討ち壊すことはできただろう？
すでに日本には戦闘機さえ木材でしか作れなかった。
いまでも被爆の後遺症に苦しむ人がいるのに絶対的に正しかった？
現在の日本人は自分たちが被害者だとは思っていないし、戦争を恨むがアメリカを恨み続けてはいない。
むしろアメリカの戦後支援に感謝し、文化に憧れ親近感を抱いている。
歴史教育では日本の軍部の暴走とアジアの戦場て加害者でもあったと教えられる。
やはり相手が白人ではない日本人だから、大量の非戦闘員が苦しみ踠いて死んでも、悲劇には感じないのか？
広島長崎が更なる犠牲を止めるための最善策なら、ロシアがウクライナに核を使っても、ロシアにとっては最善策になってしまう。
一方的で冷めたコメントを見ていて、戦勝国の傲慢さと欺瞞に寒気がする。
In reality, Japan recovered very fast after WW II
Not to mention that after you've thrown all your young women into a solid wall of firepower - there's no one left to produce the next generation of Japanese.
A death cult of staggering inhumanity.
My father, a Marine Corp veteran of the Battle of Okinawa, was training for the invasion of Japan when the bombs were dropped. He told me he and his fellow Marines knew they would die in the invasion. They were to be in the first wave and knew there was no way they would survive. Thank you Mr. Truman.
The actual 1st group in was army they were to invade a couple of small off shore islands that were heavily fortified. My dad was in this army division. His division had come up all the way up through the south pacific the invasion of the Philippines and was scheduled for this landing. They were told once this was done they would then go in on the Japanese mainland. He always said thank God for that damned bomb
@@letsgowinnietheflu5439 Regardless, they would not have survived. The dropping of the bomb ironically saved lives.
My father was Army and among those who were scheduled to be in the first wave to land on the home islands. Of course the invasion was not necessary, but he was among the occupational forces, and later on he saw his orders. His entire division was listed as expendable and expected to suffer casualties near 100%. . He said that literally every man woman and child was prepared to fight. He always had respect for the men he fought, in the stories he told. They were starving and still refused to surrender which , coming from a warrior tradition he respected. He said that oddly, there was no enmity from the people and like many of the occupying forces, came to love the country and people.
My father was a Navy Corpsman, training for the mainland invasion. He was to be on those first landing also. They were expecting 100% casualties also.
@@Hawkeye2001 My dad was also a medic His best friend was shot of the back end of the stretcher they were caring in the Philippines. He was 1st wave. He said that they would not ware their medical designations because that made them primary targets for the Japanese
I've spoken to a couple of Japanese WWII veterans and civilians in the 90s. In their minds, they were defending their Empire & the Emperor they had a lot of national pride and patriotism, of course they don't want to go on suicide missions, but they were willing to if ordered. That was the mentality back then.
People forget that at the point of the looming invasion, the Japanese had seen centuries of Western empires and how they ruled the world. As far as the Japanese knew, if they lost, they were going to be at best enslaved for centuries, and at worst, wiped out. If I thought my country was facing that I'd be prepared to make the ultimate sacrifice too.
Also, Japan was ready to execute every single POW at the moment the first shell was fired at the home islands, so there would be thousands of casualties that way.
US never stopped bombing Japan until the day of surrender. Many more died of firebombing than atomic bombs. But yeah, the home islands were bombed to hell non stop.
Hundreds of thousands
I’ve said it before, and I’ll say it again.
Operation Downfall likely would have surpassed Operation Barbarossa to become the deadliest military operation in history.
Just thinking about it makes me shudder.
Tens of millions of people dead, soldiers being unable to distinguish civilians from combatants, Banzai charges around every corner, MG and artillery choke points in every alley, executed POWs lining the streets, house-to-house fighting in every single town and city.
@@Kaiserboo1871I get chills thinking about that would’ve been horrific
And this is why they got the nuke... My dad was on Okinawa getting ready with 1st MARDIV. He said it was like someone had lifted a death sentence off their heads when they heard the news.
I can only imagine. My grandfather was wounded from Okinawa and his return kept getting delayed. I never knew why until I did my own digging. He was with the 6th marine division.
I can only imagine the relief knowing the war was over.
Same. We're children of fat man and little boy
@@funwithphobias I wonder how they came up with those names
@@charlie8344 its based on bomb size
I wouldn’t blame everything on Hirohito, given the military was practically in control of everything. If I remember correctly, there was a coup attempt to stop Hirohito from authorising the surrender as well.
Your memory is correct ... Japan's Generals and Admirals were all about saving face and, after sacrificing the entire Japanese population, would have committed hara-kiri.
The atomic bombs saved millions of allied and Japanese lives as well as a continued hatred of the Japanese culture.
It's Hirohito's choice to surrender that saved Japan
True. The royal family didn't run the nation.
I see Hirohito similar to King Victor Emmanuel III of Italy, mostly a figurehead but also cowardly. Victor Emmanuel only got the courage to do his coup and oust Mussolini when it was obvious Italy faced total destruction. IF Hirohito knew what Tojo was doing in terms of war crimes and never at least protested or confronted him about it, then he was a spineless coward without question.
@@thunderbird1921you do realize that Hirohito was in favor of Japanese expansion right? the same goes for the king of italy, it didn’t make sense for either to move against those actually running their nations while things were going well in the war.
It is absolutely insane to me that this info is readily available but people still insist that the US never should have dropped the atomic bombs. It was a terrible, terrible thing that they did but it was also a necessary action to avoid many many more deaths civilian and military alike
Just like it is absolutely insane that the info about the Japanese plans and the real reason for the Japanese surrender is readily available yet people think that bombing the Japanese rubble even more finer somehow made Japan surrender.
@@Pikkabuu Are you a communistoid
@@DogeickBateman
How does that have anything to do with what I said?!
My point, EXACTLY, bro!! The casualty estimates, JUST FOR "Operation: Downfall," ALONE would've, EASILY been in the MULTIPLE TENS OF MILLIONS!!!! Folks!! You gotta get this fact through your THICK heads!! By NO MEANS, would the Japanese acquiesce and, surrender!!! The mentality of THE ENTIRE POPULATION WAS NECK-DEEP in the Ancient Japanese warrior code of Bushido. Simply put: their lives for THEIR "god- Emperor"!!! Factor in the casualties from "Operation: Olympic"!!! Those figures LEAP to just about the HUNDREDS OF MILLIONS...............
F****** DEAD, BONEHEADS!!!!!
Add to that, the enormous public outcry ONCE WORD GOT OUT THAT THERE WAS A LESS-COSTLY WAY TO END THE WAR; i.e., the 2 atomic bombs!! Truman would've not only been vilified. But, his @$$ would've been REMOVED from office. Either by the 25th. Amendment's protocol OR, OUTRIGHT IMPEACHMENT!!!!! If any of you think otherwise! You're fooling yourselves!!!!!
This is a foolish and short-term view on the situation. In the war, the bombs make sense, but the implications of what dropping them meant will come to fruition in the future and maybe not even in our lifetime. When you drop something like that on a nation, you've opened the door to having that same bomb if not a worse version dropped on you. It's probably something that was inevitable due to human innovation and warmongering, but it's something America will specifically have to pay for in the future unfortunately
So my dad used to tell me this story about how he was told that he would have only 5 minutes to live in WW2. See, if the Hiroshima and Nagasaki Nuclear bombs weren't used. He and about 500,000 Americans and allies would have had to invade in the first wave. He was supposed to be the on the first wave on the beach at the Kanto Plain near Tokyo. So, you can say that I and all of my siblings and their kids are directly alive due to the nuclear bomb. It's amazing what one presidential decision can do to a family. He said, that when he arrived in Japan about a month after the bomb. His detail inspected the beach he was supposed to land on and they found machine guns, 30ft bamboo sticks with mines and sticks of dynamite at the ends all hidden in little caves along the beachhead. The US also had 500,000 drums of Mustard gas and another 500,000 drums of napalm being stored at Guam. Which was going to be used on Japan during the invasion... It would not be pretty.
Damn. That would have been pretty.
it would essentially be Battle of Berlin but over the entire Japanese Island.
Mustard Gas... the optics of that would be great, today
In preparation for the Invasion of Japan the US made over half a million Purple Hearts. Only in the last ten years did they award half of those Purple Hearts.
My dad was going in on wave two. He was en route from Italy when the bombs were dropped. If I understand correctly, the chemical agents would be retaliatory use, not first use.
My grandfather who served in the pacific told me when I as a a teenager when I asked him what he thought about the atomic bombings “more would have died had we invaded”.
It’s so crazy that they were fighting so hard, and losing to America was the best thing to ever happen to the country
Not sure it was 'the best thing', but its definetly not the worst if we look to what might have happened if the Soviets would have gotten involved proper in the war with Japan.
@@MajorCoolD It's the best thing. Japan have changed completely compared to 80 years ago. No more fanatics willing to sacrifice their entire nation's population.
Best thing compared to loosing to the soviets yes.
The entire history of Japan up until that point was defined by the brutal subjugation of the common people to despotic elites. It was a horrible place. They were completely backwards until the Meji restoration shortly before the war. Then they continued to be used like animals to serve the ruling class, but on a more industrial scale. During the war they were all treated as cannon fodder. Not just the kamikaze (suicide) soldiers, but the rest of the population. Including 90 year old women (and very young children) taught to make homemade knives to scuicidally attack American soldiers.
It's unlikely Japan would exist today in any recognizable form if those two bombs weren't dropped. Their population would have been decimated by the millions, their entire country destroyed, and the allies would have been out for blood after losing close nearly two million soldiers (for context the US lost 300,000 in the European and Pacific theater in the war).
instead they firebombed every Japanese city and would keep doing that until they were wiped out or surrender WW2 is awful
Whenever someone says that we didn't need to drop the atomic bombs, there is a number I like to point out. 500,000! That is the number of purple hearts the military had minted up just for the battle of Kyushu. So many were struck that we are still using up the stock today.
The invasion wasn't the only alternative. A conditional surrender with more favourable terms for the Japanese emperor would have been possible too...
@@dindrmindr626 Dude, think for a moment. The Constant Bombings would eventually rack up a body count that would have exceeded the two Atom bombs.
Non of the options you presented were better than the bomb. It's just choosing how you would put them down.
So you are saying that its ok to kill civilians to prevent your soldiers from dying? Or what? That pretty much justifies alot of massacres, which isnt really good you know.
@@bundabunda7774 Did you even see the video? The Japanese were going to use EVERY LEGAL AGE CIVILIAN to defend against the American invasion. 500,000 civilians is a small number if compared to the 40,000,00 civilians the Japanese were planning to use to stall the invasion
@@dindrmindr626 Dude, the video outright stated that so many Civilians were put for the final defense that barely any were left to operate the factories. They were arming them with either sticks or crudely made smoothbore rifles. They already had nothing of worth to produce.
ironic how the killing of civilians with the atomic bombs was condemned by a country strapping bombs to those exact same civilians.
Every axis country + GB told Muricans that communism is the biggest threat, they didn´t listen. A few years later, however...
Patriots*
@@PROVOCATEURSK …Would you rather we just let the Nazis live? We were dealt a bad hand overall in the WW2 time period. At least with the communists they weren’t specifically targeting whole cultures for systemic obliteration. (No, Joseph Stalin killing a lot of Ukrainians is not genocide, because he killed a lot of Russians and others too. Not saying that excuses him, though.)
@@PROVOCATEURSK Japan was communist?
@@theinquisitor8112 imo I would consider it a genocide because the holodomor was targeted specifically at Ukrainian land owners. Btw I also hate the nazis.
My great-uncle was on a troop ship preparing for the invasion when Japan surrendered. His parents were very relieved when they found out he wouldn't see combat.
The invasion of Japan would not have been as bloody as predicted
The Japanese Army had lost most of its automatic weapons and heavy artillery in the defense of Okinawa
Shooting waves of teen girls with sewing needles and little boys with bamboo sticks charging at you would be bloodless, definitely
the Japanese would be no more. @@MrWadewynn
@@makeitpay8241 oh no no, apparently the more justified way to win was to blockade them with ensuing mass starvation because the Japanese government at that time clearly valued the lives of their citizens more than anything else. Or even better, give the Japanese really good terms to surrender on including the retainment of their colonial holdings. Cuz by bombing them the first time, they had to drop many of their previous conditions, and that’s not fair
@@makeitpay8241 nah
The underwater suicide bombers sound ridiculous and horrific at the same time. The Emperor was a figurehead who didn't was not allowed to make military decisions. The Japanese regarded him as the direct descendant of their sun god, Ameratsu, and therefore EVERY Japanese was willing and expected to die for the emperor. It wasn't until after the 2 atom bombs were dropped that the people even had a chance to hear the emperor's voice in his surrender speech. That's how sacred he was! Finally, the generals had to surrender because the emperor surrendered. Hirohito was also spared the war crimes tribunals at MacArthur's urging.
The divers died by the scores just during training.
The emperor was spared from war crimes and even allowed to maintain rule because the Americans feared rebellion. They wanted to maintain some form of control and change the country to become democratic so they could maintain ideas and influence rather than it becoming a soviet state like what happened to Germany.
Wait till you hear the US Army Chemical corps were planning to use gas shells on Ariake Bay. It was the most heavily defended of the 3 major points.
Was it a lack of resources, or some other reason they didn't consider a limpet type mine with a short timer? The diver would probably still be killed either by the explosion, or trying to get away, but at least there's a chance of survival.
@@christopherconard2831 I doubt the chance of survival was very relevant to them at that point. They prepared to use schoolgirls with fucking bamboo sticks, what makes you think they'd care about a couple dozen survivors out of 1000 divers? As long as it got the job done that was fine.
Even after the A-bombs dropped US military planners weren't sure Japan would surrender. Once planners knew the bombs existed they worked them into the invasion plan. Which would be challenging since the bombs were so hard to make, after those first two there wouldn't be anymore for months. They hoped to have 4 of them ready for in the initial bombardment of Kyushu.
Honestly it to the point that they were just throwing body’s for a war they knew was lost
The planned defense was called "Ketsu Go". the planned Armageddon battle on Kyushu to turn the military situation to Japan’s favor. And after a while Hirohito had doubts about Ketsu Go being effective as high command had predicted it would be, on account of the long record of “discrepancy between plans and performance.” So he basically contemplating that going to the absolute wouldn't even matter in the end.
There was only one more bomb after the second was dropped.
A third bomb was ready to go August 18th on Kukora but wasn't needed
@@glitch164 plus he figured it was better to surrender to the Allies than be overrun by Russia
Good documentary. Follows closely with what my dad told me.
He was drafted in 1944, and got to the Philippines in time for the Battle of Zamboanga (early 1945) and a few smaller mopping-up operations with the 41st ID. He was in training for Olympic when news of surrender came.
If the planned order of battle had been used, he would have gone ashore at the coastal city of Miyazaki in he first attack (Cadillac Beach).His participation in the Occupation Forces showed him how bad things could have been. He told me stories about the tunnel complexes in the hills that he had to go through as part of the disarmament inspections. If he’d had to fight his way in, it would have been hell.
Several years ago, he and I watched a documentary in which they said that the US govt. commissioned ONE MILLION Purple Heart medals to be ready for Operation Downfall. When that battle didn’t happen, the medals went to a warehouse.
Every Purple Heart issued by the US Govt. since then (WW2, Korea, Vietnam, Desert Shield/Storm, Iraq, Afghanistan, etc.) has been pulled from that WWII stockpile. My dad said, “Don’t doubt that for an instant. It was gonna be that bad.”
"I am tired of hearing the people will fight to the last man. I want to know how we will end this war."
- Emperor Hirohito
Anyone have a white cloth?
any of us would fold his short ass.
It's insane how Japan got away with what it did in ww2 , at least the German people acknowledge there wrongdoing .
Blame their right-wing nationalists...
I think most Japanese acknowledge the war crimes the military committed during the war…
@@TruePT but the government won't apologize for anything unfortunately.
@@TruePT I also hoped that was the case. Untill my Sister in law started learning Japanese and went there to study for half a year. Basically no one knew anything about their country in the years 32-45. And it was no accident. It's just how Japan handled the ww2 topic.
@@debicadudeReally? I knew there were people who don’t know, but THAT many people? Dang. Ps Was your sister in Tokyo, or any big city?
My grandmother was Japanese and served in the war with the Japanese Red Cross as a nurse. She left Japan in 1943 and spent the rest of the war in Singapore. She told that everyone was expected to fight. Even her. The nurses were trained on how to use rifles and grenades. They had hospital guard to maintain order. The nurses and staff weren't expected to take up their rifles unless the enemy was kicking in the front door of the hospital. If they did, there was Grandma with a rifle and a grenade.
I am grateful for this video because it confirms everything which my Dad told me about his time in Japan immediately after the war.
My father was a lieutenant in the Third Marine Division, which was to be the tip of the spear in Operation Olympic. The task of his division and the two army divisions who were to follow them in was to establish a beachhead. The same task was the objective of the NEXT three divisions, because my Dad's force was expected to be annihilated.
After the surrender, the Third was sent in as occupation forces. What shook him the most was finding warehouses crammed with bundles of bamboo spears, which were to have been used by Japanese civilians to attack him and his men should they somehow manage to make it past the beach.
He also described how Japanese civilians would avoid any contact with marines, because they had been told by the Japanese media that the Globe and Anchor emblem was only given to Americans who had slaughtered their own mothers.
His best memory was going to Midnight Mass in a partially destroyed Catholic Church just outside Nagasaki on Christmas Eve 1945, with American marines, soldiers and sailors worshipping alongside their former Japanese foes. His battalion CO told the assembled marines that if the collection plates for the offertory were filled to overflowing, to allow the church to begin repairs, all disciplinary reports on his desk would mysteriously disappear the next morning. His marines complied.
Nothing against your father
But his CO and this made me sick "all disciplinary reports on his desk would mysteriously disappear the next morning. His marines complied."
Knowing how much R"pe US soldiers committed during the occupation and how often it was ignored by CO`s only further galvanised the people against the US
It proved to the Japanese people that the US were western brutes ( Comical since the Japanese did the exact same thing)
Even to this day in places like Okinawa the Base is HATED by the locals they want it gone since often US personnel will commit crimes go to the base and be protected , like how that young girl was r*ped and the soldiers nearly got away with it , They only received justice after international news caught the story
Not saying your father was like this, but the US army was known to be DEEPLY RACIST and not caring about any crimes against Japanese civs during the occupation seeing it as justice and revenge
I've talked to a British veteran who was part of the British occupation and he remembers talking to some Japanese civilians who fled there prefecture due to it being under the US and were scared of US reprisal on them.
Read read all shit the japanesse military did 6 members of my familly where murdered in occupied Indonesia. Teachers and there kids not military . Have you ever heard of comfort women read !
@@mk_gamíng0609The crime rate of the American garrison on Okinawa is actually less than the local population’s already low rate.
@@mk_gamíng0609 Quite a lot of rubbish here. The americans aren't innocent heroes true, but it is also true that america are the reason Okinawans avoided being extinct. WHen they go into the island, they go in prepared, to shelter the local populace, to provide them with shelter and food. After all the battles they fought against Japan until then, they knew how Japan would treat the local populace, especially after Saipan. Japan encouraged okinawans to resist and fight until the end, if they can't then just commit mass suicide, this is the exact same thing japan did in saipan, they wanted the entire local populace to die alongside the soldiers. Did you know that 1/3 of Okinawa's population died during the battle? America helped to save the remaining 2/3 of the populace by coming in prepared to shelter them. Most of the older Okinawans that survived the battle were once part of this shelter built by america on the island.
Compared to the Japanese that encouraged the entire islander to die along with the soldiers. You know, during the last days of the battle, when Japanese organized resistance have ended, all surviving soldiers were given order to fight guerilla warfare until death. This has unexpected tragic consequences for Okinawa populace. The surviving Japanese troops know they can't go back to Japan alive as they have been given the order to die. But since their commander in Okinawa have committed seppuku, instead of fighting guerilla warfare they simply do whatever they want, like a deserter's army. They would rape, kill, rob, and throw out the Okinawan population, to do whatever they want to prolong their life. They just don't care anymore since they all thought they were gonna die anyway. This created future tension between Okinawans and Japanese mainland later after the war, because of the contempt the Japanese soldiers treated the Okinawan populace with. Did you know that Okinawans after the war even started burning Japanese flag? This was decades ago though, but the tension was real back then.
This is something that even Masahide Ota, the former Okinawa governor, and also a survivor of the battle, when he was part of the student soldier (he was a teenager), admitted in 2013, 4 years before his death. He admitted that although today there are tensions between the Okinawan population and the US base in the island, it is undeniable that America was an important part of the rebuilding of Okinawa after the war, and also to have saved Okinawans from a complete humanitarian disaster, because they came into the island prepared to shelter the local populace, a polar opposite of the contempt shown by many japanese soldiers towards the okinawan populace. Masahide Ota would know what he's talking about. He was one of the many Okinawan youths indoctrinated by the japanese army to die for the emperor. His unit was ordered to fight guerilla warfare to the death against America. His salvation was that he was captured by the americans before he could do any of that. It opened his eyes gradually to the reality.
so the Japanese locals should be the old ones doing the r@ping? understood. @@mk_gamíng0609
And some people wonder why Truman decided to drop the Atomic Bombs. It was probably the LESS bloody option.
Nah it was to prevent the Soviets from capturing Japan like Germany.
The less bloody option? Then why did the US drop the bombs twice? Japan was already willing to surrender when Hiroshima got nuked, but the US dropped Nagasaki 3 days after. Did the people lived in Nagasaki had no choice but to die?
@@asdfghjjhgf
That's simply not true, they definitively weren't.
We have the cabinet protocols of them assessing it was a very limited capability of little strategic importance, and deciding to refuse to surrender.
Even after the second one, the cabinet was still evenly split, with the emperor having to intervene, against all precedent.
And even then - there was still a coup attempt, that barely succeded, to try to stop him.
Any attempt to claim that they were willing to surrender following the first one, not to mention claiming the US knew that - is completely untrue and unhistorical.
@@tomhuynh3867 How would they have conquered Japan? They didn't have the Naval power to launch a invasion of that scale. Only the US could have invaded Japan. So unless the US offered them the use of their ships I don't see that happening. The Soviets were a major land military power not a major naval power.
@@asdfghjjhgf After Hiroshima, the Japanese military concluded it was a one-off stunt to cower them into surrender. They did not believe the US could make more than 1 or 2 a year at most. Nagasaki was complete shock as it meant the US could produce maybe a 1 or 2 a month and more were definitely coming. They were not the only reason Japan surrendered.
BTW Japan had an active nuclear weapons program so they knew what happened at Hiroshima and Nagasaki.
My grandma said the Japanese army men came and taught them to use sharpened sticks against the Americans. She said when the army men left, they all threw down the sticks and said "what good are sticks against guns"
They were done with the war, starving, and exploited by this military regime.
Just read this now. Good comment from Gran. The Japanese. Were starving to death by the time Hiroshima was bombed.
McArthur as Supreme Commander had power and latitude never granted to a general or anyone else since. He knew how to handle the terrible situation. He had to feed the Japanese people or things would deteriorate out of control. So he took all the forward supplied food provisions stashed on islands for the intended main island invasion and used them to feed the Japanese. Additionally his meeting with Hirohito where Hirohito came and met with Him completly diffused any or most animosity towards the American occupiers.
I have changed my mind about Japan and ww2 several times. That means understanding maily as I learned more.
One other point, Japan lost the war the day they bombed Pearl. JIA did not listen to Admiral Yamamoto Isoruku who orchestrated the Pearl attack. He figured about 1 year for Japan to be somewhat successful. Didn't even really get that though.
This has rescued me from bordem at work 😁👌👍🏻
👀 *boredom*
@@greenkoopa thanks lol
Same I’m
In the back of my store watching this rn
If you have time to lean you have time to clean
I remember hearing that on the month of the planned invasion of Japan a hurricane hit the Japanese coast. The type not seen since the Mongol Invasion and might've scattered the American Invasion just like it did the Mongol one. Talk about a bullet dodged.
‘Divine winds’ indeed.
@@starbladesfury2195---yes
It hit the American staging areas and would have delayed The Invasion for a couple months
Giving the Japanese 2 months more to dig in unfortunately the Japanese had only a 6 week supply of food stored for the invasion
Americans ain't no Mongols. We'd have swam ashore with bayonets in our mouths! Because we make the Mongols look like a bunch of Girl Scouts.
@@1pcfred---If you insist.
I had an uncle who was stationed at Pearl Harbor at the beginning of the war. He was thankfully out on a supply mission when the attack happened. He drove landing craft during some of the early amphibious assaults and ended the war on a UDT. If the invasion of Japan had happened, he would have seen a lot of action. He began and ended the war with luck on his side.
The more I learn about this, the more cemented I am that we did the right thing in dropping the bombs. For a while now, nothing nobody says will convince me otherwise. I've even heard that some Japanese who lived through that period were glad the bombs dropped, because if they hadn't, they would be dead today.
True. I am acquainted with a Japanese person. He admits that the nukes gave the Japanese elites an excuse to surrender without losing face.
Yes yes and yes.
One of the men who worked on the Manhattan Project as well as the B-17, Roscoe Charles Wilson, surveyed Japan after their surrender. He found every rice Pattie, home, and city entrenched and armed to the teeth. As terrible as the bombs were, they saved more lives than they took.
“This isn’t war, but the breaking of seals. The undoing of life itself…” - B.J. Blazkowicz
Sad how the military leaders of Japan thirsted for their own peoples blood more than the Americans did. Probably the only time in history where Nukes where the more humane option.
Very wise comment.
agred
i mean the people also believed it it's amazing what propaganda can do. It's the same today all most of the thing you believe is from an unconscious national propaganda effort that's started when you were born.
@@MrRjizz and the Earth is cube shaped and Joe Biden is a reptilian
I do love how some people stubbornly insist that Japan was on the verge of surrender and the US cruelly deployed the atomic bombs just 'because'
edit: well.. I certainly didn't expect this comment to blow up
even if they were on the verge of surrender which I do not belive for a moment they definitely diserved some karma
sincierly-Joe Mama
@@Ok-but they might have been worse than the Germans in ww2
Don’t forget, Japan’s favorite war crime to use is Perfidy
@@benben6054 they where worse imo
first one was necesary but the second one is the one ppl debate about
The people who complain about the atomic bombs clearly have no idea how brutally vicious the Japanese could be on a good day; let alone in a desperate attempt to defend their own island.
Absolutely correct!
Japan was literally gonna throw civilians at U.S forces hoping to break U.S moral.
Fun fact. Japs got off considerably well than their previously occupied areas. So those a bombs were nothing conpared to what the japs did to their occupied areas. Especially korea and china.
The Japanese treatment of prisoners were
shocking. The human war crimes committed by
them inexcusable.
The Japanese treatment of prisoners were
shocking. The human war crimes committed by
them inexcusable.
As much as I disliked McArthur, I have to give him props for the way he handled post-war Japan. He understood that there was a vast cultural difference between Japan and the West. While Japan the country had modernized with amazing speed, much of their culture was still essentially feudal. All the worst war crimes against civilians and POWs were a part of that feudal mentality from the top to the bottom. The Allies were wise to go gentle on Japan despite what were to anyone's definition vicious war crimes.
My Uncle was a Marine who fought in the South and Central Pacific, and he said of the Japanese: "They were tough, smart and had no give up in them. If we have to go to war again, I'd rather they be beside me than in front of me."
Doug was a living God. A man above men. The Inchon invasion was a master stroke too.
He wasn't the finest man out there, but he certainly wasn't *the* worst
Why do so many people dislike McArthur? From what I've seen so far he was a capable general and a great diplomat; and he did a really good job making peace with Japan after the war.
@@alaskamark4562 Mostly because the Korean war. He advocated for nuclear bombings.
@user-yc7vc3fq7b. No he didn't. This is a common misconception, he never actually advocated for using nukes in Korea.
ua-cam.com/video/Msr2w02m8VE/v-deo.html
When it comes to the debate between the atomic bombings or invasion. I have two things to say.
1. The atomic bombings of Hiroshima and Nagasaki were terrible and awful, but so were all the other options.
2. It’s easy to pass judgment when you have decades of hindsight on your side and not making a critical decision in the actual moment.
It’s almost like war is an awful destructive experience that should be avoided but requires decisive choice making when placed into the situation.
@@RandomGuy-jo8ky so not only saved japan, but the whole world
@@RandomGuy-jo8ky the dropping of the nukes fall under the "show of force" catagory rather than war crime. IMO
With that logic terrorists attacks are also ok, they are supposedly defending something so we all have to agree
@@ericsuarez834 whether you agree or disagree what happened in the past cant be changed so...
@@ericsuarez834 completely different, one is a legitimate attack against military targets to save the country we're Attacking. And the one you're talking about is killing children because they are innocent.
The Emperor was just afraid that the next atomic bomb would hit too close to his own bunker.
"Some of you may die, but that is a sacrifice I am willing to make"
^words of Dr. Strang of Nova Scotia.
Imagine if we didn't drop the Atomic Bombs on Japan and instead invaded the island nation. We in the West wouldn't be talking about D-Day the invasion of Normandy as much as we do but the amphibious invasion of Japan. We would've lost 500,000 to a million US Soldiers and Marines and hundreds of thousands of other Allied soldiers. Not to mention the 10 million more or so Japanese soldiers and civilians. That is insane. And some people say the Atomic Bombings on Japan was horrifying and shouldn't have happened. But if you look at what would have happen if we invaded Japan instead, you can clearly see what was the best option.
It didn't help there really weren't many good options. Others saying that just conventional Bombing and Blockades would have worked better.
Forgetting that mass starvation and possibly a higher body count as well as wider area of damage don't make them necessarily better than the bomb.
@@silverhawkscape2677 Exactly!! It was the best outcome with the least amount of deaths. Saying that blockading Japan and continuing conventional and fire bombings would have been a better decision is ridiculous. Not many seem to understand that the fire bombings for example killed more Japanese than the Atomic Bombs. And a invasion of Japan would be even worse for everyone involved.
There was no guarantee that Japan would surrender after being nuked and initially they didn't. Which is why we bombed them again. Even that didn't get an immediate response.
My grandpa serve in Kyoudo Boei Gyugun, he once said that theres a rumor among the auxiliary volunteers that they will be send to Japan's mainland to defend the country.
Taking Lord Farquaad’s “Some of you may die, but it’s a sacrifice I’m willing to make” to its logical extreme
I've lived in Japan over 30 years and grit my teeth every summer while the national media gets all weepy about the nuke strikes. They would never be convinced that less people died because of them. Other than the well deserved retribution, it was absolutely essential use the coup de grace or else half of the country, at least, would be speaking Russian now. IMO
It wasn't just the lesser evil, but Japan choose this path. People are responsible for the actions of their government, that includes the suffering they caused their own people.
@@notest396 the Japanese conservatives government has perpetrated outrageous inhumane level of coupe de grace and Stockholm syndrome brainwashing on the average Japanese person.
That must have been frustrating.
I’m around Chinese people, ( in Vancouver). Even with asking, I’ve never heard a Chinese person. Give thanks, for the allies, (mostly USA), for the defeat of The Japanese.
@@billpetersen298 I wouldn't expect them to be too thankful to the US. China was invaded in 1937 and the US did nothing at the time. The US didn't join the war until they were attacked themselves meanwhile China was going all out trying to fight the Japanese while the US slowly mobilized. The UK was also not the most helpful and refused to let the Chinese station some of their best troops in Burma which eventually lead to the fall of Burma and China being cut off from their biggest supply route. Yes the allies were instrumental in defeating Japan but they got involved for self interest reasons and not out of support for China who was illegally invaded.
@@notest396 Lol the war started by four of their megacorporation, not their people. People often forget that Imperial japan is what happen if megacorporation take control of government.
My Grandfather was 6 when the war ended. He remembered that the High School students were pulled from school and given knives. Then the middle schoolers were mobilized for labor. Luckily nothing ever came of it.
If anyone says the allies shouldn't have nuked Japan, send them this video. The atomic bomb saved millions of lives.
The bomb kills thousands just to save a million lives. Irony and Harsh reality.
I have several times mentioned in comments the fact that our soldiers would have had to kill every man, woman and child if it came to an invasion. I tell them that the people killed by the bombs were “sacrificed” for the rest of Japan to survive.
@@mockz2327 #Villainmindgrindset
@@mockz2327 you just defined what war really is. Great job
それは後付けの言い訳に過ぎない。講和ができたのに拒否したのはアメリカ。
This video should be required viewing for all the WWII apologist who think the US was wrong in dropping the atomic bombs.
Absolutely
In brazilian school system (mainly dominated by leftists) they teach people that "Japan was ready to surrender/already surrender" and that the US only bombed Japan to "scare the soviets".
Yeah it is dumb and doesnt make any sense.
well, it was a war crime, so i would say they were in the wrong.
@@bundabunda7774 Dropping the atom bombs was a war crime?
@@endutubecensorship of course it was, or how else would you call
targetting 200k civilian casualties?
There were still wharehouses full of weapons being held and not issued. Old guns like Russisn no.3 Revolvers and ancient Samuria Swords. My Grandfather brought a bunch of the "obsolete" weapons home after liberating them during the occupation in 1946. For some reason the Japanese government was holding on to the odd weapons instead of issuing them, maybe part of the infighting of their military forces
Actually, at the later stage of the war, a conventional bomb attack by a Japanese plane against the U.S naval task forces was a suicide mission
just attempting to get thru the tremendous amount of anti aircraft fire the U.S ships could put up for defense made a successful mission and coming back alive next to impossible,
Is so suicidal that suicidal attack kamikaze is less suicidal lol
@@canthi109 suicidal divine wind .
That is kinda the point of a kamikaze attack. It wasn't worth the cost trying to get experienced pilots and quality aircraft if it was just going to get shredded in a matter of minutes trying to penetrate their air defense. Kamikaze pilots in contrast required little to no training and no specialised aircraft so if just one makes it through then it was worth it in their eyes.
My family is Japanese-American. My grandfather served as a translator in the Military Intelligence Service (MIS) in the Pacific and in MacArthur's camp during the occupation. The state of Japan post-war was horrific. He and a friend would sneak duffle bags of food and supplies to family they had never even met and only knew by name. Had the invasion happened, there might not have been anyone left.
I knew somebody who was a translator for General MacArthur's office after the war and she used to handle the incoming mail. She said that the vast majority of mail from civilians was basically, "send more rice, PLEASE".
"140 Days to Hiroshima" is a great book to read for an in-depth analysis of this question. Whatever your conclusion, I know that my father spent 4 years fighting from island to island in the Pacific and my father-in-law, who landed in France on D2, was on a troop carrier halfway across the Pacific with orders to be part of the landing and attacking force when the surrender occurred and their ship was ordered to turn around and head back to San Diego. So, there was an excellent chance that neither my wife, myself, our kids, or our entire family would be here if the atomic bombs had not been used (as horrific as those events were).
I think this is truly evidence for the bombs being the best choice in the end. This not only saved millions but showed how horrible nuclear weapons are. Very informative video.
@@RandomGuy-jo8ky care to explain? I literally don't know anything your talking about?
Yes, I'm glad 9/11 happened so it showed us how important flying safety is
@@ericsuarez834 this comparison makes no sense 9/11 had nothing to do with flight safety and if it didn’t happen people wouldn’t have died.
@@battlesevengames9479 it makes sense for anyone who hasn't brainwashed by American public education and Hollywood movies
Americans 😂😂.
Let your tali buddies do it too then
There's a reason why the US chose to drop two nuclear bombs rather than invading Japan. Yes its tragic what happened due to that discission but far more people both soldiers and civilians would have been killed if the allies invaded japan.
Or they could have just accepted the conditional surrender japanese were offering.....which they ended up accepting at the end anyway japan is still a monarchy
@@leaveme3559 Stop being stupid. The conditions Japan wanted were to hold on to some of their conquests. A conditional surrender was not an option. Hirohito was only kept around after the fact as a stabilizing force against communism.
@@eodyn7 MacArthur was a visionary.
@@leaveme3559 Don't be an illiterate, Japan's offer was not of unconditional surrender. The monarchy stayed because MacArthur and many other US officials (Not all, as others wanted the Emperor tried) deemed it necessary to keep the Japanese nation together in the threat of Stalin - who pressured the JCP to initiate a violent Communist uprising in early 1950 - and Communism.
@@eodyn7 no they didn't it's demands are clearly stated in the video they wanted the emperor to still exist and usa could have agreed and not kill 100s of thousands of innocent people
"Thank God for the atom bomb." -- Paul Fussell, future cultural and literary historian, in August 1945 a second lieutenant and ETO veteran slated to take part in the invasion of Japan.
Regarding the suicide frogmen, their greatest strength would be if no one knew they were there in the first place. Otherwise the Americans might have just chucked grenades over the sides of the landing craft which would have killed the frogmen by concussion. Considering how America's UDT (forerunners of the Navy SEALs) operated during this time and how they were not treated as a suicide force the Japanese weren't likely to be successful. In fact I think the Viet Cong also had underwater sappers and they used less. As for the Emperor, it seemed that the militarists of the Imperial military had more authority using the Emperor as a rubber stamp. Hirohito's greatest crime might not have been that he ordered the deaths of millions, but he didn't stop them when he had the authority to do so. Keep in mind when he made the decision to surrender there was a military coupe that tried to overthrow him, but it failed.
I think the pre-invasion bombardment would have inadvertently taken most of them out
We did know they existed. Similar efforts had been tried before, always total failures. The same would have occurred here.
@@brianmccarthy5557 Would've scared me straight regardless.
Yamamoto: I told you…. We would fail.
Hirohito: Yes….yes you did.
He was bullied into
@@nandinhocunha440 I’m referencing Justice League.
@@kaneslives F
While in high school in the 60's a Japanese foreign exchange student questioned, "Why TWO A-bombs"? I upset him when I answered, "We didn't have 3 ready to go at the time". I had no idea if that was true or not, but it seemed an appropriate reply.
We can debate all day as to whether the Soviet Invasion of Manchuria or the Atomic Bombings of Hiroshima and Nagasaki (Or both) is what truly drove Japan to unconditional surrender, but we cannot deny the fact that regardless of what was the true cause, Japan's unconditional surrender saved everyone, even themselves, from a lot of death and destruction.
I think it was a bunch of contributing factors the soviets joining instead of mediating, nuclear bombings/ firebombing campaign, Successes in the submarine blockade of Japan, and Emperor using his influence for peace. Finally overcame the war hawks in the Japanese government.
Soviets were not nearly as big of a threat as the US for Japan. Didn't have near the same naval capacity as the US for a landing of mainland japan
@@tylerkapteyn5830 the soviets would have had the advantage of landing in the boonies of Japan, up in Hokkaido and northern Honshu, and they had just taken Sakhalin, so they wouldn't have needed nearly as much naval capacity especially with the Japanese being focused on the Americans and British in the South. But even if the Soviets had no realistic ability to land on Japan, was that something the Japanese planners were aware of with the fog of war and the desperation of late 1945?
@@sankarchaya if that happened, the post war history would drastically changed. there might be no south korea, and a new conflict between soviet controlled japan and allied controlled japan will spark.
The debate is over because the Japanese insiders have told everyone that the Soviet invasion of Korea was simply not a factor back in Tokyo.
For the key decision makers, the Emperor's new status was EVERYTHING. Truman indicated through channels that he'd let the Emperor live on in his palace. THAT'S what did it. This reality has been twisted and omitted in every US official telling of the decision... because Truman was reversing FDR's pledge.
But, ever since the Cold War, Moscow has tried to build-up its self-importance to the Pacific War.
It's a MYTH, a myth tied into the Soviet's attempt at creating Western Guilt WRT the atomic bomb... and their detonation.
It was plain on its face that the US would be using atomic bombs on Mother Russia if the Bolsheviks crossed the line.
The KGB was arguing that you don't need atomic weapons to win wars // win the peace.
Think of it (the proposition) as military-theology: just say your prayers.
Great video. This a very seldom talked about aspect of the end of the war. I don't think many people will argue that the dropping of the 2 atomic bombs was a good thing, but it was a necessary thing. It gave the Japanese leadership a way out instead of having to sacrificing millions of lives. As for the predicted cost here's a bit of trivia. To this day the US Military is using Purple Hearts minted for Operation Olympic.
Honestly what japan was doing at that point can it even be called war cause at that point they were just knowingly sending people to their deaths for a war they knew was lost
When world war 3 starts. I want to see you say a nuke is essential
@@liam6170 it was delusion, they wanted honour, a very twisted one
I have lived in Japan for many years and love it. That said, I hike a lot here, and just about every time I venture into the mountains I am grateful we dropped the bomb. This terrain is so rugged, so easy to hide in and defend. I often think that if it weren't for the bombs we'd still be fighting in the hills.
Nah the US is a rugged country too. We wiped the natives out here. So it wouldn't have been our first time.
@@1pcfred That's different the natives were divided and easy to be turned against each other, The Japanese on the other hand were religiously fanatic and loyal, to their emperor whom they believed was a living god. There's a story of that one Japanese soldier in the Philippines that didn't surrender till 1970. I think a more fair comparison would be Afghanistan, and the Imperial Japanese army like ISIS or Al-Qaeda. Kamikaze (suicide attacks) the reports of Japanese soldiers fake surrendering only to blow them selves and the American soldiers trying to detain them.
@@GameSteph Teruo Nakamura didn't surrender until 1974. Hiroo Onoda was the more famous hold out though. He also surrendered in 74, but before Nakamura did. One screwball named Shoichi Yokoi was hiding a mile from the US air base in Guam. They found him in 1972. The history of Japanese holdouts is pretty entertaining. Some people.
@@1pcfred Almost all of the American Indians lived on the plains or the southwest. Completely different type of fighting.
@@j.w.matney8390 the Indians did not start out on the plains. As Europeans showed up in the east they kind of had to go west themselves. Least the ones that weren't wiped out by European diseases. We brought them horses. They were not a plains horse culture before we arrived. There were no horses here. The Spanish brought horses to the New World in the 1500s. So horses are immigrants too!
"You see, the American soldier is trained with a preset kill limit. Our goal is to send wave after wave until we surpass that limit."
-General Zap Branimota
Who is that?
Fun Fact- in anticipation of Operation Downfall The United States minted millions of Purple Hearts in 1945. They have not struck a single purple heart since then. It was anticipated that there would be 5-10 million Americans killed and wounded in the invasion of Japan, and at least double that in Japanese casualties, some commanders thought that we would literally have to exterminate all of Japan because they would not surrender. When you look at it objectively the 2 nuclear attacks were the humane thing to do, compared to the alternative.
Oh, and also The United States seizing Japan saved them from the Soviet Union, who were also planning their own invasion of Japan. Japan was literally months, or even weeks away from being cannibalized by the Soviets and turning it into a satellite state, truly a fate worse than death.
If operation downfall went ahead, it would probably be up there with battle of Stalingrad in terms of casualties.
Far worse most likely.
Maybe even worse than that.
I think you still underestimate how much casualties it gonna cause.
Perhaps worse than even the Normandy landings.
@@generationm2059
By a factor of 100-1000
The nuclear option wasn't an option. It was the most humane answer to Japan's inhumane war.
In an inhumane war there are no rules
Except Japan planned to surrender even without the nukes. The nukes biggest purpose wasn’t even against Japan.. it was to intimidate the USSR
@@marcoroberts9462 no, the emperor planned to surrender to Soviet but Imperial government (the majority people on the government are from IJA) want to continue the war. The emperor decided to surrender when he heard the news about Nagasaki and Hiroshima.
@@mare4599
He never wanted to surrender to the USSR.
Japan feared the USSR and thats why they surrenderd to the US.
@@marcoroberts9462 Enough of that lie. The damn Japanese military tried to stage a coup against their own Emperor when they found out that he was planning on surrendering.
My father was reactivated into the US army when the Americans landed to liberate the Philippines from Imperial Japan. After the Japanese were defeated in the Philippines, my father's unit practiced with the landing forces for the invasion of Japan.
Damn. The Japanese were REALLY going all out with anything and anyone they could spare for the invasion😳. I remember seeing a vid on simple history about these low quality weapons too and I was kinda caught off guard when I saw it
The first days would have been a bloodbath, but after a day or two of intense combat, Japan would have collapsed into itself. Imagine Japan divided; with Kyushu and Shikoku becoming American satellite states, Hokkaido being turned into a Soviet satellite and Honshu ruled by a Japanese council directly overlooked by the UN security council.
My father was at Iwo Jima and Okinawa and was on his way back to the western pacific for the invasion. His ship would be involved with pre invasion bombardment, so he would have been in the crosshairs of kamikazes before the troops hit the beach. He was very happy they dropped those two bombs.
The US approach to the emperor was the most pragmatic and smartest solution, and although Hirohito gave the thumbs up for overall campaigns, it's not like he was being briefed, "cool if we gas x amount of Chinese this week or kill x amount of western POWs this week".
Nah fam.... sounds like an excuse nazis used
@@Tpainactual not really because Hirohito really had no say on everything, it mainly the military controlled government
@@michaelluvsyouu7720 no.
@@Tpainactual Research on Hideki Tojo, and you would learn the Emperor Hirohito never actually had any real power.
My mother was in the thick of it; although a high school student, she was put to work making parts at an aircraft factory and spent her time running from Allied bombs.
Rifle weilding high school girls... Truly a japan moment
If the invasion of Japanese home island happened, my theory is that the invasion is similar to the invasion of the Italian Peninsula but more slower and bloodier
Much bloodier. Germans fight most of the fighting in Italy. Italians just waited to be liberated. Every Japanese civilian was ready to die.
Japan might have been much more of a problem if the hadnt focused so heavily on kamikaze tactics. They could have kept going for far longer if they werent sending their personnel on suicide missions constantly, let alone at all.
Kamikazes actually made a fair bit of sense from a military stand point. Ironically they cost less troops to use than regular fighting missions. I would advise looking at this very good video ua-cam.com/video/F-GVSXy37Gc/v-deo.html&ab_channel=PotentialHistory
the military history visualized video on kamikazes is also fairly good
@@CaledonianGaisgeach at the end of the war Britain sent some forces to the Pacific theater and when the kamikazes attacked the British were horrified. The Americans were all like, first time? Because by then for them it was old hat. Wearing a necklace of kamikaze bones around your neck was considered great juju. That was the depth of savagery we'd sunk to.
I'm pretty sure it was due to the problem that most of the air crafts had very little ammunition left and all of the experienced pilots were ready dead.
kamikaze tactics are just a symptom of the terrible strategy of Japan. They were extremely racists, so they consider the enemy a non entity. They would abuse and torment their own man in training, brainwashing them to the point of insanity. They never considered any chance of defeat. It was all or nothing from the start.
And not only that. They hit their targets during the first wave of expansion, but as the germans, they failed to make the occupied lands useful. They were too busy on the genocidal part, so they were under supplied. Yamamoto knew that Pearl Harbour attack would give them around 6 months to assert dominance, or they would be condemned to fail.
My father was in the Royal Naval Volunteer reserve as Lt Commander in charge of Landing Craft Tank Gun Boats, after the defat of germany he was told that his flotilla of craft were going to have there 4.7 inch guns replaced with a heaver calibre and more accurate weapons, that the craft would be modified with ballast tanks, the plan being that they should sail up to the invasion beaches and then flood the ballast tanks to sit on the bottom and make a stable gun platform so they could shoot directly into the japanese bunkers to disable theire guns as it was found unless a large calibre shell made a direct hit the palm tree, sand bunkers didnt seem affected. he knew that the likelyhood of surviving was next to nil but the chance of capture was everpressent so bought himself a 9mm self loading pistol to have as well as his service revolver to ensure he had one round left for his own head. he never forgave the japanese and said the dropping of the atom bombs was the best thing since sliced bread.
Thanks for a very informative video.
Nigel
The emperor was a war criminal and the Japanese got off easy compared to Germany.
Germany still is apologetic for what they did and the Japanese don't even acknowledge their crimes.
I never understood this and it makes my blood boil whenever I see someone "moaning" about the US using A-Bombs on Japan.
Germany is ceasing to exist while Japan will still be Japan in a hundred years. Seems the Japanese approach is better...
@@patnor7354 Low birthrate and zero immigration, I would not be so sure of that.
Good post, TF! I remember how men were aboard ship on their way to mainland Japan when they heard that Japan surrendered. We can only imagine their joy when they heard that no more American, Canadian, British or Australian blood would be spilled.
Some of media about this is worth to check out:
- An Emperor In August covered some details about this and even an attempted coup to prevent Hirohito.
- Barefoot Gen
- The Eternal Zero, about kamikaze pilot’s life and despised to see some of inexperienced young pilot to participate in the suicidal mission.
I remember reading that contemporary Japanese said that dropping the atomic bombs was the right decision. Besides the millions killed, an invasion would have completely wrecked the country and taken far longer to recover.
It’s insane how this mission would’ve made the two atom bombs look less terrifying. Imagine how much different the world would be if dozens of millions more died, maybe Japan would’ve been divided within the Allies since there would be very few civilians. Maybe Japan would’ve been a 3rd world country, the possibilities of this going through are staggering
Man, a small group of a few islands made the Allies choose a crazy decision rather than a more crazier decision
I'll send this video to anyone that thinks the atomic bombings were a mistake.
Also mention the Japanese Unit 731.
I’ve read somewhere that the allies knew the casualties would be so high so they created alot of Purple Hearts and that the purple hearts they give now are from that era
Yeah they created 500,000 Purple Hearts in preperation for the huge losses that would have occurred if the invasion happened.
The military are still using Purple Heart medals that were produced for the expected casualties from the invasion.
Emperor: Nukes are cruel and lead to too many civilian deaths
Also Emperor: run at them with sticks so that I do not get killed.
What a great leader
It wasn't the Emperor that was pushing the fight on civilians, but the Japanese military, primarily the the Imperial Army. Japan was 100 percent controlled by the military. When the Emperor accepted the surrender terms, Japanese troops attempted to overthrow the Emperor's decision. Fortunately, the Commander of the Imperial Guard Division refused to join the coup and ordered his troops to defend the Emperor. He and many of his troops died defending the Emperor from these forces. The Emperor made very few of the decisions during the war actually; most were made by the Imperial War Council made up of mostly Army officers.
For me, it sounds like, that hirohito (and staff) hoped to destroy the first wave of invasion and to show the allies (without USSR) that they are still able to fight them. Afterwards, they wouldve tried to negoticate through the soviets, because they weren´t in the war (yet). But after the Russians attacked in Manchuria, this option was not given anymore. Since Japan was an anticommunist state it needed a reason to surrender, which wasnt the russian attack. So the Atomic bombs, which were (for me) not the main reason of surrendering came coincedently in the right time. So hirohito gave his speech and surrendered to the allies, to let the world believe, that it was the allies alone, who defeated japan. This also helped him, to stay in power, because the USA were interesseted in an allied-favored Japan, because the Soviet-American-friendship held high during the war, was already iced out.
Very interesting point.
This is definitely what happened. The Soviets were the bigger threat, but the devastation of the bomb enabled a surrender without allowing Soviet influence in Japan
I definitely wouldnt say the Soviets were a bigger threat since the americans were prepared to nuke every japanese major city until they gave up
@@somedudeonline1936 True. Also how would the Soviets even invade Japan? They didn't have a navy powerful enough to transport a huge army to invade Japan. The Russians are more of a land military power not a naval power.
@@XD152awesomeness How would the Soviets have invaded Japan? They didn't have a Navy to launch such a invasion. The US had the Naval and Air power to successfully invade Japan not the Soviets.
The Japanese also had at least one submarine at sea equipped with biological weapons (cholera) they planned to unleash on San Diego. The end of the war came before it reached its target.
Invading Japan would have been an absolute horror that would have prolonged the war into 1946 and perhaps beyond.
To those who think Japan was worried of a Soviet invasion in 1945 which made them surrender, think again. D-Day in 1944 had almost 7,000 vessels involved, and that was just invading a small part of France. Not just combat ships but ships specialized for transport, landing and logistics. By mid 1945 the Soviet Navy had less than 600 vessels, a third were subs, the rest were gunboats, old and captured ships and lend lease transports, and with the soviet-western relationship getting cold, the Western Allies ain't lending them any more.
Considering there are few admirals who can plan a Naval Invasion and even if they did Russian Fighters aren't made for long range escorts due to the nature of air battles in the Western Front and their Shock Armies, Guards Rifle Division and Assault Engineers are Land Based troops not made for Naval Invasions like dedicated Marines are and majority of the Russian Navy is in Europe it will take forever to relocate them that if it happens without trouble so only two country can actually invade Japan which is UK (this is already a stretch) and US
I've known a few guys whose fathers came home from the Pacific theatre with samurai swords. McArthur demanded that the entire population was to be disarmed, including family's ceremonial swords. Each family took their swords to an allied temporary admin point and handed theirs in. These were passed out to troops as tokens of the victory. Some of these GIs came home with priceless centuries old swords. One of my friend's dad had two of them displayed in his rec room.
One of japans national swords was lost after the owner of it had to hand it in. The masamune sword. Nobody knows where it is to this day other than it being handed to a u.s gi
There's a joke about the kamikaze pilots having lost all the best ones in training
"Right, lads! Pay attention, I'm only going to show you this once!"
The Emperor was more of a figurehead than an active head of government. The structure of the Japanese government under their constitution meant the IJA and IJN were not under civilian control and could operate as they saw fit. Also, when it became apparent Hirohito ordered acceptance of the Potsdam Declaration he was the target of a failed coup attempt.
The idea of the Emperor being only a figurehead is not true. The army was responsible directly to the emperor. They took their power from the support of the Emperor. They would never have dared oppose him directly. Hiro Hito agreed to everything until he realized he would lose power. The failed coup attempt wasn't targeting the Emperor, it was targeting the record of him surrendering. The army knew once people would be aware the emperor had decided to stop the war, the would have no other choice than to comply. Had Hiro hito refused to declare war to the USA, the war would never have happened, such was his weight in japanese policies. The Japanese Emperor was perfectly informed of the policies of all government including Tojo's. I agree Emperors at that time would perhaps not meddle daily in public affairs for fears of losing their authority but going to war was far too serious a subject to even think Hiro Hito did not give full support to the military including to the atrocities they commited.
He have power, and much actually
The Emperor was educated and had his people. He knew what was going on. They do say the royal family made a fortune from the looting of the territories they conquered.
"We must embrace pain and burn it as fuel for our journey. She who loves roses must be patient and not cry out when she is pierced by thorns"
- Kenji Miyazawa
From what I've read, Hirohito was kind of a push-over, he never really wanted to be Emperor and actually just wanted to be a scientist. Does this make him a good man? No, probably not as he was well aware of the "medical experiments" and even personally watching a live dissection, I do however think he had a lot less power on a practical scale than we sometimes assume.
I feel that Hirohito was intimidated by the prospect of assassination at the hands of fanatical Army or Naval personnel. Still, he might have been able to control them.
I can't even blame hirohito for ww2. The 2nd sino-japanese war (which started the world war 2 in the pacific) was started by rogue army officer. In order to save face ( as not to say they lost control of the army) the civilian governemt endorsed the the attack after the fact.
Add to that the kyujo incident where rogue army officers (again) tried to capture the emperor, destroy the recording of the surrender speach in order to continue the war.
It was a good call for douglas not to drag the emperor to the tribunal. Not only did it help the transition after war, it secure japan as ally in cold war.
So in other terms, it was either lose millions through the invasion or lose hundreds of thousands from the atomic bombs, and the second was the lesser evil