The fan translators out there definitely deserve a lot more praise, games with tons of dialogue like RPGs are fully translated and they sometimes do even better work than the publishers who sometimes change a lot to make it more american friendly.
Yup. I’ve even seen some incredible full-on retranslations of games that exist, and usually for VERY good reason (I’m looking at *you*, Breath of Fire 2.)
I really don't understand how & why fan translators are a MILLION times better then translators OFFICIALLY hired to translate something. (I mean not really, of course I understand why Fan translators are way better then people hired to do the job... they aren't even on the same level, it is like comparing a Eunach to the Emperor{the eunuchs sre the hired translators}) It is absolutely ridiculous on all levels possible !!! Not only in games but in Asian Drama, etc. Good luck trying to understand what is being ACTUALLY said in "translations for hire", I mean even I with my limited comprehension of Mandarin/Cantonese I find these supposed translators absolutely BUTCHERING the language. TVB is a huge offender here. All their content is supposed to be multilingual with numerous Sound(language) choices, and subtitle choices(including English) and they absolutely all DESERVE to be fired strung up, stripped naked, and Flogged for their butchering of their supposed "TRANSLATIONS"‼️‼️‼️💯💯🤣
I dont have to watch an entire episode to give your vids a thumbs up. The most badass reviews on UA-cam for sure presented by Chuck Norris' younger brother and my local rabbi.
It's incredible no one tried to contact her during those 7 days considering she had only be retired for about a year and most likely still had many friends or at least acquaintances. I still can't believe she didn't go to a hospital and let the pneumonia actually take her life.... Sad ending to an amazing career.
Haha! I actually never heard of her until now, and I'm not sure if I could comfortably view her older work considering she's no longer alive. But she acutally became a pretty popular mainstream actress and had no problems talking about her troubled youth and earlier work as an "actress" to the media. From what I read on her Wikipedia page she seemed pretty amazing. :)
Game Sack, GameXplain and the Game Chasers. My favorite youtube channels. Unfortunately there aren't daily episodes. But these videos are of such quality, that I can just rewatch them.
Thanks Dave and Joe for making such quality videos. I know I, like so many other of your fans wait patiently for new videos to come out and it seems like you guys enjoy making these as much as we enjoy watching,
Nothing puts me to sleep faster than Game Sack. Which is a shame because their videos are really interesting. Unfortunately, their voices are just so soothing. Oh well, at least it cures my insomnia.
Lindvardh Stødhingsson There are far too many reviewers and Let's Players on UA-cam who do enough yelling and screaming about games as is (most of them very annoying). Part of the reason this is my favorite show is because they don't do that much unless it's in the short skits towards the end.
I'm fine with repros of games that weren't released here or of good romhacks as long as they're clearly labeled as repros. Translating all those greats that we in the west missed out on and getting them on carts should be the next big step we take as a retro gaming community. You know you want to play them.
I've actually had people selling repro carts take my UA-cam videos and embed them on their sites. Normally I'd have no problem with that but they on the site they claimed that they did the translations themselves when I knew they did not and was very unimpressed. When I asked them not to use my videos to sell games they claimed to have translated when they didn't they ignored it and eventually I had to block embedding on that one video to force them to stop. Be careful who you buy from. Some of the repro makers are on the up and up and some are very shady. I think it's an important industry though as for many people it would be nearly impossible to play these games on original hardware. Especially games which were never translated.
That sucks dude, you put that much effort and love into a project there is no way it should be jacked and used by somebody else. Fair fucking play to you though, skilled, hard working, productive software engineer / developer. 👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍
I never knew about Sapphire before this video, and that's a travesty. More music from the Lords of Thunder wizards, and we missed out on it here in the U.S. Ugh. It's also too bad that we never got that 16-bit Excitebike game. While it probably needed more polish for a retail release, the basic formula appears intact and I probably would've bought it anyway. We missed out on a lot of games, mainly before the hobby really became mainstream. And now, with some of these publishers & developers gone, getting legitimate versions of these games (instead of repros/bootlegs) is nearly impossible. It's sad. I learned a lot from this episode and really enjoyed it. Thanks for the continued dedication and hard work in putting these together!
Repro carts are darker than grey for me, personally; it's just a fancier way of selling a ROM, which are free and most of them can be uploaded on a flash cart (sans CD games and Star Fox 2). That said, they are awesome for collectors wanting a "newer" game for their respective collections. Even then, collectors do mind the older games getting taken apart in order to make them; however, Retro USB and Krizz's carts use original molding, thus no real cart is sacrificed in the process.
I am glad that you guys talked about the issue of translations being released as repros without the translators permission. So many videos on repros just ignore it or gloss it over, glad to see some one actually talking about it head on.
Back in the day when I collected a lot of music, I loved bootlegs of concerts or B-sides, etc. Repros are just the same thing with a different name. I do appreciate that people are translating the Japanese games that we never got a chance to play over here. Sweet Home is certainly on my list.
Thanks guys. This is the first time I post in a long time, but your videos are awesome. I have to say it gets my mind off of all these problems I've had lately, and I can sleep well now that there's a new episode. Don't stop making videos guys.
I make genesis repro's from time to time. It's a great way to play a game on real hardware that would normally cost like 300 bucks, and it's a fun little craft project.
I'd never heard of the BS-X Broadcasting System for the SNES before. Man, it's crazy to think Nintendo were introducing the concept of downloadable content all the way back as far as 1990.
I would buy a repro for 2 reasons, either because it's an unreleased game and I want the rom put onto a cart so I can play it on hardware or the original cart is so rare and expensive that I just don't have the money or I doubt I'll ever find one an actual cart even online, like for example, the NWC Carts, I highly doubt I'll ever have the money to spend on a Gold or even a Gray Cart of it, so might as well just buy a repro version.
I played through Sweet Home over the Easter and I agree that it's great. There's a clever mix of puzzle solving and combat and once you get to the end, the final fight is more or less one big puzzle to compensate for the fact that you most likely are super overlevelled at this point. Great video as always guys!
As a scene member, I can tell you that repros of fan translations are universally scorned by translators. It breaks a basic tenet of translation hacking, which is that the translations are ALWAYS distributed as patches to create a clear distinction between the derivative and original works. I'd be surprised if even a single repro has been made with the translator's consent. This is because we *know* that it's unethical to receive payment for either the derivative or the original work. I think there is some leeway for repros of unreleased games, but repros of fan translations are inherently unscrupulous. Please do fan translators a favor and don't download prepatched roms or buy repros of fan translations. Play them for free as they were intended, by patching them yourself and playing on an emulator or original hardware via flash cart or burning to disc.
Love the episode. Especially topic. I'm totally fine with repros if they are marked as such clearly. Even if the copyright issues are there. I would love to see official reprints for old games like this. But the past publishers or developers no longer care. So I'm glad guys like pc works does this.
Usually I get drunk and do drugs and watch gamesack on the comedown but today I've neither consumed alcohol or drugs and it's like watching a new show when you r sober!
The reason the zelda tablets game has that text in the bottom is because in the original japanase broadcast of the game you had a narrator telling you everything link was doing asuming it was imposible to put the voices in the reproduction cart i suppose they translated them so you could experience that in someway
***** The thing is, the voices themselves were not only in Japanese but are also lost because it was broadcasted live so it was never stored. So having the text would be an easier way to do it than hiring people to not only dub it but fit it on a cartage.
I love repros for prototypes and unreleased games (Satellaview for example). Otherwise they're fine, provided they are aesthetically different enough from the official cartridges that they can be easily told apart.
If you want a collection of decent looking and playable games Repros are great! Not as good as the original, but personally I like owning games I wouldn't normally be able to play on my SNES.
Interesting topic for an episode. I look forward to these episodes so much guys. Please consider doing more developer themed episodes in the future...like a From Software episode to cover Armored core, Dark Souls, & Bloodborne.
I remember playing a fan translation of Final fantasy 4 just out of curiosity that I bootlegged. It was good though noticed a few bad grammer errors. So a few years later square comes out with a collection on the playstation. It has a new translation! Low in behold...same grammer mistakes. Stealing other people's work goes both ways.
Fun Fact: The scientific name for the rhino beetle family is Dynastes. Thus, Dynastic Hero. Also, Mr. Gimmick is a fantastic almost repro exclusive title.
Great episode, as always! From a moral standpoint, I think it's fine to buy at least repros of those Super Famicom Satellite games. Nintendo has the Virtual Console, and the eShop, and if they wanted to, they could easily bring over those games, and I bet they'd sell pretty well.
As a Repro Maker, translations and mods are released with the understanding that they will be used for both emulation and copiers. What you are ultimately paying someone like me, is the time, effort, know how, and skill to hack those roms and place them on physical carts.
I disagree about repros being in a grey area. Gamestop doesn't pay anyone for used games. Though repros aren't used games, the issue is similar. If the company decided not to port it or redistribute it, the games are basically dead. Now, if the anyone associated with the original game reaches out, they should be paid. Also, if the game is rereleased, that should be the version that is played by everyone.
FYI, the original versions of the Xak games actually do play almost exactly like the Ys games, bump system and all. I don't know if this is true of Xak 3 in particular, but I do know Xak 1 and 2 were both bump-system titles that honestly could've been called Ys and few people would know the difference. ;) They're kind of Ys rip-offs, but they're so good and so close in quality to the Ys games that it's hard to be too mad at MicroCabin for their work on them -- they were just clearly Ys fans who wanted to try their hand at making similar games, and did a bang-up job of it. Later ports of Xak 1 (like the Super Famicom version) added button attacks, and I'm willing to bet the same is true of Xak 2 and 3 as well, so I'm guessing if you look, there'll be a version of Xak 3 out there that uses the bump system. Though I'm far from an authority on the matter. ;) Great episode, BTW, but a weird one to watch for me personally, since I'm actually playing Xak 1 right now on my newly-acquired MSX2. Also because of my own dealings with the guy who posted that topic about Xak 3 being used without permission -- he's made claims against us as well, which are very much untrue (he's a programmer, not a translator, and we've never used a single line of his programming work in any of our releases), but which he feels very strongly about. He seems like he has much more of a solid case here, though, since his programming work was indeed clearly used by the people creating the repro CDs for Xak 3. I definitely don't think it's right at all that he wasn't contacted about this -- in this case, other people are definitely profiting off of his work directly. In general, repro carts weird me out for this very reason -- though I suppose most if not all of these games (especially unreleased games or BS titles) are out-of-print and making no money for the original developers anymore anyway, so it's not thaaaat bad? But then again, now some people ARE getting money for those games, they're just not the people who had anything to do with their creation or translation, so... it's all kind of a gray area, like you said. And because of that grayness, it still feels kind of dirty to me, which is why I have yet to purchase a single repro game. I've considered picking up Sweet Home, but I might just go for a Famicom copy instead (or in addition).
Wyrdwad Why would you buy a repro copy of Sweet Home? I own the Famicom version, and I don't see why you'd get the repro over the original, since there is no language barrier for you?
GoldenSirius I considered it just out of curiosity, mostly, as it seems like a good fan-translation. I probably would buy the original over a repro, though, if I could find it for a good price.
Wyrdwad Hi. Please release the PSTV patch for Ys Memories of Celceta that exists in Japan in the US. There is no reason for us not to have it. Thank you and have a good day. Unless you don't release the patch then have a very bad day!
Game Sack We've been trying! Falcom needs to get the patch set up for the Western edition(s) of the game, though, before we can release it, and they seem really hesitant to do so for some reason. We keep asking them about it, and they keep either saying they're busy and they'll do it later, or just not responding at all. No idea what the hold-up is, but we'll keep at them, don't you worry!
I think the whole "grey area" you guys talked about comes down to the fact that people producing repros don't have any more legal right to do what they're doing than people who distribute fan translations. It's like one drug dealer ripping off another. There is not a real legal recourse to solve the problem, it just comes down to personal ethics. When there's no law involved, it's the rule of the jungle. Might makes right and whoever hustles and puts out a product that people are willing to pay for wins. At the worst you can say that the repro makers are in the wrong, but they don't legally owe anything to anyone that spent any time translating or localizing anything just for fun. If it comes down to an issue of respect for others' work or ethics, you can make that choice by not buying games that weren't made in collaboration with the original people that worked on localizing it. The reality is that nobody involved has the legal rights to those IP's or particular software, so it's all basically fan-service that some will profit from and others will engage in just for personal satisfaction. The end result is people who want a game will buy it...if you're someone that doesn't want to get ripped off by spending real and valuable time translating a game for fans, then either don't do it or make a lot of noise on social media to prevent others from selling it, because that's your only real option.
Nice episode! If copyrights on repro's are brought up again I think you should add artwork to the list of things to talk about. So many print posters, books and boxes from people doing fan-service just like the translators
As someone who works with repros for a living currently, we try to reach out to any translator if we make something that uses a fan translation if we can track down the translator unless they've stated in any "readme" file that they are cool with it. Most times it's like you said in the video, they are just cool with it. Though yes, very much a grey area in many aspects. On that note, Twinkle Tale on the Genesis is one of my favorite repros, as is Super Fantasy Zone.
I like that the River City Ransom 2 cart used a real donor cart and board. That's going to be a must for me going forward. I have a couple of those heavy ones and I'm afraid they look like the one you showed inside. Honestly, I'd like to learn how to program and build my own.
A game that comes to mind that would probably cover three different segments you guys do: Summer Carnival '92: Recca for the Famicom. This game is rare, expensive, pushes the system's limits, and there are quite a few variations of repros out there. This is one of the few repro carts I was considering. When I found the ROM, I was hooked immediately. Repros are definitely something I could get into with the unreleased games, especially the SFC Satellaview games.
The dialogue at the bottom of the BS Zelda is a compromise the programmers had to make. During the actual broadcast the conversations would've been fully spoken dialogue.
My favorite repros are "Shui Hu Feng Yun Zhaun" (Beneath the Clouds) and Fix it Felix Jr. both for the Megadrive/Genesis. I'm not a huge fan of collecting repros, but find myself interested in having physical copies that I can actually play on the console, usually unlicensed games like the two mentioned above. I'm still looking for a physical copy of Gauntlet DS, so far all I've seen is the rom dumped online.
not gonna lie. i am drunk and feel like i cant breathe. but watching this episode and breathing every three seconds saved my life. i love you game sack.
8-Bit Eric So you're saying that if we hadn't of released this episode when we did, you'd be dead? Sometimes we all make decisions we regret and now I'm really regretting not waiting an extra day to release this! Oh well I guess final bosses have to help each other out.
Great video guys, some of my favorite repro carts are Clock Tower for the SNES, EarthBound zero for the NES and DragonQuest 3 the SNES which was a Japanese exclusive remake
The reason there are text popups at the bottom of the screen in that Zelda is because you had to play it during the broadcast hours in Japan, and live audio would be streamed to the player's console, a recording of the conversations which have been here turned to text. Since naturally the streaming system is down nowadays, and the audio would have been in Japanese anyway, it's great to have what was an element of the original reintegrated in some form. Maybe someday, someone will make a MSU-1 adaptation of it in repro form, and we'll get the audio playing (in english, by a group of dedicated fans) so that the full experience can be brought back and players wouldn't have to read, but as it is, cramming all the audio inside would be problematic. It's likely that this Excitebike game used to stream the audio music as well, hence the parts without music in it, but don't quote me on that. I'm pretty sure of my facts about the Zelda one though.
A couple years ago I got a pretty decent PAL version of Mega Man & Bass complete with box and manual fully translated. Though the box suffered from that stretched photoshop thing the cart did not so I´m pretty happy with it. Pretty nice for a game that only came out in Japan. =)
here's how I see it the original developers weren't going to make any money on said game if they never planned to release it internationally. So they shouldn't be upset about loosing money they would have never made. When it comes to the translators of said games, most of the work was done just to translate it for an English audience with no expectation of getting paid. This is where it starts getting grey for me, I'm not sure where my morals stand on reproduction carts and who should receive the money.
"There was controversy over people selling this game without the translator getting any of the money." Yyyeahhhh..that's about how a lot of repros go. Tons of rom hacks and translations get sold online without the original creator getting any money. Hell, half the time, they're lucky to even get credit. I've even seen some sites make custom title screens for their rom hacks, which removed the in-game credits in the process. I'm actually doing a very basic re-hack of a SMB NES hack. Re-doing some sprites, and making custom levels for Super Mario Xmas. But it's mainly for personal use. I almost don't want to upload it anywhere, because it wouldn't surprise me if it ended up on a repro site a month later, being sold for $40, without so much as a "hey we're selling your shit".
Just want to thank you guys :D your channel is the best ever, I recently lost my father to throat cancer and yeah you guys get me through the day everyday. Lol this might sound weird but jay reminds me of my dad XD but yeah love your show cause it reminds me of my dad who gave me my first video game which was an atari 2600. Love u guys love ur show
I don't have any repro games, but I do have some repro Gundam Wing Music CDs I got in the late 90's that came in blue jewel cases, that my old import comics shop said a guy did for him in Hong Kong, as the originals only had a limited pressing. They are pressed disc, and not burned disc, and they came with spine cards, and everything just like the originals, and they where only $23 for both disc at the time, and I'm really glad I got them, as they have turned out to be some of my favorite Anime soundtracks to chill out too.
i'm gonna gather up every gameboyrelated game review dave has ever done and then collect them on my own repro gamesack vhs! pop it into the old vcr and then i'll yell out loud: WOW! just yesterday i was hoping for a game sack on the good old gameboy and now i already have it! MAGIC!
Sweet Home was the inspiration for what later became Biohazard/Resident Evil. So even though the original game didn't come out in the US its legacy lives on.
Great episode as usual. I know you cant possibly cover everything out there but it would have been nice to see you talk about Chrono Trigger Flames of Eternity
I just ordered a repo a few months ago. It was a port of Leisure suit larry for the NES sold by Retrousb. I love it. I think I am going to start getting more Repros.
Sapphire has got to be one of my favorite soundtracks.. up there with Lords of Thunder on the TG-CD! Sweet Home, I was delightfully surprised by how in-depth for a Famicom game it was, great game, with a lot of substance and the graphics are top notch!
It's also worth saying that someone should really get their hands on the original cart molds and make new ones, along with scrap parts from broken games, old warehouse stock, etc in order to save old carts from being chopped up. Id gladly pay extra for this!
+Eric Durant Some games have literally millions of copies sold that are eating up dust on shelves. If nobody wants to pay for them, the owners should be able to do with them what they want.
The fan translators out there definitely deserve a lot more praise, games with tons of dialogue like RPGs are fully translated and they sometimes do even better work than the publishers who sometimes change a lot to make it more american friendly.
Yup. I’ve even seen some incredible full-on retranslations of games that exist, and usually for VERY good reason (I’m looking at *you*, Breath of Fire 2.)
I really don't understand how & why fan translators are a MILLION times better then translators OFFICIALLY hired to translate something. (I mean not really, of course I understand why Fan translators are way better then people hired to do the job... they aren't even on the same level, it is like comparing a Eunach to the Emperor{the eunuchs sre the hired translators})
It is absolutely ridiculous on all levels possible !!!
Not only in games but in Asian Drama, etc.
Good luck trying to understand what is being ACTUALLY said in "translations for hire", I mean even I with my limited comprehension of Mandarin/Cantonese I find these supposed translators absolutely BUTCHERING the language. TVB is a huge offender here. All their content is supposed to be multilingual with numerous Sound(language) choices, and subtitle choices(including English) and they absolutely all DESERVE to be fired strung up, stripped naked, and Flogged for their butchering of their supposed "TRANSLATIONS"‼️‼️‼️💯💯🤣
@@Renwoxing13 wtf is this comment
I dont have to watch an entire episode to give your vids a thumbs up. The most badass reviews on UA-cam for sure presented by Chuck Norris' younger brother and my local rabbi.
Stone8age That's funny. I'm glad you like the show.
Game Sack Dave A yarmulke really might suit you well, Dave! That's one kosher way to cover a pesky bald spot.
frozenaorta why is Dave being called a Jew lol? he reminds me of Billy Mays
protocetid maybe the beard? Ha. No reason. I was just going off what the other guy said about being a rabbi.
Stone8age
lol
You forgot to add chuck Norris' *nerdy* younger brother. What? Nerds are cool! This isn't the 80's anymore. :D
Game Sack, y'all rock. Thank you for putting these videos together. We viewers appreciate all of your hard work.
Upon research concerning Magical Pop'n for the voice actress, she died in 2008 and they only discovered her body 7 days after she died
Ah man...
ShootStyleZombie whhhhhhaaaaa... Can you provide links to the research? :(
Rowsdower Mansion
Wikipedia and it was sourced
It's incredible no one tried to contact her during those 7 days considering she had only be retired for about a year and most likely still had many friends or at least acquaintances. I still can't believe she didn't go to a hospital and let the pneumonia actually take her life.... Sad ending to an amazing career.
Haha! I actually never heard of her until now, and I'm not sure if I could comfortably view her older work considering she's no longer alive. But she acutally became a pretty popular mainstream actress and had no problems talking about her troubled youth and earlier work as an "actress" to the media. From what I read on her Wikipedia page she seemed pretty amazing. :)
My group translated Sweet Home at 13:00, its a bit unfortunate there are people making money off the translation we gave away for free
I would love it if GS continued on doing these kinds of episodes about the repros. I love this episode.
WOW I gave you the idea of making this video LAST NIGHT and you already put it out. You are a magician.
The Game Chasers I will pay your fee shortly. But actually your fee is equivalent to my fee for that other thing so we're even.
Game Sack "... your fee is equivalent to my fee for the other thing so we're even..."
- wait WHAT?
Chayse Poikea its a secret
Chayse Poikea It's a HUGE grey area
LonelyMonarchist1998 LOOOOOOL!
Game Sack, GameXplain and the Game Chasers. My favorite youtube channels. Unfortunately there aren't daily episodes. But these videos are of such quality, that I can just rewatch them.
Thanks Dave and Joe for making such quality videos. I know I, like so many other of your fans wait patiently for new videos to come out and it seems like you guys enjoy making these as much as we enjoy watching,
Krys Karr Thank You and yes we do enjoy making these videos. Always a good time.
Still the Best Channel on UA-cam. Thank you both for making my days so much better. Oh and the young lady who occasionally helps with filming. :)
Nolon GT Thank You!
Been feeling pretty jaded/bummed over video games lately, but I can always count on Game Sack to pick me up and renew my enthusiasm. Thanks, guys.
I was falling asleep to game sack until I heard my phone. You guys make such soothing sounds. Dave moreso than Joe, obviously.
Nothing puts me to sleep faster than Game Sack. Which is a shame because their videos are really interesting. Unfortunately, their voices are just so soothing. Oh well, at least it cures my insomnia.
falsehero2001 I don't get this! Our voices are NOT soothing! They are irritating!
Game Sack I agree your voice are NOT soothing
falsehero2001 Glad to know it's not just me. Maybe Joe and Dave need to just start yelling their lines.
Lindvardh Stødhingsson Or we could start smoking and sound like this lady: ua-cam.com/video/SsLUAKYAmAU/v-deo.html
Lindvardh Stødhingsson There are far too many reviewers and Let's Players on UA-cam who do enough yelling and screaming about games as is (most of them very annoying). Part of the reason this is my favorite show is because they don't do that much unless it's in the short skits towards the end.
I can always safely like these videos even before they start. Nice!
I'm fine with repros of games that weren't released here or of good romhacks as long as they're clearly labeled as repros.
Translating all those greats that we in the west missed out on and getting them on carts should be the next big step we take as a retro gaming community. You know you want to play them.
There is nothing better that new episode of Game Sack on Sunday morning!
I've actually had people selling repro carts take my UA-cam videos and embed them on their sites. Normally I'd have no problem with that but they on the site they claimed that they did the translations themselves when I knew they did not and was very unimpressed. When I asked them not to use my videos to sell games they claimed to have translated when they didn't they ignored it and eventually I had to block embedding on that one video to force them to stop.
Be careful who you buy from. Some of the repro makers are on the up and up and some are very shady. I think it's an important industry though as for many people it would be nearly impossible to play these games on original hardware. Especially games which were never translated.
That sucks dude, you put that much effort and love into a project there is no way it should be jacked and used by somebody else.
Fair fucking play to you though, skilled, hard working, productive software engineer / developer.
👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍
I never knew about Sapphire before this video, and that's a travesty. More music from the Lords of Thunder wizards, and we missed out on it here in the U.S. Ugh.
It's also too bad that we never got that 16-bit Excitebike game. While it probably needed more polish for a retail release, the basic formula appears intact and I probably would've bought it anyway.
We missed out on a lot of games, mainly before the hobby really became mainstream. And now, with some of these publishers & developers gone, getting legitimate versions of these games (instead of repros/bootlegs) is nearly impossible. It's sad.
I learned a lot from this episode and really enjoyed it. Thanks for the continued dedication and hard work in putting these together!
The developers don't get a cut when you buy the legitimate game used, which is the only way to buy any of these retro games.
Repro carts are darker than grey for me, personally; it's just a fancier way of selling a ROM, which are free and most of them can be uploaded on a flash cart (sans CD games and Star Fox 2). That said, they are awesome for collectors wanting a "newer" game for their respective collections. Even then, collectors do mind the older games getting taken apart in order to make them; however, Retro USB and Krizz's carts use original molding, thus no real cart is sacrificed in the process.
I am glad that you guys talked about the issue of translations being released as repros without the translators permission. So many videos on repros just ignore it or gloss it over, glad to see some one actually talking about it head on.
Back in the day when I collected a lot of music, I loved bootlegs of concerts or B-sides, etc. Repros are just the same thing with a different name. I do appreciate that people are translating the Japanese games that we never got a chance to play over here. Sweet Home is certainly on my list.
Good episode... opening the cartridge was a nice touch. Bravo again guys.
Thanks guys. This is the first time I post in a long time, but your videos are awesome. I have to say it gets my mind off of all these problems I've had lately, and I can sleep well now that there's a new episode. Don't stop making videos guys.
I make genesis repro's from time to time. It's a great way to play a game on real hardware that would normally cost like 300 bucks, and it's a fun little craft project.
I'd never heard of the BS-X Broadcasting System for the SNES before. Man, it's crazy to think Nintendo were introducing the concept of downloadable content all the way back as far as 1990.
I need a Game Sack coffee mug. Get on that, guys.
Thanks for sharing these games with us, your videos are top notch.
Ahh, Sunday morning Game Sack, thank you for yet another excellent episode.
I would buy a repro for 2 reasons, either because it's an unreleased game and I want the rom put onto a cart so I can play it on hardware or the original cart is so rare and expensive that I just don't have the money or I doubt I'll ever find one an actual cart even online, like for example, the NWC Carts, I highly doubt I'll ever have the money to spend on a Gold or even a Gray Cart of it, so might as well just buy a repro version.
I played through Sweet Home over the Easter and I agree that it's great. There's a clever mix of puzzle solving and combat and once you get to the end, the final fight is more or less one big puzzle to compensate for the fact that you most likely are super overlevelled at this point. Great video as always guys!
As a scene member, I can tell you that repros of fan translations are universally scorned by translators. It breaks a basic tenet of translation hacking, which is that the translations are ALWAYS distributed as patches to create a clear distinction between the derivative and original works. I'd be surprised if even a single repro has been made with the translator's consent. This is because we *know* that it's unethical to receive payment for either the derivative or the original work. I think there is some leeway for repros of unreleased games, but repros of fan translations are inherently unscrupulous. Please do fan translators a favor and don't download prepatched roms or buy repros of fan translations. Play them for free as they were intended, by patching them yourself and playing on an emulator or original hardware via flash cart or burning to disc.
And I would love to see more repro episodes in the future.
Love the episode. Especially topic. I'm totally fine with repros if they are marked as such clearly. Even if the copyright issues are there.
I would love to see official reprints for old games like this. But the past publishers or developers no longer care. So I'm glad guys like pc works does this.
Usually I get drunk and do drugs and watch gamesack on the comedown but today I've neither consumed alcohol or drugs and it's like watching a new show when you r sober!
The reason the zelda tablets game has that text in the bottom is because in the original japanase broadcast of the game you had a narrator telling you everything link was doing asuming it was imposible to put the voices in the reproduction cart i suppose they translated them so you could experience that in someway
***** The thing is, the voices themselves were not only in Japanese but are also lost because it was broadcasted live so it was never stored. So having the text would be an easier way to do it than hiring people to not only dub it but fit it on a cartage.
***** Thanks for the info. That's interesting.
I love repros for prototypes and unreleased games (Satellaview for example). Otherwise they're fine, provided they are aesthetically different enough from the official cartridges that they can be easily told apart.
If you want a collection of decent looking and playable games Repros are great! Not as good as the original, but personally I like owning games I wouldn't normally be able to play on my SNES.
Interesting topic for an episode. I look forward to these episodes so much guys. Please consider doing more developer themed episodes in the future...like a From Software episode to cover Armored core, Dark Souls, & Bloodborne.
I remember playing a fan translation of Final fantasy 4 just out of curiosity that I bootlegged. It was good though noticed a few bad grammer errors. So a few years later square comes out with a collection on the playstation. It has a new translation! Low in behold...same grammer mistakes. Stealing other people's work goes both ways.
"Low in behold...same grammer mistakes." (sic) ...😂
I don't mean to tease you but _that_ is a funny sentence.
Repro's are great cause we get to experience games that we otherwise wouldn't be able to in physical form. Great episode as always guys.
thank you phone notification i was watching a different video and shut it down for you guys
I need that Tanooki Mario 3 shirt in my life.
GT6SuzukaTimeTrials 8BitFetish.com ;)
Fun Fact: The scientific name for the rhino beetle family is Dynastes. Thus, Dynastic Hero. Also, Mr. Gimmick is a fantastic almost repro exclusive title.
Great episode, as always! From a moral standpoint, I think it's fine to buy at least repros of those Super Famicom Satellite games. Nintendo has the Virtual Console, and the eShop, and if they wanted to, they could easily bring over those games, and I bet they'd sell pretty well.
everytime i see one of the videos of yours i hear great soundtracks,i like to see one day one video with yours 100 favorite ost of videogames
I didn't know the market for this stuff was so lively. Great episode.
Awesome episode! My favourite show on UA-cam!
As a Repro Maker, translations and mods are released with the understanding that they will be used for both emulation and copiers. What you are ultimately paying someone like me, is the time, effort, know how, and skill to hack those roms and place them on physical carts.
Thanks dude .im 37 and I appreciate this stuff .helps people remember there childhood and for me that's therapeutic.
I disagree about repros being in a grey area. Gamestop doesn't pay anyone for used games. Though repros aren't used games, the issue is similar. If the company decided not to port it or redistribute it, the games are basically dead. Now, if the anyone associated with the original game reaches out, they should be paid. Also, if the game is rereleased, that should be the version that is played by everyone.
FYI, the original versions of the Xak games actually do play almost exactly like the Ys games, bump system and all. I don't know if this is true of Xak 3 in particular, but I do know Xak 1 and 2 were both bump-system titles that honestly could've been called Ys and few people would know the difference. ;) They're kind of Ys rip-offs, but they're so good and so close in quality to the Ys games that it's hard to be too mad at MicroCabin for their work on them -- they were just clearly Ys fans who wanted to try their hand at making similar games, and did a bang-up job of it.
Later ports of Xak 1 (like the Super Famicom version) added button attacks, and I'm willing to bet the same is true of Xak 2 and 3 as well, so I'm guessing if you look, there'll be a version of Xak 3 out there that uses the bump system. Though I'm far from an authority on the matter. ;)
Great episode, BTW, but a weird one to watch for me personally, since I'm actually playing Xak 1 right now on my newly-acquired MSX2. Also because of my own dealings with the guy who posted that topic about Xak 3 being used without permission -- he's made claims against us as well, which are very much untrue (he's a programmer, not a translator, and we've never used a single line of his programming work in any of our releases), but which he feels very strongly about.
He seems like he has much more of a solid case here, though, since his programming work was indeed clearly used by the people creating the repro CDs for Xak 3. I definitely don't think it's right at all that he wasn't contacted about this -- in this case, other people are definitely profiting off of his work directly. In general, repro carts weird me out for this very reason -- though I suppose most if not all of these games (especially unreleased games or BS titles) are out-of-print and making no money for the original developers anymore anyway, so it's not thaaaat bad? But then again, now some people ARE getting money for those games, they're just not the people who had anything to do with their creation or translation, so... it's all kind of a gray area, like you said. And because of that grayness, it still feels kind of dirty to me, which is why I have yet to purchase a single repro game. I've considered picking up Sweet Home, but I might just go for a Famicom copy instead (or in addition).
Wyrdwad Why would you buy a repro copy of Sweet Home? I own the Famicom version, and I don't see why you'd get the repro over the original, since there is no language barrier for you?
GoldenSirius
I considered it just out of curiosity, mostly, as it seems like a good fan-translation. I probably would buy the original over a repro, though, if I could find it for a good price.
Wyrdwad Hi. Please release the PSTV patch for Ys Memories of Celceta that exists in Japan in the US. There is no reason for us not to have it. Thank you and have a good day. Unless you don't release the patch then have a very bad day!
Game Sack
We've been trying! Falcom needs to get the patch set up for the Western edition(s) of the game, though, before we can release it, and they seem really hesitant to do so for some reason. We keep asking them about it, and they keep either saying they're busy and they'll do it later, or just not responding at all. No idea what the hold-up is, but we'll keep at them, don't you worry!
Wyrdwad Where can I find their e-mail address? I can't imagine it would be much effort for them.
That Japanese satellite service sounds awesome! If I had been able to use that as a kid I would've been in gaming heaven.
Another fantastic episode. Thanks guys.
That beard is SHAPED. Kudos.
Yes new Game Sack. Best show on UA-cam.
I think the whole "grey area" you guys talked about comes down to the fact that people producing repros don't have any more legal right to do what they're doing than people who distribute fan translations. It's like one drug dealer ripping off another. There is not a real legal recourse to solve the problem, it just comes down to personal ethics. When there's no law involved, it's the rule of the jungle. Might makes right and whoever hustles and puts out a product that people are willing to pay for wins.
At the worst you can say that the repro makers are in the wrong, but they don't legally owe anything to anyone that spent any time translating or localizing anything just for fun. If it comes down to an issue of respect for others' work or ethics, you can make that choice by not buying games that weren't made in collaboration with the original people that worked on localizing it.
The reality is that nobody involved has the legal rights to those IP's or particular software, so it's all basically fan-service that some will profit from and others will engage in just for personal satisfaction. The end result is people who want a game will buy it...if you're someone that doesn't want to get ripped off by spending real and valuable time translating a game for fans, then either don't do it or make a lot of noise on social media to prevent others from selling it, because that's your only real option.
Thanks for rockin' the Mario 3 shirt from 8BitFetish.com, Dave!
Nice episode!
If copyrights on repro's are brought up again I think you should add artwork to the list of things to talk about. So many print posters, books and boxes from people doing fan-service just like the translators
As someone who works with repros for a living currently, we try to reach out to any translator if we make something that uses a fan translation if we can track down the translator unless they've stated in any "readme" file that they are cool with it. Most times it's like you said in the video, they are just cool with it. Though yes, very much a grey area in many aspects.
On that note, Twinkle Tale on the Genesis is one of my favorite repros, as is Super Fantasy Zone.
Never collected any repros but I don't think I'd be against it if in the future I came across something worthwhile and was way too expensive on Ebay.
Wow, that custom PCB on Magical Pop'n is a nice repro job.
I like that the River City Ransom 2 cart used a real donor cart and board. That's going to be a must for me going forward. I have a couple of those heavy ones and I'm afraid they look like the one you showed inside. Honestly, I'd like to learn how to program and build my own.
Oh wicked Sunday morning hangover is cured by a nice slice of game sack!!
Greet episode. Never knew so many raptor gamees existed. Good work Vade and Schorsch.
A game that comes to mind that would probably cover three different segments you guys do: Summer Carnival '92: Recca for the Famicom. This game is rare, expensive, pushes the system's limits, and there are quite a few variations of repros out there. This is one of the few repro carts I was considering. When I found the ROM, I was hooked immediately.
Repros are definitely something I could get into with the unreleased games, especially the SFC Satellaview games.
The dialogue at the bottom of the BS Zelda is a compromise the programmers had to make. During the actual broadcast the conversations would've been fully spoken dialogue.
My favorite repros are "Shui Hu Feng Yun Zhaun" (Beneath the Clouds) and Fix it Felix Jr. both for the Megadrive/Genesis.
I'm not a huge fan of collecting repros, but find myself interested in having physical copies that I can actually play on the console, usually unlicensed games like the two mentioned above. I'm still looking for a physical copy of Gauntlet DS, so far all I've seen is the rom dumped online.
It’s crazy how good cd quality music can be when it’s in the right hands.
What does that even mean? Your a dick. Stop trolling
@@TheGrader600 I know what you are but what am I
I have an awesome complete Mystic Ark repro. It has sweet box art, a manual, a poster, and cool artwork on the cart.
not gonna lie. i am drunk and feel like i cant breathe. but watching this episode and breathing every three seconds saved my life. i love you game sack.
8-Bit Eric Did you almost go Jewwario on us?
Doongie4ever dude, come on
uncalled for
8-Bit Eric So you're saying that if we hadn't of released this episode when we did, you'd be dead? Sometimes we all make decisions we regret and now I'm really regretting not waiting an extra day to release this! Oh well I guess final bosses have to help each other out.
This really brightened up my day. Thanks fellas. :-)
It always makes me happy to see a new gamesack in my subs, keep up the awesomeness guys!
I like cutting everyone out of the loop and go straight emulator.
Thanks Gamesack! I love the episode. I learn new things from you guys everytime :)
Best gaming show on UA-cam.
Watching this episode made me miss Dave!
Great video guys, some of my favorite repro carts are Clock Tower for the SNES, EarthBound zero for the NES and DragonQuest 3 the SNES which was a Japanese exclusive remake
The reason there are text popups at the bottom of the screen in that Zelda is because you had to play it during the broadcast hours in Japan, and live audio would be streamed to the player's console, a recording of the conversations which have been here turned to text. Since naturally the streaming system is down nowadays, and the audio would have been in Japanese anyway, it's great to have what was an element of the original reintegrated in some form. Maybe someday, someone will make a MSU-1 adaptation of it in repro form, and we'll get the audio playing (in english, by a group of dedicated fans) so that the full experience can be brought back and players wouldn't have to read, but as it is, cramming all the audio inside would be problematic.
It's likely that this Excitebike game used to stream the audio music as well, hence the parts without music in it, but don't quote me on that. I'm pretty sure of my facts about the Zelda one though.
RudyC3 Thanks! I really know very little about the St. Giga broadcasts but posts like this help answer questions.
best part of the whole video (joe clears throat) "i disagree"
"Repo my repro, bro." Haha, I love it.
A couple years ago I got a pretty decent PAL version of Mega Man & Bass complete with box and manual fully translated. Though the box suffered from that stretched photoshop thing the cart did not so I´m pretty happy with it.
Pretty nice for a game that only came out in Japan. =)
here's how I see it
the original developers weren't going to make any money on said game if they never planned to release it internationally. So they shouldn't be upset about loosing money they would have never made.
When it comes to the translators of said games, most of the work was done just to translate it for an English audience with no expectation of getting paid. This is where it starts getting grey for me, I'm not sure where my morals stand on reproduction carts and who should receive the money.
>Night Wolve
Guy does good translation work and coding but holy hell is he a comedy gold mine of drama. Especially when it comes to XSeed.
chapsy1983 Thanks, I'm glad you approve!
You're welcome.
"There was controversy over people selling this game without the translator getting any of the money."
Yyyeahhhh..that's about how a lot of repros go. Tons of rom hacks and translations get sold online without the original creator getting any money. Hell, half the time, they're lucky to even get credit. I've even seen some sites make custom title screens for their rom hacks, which removed the in-game credits in the process.
I'm actually doing a very basic re-hack of a SMB NES hack. Re-doing some sprites, and making custom levels for Super Mario Xmas. But it's mainly for personal use. I almost don't want to upload it anywhere, because it wouldn't surprise me if it ended up on a repro site a month later, being sold for $40, without so much as a "hey we're selling your shit".
How many episodes do you think until Dave's beard goes totally grey? XD I reckon another couple years worth :P
Nintendo should definitely release the Satellaview games, also the VS series.
Just want to thank you guys :D your channel is the best ever,
I recently lost my father to throat cancer and yeah you guys get me through the day everyday.
Lol this might sound weird but jay reminds me of my dad XD but yeah love your show cause it reminds me of my dad who gave me my first video game which was an atari 2600.
Love u guys love ur show
merangkillbots Thanks and hang in there man.
I don't have any repro games, but I do have some repro Gundam Wing Music CDs I got in the late 90's that came in blue jewel cases, that my old import comics shop said a guy did for him in Hong Kong, as the originals only had a limited pressing. They are pressed disc, and not burned disc, and they came with spine cards, and everything just like the originals, and they where only $23 for both disc at the time, and I'm really glad I got them, as they have turned out to be some of my favorite Anime soundtracks to chill out too.
i'm gonna gather up every gameboyrelated game review dave has ever done and then collect them on my own repro gamesack vhs! pop it into the old vcr and then i'll yell out loud: WOW! just yesterday i was hoping for a game sack on the good old gameboy and now i already have it! MAGIC!
Holy crap! Another one already? NICE!
Uncle Victor A fortnight sure does fly by sometimes.
Sweet Home was the inspiration for what later became Biohazard/Resident Evil. So even though the original game didn't come out in the US its legacy lives on.
The walker feature from Star Fox 2 made it into Star Fox Zero :D
A good sunday starts with Game Sack and a coffee
Great episode as usual. I know you cant possibly cover everything out there but it would have been nice to see you talk about Chrono Trigger Flames of Eternity
I just ordered a repo a few months ago. It was a port of Leisure suit larry for the NES sold by Retrousb. I love it. I think I am going to start getting more Repros.
Magical Pop'n did sound a bit too much like a porn title, now it all makes sense lol
Not to mention the publisher name, Pack-In-Video.
hahahaha x3
Poppen is an older 90s German slang word for "to fuck". So it definitely sounds funny.. For some of us :)
AlphaOmegaSin I would love to see the behind the scenes for the voice recording...HOLY SHIT I need tissues and hand lotion NOW/!!!
The Treacherous Disciplin Magical poppen
Sapphire has got to be one of my favorite soundtracks.. up there with Lords of Thunder on the TG-CD! Sweet Home, I was delightfully surprised by how in-depth for a Famicom game it was, great game, with a lot of substance and the graphics are top notch!
If you do plan on making another Repro video, you should try out Live A Live and Dragon Quest 5 for the SNES. Great games!
It's also worth saying that someone should really get their hands on the original cart molds and make new ones, along with scrap parts from broken games, old warehouse stock, etc in order to save old carts from being chopped up.
Id gladly pay extra for this!
+Eric Durant Some games have literally millions of copies sold that are eating up dust on shelves. If nobody wants to pay for them, the owners should be able to do with them what they want.
Recommending Mega Man: The Wily Wars for the next Game Repros.