Good series, but I think you're missing the point of the nock tuning. Each nock comes out different, competition shooters will even order nocks from the same section of the injection molding every time so that they're the most similar. Each nock will fly differently, so using one nock to tune it and then swapping in a lighted nock does you no good. I know it's an old video now, but in case you haven't looked into it since then I thought you should know. Shouldn't make a huge difference, but the point of this whole process is to make it perfect so I think it's worth doing to ensure an ethical shot every time.
I understand what you are saying, but that is not what I was taught nock tuning accomplishes. The minor differences in the nocks may effect competition shooters. But for my practical purposes, they shouldn't really have any effect because the nock is so close to the force pushing it (the string). Slight variations in the nock create such small and insignificant moment arms at the string that hardly effect the flight of the arrow. However, each arrow having different spines along its circumference has much more effect on arrow flight. That's what I am attempting to weed out by spinning the nock in the arrow to find which way it shoots best.
@@NobleSavageOutdoors That's why I said it doesn't make a huge difference and what you're doing should be well good enough. Didn't mean any offense, just another small thing in the pursuit of perfection, Good Hunting!
Um, the fletching does not use any energy. It is a wing. So is your broadhead. The offset/helical adds spin. So, a 3o offset won't use any energy. It's like rifling in a rifle barrel. Although, with over 9o helical there is an issue with drag.
It does transfer some of the arrows linear kinetic energy into rotational kinetic energy (and also wastes some extra energy through drag). The more the rotation/faster the arrow spins, the more it robbed from the linear kinetic energy to do so. You are right it is like rifling, but for the wrong reason. Rifling also steals linear kinetic energy from the bullet and turns it into rotational kinetic energy that stabilizes the bullet in flight. On the scale of energy of the bullet it is likely negligible, and may actually be negligible for an arrow as well (I could/should probably do some simple testing by seeing if/how much arrow speeds change with different fletching configurations). But regardless, because I took the time to make sure my arrows were flying perfect without fletchings, I saw no point in doing a large offset. I do have a mechanical engineering degree which allowed me to study fluid mechanics and I'm just trying to help educate people. Hope this helps.
Yeah part 4 is going to be installing vanes, but life has gotten in the way for the time being. Hopefully things will settle down here soon and I'll be able to get around to it.
I have considered using the spinning inserts. From what I've researched, they can actually help accuracy more than you would think because the fletchings don't have to overcome the inertia of the insert so the arrow starts spinning and becomes more stable faster. Even if I went to the spinning inserts I would still go through the same insert tuning process though. If I couldn't get perfect bullet holes with nock tuning I'd still attempt to mess with the spinning inserts to try to salvage that arrow. It's very rare you have to insert tune in the first place.
I am wanting to use some lighted nocks that I have gotten for my arrows ( Walmart special arrows for 45-70 lbs bows ) but hey are very loose in the arrows do they make nock bushings for these they are Chinese knock offs of the luminock lighted nocks and I really like them. I know I need to buy American but I could not pass up the price 12 for $20.00 dollars and they are very bright ( over 20 + hours ) it is just that the out side diameter of the part the both holds the battery and slides into the arrow up to the shoulder is overly small and slides and wiggles into the arrow and falls out ( nothing holding holding it in ) how do I fix this? Can you help please?
Take the outside diameter that goes into the arrow and put a grocery bag around it then push both the grocery bag and nock into the arrow. If that is not enough to tighten it use a little bit thicker zip lock bag. Just work your way up in thickness until the nock is snug in the arrow and cut the excess bag away at the end of the arrow. Hard to explain but hope that makes sense.
Yes, that's basically the point, to make sure the arrows you are going to shoot at an animal are flying exactly how you want them to before you ever even take them in the woods with you.
You absolutely need to nock tune with the same grain field point as your broadhead. If not your arrow will be over or under spined when you are nock tuning, and you will.never be able to get it to fly straight.
@@NobleSavageOutdoors that is definitely what I was thinking I’m going to be trying my hand at building “adult arrows” this winter so I have been trying to get a list of everything I will need to do so
U should not use paint thinner to clean your shafts. Paint thinner has oil in it. U are not as foc this way as where with your practice tip. Your putting weight in the shaft not outside of the shaft like the practice tip.
Yeah probably could have used a different solvent, but it worked. I understand that the weight location is changed slightly from the field point to the insert. The field point is used to get an idea on how much weight you will need and the small change in location of that weight has little effect on arrow flight. But just incase, we still shoot them through paper again after installing the inserts and nocks to make sure everything still flies perfectly straight.
Just picked up some black eagle renegades, gonna order the stuff tonight to start the process.
Nice! Good luck. It's great to see people doing it the right way instead of the easy way.
Good series, but I think you're missing the point of the nock tuning. Each nock comes out different, competition shooters will even order nocks from the same section of the injection molding every time so that they're the most similar. Each nock will fly differently, so using one nock to tune it and then swapping in a lighted nock does you no good. I know it's an old video now, but in case you haven't looked into it since then I thought you should know. Shouldn't make a huge difference, but the point of this whole process is to make it perfect so I think it's worth doing to ensure an ethical shot every time.
I understand what you are saying, but that is not what I was taught nock tuning accomplishes. The minor differences in the nocks may effect competition shooters. But for my practical purposes, they shouldn't really have any effect because the nock is so close to the force pushing it (the string). Slight variations in the nock create such small and insignificant moment arms at the string that hardly effect the flight of the arrow. However, each arrow having different spines along its circumference has much more effect on arrow flight. That's what I am attempting to weed out by spinning the nock in the arrow to find which way it shoots best.
@@NobleSavageOutdoors That's why I said it doesn't make a huge difference and what you're doing should be well good enough. Didn't mean any offense, just another small thing in the pursuit of perfection, Good Hunting!
No problem. Didn't take any offensive just explaining my thoughts on the matter. Thanks for the comment and good luck to you as well.
A gun cleaning rod works better than a drill bit. Also safer.
I'll have to give that a try next time on the stubborn ones. Thanks!
Um, the fletching does not use any energy. It is a wing. So is your broadhead. The offset/helical adds spin. So, a 3o offset won't use any energy. It's like rifling in a rifle barrel. Although, with over 9o helical there is an issue with drag.
It does transfer some of the arrows linear kinetic energy into rotational kinetic energy (and also wastes some extra energy through drag). The more the rotation/faster the arrow spins, the more it robbed from the linear kinetic energy to do so. You are right it is like rifling, but for the wrong reason. Rifling also steals linear kinetic energy from the bullet and turns it into rotational kinetic energy that stabilizes the bullet in flight. On the scale of energy of the bullet it is likely negligible, and may actually be negligible for an arrow as well (I could/should probably do some simple testing by seeing if/how much arrow speeds change with different fletching configurations). But regardless, because I took the time to make sure my arrows were flying perfect without fletchings, I saw no point in doing a large offset. I do have a mechanical engineering degree which allowed me to study fluid mechanics and I'm just trying to help educate people. Hope this helps.
@@NobleSavageOutdoors I do agree about knock tuning each arrow. This was a still a very good video! Have a good one!
Are you planning to make a 4th part to this series?
Yeah part 4 is going to be installing vanes, but life has gotten in the way for the time being. Hopefully things will settle down here soon and I'll be able to get around to it.
did you consider getting Ethics spinning inserts and skipping the insert tuning step?
I have considered using the spinning inserts. From what I've researched, they can actually help accuracy more than you would think because the fletchings don't have to overcome the inertia of the insert so the arrow starts spinning and becomes more stable faster. Even if I went to the spinning inserts I would still go through the same insert tuning process though. If I couldn't get perfect bullet holes with nock tuning I'd still attempt to mess with the spinning inserts to try to salvage that arrow. It's very rare you have to insert tune in the first place.
I am wanting to use some lighted nocks that I have gotten for my arrows ( Walmart special arrows for 45-70 lbs bows ) but hey are very loose in the arrows do they make nock bushings for these they are Chinese knock offs of the luminock lighted nocks and I really like them. I know I need to buy American but I could not pass up the price 12 for $20.00 dollars and they are very bright ( over 20 + hours ) it is just that the out side diameter of the part the both holds the battery and slides into the arrow up to the shoulder is overly small and slides and wiggles into the arrow and falls out ( nothing holding holding it in ) how do I fix this? Can you help please?
Take the outside diameter that goes into the arrow and put a grocery bag around it then push both the grocery bag and nock into the arrow. If that is not enough to tighten it use a little bit thicker zip lock bag. Just work your way up in thickness until the nock is snug in the arrow and cut the excess bag away at the end of the arrow. Hard to explain but hope that makes sense.
Do you shoot the arrows you hunt with? Just trying to figure out if I should test my hunting arrows out?
Yes, that's basically the point, to make sure the arrows you are going to shoot at an animal are flying exactly how you want them to before you ever even take them in the woods with you.
Ok I thought so I just wanted to make sure! Thanks can’t wait to get started on my build
No problem. Good luck, you will learn a ton along the way!
Would it be better to knock tune with the same grain field point as what your broad head would be or is using a baseline 100 grain okay?
You absolutely need to nock tune with the same grain field point as your broadhead. If not your arrow will be over or under spined when you are nock tuning, and you will.never be able to get it to fly straight.
@@NobleSavageOutdoors that is definitely what I was thinking I’m going to be trying my hand at building “adult arrows” this winter so I have been trying to get a list of everything I will need to do so
Awesome. I have a list on my amazon storefront you can check out for the gear I use to build arrows.
@@NobleSavageOutdoors how do I go about seeing that list?
Here's the link www.amazon.com/shop/noblesavageoutdoors
U should not use paint thinner to clean your shafts. Paint thinner has oil in it.
U are not as foc this way as where with your practice tip. Your putting weight in the shaft not outside of the shaft like the practice tip.
Yeah probably could have used a different solvent, but it worked. I understand that the weight location is changed slightly from the field point to the insert. The field point is used to get an idea on how much weight you will need and the small change in location of that weight has little effect on arrow flight. But just incase, we still shoot them through paper again after installing the inserts and nocks to make sure everything still flies perfectly straight.