Its a common misunderstanding that mary and Elizabeth were always enemies. They weren't. It's been recently coming to light that they were very close growing up. Hate usually stems from love. When we feel someone we love betrayed us, we hate them. I feel for both Mary and Elizabeth, they both had it rough for different reasons.
@@moonsdottirYou are so right! They weren't always enemies. Mary never hated Elizabeth. She never despised her for the fact that Elizabeth had taken her place as heiress to the English throne. I think Mary might have at first felt different and anger about being replaced by someone else and forgotten, but I think it wasn't really a feeling of hate towards her newborn sister. Mary loved Elizabeth deeply and so did Elizabeth. Only in their later years their relationship began to crumble and also due to the fact that Mary became Queen and started seeing her sister as a threat to her throne, imprisoning her and almost considering to execute her, but I really think that deep down she still had some love and affection for her sister as I really think that's why she did not go further with the execution and spared Elizabeth. I feel sorry and emotional of why their relationship had to end up like that💔 Mary and Elizabeth never deserved to suffer from their father and others. They were both strong woman! For me, they were the best sister duo ever!💖
@@historylover2 Something that was common amongst the Tudor reign? They all killed innocents at one point, it is not any different from Henry, Edward, Mary ,and Elizabeth.
I actually feel really horrible for Mary. She was not the best queen and she made awful decisions for the nation don’t get me wrong, but she started as just a broken little girl. She was a beloved princess only daughter to the King and adored before being tossed aside, stripped of her title and called a bastard. Her father abandoned her. Her mother was torn from her. All she had to cling to was her faith and even that was being pulled away from her. I don’t blame her for clinging so so tightly to her Catholic faith, it’s all she had left from her happy childhood. She was treated horrible. She married a man who basically just used her for her crown. She wanted a child so so desperately that a growing theory was she didn’t realize she had cancer in her stomach and thought she was pregnant, but the cancer was killing her. She was basically driven mad. She did some cruel and wicked things in the name of her faith. I do not justify her actions in any way so much blood spilled, but I can’t help but feel sorry for that broken and sad little girl.
@@allshookup1640 That's what I've always said and stuck by it. Mary was and still is very unfairly misunderstood and stereotyped. Instead of constantly concentrating on the bad she did, people should look at the full picture
@@allshookup1640 Like all her family did way worst and more wocked things fir their fairh than she did, but because she was catholic she's remembered as crueler. Though, to be honest, the other had no religion nor faith, Protestantism is political propaganda at best, hardly a religion to begin with
@@goodaimshield1115 okay firstly I’m a Protestant so let’s please not go insulting other people’s religions I would appreciate it. Secondly, I know she didn’t anymore than he father or sister and yes being preceding and succeed by Protestant rulers certainly did not help her cause. However, Henry VIII’s rule was 38 years, Elizabeth 1’s was 45 years their various kills were spread over these years so they don’t look as bad. Mary had over 300 Protestants burned in only 5 years. Also Mary allowed herself to be manipulated by her husband Phillip II. Who was a horrible person don’t get me wrong. But he convinced Mary to begin a unsuccessful war with France (while England was allied with Spain) and lose the European toe hold that England really needed and had held for a long time, Calais. Her short reign really compacted her failures and made her look far worse than she would have had these events occurred in a longer reign.
For context: the people making fun of 1/2 of the oldest Christian church are supposed to be faithful to a church invented by a king so he could divorce as much as he wanted and confiscate as much land and wealth as he wanted from the church and basically have a monarch be in charge of religion.
Protestantism was started around Germany because they recognized that Church authority could make the Bible what it wanted to be in order to control people, not all Churches was bad but this was enough for people to start questioning the authority and authenticity and Catholic specific teachings that are not presented in the Bible. It became Englands official religion because of the King you mentioned. Protestantism is focused on the full authority of the Bible, but still puts importance on the Church for most denominations. It’s really easy to make a faith look bad with just some unmentioned historical context, like how I could make a case of the Popes being corrupted and bad. If you are a brother in Christ then you mind your tongue, it can easily lead you to spew out lies.
@@willwalker6894 has absolutely no line to the apostles that's just one of the thousands of Catholic lies, according to the bible peter never left judea , never Introduced the European made Catholic laws, and never set up system where men are elected to rule over the church
Yet even modern science proves the remains in the grave upon which St. Peters basilica is built is those of a fisherman from Galilee and about 2000 years old. Do you have any more lies ?
Edward was literally raised by radical Protestant tutors, and since he was only 15 when he died, it is hard to say how much of this anti-Catholic fervor was of his own volition. There were two ironies here. His mother, Jane Seymour, was a devout Catholic, and had she not died soon after his birth, it is quite probable that his outlook would have been different. The other is that, in his early years, Edward was closer to Mary than he was to Elizabeth, the result of her genuine doting upon him. Elizabeth, though not a Catholic, was religiously the most like her father, a true Anglican. She also rejected many of the radical Protestant teachings such as non-celibate clergy and the banning of religious images. And it was not until Mary ascended the throne that the two sisters became rivals, so at this point, they were still on very good terms. (A salute to Mary when considering the harsh treatment of her and her mother Catherine of Aragon by Elizabeth's mother Anne Boleyn).
King Edward's mother, Jane Seymour, was not a devout Catholic and neither was she a convinced Protestant, especially since King Henry VIII had used religion to get his personal wishes with Anne Boleyn. Jane was a good and submissive girl. The Seymour family wanted to achieve social and economic benefits at court and she was the way to achieve them. she wasn't like Anne Boleyn or like Katherine of Aragon, she never expressed her own opinions, although she tried to reconcile the king with his daughter Mary. We don't know what her future would have been if she had survived the birth of her child. Catholics and Protestants were equally fanatical in those years and for centuries. Mary's Catholicism was mocked at the court of Edward VI, but later, during Mary's reign, Protestants were persecuted and executed. Mary was a fanatic and took revenge on the Protestants on behalf of herself and her mother, Queen Katherine of Aragon. His sister, Queen Elizabeth I, I think she didn't believe in anything, but she chose Protestantism for political reasons. It is true that Edward was a manipulated child, especially by his uncle Edward Seymour. Religion was the excuse to lead Europe into long centuries of war. Even today it is an excuse to manipulate the population: arousing religious feelings is often the pretext to achieve other goals.
@@KrisBCN Protestants were WAY more radical and fanatics than catholics (or any other Christians) basically because protestantism was founded upon political propaganda against some catholic countries (Spain being the main one), so it was way more radical than Catholicism, basically because Catholicism only had to stand its ground, Protestantism was revolutionary political propaganda masked as religion, and as all revolutions in history it was established upon immeasurable cruelty and violent acts. You say Maru was fanatic? Jesus Christ, Maru was probably the lest fanatic of them all.
@@goodaimshield1115 I agree with you when you say that Protestants are fanatics and radicals. I don't know if they were more or less than Catholics. Felipe II of Spain was a fanatic and John Calvin, for example, was a fanatic too. Fortunately, I have not lived in the time of Mary Tudor, Elizabeth I, Felipe II, Luther, or Calvin. All of them were intolerant, whether for truly religious or political reasons. Therefore, I am not defending either one or the other. Both Protestants and Catholics persecuted those who didn't think like them. Remember the Night of Saint Bartholomew in France when thousands of protestants were massacred. But, in fact, it was only about political issues. Years later, Henry IV, the head of the French Protestants, converted to Catholicism and said: "Paris deserves a mass" Fortunately, I have not lived in the time of Mary Tudor, Elizabeth I, Philip II, Luther, or Calvin. All of them were intolerant, whether for truly religious or political reasons. Therefore, I am not defending either one or the other. Both Protestants and Catholics persecuted those who did not think like them. It was a terrible time if you were someone with your own ideas, it was dangerous whether you lived in a Protestant or Catholic country. About Mary, she was a person with a lot of mental trauma. It is true that she is often ridiculed or shown as someone very cruel in English series and movies, but she practiced systematic terror against Protestants, this is indisputable., that is not what I say, but historians, English or not English.
@@goodaimshield1115 that’s hilarious because it’s pretty much untrue. Henry was actually awarded the title of defender of the catholic faith in 1521 by Pope Leo X, it was only when the Pope refused to annul his marriage did he break, and even then he wasn’t antagonist that only occurred when CATHOLIC Spain got greedy
I’ve never seen any show/film that depicts the siblings’ relationships during Edward’s reign, so the show is rather refreshing. I’ve read Mary Tudor’s biographies in my uni years, so I feel like this scene perfectly encapsulates the heightened tension in her family and court life. Especially as she was in a hostile anti-Catholic environment. The background music sounds somewhat exotic and modern, which makes the scene feel all the more unnatural. The dutch angles make it even weirder, as well. You never hear this type of orchestration in a historical period drama, so I feel like it helps the audience to really empathize with Mary’s disgust, trauma and humiliation. Like… the foundation for Mary’s faith and country is being corrupted by something hideously different and hostile. I hope it makes sense… I’m a Protestant, btw… but no one should be targeted for their beliefs. It will just make things so much worse for everyone. Whether it’s a social, emotional or physical persecution.
There is an excellent BBC TV series called ‘Elizabeth R’ (1971) starring Glenda Jackson. The show portrays scenes with Elizabeth and Mary. I think it the most extensive TV show depicting Queen Elizabeth.
Mary used to give Elizabeth horseback rides when she was a toddler and rub her gums when she was teething. Seeing that Elizabeth was bastardized when her mother died (just as Mary had been) diminished some of the resentment. Mary was now old enough to understand that Anne Boleyn was only a symptom: the problem was Henry.
Jane Seymour must have been spinning in her grave. She was a Catholic [who was faithful to Queen Catherine and Mary] and yet her son, King Edward VI, became such a fanatical protestant.
And Edward was a zealot protestant, he seemed to be a Calvinist which i don't understand since Coe was very Catholics in rituals and architecture, even Elizabeth was not at all against the imagery and art in the church, she only become really worried towards Catholicism when Mary Stuart was impresioned which lead to multiples rebelions. So why he had such a puritan view about the church even though he was raised in the same background as Elizabeth?
I feel downright nothing but sympathy for Mary. History taught us to ridicule her when actually she was misunderstood. I understand her deeds wasn't great, being infamous for burning Protestants and I won't excuse that. But let's not forget many died at the hands of Henry the 8th, Edward & Elizabeth's as well.
Honestly, when I learned about The Tudors, it taught me to mistrust all monarchies. This whole family was terrible. Henry: brought the nation to war, was gorging himself, abusing the people and waving Devine right as the head of his church as if it were nothing. Edward: didn’t live up. Mary: Was a religious zealot, who burned people alive (most likely as a form of vengeance), and clearly suffering from mental illness with her phantom pregnancies. Elizabeth: Cruel, jealous, and manipulative. Had a god complex, took credit for other peoples work (especially with the military) and almost bankrupted the kingdom waging a war with Spain. And no heir leading to almost worse royal family, The Stuarts, rise to power. In my opinion, The Tudors, like most of the royals are terrible. They are equal with monarchs like John, Longshanks, Charles I, and George III.
Elizabeth shows her enthusiasm but ceases when she sees her sister's discomfort and shock. She sporadically checks upon her while looking at the scene before her. She loved Mary so much and it was evidenced in this scene.
What is interesting is that Mary is the granddaughter of the famed Spanish rules, Ferdinand and Isabella, who completed the reconquest of Spain from the Moors and were devout Catholics. Her first cousin, Charles, was probably the most powerful Catholic in the world at the time as he was King of Spain, Emperor of the Holy Roman Empire, and the Arch Duke of Austria.
Charles was actually engaged to their aunt (also named Mary) for a while in the earlier 1500s which didn’t work out and she married Louis XII of France. Charles was later engaged to Mary Tudor herself when she was only 6 and he was 21 🤮 in 1522. They were engaged for 3 years before it was broken off for a variety of reasons and Charles married his wife, Isabella. They had a son named Phillip II who Mary ended up ACTUALLY marrying!
@@allshookup1640 Yes, and had they had a son and lived he would have ruled both Spain and England. While Phillip had a son from his first marriage, Mary was his second, that son suffered severe mental issues, and probably would have died "accidentally" once there was a male heir. It took so long for that male heir to come, that Phillip II did not want to wait and the son, Carlos, died thus leaving only female heirs at the time of his death, from Phillip's third marriage. Mary may have waited to marry until she was Queen, or displaced by Edward's heirs since she knew marrying a Spanish Royal would cause problems.
@@janefelix3821 well as a woman, it wasn’t really her choice. She was married FAR too late for a woman of her birth. Her father should have arranged a marriage for her LONG before his death that would have benefited the kingdom and Mary. She could have had a happy life and possibly a family of her own if her father had been looking out for her the way that he should have been.
@@allshookup1640 Problem was that Mary was around 16 when her father broke from the Catholic church, thus alienating the two most likely sources of matches, the Hapsburg (which included Spain) or France. Mary, being of famed Spanish blood was eyeing a match with a Spanish ruler, but as England's Protestant population grew, that would be hard to accomplish due to widespread distaste at the time against Spain. Only once she became Queen did she feel comfortable making it official. In the 17th Century, two English Kings married foreign Catholics, Charles I married the sister of King Louis XIII of France, and his son James II married (second marriage) Mary of Modena, from a noble Italian family. Both Kings were ousted, Charles I was beheaded and James II was forced to flee to his first cousin, King Louis XIV of France. Shortly thereafter, England's Parliament created strict succession laws thus requiring any heir/monarch who marries a Catholic to renounce their claims to the throne, passed in 1701.
@@janefelix3821 yes you are correct. I’m just saying that when Henry died Mary was 30 years old. Henry was well established in the Church of England and could have found her a suitable husband by then. It might not have been a 100% match as it would be likely they would not be Catholic, but none the less he should have done that for his daughter. She must have been quite embarrassed to be such a high born lady unmarried at age 30 even with her demoted status. At the time, this would have made her a freak of sorts.
Umm before you feel any remorse for this women, let me give you a little lesson In history. Mary Tudor was a super evil and wicked person. During he reign as queen, She had thousands and thousands of people burned at the stake (Specifically good Christians who refused to pledge their allegiance to the corrupt Catholic Church) she had entire families including children tortured and murdered during her reign. The Bible NEVER condones murdering people for not submitting to the faith. The Catholic Church is extremely corrupt and evil. If you study the Bible when it talks about being aware of false prophets, the Catholic pope fits that description exactly. They pervert the gospel of Jesus Christ and give real Christian’s a bad name. Their torturous escapades lasted for centuries and was at an all time high during the 15th and 16th century. Torturing people for not submitting to the pope, which again goes against everything the Bible teaches. Not to mention all of their child molestation and pedophile that they try to cover up to this day. So forgive me for not caring one bit about these people making fun of the pope, because honestly that’s the least this evil woman deserves.
@@EternalShadow1667 This may not have happened in reality, but life wasn´t certainly easy for princess Mary in her father and later in her brother´s court. Mary was denied a suitable and grand marriage like she was supposed to have being a princess and a king´s daughter because she was catholic. Before her falling from grace , there were talks that she would marry prince Luís of Portugal ( Louis of Avis ), King Manuel and Queen Maria of Aragon´s son. Being a portuguese myself , I always found that fact very interesting. No doubt English history would be very different if she had.
@@theuniverseisme432 Common belief ( from foreigners from catholic countries ) , when we comment on English history concerning Mary , is that she didn´t burn a great amount of people as it was first believed.
She burned 250 people while being powerless politically, she was widely hated, and Elizabeth did away with almost every reform she was able to make. Her father abandoned her to a convent and her life was one of a place holder and political prisoner. She was a failure as a monarch and changed literally nothing. In fact James would kill many times the number of Catholics as she did Protestants in half the time. Also passed laws effectively making it so a Catholic household could not earn income. She killed Protestants to make herself feel good, despite no protestant plot against her. James killed Catholics because they made three attempts in his life in the first year of his reign. All she did was make herself into a hateful tyrant that was easy to forget. James even buried her in a protestant cemetery with Elizabeth as her roommate, against her last will.
@grizzlyblackpowder1960 History is written by the winners which is Protestant of course Elizabeth is seen she can walk on water Mary is the evil one I’m not excusing what she done but Elizabeth enough Saint she killed more people than Mary did there exactly was assignation attempt on Mary to Elizabeth on the throne which is why she locked Elizabeth in the tower yes Mary find some bad things but she wasn’t terrible queen idk why she the only one getting crap when other monarchs including Elizabeth did messed up stuff as well
This is very hard for Mary to see, the scene captures it perfectly, so awful for her! Indeed it shows why things happen the way they did. Thanks for posting Lili!
It’s worse too that she can’t say or do ANYTHING. She just has to sit there and take it. Elizabeth knows it too you can see her checking on her and possibly trying a little to comfort her sister. Mary can’t condemn them all, she can’t yell or cause a fuss, she can’t cry. They are blatantly mocking the thing she holds dearest RIGHT IN FRONT OF HER. It’s really really cruel to Mary
Funnily enough I remember my teacher at school describing Edward VI much like Joffrey, a precocious psychopath who would have been a worse tyrant if he'd lived long enough.
@@Sawrattan Joffrey is fiction. Edward VI was a real King who was clever, smart and could think rings around his sister's who were clever and his advisors who were clever. He was a King. He died aged 15 years. All the Tudor Monarch's had Temper Tantrums and were ruthless it is either you died and your country gets taken over or you don't. Remember King Edward VI govern real people, in a real land and made laws for his subjects. The Common People of England rather liked their boy king and were looking forward to his marriage and him coming of age. His death was awful, not expected at all and came as quite a shock.
@@AnnaBellaChannelIf I remember correctly a more apt comparison of Joffrey is to Edward of Westminster, who was also known for monstrous behavior, and especially since Martin was heavily inspired by the War of the Roses
She was victim and victimizer. She was a victim because just to defend her mother, her father mistreated her in many ways and then she suffered a lot under the yoke of her brother's advisers. she was not loved and had to make his religion his hill to die on. Ironies of her life, her sister Elizabeth killed more Catholics in the first year of her reign than Mary Protestants in the five years of her reign.
I mean not every monarch are good, her father killed hundred and thousands of people who opposed him but when Mary killed protestants people suddenly called her “barbaric Queen” when most monarch did the same thing, they also gave Mary a nickname “Bloody Mary” to emphasize her inhumane actions. I dont think its fair to assume one’s personality based on what they did once or twice. I never heard her father be called a man whore or “mad man whore” when he divorced and beheaded most of his 6 wives.
@@anayadegani626 That would assume that the lay Protestants did not share the same view, which would be relatively bold claims to make. Like maybe I can agree that they don't mock Catholic faith to THAT extend, and obviously the Catholic did the same, but let not pretend that the average devout Protestants (ie people who are aware that there is a different in doctrine of the faith between Protestant vs Catholic) at the time would not share the same kind of bias.
@@WORLD8NSH5KNIGHT1ah yeah, the one who killed almost anyone in comparisson to the protestant massacres on Germany. Or the same religion that stoped conquistadores from killing natives thought Pope Paul III. I wonder what the anglicans did to the native americans on the North. Oh thats right, we cannot ask them cause they massacred them all
@@WORLD8NSH5KNIGHT1lol, you have no idea what you're talking about, only during Elizabeth I reign many more executions on account of heresy were made than during the 300 years the Spanish Inquisition was active
I don't like the idea that people think of the pope more than they think of God, but poor Mary should not have been subjected to that sort of humiliation.
@@megan166As a Catholic, I'm so sick of people thinking we worship the clergy, we don't. Heck, I see plenty of flaws in the church (child predators going unpunished, greed, ect.) I personally see the church as more something you can turn to for advice, given those people have devoted a lot of time to studying Christianity and the Bible. But even then I know it's run by humans, and therefore has flaws
Which explains why Mary became what she is said to be or maybe later historians of a Protestant England painted her that way? Still though, she was actually Queen of a far larger empire than her father, sister or brother reigned on. Which begs the question, if she had a child, can you imagine the scale of a combined British-Spanish empire or maybe England will not be able to soar the way it did if their Ruler was also the Ruler of Spain?
Given that Felipe II was also ruler of the Netherlands and would also take Portugal in the 1580s, I think that Britain would soar but would also be constantly involved in territorial wars with France and France's ally Scotland. So not much changes there, except that English culture would be more influenced by Iberia and the predominant religion would be Catholicism.
England and the Netherlands would grow even closer, and eventually declare independence from Spain. Maybe even attempt an Anglo-Dutch 'United Kingdom' although their joint control of the Channel would probably set off a war with France.
Spain was far, far wealthier than England in the 16th century, so the Spanish kingdoms would probably take priority in most monarchs's eyes. However, Spain itself was mostly a series of kingdoms in personal union stitched together at that point, so making England "part of it", so to say, shouldn't be that difficult.
Even Edward's father Henry VIII. - the one who separated England from the Pope in the first place - would never have allowed the Pope or other priests to be ridiculed like that in his court. Henry saw himself as a devout Catholic for his entire life and only separated from Rome to get his way but under his reign the liturgy of the church of England remained catholic and a show like this would've been sacrilegious to him.
@@cg8397 Why would he? The breach from Rome had given him many advantages. Also he would've made himself look ridiculous if he came crawling back to Rome after all that happened. Also - like I said - he saw himself as a devout catholic when it came to the teachings but to him that had nothing to do with the Pope. That's btw not up for discussion, it's a fact. You can see that in what the actual teachings of the early Church of England which more or less stayed the same after the breach from Rome. And also in the way actual protestants were treated. Like his last wife Catherine Parr for example had to hide the fact that she was a Protestants because Henry saw Protestants with their teachings as heretics.
She shouldn't have married him, he was never going to spend much time in England with her because of his royal duties on the continent. Edward Courtenay was the better choice.
@@cg8397 She was doing what she wanted to do, find a husband, though for the life of me I don't know why my angel had to go and pick HIM, of all people! But he was a King; he could not be expected to stay all the time. But when you really love someone, you miss them. I don't know about Courtenay. He seemed kind of contradictory to me.
Yeah, you can't help but feel deeply sorry for her here, it's so awful to see her endure something like this 😢 That's exactly what I like about Mary's portrayal in this series. It's not that they want to deny what she did during her rule, but it gives all her actions a deep context. She had to endure a lot of sht during Edward's protestant reign. It's not that she was born as Bloody Mary and everyone before her and after her in England was all good and kind when it came to religion... I love Romola Garai's portrayal and I think that especially in this scene she portrays all the tumultous emotions of Mary so well.
@@Lily1127channel Right. This series and the Tudors really did a good job with her character. (Honestly Mary was my fav part of the tudors cuz I hated how gratuitous the show would get). I’ve had a pipe dream for some time now to see Sarah Bolger come back as Mary in a film about her tragic reign. But maybe Romola can do it too. Maybe both? It could be a sweeping comprehensive look at her story with flashbacks.
@@savagedarksider5934 That’s fair. But just keep into perspective why she turned out the way she did. That’s all we can do as historians. Why and how. She’s an clear example of how the Reformation destroyed people at the time. She was a conservative clinging to Catholicism and her dignity at a time when the Country was trying to rip apart everything she’d ever known and believed in. To be honest, they were in the wrong as much as she was because the Protestants of the Church of England were as harsh and prejudiced as the Catholics would be. Just a perspective of how bloody the reformation was. On a more personal spectrum, Mary’s own father disowned her and started the trend of people calling her a bastard. Not to mention he tried to ruin her mother’s reputation. If that was not enough, Mary would get hounded all her life, with no one to protect or guide her but her dear uncle, Emperor Charles V, the Pope and their mutual advisors. No wonder she’d go on to marry Philip II who ended up abandoning her as well. I relate sometimes to how lonely she was. She lived and died lonely. As for what she’d do during her reign, well,.. 🤷🏻♂️can’t really excuse it. But I also rationalize her decisions as a result of yes religious radical insanity but also imo, what being shunned does to you. You feel resentment and anger at the world. I can only see it as years of frustration and desire to save herself and the England she believes in. I don’t condone it. And I don’t see what I’m saying as excuse. More as my hypothesis for why she did what she did (from an internal reasoning). Also the pressures of ruling and feeling like you have to kill or be killed. Monarchy in those days wasn’t easy not were you safe. Multiple rulers in medieval and Renaissance history did even worse things in order to survive and carry out their dictates. But hey, I notice I tend to connect more to people who make mistakes and live difficult lives. Just me.
@@acdragonrider Um, Charles V wasn't her uncle-he was her cousin. As for Henry;He desperately,desperately wanted A son and to be this warrior king like Henry V and Richard the lion heart-but that's not how history remember him as. He took his frustration over not having A son on Mary and Catherine because he couldn't execute them. Philip II, I think is actually relieved he never had any children by Mary because that mean he doesn't have to spent A whole lot of time in England.
I feel sorry for Mary. She was probably one of the unhappiest queens ever! Discriminated for being a woman, lost her mother, her father did not protect her and made her a bastard, her faith was ridiculed in her country... When she finally became queen and married Phillip, she died childless and was unable to maintain the Catholic Faith , which was probably her main goal. Everything was in vain for England fell into the hands of the protestants... I know she burned hundreds of people but there were worse kings/queens who are remembered as great... Her grandmother Isabella of Castille also executed jews and muslims and is remembered as "Isabella, the Catholic" not "Bloody Isabella" , her sister also killed catholics and is known as "Virgin Queen", not "Bloody Elizabeth "... Why isn't Mary known as "Mary the Catholic" ? ... I don't support what she did but I think History was unfair with her...
Protestant historians in the Elizabethan age vilified poor queen Mary. The reputation they gave her in their writings have stayed in peoples minds till this day. I visited Aspley house in London, there is very beautiful portrait of Mary where she looks like both her parents and she is dressed in gold and decked with jewels. We're used to seeing Mary in a very unflattering portrait by Antonis mor. Every documentary or adaptation of her including this series has based her appearance on this this awful painting but in reality she dressed as spectacularly as all other Tudor monarchs dressed. She also gave people second chances before they screwed up, for ex; Lady Jane and her family and her sister Elizabeth faking her beliefs in Catholicism.
@@rushamitra335 She did! Plenty of Catholics were killed during her reign. But she was clever, she executed people for treason rather than burning them for heresy...
After centuries of oppression you start to question why am I being controlled by some guy living thousands of miles away who is just as corrupt as any other man. In the long run it looks like Henry's idea worked out rather well.
@@murmursmeglosIf I’m not wrong the current pope was Pius V which was the pope that was against Jewish persecution and is considered a saint and one of the greatest popes in history
@@murmursmeglos Which oppression? England had been nearly entirely catholic for over a thousand years at that point, and Henry VIII himself had a wonderful relationship with the church pre-reformation.
TBF Henry VIII's changes were fairly moderate. The Church of England remained very close to its catholic roots theologically during his reign. But being arguably the first major protestant monarch (if a rather moderate one) won him many zealous protestant friends, many of whom would become Edward VI's tutors and regents.
This didn't happen, though. Mary was mostly away from court during Edward's years anyway. People need to learn that not everything that happens in a "historical" series is actual history.
@@RM-uk1sdThis probably would have happened since theatricality was not uncommon in Tudor era. And in fact, Elizabeth and her father Henry killed more people for their faith than Mary, but scapegoated Mary in history as bloody Mary....!!!
@@pradeepakrish If you start thinking up fiction in such a simple way and accept it as fact, then we can all start making statements like: "Elizabeth and Mary had a big duel in the streets of London. You know, they had different religions so it probably happened"🤡 Also, Henry VIII couldn't even make Mary the scapecoat as he reigned BEFORE her and he had no idea she would even become queen. It's very clear you know little about and care nothing about history.
@@RM-uk1sd LOL 😂🤣 You are so silly dude! I blamed the fanatic Protestants (perhaps someone like you!) for portraying Mary as the bloody Mary, not Henry!! 😂 And also, you cannot deny something like this wouldn't have happened, as well as nobody can prove something like this happened without evidence. I know that all TV shows or movies aren't reality TV shows! But the director can take the freedom of creativity given the historical sentiments. I feel pity about your stupidity and illiteracy about Tudor and Renaissance history! 🥲 Bye bye!
Mary was in her twenties when Edward was born, in her thirties when he became King (37 when he died at the age of 15). She had already lived through much worse than this.
I mean, she spent a good chunk of Edward VI's reign as far away from the court as possible. And Edward VI's court was a lot more radically protestant and antipapist than Henry VIII's.
Protestantism is generally see as a product of the Modern Era, so it’s interesting to see early Protestants displaying what are usually considered Medieval/Renaissance aesthetics and practices.
@@antediluvianarchive7958 500 years ago is not very long in British History terms or world history terms. The Tudor Period is seen as the beginning of the modern era.
@@crazyzealots5568 I get that the era is referred to as the early modern period, but I wouldnt call it modern. Though now i think I'm confusing the words modern and contemporary. Looking at the scope of the 300,000ish years our species exists 500 years ago is like 15 minutes ago
@ndie8075 How so? I find the actress who played Mary and Elizabeth to sort of resemble their portraits. At least they both have the right colouring. And the actor who plays Edward looks a lot like the portrait by William Scrots.
Es normal y comprensible q Maria Tudor se sintiera molesta y ofendida ante esta obra teatral satírica q se burla del Papa y de la fe católica. Para ella la fe católica era parte de su vida y tmbn parte del legado y la educación q le dio su madre Catalina de Aragon. Por supuesto en aquella época no había cabida para la tolerancia religiosa ni mucho menos para la libertad religiosa de tdo creyente sean cuales sean sus creencias
@@ahmedzahir2865 lamentablemente creo era muy habitual ese tipo de representaciones teatrales para satirizar a la Iglesia Católica y al Papa. Tristemente una de las causas de la Reforma Protestante fue la falta de moral por parte del Papado y del clero católico de la época. Los papas y altos jerarcas de la Iglesia de entonces llevaban un estilo de vida muy poco coherente con el Evangeluo, en medio de lujos y vicios. Me duele decirlo como creyente pero es así
@@ahmedzahir2865 es porque es ficción. Si bien es cierto que se ridiculizaba a la religión católica, en la vida real la corte no se atrevería a tales acciones por una cuestión de ofender a los diplomáticos católicos e iniciar una guerra
@@Martin-Tello Exacto, eso mismo he pensado. Supongo que en privado podrían hacerse comentarios ofensivos, pero una representación como esa no se representaría en la corte. Como siempre, la cadena Starz produce series "históricas" entretenidas y vistosas, como The Tudors, The White Queen, etc, pero la historicidad de los personajes o de las situaciones no es demasiado fiable.
@@KrisBCN de todas creo que la más acertada es la Reina Blanca excepto por el romance entre Elizabeth York y Ricardo y que Margaret Beaufort matara a los príncipes de la Torre
When you think you’re in the right to such an extreme it’s sad what people can bring themselves to think, say or do. I mean don’t forget this is the same continent that was fine with inquisitions, pogroms and expulsion of Jews and Muslims too.
I truly feel bad for Mary and all she went thru in life it was her father divorcing her mother and shunning her just for being a girl and him desperately wanting a son to take the throne that caused Mary to turn out like she did she was forced to renounce her birth right to the throne and Henry wouldn't even let her see her mother after the divorce she was also looked down on by Anne Boleyn for not acknowledging her as the true queen but her mother as queen of England and poor Mary didn't even get to attend her mother's funeral it was the cruelty from her father and Anne Boleyn and others that made her the way she was when she became queen it wasn't all her fault and her tragic story is still looked over today
@@murmursmeglos🙈yes the anglican church is a masterpiece of wokeness and to a act against the bible.....the rest of the country became atheist..........the anglican Community is shrinking like a dry sponge........the catholic Church is growing by 15 million a year...despite the old europe....
I am a Protestant, like Edward and Elizabeth and Jane, but even this is too far. I believe that the Pope is not an omnipotent human, but even this is too much for anybody. The Pope is a human being and deserves respect like we all do, not ridicule and rudeness.
This didn't even happen. Mary was mostly away from Edward's court anyway and at her own property. He did admonish her once for being catholic, but when he started crying, he cried as well. Historicsl fiction is not always accurate history. The word fiction gives it away.
@@iainclark5964 Edward burned two radical Anabaptists at stake for heresy during his reign. One of these burnings is showed in the series. That is what I meant by "burning heretics".
They always say history is written by the winners. Just as French media today still champions Mary Queen of Scots, English media glosses over Edward the little Taliban king.
You cannot know for sure. If by any chance Mary had married the portuguese prince Luís of Aviz as it was arranged , or a spanish prince , two princes from two of the dominant sea powers and empires at the time, it would.
@@shaunsteele8244 he told them off; that's not the same as mocking. You've got to remember that different translations will translate the same word differently. One of my bibles says reprimanded and another ridiculed.
@@shaunsteele8244 Well exactly. Why did Christ mock the Pharisees? To teach them a lesson. He was trying to educate his followers and them about something. He was trying to show them that they are wrong. Do you see anything like that here. I dont. I see a bunch of people being mean and vile. There is no message, no lesson just hatred.
I love all the commenters judging this by 21st century standards. "Oh they're being so mean" The world was a cruel place in the 16th century. Most people were worked to death or died of smallpox by 30. Or women died in childbirth. Or you were sent to be slaughtered in some petty war!
@Prkau telek Of course not. There was no national army like in Modern times. But the local noblemen raised armies for the King. Do you think the Lords just took volunteers? "You want to stay on your farm to tend your crops. I promised the King troops but my Earldom is a democracy so stay home"
@@a_little_demon Yeah they should. Can't let ideas get so powerful that they cannot be mocked. Then you get exactly what the Catholic Church was offering for hundreds of years...
I would like to know, whats your opinion about this show so far? :) Is it worth watching? Till this show I have seen all Starz TV series about english history, except this one. Suprisingly I have no interest in this show so far, havent even tried it yet. Maybe I just dont desire to watch another Tudor drama, even though I love Tudors, i want to finally see something different. I also was so dissapointed in The Spanish princess, because the quality was so low and it was pain to watch. Anyway, I am still waiting patiently for new season of Barbarians and I still have hopes for season 3 of El Cid. Would love to see new historical drama from Spain, at least Heirs to the land had that kind of vibe for me.
Well, I still wonder what my final verdict will be. So far I have had bit of mixed feelings, but I am more positively surprised than negatively. If I had to make a guess, I think it won't make the list of my most favourite historical series, but I am definitely enjoying it. But let's wait till the end. Episode 4 was so great and I really thought the series is going uphill more and more, but then I heavily disliked episode 5. So we will see. So far I certainly haven't lost interest, I look forward to every new episode. I would say that I like it definitely more than The Spanish Princess but I like it less than The White Princess. I must admit I was really excited when this show was announced, Edward VI's reign was a kind of dark spot for me, I didn't know much about it. Then I started to read up a lot and was waiting for this show to air and see how they portray all the stuff. It was certainly a very tumultous and exciting time and it's a very good subject for a movie/series. Also, among all the Tudor related dramas, at least this part of history is not overdone yet. Instead of the former Starz historical drama style, the "shiny romantic teenage" dramas, this one is surprisingly dark and serious and 16th centurish. Historically it is more accurate I think than The Spanish Princess and The White Princess, also more accurate than The Tudors. Kinda like Wolf Hall style. I also like that all characters are well rounded, with good and bad characteristics as well, from Elizabeth to her siblings to the Seymours, everyone. Some say it is the show's weakness, because there are no really likeable characters you can root for, but to me this is my type of drama, where I always change who I like the most. Catherine Parr is not all good and holy (finally!), she is a cunning woman who is capable of awful things sometimes. Edward VI is sometimes cute sometimes a really unlikeable child king. I like the way they portrayed Jane Grey's personality too, I think the actress from GoT, Bella Ramsey, plays her very well. Mary I is not all bloody Mary, she is a very complex character. Romola Garai is just amazing as her 😍 The Seymour brothers are both awful sometimes and more understandable at other times. Other than praise, there are two main critics I read about the show: 1) not me-too enough on the Elizabeth & Thomas Seymour case, showing too many good things from Thomas, too much romantization. I don't really share this opinion. I think Thomas's actions are often creepy and disgusting just enough. Just because he is still shown as a human and not a monster is not necessarily a bad thing imo. The problem with the portrayal of the case is maybe that the Elizabeth actress is far too old, she does not seem 14 at all. So in the seducing scenes you see an adult man and an adult woman, and not an adult man and a child. So if you don't remind yourself all the time that "she was only 14 at this point", you won't feel the weight of the whole situation and it won't seem as disgusting. To me it was not that much of a problem because I could keep in mind that she is still a child around 14, but I can see why it can be disturbing to some. But the show portrays all the known situations, events, about the Seymour&Elizabeth thing, so there is not much to complain on historical accuracy there. Only that the whole portrayal is not "21st century" enough. But in a world when 30ish men married girls aged 14 quite often, I don't think you should expect hearing "oh it's wrong" "oh he is a pedophile" all the time on screen.... 2) There is some "diversity" some complain about, meaning there are 2 actors who are not white. Tbh in one case, the character is based on a real life mercenary, Pedro Negro, who served there in the Tudor times, but I don't think people realize it, they just complain that "oh, diversity again". The other actor is a poc man who plays the Spanish ambassador, which is indeed very inaccurate, I can understand the complain in that case. But he is such a side character that I am not disturbed by this inaccuracy that much. It is not like that 2021 Anne Boleyn drama at all. Tbh my complaint is something else, it's the main actress. And that's not a small issue because it's the main role. First, she is too old, second, she does not play that well. I saw her in German productions and I know she is a good actress but here she is just... meh. Maybe because she has to speak in a language that's not her native so she can't focus that much on acting? Idk. Her voice is also so strange, I guess she is trying to sound younger and more childlike, but it's just weird. Or maybe her part is not written well by the scriptwriters. But she and her scenes are definitely the weak parts of the show for me. Edward, Mary, Jane Grey, Robert Dudley (😍😍), Catherine Parr, the Seymour brothers, they are all so interesting to watch, unlike Elizabeth. And that's not so good when it is supposed to be an Elizabeth coming-of-age story. I just hope it will improve till the last episode.
@@Lily1127channel thanks, it is true that Edwards reign was definitely black spot and he was not really shown in any other tv series before (or he was just a kid or already dead). But Seymore brothers are something that definitely interests me as a topic, both of them were very important; especially Edward. And young Robert? That sounds amazing, how I could forget that he is supposed to be there? 😂 I get you when it comes to the main actress, because when you dont like her, thats a huge problem because it makes the whole show. I probably will watch it to make my own opinion, also there are barely any new historical dramas out there so it would be pitty to ignore it. I actually dont know why I dont feel any interest in Elizabeth as a historical figure in general even though I love this period and have interest in other rulers of her times (like Felipe, Henry IV,… etc.).
I also look forward to the new season of Barbarians. I hope El cid will get a season 3 but it's been 1 year since season 2 and no news so I don't have high hopes 😞 I would really like to see a good Spanish historical tv show again. I've read that Boundless, a miniseries about Magellan will soon air, with Rodrigo Santoro and Alvaro Morta, I really want to see that one. It's made by RTVE like Isabel and CRE. So I hope it will be good. I've just seen the end of the Maria Theresia series and I really wosh they had given that show more episodes and higher budget. Such potential wasted 😞 I hope one day I will see something worthy made about Maria T.
@@Lily1127channel I hope they will realise that El Cid has so much potential (i just want to see Alfonso as king of all kingdom to be honest 😂) and they will continue the show. It would be nice to have something about MT which would dig a little bit deeper into her personality and reign. There is so many good topics which could have been already filmed, TV series about French Revolution would be nice or Henry IV. TV show (because his life was so interesting). But I will take every new historical show, especially when it comes from Spain. Their quality just hits different. I also hope for season 4 of Ekaterina, i am not sure if that is coming or not. I would like to see Godunov because I heard it is really good but hard to find :/
Yeah, Godunov is super good, it is like a Russian Game of Thrones, I loved it. I would like to see the new series Elizaveta, and also hope for Ekaterina season 4, though I don't know how available Russian content will be nowadays. I don't have high hopes. I think the El Cid series is kind of underrated, I think it has a lot potential (Alfonso's reign!), I hope they will realize this and continue. I also find Henry IV tremendously underrated. I once saw a French movie about him but that was kind of meh. Also, there were so many events in it that it was too much for a movie, you need a tv show to show so many things about his life. I think his life had everything that sells a tv show well (lot of blood, fights, lot of lovers, lot of drama), I have no idea why there is nothing made about him. The new French series about Diane de Poitiers is coming this year, I hope it will be good, though that part of history has been shown several times. Also the Marie Antoinette series, it has potential but she is also an overdone historical figure. I think the new Sissi series on Netflix, The Empress, is also coming this year 😄 Honestly now I don't know what to hope from that, after last year's Sisi disaster.
It is very likely that such a scene never occurred. First of all, it would have been recorded. Second, the three Tudor children spent most to nearly all of Edward's reign living apart from one another. Third, Mary would NEVER have just sat there and taken that spectacle. She would have stormed out of the room.
She does storm out of the room, though 😀 Pope mocking and Church mocking performances like these were not rare during Henry VIII's regin. Edward's reign was even more strictly Protestant, it is not unthinkable that such a performance could also happen during Edward's reign. It is not sure that it would have been recorded, not every single court play was recorded. But yes Mary was probably not there and she was very rarely at court during his reign.
Edward did publicly humiliate her though, it is recorded that he once reduced her to tears in front of everyone when pushing her to renounce Catholicism.
God, can someone help Mary? She looks like she's about to collapse. I mean, HEY, they're rude and I'm sorry her faith was mocked. LIKE, WHY, MAN?! I think what Mary deserves is understanding.
She imprisoned my ancestor because he was a church of England bishop. but he got out when Elizabeth took over. and she gave him lot of money, which his sons used to help fund their new company they co-founded, the Virginia company, named after the "virgin" queen who funded them. crazy how real in history that was
Wow I wish I could watch this series, I am the biggest fan (sucker) for a damn good British costume drama as only they can tell it, I hate being on a fixed income!!!!
Killing people over something like this is not justifiable. Says a lot about you and your religion if you think it is. Also, this is fiction. There is no account of this happening. Mary was away from Edward's court for most of his reign anyway.
The Pope was a political leader back then who interfered with other countries and raises coalitions against them. The pre-1871 Catholic Church fought wars and played geopolitics.
I really liked that show and was pissed off that they won't be making another season. There really is no accounting for taste these days. Several shows (Particularly historical ones) that I got into were never renewed.
Not intent on defending the Catholic Church during the 16th century. But I suppose its more dignified to associate with a creed led by the Holy See in Rome rather than one which was founded by some debauched monarch, who couldn't accept the fact that you can't just divorce when your pride is not satisfied.
@@megakillerx I did say that I recognize the corruption in the Roman Catholic Church in the 16th century. But the Borgias were gone from the Church by the time Henry VIII abolished the monasteries in the Edict of 1538. The previous grave corruption in the Roman Catholic Church that had motivated the Reformation by Luther in 1517 was just a pretext to get a divorce and seize church propety and power to pay for his royal court's glottenous parties. Say whatever you want, but since the Reformation more corruption had existed in the institutions like the Church than ever before since it was the subordination of a religious institution to secular authorities like state who would constantly upgrade and change it. Prior to the Reformation there was no such thing states as we know today, more like various institutions which preserved cohesion throught the continent.
All the stories of Catholic priests and young boys, I would not say that's particularly dignified. Removing the Pope led to a constitutional monarch and away from absolute monarchy, while the reformation is credited with new age thinking that certainly benefited Britain, including the industrial revolution. To this day, I'd say England is still very much thankful to have moved away from Catholicism, especially as it opened the door for Christians to actually be able to read their own holy text in their own language and not have it dictated to them by superiors.
Also this just gave more support abroad towards Mary it was terrible for trade thats y Cromwell was so diligent he knew u had to balance morality as trade would be affected
I love how Elizabeth stops laughing when the pope is ridiculed and looks worried for her sister Mary❤️
Ciertamente, Isabel en su reinado era más ecuánime hasta que su excomulgacion la obligó a tener a los católicos a rienda corta
Its a common misunderstanding that mary and Elizabeth were always enemies. They weren't. It's been recently coming to light that they were very close growing up. Hate usually stems from love. When we feel someone we love betrayed us, we hate them. I feel for both Mary and Elizabeth, they both had it rough for different reasons.
@@moonsdottirYou are so right! They weren't always enemies. Mary never hated Elizabeth. She never despised her for the fact that Elizabeth had taken her place as heiress to the English throne. I think Mary might have at first felt different and anger about being replaced by someone else and forgotten, but I think it wasn't really a feeling of hate towards her newborn sister. Mary loved Elizabeth deeply and so did Elizabeth. Only in their later years their relationship began to crumble and also due to the fact that Mary became Queen and started seeing her sister as a threat to her throne, imprisoning her and almost considering to execute her, but I really think that deep down she still had some love and affection for her sister as I really think that's why she did not go further with the execution and spared Elizabeth. I feel sorry and emotional of why their relationship had to end up like that💔 Mary and Elizabeth never deserved to suffer from their father and others. They were both strong woman! For me, they were the best sister duo ever!💖
I find that hard to believe as Elizabeth I was just as malicious. Hanging, drawing and quarterings anyone?
@@historylover2 Something that was common amongst the Tudor reign? They all killed innocents at one point, it is not any different from Henry, Edward, Mary ,and Elizabeth.
This show is definitely more Becoming Mary than Becoming Elizabeth. The portrayal of Mary has been a real refreshing highlight
I actually feel really horrible for Mary. She was not the best queen and she made awful decisions for the nation don’t get me wrong, but she started as just a broken little girl. She was a beloved princess only daughter to the King and adored before being tossed aside, stripped of her title and called a bastard. Her father abandoned her. Her mother was torn from her. All she had to cling to was her faith and even that was being pulled away from her. I don’t blame her for clinging so so tightly to her Catholic faith, it’s all she had left from her happy childhood. She was treated horrible. She married a man who basically just used her for her crown. She wanted a child so so desperately that a growing theory was she didn’t realize she had cancer in her stomach and thought she was pregnant, but the cancer was killing her. She was basically driven mad. She did some cruel and wicked things in the name of her faith. I do not justify her actions in any way so much blood spilled, but I can’t help but feel sorry for that broken and sad little girl.
@@allshookup1640 That's what I've always said and stuck by it. Mary was and still is very unfairly misunderstood and stereotyped.
Instead of constantly concentrating on the bad she did, people should look at the full picture
@@allshookup1640 Like all her family did way worst and more wocked things fir their fairh than she did, but because she was catholic she's remembered as crueler. Though, to be honest, the other had no religion nor faith, Protestantism is political propaganda at best, hardly a religion to begin with
@@goodaimshield1115 okay firstly I’m a Protestant so let’s please not go insulting other people’s religions I would appreciate it. Secondly, I know she didn’t anymore than he father or sister and yes being preceding and succeed by Protestant rulers certainly did not help her cause. However, Henry VIII’s rule was 38 years, Elizabeth 1’s was 45 years their various kills were spread over these years so they don’t look as bad. Mary had over 300 Protestants burned in only 5 years.
Also Mary allowed herself to be manipulated by her husband Phillip II. Who was a horrible person don’t get me wrong. But he convinced Mary to begin a unsuccessful war with France (while England was allied with Spain) and lose the European toe hold that England really needed and had held for a long time, Calais.
Her short reign really compacted her failures and made her look far worse than she would have had these events occurred in a longer reign.
@@goodaimshield1115 But Henry VIII was not Protestant at all, he merely separated from Rome but his devotion remained the same for the entire life.
For context: the people making fun of 1/2 of the oldest Christian church are supposed to be faithful to a church invented by a king so he could divorce as much as he wanted and confiscate as much land and wealth as he wanted from the church and basically have a monarch be in charge of religion.
No difference between his church and the Catholic roman Church, none created by the Lord Jesus or ruled by him, both following their own laws
Protestantism was started around Germany because they recognized that Church authority could make the Bible what it wanted to be in order to control people, not all Churches was bad but this was enough for people to start questioning the authority and authenticity and Catholic specific teachings that are not presented in the Bible. It became Englands official religion because of the King you mentioned. Protestantism is focused on the full authority of the Bible, but still puts importance on the Church for most denominations. It’s really easy to make a faith look bad with just some unmentioned historical context, like how I could make a case of the Popes being corrupted and bad. If you are a brother in Christ then you mind your tongue, it can easily lead you to spew out lies.
@@YahalEL7 The Catholic Church sprung from the early church and has a direct line to the apostles and bishops and Peter.
@@willwalker6894 has absolutely no line to the apostles that's just one of the thousands of Catholic lies, according to the bible peter never left judea , never Introduced the European made Catholic laws, and never set up system where men are elected to rule over the church
Yet even modern science proves the remains in the grave upon which St. Peters basilica is built is those of a fisherman from Galilee and about 2000 years old. Do you have any more lies ?
Edward was literally raised by radical Protestant tutors, and since he was only 15 when he died, it is hard to say how much of this anti-Catholic fervor was of his own volition. There were two ironies here. His mother, Jane Seymour, was a devout Catholic, and had she not died soon after his birth, it is quite probable that his outlook would have been different. The other is that, in his early years, Edward was closer to Mary than he was to Elizabeth, the result of her genuine doting upon him. Elizabeth, though not a Catholic, was religiously the most like her father, a true Anglican. She also rejected many of the radical Protestant teachings such as non-celibate clergy and the banning of religious images. And it was not until Mary ascended the throne that the two sisters became rivals, so at this point, they were still on very good terms. (A salute to Mary when considering the harsh treatment of her and her mother Catherine of Aragon by Elizabeth's mother Anne Boleyn).
King Edward's mother, Jane Seymour, was not a devout Catholic and neither was she a convinced Protestant, especially since King Henry VIII had used religion to get his personal wishes with Anne Boleyn. Jane was a good and submissive girl. The Seymour family wanted to achieve social and economic benefits at court and she was the way to achieve them. she wasn't like Anne Boleyn or like Katherine of Aragon, she never expressed her own opinions, although she tried to reconcile the king with his daughter Mary. We don't know what her future would have been if she had survived the birth of her child.
Catholics and Protestants were equally fanatical in those years and for centuries. Mary's Catholicism was mocked at the court of Edward VI, but later, during Mary's reign, Protestants were persecuted and executed. Mary was a fanatic and took revenge on the Protestants on behalf of herself and her mother, Queen Katherine of Aragon. His sister, Queen Elizabeth I, I think she didn't believe in anything, but she chose Protestantism for political reasons. It is true that Edward was a manipulated child, especially by his uncle Edward Seymour. Religion was the excuse to lead Europe into long centuries of war. Even today it is an excuse to manipulate the population: arousing religious feelings is often the pretext to achieve other goals.
Well Henry VII was catholic, a very bad one, and of course, a terrible person, spouse and father.
@@KrisBCN Protestants were WAY more radical and fanatics than catholics (or any other Christians) basically because protestantism was founded upon political propaganda against some catholic countries (Spain being the main one), so it was way more radical than Catholicism, basically because Catholicism only had to stand its ground, Protestantism was revolutionary political propaganda masked as religion, and as all revolutions in history it was established upon immeasurable cruelty and violent acts. You say Maru was fanatic? Jesus Christ, Maru was probably the lest fanatic of them all.
@@goodaimshield1115 I agree with you when you say that Protestants are fanatics and radicals. I don't know if they were more or less than Catholics. Felipe II of Spain was a fanatic and John Calvin, for example, was a fanatic too. Fortunately, I have not lived in the time of Mary Tudor, Elizabeth I, Felipe II, Luther, or Calvin. All of them were intolerant, whether for truly religious or political reasons. Therefore, I am not defending either one or the other. Both Protestants and Catholics persecuted those who didn't think like them. Remember the Night of Saint Bartholomew in France when thousands of protestants were massacred. But, in fact, it was only about political issues. Years later, Henry IV, the head of the French Protestants, converted to Catholicism and said: "Paris deserves a mass"
Fortunately, I have not lived in the time of Mary Tudor, Elizabeth I, Philip II, Luther, or Calvin. All of them were intolerant, whether for truly religious or political reasons. Therefore, I am not defending either one or the other. Both Protestants and Catholics persecuted those who did not think like them. It was a terrible time if you were someone with your own ideas, it was dangerous whether you lived in a Protestant or Catholic country. About Mary, she was a person with a lot of mental trauma. It is true that she is often ridiculed or shown as someone very cruel in English series and movies, but she practiced systematic terror against Protestants, this is indisputable., that is not what I say, but historians, English or not English.
@@goodaimshield1115 that’s hilarious because it’s pretty much untrue. Henry was actually awarded the title of defender of the catholic faith in 1521 by Pope Leo X, it was only when the Pope refused to annul his marriage did he break, and even then he wasn’t antagonist that only occurred when CATHOLIC Spain got greedy
I’ve never seen any show/film that depicts the siblings’ relationships during Edward’s reign, so the show is rather refreshing. I’ve read Mary Tudor’s biographies in my uni years, so I feel like this scene perfectly encapsulates the heightened tension in her family and court life. Especially as she was in a hostile anti-Catholic environment. The background music sounds somewhat exotic and modern, which makes the scene feel all the more unnatural. The dutch angles make it even weirder, as well. You never hear this type of orchestration in a historical period drama, so I feel like it helps the audience to really empathize with Mary’s disgust, trauma and humiliation. Like… the foundation for Mary’s faith and country is being corrupted by something hideously different and hostile. I hope it makes sense…
I’m a Protestant, btw… but no one should be targeted for their beliefs. It will just make things so much worse for everyone. Whether it’s a social, emotional or physical persecution.
There is an excellent BBC TV series called ‘Elizabeth R’ (1971) starring Glenda Jackson. The show portrays scenes with Elizabeth and Mary. I think it the most extensive TV show depicting Queen Elizabeth.
@@DMAN-ey1nb "Elizabeth R", A TRUE CLASSIC!
(I have seen it, NOT in the 1970s, but around the early 1990s)
I think it was on BRAVO.
Mary used to give Elizabeth horseback rides when she was a toddler and rub her gums when she was teething.
Seeing that Elizabeth was bastardized when her mother died (just as Mary had been) diminished some of the resentment. Mary was now old enough to understand that Anne Boleyn was only a symptom: the problem was Henry.
I LIKE HOW THE MUSIC SOUNDS LIKE A RAVE BUT NOBODY HERE REALIZES
Jane Seymour must have been spinning in her grave. She was a Catholic [who was faithful to Queen Catherine and Mary] and yet her son, King Edward VI, became such a fanatical protestant.
*Jane Seymour was a cold bitch, she treated Elizabeth I as a bastard after Anne Boleyn was executed.*
She would have known her son would be raised Protestant though
@@Seek1878Her 2 brothers were literally around serving Edward's "church"
@@Seek1878 Had she lived she would have smoothed over these things... she never would have allowed her son to think this debacle was ok.
@@swordchild0013 who knows
Too uncomfortable to watch for a staunch Catholic like Mary, I felt sorry for her for enduring seeing her faith being ridiculed.
do u know if the popes actor got killed?
@@elenamenendezgonalez9881 the actor didn't die it was a symbolic death
And Edward was a zealot protestant, he seemed to be a Calvinist which i don't understand since Coe was very Catholics in rituals and architecture, even Elizabeth was not at all against the imagery and art in the church, she only become really worried towards Catholicism when Mary Stuart was impresioned which lead to multiples rebelions.
So why he had such a puritan view about the church even though he was raised in the same background as Elizabeth?
@yuriitoh7682 - Do you feel sorry for the 300 Protestants she had burned alive?
@@WORLD8NSH5KNIGHT1 Caedite eos. Novit enim Dominus qui sunt eius.
I feel downright nothing but sympathy for Mary. History taught us to ridicule her when actually she was misunderstood. I understand her deeds wasn't great, being infamous for burning Protestants and I won't excuse that. But let's not forget many died at the hands of Henry the 8th, Edward & Elizabeth's as well.
Yeah religion sucks basically. Made up stupid reason to kill eachother.
Honestly, when I learned about The Tudors, it taught me to mistrust all monarchies. This whole family was terrible.
Henry: brought the nation to war, was gorging himself, abusing the people and waving Devine right as the head of his church as if it were nothing.
Edward: didn’t live up.
Mary: Was a religious zealot, who burned people alive (most likely as a form of vengeance), and clearly suffering from mental illness with her phantom pregnancies.
Elizabeth: Cruel, jealous, and manipulative. Had a god complex, took credit for other peoples work (especially with the military) and almost bankrupted the kingdom waging a war with Spain. And no heir leading to almost worse royal family, The Stuarts, rise to power.
In my opinion, The Tudors, like most of the royals are terrible. They are equal with monarchs like John, Longshanks, Charles I, and George III.
@@dylantennant6594 lmao!! Edward’s fault is he didn’t live?
More like bringing Lady Jane Grey into the mess for nothing.
@@queenanneboleyn6848 Not what I meant. More he didn't get a chance to live into the crown. Maybe he could have beena good king, maybe not. Who knows.
@@dylantennant6594 I know. I was kidding.
Elizabeth shows her enthusiasm but ceases when she sees her sister's discomfort and shock. She sporadically checks upon her while looking at the scene before her. She loved Mary so much and it was evidenced in this scene.
It's not bloody Mary, it's BLOODY Elizabeth!!! 😡👹🤮
What is interesting is that Mary is the granddaughter of the famed Spanish rules, Ferdinand and Isabella, who completed the reconquest of Spain from the Moors and were devout Catholics. Her first cousin, Charles, was probably the most powerful Catholic in the world at the time as he was King of Spain, Emperor of the Holy Roman Empire, and the Arch Duke of Austria.
Charles was actually engaged to their aunt (also named Mary) for a while in the earlier 1500s which didn’t work out and she married Louis XII of France. Charles was later engaged to Mary Tudor herself when she was only 6 and he was 21 🤮 in 1522. They were engaged for 3 years before it was broken off for a variety of reasons and Charles married his wife, Isabella. They had a son named Phillip II who Mary ended up ACTUALLY marrying!
@@allshookup1640 Yes, and had they had a son and lived he would have ruled both Spain and England. While Phillip had a son from his first marriage, Mary was his second, that son suffered severe mental issues, and probably would have died "accidentally" once there was a male heir. It took so long for that male heir to come, that Phillip II did not want to wait and the son, Carlos, died thus leaving only female heirs at the time of his death, from Phillip's third marriage.
Mary may have waited to marry until she was Queen, or displaced by Edward's heirs since she knew marrying a Spanish Royal would cause problems.
@@janefelix3821 well as a woman, it wasn’t really her choice. She was married FAR too late for a woman of her birth. Her father should have arranged a marriage for her LONG before his death that would have benefited the kingdom and Mary. She could have had a happy life and possibly a family of her own if her father had been looking out for her the way that he should have been.
@@allshookup1640 Problem was that Mary was around 16 when her father broke from the Catholic church, thus alienating the two most likely sources of matches, the Hapsburg (which included Spain) or France. Mary, being of famed Spanish blood was eyeing a match with a Spanish ruler, but as England's Protestant population grew, that would be hard to accomplish due to widespread distaste at the time against Spain. Only once she became Queen did she feel comfortable making it official.
In the 17th Century, two English Kings married foreign Catholics, Charles I married the sister of King Louis XIII of France, and his son James II married (second marriage) Mary of Modena, from a noble Italian family. Both Kings were ousted, Charles I was beheaded and James II was forced to flee to his first cousin, King Louis XIV of France. Shortly thereafter, England's Parliament created strict succession laws thus requiring any heir/monarch who marries a Catholic to renounce their claims to the throne, passed in 1701.
@@janefelix3821 yes you are correct. I’m just saying that when Henry died Mary was 30 years old. Henry was well established in the Church of England and could have found her a suitable husband by then. It might not have been a 100% match as it would be likely they would not be Catholic, but none the less he should have done that for his daughter. She must have been quite embarrassed to be such a high born lady unmarried at age 30 even with her demoted status. At the time, this would have made her a freak of sorts.
It seems Mary was humiliated and suffered a lot at her father´s Court and later during her brother´s reign. Poor Mary.
Umm before you feel any remorse for this women, let me give you a little lesson In history.
Mary Tudor was a super evil and wicked person. During he reign as queen, She had thousands and thousands of people burned at the stake (Specifically good Christians who refused to pledge their allegiance to the corrupt Catholic Church) she had entire families including children tortured and murdered during her reign.
The Bible NEVER condones murdering people for not submitting to the faith.
The Catholic Church is extremely corrupt and evil. If you study the Bible when it talks about being aware of false prophets, the Catholic pope fits that description exactly. They pervert the gospel of Jesus Christ and give real Christian’s a bad name. Their torturous escapades lasted for centuries and was at an all time high during the 15th and 16th century. Torturing people for not submitting to the pope, which again goes against everything the Bible teaches. Not to mention all of their child molestation and pedophile that they try to cover up to this day.
So forgive me for not caring one bit about these people making fun of the pope, because honestly that’s the least this evil woman deserves.
Careful, films aren’t history!
@@EternalShadow1667 This may not have happened in reality, but life wasn´t certainly easy for princess Mary in her father and later in her brother´s court.
Mary was denied a suitable and grand marriage like she was supposed to have being a princess and a king´s daughter because she was catholic.
Before her falling from grace , there were talks that she would marry prince Luís of Portugal ( Louis of Avis ), King Manuel and Queen Maria of Aragon´s son. Being a portuguese myself , I always found that fact very interesting. No doubt English history would be very different if she had.
@@EternalShadow1667 she did suffer, that’s why she burnt all those Protestants when she got into power.
@@theuniverseisme432 Common belief ( from foreigners from catholic countries ) , when we comment on English history concerning Mary , is that she didn´t burn a great amount of people as it was first believed.
Laugh while you can, because you will be crying later when she becomes queen.
I was really disappointed that Becoming Elizabeth only got one season. Well-acted with an interesting story. I would have liked to see more.
Indeed.
She burned 250 people while being powerless politically, she was widely hated, and Elizabeth did away with almost every reform she was able to make. Her father abandoned her to a convent and her life was one of a place holder and political prisoner. She was a failure as a monarch and changed literally nothing. In fact James would kill many times the number of Catholics as she did Protestants in half the time. Also passed laws effectively making it so a Catholic household could not earn income. She killed Protestants to make herself feel good, despite no protestant plot against her. James killed Catholics because they made three attempts in his life in the first year of his reign. All she did was make herself into a hateful tyrant that was easy to forget. James even buried her in a protestant cemetery with Elizabeth as her roommate, against her last will.
@grizzlyblackpowder1960 History is written by the winners which is Protestant of course Elizabeth is seen she can walk on water Mary is the evil one I’m not excusing what she done but Elizabeth enough Saint she killed more people than Mary did there exactly was assignation attempt on Mary to Elizabeth on the throne which is why she locked Elizabeth in the tower yes Mary find some bad things but she wasn’t terrible queen idk why she the only one getting crap when other monarchs including Elizabeth did messed up stuff as well
and cry many protestants did.
This is very hard for Mary to see, the scene captures it perfectly, so awful for her! Indeed it shows why things happen the way they did. Thanks for posting Lili!
It’s worse too that she can’t say or do ANYTHING. She just has to sit there and take it. Elizabeth knows it too you can see her checking on her and possibly trying a little to comfort her sister. Mary can’t condemn them all, she can’t yell or cause a fuss, she can’t cry. They are blatantly mocking the thing she holds dearest RIGHT IN FRONT OF HER. It’s really really cruel to Mary
“Stop judging and you will not be judged. Stop condemning and you will not be condemned. Forgive and you will be forgiven."
-Luke 6:37
Lady Mormont spoke harshly ...
And she paid with her life later on
But NOT fairly
Lady Jane Grey *"The Queen of the nine days."*
1:17 Quite astute of you to notice :-) ( Bella Ramsay acting as....)
I wondered if that was lady mormont I saw there.
reminiscent of a scene in GoT where Sansa is ridiculed with the reenactment of her brother's death.
Funnily enough I remember my teacher at school describing Edward VI much like Joffrey, a precocious psychopath who would have been a worse tyrant if he'd lived long enough.
And Jane Grey is being played by the same actress (Bella Ramsey) who played Lyanna Mormont.
@@Sawrattan Fortunately, he was no psychopath, although some might have gotten such impression from reading his diaries. He still loved Mary deeply
@@Sawrattan Joffrey is fiction. Edward VI was a real King who was clever, smart and could think rings around his sister's who were clever and his advisors who were clever. He was a King. He died aged 15 years. All the Tudor Monarch's had Temper Tantrums and were ruthless it is either you died and your country gets taken over or you don't. Remember King Edward VI govern real people, in a real land and made laws for his subjects. The Common People of England rather liked their boy king and were looking forward to his marriage and him coming of age. His death was awful, not expected at all and came as quite a shock.
@@AnnaBellaChannelIf I remember correctly a more apt comparison of Joffrey is to Edward of Westminster, who was also known for monstrous behavior, and especially since Martin was heavily inspired by the War of the Roses
I’m not even Catholic and I didn’t find this funny. I was in the “what? Are you freaking kidding me?” camp.
I know Mary wasn’t a good person in real life but this scene definitely humanizes her and makes you feel sympathy for her.
She was victim and victimizer. She was a victim because just to defend her mother, her father mistreated her in many ways and then she suffered a lot under the yoke of her brother's advisers. she was not loved and had to make his religion his hill to die on. Ironies of her life, her sister Elizabeth killed more Catholics in the first year of her reign than Mary Protestants in the five years of her reign.
The one time I dislike edward
I mean not every monarch are good, her father killed hundred and thousands of people who opposed him but when Mary killed protestants people suddenly called her “barbaric Queen” when most monarch did the same thing, they also gave Mary a nickname “Bloody Mary” to emphasize her inhumane actions. I dont think its fair to assume one’s personality based on what they did once or twice. I never heard her father be called a man whore or “mad man whore” when he divorced and beheaded most of his 6 wives.
She was a saintly queen who brought England back to the holy catholic church and punished heretics.
@@L0velySam Edward was a tool, a little dweeb.
`But the Lord laughs at the wicked, for he knows their day is coming.' - Psalm 37:13
"You are Peter the rock on this rock I will build my church and the powers of the underworld will not overcome it....."....since 2000 years.....
In context, the rock was Peter's confession.
@@person-gs6xr That's the Protestant interpretation.
*Mocks Mary’s faith*
Mary: *Goes on an anti Protestant rampage*
England: Why would she does this??
The entirety of England shouldnt have to pay for the court being horrible
@@anayadegani626 That would assume that the lay Protestants did not share the same view, which would be relatively bold claims to make. Like maybe I can agree that they don't mock Catholic faith to THAT extend, and obviously the Catholic did the same, but let not pretend that the average devout Protestants (ie people who are aware that there is a different in doctrine of the faith between Protestant vs Catholic) at the time would not share the same kind of bias.
There is no record of this having happened. She was mostly away from court during Edward's reign.
Its cringey to see how they ridicule catholicism
@jassypr - Catholocism at that time was hardly a tolerant faith though was it? Have you ever heard of the Spanish Inquisition?
@@WORLD8NSH5KNIGHT1ah yeah, the one who killed almost anyone in comparisson to the protestant massacres on Germany. Or the same religion that stoped conquistadores from killing natives thought Pope Paul III. I wonder what the anglicans did to the native americans on the North. Oh thats right, we cannot ask them cause they massacred them all
@@WORLD8NSH5KNIGHT1 The institution that has sentenced to death some 200 people in the period of 300 years?
@@WORLD8NSH5KNIGHT1lol, you have no idea what you're talking about, only during Elizabeth I reign many more executions on account of heresy were made than during the 300 years the Spanish Inquisition was active
Religious people in general are cringe. Nobody with a rudimentary understanding of palaeontology and geology takes this stuff seriously.
I don't like the idea that people think of the pope more than they think of God, but poor Mary should not have been subjected to that sort of humiliation.
They don't. The Pope simply attends to earthly matters in God's name. Who would ever worship a Pope (Bishop of Rome)? He is human like us all.
I'm Catholic, there are many accusations of us that are not entirely true, we don't worship the Pope.
@@megan166As a Catholic, I'm so sick of people thinking we worship the clergy, we don't.
Heck, I see plenty of flaws in the church (child predators going unpunished, greed, ect.)
I personally see the church as more something you can turn to for advice, given those people have devoted a lot of time to studying Christianity and the Bible. But even then I know it's run by humans, and therefore has flaws
Which explains why Mary became what she is said to be or maybe later historians of a Protestant England painted her that way? Still though, she was actually Queen of a far larger empire than her father, sister or brother reigned on. Which begs the question, if she had a child, can you imagine the scale of a combined British-Spanish empire or maybe England will not be able to soar the way it did if their Ruler was also the Ruler of Spain?
Given that Felipe II was also ruler of the Netherlands and would also take Portugal in the 1580s, I think that Britain would soar but would also be constantly involved in territorial wars with France and France's ally Scotland. So not much changes there, except that English culture would be more influenced by Iberia and the predominant religion would be Catholicism.
Much of her image is anti catholic propaganda, she's portrayed as a blood thirsty maniac when her father alone killed like 1000 times more people
England and the Netherlands would grow even closer, and eventually declare independence from Spain. Maybe even attempt an Anglo-Dutch 'United Kingdom' although their joint control of the Channel would probably set off a war with France.
Gross
Spain was far, far wealthier than England in the 16th century, so the Spanish kingdoms would probably take priority in most monarchs's eyes.
However, Spain itself was mostly a series of kingdoms in personal union stitched together at that point, so making England "part of it", so to say, shouldn't be that difficult.
Even Edward's father Henry VIII. - the one who separated England from the Pope in the first place - would never have allowed the Pope or other priests to be ridiculed like that in his court. Henry saw himself as a devout Catholic for his entire life and only separated from Rome to get his way but under his reign the liturgy of the church of England remained catholic and a show like this would've been sacrilegious to him.
I disagree, if that was the case then Henry VIII would have repented and fixed matters with Rome after Edward was born.
@@cg8397 Why would he? The breach from Rome had given him many advantages. Also he would've made himself look ridiculous if he came crawling back to Rome after all that happened.
Also - like I said - he saw himself as a devout catholic when it came to the teachings but to him that had nothing to do with the Pope. That's btw not up for discussion, it's a fact. You can see that in what the actual teachings of the early Church of England which more or less stayed the same after the breach from Rome. And also in the way actual protestants were treated. Like his last wife Catherine Parr for example had to hide the fact that she was a Protestants because Henry saw Protestants with their teachings as heretics.
Its less obvious but people still do this today about religions they don't agree with/aren't a part of
@dreamsteddybearsmaster - Yes and religions - especially Islam do plenty of persecuting when they feel 'offended' !
Philip II didn't love Mary and I'm sure he was relieved he didn't have any children by her.
The age gap was huge. I wish he did love her though. She deserved that much .
@@acdragonrider That's the thing abput arranged weddings. They're not build upon love but for business-Mary never quite understood this.
@@savagedarksider5934 My angel cannot be blamed for her feelings.
She shouldn't have married him, he was never going to spend much time in England with her because of his royal duties on the continent. Edward Courtenay was the better choice.
@@cg8397 She was doing what she wanted to do, find a husband, though for the life of me I don't know why my angel had to go and pick HIM, of all people! But he was a King; he could not be expected to stay all the time. But when you really love someone, you miss them. I don't know about Courtenay. He seemed kind of contradictory to me.
Poor Mary 😢.
If I were her, I would want to rip everyone apart and have them burned… At least there’s the kind of motivation
Yeah, you can't help but feel deeply sorry for her here, it's so awful to see her endure something like this 😢
That's exactly what I like about Mary's portrayal in this series. It's not that they want to deny what she did during her rule, but it gives all her actions a deep context. She had to endure a lot of sht during Edward's protestant reign. It's not that she was born as Bloody Mary and everyone before her and after her in England was all good and kind when it came to religion...
I love Romola Garai's portrayal and I think that especially in this scene she portrays all the tumultous emotions of Mary so well.
@@Lily1127channel Right. This series and the Tudors really did a good job with her character. (Honestly Mary was my fav part of the tudors cuz I hated how gratuitous the show would get).
I’ve had a pipe dream for some time now to see Sarah Bolger come back as Mary in a film about her tragic reign. But maybe Romola can do it too. Maybe both? It could be a sweeping comprehensive look at her story with flashbacks.
@@acdragonrider I still don't like Mary.
@@savagedarksider5934 That’s fair. But just keep into perspective why she turned out the way she did. That’s all we can do as historians. Why and how. She’s an clear example of how the Reformation destroyed people at the time. She was a conservative clinging to Catholicism and her dignity at a time when the Country was trying to rip apart everything she’d ever known and believed in. To be honest, they were in the wrong as much as she was because the Protestants of the Church of England were as harsh and prejudiced as the Catholics would be. Just a perspective of how bloody the reformation was.
On a more personal spectrum, Mary’s own father disowned her and started the trend of people calling her a bastard. Not to mention he tried to ruin her mother’s reputation. If that was not enough, Mary would get hounded all her life, with no one to protect or guide her but her dear uncle, Emperor Charles V, the Pope and their mutual advisors. No wonder she’d go on to marry Philip II who ended up abandoning her as well. I relate sometimes to how lonely she was. She lived and died lonely. As for what she’d do during her reign, well,.. 🤷🏻♂️can’t really excuse it. But I also rationalize her decisions as a result of yes religious radical insanity but also imo, what being shunned does to you. You feel resentment and anger at the world. I can only see it as years of frustration and desire to save herself and the England she believes in. I don’t condone it. And I don’t see what I’m saying as excuse. More as my hypothesis for why she did what she did (from an internal reasoning). Also the pressures of ruling and feeling like you have to kill or be killed. Monarchy in those days wasn’t easy not were you safe. Multiple rulers in medieval and Renaissance history did even worse things in order to survive and carry out their dictates.
But hey, I notice I tend to connect more to people who make mistakes and live difficult lives. Just me.
@@acdragonrider Um, Charles V wasn't her uncle-he was her cousin. As for Henry;He desperately,desperately wanted A son and to be this warrior king like Henry V and Richard the lion heart-but that's not how history remember him as. He took his frustration over not having A son on Mary and Catherine because he couldn't execute them. Philip II, I think is actually relieved he never had any children by Mary because that mean he doesn't have to spent A whole lot of time in England.
I feel sorry for Mary. She was probably one of the unhappiest queens ever! Discriminated for being a woman, lost her mother, her father did not protect her and made her a bastard, her faith was ridiculed in her country... When she finally became queen and married Phillip, she died childless and was unable to maintain the Catholic Faith , which was probably her main goal. Everything was in vain for England fell into the hands of the protestants... I know she burned hundreds of people but there were worse kings/queens who are remembered as great... Her grandmother Isabella of Castille also executed jews and muslims and is remembered as "Isabella, the Catholic" not "Bloody Isabella" , her sister also killed catholics and is known as "Virgin Queen", not "Bloody Elizabeth "...
Why isn't Mary known as "Mary the Catholic" ? ... I don't support what she did but I think History was unfair with her...
Protestant historians in the Elizabethan age vilified poor queen Mary. The reputation they gave her in their writings have stayed in peoples minds till this day. I visited Aspley house in London, there is very beautiful portrait of Mary where she looks like both her parents and she is dressed in gold and decked with jewels.
We're used to seeing Mary in a very unflattering portrait by Antonis mor. Every documentary or adaptation of her including this series has based her appearance on this this awful painting but in reality she dressed as spectacularly as all other Tudor monarchs dressed. She also gave people second chances before they screwed up, for ex; Lady Jane and her family and her sister Elizabeth faking her beliefs in Catholicism.
Elizabeth never killed any o her subjects for their faith.
@@rushamitra335 She did! Plenty of Catholics were killed during her reign. But she was clever, she executed people for treason rather than burning them for heresy...
@@anabarros1018 sounds logical.
@@rushamitra335 Elizabeth quartered catholics and anabaptists since 1559. Idiot how can you be so ignorant!
they are laughing but king henry 8th changed the religion of england because he wanted a divorce .
After centuries of oppression you start to question why am I being controlled by some guy living thousands of miles away who is just as corrupt as any other man. In the long run it looks like Henry's idea worked out rather well.
@@murmursmeglosIf I’m not wrong the current pope was Pius V which was the pope that was against Jewish persecution and is considered a saint and one of the greatest popes in history
@@murmursmeglos Which oppression?
England had been nearly entirely catholic for over a thousand years at that point, and Henry VIII himself had a wonderful relationship with the church pre-reformation.
TBF Henry VIII's changes were fairly moderate. The Church of England remained very close to its catholic roots theologically during his reign.
But being arguably the first major protestant monarch (if a rather moderate one) won him many zealous protestant friends, many of whom would become Edward VI's tutors and regents.
I don’t understand why the Pope should have the right to prevent a divorce.
And people wonder why/how she earned the name Bloody Mary
Mary I, saintly queen, you who brought back England to the holy catholic church and punished blasphemous heretics, pray for us!
This didn't happen, though. Mary was mostly away from court during Edward's years anyway. People need to learn that not everything that happens in a "historical" series is actual history.
@@RM-uk1sdThis probably would have happened since theatricality was not uncommon in Tudor era. And in fact, Elizabeth and her father Henry killed more people for their faith than Mary, but scapegoated Mary in history as bloody Mary....!!!
@@pradeepakrish If you start thinking up fiction in such a simple way and accept it as fact, then we can all start making statements like: "Elizabeth and Mary had a big duel in the streets of London. You know, they had different religions so it probably happened"🤡
Also, Henry VIII couldn't even make Mary the scapecoat as he reigned BEFORE her and he had no idea she would even become queen.
It's very clear you know little about and care nothing about history.
@@RM-uk1sd LOL 😂🤣 You are so silly dude! I blamed the fanatic Protestants (perhaps someone like you!) for portraying Mary as the bloody Mary, not Henry!! 😂 And also, you cannot deny something like this wouldn't have happened, as well as nobody can prove something like this happened without evidence. I know that all TV shows or movies aren't reality TV shows! But the director can take the freedom of creativity given the historical sentiments. I feel pity about your stupidity and illiteracy about Tudor and Renaissance history! 🥲 Bye bye!
Mary was in her twenties when Edward was born, in her thirties when he became King (37 when he died at the age of 15). She had already lived through much worse than this.
I mean, she spent a good chunk of Edward VI's reign as far away from the court as possible.
And Edward VI's court was a lot more radically protestant and antipapist than Henry VIII's.
Mary’s already planning to eat them for breakfast (and rightly so).😊
Protestantism is generally see as a product of the Modern Era, so it’s interesting to see early Protestants displaying what are usually considered Medieval/Renaissance aesthetics and practices.
Protestantism is still modern and the Tudor period invented the modern world.
@@AnnaBellaChannelhow is something that started around 500 years ago modern? Are you using a geologic timescale?
@@antediluvianarchive7958 500 years ago is not very long in British History terms or world history terms. The Tudor Period is seen as the beginning of the modern era.
@antediluvianarchive7958 The historical period that this takes place in is literally the early modern period, so yeah, it is modern.
@@crazyzealots5568 I get that the era is referred to as the early modern period, but I wouldnt call it modern. Though now i think I'm confusing the words modern and contemporary. Looking at the scope of the 300,000ish years our species exists 500 years ago is like 15 minutes ago
Whoever did the casting did an excellent job!
The Most Excellent
Order of the British Empire
🤔I have serious doubts...
@ndie8075 How so? I find the actress who played Mary and Elizabeth to sort of resemble their portraits. At least they both have the right colouring. And the actor who plays Edward looks a lot like the portrait by William Scrots.
Es normal y comprensible q Maria Tudor se sintiera molesta y ofendida ante esta obra teatral satírica q se burla del Papa y de la fe católica. Para ella la fe católica era parte de su vida y tmbn parte del legado y la educación q le dio su madre Catalina de Aragon.
Por supuesto en aquella época no había cabida para la tolerancia religiosa ni mucho menos para la libertad religiosa de tdo creyente sean cuales sean sus creencias
Exactamente!, pobre Maria. Me sorprende que esta obra se representara en el palacio.
@@ahmedzahir2865 lamentablemente creo era muy habitual ese tipo de representaciones teatrales para satirizar a la Iglesia Católica y al Papa. Tristemente una de las causas de la Reforma Protestante fue la falta de moral por parte del Papado y del clero católico de la época. Los papas y altos jerarcas de la Iglesia de entonces llevaban un estilo de vida muy poco coherente con el Evangeluo, en medio de lujos y vicios. Me duele decirlo como creyente pero es así
@@ahmedzahir2865 es porque es ficción. Si bien es cierto que se ridiculizaba a la religión católica, en la vida real la corte no se atrevería a tales acciones por una cuestión de ofender a los diplomáticos católicos e iniciar una guerra
@@Martin-Tello Exacto, eso mismo he pensado. Supongo que en privado podrían hacerse comentarios ofensivos, pero una representación como esa no se representaría en la corte. Como siempre, la cadena Starz produce series "históricas" entretenidas y vistosas, como The Tudors, The White Queen, etc, pero la historicidad de los personajes o de las situaciones no es demasiado fiable.
@@KrisBCN de todas creo que la más acertada es la Reina Blanca excepto por el romance entre Elizabeth York y Ricardo y que Margaret Beaufort matara a los príncipes de la Torre
Damn. Nobody should watch how something they believe deeply is cruelly humiliated.
When you think you’re in the right to such an extreme it’s sad what people can bring themselves to think, say or do. I mean don’t forget this is the same continent that was fine with inquisitions, pogroms and expulsion of Jews and Muslims too.
I would've loved to see Mary's reign in season 2. Alas.
the show's not continued ?
I truly feel bad for Mary and all she went thru in life it was her father divorcing her mother and shunning her just for being a girl and him desperately wanting a son to take the throne that caused Mary to turn out like she did she was forced to renounce her birth right to the throne and Henry wouldn't even let her see her mother after the divorce she was also looked down on by Anne Boleyn for not acknowledging her as the true queen but her mother as queen of England and poor Mary didn't even get to attend her mother's funeral it was the cruelty from her father and Anne Boleyn and others that made her the way she was when she became queen it wasn't all her fault and her tragic story is still looked over today
Now look at modern England.
Yeah and we still think 'thank god we're not a Catholic country'.
@@murmursmeglos🙈yes the anglican church is a masterpiece of wokeness and to a act against the bible.....the rest of the country became atheist..........the anglican Community is shrinking like a dry sponge........the catholic Church is growing by 15 million a year...despite the old europe....
Mary shouldn’t have seen that
I love edwards outfit here actually i love everyones outfits
Absolutely, the costumes are a high point of the series
I am a Protestant, like Edward and Elizabeth and Jane, but even this is too far. I believe that the Pope is not an omnipotent human, but even this is too much for anybody. The Pope is a human being and deserves respect like we all do, not ridicule and rudeness.
they ate Mary up
Poor mary
Noone's religion should be ridiculed like this
What a mistake as Mary 1st would give such retribution
This is why Mary persecuted Protestants once she became Queen, which I do not blame her at all. Henry VIII caused this mess.
This didn't even happen. Mary was mostly away from Edward's court anyway and at her own property. He did admonish her once for being catholic, but when he started crying, he cried as well.
Historicsl fiction is not always accurate history. The word fiction gives it away.
I loved how Bella Ramsey from the worst witch AKA Mildred Hubble became Lady Jane Grey
Elizabeth is the protagonist but boy Mary really is a breakout character. I felt so bad for her, no wonder she snaps.
And the gates of hell shall not prevail.
I cannot believe this show was canceled
Why? So they're not making season 2?
Why is the camera so shaky. Is the whole show like this.
And wait until she becomes queen in her own rite. Hell HATH no fury😠😠😠
Can’t imagine how Jane, or even Edward’s grandparents or even ancestors would feel 😢
This was set during the reign of Edward VI when England was more extremely Protestant. This was mild compared to what was really going on.
Oh there are far worse scenes than this about Edward's reign in this tv show. Robbing churches, beating priests, and then burning heretics, etc.
@@Lily1127channel Protestants did not burn Catholics as heretics, but hanged them as traitors.
@@iainclark5964 Edward burned two radical Anabaptists at stake for heresy during his reign. One of these burnings is showed in the series. That is what I meant by "burning heretics".
They always say history is written by the winners. Just as French media today still champions Mary Queen of Scots, English media glosses over Edward the little Taliban king.
@@Sawrattan Most Scots I've spoken to view Mary as tragic but useless as a monarch.
Both Mary and Edward were fantically devoted to their respective branches of Christianity!
As a Catholic myself, this was difficult to watch, and I felt for poor Mary. She was trying so hard to find solace in her Rosary.
Meanwhile in France, king François the First : "Oh, you too dislike the Pope ?" then laughs in Concordat de Bologne. ;)
England could never rise to become a dominant world power while under the influence of Rome
That may be. But mocking people is still sinful either way. They were still in the wrong for doing this.
You cannot know for sure. If by any chance Mary had married the portuguese prince Luís of Aviz as it was arranged , or a spanish prince , two princes from two of the dominant sea powers and empires at the time, it would.
@@bexie1992 then why did Christ mock the Pharisees?
@@shaunsteele8244 he told them off; that's not the same as mocking. You've got to remember that different translations will translate the same word differently. One of my bibles says reprimanded and another ridiculed.
@@shaunsteele8244 Well exactly. Why did Christ mock the Pharisees? To teach them a lesson. He was trying to educate his followers and them about something. He was trying to show them that they are wrong. Do you see anything like that here. I dont. I see a bunch of people being mean and vile. There is no message, no lesson just hatred.
That mockery was more moral than the popes of that era
Being a Christian and having to watch that is heartbreaking
No god but Allah
Islam way for peace and real monotheist
Search about the truth with honest heart
@@amany247cancer
@@amany247 But remember that there is no compulsion in religion. Let people be.
@taylorrowe2002NOT IT ISN'T ! every religion should be respected and every one of them are beautiful ! RESPECT PEOPLE'S RELIGION !
@@amany247 that's okay if they're christian. every religion are valid.
I can easily relate to and identify with Mary Tudor and Mary Stuart.
I love all the commenters judging this by 21st century standards. "Oh they're being so mean" The world was a cruel place in the 16th century. Most people were worked to death or died of smallpox by 30. Or women died in childbirth. Or you were sent to be slaughtered in some petty war!
Yes, and in the same way, people judge Mary too harshly compared to the other Tudors especially Edward VI who were just as bigoted.
Revisionists everywhere indeed. Modern armchair historians everywhere
And in 20th century 10 million people were butchered for their religions, sexualities, skin color. These horrors still exist.
@Prkau telek where has he mentioned conscription?
@Prkau telek Of course not. There was no national army like in Modern times. But the local noblemen raised armies for the King. Do you think the Lords just took volunteers? "You want to stay on your farm to tend your crops. I promised the King troops but my Earldom is a democracy so stay home"
What happened to the actor who played the pope in this scene? They appear to have cut it out, did he get pissed on or something?
he urinated on him
@@nickgreu4ever ok good, part of me thought he was fuckin killed or something
@@thomassmith8140 same. but found the episode myself to find out :P
Edward vi is angry king?
Then God struck Edward by illness. Well deserved.
Whether you believe in God, no God, a potato, or the flying spaghetti monster, one should never be ridiculed in such humiliation.
Yeah they should
The pope is just a man nothing more
@@Dryhten1801no they shouldn't.
@@a_little_demon Yeah they should. Can't let ideas get so powerful that they cannot be mocked. Then you get exactly what the Catholic Church was offering for hundreds of years...
@@andrewmurray409 no. especially not in front who is devoted af in the belief like Mary.
Mary is going to kill me in season 2 if there is one her life was awful :(
I would like to know, whats your opinion about this show so far? :) Is it worth watching? Till this show I have seen all Starz TV series about english history, except this one. Suprisingly I have no interest in this show so far, havent even tried it yet. Maybe I just dont desire to watch another Tudor drama, even though I love Tudors, i want to finally see something different. I also was so dissapointed in The Spanish princess, because the quality was so low and it was pain to watch.
Anyway, I am still waiting patiently for new season of Barbarians and I still have hopes for season 3 of El Cid. Would love to see new historical drama from Spain, at least Heirs to the land had that kind of vibe for me.
Well, I still wonder what my final verdict will be. So far I have had bit of mixed feelings, but I am more positively surprised than negatively. If I had to make a guess, I think it won't make the list of my most favourite historical series, but I am definitely enjoying it. But let's wait till the end. Episode 4 was so great and I really thought the series is going uphill more and more, but then I heavily disliked episode 5. So we will see. So far I certainly haven't lost interest, I look forward to every new episode. I would say that I like it definitely more than The Spanish Princess but I like it less than The White Princess.
I must admit I was really excited when this show was announced, Edward VI's reign was a kind of dark spot for me, I didn't know much about it. Then I started to read up a lot and was waiting for this show to air and see how they portray all the stuff. It was certainly a very tumultous and exciting time and it's a very good subject for a movie/series. Also, among all the Tudor related dramas, at least this part of history is not overdone yet.
Instead of the former Starz historical drama style, the "shiny romantic teenage" dramas, this one is surprisingly dark and serious and 16th centurish. Historically it is more accurate I think than The Spanish Princess and The White Princess, also more accurate than The Tudors. Kinda like Wolf Hall style. I also like that all characters are well rounded, with good and bad characteristics as well, from Elizabeth to her siblings to the Seymours, everyone. Some say it is the show's weakness, because there are no really likeable characters you can root for, but to me this is my type of drama, where I always change who I like the most. Catherine Parr is not all good and holy (finally!), she is a cunning woman who is capable of awful things sometimes. Edward VI is sometimes cute sometimes a really unlikeable child king. I like the way they portrayed Jane Grey's personality too, I think the actress from GoT, Bella Ramsey, plays her very well. Mary I is not all bloody Mary, she is a very complex character. Romola Garai is just amazing as her 😍 The Seymour brothers are both awful sometimes and more understandable at other times.
Other than praise, there are two main critics I read about the show: 1) not me-too enough on the Elizabeth & Thomas Seymour case, showing too many good things from Thomas, too much romantization. I don't really share this opinion. I think Thomas's actions are often creepy and disgusting just enough. Just because he is still shown as a human and not a monster is not necessarily a bad thing imo. The problem with the portrayal of the case is maybe that the Elizabeth actress is far too old, she does not seem 14 at all. So in the seducing scenes you see an adult man and an adult woman, and not an adult man and a child. So if you don't remind yourself all the time that "she was only 14 at this point", you won't feel the weight of the whole situation and it won't seem as disgusting. To me it was not that much of a problem because I could keep in mind that she is still a child around 14, but I can see why it can be disturbing to some. But the show portrays all the known situations, events, about the Seymour&Elizabeth thing, so there is not much to complain on historical accuracy there. Only that the whole portrayal is not "21st century" enough. But in a world when 30ish men married girls aged 14 quite often, I don't think you should expect hearing "oh it's wrong" "oh he is a pedophile" all the time on screen....
2) There is some "diversity" some complain about, meaning there are 2 actors who are not white. Tbh in one case, the character is based on a real life mercenary, Pedro Negro, who served there in the Tudor times, but I don't think people realize it, they just complain that "oh, diversity again". The other actor is a poc man who plays the Spanish ambassador, which is indeed very inaccurate, I can understand the complain in that case. But he is such a side character that I am not disturbed by this inaccuracy that much. It is not like that 2021 Anne Boleyn drama at all.
Tbh my complaint is something else, it's the main actress. And that's not a small issue because it's the main role. First, she is too old, second, she does not play that well. I saw her in German productions and I know she is a good actress but here she is just... meh. Maybe because she has to speak in a language that's not her native so she can't focus that much on acting? Idk. Her voice is also so strange, I guess she is trying to sound younger and more childlike, but it's just weird. Or maybe her part is not written well by the scriptwriters. But she and her scenes are definitely the weak parts of the show for me. Edward, Mary, Jane Grey, Robert Dudley (😍😍), Catherine Parr, the Seymour brothers, they are all so interesting to watch, unlike Elizabeth. And that's not so good when it is supposed to be an Elizabeth coming-of-age story. I just hope it will improve till the last episode.
@@Lily1127channel thanks, it is true that Edwards reign was definitely black spot and he was not really shown in any other tv series before (or he was just a kid or already dead). But Seymore brothers are something that definitely interests me as a topic, both of them were very important; especially Edward. And young Robert? That sounds amazing, how I could forget that he is supposed to be there? 😂
I get you when it comes to the main actress, because when you dont like her, thats a huge problem because it makes the whole show. I probably will watch it to make my own opinion, also there are barely any new historical dramas out there so it would be pitty to ignore it. I actually dont know why I dont feel any interest in Elizabeth as a historical figure in general even though I love this period and have interest in other rulers of her times (like Felipe, Henry IV,… etc.).
I also look forward to the new season of Barbarians. I hope El cid will get a season 3 but it's been 1 year since season 2 and no news so I don't have high hopes 😞 I would really like to see a good Spanish historical tv show again. I've read that Boundless, a miniseries about Magellan will soon air, with Rodrigo Santoro and Alvaro Morta, I really want to see that one. It's made by RTVE like Isabel and CRE. So I hope it will be good.
I've just seen the end of the Maria Theresia series and I really wosh they had given that show more episodes and higher budget. Such potential wasted 😞 I hope one day I will see something worthy made about Maria T.
@@Lily1127channel I hope they will realise that El Cid has so much potential (i just want to see Alfonso as king of all kingdom to be honest 😂) and they will continue the show.
It would be nice to have something about MT which would dig a little bit deeper into her personality and reign. There is so many good topics which could have been already filmed, TV series about French Revolution would be nice or Henry IV. TV show (because his life was so interesting). But I will take every new historical show, especially when it comes from Spain. Their quality just hits different. I also hope for season 4 of Ekaterina, i am not sure if that is coming or not. I would like to see Godunov because I heard it is really good but hard to find :/
Yeah, Godunov is super good, it is like a Russian Game of Thrones, I loved it. I would like to see the new series Elizaveta, and also hope for Ekaterina season 4, though I don't know how available Russian content will be nowadays. I don't have high hopes.
I think the El Cid series is kind of underrated, I think it has a lot potential (Alfonso's reign!), I hope they will realize this and continue.
I also find Henry IV tremendously underrated. I once saw a French movie about him but that was kind of meh. Also, there were so many events in it that it was too much for a movie, you need a tv show to show so many things about his life. I think his life had everything that sells a tv show well (lot of blood, fights, lot of lovers, lot of drama), I have no idea why there is nothing made about him. The new French series about Diane de Poitiers is coming this year, I hope it will be good, though that part of history has been shown several times. Also the Marie Antoinette series, it has potential but she is also an overdone historical figure.
I think the new Sissi series on Netflix, The Empress, is also coming this year 😄 Honestly now I don't know what to hope from that, after last year's Sisi disaster.
The scene was a bit too vulgar and reached too far. Poor Princess, no wonder she was that cruel...
This never happened. Artistic license
It was not bloody Mary in fact, it was BLOODY Edward & Elizabeth!!! 👎😡👹🤮
It is very likely that such a scene never occurred. First of all, it would have been recorded. Second, the three Tudor children spent most to nearly all of Edward's reign living apart from one another. Third, Mary would NEVER have just sat there and taken that spectacle. She would have stormed out of the room.
She does storm out of the room, though 😀
Pope mocking and Church mocking performances like these were not rare during Henry VIII's regin. Edward's reign was even more strictly Protestant, it is not unthinkable that such a performance could also happen during Edward's reign. It is not sure that it would have been recorded, not every single court play was recorded. But yes Mary was probably not there and she was very rarely at court during his reign.
Edward did publicly humiliate her though, it is recorded that he once reduced her to tears in front of everyone when pushing her to renounce Catholicism.
@@Sawrattan Yep, and they actually had that scene in the show, but it was a private moment in his office instead.
God, can someone help Mary? She looks like she's about to collapse. I mean, HEY, they're rude and I'm sorry her faith was mocked. LIKE, WHY, MAN?! I think what Mary deserves is understanding.
Brutal times.
She imprisoned my ancestor because he was a church of England bishop. but he got out when Elizabeth took over. and she gave him lot of money, which his sons used to help fund their new company they co-founded, the Virginia company, named after the "virgin" queen who funded them. crazy how real in history that was
Wow I wish I could watch this series, I am the biggest fan (sucker) for a damn good British costume drama as only they can tell it, I hate being on a fixed income!!!!
Wish the show was renewed for a 2nd season
I guess her being called "Bloody Mary" is justifiable.
Killing people over something like this is not justifiable. Says a lot about you and your religion if you think it is. Also, this is fiction. There is no account of this happening. Mary was away from Edward's court for most of his reign anyway.
Love all scenes with Mary. She took the show to rule it
This is disgusting
Mary should have been queen of England
The Pope was a political leader back then who interfered with other countries and raises coalitions against them. The pre-1871 Catholic Church fought wars and played geopolitics.
The fact that they did it in front of her face, is the most disgusting. They knew but didn’t care.
Long live the reformation No Surrender VVV 🇬🇧
Mary had red hair too?
Yes, both her parents had red hair
If you look at her paintings it looks like reddish-brown in a certain light, though less obvious than Elizabeth.
The name of the show please
Becoming Elizabeth
@@Lily1127channel thank you
At least they are using people with the right race.
Mary Started to freak out
yeah, her faith was litteraly laughed at !
Seems like a nice movie
I really liked that show and was pissed off that they won't be making another season. There really is no accounting for taste these days. Several shows (Particularly historical ones) that I got into were never renewed.
No entiendo porque los católicos tenían tanto fanatismo al papa .-.
No entiendo porqué los anglicanos pusieron su fe en un rey gordo inglés que se fue De la Iglesia católica por querer trajinarse a otras mujeres.
Nah that’s nothing compared to today, I developed a thick skin to this ages ago. I’m sure it was shocking back then though.
There is no indication this ever really happened. Mary was away at her own property during Edward's kingship most of the time
Not intent on defending the Catholic Church during the 16th century. But I suppose its more dignified to associate with a creed led by the Holy See in Rome rather than one which was founded by some debauched monarch, who couldn't accept the fact that you can't just divorce when your pride is not satisfied.
Spoken like someone who hasn’t heard of the Borgias before.
@@megakillerx I did say that I recognize the corruption in the Roman Catholic Church in the 16th century. But the Borgias were gone from the Church by the time Henry VIII abolished the monasteries in the Edict of 1538.
The previous grave corruption in the Roman Catholic Church that had motivated the Reformation by Luther in 1517 was just a pretext to get a divorce and seize church propety and power to pay for his royal court's glottenous parties.
Say whatever you want, but since the Reformation more corruption had existed in the institutions like the Church than ever before since it was the subordination of a religious institution to secular authorities like state who would constantly upgrade and change it. Prior to the Reformation there was no such thing states as we know today, more like various institutions which preserved cohesion throught the continent.
All the stories of Catholic priests and young boys, I would not say that's particularly dignified. Removing the Pope led to a constitutional monarch and away from absolute monarchy, while the reformation is credited with new age thinking that certainly benefited Britain, including the industrial revolution.
To this day, I'd say England is still very much thankful to have moved away from Catholicism, especially as it opened the door for Christians to actually be able to read their own holy text in their own language and not have it dictated to them by superiors.
On 6 July 1553, at the age of 15, Edward VI died of a lung infection, possibly tuberculosis. That is called Karma good riddance to bad rubbish
Bloody Mary.
Jane Seymour gotta be mad at his son Edward
Also this just gave more support abroad towards Mary it was terrible for trade thats y Cromwell was so diligent he knew u had to balance morality as trade would be affected
Looks like a Madonna show
Her ol' dad acted a lot more like the antichrist